Fun fact if Felipe somehow managed to void Singapore than the Spa GP will be voided or at least the penalty because 3 years later FIA accepted that penalty was unfair
Unfair penalty different than allowing a race result to stand knowing it was the result of cheating. Cheating and iffy penalty completely different universe.
@@BlueSkyCrystals vill never happen though as they do not want to give Hamilton any chance of taking Abu Dhabi 2021. which both CAS and FIA have admitted that what happened was not right. which is also why Masi lost his job etc
Two hours after the race, the FIA stewards for the race issued a statement announcing that Hamilton was guilty of contravening Article 30.3 (a) of the 2008 FIA Formula One Sporting Regulations and Appendix L, Chapter 4, Article 2 (g) of the International Sporting Code, which both state that cutting a chicane and gaining an advantage is subject to a drive-through penalty. As the race had finished, a 25-second penalty was added to Hamilton's time instead.[34] As a result of this penalty, Massa was promoted to winner of the Grand Prix, and Hamilton was dropped down to third position. 25 second penalty for hamilton back in 2008 compared to 5 sec penalty for max in saudi arabia gp. And yet people are still thinking that FIA favour Lewis.
Hamilton ran Verstappen of the road on turn 27 And hé only got a audible warning from masi And bottas was on purposly holding Verstappen back when the safety car came out. In fp2-3 hamilton ignored yellow flags agian only a warning. Silverstone hé almost killer Verstappen only 10 second penalty . Nooo they really dont favor Mercedes . Joker
@@ThaDutchDK1989 Multiple issues with your reply. 1. The yellow flag in FP3 was a malfunction with the light - it should not have gone on, and it was only for a second. 2. The Silverstone point is moot because Verstappen drove on top of Hamilton's car in Monza. 3. Lewis pushed Max wide in Turn 27 because Max made a half-assed attempt to let him through 2 laps earlier and immediately re-passed. 4. Max cut Turn 1/2 for a lasting advantage and unsafe return not only once, but twice during the race.
@@ThaDutchDK1989 they established you can now run people wide in Brazil, at least Hamilton kept it between the lines. It amazes me people can watch that race and think Hamilton is the dirty driver.
This always seemed a strange decision to me. Kimi missed the breaking zone to defend the corner against Hamilton, and ended up locking up and forcing Hamilton to take evasive action by going off the track. The result of this was Hamilton was briefly ahead of Kimi after the corner. He immediately gave it back to Kimi and then continued his attack. Any penalty for Hamilton was unwarranted, but 25s was beyond bizarre.
I believe 25 seconds was the smallest penalty available to stewards at the time, so that’s what they gave. The FIA later admitted he did not deserve any penalty.
@@cinegraphics Yes, but Hamilton also gave the place back to Kimi. He just had so much extra pace at the time that he could immediately just go fo another move into La Source
@@xxexterm1nat0rxx44 He definitely didn’t give the position back. Kimi had a better exit on the cleaner part of the track and after passing Lewis, Lewis immediately overtook him. That’s just not allowed…
I remember watching it live. This one will never get old 😄 I love it. I am still annoyed at such a deserved win being taken from Hamilton, but at least we got some F1 history on a wet track on slicks. If this happened today they probably would have stopped the race and we'd have missed it all. Rest in peace and glory Formula 1 rain races.
Nick used to be McLaren next driver for 2002 Kimi, his teammate in Sauber 2001, crossed him for the seat. His seat in BMW Sauber was good in 2006 until Kubica suddenly arrived in Hungary... Really unlucky, good driver but missed what it takes to be a world championship contender because he struggled against his teammates (Raikkonen, Massa, Kubica). If you want to win, first beat your teammate and show your guts. He didn't...
POV: You are here because of the Saudi Arabia GP in 2021 fight between Hamilton and Verstappen. Was expecting you, welcome! Civilized discussion below 👇
The FIA clearly said after the race you have to yield for a few corners before attempting to regain a position- 13 years later people including Max think it’s fine to let a driver past then try to overtake again straight away
@@Keenangoal In the next lap he allowed Hamilton to go through again and Hamilton pushed him out of the track #Blessed #KneeOnTheGround #SavingTheWorld
@@Keenangoal I rembered this race after Verstapen overtook Hamiltom imediatly after leting him pass, i knew that Hamilton received a penatly for doing this to Kimi, wondered if the rule is still in efect or not.
@@blleki well giving the place back means you can’t use DRS or the slip stream to retake it back again straight away. That’s why he was told to give it back a 2nd time. The irony is Hamilton got a 25 second penalty for the offence on Kimi who eventually crashed out anyway - whereas Max gets 10 seconds for effectively trying to seal the WDC by foul play
They left kimi’s car by the side of the track?? Lol And also on one of the fastest sections on the track. Damn, this is 2008, safety has come a long way. Today, this race would be ending under SC.
