Problems with the Mormon Doctrine of God 

Mormonism is arguable even more different from Christianity than Christianity is from Judaism. And despite all the PR BS about the "Judeo-Christian" thing, no Jew would ever agree that Christianity is just another form of Judaism. Just ask Maimonides. Commonality yes, but the differences are crucial and defining. Mormonism is a post-Christian faith.

I really appreciate that you have done so much research and reading and present the information in factual form, without antagonizing the followers of the religion itself. You are able to see the clear difference beteen scholarly criticism of a religion (“criticism” has garnered a such a negative connotation for those who have not done any scholarly research, and it’s very important that, if someone chooses to do research of any kind, that they know the difference), and personal criticism, which carries tacit understanding of emotive attack). Refreshing to see information presented in such a clean, easily understood narrative. Bravo, sir. * insert scholar emoji here *

Could you put this essay in written form on your website, Pastor?

So basically: (1) Matter is prior to God (2) Some God must (by Mormon Theology) be prior to the very first God who was an “exalted man”. So was that prior God not an “exalted man” ?

Mormonism-- as well as JW-- have some of the most inconsistent and muddled beliefs I have ever heard

I am extremely impressed that you didn’t jump immediately into the infinite regress theory as the definitive Mormon belief but immediately stated it as a “form of Mormon belief” and the continued on fo mention Blake Oslers theory

Is Mormonism monistic? I've been doing research on John Milton, of paradise lost… And I'm noticing a consistent strand between the two on their views of God.

"You can become like god" was more persuasive when the serpent made the same argument.

OBSERVATIONS "AS MAN IS GOD ONCE WAS. AS GOD IS MAN MAY BECOME" . John 5:18-19,36 18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. . John 1 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. . 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. . Luke 2:52 52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man. . Hebrews 5:8 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; AS MAN IS GOD(CHRIST) ONCE WAS *********** . Ephesians 3:15 15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, . Romans 8 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. . 1 John 3:2 2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. . Matthew 5:48 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. AS GOD(CHRIST) IS MAN MAY BECOME ********* AS MAN IS GOD(CHRIST) ONCE WAS. AS GOD(CHRIST) IS MAN MAY BECOME . John 5:19-20 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

Technically it's henotheism, which means the worship of only one god while acknowledging that other gods exist too. Also as an interesting bit of information, the original version of the Book of Mormon presented a trinitarian view of God. It was then later edited and updated to present the current view, with each member of the Godhead being a separate individual being.

Thank you for the clarification

I found their God the Father as First who achieve divinization similar to buddhism and jainism.

I giggled every time he pronounced Alma... Like it was pronounced like almonds 😂👌 good video though

Flesh & blood (body of man) canot inherit the Kingdom of God (1 Cor. 15:50). God is Spirit (John 4:24). Mormon god is not the God of Abraham, Isaac & Jacob aka Christian God.

28 bible passages teach there is only ONE GOD ... 1. Deuteronomy 4:35,39 - Unto thee it was shown, that thou mightest know that the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him. (39) Know therefore this day, and consider it in thine heart, that the LORD he is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else. 2. Deuteronomy 6:4 - Hear, O Israel: The LORD thy God is one LORD. [Note in Mark 12:28-34 how Jesus and a Jewish scribe he encountered understood this text.] 3. Deuteronomy32:39 - See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. 4. 2 Samuel 7:22 - Wherefore thou art great, O LORD God; for there is none like thee, neither is there any God beside thee, according to all that we have heard with our ears. 5. 1 Kings 8:60 - That all the people of the earth may know that the LORD is God, and that there is none else. 6. 2 KINGS 5:15 - And he returned to the man of God, he and all his company, and came, and stood before him: and he said, Behold, now I know that there is no God in all the earth, but in Israel; now therefore, I pray thee, take a blessing of thy servant. 7. 2 Kings 19:15 - And Hezekiah prayed before the LORD, and said, O LORD God of Israel, which dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth; thou hast made heaven and earth. 8. 1 Chronicles 17:20 - O LORD, there is none like thee, neither is there any God beside thee, according to all that we have heard with our ears. 9. Nehemiah 9:6 - Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou has made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein, the seas, and all that is therein, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee. 10. Psalm 18:31 - For who is God save the LORD? or who is a rock save our God? 11. Psalm 86:10 - For thou art great, and doest wondrous things: thou art God alone. 12. Isaiah 37:16,20 - O LORD of hosts, God of Israel, that dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth: thou has made heaven and earth. (20) Now therefore, O LORD our God, save us from his hand, that all the kingdoms of the earth may know that thou art the LORD, even thou only. 13. Isaiah43:10,11 - Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he:before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior. 14. Isaiah44:6,8 - Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.Fear ye not, neither be afraid; have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any. 15. Isaiah 45:21 - Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time: who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Savior; there is none beside me. 16. Isaiah 46:9 - For I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me. 17. Hosea 13:4 - Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me; for there is no savior beside me. 18. Joel 2:27 - And ye shall know that I am in the midst of Israel, and that I am the LORD your God, and none else: and my people shall never be ashamed. 19. Zechariah 14:9 - And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one. 20. Mark 12:29-34 -And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. And the second is like, namely this, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these. And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he: And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbor as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices. And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question. 21. John 17:3 - And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. 22. Romans 3:30 - Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. 23. 1 Corinthians 8:4-6 - As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, andthat there is none other God but one. For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. 24. Galatians 3:20 - Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. 25. Ephesians 4:6 - One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. 26. 1 Timothy 1:17 - Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen. 27. 1 Timothy 2:5 - For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. 28. James 2:19 - Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. mit.irr.org/28-biblical-passages-which-explicitly-teach-there-only-one-god Thank you for reading ~ blessings! /

