You say that the Unknown Dragonborn nothing is known. However you pointed out that he's either from the Merethic Era or the early first based on Armour. The biggest Hero we know of from that time is Ysgrammor, I believe it's quite likely that Ysgrammor's Deeds simply over shadowed the Unknown Dragonborn own to such a point he was completely forgotten by History. It wouldn't be the first time in Tamerial that knowledge of an earlier time would be lost or forgotten.
You make the funniest puns!! But some of your throw away lines, sometimes risque , which you throw out there and hurry on, make me bust out laughing!!! Here has been my thoughts on the unknown 'other' dragonborn there: I feel it might be an easter egg, put there by the devs, to represent all of the 'players' who have become Dragonborn before you, in your own game. Could it be??
@@BigBangAttack-mt6pz I keep playing in the game after I go to Sovngarde, and in one series, I died and then ended the series there. So I would have went to Sovngarde..wouldn't I?
I've always hated that quest it's so contradictory. Seriously, is olaf in sovngarde, or in skyrim as a dragur? Or is there some missing piece of lore that explains he can somehow be both? It makes no sense whatsoever.
@@DragonGunzDorian I like to believe Draugr are just the body and the last remnants of a Nord's soul after they die, volunteered by the Nord before death to act as a guard to their tombs. And those that do this get a special seat at Shor's table for until the rest of their soul is reunited with the part that was left behind. But of course, this is just what I like to think happens
Sigma while this is cool and could make for some cool lore, It does seem a bit contradictory to how the draugr we see in skyrim were traitors who served the dragons.
“In the end, all valiant Nords can enter Sovngarde. Dismemberment, decapitation or evisceration seems a small price to pay for the chance to spend an eternity in Shor's wondrous hall.”
I remember a post on r/TESlore saying non-nords who live and die as valiant nords can make it to Sovngarde. For example, Hernantier, the first elven member and Harbinger of the Companions, was "born with the heart of a Nord," and could theoretically be in Sovngarde. It should be noted tha the people you can see in the Hall of Valor are not the only residents of Sovngarde, but that's probably obvious considering how few people you see in the Hall.
I noticed that you didn't mention that if you finish the civil war for the Empire that you find Ulfric there and he literally regrets the entire rebellion and how shortsighted and stupid it was.
@@turin5675 I think you two are referring to two different shouts; you are referring to the call of valour, while I guess that the other lad meant the dragon aspect shout that summons a nameless dragonborn?
Delphine says that the blades knew that Dragonborns were the ultimate dragon slayers, but Miraak, for as far as we know, never worked with the blades, but he could’ve had children, or akatosh knew that the majority of dragons were evil so gave more than one after the defeat of Alduin to help with the population, and that early history was lost, like the dragon tend shout, to time
As far as i know, Atmorans didn't record their history until Ysgramor learned to write (conventionally). This mysterious Dragonborn is most likely from Atmora, before dragons and men migrated to Skyrim.
any of the heroes of sovengarde can have that line of dialogue or at least a select number do. it's not just the one, I've experienced more than one say it.
That unknown Dragonborn might actually be Shor in disguise, and the only reason you can sit in that throne isn't because you are the mortal reincarnation of Shor, but because you aren't dead in the REALM of the dead and thus it's rules don't quite apply to you. The dead Nords in the fog can't find their way to the Hall of Valor, whereas you can walk through it without a single care in the world and get to the Hall within minutes. Not because you are Dragonborn, but because you aren't dead yet. Shor's throne was most likely made so that denizens of Sovengarde can't sit on it, but you aren't a denizen. You are merely passing through to eat the soul of an upstart lizard with an inability to shut up. And the reason Shor is in disguise? Because he wants to drink with his patrons without blinding them! Even gods like food and booze!
I personally don't buy the theory of the dovahkiin being an aspect of shor. Nowhere in the game, to my knowledge, does it say only shor can sit in that thrown. Just because I slap my name on a throne doesn't mean it prevents others from sitting on it. Then again I'm not a god, but still. The theory just does not have that much proof.
