Should I Give My Claim Document To A Roofer? 

Thats the best explanation possible for why to share your estimate. If your state has laws that enforce deductibles to be paid your only priorities should be the quality of work and the contractual agreement the homeowners only out of pocket is the deductible.

You can. Just scrub out the cost

Out of 100 insurance claims, show me 5 which got it right. Why would I want to agree to do a job that pays too little? That doesn't make any sense.

@@homesteadroofing the company I work for _only_ follows the insurance enstimate. Whether it's high or low, we do it for that to the penny, and the homeowner is only ever responsible for the deductible (plus any upgrades). We win some here, and lose some there, but it all balances that out in the end. The point is that the customer _always_ wins, and that's what's good for business.

Agreed.

@@homesteadroofing Well in an instance where a insurance company is actually paying for a full replacement of someone's roof, here in Florida, they consistently pay higher than market rate. So why wouldn't I want to do the work for more money?

We're in Colorado and it's not that way at all here. Working with insurance companies here is awful in many cases. Here are 4 of my most recent jobs. 1. Standard sized asphalt shingle roof - Insurance company short by $5200 (they didn't include required IWS). 2. Small mountain cabin shingle roof - Insurance company short by $2800 (they didn't include required IWS and decking). 3. Asphalt shingles, gutters, painting - Insurance company short by $4600 (their scope of the loss was less than actual). 4. Presidio tile - Insurance company short by $17,900 (they had no clue what Presidio is). So if I told the homeowners I would do the work for the amount of the claim, just on those 4 jobs I would be short $30,500, which is impossible to sustain a business with. We had one prospect recently who has AmFam. Their claim amount was literally about 10% over actual costs of material and labor. No roofer can stay in business at those margins. The owner's house was up for sale and getting a new roof was a contingency for the sale. He couldn't get a new roof at the amount the insurance company had put in the claim, so it screwed up his house sale. That's why I say it doesn't make any sense to do the work for the claim amount. 95 out of 100 claims have to be supplemented or the margins are way too small to sustain our business.

If you've already sent him the scope of work from the claim and it has the prices on it, it could be that he's trying to find out a couple of other things, like - 1. What is your deductible. He may want to know this so he can offer to pay some or all of it. 2. What is your coverage. Is it Replacement Cost or Actual Cash. He may want to know this so he knows how much your out of pocket will be 3. One other thing that you have to be careful of... If your claim has items other than the roof, those will be included in the total claim amount. Something dishonest roofers will do is they will then set their price for the roof replacement based on the **whole claim amount.** If you sign a contract for that amount, that's what you're paying for the roof. You then end up giving the roofer all the money, even the money for other items in the claim. 4. He also may want to know if there's Overhead and Profit built into the claim. This is an additional 20% over and above all the line item totals to pay a GC to subcontract the work. For example, there may be roof, gutters, windows, and paint in your claim. If you hire a GC, he needs to make money on top of what he's paying the subs. So if he hires a window sub, and that sub is charging the GC $1000 for the work, then the claim may have $200 in it to pay the GC for coordinating and managing the sub's work. That's legit. But, if you're hiring a roofer, he will already be building in his overhead and profit into his quote. So let's say if your roofer were to write a quote for your roof, and it comes out to $15,000, that would include his company's overhead and profit in it. If you give him the whole claim doc and there's O&P in it, he can add that to his "estimate" and make an additional 20% on the job when he doesn't have to do anything extra for it. Stick to your guns and tell him to write his quote for your roof. It sounds like there's red flags already though.

@@homesteadroofing To clarify, my claim statement is 7 pages. I only sent the contractor the one page that lists the scope. The scope is broken down into quantity and price of materials / labor, including waste factor, and additional for steep roof. It is all laid out. I did remove ALL pricing. As you mentioned, I don't want contractors creating a proposal with dollar amounts based off of the dollar amount in the claim. "You have the scope the insurance is covering, give me a proposal based off of that. If we agree that the adjuster missed something, then we can go back to the adjuster to suggest supplementation." Agree?

@@jimmynavarro8056 Perfect plan!

I think you're doing the right thing!! Stay the course.

That is typically the process. If you get a check for your roof, the roofer is supposed to do the roof for what the insurance pays, if you do it for less you won’t get to keep the money for that..

You can always tell him what you want done. Or you can give him the redacted insurance claim if you don't want him to have the prices.

@@homesteadroofing What I’ve done so far with a new roofer from a neighbor’s recommendation is: he came out and inspected the roof, and I told him the 2 skylights, gutters and downspouts were on it. Then he’s given 2 days to prepare his estimate. Tomorrow we meet again and then we’ll compare his estimate with the insurance company’s estimate.

@@KingArtexerxes That's smart!

Everything about that scenario is a red flag. She is under no obligation to this roofer. She should talk to some others. Check Directorii.com for reputable contractors in her area.

