Hands down the best explanation of installing these front derailleurs. Couple of tricks around positioning of derailleur prior to cable tensioning... also setting low limit flush with big chain ring is key before playing with cable tension. Only video that nailed it for me thanks 👍
Just installed a R8000 FD for the first time. Opinions on the www seem to say it is a nightmare to install but this video allowed me to install and tune with ease, easier than old 6800 FD! Many thanks man!
Thank you sir! I’ve probably set up five or six of these already and each time I do it I forget all the steps. They work great when they’re set up but really wish Shimano didn’t try and reinvent the front derailleur.
Great video. My FD is very stiff to move up to big cog. Shifter runs nice and easy if cable disconnected from FD. Is this just a firm spring tension? I'm fed up of grimacing each time i change up from small to big cog.
Great video and very helpful information. One of the best describing installation and adjustment of shimano FD derailleurs of 5801, R8000 and R9100. Thank you!
Great Video Thanks. Hopefully setting mine up tomorrow. anyone has been running these for a while now? I have the 5800 one but as Joey says, on my frame it's hard to get that first pull. I've had to hack it and thread the cable round the top, as that was the only way it worked. It worked fine for about 1.5 years but I guess the strain has won and the left shifter is now packed in, shame cause the rest of the groupset is brill. Hopefully this new design will be easier on the shifters. I have an suspicion that that's why Shimano decided to upgrade to 5801 all of a sudden...is not like they like to give us "Trickle Up" technology. Cheers again for the vid.
First when you set up the cable tension using the screw you tightened all the way in. At the end of the video it was almost all the way out unscrewed . Why ?
The first time I installed one of these derailleurs I just couldn't get the tension right, those white lines just refused to line up. It turns out I had taken that "tighten well" advice everyone gives a bit too seriously, and actually over tightened the cable. And you can use the tension adjuster to take out slack if the cable is too loose, but you can't use it to get slack in a cable that's too tight...
After you aligned those white lines using the front deraileur (FD) cable tensioning hex screw, did you micro click the front deraileur again to drop the derailleur where it would be if in 1st gear? Does the FD need to be all the way down before setting the final lower limit screw adjustment?
You set the white lines together 1 micro click down from the very top or shift all the way up to the big ring, as far as the derailleur will go, micro shift down 1 click, set the white lines. All the way down to set low limit screw and all the way up to set the high limit screw.
@@JoeyMesa Do you leave it one micro cick down when you ajust the Lower limit screw which is the next step or do micro click it all the way down and then do the lower limt adjustment?
Actually, it's best you set the lower limit before even connecting the cable. You want to make sure the FD arm can go against the limit screw and not be held back by the cable. If it's connected first, you run the risk of there being tension in the cable still when clicked all the way down, and you don't want to resort to using the cable trim adjuster to let the FD move down more.
Hi Joey. As of recently, sometimes (say 10% of the times), when trying to shift to the big ring, the front derailleur (FD-R9100) won't move all the way toward the stem *in one go* and will only allow a micro shift. Only then, when the micro shift is done and I have released the shifter (ST-R9120) from my hand, will it allow me to move it all the way toward the stem in order to shift to the big ring. I am pretty sure that the derailleur is set up properly. What could be the cause of the problem? Cable is about 9 months old. Thanks in advance for your reply.
I haven't really seen this issue on any of the 9100 series stuff yet. I've seen it many times on the shifters from a few years ago. Generally it's either some debris in the shifter (usually a piece of broken cable strand), a cable that's starting to fray or something broken in the shifter. Shimano has a 3 year warranty on Dura Ace components, so I would first check the cable and make sure all is good there, if it's fine, I'd look into the nearest Shimano dealer and see about a possible warranty replacement. Shimano is generally pretty good at taking care of stuff like this unless there's obvious crash damage to the shifter. Thanks for your question!
@@JoeyMesa I haven't replaced the cable/housing yet but noticed that in the manual Shimano refers to two trim positions for the left shifter lever: the L-trim (low trim, all the way down) and the T-trim (high trim, one click before all the way up) positions. Accordingly, the low (not low trim) position of the shifter in order to have the chain on the small ring is not all the way down (L-trim) but one click before that. The issue I'm facing is when trying to shift the chain *in one go* from all the way down (L-trim) to all the way up. However it works fine when trying to shift from the normal low (not all the way down / low trim) position to the big ring. Could it be that it is just meant to work this way? Namely, that for riding purposes you never shift all the way down to the trim position but to one click short of that, from where there is in fact no problem shifting to the big ring in one go? Black magic indeed!