I asked a very nice young LDS missionary who was Heavenly Father's God? She didn't know or wouldn't say.

They completely changed the true view of God. One God three divine person. Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Just curious: So, in your view God does not have the power, ability or will to makes others as Himself?

Excellent video

In the Great Commission, Jesus didn't say, "teach them all I've commanded.” Nor did he say, “only teach them doctrine.” He said, “teach them to obey all that I've commanded." Discipleship.

I’m actually fine with calling Mormons “Christian” in the academic sense in the same way that the Arians were called “Arian CHRISTIANS.” After all, if all heretics are no longer Christian, the word “heretic” loses all meaning and purpose. With that said, their views on cosmology are so out tgere so as to be one of the most heretical groups of all time. That’s why I’m also at least sympathetic to those who feel the need to call them their own religion. Funnily enough, their definition of what God is kicks the can down the road to necessitate another (actual) God!

As your Orthodox brother 10000%

Why delete my comment from yesterday?

Jesus Christ is Lord who is the Alpha and the Omega, he was not a man, he was God incarnate in man Alleilua, I love you Lord Jesus Christ, Amen

This is a decent analysis of Mormon doctrine of deity. However, it doesn't explain "orthodox" problems on the nature of God. If God is totally transcendent to reality, how does he interact with it? If he DOES interact with it, then there must be some commonality, God cannot be totally "other." So either God is part of reality, or reality is part of God. Mormonism answers that question quite simply: God is part of an infinite reality. Mormonism also affirms that God is in process. Traditional Christian theology asserts that he is infinite, perfect, complete and does not change. That is a huge problem, since a being that does not change cannot actually institute any processes. How does an unchanging being create changing processes? Mormonism also emphasizes deification. Humans can follow in the same path as God and become exalted beings. That is actually a major part of "orthodox" Christian theology, and by that, I mean the Orthodox branch of Christianity. Humans can become so unified with God, they are deities themselves. It is easy to point out flaws and faults within LDS history. However, I have found the same applies to Christianity in general.

That’s the beauty of a living prophet and continuing revelation. Changes over time are a direct result of the congregation being ready to accept it. Just like what appears to be bouncing around, blacks getting the priesthood, then denied it, then getting it again. Heck, maybe in the future they will be denied it again. And then get it again. As long as it’s from the prophet talking to god, who cares. The same could be said about the church dancing all around the gay issue. Or women and the priesthood. Heck, it’s completely conceivable that the church looks/is completely different in 50 or 100 or 500 years. Again, having a living prophet in constant communication with god could mean it could be anything. The possibilities are endless. We need to do away with the notion that anything really lasts very long and that as society changes so will all religion. Except of course Mormonism will get better and better and all other religions will get worse and worse.

That's why there are so many religions. Men couldn't handle the gospel Christ taught, and disagreed with each other. The devil works hard to keep men from the true Church of Jesus Christ. Ever learning and never coming to a knowledge of the truth.

Why does the traditional Christian religion believe Plato's idea of God as immaterial when the Bible clearly says otherwise?

5:30 in that case mormons are polytheistic and not christian at all

The cherry picking power is real.

Mormonism, or whatever it may be called, is the most abominable heresy. Its doctrine of God is a total affront to real divinity.

Why people use the book of Mormon instead of bible. Isn't the bible enough?

The "Mormon" concept of God varies depending on which period you're talking about, which particular theologian or scripture you're referring to, etc. Same with many other denominations in Christianity, actually. Depends on which sect, preacher, pastor, minister, priest, or whatever, you're referring to. It's pretty clear that Smith wrote the Book of Mormon subsequent to his hearing the proclamations of many revivalist ministers of his time, and as times changed, so did the "nature of God," etc.

I guess you haven't heard about this Paul guy who has some amazing incites to the book of Abraham supporting Joseph Smith. He is frightening the critics who have actually blocked him from commenting on several sites. He has some brilliant evidence to explain why Joseph was adding characters that didn't match Egyptian. like we see in the facsimile 2 their were likewise Lacunas in the missing Abraham scroll. The dead sea scrolls had the same problems wherein they had to invent greek words and character's to fill in certain holes in the scrolls. Joseph and the scribes were likely using the book of breathings characters to fill several lacunas in an attempt to match the English translation with the Egyptian character's. What he proposes explains everything the critics question and supports the reality that Smith was actually translating. Don't miss this new evidence. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--ZCk6jX1CIY.html

Technically, God is not of a kind or species at all. The difference between Creator and creatures is more radical than that. And it is an infinite gap.

