Тёмный

That's It, I'm Done With Serverless* 

Theo - t3․gg
Подписаться 300 тыс.
Просмотров 196 тыс.
50% 1

Gonna be a long year of moving everything to the edge...
ALL MY VIDEOS ARE POSTED EARLY ON PATREON / t3dotgg
Everything else (Twitch, Twitter, Discord & my blog): t3.gg/links
S/O Ph4seOne for the awesome edit 🙏

Наука

Опубликовано:

 

21 апр 2023

Поделиться:

Ссылка:

Скачать:

Готовим ссылку...

Добавить в:

Мой плейлист
Посмотреть позже
Комментарии : 463   
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
Oh no this is going viral which means the comments are going to utter shit. FAQ HERE - IF YOU ASK SOMETHING I ANSWER HERE YOU'RE PERMABANNED "What is the edge runtime" - it's an ALTERNATIVE TO NODE that is VERY MINIMAL and VERY FAST. That is why it has no cold starts. That's also why it has no native ability. (mentioned at 8:54) "Regional edge is contradictory; You made that up!" - As I said AT THE START. Edge references TWO THINGS. Runtime and location. If you limit your edge functions to run in a specific region, they're called "regional edge functions". Learn more here: vercel.com/blog/regional-execution-for-ultra-low-latency-rendering-at-the-edge Seriously if y'all don't cut the shit I"m turning off comments.
@xN811x
@xN811x Год назад
lol
@xN811x
@xN811x Год назад
Something to add to the FAQ maybe, as I can't seem to find the original comment questioning it: - Why does the cold start take several seconds? - Why would we care about it? The number of needed cold starts approaches zero in the long run
@NotesNNotes
@NotesNNotes Год назад
I just got here stop yelling at me
@ruyvieira104
@ruyvieira104 Год назад
@@xN811x typescript compiling all the node_modules
@BusinessWolf1
@BusinessWolf1 Год назад
The internet is full of idiots. You should know this by now.
@Gabriel_Pureliani
@Gabriel_Pureliani Год назад
First serverless, then edge, next thing you know theo's in your kitchen installing a server for less latency.
@ea_naseer
@ea_naseer Год назад
they might as well start torrenting databases and some parts of the backend to reduce latency
@sohn7767
@sohn7767 Год назад
Eventually we are back in the Stone Age of locally running services
@vivarantx
@vivarantx Год назад
​@First Last is the AGI gay by any chance?
@RawBert
@RawBert Год назад
@@ea_naseer at this point blockchain makes more sense
@Fernando-ry5qt
@Fernando-ry5qt Год назад
@@ea_naseer Might not be that crazy, running microservers on edge and using a token algorithm to handle the data persistance.
@plopplippityplopyo
@plopplippityplopyo Год назад
It's funny watching devs reinvent everything they shunned 😂
@Winnetou17
@Winnetou17 Год назад
This needs more upvotes
@muskrat7312
@muskrat7312 Год назад
YES! So spot on. It's even better when you listen to a dev that has "discovered" security principles and having them walk the team through all the things they should have been doing from the beginning.
@meorung05
@meorung05 Год назад
Just wait until they fully move client side rendering back to the server
@BKearal
@BKearal Год назад
@@meorung05 You mean server prerendered HTML. The heresy! :D
@philipgumm9243
@philipgumm9243 Год назад
Was thinking the exact same thing.
@wiztek1197
@wiztek1197 Год назад
"Put everything on a VPS" and stop thinking Best decision i ever made
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
see: my video on getting DDOS'd last week lol
@timschupp2080
@timschupp2080 3 месяца назад
@@t3dotggno one said you cant put it behind cloud-flare anyways
@Kimitri
@Kimitri 3 месяца назад
@@t3dotgg so put everything on a vps with cloudflare protection
@sphinxwar8529
@sphinxwar8529 2 месяца назад
​@@Kimitri I agree, the level of fucking idiocy devs go to while there are simple point-and-click solutions is astounding. I feel like there are two different worlds - the actual dev world and YT tech space where everything is THE NEW THING. Like SHUT THE FUCK UP oh my god. Yes, it's fun to learn the new things, but wait for them to mature before switching. Fucking tech youtube is a bunch of hipsters ordering essential oils for a flu.
@heidji
@heidji Год назад
I feel that web developers went from optimizing LAMP stacks and dove directly into serverless, to quickly realize that it's expensive if you're not going to optimize, and then went back to optimizing. Next video will be about "how I ditched serverless to configure my own Varnish/Redis cache"
@o_glethorpe
@o_glethorpe Год назад
So true. You need to ask yourself how this man make money and you will see that this is a propaganda campaign disguised as tech content, and dont you dare debunk or you will get ban.
@heidji
@heidji Год назад
@@o_glethorpe I don't necessarily think that he's doing propaganda, but rather milking content for views. No one on earth changes their mind on tech stacks like this guy
@Firestar-rm8df
@Firestar-rm8df Год назад
I've heard memcached has better performance than redis as it it written in a lower level language and supports multithreading, but admittedly haven't tested it yet.
