Surge Protection Has Nothing To Do With Lightning - DID YOU KNOW 

This is mostly incorrect. Surges can and indeed will be caused by lightning. What you described was inrush current which a surge protector will not save you from. Surge protectors save you from events where power is higher than the device is designed for, as it suppresses the extra energy (therefore the joule rating). Inrush from another device would cause a dip in voltage, which a surge protector wouldn’t save you from. However, the UPS’s shown in the video ARE intended to do surge and inrush and power outage protection. That’s another thing to note too. You never once mentioned in the short that what you are showing is a UPS, which while it has surge protection, is a completely different piece of equipment.

You failed on this one. Try again.

Talking about surge protectors when you're in front of a bunch of Uninterruptable Power Supplies... not surge protectors.

Breakers protect from shorts and overcurrent situations. Surge suppressors and surge protectors protect from over voltage situations. It's that simple.

Surge protectors are definitely used for lightning protection!

Um, those aren’t Surge Protectors. Those are UPS’. Also, Surge Protectors do NOTHING for “those lows” (officially called Brown Outs). Only a UPS can help with that. Lastly, quality surge protectors (I run ISOBAR protectors) absolutely can stop a lightening strike from damaging what’s plugged into it. Seems like the guy in the video needs to go take official training on these products.

Like many other comments you missed the boat on this one. Surge protection is all about lightning and very short impulses (spikes) seen during some motor etc operation. The In (subscript n) rating (normative impulse) is measured in microseconds and in accordance with UL 1449 this impulse is an 8/20ųs waveform (8ųs to peak and 20ųs to decay to half the value). One electrical cycle is 167ms (1ms = 1000ųs) so SPD's are only designed for fast impulses. A UL Listed SPD with an In rating of 20kA will withstand a minimum of 15 impulses (8/20ųs) and still be operational. High dollar SPD's have more and bigger MCOV's to handle additional transients and longer life span. Average direct lightning strike will produce around 18-20kA, thus these devices will absolutely help protect your business or home from damage. They do have a set overvoltage let-through so to speak so on a 480v system 1800v or so L-L may be seen. NFPA 780 and UL 96A (both lightning protection system installation standards) require SPD's to be installed as part of a proper lightning protection system. IEC 62305 (international lightning protection standard) also requires SPD's to be installed but uses a 50/350ųs waveform.

Aren't those UPS battery backups that also do voltage regulation

Surge is for when the utilities restore service and over power the system as they anticipate the load for that moment

Nothing to do with lightning? This statment maybe true directly, but not indirectly. There is a ridiculous amount of grid/mainline surges during lightning storms when heavy duty electrical equipment and grids are turning off and on. So having one is way better than having nothing.

EXCEPT: lightning induced power surges. They won't do much for a direct or nearby lightning strike, but they do help when the grid has a power surge from a lightning strike.

Surge protection does have something to do with lightning as lightning is a surge. Look up what Eaton surges protect from.

Lightning just went through 12 miles of air, a 1cm gap inside a disconnect mechanism isn't going to stop it.

Just a tip, if your gonna make a video. Research first

The late author Jerry Pournelle lost most of his lights and appliances hit a transformer pole and sent 10,000 volts down the line to his house. As an electical engineer he called that a SURGE.

Why do we replace surge protectors every time there is a mad storm 😂

When I lived in Florida, I used to install Lightning Arresters and surge suppressors on residential panels all the time. It was usually a quick and easy installation and I could get in and out in less than 90 minutes. Great way to pick up a few extra dollars to supplement my income when I had the time and the customer demand was there.