From the very lowest position, you should be able to go all the way to the highest position in one motion. When you're in the big ring and you shift down, you have to shift the small paddle once more to go to the furthest trim position down.
Thanks! Let me know if you have a question about a critical spot that was too dark to see. I can always make another video pin pointing that area and going over it a little more in depth.
Great, I'm glad you found the video helpful! On front derailleurs in general, depending on several factors (stiffness of the derailleur assembly, chainline, chainstay length Etc.) sometimes derailleurs work better angled a little in or sometimes out. On all front derailleurs with the stabilization screw, I like to start with the rear of the derailleur angled inwards slightly, then tighten the stabilization screw just enough to get the derailleur parallel to the chainrings. I feel like that little bit of preload helps the overall rigidity of the set up. Plus it's easy to fine tune the angle of the derailleur in or out a degree or so to the final setting, which does work better in some configurations. Thanks for your feedback!
Before you tighten down on the cable clamp, you should set your lower limit screw to clearance the chain when in the small ring front and big in the back, then also on the FD, there is a cable tension screw that should be backed out and make sure the turnbuckle that the cable gets clamped in is turned clockwise so it's resting against the tension screw, before you clamp the cable into it. Hope that makes sense, but you didn't even bother to mention that when you clamped the cable down.
On the second generation 11 speed front derailleurs, it's difficult to get the cable tight enough unless you clamp it down with the low limit screw initially set so the outer cage is parallel to the big ring. Seems like a very counterintuitive step, but that's how it was demonstrated to me by our Shimano rep, as well as the process shown in the Shimano tech documents. Once the cable is secure, you back the low limit screw down to it's normal big cog/small ring with some clearance between the chain setting. You're correct that I should have mentioned that the cable tension adjuster should be all the way out before clamping the cable, which would be true if someone were installing a new cable, but a new derailleur out of the box will already have the adjuster screw all the way out. Thanks for your feedback!
Well, as long as you have slight cable slack when the FD is at its lowest click, so that the FD is resting on the correctly set lower limit screw and not being held back by the cable, after the trim marks are aligned properly.
Hi! I have the lowest GRX group, and have some problems with the front derailleur. It seems that I have to screw the high limit all the way in to be able to switch to the large gear. What could be the problem?
My first guess would be the cable tension is too low/slack. I made another video on this front derailleur system (5801, 700, 800, and 9100) that is the same as the GRX mechanical derailleurs that may be helpful. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-42bSAnk9_zQ.html
Another interesting aspect of this generation of FDs is the relationship of the upper and lower limit screws. Tough to visualize with one in your hand but. The lower limit is as usual. It works off a bracket, however the upper limit screw works off of the part of the parallelogram that is moved out by the lower limit screw. It is not like a tradition upper limit ‘stopper screw’. So unlike a traditional FD, on this version if after you’ve set it up, and go back and change your lower limit screw, to my eyes that will affect your upper limit adjustment, and it should be checked again.
Hi Joey First of all , although still a struggle , I would never have been able to fit my FD6800 so thank you for that. I have now found this video and I am wondering whether its possible to replace the 6800 with this FD. Would it be possible and if it is would it be a lot easier to set up in your opinion. I ask this because I hate to think if my FD cable breaks I would have to struggle once again to set it up. Needless to say you now have another Sub.
The pull ratio is the same for all the newer style models as your 6800 front derailleur, so it's a cross compatible swap. They're probably equal in terms of set up time and skill level required, but at least the newer style has a cable tension adjuster built in.
According to the manual, you are supposed to use the L screw to get the derailleur to line up to the large chain ring, not the support screw in the middle. Then support screw and then your cable
If you go by the Shimano dealer manual, it's a combination of both. Yes, you want the derailleur initially positioned in the correct height position, then turn the L screw in until the outer cage of the derailleur is flush with the big chainring, but with the tail end of the derailleur angled inward about 1 degree. Then, as you preload the support screw into the backing plate or braze-on plate if it has a perch, the derailleur should end up parallel to the big chainring.