@System0Error0Message
@System0Error0Message Год назад
well you cant optimise your php if aws is the one running it on serverless.
@Firestar-rm8df
@Firestar-rm8df Год назад
@@System0Error0Message I hate php. I hope it dies and is replaced with c++ backends and wasm clients.
@mattiarasulo9934
@mattiarasulo9934 Год назад
idk guys I feel at this point when I was building with Express and EJS and deploying on a VPS with a simple NGINX reverse proxy we reached the peak and then we started over-engineer..
@SimonCoulton
@SimonCoulton Год назад
@@vinos1629 of course there is a reason, adding to your resume…
@svenhofstede
@svenhofstede Год назад
Agree 100%. Maybe this is useful for use cases that I’m not aware of but to me this seems like major extra complexity. Connecting to your database using REST?! Your existing code won’t always work because the runtime doesn’t support certain functions? And if they do it’s because the vendor is maintaining some custom converter? What problem are we solving here? Is it purely for cost reduction while achieving low global latency?
@ethannr1
@ethannr1 Год назад
Build for now and not the future, the majority of projects will never need to use edge
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
I don't think you guys understand just how hard it is to do VPS management correctly at scale.
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
@@vinos1629 and I don’t have to hire engineers like y’all to manage it full time while maintaining cheaper, faster, more scalable solutions 🤷‍♂️
@allNicksAlreadyTaken
@allNicksAlreadyTaken Год назад
You are the meme JavaScript developer that has a different stack every week, but pretends they don't.
@DannyMcPfister
@DannyMcPfister Год назад
😂😂😂
@33ethan33lol1
@33ethan33lol1 Год назад
Are you a Developer who doesn't like to improve your stack ? I mean updates the stack and change are two very separate things buddy. 🎉🎉❤ Theo
@curiouslycory
@curiouslycory Год назад
Theo does the experimentation and research and as a result I get to spend a lot less time doing it to find really great tools. I hope he keeps changing his stack every week!
@damionmurray8244
@damionmurray8244 Год назад
@@curiouslycory I concur. Your comment epitomizes the phrase *_"'Tis wise to learn from one's mistakes, but wiser still to learn from the mistakes of others"_*
@Davidlavieri
@Davidlavieri Год назад
Chasing the framework of the week, the tech of the month whatever it is, never satisfied. This is not targeting real developers with real companies, just the usual twitter's "TODO app devolver" thats basically just clickbaity sponsored content "omg it only takes .00023seconds to create this full fledge app with this tech" the full fledge app being a todo app auth 😂
@_2_100
@_2_100 Год назад
this is a marketing video
@LawJolla
@LawJolla Год назад
Soon we will rediscover servers where cold starts, hand shakes, and ORM spin ups aren’t a thing.
@captaindrake8040
@captaindrake8040 8 месяцев назад
don't tell Theo he will rewrite everything again
@jacobwwarner
@jacobwwarner 8 месяцев назад
I really like how you give an explanation with a visual diagram to support it. It's really helping me understand some of the more infrastructure-side tech.
@lennart5738
@lennart5738 Год назад
Hey Theo. I don't know if you actually measured the difference in request time to the DB but from what I know there is signifcant overhead to an HTTP request unless you are using Connection: keep-alive. Does the edge runtime support keep-alive connections? (P.S. I checked the FAQ first)
@matthew_whitfield
@matthew_whitfield Год назад
I use lambda running node/express for SSR and find that less than 1% of user requests end up being cold starts now that the site has a decent level of traffic. With a cold start, the TTFB on a good connection rises from around 200ms to around 400-450ms, which isn't bad enough to make me want to switch. Plus the JS code is 20mb+ uncompressed on the server side so I would have to do something with that.
@nsuid7499
@nsuid7499 Год назад
curious what your setup looks like? would you mind sharing a little more detail? I'm assuming you're using some template engine to serve HTML from lambdas and routing reqs through AWS APIGateway.
@matthew_whitfield
@matthew_whitfield Год назад
@@nsuid7499 Yeah, a page request first goes to CloudFront (CDN), if it hasn’t been cached it goes to API Gateway (HTTP API) which then calls the Lambda function to generate the HTML for the page. The site uses the Angular framework ("boo!"), so it’s their rendering engine, but I imagine it would work just as well with any other template engine. The lambda functions need to get an item from DynamoDB to produce the page (house price information site). The average execution time for a warm Lambda function is 50-75s of which I think the database query is 10-15ms. For users 200ms seems to be the time it takes to get anything back, so I guess the rest is all network stuff like directs, DNS, connection etc. Cold start on average seems to add around 200-250ms, and they are a very small percentage of total requests.