You might want to let Schneider electric know that because they have on their packaging that their square snap in surge protector, protects against lightning strike

​Actually there are a whole host of Transient Voltage Suppression (TVS) devices that arrest a surge. A diode, more specifically a CLAMPING diode is one type of device. An Avalanche TVS will clamp in 50 Pico seconds and is bi directional. There is also a gas discharge tube which is slow (>1 us) and typically most surge suppressors use a Metal Oxide Varistor or MOV. Its a small, button battery looking thing and works by decreasing resistance as the voltage goes up. This effect would trip your circuit breaker as it presents a short circuit between Line and Neutral. The life span of a MOV degrades over time and should be checked, bit it is a cheap device and thats why its predominantly used in most surge suppressors. A typical UPS is NOT a UPS at all. Its a STANBY powersupply and requires switching time to go from Line voltage to Battery. With a TRUE UPS, the load is ALWAYS running of the batteries. The input to a standby powersupply has some sort of TVS device. Typically a surge protection power strip just has a MOV in it. A true UPS is basically two parts; a charger & inverter both operating at the same time. The charger basically just recitfies the incoming AC then processes this DC voltage into two parts. One to keep the batteries fully charged, the other is fed to the inverter (as well as the battery voltage) to keep the load operational at all times. I design backup power systems for large data centers, so i am very familiar with power systems for sensitive equipment.

Should note if it says it has a lightning arrestor on the surge protector or UPS it can protect (but need to make sure network cables have them as well) the newer APC ups (like the ones you got there) probably have lightning arrester in them most belkin products do have one time use arrestor, the green light is for the surge protection only if it goes out it's only has one time use lightning protection remaining (no surge) and if the lightning protection is used it sacrifices itself by blowing it self up (dead extension lead) usually when you open them up there be a mess inside the case where it basically blows up to cut the circuit Most UPS can switch to battery before the lightning gets to the equipment (a lot of them die but at least the connected device is protected) but if it doesn't state lightning arrestor on the product or in the technical specs, it can only handle brownout or overvoltage (flip of a coin on how it handles lightning if it's offline ups or line interactive then probably not (unless it says otherwise) online ups may be able to because the power never switches to grid power it's a power in and out inverter with battery in between (best case is it handles it second base case it blows the imput inverter up protecting the connected device or worst case it jumps to the outgoing inverter and let's the voltage through)

Sorry but this is incorrect.

What you’re talking about here is power conditioning. A normal “surge protector” doesn’t condition power by attenuating or amplifying the line input during over and under voltage current situations. It essentially does this by keeping the devices drawing their power off of a battery in the unit which provides a clean and uninterrupted output despite line changes and then keeps a tiny trickle charge on said battery from the branch circuit to keep itself topped off at the back end. This is also how the power from the line can be lost and sensitive devices connected to it with a low threshold tolerance are not affected - like a circuit board whose state and integrity relies on the accurate maintenance and relay of current. A surge protector that you’re talking about either has a breaker which trips and can be reset, or a fuse that fries out and the unit must be replaced; it’s dumb. It’s either too much power coming through or it’s all good. They’re not reliable anyhow in most cases. I literally had a metal building take a direct lightning strike which went through the wiring and literally blew all of the outlets and things plugged into them out of the sockets like an explosion. I found my security cameras about 50-100’ away, across the yard, blow off their mounts and melted into globs of black smelly plastic. The funny thing is- the surge protector I had them all plugged into looked like it just came out of the box. The “protected” led that indictes all is good and “you can count on it” was still lit up and happy… lmao… really now? Cause I think you’re lying to me, mister. Aaaand that was the day I stopped worrying about these strips you buy at the store. If you take a good hit, without a whole house protector that can deal with tens of thousands of amps coming in, you’re done anyway. Just know that surge strips are basically expensive wish sticks serving you false hope and security. Use them for the only real thing they’re good for, which is giving you more plugs in a place where you need more. If you want actual protection, you need to make sure your service/breaker panel is properly grounded via an electrode that goes deep into the ground at the point of entry. That way any massive line surge coming in is diverted into the ground (literally) and ole’ Mother Earth takes the brunt instead of your new PlayStation 13. I think I’ll pass on my degree from this university. I’m not even an electrician and I know all of this stuff.

