Show jumping in the 1960's Featuring Hickstead and Douglas Bunn 

Ignorant comment.

I think some of the saddles that have no saddlepad have a little padding underneath but not enough t9 keep the horse comfy

Have we? It seems like much hasn't changed at all.

@@almondjoytheoofer140 The saddle pad was made to protect the saddle from sweat, so lazy didn't need to clean it. If you need to use a specific saddle pad on your horse, it means that the saddle doesn't fit your horse. How is that better than a perfectly fitted saddle?

@@Galemor1 u know nothing LMAO

@@Galemor1 That’s… not what saddlepads are for..

Jason Saggs To make sure he doesn't forget to take it with him. 😁

Most accidents are at home ;-)

The fact they also just sat on his head without anything to hold it in place.

@@Ceciel_ When the hat fit properly it was tight around the head and shaking the head while bending over or upright was part of the testing to make sure that it fit properly!! After 15 or 20 minutes at a show with my helmet on, when I took it off, I would always have a crease across my forehead where the helmet had been!! So it didn't "just sit there"!! ☺

yep🤣🥲🥲

But 55 pounds at that times was like 550 pounds maybe. I am not English but I inflation and salaries are different from decades ago.

Lol

You forget to adjust for inflation.

Omg the swinging leg. Gripping with the knee let’s the rider pivot instead of being firm with the thigh to stay in place. These days you see a lot less of that flapping around, but it still is out there even at Grand Prix level

omg

Yeah it would be so much cheaper and that the saddle in their day was specially fitted? So cheap for such a good quality saddle to :-)

£55 back then is the equivalent of £1143 today. Still a very good price for a hand made specially fitted saddle of course.

Make that around ~500 adjusted for inflation.

I laughed my ass off, sorry but i did. god I wish county was that cheap

S

that was 60 years ago

the working salary was maby 3 pounds an hour.. remember inflation was not a hudge issue back then

Working around 20 hours to then afford the cost of a horse doesn’t sound too bad … can’t quite do that nowadays ;(

+babsfocker Sorry Babs but horses don't necessarily buck because they are in pain. Just take your horse to the paddock and let it run free then see how it bucks. After nearly 60 years around horses I have only had a handful that didn't buck when you do that.

Saddle pads keep the saddle clean, basically. They don't make the saddle fit better. We always rode without saddle pads back in the day, but the saddles were very soft, and very well-fitted. Never had a problem. The only time I caused a sore on a horse was a girth gall on a horse's belly because I put a leather girth on backwards. Had to ride bareback for a couple of weeks. Whereas today, I rescued a horse from a jumping lesson barn who had bald spots on his back from a badly fitted saddle - using a saddle pad. Another horse in that lesson barn was clearly in pain from a poorly made saddle. Ours also had scars on his withers from a poorly fitted blanket. Saddles are often stiff and badly made, poorly fitted. Saddle pads do not equal comfort That has to come from the saddle itself, how well fitted it is to the horse

A properly fitting saddle doesn't need a saddle pad. Originally they were used to protect the saddle, not the horse. Still true today: If you NEED a saddle pad, it's likely your saddle doesn't fit correctly.

Just a guess, but it looks like the horse was barefoot behind (for who knows how long), and then they put shoes on it. It was probably not lameness but the horse getting used to the hind shoes.

I definitely agree with the lameness on the longe, but as for the bucking, I had a mare that bucked over every single solitary fence just for the hell of it. She never had any soundness issues, she just bucked. It was like her way of expressing herself, I suppose. Boredom, maybe? Spunk? LOL.

To be honest, the horse was bucking after recently getting hind shoes put on, and if you look at his behavior, he looks like he's trying to rid himself of something, which could very well be cause by the new shoes. He doesn't buck in the showjump ring at all, at least that I saw. As for being lame on the lunge, when was that? When he was leaning in towards the center and running on his forehand and considering picking up a canter? That's not lameness. That's an excited, unbalanced horse. Look again after he breaks from the canter. His trot's a little quick, but even as a metronome. Don't be an armchair veterinarian, or so judgmental. Yes, times have changed, but that horse looked like it had top care. I would bet my car it wasn't lame.

***** Agreed. My horse did while he was still very green and didn't have the power/fitness to keep himself balanced. LOTS of trot work and "long and low" riding fixed that pretty well. And the bucking is usual of an opinionated young horse with his first pair of hind shoes.

I knew I wasn`t the only one who noticed this!!

"Although you can buy a horse and have fun in small shows for £50-80..." The modern equivalent is £1038-1661. Which isn't that far off for a hobby-horse tbh.

You need to adjust for inflation.

A saddle pad is only there to protect the saddle from the horse sweat. So a horse doesn't need a saddle pad under the saddle.