4:55 hey look mom I’m on the internet… kinda… almost… Close enough

Gee, if you think that LDS doctrine is not quite right when it comes to their descriptions of God, the Bible has some confusing passages as well. The Dead Sea Scrolls (mostly carbon-copies of existing scripture) also contain descriptions of polytheism, councils of the sons of God, including Yahweh, Lucifer and others, war in heaven, different heavenly realms etc. In fact, quite a bit of stuff that just doesn't agree with evangelical Christianity today. If you're looking for problems, you certainly can find them.

Their president Hinkley admitted they dont believe in the traditional Jesus.

Watch out for false prophets

7:35 because he’s of the same species he’s not worthy of being worshiped? Is not the entire point of Christ, in the trinitarian view, that he is a Man? That he is FULLY man along with being fully god? His favorite way to refer to himself was “the son of man” which is literally Hebrew phraseology meaning “The Human” Christ repeatedly said he was a MAN. Post nicene creeds dictate that Christ was a man from eternity to eternity and still maintains his human body. To say this is to say Christ isn’t worthy of being worshiped, and is a far bigger heresy than to say the father and man are of the same species

So God is immaterial & doesn't have a body? I'll assume that's from God is a spirit & invisible. What is the holy spirit then & what need is there for it? Due to it being a spirit & invisible. How is Jesus the express image of God? God doesn't have an image for Jesus to be in, nor does God have an image for us to be made in, because he's an invisible spirit, remember. Christ said he can't do anything of his own, only what he's seen the father do. How has he seen this invisible spirit do anything, because according to trinitarian belief Jesus is the exact same God as the father, so how come Jesus isn't an invisible spirit as well? It must be Mormonism, huh? That's very clearly the problem

Why do you care? Why does it matter what Latter-Day Saints belive? Don't you have anything better to do?

Mormons do not believe you must be born again. For instance at another video they were giving testimony about the BOM redeeming them and gave them eternal life. I then gave my testimony at that video of asking Jesus in sincerely and then the Holy Spirit baptized me Spiritually by the blood of Jesus. Then the crickets started 🦗🦗🦗🦗 chirping.

As a Lds memeber , i apprciate the way you approached talking about this .

I would consider Mormons to be among the Gnostics

Mormonism is even farther away from Christianity than Catholicism is, with regards to everything they added on top of scripture. At least with Catholic tradition, it's mostly practices; rituals & sacraments that they've created out of whole cloth. Joseph Smith & company created an entire belief system at odds with Both Jewish & Christian theology. Entirely New Concepts of God, the heavens, salvation and even humanity.

How much does the LDS Church take in subscriptions from fees on UTUBE is the real question. This is the most regurgitated carrot chase of all time.

Jesus has a body believers will have bodies in heaven so there is no reason why the Father does not have a body

The latter writings and doctrine is from Freemasonry, Joseph Smith was a 33rd Degree Mason, the temple ceremony has oaths and rituals from Freemasonry, pagan symbols on their churches. Mormonism is not a Christian religion; it is a pagan religion.

The Book of Revelations 3:21. JESUS SAID the he that overcame would sit on the Heavenly Throne with Jesus and God the Father. Early Orthodox Christian writers t wrote that God became a man to teach man how man could become a God.These guys need to study up.

We are trying to work together toward God not fighting against each other Jesus said love one another man may know that ye are My disciples and if ye are not one your not Mine

How can we have some mormon splinter groups that accept the Book of Mormon and Bibke yet deny his other works? I'm sorry but you either accept all or none.

it is sort of like when Christians worship Jesus and conflate him as God in the idolatry that is trinitarianism which is also incompatible with the God of Abraham