FYI... he's not showing you SURGE PROTECTORS... he's showing you UPS (UNINTERRUPTABLE POWER SUPLIES) super confusing for anyone not a electrician

Bad Audio. How can I trust you about technical things when you can't even mic yourself decently? You're dealing with ROOM REVERB. Deal with it well and fully. No more BAD AUDIO, please! Sheesh!

Inrush current causes voltage DROP, and your average "surge protector" which is just a power strip with a bunch of Metal Oxide Varistors in it.... doesn't have any way to store energy, so it can't do anything about a voltage DROP. What you need to adjust for a voltage drop is an "automatic voltage regulator". I am unaware if such systems are available to protect an entire house, but they're available to protect a large computer server (running on a 120v20A circuit). What surge protection CAN do is protect against voltage SPIKES, including those caused by (indirect) lightning strikes. However, if a lightning bolt directly strikes the wire feeding power into your house, and all you have is surge protection, all bets are off. Lightning is so incredibly powerful that you simply can't dissipate the energy it contains, and so the surge protectors will be destroyed likely along with a lot of equipment. All you can do with the energy of a lightning bolt is provide it with a more favorable path to ground. To that end, there are things called Lightning Arrestors. These are different from surge protectors. Surge protectors protect devices. Lightning arrestors protect BUILDINGS, including the wiring within them. Lightning arrestors almost always include a VERY LARGE connection for a grounded/earthed conductor, and this is where the energy of the lightning strike will be redirected to. Lightning arrestors usually operate on the spark-gap principle, however sometimes they use a Gas Discharge Tube, which performs similarly but operates at a lower voltage, conveying increased protection. After a lightning arrestor system, a standard whole house surge protection system will be able to take care of the remaining energy that the lightning arrestor is not rated to redirect (there is often still a sizable ~600-2500 volts spike on the incoming "240v center-tap grounded" service after the lightning arrestor redirects most of the energy of the bolt itself, simply due to inductive and capacitive effects, and the whole-house surge protection system will protect against that). What surge protectors themselves do is to protect against INDIRECT lightning strikes. Say a lightning bolt hits a tree 20ft away from the power pole that carries the transformer that supplies your house. A lightning bolt can carry peak currents on the order of 1 million amps, typically, with an extremely fast rise and fall time. For current carrying conductors oriented in "favorable" directions, this will induce a large potential on the wire, despite no electrons from the bolt itself having traveled to the nearby wire. And it is this inductive spike that surge protectors are designed (and rated) to protect against.

Ignoring lightning for a moment to correct an assumption.... a large voltage spike will occur when an inductilve field ** collapses **, not starts up. Shutting off a motor, for example, sends a voltage burst in the opposite direction of the normal current flow. This is how the points and coil ignition system worked on cars until the 1970s. I was an engineer in a space satellite factory. When a work shift ended at 4 pm, a computer would go down - everyday. It was found that a 50 Hp electric motor was the cause. It would generate a 1300 volt spike on the power lines for a few milliseconds when it was shut off, giving a critical computer a lobotomy. A surge protector solved the problem.

Lol what....... Thats a negative. a surge is above normal voltage which can be lightning on the overhead lines, Surge protectors have a bunch of MOV's in them which just short out to dump voltage when voltage exceeds their rating...... Yikes

lightning protection is so misunderstood by electricians because they are not trained for it. Refer to NFPA 780 not NFPA 70. Hint: a properly designed low impedance ground system will potentially limit the voltage to a level that a surge protector can manage.

Did you know, there is no defined electrical term as a “surge“? It’s a loose term for a half a dozen things, to include motor inrush current, other transient voltage spikes, switch and current spikes, and other things. To include lightning strikes. - We should really stop making use of the word. Maybe it is the purpose of the word, to realize that anybody making use of the word, is clueless?

this guy definitely isn't from Florida.. most of the videos are awesome but this one isn't helping our Florida electricians. We get power outages all.. the.... time .. because of lightning ⚡ and then power comes back on and boom.. stupid arc breakers are shot, smart appliances are shot... etc.. because of what I thought was "surge" but what do I tell customers now?