@wissens4644
@wissens4644 Год назад
Dev Test
@AmithKini
@AmithKini Год назад
It's surprising to see how "Frontend development" went from "Develop HTML, JS, CSS" --> "Develop SPA but backend handles database and hosting" --> "Decide if a feature/page is served on serverless or edge and take care of it". Does this mean small app developers no longer need a dedicated backend engineers?
@pts394
@pts394 Год назад
yeah backend devs are often useless lol (for small apps)
@gamemoves2415
@gamemoves2415 Год назад
@@pts394 terrible opinion. Who do you think wrote the code for edge to work? Frontend Devs? Lmoa
@daleryanaldover6545
@daleryanaldover6545 Год назад
It's fullstack all along. I've been fullstack since I entered the industry for all I know.
@daleryanaldover6545
@daleryanaldover6545 Год назад
@@pts394 words of a front end dev who can't center a div and happen to be stuck in vim.
@pts394
@pts394 Год назад
Hey guys, chill, I was talking about smaller apps, ofc backend devs are important, nobody is debating that. Maybe I used not enough words to say what was on my mind
@MarthinusBosman
@MarthinusBosman Год назад
I want the "Edge" to just become everyone's PCs/phones and everything just running like torrents and not off any owned server whatsoever.
@pts394
@pts394 Год назад
sounds similar to a blockchain distribution
@pursuitofknowledge5566
@pursuitofknowledge5566 Год назад
@@pts394 lol no it doesnt
@pts394
@pts394 Год назад
@PursuitofKnowledge how come? Blockchain is a similar concept, isn't it? Everybody in the network has the ownership of something, and at the same time, everybody has the ability to share it with multiple users at the time. It's like a giant system built on top of some sort of community
@pursuitofknowledge5566
@pursuitofknowledge5566 Год назад
@@pts394 I would suggest looking up what torrents are.
@pts394
@pts394 Год назад
@@pursuitofknowledge5566 yeah sounds like a good idea after all lol
@oscarhagman8247
@oscarhagman8247 Год назад
it's only been a month since your T3 tutorial and i feel like it's already getting outdated. Will you make an update video where you build it with all the new things you have been talking about since then?
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
Of course. Unlike my tutorial, none of this tech is ready for general use and recommendation. Hopefully soon…ish…
@oscarhagman8247
@oscarhagman8247 Год назад
​@@t3dotggthanks! and yeh, whenever it's ready ofc
@matthew1106
@matthew1106 11 месяцев назад
This is a fantastic video. Really wonderful job explaining the trade offs.
@TomasJansson
@TomasJansson Год назад
I like your visualization around 5:00 on the impact of moving the service further away from the db.
@keyone415
@keyone415 Год назад
Seems like the Vercel Edge Runtime is only for JS app, so not for me :) An inter-continental round trip takes 150ms, so in most situations, we don't even need multi regional deployments. I'm fine with doing a little bit of server management and never have a "cold start" and having super fast DB queries... On AWS if we pick things like Spot instances we can save a lot on ECS costs, when done right you can save like 90% on the on demand price. Serverless is fine for doing Async use cases, but I don't think it's a good choice for Web Servers where latency is critical.
@paologaleotti8478
@paologaleotti8478 Год назад
i agree but sometimes It can be a really good choice if you dont mind cold starts. very low prices and you get auto scaling out of the box
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
Edge runtimes can only run JS or WASM generally, and you'll only see response times this good in JS. Crazy enough, having a fully virtualized engine for your language has benefits sometimes
@SkywalkerWroc
@SkywalkerWroc Год назад
Yep. That fear of cold starts is grossly overblown.
@pappdomi5
@pappdomi5 Год назад
Wouldn't read-only DB regions be a solution for the global edge problem? (Planetscale can manage that) Or I can't guarantee my global edge function calls my closest read-only database?
@invinciblemode
@invinciblemode Год назад
You can guarantee that your edge fn calls the closest db.
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
You’re thinking too far ahead I wasn’t gonna talk about this for at least a month or two…
@oleksandrploskovytskyy1520
@oleksandrploskovytskyy1520 Год назад
Yeah it’s awesome! Btw is it possible already to use just “edge” keyword instead of “experimental-edge” for deployments or it’s different runtimes where the experimental one is for new features like regional edge?
@almeidaofthejoel
@almeidaofthejoel Год назад
Thank you for showing that you could opt into edge on pages as well as API routes, I was trying to find out if you could for like an hour yesterday and couldn't find that anywhere. Everything I see on Vercel is just showing API routes
@user-jg2xj4kj3f
@user-jg2xj4kj3f Год назад
Deno and Deno Deploy have improved edge runtime capabilities. Not everything is addressed (there is some issues with low level apis), but Deno is doing some pretty cool things in the Edge landscape.
@jricardoprog
@jricardoprog Год назад
And my shared server that responds in less than 50ms with PHP!
@Joao-te9sl
@Joao-te9sl Год назад
What you are referring to as Edge Runtime is in fact specifically the Cloudflare Workers runtime (Vercel is powered by Cloudflare Workers), that runs on V8 Isolates. There is nothing that prevents you from having another edge runtime with an approach that does not use Isolates. AWS Lambda@Edge is also on an "edge runtime", but they use their own solution to achieve this (on which you can only use Node and Python as far as i know), it's just much inferior to Cloudflare's.
