RadioMaster Bandit: 8x the range of 2.4 GHz, but at what cost? 

My stomach flipped when you tossed that radio. Damnit Bardwell. 😆

Some comments from the perspective of someone who has taken crossfire out to 121km on a 1.3kg FPV plane: 1) 900 MHz and 1.3ghz analog (still #1 for pure long range) really mess with each other. I run additional notch filters on the video receiver - which already have good filtration to begin with (rmrc brand). On top of that I relay my RC link and video link so I can have each on their own tripod spaced out by 20-100 meters. Even still I see the blips of 900 MHz interference in my video at extreme range. On the RC receiving end of things - I run Matek 1.3g vtx with selectable output power. I avoid the highest power setting when possible (800 mW) because in some cases you can watch SNR db drop on the RX link with increased video output power. This probably has more to do with fresnel zone interference which impacts both video and RC link, placing both on the edge of failure to begin with. Still, it isn’t fun to clear up static with increased vtx output - only to instantly Send your RC link into failsafe…. 2) Having the RC transmitter on a tripod - wirelessly linked to your transmitter is fantastic for long flights. It could in theory be done in the opposite order but you can run say…. Tracer on your radio. Then have the tx pad of your tracer receiver wired to the RX wire of the CRSF input on your 900mhz module. This obviously adds latency and you will never have telemetry - but for long range FPV - it’s fine. Then you don’t have to care how you hold the radio - you can go piss behind a sand dune with your goggles on your forehead, holding the radio by your side…. Just saying…. 3) As to how 1.3ghz video and 2.4 ghz RC play together? Idk.. never tried it - but I want to. As you pointed out, antenna size is massively different between 900 and 2.4. I only use a shapeshifter for my 900 long range setup - so not very directional…. For that same size - I could run a 9-12 db yagi on a 2.4 ghz module. This really would help close the range gap between the two frequencies. No free lunch of course - as the high gain yagi is very directional - but so is my Long range flying… I know what course I will fly within a few degrees days before I fly it - because I plan it that way. I set up my tripods with a compass - directional isn’t an issue for me. Maybe for others it is…. Idk… Cheers and thanks for the good vids as always.

The noise that transmitter made hitting the ground hurt me inside lol. Great video keep it up JB

ELRS 4life boyee!! ❤😂

I'm getting into long range fpv with a new airplane that just built and this video is exactly what I needed to build the set up I want.

I love your extensive and clear videos on FPV topics! Thx again!

❤Exellent explanation of feeling the bass, the low frequency❤

Been waiting for this!

Thank you so much for preparing such an informative video.

You're a celebrity in my book. Thank you for being super intelligent and an amazing teacher! Kudos! 🏆

Thank you for putting so much effort into these videos JB! I am disgusted by the handcuffs these unnecessary regulations have placed on your livelihood. Especially given this hobby's impeccable record of safe flight. This was very informative, and I appreciate it. Take care, and keep up the good work.

Great Video as Always.

Sometimes(long-range quad) antennas are a plus. Love your content

Looking to get into the hobby and this video has helped me decide on a decent starter setup. Tx16s with elrs, fatshark scout, skyzone M5, and whatever small cheap Kwad I want to bounce off the walls and learn with. And with the Tx16s I can later upgrade the ag01 gimbals and can upgrade the fatshark scout with rapid fire. Seems a good way to start and not have to upgrade for quite some time and still have a decent rig. And I’ve figured out I’m probably gonna own several quads and fixed wing fpv craft. Super cool that the radiomaster ranger and bandit can be turned into Rx mode. Thanks for the great video!

Great video once again 🙃

Good video Joshua. For the viewers and readers, if you got a radio link that works for you and how you fly, you don't have to change. There is no FOMO here. I'm a confident CRSF flyer and mostly do mountain crusing. But I confess, the huge antenna (900Mhz) is a hassle. Monst of my quads use the L-shaped style. Some the horizontal style (but I prefare the L-shape cause I can avoid the nulls. If it's working, don't try to fix it.

yes the symmetrical telemetry and native mavlink support is gonna be a gamechanger for long-range

Fantastic review, Joshua! Thanks!!! 😃 If you're doing FPV with rc cars perhaps 900mhz may be a better choice. But I don't know, it depends a lot... Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊 And happy holidays!