THIS INFO IS TWEEKED TO SOUND WIERD. FIRST THE BIBLE SAYS IN GENESIS "ELOHIM" CREATED ALL THINGS. "ELOHIM" IS NOT SINGLAR. IT MEANS "GOD OF THE GODS". GENESIS 3 SAYS JEHOVAH ELOHIM SAID "MAN HAS BE COME LIKE ONE OF US TO KNOW GOOD FROM EVIL. " .. NOTE THERE ARE TWO OF THEM. WHEN JESUS IS ON THE GARDEN OF GETHSEMENE HE ASKS GOD THE FATHER TO TAKE THE OF OF SUFFERING FROM HIM BUT THEN SAYS NOT MINE WILL BUT THINE. CLAERLY THE FATHER AND JESUS ARE TWO SEPARATE PEOLE. JESUS SAID " HE THAT OVER COMES SHALL I GRANT TO SIT ON THE THRONE AS I OVERCAME AND SIT NEXT TO THE FATHER". REVELATION 3:21 NOTE JESUS OVERCAME TO BE GRANTED TO SIT WITH GOD THE FATHER. THUS THEY ARE TWO SEPARATE BEINGS. HE IS TELLING THE CHRISTIANDS TO OVERCOME TO SIT WITH HIM ON THE THRONE (WHICH MEANS TO RULE AS GOD DOES) NOTE EARLY CHRISTIANS TAUGHT THAT GOD( JESUS ) BECAME A MAN IN ORDER THAT HE COULD TEACH MAN HOW HE COULD BECOME A GOD. THE CONCEPT THAT CHRISTIANS COULD BECOME GODS WAS A COMMON TEACHING. JESUS SAID I ASCEND UNTO MY FATHER AND YOUR FATHER MY GOD AND YOUR GOD. CLEAR GOD THE FATHER IS JESUS' FATHER AND GOD AND THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT PEOPLE. JOIHN 20:17. PETER SAID CHRISTIANS CAN BE PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE. I.E. TO BE MADE A DIVINE BEING. 2 PETER 1:4 . IN JOHN 17: JESUS WHO IS ON THE EARTH WITH THE APOSTLES PRAYS TO GOD THE FATHER WHO IS IN HEAVEN ASKS GOD THE FATHER TO MAKE THE APOSTLES ONE WITH JESUS AND THE FATHER AS JESUS AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. JEHOVAH / JESUS SAID "YE ARE GODS" PSAMS 82. BEST READ THE BIBLE AND LEARN THE FATHER IS NOT JESUS GOD THE SON . READ WHERE JESUS OVERCAME THE WORLD TO SIT ON GOD THE FATHER'S THRONE AND TELLS US WE CAN TOO.

Well, so traditional Christians believe that Jesus Christ was not a God because he was born into mortality and had a body of flesh and bones. Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. But Jesus told the Pharisee that he was Jehovah, the God of the Old Testament. Before Abraham was, I AM. The Pharisees had no doubt about what he was saying. They took up stones to kill him.

I am not a Mormon. As a member of Christ's church, my identity is a son of God, as are all of humanity. It is the philosophy of Greeks and Romans that was condemned by Paul and the Apostles, many of whom ended up in Babylon (Rome). The Gentile philosophy couldn't accept the physical resurrection of Christ, which much of mainstream Christianity also rejects. The pleasant sounding doctor here is using the philosophically solid sounding term monotheism and creature. Not the terms used a lot by Jesus Christ, who proclaimed that His Father was your Father and his God was your God. The Bible teaches that the man and the woman would no longer be twain (two individuals) but one flesh, which the devil attempts to tare apart. The Roman church used one in the great prayer on oneness to mean one individual based on your monotheistic model, but the Bible never double downs like the marriage one flesh. Never saying unlike mortals one Trinitarian being. The good doctor should have relied less on philosophy and more on the words of Christ, which always sounds like the children of men are one and the same as children of God. Besides, Jesus's doctrine was always higher and more rewarding. Man could never think of a more rewarding doctrine than what Christ taught. Here, the doctor is teaching that mankind is lesser sounding than the words of Christ. No doctrine of God permits children to be slaughtered for animals. He allowed his son to die for his children, not for mere animals or creatures. Of course the Roman philosophy we get from the Babylon church is a stranger to our relationship with the true Father of our spirits. What is mainstream Christianity anyway? Is it not really legion? And when Christ cast them out, they entered a herd of swine and ran violently into the sea and were drowned. If mainstream Christianity were one, how would you know it? It's not like the keyholder from the keys past from Peter exists today like with the modern senior Apostle who holds the keys of the priesthood. If he required all the locks changed on all the doors, he can also do that. How would that happen in the legion of mainstream Christianity. Yes you may move as one but you aren't one in the priesthood or with one physical key holder. You are not one faith, one baptism or one Christ. You are only one like a legion of possessed swine capable of running violently into the sea.

If you could talk more plainly & use fewer big words, we could get more out of this.

Mormons should read the Book of Isaiah, Chapter 43 Verse 10.

The Latter-day Saints live by the Ten Commandments and the Beatitudes and the whole Gospel of Christ just as faithfully as anyone. Their hope in His Infinite Atonement isn’t any less diminished than any other Christian. How can you charge them with not being Christian because of their precepts of the Godhead and man’s relationship to them? Every church has a different take on one doctrine or another. But, they get a pass. Matthew 7: 15 & 16 says: Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? There’s absolutely no evidence of false prophets or ravening wolves in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They are laden with fruits that deserve more respect than the constant attacks it has received since its very foundation. And, those fruits are good solid faithful family oriented children of God who have sacrificed as much or more than anyone in defence of our Savior, Jesus Christ. The Book of Mormon says: And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy of Christ, and we write according to our prophecies, that our children may know to what source they may look for a remission of their sins. They don’t rifle through the doctrines of other churches and put them down or denounce them like so many do to them. There isn’t any time for that when you’re trying to prepare a people to meet The Savior when he comes again.