@NotOats_
@NotOats_ Год назад
When I was watching this I kept thinking "this sounds exactly like CF workers", good to know it basically is
@DisFunctor
@DisFunctor Год назад
that's good to know! Sorry if this is a stupid question, but doesn't that mean it's possible to achieve the same without going through Vercel at all? I've never used either, but it looks like if one were to use CloudFlare workers directly, you'd have more flexibility (don't need to be constrained to using node, for instance), which I'm sure has its trade-offs since I'm guessing Vercel provides some conveniences in case you do want to use their service instead.
@NotOats_
@NotOats_ Год назад
@@DisFunctor I've never used Vercel but yeah you can achieve the same result using CF Workers directly. I am sure there's some sort of service/features that Vercel adds to the equation though
@aprilmintacpineda2713
@aprilmintacpineda2713 Год назад
Sometimes Theo isn't a reliable source.
@lex-fridman
@lex-fridman Год назад
hmm.. like a lot of times in fact. I suspect most people watching Theo are not real senior engineers and those who are senior just use Theo's content as one uses newspapers, just to hear about topics in the market and selectively do their own deep research on technologies.
@manai2683
@manai2683 Год назад
@@lex-fridman To be honest that's what anyone should be doing with any info on the internet in general. Sure there are more or less reliable sources, but in the end, you make the call.
@xenonchikmaxxx
@xenonchikmaxxx Год назад
​​​​@@lex-fridmansystem architect here. Some time ago I've consulted my friends about tech stack for their startup idea. The issue is that in my country salaries of developers are pretty high, so I've decided to put in serverless everything that was possible. My main job is in big corpo so I'm not familiar with such stuff and Teo's videos helped me a lot. For my standards the result app was sht af, performance sucked, but its more pragmatic than hire expensive team of java+js devs for startup with unknown future. If everything will go right and guys get some investment we ofc hire a normal team but for now it's not an option. So, all this stuff is not suitable for big corpos where "Serious Enginners" work but useful for testing business ideas.
@alokpuri9953
@alokpuri9953 Год назад
I would like to correct you. It's not "sometime" , you can never trust Theo, this is just an vercel sponsored channel
@theshy6717
@theshy6717 Год назад
Do you have a video of you building an app on the edge with planetscale? I find it hard to use planetscale without prisma and would love to see how you do it
@brefaccion
@brefaccion Год назад
Edge runtime feels like an oportunity for CQRS revival to me. Serverless was already a good fit for it but with those limitations specifically, it almost reads like the intent of `exec` in pure FP variations of CQRS. Meaning, you aren't meant to do IO in it, you just take a command and a state (usually local to the system), and emit events out of it instead of running long-living requests (which can be triggered elsewhere reacting to events similar to redux-sagas), and you just need to keep a minimal internal state, only what is necessary for your `exec` to make decisions on what events to emit. Plus events are meant to be JSON.stringify-able
@mochalatte3547
@mochalatte3547 Год назад
What presentation tool do you use to explain all about serverless? quick drawing is what kept my attention when you were pointing out the subtle differences between serverless vs edge. Kudos.
@michidk
@michidk Год назад
When talking about edge locations, you assumed that there always has to be a cold time or some slow database connection build-up, there are solutions where this is not the case (warm standbys). Additionally you can also send HTTP requests to database API from edge locations, this is not only limited to edge runtimes.
@DiegoBM
@DiegoBM Год назад
This was incredibly informative! Where can we read more about practical coding for the edge runtime (including handling non-edge-ready dependencies and dealing with data)?
@francescociulla
@francescociulla Год назад
I like the strong opinions. Watching it now
@kemoboy
@kemoboy Год назад
And when I think that for more than half of my and my clients web apps/sites I just use a VPS and it just works fine, with loading times that are good. :( When did deploying stuff become so overcomplicated?
@OldKing11100
@OldKing11100 Год назад
My brain fried when trying to figure out the subtle differences between edge/regional I'm just happy to be able to throw my SvelteKit frontend up to Cloudflare pages with specifying which routes can be prerendered. Then for anything more complicated I connect Cloudflare Pages to my Go Fiber API and DB backend through Cloudflare Tunnel. Edge functions are still spooky to me, even though I do use fetch().
@carlosbueno6252
@carlosbueno6252 Год назад
You shoul'd take a look at Fermyon. It's basically everything you want when you talk about edge runtime. It's basically webassembly on the server, it allows you to have no cold start and spin up and down you infra as needed.
@JB-fh1bb
@JB-fh1bb Год назад
Edge location is basically only useful for static content. Making a brochure website for a big client? Edge location is a solid choice. Want anything with live data? Rethink it.