@@JoeyMesa handy concise tutorial though, thanks for uploading! For some reason, even when in top trim, I seem to have to sacrifice the ability to use my 3 inside (larger) cogs on the rear when in the large chain ring on front because it rubs the inside of the front derailleur (cross-chaining). It seems I have to tune the H screw to set the derailleur outboard more to not have noise/rubbing when in the large chain ring on front/small cog on back (required highly used gear combo). Do you find the same sacrifice has to be made or do you get some rubbing when cross chaining?
I tried your installation. After setting it up, i can't adjust the LOW bolt to gove clearance to the chain (smallest chainring in front and biggest at the back). It keeps on hitting the black/rubber thing. But i can adjust the high bolt. What is the problem?
@@JoeyMesa I already know why. After setting in the bolt for support (aligning the fd to the large chainring). I forgot to set the Low setting screw to where it doesn't touch the chain. Thanks
Before starting your installation and adjustment of the R8000 Front Derailleur (FD), do you loosen the (FD) cable thrumb screw nearly all the way so that that the cable is the most slack? Would this give you maximum tightening potentional as the cable stretches over time? How loose do you recommend that the FD cable be before starting the procedure as you have outlined in this video?
I like to start by turning the low limit screw in until the outer plate is out and in a parallel plane with the big chain ring. In addition to being able to set the height and angle of the derailleur, it's also the ideal position to tighten the cable in the anchor bolt. That will get you in the ballpark with only a turn or two of the micro adjuster and a couple turns of the low limit screw is about average to set the low limit. Here's Shimano's PDF with illustrations on how to follow the process. It's pretty much the same as the steps in the video: si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-RAFD001-02-ENG.pdf
@@JoeyMesaI reviewed your video before posting my question. I am sorry I am not explaining my question very well. Before going through your video procedure that you so nicely presented, you never made mention of where the thumb screw should be, before you start making derailleur adjustments. I am wondering how much tightening adjustment I should have in the FD thumb screw. Should I make available all of the cable to the procedure so that I have the maxium amount of thumb screw tightening potential or is there a reason to leave a certain amount of cable lossening potential to the thumb screw? If this does not make sense, can you go back and review again my prior question. Pehaps between the two you can make sense of them. Sorry if I am amiss on any terminology.
I guess I'm not understanding what you are describing as the "thumb screw"? I'm thinking it's the micro adjustment screw or what Shimano refers to it as the cable adjustment barrel? If so, I just start with it backed out to the point of where the little nub on the plate that holds the cable in place is rotated clockwise as far as it will go. Backing the cable adjustment barrel past this point will not make any difference as the plate with the nub can't physically rotate any further clockwise. A new derailleur comes pre set in this position. If we're still not on the same page, you might look at the Shimano PDF as they have descriptions and illustrations of all the crucial parts.
@@JoeyMesa Thank you, yes, it is the cable adjustment barrel that loosens and tightens the cable tension. I thinking it should be loosened nearlly all the way (except for maybe a couple of turns) before doing the deraileur cable installation and adjustment. The thinking there is that it is unlikely that the cable will never need to be lossened once the derailleur is adjusted, as the cable will only stretch and never tighten with use. Can you confirm this aspect of the procedure?
@@mro4056 Yes, that's correct. Generally, most cable stretch will occur in the initial set up, and you may find upon adjusting the cable tension that you end up using all the adjuster or turn it all the way in. If thats the case, you may have to back it out, reset the process by loosening the cable anchor bolt and pulling out the excess slack, retighten the bolt and then readjust the barrel adj til the white lines line up.
Yes, that can happen. Make sure you pull on the end of the cable and make sure the tabbed washer under the bolt is rotated clockwise as far as possible before you tighten the bolt.
I can't seem to find anything explaining how to determine the correct setting for the cable throw on the older 11sp shimano FDs. You show the FD in the beginning. Apparently there's a way to take a piece of it out and flip it around and that changes the throw/pull?
It's dependent on the angle that the shift cable routes from the BB to the front derailleur. There's a lot to this answer, so I'll make a video in a day or two. I have this style derailleur currently on my road bike.