Nice presentation… And I agree with everything that you've spoken, and I closely align with the Mormons in thought… I have a son and my son I hope becomes like me and there's nothing I would deny him. It only makes sense to me that if God created us, he wants us to become like him, and that he would deny it's nothing as we progress eternally… I think that people who watch your video like me should immediately contact the missionaries for the Mormons… Because it seems more practical as a religion then all of the mysteries of thinking otherwise that God is everywhere, but he's nowhere, etc.

Hey, just because we aren't nicene. God is the only one. You don't get the concepts of how many gods can be one, it's a different concept. Adam & Eve WERE gods in heaven (at the side of Christ) but they and every man/woman canONLY be made gods through Jesus Christ. Man, it's just other words, a different perspective. Try to take something from it not just wasting it…

Tradition is just another word for corrupt. The Book of Mormon Another Testament of Jesus Christ is true, and the church Christ founded is also true. The doctrines of men is what makes up corrupt churches that claim to follow the gospel, and do not. Hence why they refuse to see the truth.

You know what does it really matter what people (Mormons) believe? What others believe doesn’t have to threaten our own beliefs. Besides we all are given agency, agency to decide for ourselves what we believe is right or wrong, good or evil. As long as we live the laws of harmony and of our society our belief in whatever type of God feels most comfortable to each of us shouldn’t be argued over. In the end we may all find that our understanding of God was less than we thought. But that shouldn’t matter if our intentions were sincere. We can’t know all things in this mortal life and I can’t believe a loving God would reject any of us who might get somethings wrong. He knows our hearts and to me that is what is most important!

Anyone care to say anything about the starving of women and children in palastine .

Say what you will, but this theology is beautiful. Who cares what traditional Christianity thinks.

The first Century Christians lived Consecrated United Order and Patriarchal relationships which includes the plurality of wives. Maybe that makes most all contemporary Christians summarily disqualified.

Wild that anyone believes this stuff

Genesis 1:26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image." Genesis 3:22 "And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil." In Genesis a plurality of God's exist, hence the clear passages given above of one speaking to another. Also, it should be noted that the word "God" is translated from the Hebrew "Elohim" which is PLURAL. If translated properly every time it says God in Genesis, it should read "Gods." Acts 17:28-29, Paul speaking to those who don't know God: "For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device." The Greek word for offspring here is 'genos,' a very strong and specific word. Psalm 82:6 "Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." This is the same verse Jesus references in John 10 when being accused of blasphemy by calling Himself the Son of God. Jesus invoked this divine principle in His defense, and was absolutely right. He was the only begotten perfect Son of God in the flesh, but all begotten sons and daughters of God in their spirit. Hebrews 12:9 "Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?" Romans 8:17 "The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Those who are "born again" to a new life spiritually are adopted sons and daughters of the father of our salvation, Jesus Christ. They are adopted into His family as will be "joint-heirs with Christ." They are they who overcome. "As many as received him gave he power to become the sons of God" John 1:12. "You shall be called the children of Christ, his sons and his daughters" Mosiah 5:7. "All people must be born again, becoming his sons and daughters" Mosiah 27:25. "Ye certainly will become a child of Christ" Moroni 7:19. The scriptures and revelation teach that we are indeed the literal offspring of God, but only to those who overcome through Christ and suffer with Him (by rejecting the corruptibleness and sin of the world) will they truly fulfill their divine measure and become as their Father. Christ is already as the Father and has the power to bring us to Him, to where they are.

Joseph Smith resides in HELL

Yep, their superstitious beliefs are pretty crazy. Like all Christianity. Just different.

