Even Agents of Shield beats the entirely of the arrowverse by a huge fucking mile. And I only just saw he first three seasons and I gotta say, this is has got to be the best thing I’ve ever seen in all of superhero television. Such an underrated masterpiece.
Personally I just like the overall story in Flash Seasons 1-2 and some of the execution. Whenever there's an episode that hits it does HIT but the filler kind of overshadows it
Madvocate explaining why The Flash is bad: "Don't stop to talk. Don't stop to talk. Don't stop to talk. Don't stop to talk." "There's no where to run!" *villain runs away*
Isn't Superman & Lois developed by HBO Max but aired on the CW due to its connection with the Arrowverse? That's what I was told and honestly it makes a lot of sense considering the writing and CGI on that show compared to everything else.
Stargirl and Superman & Lois are some of the best comic book shows. The sad thing is that people tend to avoid them after getting to know that they are on the CW. Stargirl is literally written by the creators of the character and comic book writers who have written the JSA for years. You should give it a chance.
This comment low key called me out😭. I actually liked Stargirl but when season 2 came back I stopped watching the CW by then and I just felt like it wouldn’t be that good anymore but your comment convinced me I’ll go back and watch it and I’ll watch Superman and Lois too🙄
@@seanayenu7682 Stargirl is really good and I’m actually looking forward to the 3rd season not something I have done since they cancelled black lightning
Hello, Tex. I love the Arrowverse, even though, shows like - Batwoman, Supergirl and Naomi are largely disappointments. The rest of them, I love. Some of the shows get worse over time, but when you really take the time, to watch all the seasons of the respective shows, it gives you a full scope, of everything that they've done. The Flash season 1 and 2, along with Legends of Tomorrow season 1, Arrow Season 1 and 2, Superman and Lois and Stargirl, I think are top tier comic book shows. However, I understand if someone watched the bad part of those shows, but there is alot of good, with in that universe. So many episodes and seasons, the universe is still going as well, with no signs of stopping. Well, Terrance will be there for it all, as I've been there since Arrow Season 1 episode 1. TERRANCE OUT
Yeah dude, Arrow season 1 and 2 and Flash season 1, are definitely top tier superhero shows for me. And even though the show had overstayed it's welcome. I will be lying if I said I wasn't a bit emotional when Arrow ended. Oliver Queen started it all by trying to save his city, and he ended it all by literally saving the Multiverse. It was perfect.
@@kingkiller5325 I agree with you. Arrow is still my favourite CBM show. It has flaws and bad seasons but it doesn't wipe away the good storytelling of the few seasons that I would love to watch anytime.
@Clifford Terrell I say this with all respect, I don't care what you think, human. Most of the individuals who watched the Arrowverse stuff, are not even real fans of DC, while not willing to be objective. Miss me with your silliness. TERRANCE OUT
Superman and Lois is legit a great show and is probably the best and most mature thing they've ever made. Beats the other arrowverse shows easily and I'm surprised that not a lot of people really talking about it. Wacks like CW arrowverse shows have dedicated fanbases who go crazy over the dumbest things they show. They just accept whatever is shown to them but unfortunately, comparatively, Superman and Lois isn't getting the same amount of love from fans.
Probably the first season hiatus the cw did to Superman and Lois turned people off to the show cause they probably stared watching it like I did then Supergirl was ready to premiere and the cw Superman and Lois on hiatus to air supergirl and some of those people probably didn’t return to the show cause they probably forgot about it
Sorry but I have to disagree. I know they're mostly garbage now, but for what they were back in the early Arrow and Flash days they were fun to watch at the very least. Black Lightning was solid and Legends of Tomorrow knows it's stupid at this point and that's what makes it fun and I still watch it to this day. And of course Stargirl and S&L are good.
Nah you probaly haven’t seen a actual good tv show or don’t know how to critique tv shows quality, madovcate exposed the flash early seasons to show how inconsistent the wiring around Barry was, I like the early seasons and I can admit they were fun to watch but it was never good, so many inconsistencies has always been a cw problem
You should watch Gotham, the cgi holds up, and the story and character development is much more noticeably better than the cw shows. Not to mention gave us a badass Alfred and a perfect Joker
gotham was perfectly fine until season 4, i just found the league of shadows stuff to be uninteresting and a lot of the side characters were just becoming goofy beyond the point of likability
Arrow season 1 and 2 would've definitely benefitted from being tv ma to fully delve into the darker moments it was trying to portray. They are a lot like Daredevil in that aspect aside from the filler episodes. They have dark and very nuanced villains much like Kingpin in season 1, and a hero that is willing to go far to stop the villain. I would've like to see Green Arrow do more with his bow rather than everything being neck snaps
The main problem with the Arrowverse is that the episodes are too long. Arrow only needs 30 minutes and maybe a To Be Continued to catch the criminal(s). Flash and Supergirl don't need 45 minutes, which might be 3 to 4 days to catch the criminal(s). Two fifteen minute shorts per week and a To be Continued would greatly improve the CGI and actors performance.
