The fact that Helen is so hysterical while Rev is so laid back always struck me as clever story craft. Especially since, in a lot of ways, Lovejoy was meant to play off of Flanders.
It's almost like he's the Edna Krabapple and she's the Ned Flanders in their relationship. Feels like they could have done more with that dynamic though, it's not super consistent.
@@bostonrailfan2427 sure but that’s because she’s barely even a character, not because she brings ned back down to earth. maybe im just not remembering though, the only venue i’ve had to watch the simpsons for years are these totally butchered uploads on youtube.
I actually like Helen Lovejoy, simply because she gives Marge an antagonist to play on. Homer and Bart have their fair share of antagonists and even Maggie has that baby with the one eyebrow. As for the next subject, let's keep this Maggie Roswell train going with Miss Hoover.
Yeah I like her too, I think she's funny and cute, I know shes judgemental but I mean she's not the only character in the Simpsons who's rude sometimes, I mean look at Homer, Moe, Comic Book Guy and Krusty the Clown. Besides her daughter Jessica is way worse.
@@ericstoverink6579 I rather take Lisa than Helen Lovejoy. Sure, Lisa's annoying and being a soapbox was the worst thing the writers gave her, given the fact she was 50 times better as the smart kid, but acting like an actual kid. Overall, I find her pretty decent as a character, both extremeley criminally underrated and way too overhated. Helen Lovejoy was a complete bitch and all she did was gossip, torture poor Marge and she was made for the audience to love to hate her.
Lenny and Carl is quite an interesting one. Because Carl reveals in a late episode, "the saga of Carl", that he didn't consider Lenny as a friend. It's only then that you can go through the entire series up to that point and realise that their friendship is kind of one-sided from lenny's end. Just small stuff that adds up, like BOTH lenny and Carl seeing Carl in clouds, or Carl's utter reluctance and annoyance at being paired with lenny in "mountain of madness", or how Carl is "tired of dumbing down" to the Moe's tavern group.
I've always been kind of fascinated by Helen Lovejoy as a character. She's designed to get on the audience's nerves most of the time. I wanted to do this video to see if they have tried to give her different roles over the year, or if she stuck to the shrill and gossipy territory. I was questioning if the writers should consider having a little more fun with her, maybe make her more sympathetic, or if that completely loses the point of her character. She seems like the kind of character they could do a lot more with. Also, this video got delayed by a full week because I literally got a cold the day I was going to do the audio recording. Couldn't get my voice together for, like, 5 days, which basically halted production of this video. I suspect Helen Lovejoy somehow sent me cold or something to prevent me from gossiping about her.
PhantomStrider listed Helen as one of the six least likable characters on the show. I guess she does her job a bit too well sometimes. I mean, I find her annoying in the way the writers intend.
I like that the writers got a little more adventurous with her character. It would have been easy to have her remain an untouchable, shrill gossipy bitch character but it's good to see Marge bite back and to see that she's a bit of a freak in the sack.
I'd really like to see a Lenny & Carl episode, especially for how Lenny seems to be so popular in Springfield at times, Marge's "Not Lenny!" line gets me every time
I really like how straight-up villainous Jessica Lovejoy is in her first episode. Makes Bart look like a sideman. Also, that soccer episode actually kinda makes sense for her character. She's ultra-competitive. She has to win everything. That also makes sense why she would be involved with the church, she gets morality as a trump card.
There's the episode where Bart has A.D.D and was diving a tank and Mrs. Krabappel say very sarcastically, "No, won't somebody please think of the children..."
Martin is definitely a worthy character of being looked at. He seems to be the only equal to Lisa in terms of intelligence, though I think they started to use Lisa more as a smart antagonist to Bart later down the road. I'd love to see a Lenny and Carl relationship video.
Alison is also equal to Lisa in intelligence but the writers forget about that at times. They occasionally have moments like that such as when the mafia, despite being Italian goes to the same protestant church as the other characters, in one episode Moe's full first name is Moammar, while in another it is Morris, and in one old episode, Bart speaks fluent French after coming back from France, while in another recent one he is made fun by the French club for not speaking French. There are more examples but those came first to my mind.
@@jacobr5627 While there are clearly continuity errors here, I find it entirely believable that Bart was able to pick up some basic French by spending months in France only to then lose it pretty quickly upon returning to America. Hell, he was able to forget Spanish by hitting his head a few times.