@Mrdresden
@Mrdresden Год назад
Thanks for the informative explanation, it actually did clear some things up that weren't fully clicking for me . One question of topic though; what tool are you using for drawing your diagrams there? I'm in need of a non cluttered drawing tool like that but my google foo is failing me.
@kenfrostyypaws9113
@kenfrostyypaws9113 Год назад
It's called excalidraw and it's fantastic!
@DontEatFibre
@DontEatFibre Год назад
What is that drafting/presentation software on 3:39? My projects are usually quite simple so I have been using Cloudflare workers and KV Storage to host static website exports and to build basic APIs. Now they have made their D1 SQL databases for workers open for testing.
@ccccjjjjeeee
@ccccjjjjeeee Год назад
World confirmed to be a flat circle 💯
@SeanCassiere
@SeanCassiere Год назад
Does anyone know of an edge compatible cuid generator? The paralleldrive one seems to use node:crypto which doesn't work in edge, and I don't believe Drizzle has a helper for it.
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
The paralleldrive one _should_ work but doesn't due to a weird bug in bundling for app router. Works in /pages for some reason 😅 I've raised it with vercel and hope they have it handled soon. Suffering with uuid v4 for now 😅
@zeon137
@zeon137 Год назад
I hope we can keep edging together for a long while
@L33tRose
@L33tRose Год назад
Damn the edge looks really impressive. I might take a deep dive into v8 isolates to see how they work and what other tech is using them. Would be really cool to see a follow up video on moving ping to the edge and seeing a before and after in performance.
@chair547
@chair547 4 месяца назад
Thanks for this great edging tutorial theo
@rickdg
@rickdg Год назад
Respect to the editor going back to screenshot that yes from Jacob 😂
@sbmb9613
@sbmb9613 8 месяцев назад
So no ffmpeg @ edge ... shouldn't v8 isolates support wasm? Technically able to execute rust binaries?
@nikolozichikhladze8638
@nikolozichikhladze8638 Год назад
Can somebody link me a video where Theo is talking about Firebase or why he would never consider it If such exists? Just curious of Firebase functions vs vercel edge comparison
@MattThomson
@MattThomson Год назад
I don't know what makes everything change so much. You learn one thing and next month it's not the right way.
@o_glethorpe
@o_glethorpe Год назад
Everyone is pushing some kind of agenda, you should learn as much as possible and create your own opinions, dont just go with the flow and never assume to yourself any opinion just because some dude with fancy hair said so.
@vivarantx
@vivarantx Год назад
he's just selling his service...serverless is fine for 99% of the apps
@studiowebselect
@studiowebselect Год назад
Vercel is using aws or i am wrong? Also for the cold start time, its because your code is to big. Sound crazy, but we are in an time where you need to optimize the weight of the backend as we do with the front-end. For the DB connection, use DynamoDb as mush as possible and dont use external db of aws. Serverless DB from aws is bad also. So lightweight code, DynamoDb with a aws non-serverless db and it will be fast without cold start lag
@brainsniffer
@brainsniffer Год назад
The funny thing is, I thought when serverless was released it had the same sort of pricing, and people where massively touting it because you could get millions of runs for pennies - am I misremembering that? I’d imagine, once there was uptake and people began using serverless that it became worth it for providers to begin charging for potential availability, tracking the minutes and charging that way. I would expect a similar shift for edge.
@rzr1191
@rzr1191 Год назад
Don't let the terminology mislead you. It's really just "Web standard APIs inside v8 isolates" It's on the "edge" because providers like cloudflare can achieve incredibly high multi-tenancy on far fewer servers compared to VMs A 1-5MB bundle is much more reasonable to replicate to 100+ regions compared to 300MB to 1GB+ docker images It's objectively cheaper than "serverless" VMs. And much better suited to applications like frontend servers which don't really need much more than a subset of Web APIs
@MrWandalen
@MrWandalen 9 месяцев назад
Hello! Thanks for video! Wonderful diagrams! Which software did you use to draw it?
@Leofmoura87
@Leofmoura87 Год назад
Can anyone help me to understand why we don't have cold start on the EDGE? I missed that. thanks!
@JacobKrajewski
@JacobKrajewski Год назад
Edge is also used to talk about edge devices. For instance, whether or not a computer vision model is handled online somewhere, or on the physical device, or the "edge device" or "edge processing"
@GccYak-eg3wk
@GccYak-eg3wk Год назад
Vercel edge functions charge for execution units of 50ms. Isn't that the same as lambda charging for CPU time?
@JohnVandivier
@JohnVandivier Год назад
Excellent watch. Tysm
@jonnyso1
@jonnyso1 Год назад
Doesn't like slow apps... writes everything with typescript.
@WhhhhhhjuuuuuH
@WhhhhhhjuuuuuH Год назад
Great video. I would if you included a bit on how this helps your customers.
