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Comeback might not be the best word for it. With Bowser, you just have a different mindset into the life of a stock. As Bowser, you're kinda resigned to that 60% combo each stock, so you just don't lose sleep over it. You use that to study the opponent, maybe look for openings to armor through something, and generally get the opponent used to the idea of totally kicking your ass so hard that they forget that 60% on Bowser is still basically mid percent. Also, no matter how many times people say it, people continue to be genuinely surprised by just how fast Bowser is. So, it's not so much a comeback, but more like patience and taking advantage of the opponents mental state? From the outside, maybe they look the same, but it's not like Joker or Lucario where they actually need to make that comeback. Bowser is completely happy sitting at 60-120% for the rest of the game, since you can't really combo him at that point, and you're gonna lose neutral eventually. All this is pointless against characters with counters, mind. If they knock Bowser offstage, it's a chore and a half to get back. 0/10, remove all counters, Bowser has approved this message. DK agrees.
@@SoggyWafflesXpand the rage mechanic doesn't reward players for losing? Aura and rage function pretty similarly, so I'd say lucario can be terrifying at high damage because both effects stack
I’m pretty sure it’s not. I’ve maines Bowser since the game’s release and watched lots of tournaments and I’ve never once seen Flying Slam do more if they fall further.
@@Moakmeister I have as well. Looking at it in Training Mode, it does change the damage dealt, though it's very slight between grabbing from the top platform and landing below and vice versa. The knockback seems to be a lot more affected by the fall distance however, which is the main part that matters in the case of this move. I've always found zooming to the top platform to be inconsistent at best and unreliable at worst, and this'd be a good explanation as to why. Though it also seems like the move stales pretty quickly, which is something I've figured for a while now. The long and short of it is that it seems like both play small parts in a bigger situation.
Bowser has come a long way from being the ugly low tier punching bag he was in melee to the high tier tank he is in Ultimate. Truly an evolution. Edit: Down tilt can also trip sometimes. Just thought I'd bring that up. Ether way excellent video. Your editing style is some of the cleanest I have come across. Keep it.
I remember being in college and hearing some of my fellow students talking about smash (brawl), using advanced terminology. "Finally", I thought, "someone who will challenge me!". Ended up asking who they mained (Pikachu and Olimar, respectively), and they asked who I mained. I told them Bowser, and that we should all play together soon. They ended up coming over to play, and I annihilated them. They started coming over weekly so I could help them practice and learn, and later told me they when I said I mained Bowser they thought I wasn't going to be worth fighting, and were very surprised when I trounced them. Part of me misses shocking people with the "low tier punching bag", but I still get that feeling with the other heavyweights so I guess it all works out. Wish they'd apply the lessons learned with Bowser over the last two decades to the other heavies, tho.
I can't help but feel that ALL the big characters that are combo food and are based on bosses should have some form of tough guy as well (Ridley being the biggest example).
Even though redesign bowser is a million times better, I can't help but miss the old design sometimes. I miss the... whatever you call Bowser's old run animation. Dry Bowser wen?
Trubbish I’m a ganondorf main I suck at smash ultimate cuz I only play in undocked mode so yeah and I need a vid like dis on ganondorf need all the data and info on him
Meanwhile dk has most of the same disadvantages except with most of his moves negative on hit at low percent, the opponent might as well have tough guy ):
Thanks for the visual summary (and link) of tough guy armor - years of playing without it means I don't find myself using the mechanic except by happenstance, but it is nice to know. I am surprised and disappointed the other heavies haven't gotten more armor to compensate for being combo fodder. It would help Ridley, DK, K Rool, and others a lot. Been maining Bowser since Melee....each game he's gotten significant buffs that really help his overall game. Can be tough to go back to an earlier game because the further you go back, the less viable moves you have at your disposal. I miss surprising people with a steamroll from a low tier, as well as some of his old style (headsmash, shell roll ledge attack, old bair, etc), but I'm really glad for all of his buffs. In ultimate, every single attack he has is useful multiple times per match. Long gone are the days of Melee UpB and Fair spam. I strongly disagree with your analysis of dtilt - yes, it has been gutted compared to 4, but it still is a very easy, strong ledge guard, as you can camp back a little bit and get just about everything but a jump. Much easier to reliably land over other moves, great for when you don't know what your opponent is going to do. Further, I struggle to recall a time an opponent slipped out of it early, and I have more time in Bowser in each Smash game than most people do in Smash period. Upsmash is so good, it cannot be stressed it enough. Like wonderwing for opponents trying to land - it really sucks going back to Brawl and Melee and not having the invincibility. Upair is a good kill option, and should be used any time the opponent goes high and is over 80% or so. It lacks the old-school power from Melee and Brawl, but its a lot faster, so I guess is a wash. I actually liked the old, slower one better, but again this is a great punish for opponents that like to stay high, so should be thrown out liberally. While the old dair continues the