You ever seen that picture with Dante, Doom slayer and Draigo standing side by side? With Dante and Draigo grinning like idiots and Doom guy being Doom guy?
39:51 I'm gonna be "that guy", but Jorge actually says "Ma'am", not "mom". I didn't know this for 10+ years until I replayed Reach on PC with subtitles turned on xD
34:41 to the point on Spartan2 processing time: master chief wakes up from his upgrade surgery and gets freaked out by what he thinks is messed up time. So he goes to the gym, throws a weight around in the spin gravity environment, does the calculus, and realizes 'oh, I have just gotten very fast!'
"I Cato Sicarius shall end every enemy that stands before me, because I Cato Sicarius, perfected every aspect of warfare and mastered it to such an extend that Only the Emperor himself, is superior to me"
You guys handle this far better than even Rooster Teeth's Death Battle does. I appriciate that. Related; Chief wins his fight with Sicarius because Sicarius has his "I, Cato Sicarius" bit whereas Chief just rolls in with the Warthog Run music from Halo 3 blaring at ear-rape level via Grappleshot and starts beating on him. Jorge calls Halsey "ma'am" inside Sword Base, its just that his accent is so thick that it sounds like "mom". I remember that being a HUGE controversy in the community when Reach came out.
There is one thing that the Master Chief has over any space marine, Cortana. We have seen in Warhammer lore where an AI had locked up a squad of space marines in their power armor just to prove a point to a tech priest. Cortana (and any smart UNSC AI) can take total control of any advanced system and weaponize it against their owners.
Legends Vader really is OP. Man has had entire buildings dropped on his head. Even then, Cannon Vader pulled an excellorating starship towards himself with his telekinesis. He litteraly could mulch anyone he wanted without a second's thought.
I agree Chief's main limitation is the fact UNSC weapons are underpowered due to most rifles using current day NATO rounds. Give him the more exotic armoury of say Halo 4/5 (especially the stuff they added in 5's warzone that stuff is wacky) or give him access to the imperium's arsenal and Cato is very much on the back foot as I think Cato would likely underestimate Chief. Though personally I'd say Linda-058 would much more likely to kill Cato personally. Basically the perfect Spartan 2 lone operative who would be able to put sniper shots into the helmet eye lenes.
I will say this now. my mom had stage four caner twice and survived. Cancer isn't a vulgar word, just an illness. it's okay for people to say. If people act like it's taboo to talk about, that's how people with cancer die. Not telling anyone or admitting it to themselves.
Hey man, thanks for this comment - I really appreciate it. My words during that segment were intentional because my own mother had stage four cancer last year and did not survive. Whilst I was indeed involved in the humour, I felt as though someone else who maybe felt how I felt during that time would've liked the small courtesy. - Tom
My stance is that a Spartan and an Astartes have comparable aiming skill and reaction times, a *slight* strength and size advantage for Astartes, a slight mobility advantage for Spartans with thruster packs, and major advantages for Astartes in durability, stamina, standard weaponry, combat experience, and overall longevity. Astartes are known to still be combat capable even when cut in half. Spartans can lose limbs and keep fighting, but they lack the absurdly quick healing and organ redundancies to shrug off potentially fatal wounds like Astartes do. An MA5B ain't doing diddly to Astartes warplate. But give a Spartan a bolter and things get decidedly more evenly matched at range. Overall, I'd have to give it to the Astartes. 6:4 at range (assuming equalized weapons), 7:3 in melee. Much as I prefer the Chief as a hero over any brainwashed murderous roid-raging zealot.
Half-Life 1 and Halo don't run on variants of OG Doom code, they run on variants of the Quake I engine. The Quake engine did some things so cleverly and efficiently that most 3D engines these days still have parts of it (or extensions/updates of those parts) buried inside their code to this day.
One of my favorite doom lore is that the demons of hell only chance of defeating the doomslayer was by dropping a church on him and turning that church into a sarcophagus just to imprison him
To give everyone and you guys of this fine podcast an idea, John is 7'2 in height. Jorge is 7'4 in height. In real life, the tallest police officer I know is 7'3 and that guy could pick up a grown man like a child pretty easily. Not only that but John has been noted to have been decorated by all of the medals the UNSC has to offer minus the prisoner of war medal. However I should state while John is meant to work solo during Halo CE he was so use to be in a unit that he forgot he was far away from the chain of command so while he is good at this he will at times forget to check his flank when he's by himself.