When designing terminals and PC's at Texas Instruments in the 1980's surge protection was designed to deal with lightning strikes, not inrush current. This guy has plenty of good advice for wiring panels, but in this case is way off.

Most internal generated surges occur from inductive kick-back, as a device, like a motor, is de-energized -- not the other way around. It builds a reverse voltage to try to keep the inductive current flowing and then decays away. Basic electronics 101. And surges do come from lightning strikes at or near the utility poles.

I just installed a lightning rod on our farmhouse and got some pretty confusing feedback about grounding the LPS to the house and home neutral. Versus having a separate grounding rod just for the LPS. Can you do an episode explaining weather the Lightning Rod should be bonded to the house grounding system and neutral? Or kept Isolated.

From outlet to equipment I only trust the Line Conditioner with Surge Protector internal to it. Surge Protector has no cure for briefl significant increase or decrease in AC Voltage that last split-seconds to minutes in duration.

I have multiple APC surge protectors and they work great, but that little one on the left is complete garbage. If you put it on an oscilloscope it looks like a tangled fishing line. It's actually fried multiple AC to DC "bricks".

Surges can be caused by the voltage gradients created by lightning strikes close to the Service. Of course the surge protector won’t do much for a direct hit but can help with lightning close to the property. To say they have NOTHING to do with lightning is a misnomer.

Lightning suppression is a 6 foot copper clad pole next to your house running a cable to a pole higher than the highest point in the structure. Results can vary, mostly good. In a direct hit you are lucky not to get an eight foot hole through your house or a fire disaster. Mother nature is difficult to tame.

It absolutely does have to do with lightning strikes alongside the other problems associated with big pieces of equipment on the network

This is horribly misleading, a surge protector might not always be able to protect from lightning, as that's an extreme case, it protects from power SURGE, ie excess power,

This is just about the most inaccurate explanation I think I’ve ever heard. I’d be very surprised if this guy is actually an electrician, although saying that, he is an American and their standards are pretty low.

......As a dude who has had multiple lightning strikes fry electronics in his house - you might be right about the designed purpose, but the fact of the matter is that the electronics in there will often take the hit for your electronics -saving your device. Devices not on surge protectors would be dead, device on surge protectors would just need a new surge protector.

Sooooooo, does this mean I can go take my 6-outlet surge protector strip off of the tail of my kite?? Well, that's cool... maybe I'll finally be able to get that damn thing off the ground now.

"Nothing to do with lightning protection" 😅 yet it's part 4 of IEC 62305 protection against lightning standard

As others are saying your statement is incorrect. Utility companies provide electric power to consumers. Occasionally when they change configuration of their switching equipment you will get what is indeed a surge. Also for example when a tree falls on a power line especially at three phase power line you will get two phases connected together which will also cause a surge for several cycles.

If it states the voltage squiggly and says 14kv protection, it will protect from overcurrent. Not undercurrent. Your utility would normally never be able to send 14kv to the home so this implies lightning level protection. What you describe would be the same as putting a capacitor across the two hots or hot and neutral to instantly cover undercurrent just like a AC single phase compressor. Also a note to the UPS video. A good UPS will constantly feed mains to rectifier to battery to inverter to load so that the battery always gets a workout and the device battery just keeps doing what it does with or without power. Power just charges the battery. Helps with faster transfers of power down to the millisecond which can keep a computer from ever turning off.

The Regs in the UK require Surge Protection on all new installation since the last 2nd Amendment of the 18th Edition 2018.

ALSO people buy a UPS that gives true sine wave power to your devices. This will help to greatly prolong the life of your electronics.

Hey did you know about phase as it applies to the audio signal in/through/from your microphone? Please study up on that and you can produce even better quality content.

TVS - Transient Voltage Suppression diodes were built for lightning protection. They're in some surge protectors.

A bold statement that’s mostly inaccurate. A surge protector will protect your devices from lightning but not a close strike.