@@DragonGunzDorian Absolutely, there is no exact proof. But of course that is what a theory is. And most gods are/were pretty petty about mortals using their shit, both in fiction and mythology. That part is mostly just assumed
Why would shor disguise himself. I dont think shor would be afraid of alduin. And Why wouldnt the rules apply to living human? Best bet have right now is dragonborn is shor s avatar
@@greatenheim8460 he would disguise himself because his true form is to much for even the dead to see. It's why he never uses his throne. And as for why the rules wouldn't apply to the living, it's entirely because the living is not supposed to be there. It's unnatural, which is why you get sent back to Mundus almost immediately after you kill Alduin
I honestly always assumed that the bridge was just a massive dead dragon, didn’t know it was actually just a regular old whale but I guess it would make sense as even Alduin isn’t as big as the bridge.
Arngeir after returning from sovngarde says that you can be a force for good, a force for evil or fade into history and be forgotten as past Dragonborns have
It's been over ten years...and just when I think you two are done- you and Nate throw another video out. I love you guys. I often binge your videos while I'm playing
the "hero of sovngarde" that says "hail dragonborn that honor is also mine to our shared birthright you'll bring new glory" may be a easter egg from bethesda referring all the other players
12:51 I had witnessed it in my play-through. I was trying to get them to turn and they wouldn’t turn to face me and when I messed with my third-first person camera it showed them moved. It is a very quick snap of the model, like SCP 173 hoping to break your neck.
You know, i was in Skuldafn and Sovngarde today. And i happened to notice that there is a single burnt human corpse in Skuldafn Temple. According to Odavhiing, if you have no wings, you'll never set foot in Skuldafn. So how did that human get there? Maybe i'm talking nonsense, but could this maybe be related to this unknown dragonborn in Sovngarde?
Do you ever plan to go back to some of your older ccc's and update them because some of them like eastmarch is only 12 minutes long and there is way more content then that im sure?
If you watch his April Fools video from this year, about the Almighty Torch, he lays out in the last few minutes of it what his plans are for the channel for a while to come, remastering the CCC videos is pretty much top of that list from what I remember...definitely looking forward to that!
It's possible that the unnamed Dragonborn may have failed whatever purpose Akatosh had for him, but was still good enough for Sovngarde. The reason you don't see any other Dragonborn in Sovngarde is probably because they're in Akatosh's corner of Etherius, having completed their destiny as Dragonborn. In Skyrim, you don't even know you're Dragonborn in the beginning, and if you ignore the main quest line, there's nothing really telling you what your purpose is. It's likely that after awakening as a Dragonborn, the unnamed hero just went on with his life as usual and never fulfilled the purpose Akatosh had intended for him, but was still a valiant and heroic warrior, earning a place in Sovngarde instead
The satisfying sensation of his alteration spreads through his videos to every nation and like the mastication of a snail it caresses the ears and draws in his audiance in a way Molag-Bal the lord of domination could never hope of accomplishing from his realm of desecration
A Spoiler for the end of the video and Questions Is the unnamed Dragonborn in Sovngarde the same one you can summon with the Dragon Aspect shout? Is he the Ancient Dragonborn?
I was thinking this, and if Camel is right and there are no references to other dragonborns, this guy might fit the bill. Only issue might be the armour the summonable ancient dragonborn wears. Otherwise I think this unnamed dragonborn is probably the best candidate
24:29 but if Shor is the Nordic version if Lorcan wouldn't "Shor's bones" be sort of like saying "What in the world?" as Nirn was created via Creative Sacrifice?
@@MrGod-nl7no If i remember correctly, the moons were like representations of two primordial gods. That could be very wrong though, as I remember one of those gods being Sithis.
@@deadlyframe7794 Actually, according to the typical elven and men lore, the two moons are supposedly Lorkhan's floating corpses. After Au'riel tore Lorkhan's heart, shoots and the Red Mountain was made, Au-riel just yeets Lorkhan's body that was torn in half and both became the moons. Strange, I wonder which one is his lower half, maybe when we gaze up on secunda, were actually looking up at Lorkhan's balls.