Not gonna lie I feel like the statement of Ceado cutting through more Demon then Doomguy is a bit weird even just looking at the games. Because Boltgun is obviously a throwback to stuff like Doom. Doomguy basically went through what Ceado did - as a normal human - 3-4 times with the original games. Then went on get stranded by fighting through hell - as a normal human - on some futuristic-medieval planet and fight alongside the Nightsentinels, pretty strong people, maybe some on Spacemarine level. He was strong enough to still give them a fight and resist for a little and then being taken into their ranks, rising quite high before gaining some of the Maykrs (essentially angels from heaven) attention, making Samur Hayden (aka Samuel Hayden) put him into the divinity machine making him basically something on par if not surpassing a primarch. (For context, they did try to get a warrior in there before but everyone in it turned out insane). Went on to beat back a demon invasion, kill a titan and become one of the essential leaderships and spear forces against hell. Before getting betrayed by some sentinel priests and stuck in hell again, which at some point he got his preator suit, and basically went on a killing spree on hell, that basically had a never ending bottomless shelf of demons coming back however with kill made he got stronger and he kept also killing more stronger demons and becoming an issue, and because time and all just like in the warp of 40k doesn't fully add up, he was in there fore like, Millennia. What Ceado does makes him really f*cking close to what Doomguy is I'll give him that, but Doomguy basically killed so many infinite amount of Demons hell had to drop an entire mountain on him in order to *stun* him, to place him into a box.
Going from a pure powerscaling view Doomslayer / guy is low complex multiversal as he can defeat davoth who created an infinite multiverse with separate dimensions (and a couple higher realms) Malum cadeo scales to high outerversal from being able to kill 6 lord of change (several in the warp) And 4+ great unclean one (Killing anything in the warp is above but a lord of change is ohh) Doomslayer 100% has more experience , durability/defensive hax But raw scaling malum is just higher (Side note malum feats are quite literally above most primarch levels that’s why he’s kinda a sue Mary, the only primarch that’s above him is guillemot when amped with the big e)
Master Chief with his best weapons would *obliterate* Sicarius. Thunder Hammer and Energy Sword are one, but Spartan Laser? Man portable Lascannon. Incineration Cannon? Plasma Cannon. Binary Rifle? Doesn't even have an equivalent. The man is lugging around Devastator-scale weapons and still bouncing around like an Assault Marine.
lol jokes. People always cherry pick these statements of weapons power but never remember to even measure them consistently against their own baseline. Yes Halo weapons might look impressive when taken on face value without remembering the fact that normal projectile weapons that a human can hold are still a threat to just about everything in halo. Shotgun, hand pistols all dangerous. As spacemarine wouldn't even bother using his gun on those. There are multiple sources where they just wade through dozens of people using these weapons with nothing but a knife and a punch because they chose to.. The reason 40K guard use las-weapons is because if they wanted similar firepower from a kinetic weapon they would likely have their arm ripped off by the recoil. No equivalent? A bolt gun is a equivalent to most of them if not better. As for devastator weapons these are weapons mean for vehicles. It would be like the Masterchief ripping the turret of a Scorpion Tank and firing that from the shoulder.
The doomslayer hates the forces of hell so much. He actively uses hell's own tools against it. His armor was forged by the wretch A traitor to the forces of evil. His sword is the crucible. The blade meant to be wielded by the one who commands all the forces of evil. Even without his armor he is literally able to rip a demon posessed human being in half with his bare hands. In fact, some speculate the armor in and of itself is a restraining system meant to keep his anger and strength in check. Because if he doesn't have it in check he will just go mad and start annihilate everybody be they: demon, human, angel, sinner, saint, innocent and the guilty, all Will be turned to nothing but ash and gore. It doesn't matter. without the armor to hold him in check. He is just a living entity of absolute obliteration. When you encounter the first imp in doom 2016 It isn't screaming at you in rage. It is screaming at you in absolute abject Terror because it knows what you are. It knows what you have done and it knows what you are capable of doing and what you are most likely going to do to it. So it is absolutely genuinely afraid for its little pathetic Life. I have to give the win to doom slayer.
I mean. Doomguy at this point can easily fold almost half the Primarchs, and has a pretty solid shot against the other half, so that one is at least very easy to call. :D
On a case by case basis, I can see a lot of people surviving for a time in the 40K Universe. When you do faction vs faction is where I think that the home field advantage will come into play because it isn't really faction vs faction so much as it is Your Faction vs Everyone Else. You will either be in a stalemate trading territory or you will be curb stomped for over extending.
AW MAN if Malum Caedo for some reason appears in Space Marine 2, imma be so hyped seeing my boy Titus and him. They can both kick Leandros ass for being a wuss.
I'd love to see Doomslayer face Lucuis, Angron, the Tyrannids and Khorne especially I honestly feel if the imperium wasn't already the Orks definitely would join because he'd be the best thing since Yarrick. And one more final note anyone whos played Doom 2016 my boy faced the Champion Of Hell A Demon Titan that Rivals evwn the Icon Of Sin and I'm not joking he did it completely naked without his Preator suit because the Demons straight up stole his weapons and armor as if it would weaken him only to find out even without the armor he straight up annihilated half of Hell and blew the Champions Skin completely off his body leaving him a gorey skeleton he even shot himself onto mars and into Davoths city wall with no damage.