I don’t even build drones yet but once I do/ have the funds I will ! Thank you for all the information I love the videos and watch them all the time !! Keep up the stellar work ! Happy holidays 🤙🏼🎉🎄🎊🎁

If you're interested why lower frequency have better range google "Friis transmission equation" (look at images where Pr = ...). It basically says that received power is proportional to wavelength squared, aka if you lower frequency by 2x the received power increases by 4x (if I understood it correctly)

I have been using 868 since I started using ELRS good knows how long ago. First on a modded FRSKY R9 and tnow on the BETA FPV UNIT. I usually fly rate 200. Its super redundant now. Tested up to 4 km range (limited mostly by DJI Air Unit 1 modded and can say its really now better them CRFS.

I'm really grateful you take the time to improve the knowledge in our hobby. One would wish that they information about the futaba radios was a bit more thorough... I mean I can make head of tails!! when I go to the Futaba downloads page the label 14 Mz.. and try to download the latest update it literally downloads a 12Mz and that ain't compatible with my equipment!

Imma still rock the ELRS R9m

So far , 2.4 Ghz has not let me down. Even at 17 Km from home . Just a drop of LQ to 80% (500mW - 50hz)

The boxer is a perfect one!

Seems like a good step to get more heli and airplane guys into drones. They generally use high end radios.

I fly with my buddy who has TBS crossfire and I regularly match or exceed his range. We fly in the hills and end up behind obstacles that requires serious penetration. I use ELRS 2.4ghz @ 500hz outputting at 500mw which is about as bad for long range as you can set it... I'm totally blown away with ELRS and the fact that the gear costs les than half

Hahah the spectrum toss caught me off guard

Just to test the difference regarding both systems you do not need to fligh, just do a ground test with your car! Just an idea!

that hand toss with the controller... funny af

I like my quality Crossfire 868 link....That moulded 915 mhz Moxon would be good as a boat paddle...A Dipole is more practical unless you want ultimate directional range from the Moxon.... IMO...😳😏🇬🇧

I just recently switched to ExpressLRS 2.4, and yeah the 900mhz goes further, but like you said, I don’t see a way of doing that legally. But I guess it would be pretty cool to have to capability to do so.

CaptnBry said Bandit is not in ELRS release yet. So you cannot update the TX and RX just yet. 2000mw settings are indeed in the hardware.html page on the Bandit although I have not tested it.

Awesome for ELRS.

The industrial design of the Bandit is excellent compared with the large and dorky Ranger Nano module. When will they release a new version of the Ranger?

man...the bounce on that radio! haha

915mhz for life

All the cons you outlined is a pro to me, then again i’m not really a quad pilot.

Hi, I'm new to your channel and also the drone hobby. Your channel is a great information source, I've just subscribed. I have a question that you may be able to answer for me regarding the Radiomaster Boxer. If I bought a RadioMaster Boxer Elrs in FCC, is it possible to change FCC to LBT? or vice versa? I found out a bit late about the European reg's. cheers M.

Joshua - build a 2.4Ghz quad and put a 900Mhz receiver on it controlling a strobe light Get a friend in his car to drive his 60km (or whatever you calculate it) Every so often he can get out of his car, fly the quad VLOS to a reasonable altitude and see if your 900Mhz transmitter at home can still control the strobe First USA legal range test?

900mhz video was useless in my area with tons of interference. This was long ago and I had to switch to 1.3ghz I remember. It worked fine. Makes me wonder if 900mhz for control would work here. Seems 1.3 ghz would be better that 2.4 ghz also.

This is awesome. The range-vs-wattage-vs-frequency approximation testing at the end were really cool, however I am not so much interested flying long range... My interest with a low frequency system is penetration in obstacle heavy environments (be it trees and vegetation or walls buildings, etc). If this test could be performed with signal PENETRATION in mind, it would answer more questions for my use case. Regardless, awesome video and cool to know where upcoming tech is headed.

Great info, as always! I'd be curious if your results change if you moved the devices further or closer - in case one was benefitting from standing waves (ie at a node vs anti-node)

For a range test on 900mhz, put the receiver in your car and drive to find the range.(or leave the receiver at home and take the transmitter to see the range of telemetry).

Is there a chance to use that Emax modul as a receiver and thus creating 2W symmetrical link?

The Moxon antenna is a yagi with a reflector and folded elements. They must pass the feed line thru to the driven element in the front. I was wanting a short yagi but this will do. Damn I learned something didn't I.