My only guess is that he’s a super up version of the generic Nord Dragonborn in Skyrim’s promotional material. But that doesn’t make any sense, for many obvious reasons.
any of the heroes of sovengarde can have that line of dialogue or at least a select number do. it's not just the one, I've experienced more than one say it.
I was scrolling down when I saw this and thought : "hm, never watched this one" Then I looked at the upload date and DAAAMMNN boooi, new gift from father camel
Shor: Today i'm going to create a neat afterlife realm for my Atmoran & Nordic bois. Random God-being servant: Are you sure? Shor: Yes? I am Shor? How do you keep forgetting this? God Servant: ¬_¬ Edit: I only noticed the word wall on my recent playthrough and thought it must've been for Alduin's unique fireball meteor storm ability. Either that or the mist shout (Ven Mul Riik) he uses perhaps in Sovngarde as again I believe that to be unique to him.
I have a potential theory in regards to the "unnamed" dragonborn. Its possible he was a dragonborn from the dragon wars. We know Miraak was around before then, as dragons destryoed his temple. And there is a fairly large gap in history where no dragonborn is known. This unknown dragonborn could have been around during the dragon wars, but was either killed during battle or failed to defest Alduin. This would then force the ancient nords to send Alduin forward in time using the elder scroll (since their only way to defeat Alduin was lost). I dont have much evidence to support this. But Tsun say its been a long time since he faces a dragonborn, and the dragon wars took place fairly early in nord history. His name could have been lost to history as he likely failed in his quest and was forgotten. Its been a while since i played skyrim so i could be missing some things in terms of lore. I definitely plan on going back and doing some research however.
I believe that that one dragonborn hero of sovngarde was born and died before they really started recording the dragonborns, hence him not bring known in history.
24:45 Though indeed Whale bones making the bridge.. It is also told that the enormous bones on the map of Kagren-Zel are whale bones, but these bones even dwarf the Whalebone Brigdes'bones.
So upon personal investigation, I've had several npc claim dragon born. Particularly the one pointed out in this video and a young blonde woman who wears the same ancient nordic armor. There's also a black bearded hero who I interacted with for several minutes until to my surprise I got a singal dialogue option that asks, "what do you do around here?" To which he responds, "I'm a bard. Trained at the bards collage in solitude. Wanderers like you should think about applying!" And then the optinal quest is added, 'Investigate the Bards College' Then I'm given one more dialogue option "..." And the conversation ends, and he starts saying random things again when trying to interact with him.
The mysterious dragonborn could be a piece of Mirrak. Now here me out. The dragonborn's soul like all dragons are a shard of Akatosh, a piece of a God. Mirrak was both mentally and physically corrupted by Mora. But could a daedric prince really take control of a shard of Akatosh? Most likely not therefore I believe that mysterious dragonborn could be a piece of Mirrak that couldn't be corrupted, hence why you can still see him before defeating Mirrak.
You missed something, there's also a female Hero of Sovngarde who has the same "that honor is also mine" line, a second dragonborn. She starts out standing near the roasting oxes and has steel armor with the shoulderpads and an ancient nordic axe on her back.
The unknown Ancient Dovakin might be from Atmora. He may have been famous in his time, with many a song and book written about him. But those records were lost, frozen along with the rest of the continent to the north. If true it would be a chilling tale about the ephemeral nature of glory.
I've been using these videos to help myself fall asleep lately. Something about your voice and the rhythm of your sleep helps me relax and fall asleep and that is a really tough task, so thank you Camel
Sovngarde is so beautiful I remember the first time I played it I was so amazed by the sky and the amazing unique soundtrack Skyrim will always be one of my favorites if not my favorite game
I believe those statues are a representation of Shor (how he would look like) like the other daedra statues back in Tamriel. So if the theory of the dragonborn being the mortal version of Shor, it would make sense the statues constantly stare at their "master".
I havent checked the like button for as many times as ive checked in this video to press it more, although ive done all i can to support you camel thank you especially in these hard times.