I feel like Martin being Bart's antagonist kinda fizzled out by Season Two actually, by then Martin was becoming less smug and more of a naive doormat, while Lisa was clicking as a more precocious character that was naturally easier to butt heads against Bart over many personal things. The thing about Martin is that he tends to only be Bart's enemy over good grades, and Bart tends to only desire those when their's actual stakes involved (eg. being held back a grade). It's not like with his little sister, Bart doesn't really care if Martin has Edna or Skinner's good graces compared to his parents.
It's really bizarre that Helen Lovejoy still looks like a Season 1 character even in later episodes. Like, her head and body are shaped really uniquely when compared to practically _any_ other the show. It's so weird…
ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ZrdqZVbdyDg.html Something I never realized I saw these clips is that Moe Sideshow Mel seem to interact a lot
@@nitrosherbert888 if I had to fan fiction a backstory on that it might be that they were child actors together or at least during the same time period.
I’m glad Maggie Roswell returned to the Helen role. She brings plenty of strong energy to the role. Very well done retrospective. Please do Agnes Skinner and Duffman someday. I’m also strongly eager to see a Mayor Qumiby discussion.
Wow was literally just rebinging your Simpsons Histories series while mowing the lawn, then just as I finish this one pops up. Thank you for blessing us on this day 👌😭😤
I would put Martin on the backburner like you did with Edna, so we can get a full perspective of Taylor’s portrayal. As for who is next, I vote one of the Skinners! Or maybe both! Either of them or Jacqueline Bouvier
I think he covered Jacqueline Bouvier about as thoroughly as possible in an episode of Simpsons Mysteries where he talked about the show timeline, specifically part one, the past.
Woah, i've grown up watching this series, but i've never really analized how each character was written, so i find these type of videos super interesting! Awesome job! For the next one, how about Lenny and Carl? Together or separated (although that might be a little hard, i think?? Lol), it would be cool!
I would love to see a Barney episode - he has super consistent characterization as being a really talented and smart guy who is crushed by the weight of alcoholism, and no one ever tries to help him - really some of the best and most tragic social commentary that the show ever does. It's why I actually like the pivot that he took towards sobriety in the mid-seasons, it felt good to see him be his best.
I just realized something... At least to me, the way she's drawn is is pretty different from most of the other characters. While her design has been refined to a degree, she still stands out a lot! There are a lot of long lines and sharp angles- especially compared to everyone else in the show. Then, ad to that, her strangely angular eyes (which are usually used for Asian characters), she really stands out a lot from the others. Maybe it's just because I have an art background, but after looking at all the still-shots of her, she suddenly stands out a lot to me, and so maybe- consciously or unconsciously- viewers are drawn to her.
It's kinda like Burns in how she has this kind of mantis like appearance to convey her underlying creepiness, only Helen's is more focused on the facial design. The bug-eyed look is really emphasised in her first appearance admittedly where even her PUPILS are angled. Guess that scene was really trying to establish her as a parasite. :P
I love the deadpan way you said "rekt." Helen is a really great character because she's just perfect at serving her purpose, and doesn't become overused or gimmicky
You should wait for Martin's fate to be determined before you do an episode on him, with the possible end so close as well as the possibility for a new era for him its really odd to pick now of all times for him in addition; Moe. I love his one line of reference from Das Bus where to solve the problem the narrator just goes "and eventually they were rescued by... ohhh... lets say.... Moe".
Gotta be honest, I really had no idea there'd be so much to talk about. But Jims does it again, thanks, man, great stuff. I continue to root for my Professor Frink episode someday.
After watching: Helen has a lot more to her that you just don't see til the later seasons. Still would love to see you do; Kent Brockman, Groundskeeper Willie, Jaspar Beardly or Lenny and Carl (As a pair).
I’m a little surprised that so many people dislike Helen. I mean, I’m not a fan of hers, but I think that’s kind of the point and she brings a different sort of energy to the Springfield mom and church circles. Anyway, Sea Captain for next histories.
"...surprised that Helen would want to be the submissive here, but maybe that makes sense given her control freak personality." Yes. Yes it does. You're welcome.
Helen Lovejoy has always been such an unpleasant character. She irritates me almost every time she shows up, *especially* when she has Marge thrown in jail for robbery. That was such a horrible thing to do it made my skin crawl. You *have* convinced me however she's an important character. She does fill an interesting role as a foil to Marge, and works well as a more unflattering example of a fundamental Christian than Ned (even though they did make him overly negative for a couple seasons). What I'm wondering the most is, was she actually based on Mrs. Oleson from Little House On The Prairie? They strike me as very similiar, although I find Mrs. Oleson funnier.