trend of more stylish, less functional moves, the new one is great for landing, and has fantastic coverage. Definitely a great way to punish opponents trying to combo you or stop you from landing. Nice buff to Bowser's air game. Fire breath is excellent for racking up lots of damage. I find a short hop into it (I call it Firefall) is a very reliable way to catch people with it, even people who are expecting it. As you said, using it to rack up damage on the ledge is one of its best uses. I know it is strange, but UpB is one of his worst moves in Ultimate IMO - a far cry from Melee and Brawl where it was his best. It still does what it always has, but with the nerfs over the years and substantial buffs everywhere else you have many other options to deal with pressure. With the scoop hit box addition, Down B went from useless to very powerful, a great punish on the ground as it comes out extremely fast and usually breaks shields, leading to a free Fsmash. If they don't shield it, then you either get lots of damage or a kill. As for the air, it is still good, but mainly as a mix up to dair if you need to switch up timing. I remember people complaining about Slam replacing Klaw back in Brawl, but I've always thought it was a substantial upgrade, and in Ultimate you should be using it constantly. It does good damage and is one of Bowser's best kill moves. The knockback is dependent on how you land - if you are going backwards, you'll send the enemy more horizontally, and if you are going forwards, much more vertically. Usually, I'll move backward during the rise, then move forward during the drop to kill off top, especially if I can land on a platform up high (best used for BF's top platform). Hard to go wrong with this move. One thing you didn't mention is that Bowser plays best at higher percents - at low percents he is juggled, but because he can survive so long, you get rage and keep it for quite some time, which means that you find yourself wanting to be in the 120% range for the extra kill power. Overall, good analysis!
Nice analysis on the analysis😅 I do think the down tilt can be used as a decent mix up and kill at high percent so on that I agree but do you think it's more than that
@@d3hybrid713 Thank you! If both hits connect, dtilt does more damage than ftilt, and while it isn't a killing move, the shorter knock back allows for chase/combos, so it is better for racking up damage. That said, by far and away its strongest suit is how easy it is to land. It has great range, comes out fast, and stays out for awhile, so it will catch spot dodgers every time. It is a really spammable damage option imo. I use it as much as ftilt, and more than uptilt (uptilt is good, but upsmash is just ridiculously so).
@@T4nkcommander true also it is a decent poke on shield but you might get punished for doing it but no "GUARANTEES" oh yea also while I do think that bowser should have the most super armor and tough guy type moves the other heavys deserve maybe a little more armor than they get
Nice to hear a second opinion so I appreciate your lengthy comment, and I agree with most of it :) Just a couple of points I disagree with: _"UpB is one of his worst moves in Ultimate IMO"_ That's literally impossible since it's his fastest OoS option, and therefore the ONLY way to punish your opponent in many situations! _"one thing you didn't mention is that Bowser plays best at higher percents"_ He referred to this a few times, like here at 2:02 (he didn't mention rage *specifically* but it wasn't necessary imo, since that's a universal thing and not unique to Bowser)
@@spiralanimations7736 There are other characters that are high risk, require immense skill, and force you to work much harder than most than just Sheik. She might be the most extreme case though.
New characters seem to have that a lot, unfortunately. Half the new characters have Pit's Nair, Mii Swordfighter's Fair made a few rounds, and so on. Wolf's D-Smash is honestly just a cousin to Falcon's.
I think it'd be cool if you dedicated a segment of your videos to significant matchup information. You obviously don't have to go over every possible matchup, just the most notable characters and moves that will make you adapt your play style and strategy
Amazing contant man. I been wanting to try this for so long but never did because i fear it wouldnt do well since i feel people would only listen to pros. But this video is awesome, youve inspired me. Good stuff man!
Excellent analysis, definitely learned some things! I never knew him having such bad dodges contributed to such a terrible disadvantage state. Only thing I could see being covered a bit further is down air, specifically hurtbox shifting to break combos/striings
Bowser suffers from somewhat lopsided matchups, in that a small handful of characters are able to prey on Bowser's weaknesses to an almost crippling degree (in particular his disadvantage and recovery. Looking at you, Lucina...), which I feel gives him a rough time in tournaments without a secondary or otherwise dual main to back him up. Thankfully, the number of characters that make Bowser's life quite so dramatically difficult are relatively few, so when you have those most painful matchups covered, I think Bowser proves to be very strong and reliable. Of course, this is coming from someone who doesn't play in tournaments, I'm just going off my limited personal online play experience, spectating and logical theory. He's also very accessible on a technical level. As someone who knows himself to mess up inputs on more technical characters all the time, and with Bowser being a character who puts way more emphasis on decision-making and awareness given his risk/reward-factor, I feel Bowser is right up my alley. He's my best character by *far.* It's not even close. And I'm glad, because I really enjoy playing Bowser, too. Oh, and on the note of D-tilt, I think it has slightly better reach than F-tilt? ...That's about all the merit I can find for this move, unless you have trouble angling F-tilt for some reason.