@@jentehestegal188 You are so wrong

@@billie3811 Why am I so wrong?? Please explain it to me!

@@jentehestegal188 A saddle pad is mainly to keep the riders weight from coming down hard on the horses back that's why pads aren't thin pieces of material

@@billie3811 in this case you are just a bad rider. These big pads under the saddle are used when the saddle fits the horse not 100% perfect. I was talking about the saddle pads (or saddle cloth maybe??), these thin squared pads. Maybe we have a translation misunderstanding here. If I translate saddle pad into my language (german), it means the thin ones you can buy now in nearly every colour you like, with glitter on it or what ever you like.

Sense at last. Those commenting about numnahs obviously have never had a bespoke saddle made for their horse...a Master saddler makes a saddle that fits like a glove, or bespoke leather shoes.

If I spent hundreds on a hunk of leather, I sure would want something between it and a sweaty hunk of horsehide! Pad, blanket, cloth... something to protect that leather from horse foam.

@@Oakleaf700 and do you wear thousand dollar shoes without socks? I'd hate my bespoke leather ANYTHING getting sweated up. That is what a saddle cloth is for.

You absolutely need a saddle pad always if you don't have one not only is your weight coming down harder on the horses back but the saddle is moving and causing friction which leads to saddle soars

I was thinking that as well. Pain or expressing/warning that he was not going to take much more. It was always the same kick though, so maybe a sore back?

@@bethrappeport9381 when the horse bucks after a jump it indicates blockade of sacroiliac joint usually or general back problems

I agree with you. Swishing of the tail is a warning from the horse. The next level is to buck off the rider. But holding his head so high with tight reins and sawing his mouth, prevents him from being able to execute his will to get away from the pain. I'm appaled by the narrator's comment about a jumping horse performing well until he is about 15 years old. I've seen a 15 year old TB mare who had been a jumper. She became a lesson horse. When that was not possible anymore, she was sold as a trail horse. The hind legs were ruined and she had dropped fetlocks. I think that she also had ring bone on the front legs, I saw another horse who had been a jumper and he also had dropped fetlocks. A horse who was trained and riden correctly (Natural collection) to build muscle mass on the back, can still be riden until his early 30's and even later. With a head so high and tight reins results in a sway back. I've seen a 40 year old who could still trail ride with moderation. He died at 41. I've seen another who was 42. I could have been fooled that they were about 23-25 years old. When I was younger, all I would hear is that a horse is only good until he is 20 years old. After that, they were considered too old and useless. What a pity.

@@chrl4180 my sister-in-law had a horse that lived into his early 40s and he was active up until about a month before his kidneys gave out. He was a dressage horse, then a three day eventer, and then a lesson and trail horse. His only complaint was some arthritis controlled with bute. Proper riding and conditioning let him live a good long life.

Lucy Deveney 50 pounds back then would be the equilivant of 1000 pounds now

Me too!

Individual gold medal in the 1970 world championship.

That's what I was thinking

No have you never watched showjumping the horse was getting excited and a bit giddy and skittish. Many highly bred horses are fairly skittish and silly when galloping or jumping. Sometimes horses buck because they are happy or excited, however it can because they are grumpy or angry.

Nothing to do with discomfort. That was Beethoven's personality !

@@christinecronje4704 Ryan's Son and John Whittaker too.

@@fiequestrian.x6079 Perfect discription

Some people don't now. If the saddle fits correctly you don't need too

no no no! regardless of the fit of the saddle the horse should ALWAYS have a pad of some kind whether it is a thin half pad, numnah or thick poly pad as this is what prevents the friction of leather on skin and absorbs sweat! imagine wearing your favourite shoes without socks! they might fit well but it wouldn't be nearly as comfortable!

Well, I mean, that plus the fact that you will -eventually- degrade the leather/reduce the effectiveness of the saddle.

Oldschool English saddles were beautifully made back then for the individual horse, lined with linen mainly. Numnahs were very unusual until the days of ''off the peg'' saddles. Made to measure bespoke saddlery re-stuffed and adjusted if the horse lost weight [as was done back then] didn't cause sore backs at all. A horse has hair on his/her back so it isn't at all like wearing shoes without socks.

Dog Jumper Champions HOW TO'S A well crafted made-to-fit horse and rider saddle shouldn't need a numnah or saddle pad.

You should see Roger Yves Bost, he is a french rider and he does the same thing with is legs 😅 Terrible to look at

I agree with you. Most will see "experts" but what I saw is ugly riding : Short reins, a pain bit, sawing the horse's mouth (right/left) and a saddle without other protection. Horses were not meant to jump so high or as far. They only jump if they have to, most often over a small creek or ridge if they are chased by a predator. It results in sprains, bowed tendons, ring bone and dropped fetlocks. His whole weight landing on these tiny two front hooves is very damaging. But the pride of a blue ribbon is more important for these riders. I've seen my share over the years. There is this horseman who is on YT : THINK LIKE A HORSE. This man is full of common sense and has a peculiar sense of humour.