The Christian tradition is precisely the problem. Things are believed that are not written down in Scripture. First of all we have in Genesis where God the father is said to literally be walking with Adam in the cool of the day. Which means he must have a body. Cuz it didn't say you was floating along with him. It said he was walking with him. We have Moses who sat down and spoke with God face to face as one would speak with a friend. We know that they're separate, at least in the scriptures, because at the baptism of Christ, we have God the Father speaking from the heavens, which was obviously meant to confuse it every freaking body on the planet because Jesus was still in the water, and the Holy Spirit and yet a third entity is descending in the form of a dove. So in the greatest example, we know that God the father Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are all three separate beings with a singular purpose. A Greek ism when you say I and my father are one. You are fundamentally saying we are here to accomplish one in the same thing. I don't know why that is so hard for people to believe. But let me tell you one other thing about tradition. Christ himself said that he was at odds with the traditions of men. So quit telling me about your damned traditions. Just because some Catholic supporter named Tertullius, who has never been canonized as a Prophet by the way with any authority to make such a decision, quit that God Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are all one in the same being. Does not make it so. Not only that many of the Protestant religions never adopted the three-in-one concept until fairly recently in history. I never heard it as a Baptist. It was obvious to me from reading scripture when I was young that they weren't one in the same being. The machinations you must go through in the twisting of vernacular and language to invent the Trinity concept is ridiculous. Not only that in 1522 there were two verses added to the Bible and 1st John chapter 5 verses 7 and 8 that had never been there before to help support that concept. Those versus have no business being in the Bible because they were made up, out of whole cloth. And then you somehow wake wait this belief structure with Islam, Islam doesn't even believe Christ was anything but a profit, but it doesn't answer why they don't follow his claim that he is the Son of God, that he is not God. And he says that several times. So anybody who says that God the Father and Jesus Christ Our one in the same is obviously claiming that the scriptures are wrong and Christ was a liar. But to equate Islamic belief is anywhere close to Christian belief concerning the nature of God. Islam believes that you should submit to God whether you want to or not. God the father has always said submit to me because you want to. Which was the message of Christ. It's a choice, it's not a forceful edict. That God is a Transcendent being, is apparent. Because he organized the Cosmos, and even created time so that we could have time to come back around and once again commiserate with him directly. Because we had fallen from him. He is literally our father as well in a spiritual sense as well as a physical sense. The course of the LDS church is not radically different than the vast majority of other Christian religions. Because the primary Doctrine, in almost every respect, is identical. In a case you have never decided to look at what God the father has told us about our relationship with him. We, as his creation, have the absolute right to worship Him by the precepts of our own Spirit, as best we can. And go one, even the goddamn Catholic Church when it was murdering Christians in Mass for hundreds of years because they didn't worship Christ the way the Catholic Church told them to. Has the right to tell people how to worship Christ. People will be judged on an individual basis before Christ. And as Christ has said they will be judged by their fruits. Not by their intentions, and certainly not by the damnable way they treated others that weren't worshipping Christ the way an individual wanted others to worship Him. It is a personal relationship, that's it! And you have no business telling others how to worship their God!!! In Alma 39 oh, just as an example, God is used just as it's almost always used in the last several centuries, to be the most high God. The reason this is important, is that in the Ten Commandments God the Father states have no other God before me. At no time did he say there weren't other gods. Because Gods had a different meaning at that time. Oh God, fundamentally is any Supreme Being. And in case you haven't noticed it there are beings that are more Superior to man but aren't as Superior as the god that we answer to. After that, God then says, also, do not make idols and bow down before them making false gods. But at no time does he ever State there are no other gods. The entire principal is the God the father is the one we ultimately answer to, and we answer to him through the Advent of his only begotten son, Jesus Christ. Or actually more correctly, Yeshua Christo's. As Yeshua actually has a meaning, the word Jesus does not have an alternate meeting. In Hebrew, and in Aramaic, Yeshua is a word that directly means Saviour. Jesus is just taking the Greek twisting of the name Yeshua, which is known as Ieasus, and then twisting it with the Y which is the first letter in that word in Latin, and then being changed to Jay after the first or second iteration of the King James Bible when the J was added to the language to differentiate the Y sound when it was a vowel from the Y sound when it was a consonant which is why the J was added. and then the English decided to start pronouncing the jsoj instead of pronouncing it as a y like it's supposed to be. So you're depending on a book that has been translated a minimum of three times and probably closer to five times before we ever got it to explain to you this surely Catholic invention of the trinity it's the right thing to do, and then somehow trying to claim that because God, as a Transcendent being is somehow has multiple personalities and lets himself up, which I'm not saying weren't possible. But why not just say it outright. Nowhere does he say that out right. As for the creation being by multiple gods, the Bible itself states that. The word Elohim literally means Gods, plural gods. And history is replete with scripture, not Biblical scripture, but scripture none the less, that indicates that there was a most high God and 8 lesser gods that comprised the Council of gods. The nine principles of the universe and how it works is another way that they put it. But that didn't mean that there was only one God and 8 counselors. Within the name Elohim, which is also used side by side at times with the word Anunnaki, we have some evidence that this is actually so. It wasn't until man got so high and mighty and decided to oil God down to a single being went for thousands of years, he was referred to as the most high God. To suddenly cast off that belief because some two-bit scribe in the second or third Century ad decides that God refers to all the beings that he manifested himself as when there is no scriptural support for that argument. The fact that the world was not made from nothing is absolutely consistent with the Old Testament and its original Hebrew form. Which never states that God created the Earth he said he organized it and brought organization out of Chaos. And although I agree that God is not physically everywhere, the idea that he can have an understanding of everything that goes on is not without understanding. But there is not nearly enough space for me to explain that in this comment. But even some men have manifested this ability to have knowledge of places they are not at physically. Even prophets exhibit that capability. Along with many other people, especially in the last hundred years. The Seekers of wisdom are showing up more and more often. And knowledge is useless without The Temper of Wisdom to apply it. The Eternal nature of God Remains the Same whether you believe it to be a singular being or a series of beings. Because the principal nature of God the father is all identical. The principal is immutable. I just because LDS believe it differently than what the "Traditions" of man dictate, they obviously feel like they do not have to follow the directives of man, they will more than likely follow the way they understand God and His Emissary Yeshua. Christ always stated that he was the Emissary between man and God the Father. Just exactly how difficult is that for you to understand that just because we have a difference in a thing so minor as our understanding of God, because no man can truly understand God the Father. You are willing to cast aspersions when you yourself claim that you're following the traditions of men. Something that Christ stated emphatically was that damnable thing to do. I'm not casting aspersions, I'm just quoting Christ!