1:35 Not really. Because of how knockback functions, weighing 135 means you get 0.851 scaling Knockback aprox, and a unit who weigh 116 receives 0.926 SK, (0.075 more). So a unit who receives 0.075 more SK doesn't exist, but Cloud get 1.000 SK, 0.074 SK more than Charizard. In few words, Bowser is to Charizard who Charizard is to Cloud and Sword Mii, not to Luigi (and Shulk). Still, yeah, bowser makes heavyweight looks like middleweights.
@@PBLKGaming Remember that Sheik and Lucario are now barely midtier, mostly because of their lower weight. Still, Shulk lost 5 weigh units and now is top tier instead of midtier, Greninja is even better (IDK if Top tier or High tier) despite being way lighter, and DK is low tier instead of high tier despite being 5 units heavier; weigh matters, but isn't all.
@@PBLKGaming Edit: Well, I was analizing the KB formula between classes, and it turns out that WE ARE BOT RIGHT. In the percent progression that certain move will kill your character you are right, and in Knockback scalling rate I'm right. Knockback in Smash bros. is an interesting function notheless, and after this analysis I guess now why they changed the weight calculation in Melee.
Would still have to agree it's probably Bowser's least useful move, along with maybe Dash Attack. Not totally useless, but overshadowed by other moves that fulfill almost entirely the same purpose and usually better.
I think fire breath is actually the best option purely for damage out of a jab lock, even over Down B. Dsmash will kill / send them offstage but its kind of rare to get into missed tech scenarios at later percents with this character I guess
@@PBLKGaming I also don't see anyone else giving children castles they have to guard from a Man strong enough to level buildings. But in all honesty, just me poking fun.
I may be a Hero main, but go ahead and analyze Banjo-Kazoii. Because for Hero, you'll have to account for the fact that his special moves cost mp, and if you run out, your almost helpless. Also I found out while messing around in training mode with hero that uncharged side b has a hit box if you don't have any mp. It's a quick sword sharp slap. It's funny, it's useless, but it's still technically a move. Also, Hero would take the longest to analyze. Just make sure you account for the part that he's more fun than competitive. That's why people get really mad about him. Also I'm sure there will be updates considering Hero with some buffs, nerfs, and the fact that you have to read in order to see what down b says. Someone said to put a little picture next to all the names. Not bad, probably would work. I don't know if that'll happen though. I saw your comment NVM.
The shieldbreak kills at 0% not at 30%, because you can damage them with fire. Also I like the spike hitbox of down b because you can easily spike people at the ledge with it if they do a jump get up
Honestly, getting Bowser to 60-120% is just doing him a favor since it makes all future combo follow up options significantly harder to follow up ON, since he flies too far away. Killing Bowser is a brutal task, and he takes an unreal amount of punishment, whereas he can end one of your stocks at 40% in two or less hits lmao.
Down tilt is actually better for two framing on stages with slants at the edges like yoshi’s story. And bowser bomb deals more dmg than down smash in a jab reset as long as there isn’t a platform in the way
IMO it feels like Bowser is closer to Melee Marth than [Ultimate] Marth is. Many of the moves have similar uses and hitbox. Down angled Ftilt and Jab1 replaces [Melee Marth's] Dtilt and you have no grab combo game but other than that his fair, nair, uptilt, Fsmash, jab and movement can be used in quite the same way
Bowser's tough guy armor actually feels like it could be a general mechanic. It's very intuitive that a chararcter that's very heavy can power through weak attacks.
wow I feel kinda dumb for not knowing some of his moves have their own armour, makes sense now but I always just assumed it was the tough guy ability! Does this move armour stack with tough guy? Actually, does it even matter if it does since tough guy is always active it makes no difference right? hmmm...
Random fact about Bowser he’s canonically got the highest lifting strength of anyone on the roster Some people say it’s Steve which is wrong, A full inventory of shulker boxes and enchanted golden apples weighs 11,000,000 tons, In Bowser’s inside story he throws a cannonball that’s at least 15ft across at 100meters per second which would take at least 48,000,000 tons of force