@@chrl4180 i agree with you on a lot of that stuff! but i also believe that jumping isn’t always detrimental to the horse if done correctly. obviously if you don’t have the correct gear, are jumping unsafely, or jumping a horse with medical problems it can be harmful. but i think in most cases jumping is completely fine

Not really. You’re forgetting to adjust for inflation.

£3000 is roughly £70,000 in today's money. Still on the cheap side for a top showjumper though

Shut up - you know obviously know nothing about Beethoven.

8:45

Smeeze You mean aluminium which is the English, original and correct way of spelling and pronouncing the word. 🤤

He sounds like my Grandpa he was from Surrey I went to School with that accent and was corrected by the teacher

You'd have to calculate the inflation rate, £1143, you could easily get a descent budget saddle for that price, new or second hand.

Does that make much sense? If you mean because of the advances in techniques and equipment since then, wouldn't his rivals have had access to those too, and so the (metaphorical) distance between him and his rivals would have been the same pro rata?

How could he be more than the world championship he won???

see how he never repremands him? No whip nothing, in the olden days that was a fresh horse, he is learning, great trainers like this let them be themselves, after all every computition is a partnership, you cant make them unless they want to....

And it's Beethoven, for goodness sake. Famous through his loooong career for his playful bucks and showing off . Happy, fulfilled horse. Grr, you fireside critics.

Saddle pads have been around for centuries, but were not considered to be super important back in the day !

@@baysalldays4882 I couldn't imagine riding without one!

@@chellefell1331 Personally, same. Not only are they fashion but they add life to my saddle and stop rubbing haha

@@baysalldays4882 i was just cringing at the friction the poor horse is probably feeling... and if its hot outside, ugh.... but that vintage transport truck i would take alllll day!!! i love that!!

Nah there's still a lot of shitty riding in the horse world

@@OfficialMuffiin but that type of riding isn't normalized especially in shows, everyone will call it out right away.

Joni Troubleboricua Hickstead was a Canadian horse who died after jumping a round. He had nothing to do with Hickstead the world famous equestrian Derby grounds in England. I am sure that Mr Bunn would have been ad shocked and sad as all horse lovers when Hickstead the horse ridden by Eric Lamaze died so suddenly and tragically in 2011.

He was dead when Hickstead died

I wonder if he could spell?

I’ve seen a lot of people commenting about this and yep! Saddle pads aren’t technically needed if the saddle fits properly. It won’t do any major damage HOWEVER, it can rub your horses skin. So, saddle pads were made to help protect the saddle from the horses sweat, and as an added bonus the pad prevents rubbing :)

They've been talking about nothing but!

Comments have become monotonous about no saddle tampons.

?? The majority are exstremely well bred. The only breeds you'll see with "issues" are Arabians, QH and Minature Shetlands but that's not even the common among those breeds, it's just the backyard breeders and halt bred ones.

What?!!!

If you have a well fitted saddle, you shouldn’t need a pad. However, riding without a pad could cause rubbing of the skin, which isn’t good. Saddle pads were originally created to help keep sweat off of the saddle, making have a longer life!

Laura Cleveland Such an ignorant remark! Most showjumpers in those days were ridden in an egbutt snaffle and a cavesson noseband!

+babsfocker that horse is long dead so let's not sweat how they should longe him to develop muscle. :-D :-D :-D

Beethoven was a stroppy sod who bucked and kicked whether he had a saddle on or not! it's part of why the public loved him. He definitely had a mind of his own -as did Uncle Max!!!

You know nothing about this horse, he was a champion show jumper with countless big wins and that included the world championship. He always bucked and mucked around, it was just his personality.

Another bloody 'expert'. Christ can't you lot be quiet!

This was in 1960 that’s 62 years old the horse is long dead and back then people didn’t understand much about horses because it wasn’t studied by vets .

I think that the rider at 3:23 is very decend. The riders today are defenetly not better. It may be that we have a better eye for the horse's comfort. Still I think that showjumping on a wide field is better than on a special riding ground with sand (at least when it isn't too wet) so it is more natural like the fences back then. Also today competition horses are kept inside almost all-day exept for exercise, wich I think is very bad for the horses. In addition, no martingale was used.

@@jochemkoot5808I was just refering to the riders position while jumping

@@jochemkoot5808 The more turnout out you can give a competition horse, the better. It is natural for a horse to walk around nibble and browse, be relaxed and keep the gut moving slowly. 24/7 in a stable is wrong. We owe it to them to keep them sane. They give us so much.