5:51 In hindsight, after looking at their past interactions, it's even sweeter that Marge gives Helen sincere advise with no hard feelings or passive aggressiveness at all. Sure it doesn't really help but it's a rather nice display of empathy.
Great write up and think you for thinking of the children. I like to see a Jay Sherman as a future simpsons histories video. I know it's a different show but when the Flintstones meet the Jetsons.
I kinda like the fact that the Lovejoys are sexually liberated in the bedroom. Reminds us what the "high and mighty" are really like. I've met a few of her in my time
I find her so terrible, probably because I know many, many, people like her exist. Those people who most definitely air all that dirty laundry and then make it appear worse, those Christians who conveniently forget phrases like ‘Love thy neighbour’ and ‘Judge not, lest ye shall be judged’. I do wonder what skeletons are in her closet though. Often the most judgemental people seem to have a lot of those.
I think when they wrote the Harold Joke, they wanted to imply she is a trans-woman. But when you take into account the rest of the series, it only makes sense if she had a trans-man ""phase"". Btw, could you make a Simpsons Mysteries about Moe's parents? There's quite a lot of contradictions on that.
To be honest, I think it was just the guy messing with him and/or the joke falling flat on it's face. There are a lot more convincing candidates on the simpsons for being trans, in the closet or out.
Id like to see a Skinner simpsons histories with "the princepal and the pauper" storyline treated as cannon, I'd love to see you explore that tangeled web and exanine which flashbacks can be trusted and which ones conflict that would be so fun :3
I nominate either Agnus Skinner or Dr. Nick for the next Simpsons Histories. It would be cool to see you talk about one of Tress MacNeille's characters, but Dr. Nick would also be a fun one. Also, do you plan on making some kind of tribute to Russi Taylor just like you did for Marcia Wallace when she passed away?
Great job on this one for sure! Helen has a dynamic presence for sure, so much so that she basically turned her own daughter into just a silent visitor character! Of course Jessica was basically Bart's worst match, so maybe that's for the best!
I'd like to see Superintendent Chalmers next. I choose him because I think its cool how the Simpson's can make a quotable and iconic side character who's built off another side character. You don't see that kinda thing happen in almost any other show
You seem to be why i am getting simpsons wifus!! Lol every video u do i start making (G rated ) simpsons comics!!. Yeah i am even starting to like hellen or make more back story for her!.
My son just said that he didn't want any damn vegetables! Oh you know how kids are. What was it? Asparagus? The point is he said a bad word Direct him to the bible. What page? Somewhere in the back.
I nominate Timothy Lovejoy for next Simpsons Histories. You covered his relationship with his wife pretty good in this one, but the whole Ned-Reverend Lovejoy relationship is interesting since Ned's bigotry is driving him crazy. I think Ned's bigotry is somehow making him a bad reverend as it kills his enthusiasm.
My vote for next character would be the blue haired lawyer or Lindsay Naegle - both characters who are constantly featured in various roles, so it'd be interesting to find some kind of thread between all of their appearances I agree with waiting on Martin
Want to add, in an BDSM relationship, the sub is actually the person who has the power. Nothing goes forward/starts with out the sub consent, and if they say stop, you stop. So her being a sub is total in character for a control freak like jerm
@@VineFynn yes, but the dom initiates the action, giving their consent, the sub is the one deciding if it's something they will do by giving their consent. Hence they have the power
Helen Lovejoy is a Conservative Christian. Conservative Christians believe that the husband should be in charge. I don't think people should be as surprised that Helen would take the submissive role in sex as well.@@angrybidoof847
So sad about Russi Taylor, that is one of my lingering fears for the show, cast members dying before they can officially give the show a proper ending. I hope they still keep her characters living in the show in the background and crowd scenes, they deserve that much, hoping they don't end up like Uter. Farewell, sweet Prince
I think waiting to see what they do with Martin's character is best. Maybe a Simpsons histories on the other springfield elementary kids though? Like Sheri and Terry? Edit: Actually Sheri and Teri might be too close to Helen’s role, since they function as Lisa’s enemy. Maybe Wendell?
Could we get a Simpsons History on Reverend Lovejoy himself in the future? I'm strangely drawn to this character, out of all the Simpsons characters, and maybe a history would finally explain why :D