I can't say that the contractor you're dealing with is unethical in the big picture, but what he's asking you to do would cause me to be uneasy. I'm sure you can find a different contractor who won't do that. Try directorii.com to see if you can find a different one in your area.

Agreed

What city are you in? I may be able to recommend a roofer where you are.

@@homesteadroofing St. Louis - Wow. I'd love a recommendation. BTW, no one here seems to be able to get CertainTeed Northgate for 4-6 months! You've got it all in Colorado - want to ship me some? Ha, ha. You've got us convinced on Northgate and now we don't want anything else. We're willing to wait, if we have to.

@@homesteadroofing We don't seem to be able to get CertainTeed Northgate around here in St. Louis for 4-6 months. Crazy! We really wanted to get that, based on your review and our research. You can get a much better extended warranty if we use a Select Master, too. If we go with Malarkey, we won't get that - and there's not much experience here among St. Louis roofers with Malarkey. After watching all your videos and reading your educational materials, we really wanted a Class 4 Impact Resistant shingle. We got more hail storms this year than ever before, and I think that's a trend that going to continue. On the map showing hail prone areas, ours is red. We're just trying to put together a plan for the best roof possible. We love all your tips from shingles to Pipe Flashing. Thank you. Wish our roofers were more into all the things you mention.

I completely agree!

The claim documents *do not* tell a homeowner "to show the estimate to the contractor they choose." The claim document *does* say, "Should you or the contractor you select have questions concerning our estimate, please contact us." And also, "We will provide you with a detailed estimate of the scope of the damage and costs of repairs. Should the contractor you select have questions concerning our estimate, they should contact your claim representative directly." But a homeowner is neither encouraged or required to show a contractor a claim document.

Not true. Mine said exactly what OP stated here

I think XM8 is unnecessary. It's expensive, cumbersome for a new person to try to learn, and doesn't provide any benefit. Our success rate with supplements increased 2x - 3x when we stopped using XM8. Then we stopped worrying about trying to fight with insurance companies for supplements and just charge what we charge. Much less stress and saves me at least $1600 a year not having to use XM8.

@@homesteadroofing I see, maybe one day I’ll figure out how to do that. Haven’t had good luck when I was supplementing on the back end.

That makes no sense. Why supplement? The insurance company is not your customer. The homeowner is. The insurance company doesn't pay you to supplement their claim.

Happy to help if needed

Why are you getting multiple estimates from contractors? If they give you an estimate that's lower, you will just get less back on your depreciation. You see, you must pay your deductible amount whatever that is. If not, and you try to put money in your pocket, that's insurance fraud.

@@dennishuffstutler9820 I never got multiple estimates. I went with a reputable roof contractor, showed them my insurance estimate, they replaced the roof. Not sure I understand where you’re going with your comment. At first, I thought I had to get multiple estimates, but didn’t have to.

@@rachc5496 You said right in your comment "I will get multiple estimates from contractors".

@@dennishuffstutler9820 Yes, that was prior to understanding how the process worked. Once I understood, I did not get multiple estimates.

As long as they're getting an increase in the claims high enough to pay for their services, it's worth it. I've never understood why companies pay for "claims services" to increase claim amounts but it's not high enough to compensate for the cost of the claims services. Makes no sense.

That's a great question about a tragic situation. I'm sorry but I just saw this comment a couple minutes ago. I hope you haven't done anything on this yet. Step 1: lawyer up. You don't have to actually hire one - just have one ready in case it comes to that. Step 2: If your mom doesn't have a copy of the contract, there is no contract. If they won't give you or her a copy, you can simply walk away from them. Step 3: If they do produce a contract, read through it very carefully. If you don't understand it, have your lawyer read through it. It's very rare that someone would be obligated to pay any money to a contractor who hasn't done any work or bought any materials. You should be good to tell the contractor to get lost. I'm interested to hear about how this goes.

It depends on the roofer. Just ask him.

It may not be a red flag, but it certainly causes my radar to go off. This is an organization with "certifies" "forensic" inspectors - www.nrcia.org/ I've never heard of them before. Here's an article from a roofer local to my area about forensic inspections - interstateroof.com/what-is-a-forensic-roof-inspection/ Check those out and see if you feel comfortable moving forward with your roofer.

Wow!

Generally, it's the contractor and homeowner that decide on the price of the project, not the insurance company - but that could depend on what the laws are in your state. No, I'm absolutely not in favor of homeowners keeping their insurance money. I do believe that's insurance fraud. Yes, what you said makes sense.

That's not a bad idea. For shingles, I can definitely recommend the CertainTeed Northgate. It's what I have on my own house.

Sure, if the roofer is asking to be there, that's not normally a problem. I would suggest that you be present, too, if you can. And watch the interaction between the roofer and the adjuster.