Got to try that 500mw telemetry

Do both the micro and nano aeris link 900 modules go to 2w?

Also have you seen the New Jumper T-20S GEMINI - Long Range ELRS Radio - 2 Transmitters in 1 radio.

it is important to note that elrs lacks encryption that has crossfire, its important for some applications btw (Maybe that's why it requires more bitrate?)

JB, could fly up to 10 K like Dji / Autel drones advertise range distance and still give us an example of 900 Ghz versus 2.4 Ghz in Line of Sight flight test? 🤔

the way I understand the relationship between power and range is to imagine a sphere. The volume of the sphere is the total output power, the radius of the sphere is the range (from centre point to any point on the surface of the sphere). for example the radius of a sphere with a volume of 10 is 1.34 double the volume to 20 and the radius only increases to 1.68 its not the perfect math for this, but it's a good way to picture in your mind that doubling the power doesn't double the range.

I had elrs 900 way back when. I turned my r9 system to elrs.

Thanks, Mr Bardwell, this has kept me wondering for a while (900Mhz vs 2.4Ghz). What should we do with our old 40Mhz gear? The submarine-modellers still use it as well as some antique modellers... Perhaps give it to them. By the way... for ELRS I will probably stick to 150Hz Packet Rate, still feels very good and responsive.

been running the big boi ranger, you better believe i'm picking up the big boi bandit lol

For most people it seems like the 2.4 GHz will have more range than they will ever need anyway, even at the 100 mW limit in the UK and EU, it seems the main need to go to 900 MHz is if you fly extremely long range, 10s of kilometres or more (even though the 2.4 GHz ELRS can apparently reach into the low 10s of kilometres) but like you mentioned that is illegal in most places. It would probably be a lot more useful once it can be used with fully autonomous drones but again flying those long range is likely illegal. In a lot of cases pilots are already breaking the rules on LOS and transmission power, pushing for 10s to 100s of kilometres of range just seems like a way to definitely get noticed and caught out. It is one thing to fly behind some trees or a building or to fly FPV without a spotter, it is another thing entirely to be flying 10s of kilometres away from you. If your drone can still receive signals and send telemetry then anyone else in at least that range of you or the drone can pick up those signals too and the higher power you transmit at the more likely you are to interfere with others and hence the more likely you are to get caught. If your drone is 30 km away and sending telemetry then anyone else within 30 km of you or the drone could receive those signals too, ignoring obstacles. I know they probably won’t be able to decode or interfere with your signals but if it causes disruption then it could even lead to stricter laws. As is the current advice anyway, keep it away from others where possible or keep it legal. Also very long range drones are large or fixed wing and are therefore easier to spot. The 2.4 GHz advantages over 900 MHz are probably enough reason for most people to stick to 2.4 GHz, the lower latency, higher bandwidth, smaller antennas, etc. It would be interesting how the range and power of ELRS (both 900 MHz and 2.4 GHz) compares to the range of DJI drones or air units with controllers and which is best for penetration.

IS THIS GOING TO INTERFERE WITH HDZERO THE WAY CROSSFIRE DOES (GOGGLES REBOOT ISSUE)?

Do inverted long-range testing. Have your quadcopter(s) at a fixed location with spotters you're in communication with and you ride in an aircraft in a pattern of arcs radiating away from the quadcopter flying location. You may need to work with the pilot of the aircraft on authorizations, but this may not be too big a deal.

You should find a nice open road and stick a receiver on your car roof and range test

Why dont they have transceivers that can switch between the two frequencies? FM (frequency modulation) radios?

From the way you described it I assume that the moxon antenna is basically an enclosed beam antenna

Is the 900MHz band less occupied than the 2.4Ghz band? I'd assume that would result in better SNR and helps range.

I have a question about a transmission system for my large drone. Could you possibly help me. I'm looking for options.

there are wufi boosters available..but one on the quad and you have 1w both ways

I just baught runcam wasp and using dji v2 and RC2 but its doesn't work hahaha . does any one knows when the fix its coming or i buy new controller?

Maybe you can daisy-chain with the crsf port to build a repeater: transmitter 1 - after 30km a receiver + bandit transmitter with crsf input - plane flies > 60 km

GTrick50 used uLRS to fly 50 miles (80km) straight out over the ocean, and back for 100 miles trip, in a 4 hour flight with a wing wing z84, 4s-7000 18650 pack, and it was fpv. This was a few years ago, he may have broken his record now.