Nothing against Felipe Massa as an individual, but this is part of why I will always maintain that championship had the right outcome. There was no 'wait one corner' rule at that time, Hamilton retook the lead immediately but the fact is he let Raikkonen back through, note that the commentators never even speculated he'd be in any trouble. Absolute farce of a penalty and would not have been given if Massa wasn't there.
This is painful because maFIA stole this win from Lewis and gave him enough time penalty to lose the win. Besides finding him guilty they introduced a new rule to make sure it didn't happen again. Very very dodgy.
@@erminiopreziosi1967he pushed kimi?? Kiki pushed him off by braking too late and locking up even though Lewis was ahead he forced him off. Lewis gave back the position but it was clear that he was so much faster so he could just take it back because he had better grip or at least more confidence
I was at the track (Pouhon corner) surrounded by Kimi and Ferrari fans. If you think the emotions was rollercoaster on tv… Some of us could see the clouds coming in and as soon as it started to drizzle, the Ferrari fans just knew what was coming next. Without the rain Hamilton would have lost (the stolen win) by about 10-12 seconds. That Ferrari was a monster
@@mataloce I smell a football fan that has started watching F1 after DTS season 2 and doesn't know what's happening on-track so decides to copy-paste retarded comments all over social media.
The rule is clear: "If the pilot out, can't take advantage". Hamilton give the position, but he was taking a vacuum, he out and take advantage. Penalty is clear.
@@MultiLeonardo360 I think what you're saying is even though Hamilton gave the position back, he still gained an advantage by immediately slipstreaming Raikkonen. Well I'm not convinced thats an advantage gained because there was no gap between them when Hamilton had to cut the corner to avoid the collision. Also, look at the footage again, how long is Hamilton in Raikonen's slipstream for exactly? It's a small fraction of a second, because Raikonen weaves out of the way. There was no way Raikonen was going to keep that position despite all his efforts. You also have to consider that the 25 second penalty was applied after the race. So the stewards knew that the driver who arguably lost out (Raikonen) didn't even finish the race through his own error. So applying that penalty only benefits Masa and Heidfeld who had absolutely nothing to do with the incident. Terrible decision, and completely not justified.
The rule was that if you overtake another car by cutting a corner, you’re to hand the position back. Hamilton did that. F1 then ruled that he got the advantage anyway, which is true, but irrelevant as he had complied with the rules that were in place. Only after this race they changed the rule book stating that after giving back the position you’ll have to wait another corner until you can overtake again. Penalty for LH was extremely unjustified.
Totally agree. They had to rewrite the rule book after that. And again when LH got into trouble trying to break the tow that he was giving to Petrov in Malesia(?).
@@Matkins85 No man, Hamilton would never overtake Kimi if he hadn't cut the corner. In that race, none car overtook another at that point. Was an advantage gained by Hamilton when he cut the corner.
Verstappen is fantastic but I can’t respect him because of how little he respects other drivers, shown by his choice of driving style. I gave him the benefit of the doubt in his early years because he was a kid, but he still pushes people wide, divebombs, and complains like a baby. A crazy amount of pace and talent ruined by an idiotic personality.
@@willjackson6522totalement d'accord avec toi en tant que fan de lewis je peux pas nier que verstapen est un excellent pilote mais je ne peux pas le respecter en sachant qu'il ne respecte pas les autres pilotes surtout son coequipier Perez et pareil avec son style de pilotage comme vous l'avez dit un talent gaché par une personnalité stupide
@@Willie_Pete_Was_Here why do you feel the need to tell me how he drives? i have watch his every race in f1 and he is the cleanest of them all. we will not see another as good in our lifetime.
@@lpiavelino6598you are biased as fuck then, your frontal wheel needs to be at the center of the other car for it to be considered a fight for position, hamilton rams everybody despite his front wing being at the others rear wheel, he has been a cheat since 2006 go get your eyes checked
Really odd question here. Who is the commentator with the deeper voice? I didn't watch F1 during this time period as I was too young to even know about it but the highlights from this era are amazing! I keep hearing the guy with the deeper voice and he's pretty cool.
@@TTisIH James Allen and Martin brundle did the main commentary for itv. Occasionally you can hear a guy called ted kravitz reporting from the pit lane maybe that’s who you mean
Penalty was harsh intentionally to put distance between him and Massa and tighten up the title race. If you consider how close LH and FM were at the end of the penultimate lap and then see how long it is before Massa crosses the finish line, you see what a great job Hamilton does in wet conditions.