@rewrose2838
@rewrose2838 Год назад
Around 21:30
@pokefreak2112
@pokefreak2112 Год назад
@@rewrose2838 That it? If cold starts and prisma are the bottlenecks it sounds to me like optimizing prisma and hosting on a regular server are the most obvious solutions. People really just jumped on the serverless bandwagon for the *hypothetical* benefit of scalability only to suffer the very real downside of cold starts because they don't actually have users
@Sam-wl4vo
@Sam-wl4vo Год назад
you always hit the nerve of time, very useful information
@ronenen
@ronenen Год назад
can web assembly be used to solve the c++/rust incompatibility limitation?
@supa1009
@supa1009 8 месяцев назад
awesome video, grateful to have this knowledge for free!
@andresgutgon
@andresgutgon Год назад
I'm mostly a frontend guy that knows some Ruby but my knowledge on infra is too low so let's see if you can help me understand. I have an app that I want to be accessed in Europe and USA equally fast. How can I do that? I read things about Edge and Lambda but I don't fully understand how would translate that to a Rails API + PostgreSQL For what I understand Lambda has memory limitations so I guess putting a Rails / Ruby app there is not a good idea. And for what's Edge (like Cloudflare workers) is not even possible. The other question I have is if I managed to put Rails near the user (Europe or usa) how I could put also PostgreSQL near the user. I see these videos and sure if they apply at all to my problem (Rails API globally accesible)
@leos5246
@leos5246 Год назад
in a short - you can't ... because it's postgres and it's relational db by the nature RDBMS are not possible to scale out without breaking the consistency or availability, meaning that partition tolerance is there (CAP theorem). in a long way... you can create single master instance and do async writes to it ignoring the latency for users and use reads only from replicas nearby the user...
@BosonCollider
@BosonCollider Год назад
Stupid question: WHY are edge functions free of cold start delays? I though edge functions were just serverless functions running on the edge? I feel like a bunch of people came up with a new set of buzzwords without rigorously defining them.
@Evan-dh5oq
@Evan-dh5oq Год назад
The edge runtime is not the same as edge computing.
@js_madness
@js_madness Год назад
Whats the tool Theo is using for drawing all the stuff ?
@witchmorrow
@witchmorrow 7 месяцев назад
excalidraw
@derschutz4737
@derschutz4737 Год назад
U can use wasm as ur compile target to run rust/c++ on edge
@rzr1191
@rzr1191 Год назад
Yes, but you lose our on the hyper fast cold starts promised by edge runtime using web APIs you use the included runtime whereas using another language could mean you're shipping libs that end up resulting in larger payload with slower start time The tradeoff does make sense for heavier use cases like image processing
@derschutz4737
@derschutz4737 Год назад
@@rzr1191 Do you have data to back that up? rust WASM has incredibly low cold start times/binary sizes, on lambda rust can be almost an order of magnitude faster to start and 3x less size than an equivalent node function. Why would edge suddenly mean that WASM has worse performance? Also, my main benefit is the fact that I don't have to use typescript (absolute garbage language)
@Saurabhkumar-bn3dl
@Saurabhkumar-bn3dl Год назад
But what about ridiculous bandwidth cost of vercel? Is that manageable?
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
Most of the "bandwidth" will be cached after the first requests. Don't serve massive assets off an expensive CDN and you'll be fine.
@JoRyGu
@JoRyGu Год назад
This is the elephant in the room for all of these services he's using. They all have pretty generous free tiers but balloon in cost for any serious applications. Vercel's pricing is rough enough for my company to be exploring building out infrastructure on AWS just to get Next with all the features it offers without Vercel.
@Saurabhkumar-bn3dl
@Saurabhkumar-bn3dl Год назад
@@JoRyGu Tbh vercel does makes it easier to use cutting edge things like he is talking about a lot. But this is something which is holding me back too. The balloon in the cost is why I opted for self hosted supabase instead of Planetscale. I haven't used amplify yet, but do you know how much worse it is than vercel? Or does it support all the latest features of next 13?
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
@@JoRyGu you should watch my video about AWS cost if you sincerely believe this. The bandwidth costs are in line with any other CDN of similar quality. Be smart about where you put your big assets and you’ll be fine. Your Vercel services should return HTML and JSON, if you’re moving terabytes of either you’re probably making a mistake
@mmzzzmeemee
@mmzzzmeemee Год назад
Tbh, my biggest gripe with vercel rn is that their free tier does not allow commercial usage. Almost any other provider does (e.g. netlify, heroku formerly, cloudflare pages, etc.). It's such a shame cause vercel is still probably the most convenient but their free tier is just a deal breaker. Idk why they did that but to me it's simply a bad business decision.
@jannisbaalmann6870
@jannisbaalmann6870 10 месяцев назад
Theo the type of guy who is so convincing in every single video that he makes me doubt my stack forever 😂
@snk-js
@snk-js Год назад
I liked that video very instructive
@al-ekramelaheehridoy7297
@al-ekramelaheehridoy7297 Год назад
What app do you use for visualization these nice diagram?