Red is wrong about Jorge calling Halsey mom, if you look at the subtitles of the cutscene you can see that he calls her ma'am. It sounds like he calls her mom because of the Hungarian accent, Jorge is a native of Reach IIRC and Reach was colonized by the Magyar
Yeahhhhhh in lore doom guy is stated to be like a Omni/multiversal threat or something insane like that so honestly he can probably take all of them at once Edit: Malum is legit hitting the Doom guy pose from doom eternals front cover, he’s inspired by great power😂
most of the spartans IIs were better than the master chief in some category. what made him special is he was exceptionally well rounded with no deficits in any category and he was CONSISTENTLY LUCKY. Another thing people dont talk about with an unarmed fight is that the energy shields are slippery so grappling may not be an option.
I feel like you guys should do a follow up being Factions versus? I would love to see a match up of the Sentients from warframe against the Tyranids since both play off the factor of adaptation.
Just putting it out there. DoomGuy did legitimately kill not only the devil in his world, but (as explained in the dlc) the legitimate god and creator of all existence. There aint no way that mf loses to a mortal
lol I love how the only person who could possibly be compared to Malum Caedo is the fucking doom slayer, literally master chief and Darth Vader would get bodied by Caedo simply through excess levels of hatred.
In regards to the Vader-lightsaber-melee-fight: In the Salamanders novel trilogy (by Nick Kyme) a Salamanders Sergeant (or Lt, definitely high ranking guy) gets both his hands cut off by a Dark Eldar duelist. The Astartes does not give a fuck and proceeds to try and headbutt and bite for the rest of the fight! Vader hasn't met droids **this** aggressively rabid!
>We’re going to be objective and impartial in our powerscaling analysis [an hour later] >seems like the 40k characters won every time, truly our universe is the best
vader vs tigerius depends on if the force can go through shielding that blocks warp magic. the force is the ability to manipulate energies and molecules that build items and life, if that can go through any warp resistant stuff tigerius is probably dead on the spot when vader sees him, just thinks about his windpipe crushing or his neck snapping and it will. also for a fist fight Jedi/Sith also have powerful punches we have seen mace windu punch through a super battle droid and vader has metal hands. If the warp magic defences work against the force then Vader dies. if it doesnt vader wins
Let's not forget Tigirius is a Telepath without equal, like faced down the Tyranid Hivemind kinda bs. I don't think Vader lasts long enough to do that before Tigirius just turns off his brain. But if it's a cqc duel, Tigirius is turbo fucked imo.
It is I, Cato Sicarius, former captain of the Ultramarines 2nd Company and current commander of the Victrix Honour Guard, Master of the Watch, Knight Champion of Macragge, Grand Duke of Talassar and High Suzerain of Ultramar. I, Cato Sicarius, would be able to take on any challenge presented to me and I, Cato Sicarius, would triumph above any adversary in the name of my Primarch, my Chapter Master and the almighty God-Emperor of Mankind, for I, Cato Sicarius, am his greatest champion.
I once watched something once where someone basically said that the closest person to the Doom Guy in 40k would be Big E himself. I’ve never played Halo or read any of the books, but I’ve discussed halo comparisons to other settings with friends so I’ve known for a while that Master Chief would be a tough fight for any Space Marine. Vader is strong but as was pointed out; Vader’s suit and cybernetics hinders him, and he has to use the force to keep his speeds he reaches. Space Marines are already unnaturally fast even before any psychic boosts that a trained psyker would have, let alone a CHIEF LIBRARIAN (not even to mention how scary chaos sorcerers are where they can delve into chaos powers mostly unscathed too).
I always had a problem with astartes vs a spartan marines, bcs by appearance most ppl would say astartes would win but if you look at the games chief can flip jeeps, tanks, and in the lore mountains without much problems, astartes have been said that it would be impossible for them to pull a human arm off without PA, then there I'd the purpose contrary to popular belief SMs were made disposable sure as a unit they could be deadly but by themselves they are walking bullet magnets it happens many times, then there is the armor no thing in the halo universe pierced mjlnir armor, but SMs have most frequent carapace armor which is something guard even have, so I'd say spartans were made to be more valuable even before mark 4 armor, whereas SMs were made with a unit in mind
34:39 Tom you aren't talking out your ass, Spartan Two reaction time is absolutely fucking insane. John 117 was augmented as a teenager, shortly after he recovered he was in the gym, he dropped a dumbbell, and started to calculate the speed and trajectory of the dumbbell because his reaction time and his strength was so heightened that everything felt wrong and alien
I think in terms of the Doomguy vs Malum Caedo and the Master Chief vs Cato Sicarius fights is that Doomguy and Master Chief have better chance at winning on the grounds of them having access to plasma weapons that don't have a chance to blow up from continued use (Doom guy definitely, but I am unsure if there have been record of any plasma weapons in Halo that exploded from just continued fire since they vent)
As for the Covenant plasma weapons, you CAN overload them like a plasma weapon in Warhammer 40k, however it's a deliberate choice to do so. They don't normally just explode.