Joey Mesa I would really appreciate that!! I've been unable to get the shifter to work cleanly. The chain is rubbing significantly on either the high or low no matter what I try. I've read the schematics sheet and tried the little "cable in" piece in both positions but don't have the tool needed to correctly determine the position. The stabilization screw is in the right place. I'm using an old orange lemond poprad (steel cx bike). The only thing I haven't tried yet is moving the BB cable guide from the most lateral position where it is currently and into the more centered position. Overall, it seems like I'm just not able to pull enough cable. If I tighten up the barrel adjuster, it just rubs a ton in the small ring position. Another issue is possibly the chain angle. When I set up the resting position before attaching the cable and get everything flush using the Allen wrench trick, it is rubbing the inner plate of the FD through almost all of the rear cogs. But then when I back off the lower limit screw, it won't shift into the big ring anymore. Thank you so much for your help!!!
I got a new video up of the process I use, plus some experimenting with the converter pin. Hopefully it's helpful! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-n8EyRpb1ibo.html
Hey Bro, Thank you very much for the extremely useful and well presented video instructions. I have been struggling with the Ultegra FD-R800 on my 2018 Giant TCR. After following this vid it is working much better. Bike has very few miles, less than 200 miles. But for some reason on my TCR, when chain is on largest cog 30, and large chain ring 50, the chain is making extreme noise, I confirmed several times that the chain is NOT rubbing on the front derailleur cage. I checked clearance on both sides and there is more than 0.5 mm clearance. Sounds like a rattle sound. Also using small chainring 34, and 3 smallest cogs in rear, serious chain rub on front derailleur, and I can't trim the FD to eliminate the rub. And If i setup the derailleur to eliminate chain rube in this configuration, serious chain rube in other combinations??? Any idea why this is so noisy. I have 105 11-32/50-34 on my aluminum bike and the chain is silent in all gear combinations. What can be the cause of the noise on my TCR
Thanks for the question! In general, whenever you ride in a cross chain type gear (big ring/big cog or small ring/small cog) combination, it's going to be noisier because the chain is at an extreme angle going from one gear to the other. In the case of the big/big combo, as the drivetrain breaks in a little more, say 500 miles or so, it should get quieter, but in general, you want to avoid prolonged riding in these cross chain gears. The small/small combo will always make noise. In this gear the chain will start to contact the edge of the big ring. If you find yourself in the small ring and are going down into the bottom small dogs, go ahead and shift to the big ring and up a couple gears in the rear. It's about the same gear ratio, but much quieter and less stress on your drivetrain.
@@JoeyMesa Hi Joey, Thanks for the reply. much appreciated. I guess the big ring noise on my TCR is from cross-chain combinations, and the noise appears to be amplified by the carbon frame and Shimano Ultegra chain ring. I have an aluminum Giant Contend with Shimano 105 and that bike is silent in all combinations. Take care Bro, be well...
Generally if it's a new derailleur, where it's set out of the box is fine. If it's a current derailleur, adjusted by some inexperienced mechanics, maybe start with it around the middle of being half way out.
Ultimately, it's the responsibility of the mechanic who assembled the bike. I will say I see this particular style of front derailleur set up incorrectly on all brands of bikes, so you're definitely not alone.
You could in a pinch, but it wouldn't work well. Something like a Tiagra flat bar shifter would give you all the correct trim points to work with these derailleurs.
On this particular bike, the edge of the braze on mount was at an angle. Mounting the plate butted up against the braze on at an angle seemed like the most logical way to allow the screw to contact the center of the plate. As long as the plate is secure and serves its purpose, I don't know any reason why it wouldn't work. Please let me know if you know a better way with this style braze on mount. Thanks for your feedback!
Joey Mesa, as per Shimano shop manual: Check the position where the support bolt directly touches the frame when the support bolt of the front derailleur is being adjusted, and attach the backup plate in that position. In addition, avoid positioning the tape that attaches the backup plate to the seat tube in the location where the support bolt directly touches the frame.
@@Onkelrico If you watch carefully you'll see that: 1- The position was checked where the support bolt touches the frame with the derailleur in the position it would eventually be mounted (a small mark was made by the support bolt) 2- The derailleur was temporarily removed and the backing plate was attached to the frame and centered as best as possible with the available spot to stick it on. Ideally, the backup plate should have been mounted inwards a bit more in order to get it in the center of the support bolt contact point, but the edge of the braze on mount attached to the frame interfered with that location, therefore I had to work with the available space I had to apply the backup plate. Does that make sense?
Joey Mesa I guess so. I would’ve flipped it around, you don’t want the adhesive tape/foam under the contact point, as it gives and introduces flex in the derailleur.....