There was no such thing as a 5 second penalty back then, it was like 20-25 seconds minimum I think. That's why Schumacher got what seemed like a harsh 20 seconds penalty for overtaking Alonso at Rascasse in Monaco 2010, but that was the minimum time penalty they could give him.
Times when the FIA meant Ferrari International Assistance. Very poor decision to give Hamilton 25-seconds time penalty after that. The rules back then stated that if you overtake a car off the track you have to give the place back immediately, which Hamilton did in this case, but nothing was said about overtaking right after you gave the place back. So Hamilton complied with the rules and overtook Raikkonen again. Plus before that Hamilton was alongside, then Kimi forced him off the track and Hamilton had nowhere to go so he cut the corner. Gave the place back, as stated in the rulebook, and overtook him back again. Unfair.
Actually Hamilton didn't comply with the rules, if you want an example watch sazuka 2005, Alonso did the exact same thing going past Klien, A few laps later he had to slow so much to let Klien back through properly that those watching thought he was out of the race
@@daniellinanmolina1044 Remember, Lewis was forced off the circuit, he didn't actively choose to cut the chicane. He immediately relinquished that advantage gained and allowed Kimi to overtake him - the data showed that as they crossed the line, Lewis was travelling slower than his competitor. What was the issue was that there was an 'unwritten rule' that you should wait until the next corner to try again, but how can you enforce a rule which doesn't exist? Simple, you make it up after the race has finished and slap a penalty which couldn't be taken.
@@FluppiLP People usually make fun of lewis and calls him ferrari's last drivers champion cuz of spy gate. maybe the driver really makes all the difference. heikki kovalainen in the mclaren was spinning like a top even at silverstone. same car.
raikkonen is the driver with the record of longest time between first and last won gp, he is not only one of the greatest drivers on f1 history but also better than hamilton, by a mile.
@KCrucis Kimi won a title by chance, from then on he was run over by Hamilton and Vettel. Lotus had to forbid Grosjean to won over him. Against Vettel he won 1 race in 4 seasons while Vettel won 15 races. He was beat by Massa as team mates in 2008.
That was one of Lewis’s most epic wins ... only to be taken away later on ... to me it’s good enough to register it as win number 5 of that year’s all drivers log ... unfortunately it’s not in his official standings 😑
Best laps I've ever seen by two great drivers. Then the FIA stepped in to help Ferrari/Massa = worst fiddling of a result ever. Today Kimi would have got the penalty.
@@FFmybest Mechanical failures are part of motorsport. No one's outraged when a driver loses a championship due to poor reliability. Races/championships decided by dodgy desicions made by people sat in the race control room is what transforms the sport into a farce. Senna and Hamilton were sadly victims of that in 1989 and 2021. As for crashgate, it wasn't the first first time a driver crashed on purpose; Nelson Piquet was, however, the *first one* to admit it.
@Euclides287 Hamilton only got a slight chance because he was helped during the whole season (like 10 sec penalty for kicking out someone). Yes, Masi fucked up the organisation of the last race, but Hamilton shouldn't have even had a chance. Senna's case was completely different and made no sense, he was disqualified because he "cut" the track, after the collision, despite he lost like a minute, so clearly he didn't gain any advantage. Regarding 2008, I'm not trying to say Massa was better than Hamilton, but without the technical DNFs, it would have been a clear victory for him, and nobody ever would have argued on if he deserved it or not. But I also agree that Hamilton's penalty here didn't make much sense, since there was no rule made for how should you give back the position after going off the track.
@@AJzilllaProthe sound of those engines were just incredible. I used to frequent Spa and it didn’t matter where you were at the circuit, that noise would reverberate around the whole track and then when they got closer to where you were the screaming noise would have an almost visceral effect on just about every molecule in your body. And that’s without mentioning the Honda engines in Jensen and Rubens car which made you literally vibrate as they went past.
What the hell are tou talking about, in 07 Mclaren couldn't handle their drivers and had a serious affair of stolen documents. It's like saying that Vettel won is first title because Renault being engine partnership send Petrov to block Alonso and Webber.
Hamilton can only blame himself for this, he never gave back the advantage he gained and he never would have been in a position to overtake Kimi on the start-finish straight if he didn't cut the chicane.
Amazing win by Hamilton just like Silverstone, outclassed the field . I remember this race like it was yesterday and the injustice done there, Kimi was done and hamilton gave the place back then he crashed out anyway, he literally destroyed the field with massa like 20-30 seconds back . Fixed to bring Massa back into play
Had Hamilton not cut the chicane he would have been nowhere near to be able to overtake Kimi on the main straight, yet that is where he overtook him. Massive advantage gained by cutting the chicane, Hamilton can only blame himself for the time penalty. A smarter driver would have waited and overtake after the first corner.