Yeee, Halo Plasma weapons probably could explode, but it's built in to momentarily disable the weapon and allow for heat dissipation instead of letting the weapon get to the point it would explode
On space marines vs Spartans, here’s an argument I’ve had lying around: Spartan 2s are about equal to Firstborn Astartes in speed (reaction speed included) but are slightly behind when it comes to strength, and are severely lacking in the durability department. Astartes armor (without any extra iron halo shielding) can easily take five or more bolter rounds, whereas spartan shields can only take one (maybe two) rounds of a halo bolter equivalent, and the actual armor can only take like one shot. On a biological level, Spartans cannot take as much damage as Astartes can, they simply lack the geneseed implants that allow Astartes to survive loosing a heart, most of their organs, etc. This means that Spartan 2s are more on par with Astartes Initiates/Scouts who have similar strength and speed feats, but lack the survivability that comes with being a full-blown Astartes. On top of that, the standard Spartan weapons, a BR75 battle rifle and M6D pistol, are far more comparable to basic Imperial Guard issue stubbers, which most Astartes are bullet-resistant to *even without armor.*. By contrast, a standard Bolter could end a Spartan 2 in between 2 and 4 shots, shields and armor included. Any other weapon that you can give a Spartan, Astartes have equivalents to, heck an Astartes plasma pistol is equal to an Emperor-damned spartan laser, if not more effective, so trying to add in rarer types of weapons or armor upgrades won't really change things. Outside of Astartes having far better baseline durability, the Spartan 2 is lacking in perhaps the most crucial equalizer against opponents with better stats... experience. Your standard (non-veteran) Firstborn Astartes has anywhere between 20 and 50 years of actual combat experience, whereas most S2s do not have nearly that much experience, and this doesn't even touch on the variety of enemies that Marines end up fighting. This experience combined with their well-rounded strength, speed, and durability puts firstborn astartes well ahead of Spartan 2s. Here is a space marine respect thread that has sources for all of the feats: www.reddit.com/r/Thevexarecool/comments/gtstyv/respect_space_marines_warhammer_40k/ and here is a link to easily 20 space battle debate threads that have come to the same conclusion: forums.spacebattles.com/threads/ultramarine-vs-spartan-who-wins.632056/post-45853312
MC and other S2s got trained from 6 years of age to be soldiers. Speak again about experience? And again on lack of experience: The HALO universe isn't done yet. MC can still go on for decades more. Moreover, you don't think that Spartan 2 armour is more advanced? Ok sure let's argue it's less durable (but can take a few plasma bolts). The motion tracker, vacuum seal (can survive in space for a bit), can hold an A.I, MC canonically ran 60mph + before (and he isn't even the fastest Spartan).
@@themc.kennyshow6585 my point is that 6 years of training does not equal upwards of 30 years of combat experience against the galaxy’s worst horrors. My point isn’t to compare how long the characters could live for (which is moot because there are 1000 year-old Astartes), but rather how much experience a standard S2 and Astartes would start out with and bring to the table.
@@themc.kennyshow6585 didn’t see the bit about Spartan armor so I’m responding to that bit here: I do think Spartan armor is more advanced than Astartes armor, but not in a way that would give the s2 an advantage. Spartan armor is more durable than space marine armor *if the energy shield has time to regenerate*, and it can house an AI, but that’s about it. Astartes in power armor can survive in space almost indefinitely, and their helmets also have “auto-senses” that include various range finders, targeting reticules, etc, that only increase the superhuman senses of the Astartes. on top of that, the black carapace augmentation in all Astartes allows them to connect with the armor and treat it like a second skin, activating, adjusting, or deactivating power regulations and said auto senses with mere thoughts. Though Astartes have slightly slower run speeds than the Spartans (can run 40-50 mph middle end feats), this black carapace allows their reaction speeds to essentially match or even exceed the bullet-timing of the Spartans. In short, Spartan 2 Mjolnir armor has certain differences and one or two advancements over space marine power armor, but most of those are negligible.
Even if Master Chief is hit by an overcharged plasma bolt, its not goingnto hurt him, itll just take his shield down for a few seconds. The only thing being the 40k power weapons could be seen closest to the halo Energy Sword. Also, for their average weapon, MC wouldnt use the Assault Rifle, it would be the Halo 1 Magnum
Master chiefs armour is made from a titanium alloy right? They have titanium in 40k they just don’t use it because ceramite, adamantium and plasteel are better. So if master chief can survive being hit by plasma rifle rounds without his shields that means the plasma weapons in halo are not as powerful as the plasma weapons in 40k because it could be argued that his armour is worse then what the space marines wear. Furthermore plasma weapons in 40k leave behind a steaming pile of meat when you get hit by them. From what i have seen plasma weapons in halo only make small holes in civilians and as such i do not think it can be argued that halo plasma weapons are on par with 40k plasma weapons. Now for the magnum it’s a lower caliber than bolt pistols so while sustained fire might hurt a space marine it’s not really going to do anything major to their armour. Out of armour it might be able to damage an Astartes but they have such insane toughness and healing factors that you would have to double tap one of them to ensure he was dead and i doubt a space marine will stand still long enough for the chief to do that. No hate for MC or halo but 40k is just out of it’s league
@@JeffGreff his undersuit is woven titanium-a which is a sci-fi alloy not real life titanium. the over-armor is the same material but solid and a lot thicker. theres also a gel layer which is supposed to absorb impacts and energy weapons that get through everything else. lore-wise a plasma pistol will fry a halo marine in armor just by flying past them and thats the weakest weapon in the covenant arsenal.