@pedroalonsoms
@pedroalonsoms Год назад
This is serverless stuff is getting way too overengineered. At this point just throw the whole app into a ec2 box with ubuntu and call it a day. If you ever reach page-load performance issues, start by trying to optimize in other places first (maybe start by removing huge JS frameworks). In the worst case, if you ever need to get a super-optimized backend, just hire prime to rewrite the entire thing in rust. I mean at this point we’re rearchitecting the way the entire internet works from scratch: building new db drivers, new cache systems, new ways to split up databases across many servers, new rate-limiters, etc. Just kidding Theo. Love your vids.
@svenhofstede
@svenhofstede Год назад
100%
@RemotHuman
@RemotHuman Год назад
What about the traditional way of having a regional server always running (so no cold starts or prisma spinning up for first time right?)
@knm080xg12r6j991jhgt
@knm080xg12r6j991jhgt Год назад
I think his point is: then you have to maintain that infrastructure and hire people to do it. Developer/devops time is expensive.
@RemotHuman
@RemotHuman Год назад
@@knm080xg12r6j991jhgt you could still deploy to a managed platform, but I guess you are right since it wouldn't scale horizontally automatically like spinning up more serverless functions or serverless edge runtime functions would. (Is that the right reason? Its the only one I can see right now.) I wonder if you could do a hybrid though that still doesn't require devops like maybe instead of lambdas you make a server with no state and duplicate instances can be spun up and down automatically like lambdas, but less often and multiple functions could share a database connection. And you could use existing tooling for languages other than js. I don't have much experience with back end so maybe I'm missing something about how servers work.
@jajwjwiwo
@jajwjwiwo Год назад
Under the hood Vercel deploys to AWS Lambda. To deliver world class dynamic sites in production, Vercel has turned AWS Lambda into an edge-first compute layer
@tcurdt
@tcurdt Год назад
I hear operations people quietly sigh on this video. Leaving some things aside: The main problem is distribution of data services - and also the privacy aspects of that.
@asencme
@asencme Год назад
What do you use to get autocomplete on stuff like "export const runtime"?
@emab
@emab Год назад
That will be Copilot
@zuma206
@zuma206 Год назад
it's not copilot, nextjs app directory prompts you to install a little extension thing when you run npm run dev for the first time on an app directory project
@emab
@emab Год назад
@@zuma206 oh right my bad! I assumed this was the Copilot extension providing a suggestion.
@lem8r
@lem8r Год назад
There is other approach by having distributed database (Cloud Spanner, CockroachDB) wich allows to have an app close to user and DB at the same time. Wonder how it compares to subj.
@k-c
@k-c Год назад
I still like good old PostgreSQL
@ea_naseer
@ea_naseer Год назад
based
@abdirahmann
@abdirahmann Год назад
very based.
@Amaraticando
@Amaraticando Год назад
@@abdirahmann let's see Paul Allen's database.
@ryszardrzepa5609
@ryszardrzepa5609 Год назад
I can’t wait for the video showing kysely or drizzle orm setup with T3 stack ❤
@Ratstail91
@Ratstail91 Год назад
I have one server, in Sydney, Australia. It's good enough for now, and I've built my whole site's system to use it. Who knows what will happen when I officially release it. That price though... Edit: What the hell is vercel? am I so much of a dinosaur I can't understand it?
@zuma206
@zuma206 Год назад
i believe it started out mostly as a frontend hosting solution, then slowly started to support more backend solutions. now they offer simple ways to host fullstack jamstack apps like next, remix, sveltekit etc.
@TigreXspalterLP
@TigreXspalterLP Год назад
vercel is the sponsor of the channel ;)
@abdirahmann
@abdirahmann Год назад
am dead at your edit 🤣🤣🤣🤣, a dinosour!!, bruh!!💀
@MaybeJustJames
@MaybeJustJames Год назад
Why not use (something like) Hasura?
@Khari99
@Khari99 Год назад
Wow this was crazy informative. I didn’t think edge was much of a big deal and I didn’t understand how much it differed from serverless so I never bothered with it. But now that you broke it down, I’m definitely going to try it out! The amount of value I get out of your channel sometimes is absurd. Thanks Theo. Keep up the good work
@atridgedcosta4374
@atridgedcosta4374 Год назад
Use something like Turso and just move your db to the edge as well.
@nathabonfim59
@nathabonfim59 Год назад
Awesome video! Does anyone know the application he is using to take notes?
@mykal7734
@mykal7734 Год назад
I think it's excalidraw. I know Facebook uses that for interviews.
@nathabonfim59
@nathabonfim59 Год назад
@@mykal7734 Thanks!
@sir.richardpound
@sir.richardpound Год назад
I used to use Google Cloud Functions (Firebase) a few years ago and the cold starts where just down right unacceptable. I built an entire infrastructure on Cloudflare Workers and have never been more happier serving code and sharing libraries
@yoyobroker8107
@yoyobroker8107 Год назад
What's the difference between regional and global Edge?
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
The first half of this video.
@vinu_kaliyar_
@vinu_kaliyar_ Год назад
Which software you used to draw the flow?