Tell us if you believe Jesus and God the father are the same being, then why did Jesus worship the Father, Pray to the father, do the will of the father and not his own , sit at the side of the father, etc You do not believe in the Jesus of the Bible.

I don’t understand how mainstream Christians can read John 17 or the account of Jesus’ baptism or pretty much the entire New Testament and still believe in the nicene creed.

Mormonism wouldn't exist if it weren't for Martin Luther.

The differences seem to centre around the nature of God, but surely, a Christian is at heart someone who accepts Christ, the son of God, as their personal saviour. In that respect, I fail to see why LDS are not Christian.

Sounds greek methology

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 no idea what you are talking about

We don't believe in the 4th century creeds of man. We believe that the heavens are open and God speaks to his children. Joseph Smith restored the knowledge of the true character of God the Father and his Son Jesus Christ. There are so many interpretations of the same passages of the Bible within "Traditional Christianity" There is no consistency, much less One Fold One Shepherd. People of faith should stick together. God bless

If only "Christian" theologians applied the same level of scrutiny to their own beliefs.

The Gods Enki and Enlil are the diety who founded civilization on earth. That’s from the Summerian tablet of creation

Your sectarian Christian faith makes no sense. The concept of God centers around a oneness. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one, even though they are three. When Jesus prayed to the Father concerning the twelve, he prayed that THEY would be ONE, even as HE and the Father were ONE. Thus we see that a multitude can be ONE, even as members of the Godhead are ONE. This is how the Father, Son and Holy Ghost can be ONE, even though they are THREE. This is the monotheism that Isaiah spoke of when he said God (plural) is the only God. As Christians, we believe that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are ONE. John writes that we are children of God, and thus we have the ability of becoming like God (see 1 John 3:2), for when we see him, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is." So let's see if I have this straight. Jesus Christ was resurrected with a body of flesh and bones, which body he will have forever, right? But his Father is an incomporeal spirit that is everywhere present. Wouldn't this make family get-togethers a bit weird? How are we to assume that Jesus would commune with the Father? And with the Father and the Holy Spirit being spirits, with the Son of God having a body of flesh and bones, don't you see the problem? And what of Hebrews 1: 3-4, which states that Jesus Christ, “Who being in the _brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person_ ... being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.” How can Jesus be in the “express image of God's person,” if God doesn't have a body? For Jesus to be in the _express image_ of the Father, he and the Father must have the same appearance, meaning they are both humanoid. And why would the Father have a body that resembles us humans? We are the children of God, and we are made in this image. That means he has a body with a head, arms, feet and hands. He has a nose, eyes to see, ears to hear. So why would the Father have this terrestrial-friendly body if he never lived on an Earth? Let that settle in and percolate a little. The answer is obvious.

Joseph Smith saw the Father and The Son in his first vision.

Its the Principles you live and the acceptance of Christ as our Savior that makes a person Christian only and has nothing to do with a person's preferred tenets of theology. Contention over tenets is of the Devil. period. no exceptions.

Comparing two myths doesn't make either myth true.

The problems with you.

Obviously demonic

"TRADITIONAL THEOLOGY IS FALSE" THIS IS THE MAIN REASON THAT THE LORD APPEARED TO JOSEPH SMITH AND SAID THAT ALL CREEDS WHERE WRONG. HOW IS MAN CREATED IN THE LIKENESS AND IMAGE OF GOD IF HE IS A SPIRIT? WE WOULD ALL BE SPIRITS. JESUS SAID IF YOU HAVE SEEN ME YOU HAVE SEEN THE FATHER! GOD THE FATHER HAS A BODY OF FLESH AND BONES, JUST LIKE WE DO........

Jesus was once a mortal man

Using one fairy tale religious belief to criticize another fairy tale religious belief is silly of you. I have now blocked your channel for stooping to such silliness. Stick to science, not other fairy tales, when criticizing insanity like Mormonism.