@@joshw.2739 i would still argue that Spartan armour is weaker then Astartes armour without the shield (and about equal when you add the shield). Also when you say marine do you mean Spartan, Astartes or regular halo marine?
I think Ezekiel of the Dark Angels would have been a better match for Vader. They both have archaic life support/augmentics systems. Also Ezekiel being a firstborn in power armor would be more of an even footing compared to the terminator armor of Tigurius. Just my opinion though, and it may be biased since I am a Dark Angel player.
I am a Warhammer and Star War fan. I have to say that this is the most fair analysis across those different universe. Usually i see people underestimate the warhammer universe. Before i say my bit about Darth Vader. I want to say something that is important about Master Chief. He was describe as the luckiest spartan that has ever existed. The reason that he survive that fall from orbit wasnt because he was tough for doing so. Nope it was just luck . The game made it very clear that was the only reason that he survived. Beside that great analist As for Darth Vader, as much as i loved that character even in legend i don't think he can win. Here is my reasoning he wouldn’t be able to counter a space marine strength, speed and reactions speed. Sure he has a bit of foresight and he has crazy force feat strength. But he doesnt have the versatility that a librarian would offer.
On account of multiple other spartans sustaining similar falls from orbit, i feel like chief’s fall is less luck in that regard, also considering advancemets between say the mark V[b] noble 6 was wearing, and chief’s mark VI in halo 3
Generally Spartan 2 (Gen 3 Armor) & Space Marine (Mark 7 Armor) Are in Same tier. With Space Marine having the : Endurance Stamina Experience Weapons While Spartans has better : Speed Agility Adaptability Equipment And Both are Close in or tie in Strength Durability Accuracy Reaction time.
Counterargument for fistfight: Varro pissed himself over Zoans and Terminator armor dies to average of one volley of 20 flashlights doing concentrated (both in lore, tho judged of chaos infused sorc termi rather than toiletboyscouts, and for once on tabletop). Also the man keeps triggering perils in narrative moments as if he needs a 6 to cast anything. Vader cheated to out-kickbox a a imperial knight stolen by rebels (with even worse design once physics are accounted) for and dueled his way out of 60+ troops, 3 carriers and a tank (which isnt legends, it remained mainline canon); technically he does have the force fear aura around him (not that it should matter, but if one treats force = warp maybe could factor; still cheating tho). Vader still dies to the lighting zap, but by the time it finishes frying him, the Rod of Tigurius is cut apart in bits on the floor having already fallen out of a dead nerds hands a few minutes prior. But then, you could argue its Disney vader, not canon (KOTOR info+legends) Vader, in which case comedy ensues as "(w)HORUS SOMEHOW RETURNED!"
if chief has his strongest weapons, he has a spartan laser, and that could strait up one shot a space marine. Also noble six is, canonically, on the same level as chief, being the only other spartan to have the classification of hyper-leathal vector.
@@DeadBattleBrother15 i don’t think space marines cope very well with the equivalent of a slightly more sustained las cannon blast to the chest regardless of if they have a more powerful weapon or not
no, the spartan laser is roughly equivlant to a las cannon, and some covie weapons are alagous to say plasma or rad weapon, but normal human weapons no.@@robainsworth2014
Technically....The Slayer has killed his universe's equivalent of Khorne...so idk how to even scale these characters. I simply can't see any 40K characters managing to kill an actual chaos god.
You're wrong he's above average for a spartan 2 defend that makes them extremely different from everyone else is his luck because he's not the best in any other category besides lock
It's more that he's the best all rounder Every Spartan 2 that specialises would be a 10 in their favourite fields and a 7-8 in everything else. Most all rounder Spartans are an 8 in everything while chief is a 9 in everything.
You talked at length about the two power armor wearing video game characters Master Chief and Doomslayer yet Samus Aran from Metroid wasn't mentioned. Odd, Master Chief, Doomslayer and Samus are often paired together in fan art. If you all were to talk about Samus at some point in a versus style like in this video I'm not sure who'd she'd go up against... except maybe the 40K daemon also called Samus. Samus Aran's whole thing is that she fights the good fight so the daemon Samus is absolutely the kind of monster that Samus Aran would hunt down.
1:04:39 he cant block lightnings at least in canon. Also not every jedi can block it. It ia a very rare ability wich only the most powerful jedi can use. Dooku was really impresst when yoda blockt his lightning.
Jorge didn’t call Halsey his mom. He just said Ma’am but his accent came off as “mum”. Also obligatory F in chat for Jorge. I’ll put my nerd glasses down now.