Kimi did more then one defence manoeuvre on the main straight, nothing mentioned 🤔. Look at 3.11 kimi goes wide and gains a lot of momentum in doing so getting up to Lewis, isn’t That gaining an advantage? Oh I forgot kimi is driving a red car 🙄
@Mo Elm mostly of the times there is a driver in stewards and he has to put himself a driver vision for the 2 guys involved, so yes sometimes there is interpretation and different outcomes
@Mo Elm if you think the stewards are robots Yeah there is no interpretation. But whatever you say don't changes the fact that are humans who take this decisions and, yes they will interpret
@@avinash_8723 yeah but is funny that ppl are comparing this action with verstappen’s on this one hamilton didn’t give the position back… on the other one verstappen gave the position back in the next lap…
from 2006 the f1 was extremely rigged in favor of hamilton by pressure of the british press, shit like hamilton being the 5th out of the circuit cause of rain and the crew not only rescuing him, but putting him back on track with him inside, which is illegal.
Wasn't robbed. Are you seriously claiming Hamilton would have been in a position to overtake Kimi on the start-finish straight if he had not cut the chicane? Yet that is where Hamilton overtook because he gained massive advantage by cutting the chicane. He never gave back that advantage and can only blame himself for the penalty incurred.
And pathetic that the result was changed to such a classic finish. At the end of the day kimi crashed out so there was no advantage. Very poor decision, similar to a certain 2021 race.
Had Hamilton not cut the chicane he would not have been able to overtake Kimi on the start-finish straight. It's irrelevant that Kimi later crashed out. Hamilton can only blame himself for the time penalty.
It wasn't about the place, had Hamilton not cut the chicane he would have been nowhere near to overtake Raikkonen on the main straight, which is where he overtook. He gained massively by cutting the chicane and can only blame himself for the time penalty he received. If Hamilton were smart, he would have waited and overtaken Raikkonen later. Hamilton lost the race all by himself.
I thought Lewis was robbed at the time, but looking back at it, the advantage he gained was very significant. It is not from the slipstream per se. If he had slowed to make the chicane, then his momentum would have been lost and he would not have been in a position to be in the slipstream at all. He would not have been anywhere near Kimi. There is simply no way the pass at La Source could have taken place without his cutting at the Bus Stop. He could have simply backed out of it and made the chicane, the evasive cut of the entire chicane was not necessary to avoid a collision. This can be seen at 1:52. He could have either made a quick juke to the left or just backed out of it entirely. Either move would have put him back through the chicane as he should have done. Cutting it entirely set up the move at La Source in a way that either of those would not have, however. All these years later, I think they got it right.
right but isn't that why he promptly gave the place back? this is a very ambiguous situation but if i recall, there was no rule stating that after giving the place back, you cannot repass until x amount of time/corner(s) or, give the place back and set yourself up for an overtake (slipstream).
The argument massi used was “you don’t see overtakes there” I’d counter that and say that with dry tyres on a wet track you see overtakes in places you’d never see normally.
Raikkonen ran him out of room when they were side by side at the Bus Stop; if KR takes the type of line he did when they were battling at Monza '18, odds are Hamilton's through. LH lost momentum on a straight and Raikkonen got back through, under the rules at that time Hamilton did nothing wrong. Your original instincts were correct.
cuando Raikkonen perdió la oportunidad de ser campeón otra vez y mas adelante Felipe Masa no podría lograr el campeonato , consiguiéndolo Lewis Hamilton a lo ultimo
Nobody ever seems to notice how Glock pitted for tyres in this race, but not in Interlagos the same year. History could have been very different if he had learned from this race.
hamilton was ahead of glock. if glock had pitted, he would have just ended up following hamilton. glock's strategy of staying out actually gave him a few places hence it was the best and quickest strategy. the opposite is true. glock staying out is what would have potentially made massa world champion
The rule is clear: "If the pilot out, can't take advantage". Hamilton give the position, but he was taking a vacuum, he out and take advantage. Penalty is clear.
At least Hamilton got his revenge over Ferrari in 2019 in Canada with Vettel. As Raikkonen failed to finish the penalty should have been irrelevant or not worth looking into. Massa was nowhere near to winning this race.
I did that to Hamilton in Monaco cutting Turn 16, going wide at turn 17, giving back the position just to overtake again at the end of turn 17 and getting P2😂 in F12020 .. loved the justice