There are multiple dragon borne in Sovngard. I found the male dragonborn at the table in game, but also found a female dragonborn that was listed as a hero of sovngarde. Either Bethesda made this a throw away and rare line or there are two unsung dragonborn in Sonvgarde
Could the unknown bird totem maybe be a raven? I know that ravens are a big part of Norse mythology (Odin has 2 ravens I think and were considered a sign) and since Skyrim's nords are based off Norse mythology. I dont know if ravens are big in Skyrim's lore or Elder Scrolls lore at large but I feel like I have definitely heard of ravens in Skyrim
My personal theory is that the dragonborn we find in Sovngarde is Miraak's soul. Yes, I know Miraak became Hermeus Mora's champion, but my personal theory is that he died as a person, and reached Sovngarde, this means that the Miraak we find in the Dragonborn DLC is actually an undead commanded by Hermeus Mora, this would also explain why it's so easy for us to convert him with our thu'um.
I thought you'd speak about the fact that you'll be welcomed in the afterlife in Sovngard by Tsun after you defeat Alduin whether you're a Nord or not, I think there's something to investigate there
Since Sovergarde is a parallel to the Norse Valhalla, the birds could be a parallel to Ravens, of which Odin had two and Odin is the head of the Norse Pantheon in mythology.
But Skyrim already has a GODDESS who is represented as a bird. It makes a lot more sense that it's a representation of Kyne, rather than a lame, and honestly lazy IRL reference.
@@Alizudo Notice that I said 'could be' not that it was. It was just a theory I had. And just because one is represented as a bird, doesn't mean it has to be the only one. The Egyptian Pantheon for example, has two that I can recall off the bat. Isis, who is sometimes represented by a sparrow and Thoth, who has the body of a man, but the head of an Ibis, which is a bird. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, it's just a theory
The sheer concept of Sovngarde has always creeped me out. Sure, it would be nice to meet all of old nordic heroes and crack a cold one with them, feast and drink and sing songs. But what happens after? When you get bored from eternal partying in this pocket realm you can't escape. It never changes, it looks much finite to me. You are immortal, trapped in a place that doesn't imply you can do anything else but feast and fight, which becomes repetitive. You can't get any news, you can't have an adventure, you can't go anywhere. You're stuck, infinitely, in this feverish dream. And you can't die, either. Can't make it stop. So, what do you do? Drown in mead? Get lost in the mist? Yeah, sounds horrible to me. Cool video, btw
Guess that's what they want to do, but maybe there's some magical reason why you don't get bored of it. Also im pretty certain they can see/ hear about whats goin on in mundus from sovngarde, because if I'm not mistaken when you arrive in the hall, ysgramor acts as though he knows of you, which implies somehow they have knowledge of the outside world from there
@@gpu213 That makes sense. Maybe also the area is so small because of the engine's restrictions, and in fact Sovngarde is a whole city where you can do bunch of stuff. Orrrr it's not, and it's just a prison where souls go mad eventually. Or maybe they get reincarnated after some time Who knows. But it's still a scary concept, this Sovngarde of theirs.
So glad you posted a video recently on Skyrim. As I’m in quarantine I’ve spent plenty of time revisiting the game and questing where I haven’t quested before. Thank you for this video!
Kudos for releasing a video about Nord heaven on Easter. Will you keep doing CCCs for other TES games? I'd love to see them for Morrowind and Oblivion.
I've been following you since forever ago, and I have to say your videos have allways been an absolute pleasure to watch. Every ounce of dedication and passion, every poetic turn of phrase in which the tale is spun, every cheesy wordplay joke... it all comes together in a hell of a time and a lot of smiling when I take a break from my own adventures. Keep up the good work, I'm Shor there is a place for you in Sovngarde for your great deeds ^^
For the unknown dovakin... There are always heroes that have feats that history will change or not account for because they do not want to give that one glory... Or this hero did not wish for his fantastic feats to be recorded. I actually like heroes who do not want to stand before others more. He did his deed. That was enough of a reward for him.
These videos are so zen to me, I have them playing in the background all day as I'm doing things around the house. Your voice is calming and the puns are amazing!
wow this is so relaxing and something i can actually listen to because i love skyrim, i’m gonna be watching these to fall asleep for a while! thank you
There is a fellow dovahkin in the hall of valor. She doesn't have a name, that I can remember, but she makes a point of telling you she's also dragonborn.