Both me and my father discussed this for a hour or two and we came up with some ideas. First off You gotta scale other things up. A demon baron in doom is only like 12-14 feet tall, and doomguy is still only 6.2 or about that. A normal space marine is 7-8 feet tall, Plus they were about 1000 pounds of space armor. In a melee fight very few can even compete with one. But i will say that doomguy got alot of better weapons. But his armor is not close to the level of a space marine. Halo is a better one because modified humans vs modified humans. But darth vader is one i don't have any say there. My father is alot more 40k leading. But he loses me after most points he says. I stopped talking about this after him saying that kratos wouldn't be able to do alot in 40k... the man who flipped the world tree in 2018 couldn't delete a few marines.
Canonically, in doom 2016, there is a uac journal entry that mentions how despite everything they had tried to damage the predator suit, they just couldn’t, this likely involved the use of the doom plasma rifle as well, which as one might know, space marine power armor is particularly susceptible to
If you mean doomguy & doommarine armor then yes they are worse than space marine armor, if you mean doomslayer armor then his armor is better than most if not all armors in 40k. In term of durability.
@@suemeade2471 then his armor durability surpass most if not all Armors in 40k, literally his armor has not been scratched from physical or melted from plasma, the only way to damage doomslayer was to damage his so much that the damage by pass the armor (even though it doesn't get damaged)& effect doom slayer from the sheer force or heat from the assaults
42:33 One thing people forget about Spartan IIs is that with mk V and above armor, they don’t need a gun to kill you. If they can bench press a tank (which they can, Frank O Connor said they can bench press scorpions while in later mjolnir armors) imagine hard hard they can punch you. Installation zero estimated Chief specifically can punch with a bare minimum 273 tons.
Not really. Spartan armor enhances the wearer by 2.5 to 5 times depending on the suit their wearing. Spartans can lift 3 times their body weight unarmored, and weigh over 300 pounds, so about 1000 pounds. That makes them able to to lift 1.5 to up to 3 tons. Thats strong but no where near bench pressing a 66 ton tank level. If they were that strong, they would be able to snap brutes in half like twigs. Their suits wouldn't even be to stop themselves ripping apart from the sheer force of every action they would take.
@@voomvoom4522 Something I’d like to say about their recorded out of armor feats. They we all 14 and just had the most grueling, body breaking, and invasive surgery that any human could bear. They didn’t have time to fully acclamate to their new bodies, they were still recovering from the worst surgery in human hsitory, and they weren’t fully developed physically. And for the detail about benching a scorpion, that was from Frank O Connor. Unfortunately, a lot of it is left to speculation and theory craft because of the information we’re providing with. But a good few Halo nerds will agree that many people sell the Spartans short, especially the Spartan IIs.
@@ThatOneAudioTeam The thing is, the lifting 3 times their body weight stat was done using their ADULT weight. Maybe once they reach full maturity their strength increases to 4 or even 5 times their weight, thats still no where near strong enough to lift a Scorpion. We also have to differentiate between what a character is saying as estimation or just plain exaggeration, and what should be taken as absolute gospel.
@@voomvoom4522 Frank O Connor isn’t a character, he’s one of Halo’s creators… He was with the series for 20 years. And these feats of strength are done while in the Mjolnir armor, Mk VI at the least if memory serves right. And yes, they were at their adult weight. *At age 14.* At age 14 they were already built better than Olympic champions. Obviously it would be insane if they could do this out of armor, but they don’t. Their strength is multiplied by their armor, and each new MK of Mjolnir armor multiplys off the previous one. But this only really gets crazy with MK V and above. MK IV was pretty tame, and was fairly generic in terms of feats-but it did look sexy.
Games work need to explain why ultramarines have a librarian who can connect with hive mind (Tigirius) , a space marine who can take warp explosion like nothing(Titus) and Maelum Caedo who is built differently 😂 How this 3 giga Chad's have the same pool geene of exel prime.
I wasn't really paying attention because I have had some shit distracting me, but with doom guys demons they all have skin and muscles that are stronger than steel and doom guy is infinitely strong which is the reason he rips them in half like butter, He moves hundreds of miles per hour if I remember correctly. He is insane and he's a literal god at this point after Doom eternal. So if he was in the 40K universe he would kill everything he would kill the chaos gods and then he would mourn his dead rabbit.
He wouldn’t even match a greater daemon let alone the chaos gods You gotta realise infinite strength doesn’t exist in fiction, you can have “infinite strength” in a universe cosmology but you strength is still limited by the cosmology That’s why strength (striking , lifting and ap can’t be rank by layers and tiers of infinity) In the warp speed doesn’t matter, your either beyond time or omnipresent He isn’t god, he has the power of the divinity machine which is the equal power of davoth Doomslayer best feat is killing davoth which is low complex multiversal due to davoth being able to create an infinite mulitverse with separate dimensions (some higher but not by degree of infinity) The warp transcend the multiverse of 40k, with 3 layers that each transcend the last Granting 3 layers into high outer (as 40k multiverse is high hyper due to higher dimensions and separate timelines and universe) So a outerversal named blueberry vs a low complex Devine demon slayer
Spartan III's are definitely not weaker than Spartan II's, that's unfortunately just their reputation due to the nature of their deployments. They were deployed on the most dangerous missions with inferior equipment compared to their predecessors, and suffered near 100% casualty rates, but they still accomplished the mission. Give them enough time to acclimate to their augmentations (most died while they were still teenagers and not at their full potential) and some proper Mjolnir armor and they're just as effective as their older siblings. You could almost say they're the Iron Warriors of the Spartans. Extremely effective, but treated as expendable because you can make more of them.