Okay so you throw out a bunch of ideas, purported to be Mormon doctrine, all at once and I'd like to take them on one at a time. God is one among other Gods. This depends on what you mean by other Gods, as well as what you mean by among. However I'll tackle it at face value. God Himself declares that there are others who are in fact considered Gods and yes there is implication that He is among them, for He refers to them as being with Himself. Many times when God is in the Heavens and decides that He needs to come to Earth to do a work He declares, "let 'US' go down". Many confuse these statements to mean God was talking to Himself but there is one that is clearly impossible to be explained away. And that is when Adam falls and God declares that Adam has now become as one of 'US' (the Gods) knowing good and evil. No other people had lived as of yet. Adam was the first one and still hadn't died. The only ones the Lord could have been referring to that had already known good from evil is other Gods, from other worlds. God is not the only eternal being. Again this depends on what you mean by eternal being. Technically we are all eternal beings. The difference is that God became a perfected and unchangeable being long before any other rest of us even become formed as the beings we are today. it goes back to the argument against the exnihilo creation. If nothing can be created from nothing then everything is eternal in nature, and therefore everyone is eternal in the most fundamental aspects of the concept. We and God are all of the same beginnings and that is why we can believe Christ when He declares that "ye are God's and children of the Most High". God is not unchangeable. This idea is grammatically convoluted and contextually fragmented. God is now unchanging and has been unchanging since He became God. This does not at all preclude Him from being changeable either now or prior to that ascension unto Godhood. Unchanging and unchangeable are two different things. God has always been and will always be changeable. however God now choose to be unchanging. He lives eternal principles perfectly and chooses to continue to do so and will do so for ever more. It's a matter of agency, God has agency; it is just that He uses His agency to make only the most perfect of choices. Christ grew into Godhood by following that same pattern that He saw the Father follow and at length got to where He could rightfully inherit "all" that the Father has, due to His ability to withstand all temptations and make only the most perfect of choices with His agency. Christ even teaches that He can do nothing except that which He sees the Father do. So do you just no believe Him? Do you think Christ attained Godhood a different way than the Father did? Or is it that you really don't think that Christ truly has become equal with the Father? God has bodily limitations. What do you mean by body and what do you mean by limitations? are you implying that according to your belief God has no body and therefore He can take any form or even that He can take all forms at once if He so chose? God created man in His own image. Christ as a resurrect perfect God-like being declared to the apostles, handle me and see for a spirit hath not flesh and bone as ye see me have. So again do you just not believe Christ when he declared that He as a resurrected being of flesh and bone has become equal with the Father? If Christ had an immortal and eternal body of flesh and bone and the Father didn't, could Christ really claim to be able to inherit "ALL" that the Father has? Would there not be scriptural and pragmatic issues if Christ was eternally different than the Father? The king Follet discourse is widely used and even more widely misunderstood. The idea that Joseph could refute that God has been God from all eternity is not a matter of refuting God's eternal nature nor His godhood, but rather a refutation of what many of people understand eternity to. Eternity is not an indefinite span of time, but rather an existence outside of time. Therefore it is perfectly within doctrine and scripture that God can be God from eternity to eternity and still could have progressed to godhood during an existence where time was present. In actuality the passage that states that God has been God from eternity to eternity, it should understood that God is God from the time before our time was put into motion and will remain our God until after the point when we are resurrected when time ceases to exist for us. The beauty about the infinitely applicable plan of God is that the mainstream Christians believe that the highest level of glory man can attain to is to be an eternal servant of God. And oddly enough there happens to be a place in God's plan for people to become that very thing. There is also a belief of many that Godhood is actually the highest level of glory one can attain and, and again there just so happens to be a place in God's plan for those people to potentially do just that. And there are many who say God is ethereal and unknowable and therefore we should not follow any religious ideas and just let karma and the universe play out, and low and behold there is a place in God's plan where such people can live eternally in peace and joy holding fast to that ideal. And there is yet another group of people who reject God all together and God again has accounted for them and prepared a place for them to live in such a way that God will not interfere with anything those people want to do either for the good or the bad. God has a place for all people in His plan. It is just up to us to determine to what extent we want to take responsibility for our actions, and to what degree we are willing to obey the principles of Godliness. Obviously no one is going to accept as truth that teaching to which they are not willing to abide. And none should judge any other just because they are not comfortable taking on the responsibilities that accompany Godhood. Pushing someone to accept and live that which they do not feel comfortable living only puts that person in a position of greater potential condemnation, should they fail to live up to the requirements of that degree of Godliness. It is our duty to implore all whom we come across to take up their cross and begin where they are and push forward always seeking the glory of God as an aid and guide for which we should follow and utilize along our own path. As long as we are all moving forward, continually striving to expand our understanding, and take on more responsibility, we at length will all end up inheriting the amount of glory and Godliness by which we feel secure abiding, and be placed in God’s eternal plan just where we feel the most comfortable being. It is up to us. God has set the plan in motion and Christ has done His part to clear the way of all obstacles and road blocks and now it is up to us to determine which part of God s eternal plan we will attain to and to which level of responsibility we feel the most capable and comfortable taking on, for those are the decisions which will determine the level of glory we will be endowed with in the resurrection.

Oh oh, can I play? I assert that I am correct. You do not agree with me, therefore you are wrong. Boy, this game is easy!

Demonic heresy. Come back to home, to the Catholic Church.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints in true.

Meh. Little or plagiarized research. Shallow comprehension. Not enough theological experience or study. Good try though. Try again.

OBSERVATIONS "AS MAN IS GOD ONCE WAS. AS GOD IS MAN MAY BECOME" . John 5:18-19,36 18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. . John 1 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. . 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. . Luke 2:52 52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man. . Hebrews 5:8 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; AS MAN IS GOD(CHRIST) ONCE WAS *********** . Ephesians 3:15 15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, . Romans 8 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. . 1 John 3:2 2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. . Matthew 5:48 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. AS GOD(CHRIST) IS MAN MAY BECOME ********* AS MAN IS GOD(CHRIST) ONCE WAS. AS GOD(CHRIST) IS MAN MAY BECOME . John 5:19-20 19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.