Yeah... a lightning bolt has so much power that there's very little that can be done to stop it... lighning rods just redirect it... not much more that can be done

Too bad those aren't surge protectors in front of you. I don't know why you are referring to them as surge protectors. They are UPS's. Try again.

Surge protectors when they conduct during the surging ,they need to be replaced unlike MCBs ,so you mean everytime an appliance turns on as it surges ,the spd has to be replaced each time

You American should conform to the 240v and your Aircons won’t be surging no more

I was told it’s the other way around surge protectors serve no purpose other than to protect aginsed over voltage situations wich lightning can cause

Plus there is NOTHING that will protect you or your stuff against direct lightning

If you suddenly remove current load for an inductive network the voltage wants to spike up. Lighting could cause part of the network to disconnect and a momentary surge could be encountered.

So then what protects against lightening? (Besides a grounding rod?)

I have a dumb question? Does it help if you use multiple surge protectors on a circuit.??

If your grid loses power from lightning or it flickers you will likely have a power surge from the utility lines

It also protects from lightning, since lightning causes a surge of extra electricity??

One you’re using the wrong units all a surge protector is, it’s just a capacitor on the powerlines

Like a water hose thats on then you kink the hose then un kink hose and you get a strong blast of water pressure for a second

Lightning can cause surges and spikes in the power system. Incorrect info.

All batteries in positive mode produces electrical waves that are radio active ?

Are you saying that I've been lied to for almost 50 years?

A direct hit from lightning will kill any electronics.

Yes and no ... read a book about different types of SPDs

Do you have a video of how sine waves and their formulas?

So is lightning protection even a thing? Is it possible?

equipment turning on does not "send so much current."

I dont believe this is accurate - needs scrapped

Motors especially that's why they use capacitors so the breaker doesn't trip it helps get motor starter up and running

Isnt that why we have % motor ratings?

That's just misinformation

it still helps with lightning

no solution for lightning?

Do a video on load shedding

Thanks for that...

Malarkey

Okay. 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

I have a installed a few lightening arrestors. After the customers house or property was hit by lightening. 😂 It was made of metal, half the size of an AC capacitor and sat outside the panel, fastened to a knock out, and connected to the utility power on the main.

This is why I learned things from concept up. I know for a fact that the FLC of a motor does not trip breakers unless the load current on the circuit combined is already pushing the circuit for amperage. Maybe Dustin is use to adding outlets on the lighting circuit for AC units near windows and often sees that trip his work, but that shouldnt happen unless there is some stupid uneccecary current on the circuit. Also im pretty sure lighting strikes on lines are one of the reasons why circuit breakers were invented in the first place.

bullshit, it protects from any voltage spikes without difference where they are coming from

This is news to me, and is contrary to everything I've heard before about surge protectors, so it requires confirmation not provided by this short video.

Lol!

Thanks.

That APC unit in the middle, I've got three of them in my house and love them. It's not a pure sine wave but it doesn't need to be to keep the fish tank on during a power failure. 😎

Yes

If you want protection against lightening, you need lightening rods installed at the highest points with a ground grid with 3' cross sections, and you still may have damage, but it's minimal. This is what power plants do anyways. I got to enjoy a siemens 40 MW Steam Turbine once, and that was an experience.

How does it remedy that with a power strips surge protector? If it's outside a range it just trips right

Will whole-home surge protectorz help with this as well, or does the surge protection need to be between the load and line in order to limit the draw from the panel? If it needs to be between, are there any surge protection options for hardwired appliances like an ac?

👎⚡️

Now you know and knowing is half the battle...

This is why transfer switches need spds

Tell the power companies they are wrong then…

I always like to tell customers that surge protectors are more like water filters for your electricity. Just trying to clean out the bad power to keep everything stable.

I like your explainations

Is this the cause of my lights dimming when the air conditioner turns on?

Great little clip explaining the difference! Been following you for a few years now and have picked up many useful tips. I feel like your audience is mostly DIY’ers and not professional electricians, so thank you!!