@@SparseS17 Why are their augmentations worse? Because they're cheaper and safer? People seem to be under the assumption that because the S-III program transitioned to less dangerous and invasive augmentations that didn't make them as tall, they were inferior, but I haven't seen any official literature saying that they were weaker. Training wise, they were indeed trained over a shorter period of time, but they were also trained *by a Spartan II,* which I'd argue is better than Mendez's training.
@@SparseS17 Ok, there's a bit wrong there. Their augmentations were actually BETTER as they got similar results but were far safer. The biggest difference was the genetic requirements, which were loosened to get more recruits. That would mean that IIs would have an edge in some way physically but the IIIs were so close to them that you really can't say whose better. Plus, some the IIIs matched the genetic standards of the IIs and others got experimental augmentations or drug treatments to boost their performance, which really muddies the waters. You're also comparing full adults (IIs) to teenagers (IIIs) for the most part. As for training, their's was HARDER than what the IIs received, due to having less time to train. Kurt-051 built their training from the ground up based on he had gone through as a II and for the kind of missions they would be sent on. Plus, he had Mendez come on as his aid. Kurt also accounted for the fact the IIIs have something the IIs didn't: motivation. The IIIs were unbreakable mentally and completely willing to fight last man against suicidal odds. You make it sound like the IIIs were inferior to the IIs. Yet, they accomplished missions that were deemed so crazy that even the IIs in Mjolnir would have not come back from despite being younger and having worse equipment.
Hope I'm not late to say this but Jorge doesn't say mom. The script has him saying ma'am. Jorge has a British accent and when he says ma'am it sounds like him saying mom. So while Catherine sort of saw herself as the mother, the Spartans... Well some kinda saw it like that. It's harder to explain, almost like a guardian figure but not like in a mother way. But maybe less or more with some Spartans depending on who we talking
I adore both doom and war hammer lore so the best way I can put what doom slayer is in terms of what happened is this: imagine the god emperor found caedo after he had already killed all those demons and then proceeded to make him a honorary member of the castodes(don’t know if I spelled that right) then later infused him with the essence of Kharn after kharn had killed all the other chaos gods and absorbed their power, and instead of turning into a demon prince caedo had turned into a brand new chaos god that fights solely for humanity then proceeds to kill this(hypothetical)super kharn and on the way to do it killed every demon prince sanguines the emperor himself and whoever the hell else got in his way That’s the doom slayer
Force stave should be able to stand up to a lightsaber, there's various 'shielded staff' weapons in star wars, and a big part of the reason they exist is as an anti-lightsaber weapon. Not saying vader would for-sure win, but he could just choke him out or crush his organs into mush with the force, or even just force-crush the armor like a soda can.
You guys are way off on your Halo lore: 1) All Spartan 2s are on the level of the Master Chief. The Chief is one of the best, true, but Kelly is the fastest of the Spartan 2s. Kurt is one of the best overall, Fred as well. Master chief, Kurt, Fred and Jerome were identified as the best leaders out of the group. What makes Chief unique is his "luck"😅 - that's actually lore. 2) Spartans operate in fireteams - the Chief is alone because he is one of the last. The halo trilogy takes place at the tail end of a 27 year old war with the Covenant and most of them died at Reach. 3) Jorge is not slow or a "tank". He's the same as a the other Spartans. It's just the gameplay. Gameplay is not the lore in Halo. 4) Spartan 3s are no slouches either. Overall their augmentations are slightly weaker. But they were engaging elites and killing them in hand to hand combat during their first ops. Watch Sodaz - Halo video to get an idea of their reaction time. That being said I think the space marines are way too strong for Spartans. They are like Brutes with Spartan reaction time. The master chief survived falling from orbit because he used a Forerunner warship's door to survive re-entry.
I refuse to believe that somehow any spartan is faster than a marine, a marines armour ensures he's moving faster than even he can register. Sorry, at best spartans are more agile but against 20mm autocannons that means absolutely nothing.
I'm not fully through the segment yet but the fact that they're trying to put John Halo on the same footing as Sicarius is mind boggling - the Master Chief may have faster reaction speed,but even with the largest weapons he can dig up,he still stands absolutely no fucking chance. Sicarius not only has access to artificer armour,which in general,while no two suits are the same,tend to have generally the same protection as termie armor,which dings off lascannon shots like they were nothing...Cato also is one of the characters which we know *Always* has an Iron Halo,which indepently of their judgement requires something not much shorter than Knight-grade weaponry to bring down,which yeah,no,John Halo isn't tanking a Scarab Beam to the face. And on the weaponry side,Sicarius' power sword is a glorified monomolecular blade and while it may take a fair few hits to break the chief's shield,once that's done for Chief is getting turned into Spartan Salad.