@leos5246
@leos5246 Год назад
excalidraw ?
@GeorgeDicu-hs5yp
@GeorgeDicu-hs5yp Год назад
Theo can you speak about how u protect your gateways that is in front of your apis? Do u use jwts? So u have a specific GW that has sec embedded? So mostly about security arround ClientGWAPIs Thank you
@reneseses
@reneseses Год назад
Location it's important when the international bandwidth of your users it's not good. I'm from Chile and sometimes our clients complained about loading times which always resulted in their international bandwidth. We deployed a Gateway to cloudflare edge workers and the issue went away.
@TheNivk1994
@TheNivk1994 Год назад
What is the tool he is using to paint and write?
@jean-michelhiver4362
@jean-michelhiver4362 Год назад
@t3dotgg - what software do you use to draw stuff please
@abdoutanta
@abdoutanta Год назад
Excalidraw
@lilililliilil
@lilililliilil Год назад
edge functions in T3 app?
@BlackThreadDev
@BlackThreadDev 2 месяца назад
Great vid. What diagram software is that?
@cdoodev
@cdoodev Год назад
Why “don’t use something like hasura”? Have you done another video unpacking that at all?
@cdoodev
@cdoodev Год назад
@giuliopeverelli it’s in his graphql killer video. I’ve also been using hasura for a long time, and I don’t buy the argument. Hasura is the very thing that sits between the server and the database exposing gql to the client. You just don’t have to write the service yourself.
@gleicon
@gleicon Год назад
I'm kind of lost of the difference about lambda slow start and how edge functions get rid of it...
@zzej
@zzej Год назад
Im actually running a prisma api on cloudflare workers at sub 300ms response
@monara97
@monara97 Год назад
Whats that tool you're using to draw stuff?
@_sjoe
@_sjoe Год назад
excalidraw
@robsonjunior8224
@robsonjunior8224 Год назад
I had observed a very interesting company, it called Azion Technologies! They are building a lot of thing with Edge Computing, I have used a lot the Azion Edge Runtime to accelerate our apps
@hebestreitfan6973
@hebestreitfan6973 Год назад
At this point it feels like Theo keeps over-optimizing his app for content
@hebestreitfan6973
@hebestreitfan6973 Год назад
He will eventually discover the benefit of just running a few containers on a VPS
@SkywalkerWroc
@SkywalkerWroc Год назад
Simplicity and maintainability is far more important than shaving off 100ms from the page load time.
@nickscott9832
@nickscott9832 Год назад
Would it be a big win to have the auth built into the database, e.g. request data from a table (db checks permissions and returns data in a single request/response if they have permission and says no otherwise), rather than sending multiple requests to see if they have that permission before requesting the data.
@mountainash
@mountainash Год назад
Edge as a location IS IMPORTANT! Just like a CDN; the location edge out-does Regional edge when the data is cacheable (eg 10 latest blog posts; or newest rentals in your city). Edge locations is also important when you can use a distributed DB like the SQLite offering many edge providers now offer. This video seems already outdated. (Old school thinking)
@wgolyoko
@wgolyoko Год назад
What's your services you're talking about ?
@NateLevin
@NateLevin Год назад
16:30 This is my only issue with this video - if the user has slow internet, then global edge will be much, much faster, no? Assuming that the request times are equal assumes that the user has the same internet speed as the server. Anyways, you are absolutely right when you consider lots of serial requests.
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
Why would the speed of their internet affect the latency of a call? Bandwidth and latency are entirely different and unrelated lol
@pharmokan
@pharmokan Год назад
tfw you start out as bleeding edge JS YT channel but then evolved into a devops channel because thats where all your bottlenecks occur
@t3dotgg
@t3dotgg Год назад
…You got me
@cherubin7th
@cherubin7th 11 месяцев назад
Idk I deployed my own cloud on premise and I find putting stuff directly on Linux is less cumbersome and less complicated than all that serverless or edge or whatever stuff.
Далее
Vercel Gave Up On Edge
17:50
Просмотров 98 тыс.
Serverless Doesn't Make Sense
10:13
Просмотров 363 тыс.
I'm Coming Around To Go...
21:33
Просмотров 102 тыс.
How Britain Became a Poor Country
41:36
Просмотров 839 тыс.
why WASM on Servers?!?!?!
16:00
Просмотров 1,5 тыс.
Is "edge" computing really faster?
8:14
Просмотров 582 тыс.
Wisdom From Linus | Prime Reacts
12:18
Просмотров 416 тыс.
I Parsed 1 Billion Rows Of Text (It Sucked)
39:23
Просмотров 81 тыс.
Cool Tools I’ve Been Using Lately
23:11
Просмотров 194 тыс.
If this ships, it will change javascript forever
25:54
Просмотров 193 тыс.
98% Cloud Cost Saved By Writing Our Own Database
21:45
Просмотров 314 тыс.
When you have 32GB RAM in your PC
0:12
Просмотров 297 тыс.