That depends primarily on one thing. Your insurance policy. Your policy is the contract you have with the insurance company. Most policies will have a statement that you, as the insured, are not allowed to profit from the claim. However, if you have Actual Cash Value coverage, you will only get one check. So if they send you a check for $11,000 and your roofer will do the work for $9000, the extra $2000 is yours. If you have Replacement Cost Value coverage, you will get 2 checks. The 2nd one is the depreciation check. To get that, your insurance company must receive an invoice for the work. Let's use the numbers in your example for this: RCV claim, so you get 2 checks. The 2nd check sent to you after the company receives an invoice for the amount of the project. If the claim is $12,900, and your deductible is $2000, you will receive $10,900 from the insurance company. In order for you to receive the full $10,900 in the 2 checks, the invoice you send them must be $12,900. If the invoice is for $10,900, then the total amount the insurance company will send you will be $8900. If the invoice is $8900, then you'll only get $6900. If you send them an invoice from the roofer that says $12,900, but your roofer only charges you $10,900, or $8900, both of you have just committed insurance fraud. Good question. Hope this clarifies!

@@homesteadroofing thanks for replying back! I’m just going to pay the deductible and be done with it. :)

That's fraud If you hire a roofer to do for less money many people behind the bars If the insurence company pay you 10.000 they do xactimate on the job if you did for less they will do audit collect the rest of the money the insurence never loss money.

If you have RCV do you have to ask for the second check? Example: claim pays 10,000$ - 2,000 deductible. Homeowner is mailed a check for $8,000. Roofer charges 9,000. Can a homeowner just pay the extra 1k and be done with rcv?

This guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

That's not a problem

Nope. Completely disagree.

@@homesteadroofing hahah we know

No. The deductible is paid to your contractor. It's your share of the cost of the project. Your insurance company pays the major share, and you pay the minor share.

​@homesteadroofing My question is how much in percentage is it normal to pay a contractor upfront ? My insurance adjuster estimates around 19,000. My deductible is 7800. Only received insurance check for 4800 due to depreciation.😢 My contractor said he needed My 7800 plus the 4800 if I agree to the contracted price. I know materials don't cost that much.... What do you recommend?? Thanks

Educate yourself and ask a lot of questions. It's your home and you deserve excellent treatment and service from any contractor. For all you or they know, you could become the CEO of a successful business and need a roof on your mansion! Would I want to be the roofer that treated you well when you lived in a tiny house before you got rich and successful, or would I want to be the roofer who passed on your little job in search of a "better" job? A contractor should treat every homeowner as he would want to be treated.

Maybe you could clarify your comment/questions because what you wrote doesn't really make sense.

@@homesteadroofing without the insurance scope of work how is a roofer suppose to get his instructions on what is approved? Isn’t that the instructions on what is to be done? The homeowner is not a general contractor, wouldn’t it be easier to advise customers to find a reputable contractor with credentials? Getting bids on something the adjuster has already written up is asking for insurance fraud to occur? I wouldn’t mix the 80’s industry model with a 2024 HB2102 industry like you are doing.

@@hcuhoustonchristiansunited3877 Well maybe things work differently in Houston (although I have a friend who owns a large roofing company there, and I don't think it does), but if you're a roofer, *you're* the expert on what is needed to replace a roof. The adjuster doesn't know much about it, if anything at all. So the roofer is the one who decides what the scope of work is, not the adjuster.

Friend a PA so you can get maximum amount, seriously.

I would not trust that person. And that's why the homeowner should be your customer, not the insurance company.

The homeowner is the customer and not the insurance company. These insurance companies do not want to pay a homeowner appropriately in a claim and homeowners are clueless they are getting screwed most of the time. It has absolutely nothing to do with being lazy. It's about making sure the home owner is getting what they deserve and are properly owed. These insurance companies are NOT stepping up to take care of their customers. One cannot properly take care of the customer (homeowner) without all the proper information and in most insurance claim situations one has to get an attorney involved for the homeowner to be properly paid by their insurance company for their claim. It's very sad for homeowners trying to properly be paid for their claims. You are giving people wrong information!!

You answered your own question... "they are always missing line items intentionally and at least 10k short..."

@homesteadroofing sorry bigdog a bit of a misunderstanding, I talking about doing the job for the entirety of what it pays after properly supplemented and to a number that actually reflects what it costs to do the job correctly, not this give me an estimate and I will pick the lowest chuck and a truck so I can get something cool with my insurance lotto winnings,...I absolutely despise that mentality, it keeps the bad names around giving our already defamed industry a steeper hill to climb, the insurance loss summary are our marching orders, supplementing loss summaries correctly keeps businesses alive, knowing this process keeps the cream of the crop on top, and the chucks and a truck in their truck and on to the next chuck town...........Mr.Chuck

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I had a Roofing Contractor give me a estimate on my roof. $24,300.00. He told me once they start the job if theres any problems or extras he would let me know, it was also written in the contract! When they were finished. We were all happy. FINAL BILL $24,300.00. The Man gets paid in full. 6 months later the company sends me a brand new bill. $29,600.00. My homeowners insurance State Farms estimate was $29,600.00. They made up a separate bill and never communicated to me.