The Sovngarde Dragonborn could be King Wulfharth. Also, he looks similar to the canon version of the Last Dragonborn seen in all of Skyrim's trailers, marketing, and merchandising.
He would've been labelled as Wulfharth then atleast. He is a well known dude, even Ysgramor was named. And there's no confirmation that wulfy was a dragonborn either just strong theories. And also the fact that he can't speak without causing an earthquake
Man the illusion you create with words is amazing and daunting, I’ll look into it but you should definitely write a book. You give the world a new light and it’s beautiful.
oh my gosh I freaking love all of these videos so much but yes that drove me nuts. SAW-VIN-GARD :b I am so thankful for this channel really. I'm not trying to criticize something so meaningless in such an awesome video and channel. It's just a silly little thing that kept catching me off guard lol.
Dude, i just randomly stumble upon your channel (I've almost been binge watching for 24h straight now) but in the end you will probably have changed forever my way to play and look at any TES game. What an impressive work you've made. much love keep up the great work and happy easter !
Redfall Xenos If I’m remembering correctly, the way Talos became a god is by mantling Lorkhan. Basically, Tiber Septim became similar to Lorkhan in people’s minds (sacrificing himself in battle for the good of humanity), so he kind of turned into Lorkhan, while still being separate from him. So Talos being at least vaguely present in Sovngarde (afterlife made by Shor, the Nordic name for Lorkhan) would make a lot of sense. (Side note: People also say that by the end of Skyrim the Last Dragonborn also mantles Talos.) Edit: Hadn’t finished watching the video, Talos was a Shezzarine, as Camel says the Last Dragonborn might be.
Damn dude, happy Easter to you too! For once in my lifetime, massive crowds of people dont gather around temples anymore to celebrate cuz you know "The Thrassian Plague" , but man you do an awesome job to make our time indoors much more bearable with your curating wizardry, thanks from a fan ;D
"Stuhn, Totem of the Whale" comes from a very sloppy source: A sparkly ESO mount description. Which, considering how busy their loremaster usually is with quests, writing, and mapping content I highly doubt it was properly vetted. It makes far more sense that the slain god of trials guards atop his totemic form's bones.
Perhaps the mysterious un-named Dragonborn is some lost hero of the past, and we just haven’t learned of his story yet. Similar to “the forgotten hero” from Th Elder Scrolls Legends.
This video earns the rare combination of actually liking, commenting - and subscribing. Love the content camel; so glad to see you're keeping Atmor-of it.
4-5 years before I played Skyrim, I didn't even know what defok "an elder scroll" was. I just thought it was a gmod mod honestly (but fast forward today and I'm one of the most hardcore fans of tes), but what I'm saying is, 4-5 years before I played Skyrim, I had this extraordinarily beautiful dream, where I was in sovngarde (no sh*t). The sky, the fog, the flora, the waterfalls, even the fucking hall of valor. I remember walking all the way to the bone bridge and suddenly falling off at the last step into the abyss below the island. Then I woke up. I thought it was a cute little dream, but a few years later when I was finishing the last quest of Skyrim, it hit me. I literally had a stroke when I had this EXTREME dose of deja vu. I said to myself "yo ive seen this before". After I finished the final quest, and returned to the throat of the world, I was actually crying. Strange thoughts were going through my head that seemed understandable at that time, but seem incomprehensible today. To this day I wonder what the fuck that dream was, and why I got that dream. I mean, I LOVE sovngarde, it's my fav realm, but it's ........... strange...
I haven't played much TES at all beyond some of Morrowind on XBox years ago.... But I still love the series, & I especially LOVE looooooong in-depth analysises & videos like this! Your dialogue & puns are wonderful & make these videos to dive into since I can enjoy even if I just listen! But Having not properly seen Sovngarde before this video, it felt spectacularly beautiful, like actually being a mortal witnessing something divine & incomprehensible! Thank you so much for uploading this!!! It's positively euphoric!