@@rollutherhodie3076 as much as i think a space marine would win you made one critical flaw... you included weaponry... in which case both (if they acquire non-human weapons) can effectively unmake the other. i don't like hardlight weapons unmaking people but its a thing 343 in their stupidity added... so we're counting it.
I honestly think if Doomslayer entered both Fantasy and 40k The Chaos God's straight up would we wiped out Gork and Mork just have mad respect for A. Being a Proper Boy and B. Proper Green the Emperor and Sigmar would straight up be crushed or at least have respect for him at least Sigmar and at least some of the Primarchs. I honestly could see Doomslayer beings friends with Khan, Sanguinius, Vulkan,and maybe Guiliman and Yurvraune, And if we're talking the Icon of sin it's stated the longer he remained alive and awake he literally would be strong enough to end existence as a whole bif Davoth didn't do it first .
I would like to point out that if Vader tried to deflect a bolter round he’d get obliterated by the shrapnel anyway, because in Starwars the best counter to lightsabers are conventional weapons which the bolter is dialled up to 100
He wouldnt even be inconvenienced, (heavy) bolter bolts canonically cant penetrate nor damage bricks from time of ancient rome and europe left after the technobarbarians that were still around the west end of the imperial palace. And the bolts themselves wouldnt even detonate as they have a impact based timer trigger (or as GW calls it, mass reactive switch which is just a extremely retarded way to say it has a piezometer/counterpressure based piezoelectric trigger with a resistor instead of regular inertia fuze).
@@ANDELE3025 So think that if you cut a explosive shell or grenade with a industrial laser, or other heat based cutting tool it won't explode because you did touch the fuse or pin? Lol maybe never touch a gun. Bolts can definitely damage brick, they can punch trough light vehicle Armor which is way stronger then rock types.
@@trickslies844 What the fuck are you on about, you room temp gunless cuck? First of all, bolters can't get through roman to current day stone and bricks, thats plain canon part of the siege of terra and why IWs had problems in the siege (hell modern day HEIAPs beat bolts in feats by such a degree its retroactively a even better explanation than warp shields as to why melee is the weapon type of preference). Second, its much more reliable for vader to just deflect bolter shots with force barrie because he can do so in a AOE. Third, no, bullet and even most grenades wont explode against a lightsaber because that too is already not just canon in SW, but also in real life closed chamber cutter cases because there is no fucking oxygen for the reaction to start and the 2-5% hydrogen in the cutting blend gets generally used up and bonded. Fourth, no, sige of terra, burning of prospero board game, dark heresy+deathwatch rpgs, 3rd editions iirc codex dark angels, devastation of baal, etc all prove that imperial ceramite (aka chinese tofu dreg material by feats), plasteel (current day 0.1IGP concrete) and their mythically durable adamantium for titans and heavier variants of tactical dread are in fact worse than a 2cm plate of hardened spring steel current day in strength, durability (sans the last case's tensile strength) and elasticty.
@@ANDELE3025 yeah, you are the people that should be kept away from 40k. Bolters are 19.05mm weapons, a 50.cal for comparison is 12.5mm, that is a 2d not even in 3d as yet. So no, bolters can definitely get through stone, brick and so on. And while being so ignorant and a straight up buffoon I'm not even going to argue with someone who takes modern measurements for 40k years from now, so yes, even a 19.05 bolter round made know would be a magnitude weaker than what space marines have. Just to remind you that lightsabers can't kill anymore and I've never seen a blaster even get through any cover nevermind it travels at 300m/s, and that's being generous.
The key diferece betwen halo and 40k is the warp , halo is as a hole a sifi franshice and has a copule of weird concepts but for the most part is down to earth compare to 40k, no spanker or spartan lazer holds a candel to the terros of the warp, thats not to say jhon wouldnt hold himslef in th 40k universe but he is at clear disadvantage
Another point I’d like to add to debunk the whole “imperial plasma guns explode so their unreliable” argument is that belesaruis cawl created the mk3 cawl pattern plasma incinerator which has a saftey mechanism that makes overheating impossible unless the mechanism is removed further more a bolter isn’t the only op weapon Cato can used to make short work of chief a meltagun would oneshot him easily
Another issue to consider, when comparing the short story terminal velocity, is the celestial body in question. Was this planet larger than earth? If so the space marine would be falling faster than chief due to the increase in planetary mass, thus increased gravity. This information is needed before the falling feat can be given to chief.
Counterpoint. Master chiefs armor safeguarding falling from high orbit is plot armor. Somehow armor that protects from insane kinetic forces from such an event, is incapable of stopping small arms fire from killing him. Gel layer can't stop bullets, but can stop terminal velocity? Need to pick which source you pull the feats from, books or games. Not both.
@@Al3xandr35But IT VAN THOUGH! Jesus just look at any lore vid on Spartan armour. The titanium armour protects against everything but from: hypervelocity bullets, and several plasma shots. More over. Mark 4 armour isn't the same say as Mark 6 which is bomb as hell. Then there's the new Mjoinir Gen 3. Super powerful.