My first thought was Ola Englund when he was playing guitar in a anechoic chamber 😂. Sound waves are interesting

900 megs is also attenuated lower in buildings means goes better trough a wall

Joshua, Mavlink is a pretty verbose protocol; it doesn't use compression and always resends all the data (no incremental updates). So, it will be pretty challenging to make it work over 900MHz with its bandwidth limitations. 2.4G ELRS is a much more suitable candidate for a Mavlink bridge.

Nope! Still going to use my Crossfire. When ELRS gets a simple bind button I’ll consider switching. My .02

Why not build it into that rc car and see how far you can drive it? Should be fun. … do you think they’ll do a flavor of Gemini that does both 900/2.4? Switching to 900 when 2.4 isn’t enough anymore?

I long range my fixed wing with ExpressLRS 2.4G and without even putting much thought into how it's set up and running an HM EP1 receiver that isn't even diversity, I get more range than my 4800mah battery can handle and it doesn't even go above 100mw TX while doing almost 30km. I don't know why anyone whines about 2.4 not having enough range.

Will the Bandit work with the ER6 RX?

I'm running Crossfire on my builds so far because it's more integrated aswell as the fact that I got a module included with my TX16S, also the price being higher doesn't matter much to me as I only have one build so far that needs such a system (coming from planes all my stuff is on Spektrum), but as I get more and more into FPV it might be worth trying out ELRS sometime!

I wish they had a 915Mhz PWM receiver for the MT12, although only the nano module will fit the MT12.

hi joshua, just wondering, how can i make my rates feel less jittery?

Even if you did a range test by driving, it would still require hours of driving to see the end of your range test. We're seeing a potential of nearly 500 miles with good line of sight. That's truly bananas!

Does the 900hz characteristics apply to crossfire as well, or that range comparison would be way different?

So if ELRS is going to support mavlink will it be available on all bandwidths or only 900mhz? I wonder if the 900mhz big boy could be teatherd to the ground station while plugged into the bay of your controller. Maybe this will be one of the surprises. It would be nice use one set of rx/tx for ground control and controller.

why elrs hasn't create dual 900mhz and 2.4ghz in one device for rx and tx?

What's the point with 900MHz for FPV, when regular ELRS goes twice the distance of any digital video system.

when will they make dual switching mode sistems depending on the needs..option to swit automatic or manual between 900 and 2.4 🤔 it would be a game changer ...

the ranger tx models also can be flashed as rx for telemetry ?

still more likely to go 1w from my current .25w rather than 900kh just because of the antennae. not such a big deal on 7 and 5 inch quads, but micros not really gonna like the big antenna

Is there a way to request permission at FAA for a defined long range flight? Which safety measures do they want to allow this?

But how far can the fpv video reach?

What is funny is I got the goggles x and I am more concerned of its range limitations because I noticed the bars drop really fast only at 150 ft out and I have no idea what this means so I can’t fly long range. This results in lost sales because people like me feel limited by the video signal.

Oh great I bought all 2.4 lol but I still use crsf religiously

do they offer handoff? if i flew it halfway could someone on the other side receive it and continue the flight?

I ll stick to Crossfire... It works and I m oldshool 🤷🏻‍♂️

Csrf was way worse for me in a dense urban environment than ELRS 2.4. I'm curious if it was the microwave transmitters interference but I switched to 2.4 and the only time my radio link is worse than video is when I forgot to take my tx off 25mw. 900 is beneficial to only very serious long range, like people who buy dragon link

Why not to use test with reciever and transmitter on ground? Just put one on mountain and drive with second one in line of sign. It could be done with 2 people and one car.

Crossfire for Life!!!!...... Until something better comes out from TBS.

Do a car long range test 😊

I bought it and it runs on 2 watts from the factory. why do all the reviews say that it has only 1 watt of power? I did not measure the power, but I can choose 2 watts on the module itself and in the script

Spectrum is called siniestrum in my club

Are those using LoRa/ESP32 boards? If so there are two different radios on those. One is more powerful than the other. The 1262 I think... the lower number one is the higher power radio.

What actually is the latency for each of the packet rates? What's the latency at say 200 Hz?

I love 2.4Ghz on my quadcopters, but I am most likely going to be using 900Mhz with my ground vehicles. Better penetration, while driving around behind things that are on the ground is the reason for that decision, and with ground vehicles, the longer antenna is not a problem.