Eh, I’m not sure if making them shorts are a better option. I know people say Flash and Supergirl should be winning easily in the first season, but the thing is fans make it sound more simple than it is. Sure there are some scenarios where they could be right, but I think dragging the villains of the week out for works for the most part. However, I do agree that it’s a big problem with the later seasons, especially with Cicada in Flash season 5. Man, how he keeps getting away baffles me!
The problem is length of episodes it’s the amount of episodes. No show these days with a over arcing story shouldn’t be any more than 15 episodes a season
@@adrianjames5970 I didn’t even mention supergirl😂😂but I’m not a big fan of that show either. I like Lena and Kara and Melissa is great as Kara IMO but everything else about the show sucks
@@jaxxpool9630 I watched CW Flash up to the Savitar arc. It makes no sense for the world's fastest man, who defeated other speedsters, who traveled through time, to have a hard time stopping and arresting non-speedster metas and normal guys with a gun.
One big problem is that even with low cg budget, they could do so much with what they have. Each episode is 45 mins. Most seasons are around 20 episodes. That’s an insane amount of time to adapt a ton of stories. They could adapt like 3 stories in one season, and blend it so that they don’t need to bring a new villain every week. I could only wish the shows (mostly talking about animated shows) could have this much screen time.
I used to love these shows until it got too overwhelming to keep up, since they decided to add like 20,000 separate heroes to 50 different shows. I just didn’t have the time, and since the quality of writing dropped significantly, I just didn’t bother.
The biggest problem (as with a lot of shows) is the number of episodes. Cut the number down to 13 or so and a lot of the issues with these shows will be fixed. The Story will get better, the CGI will improve (since there is a lot less VFX shots), and viewership will increase because of this. Look at any show *stares at Breaking Bad* that uses around 13 episodes and you will notice this.
Once the Arrowverse actually started to have competition, they were immedietely blown outta the water. Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. and Daredevil singlehandedly put the entire Arrowverse to shame. Not to mention the later DC shows like Doom Patrol.
My main problem with the flash (this is the cw show I watched the most) is that he didn’t use his powers correctly for example when fighting someone he’d run and stop even though even if wasn’t running his reaction would still be insane and would never get punched but he still somehow loses and if the show went by their own logic then most of the villains Barry fights wouldn’t even be a fight and Barry would win with no difficulty (Tho not against Thrawn)
Season 1 flash villains of the week did contribute to the storyline a lot lol like when Thawne helped him phase or when he beat that one dude with sonic Gauntlet’s or Snart and his partner
Dude, if we had a Flash show on HBO Max, that'd be amazing. Superman and Lois is already pretty great, if it had a better budget, it'd be up there with Doom Patrol and Swamp Thing imo.
@@Spiderstan2000 I love Smallville too. Growing up with it it’ll always have a special place in my heart. Plus it was pretty amazing for it’s time when it started.
To think with what budget Smallville worked it was pretty fine. Lana Lang was annoying as fuck but when u concentrate on the other characters it’s a great show and especially season 4 to 7 and season 9-10
For Arrow I was a fan until S5, then I stopped watching because real life caught up with me. Same with The Flash, except in that case it was s4. Legends of Tomorrow I stopped watching halfway through S3 because it was getting just too crazy. Never got into the others.
dunno if this is a valid reason for never bothering with Legends of Tomorrow, but one day I remember catching one episode on tv. they had time travelled to the 80s, and one of the male characters (I don't remember any of the names, sorry) suggested to one of the female members of the group that she should perhaps wear an 80s style blazer, of the ones with padded shoulders. she then went on a rant about how those types of clothes only existed so that women could look "masculine". I changed the channel and never looked back.
@@sunsetman22 that "rant" was one line of of dialogue followed by Nate going "it's good to have optimism" and then they totally moved on. You're exaggerating what was just a normal conversation, it wasn't at all what you're saying it was. Also the female character was from 1942 so the 80s was the future for her, and she was bummed to see how things have progressed. Not some random pointless rant about the past, a one-off comment that anyone in her shoes would make when learning disappointing news about the future
Smallville is the DC series that Truly paved the way for the Arrowverse. It's why there have been specific moments in crossovers like elseworlds such as using the Kent farm set and playing the "Save Me" theme song as ways to honor the show. It was the Godfather of the modern DC shows especially ones on the CW. It wasn't perfect but still an incredible show. One that I grew up with and made me love the character of Superman and the DC world as a whole.
Would love to see you review Stargirl. It is really different than the other CW shows, though that makes sense since it originally wasn't. As for me, I was all in on the Arrowverse, at least in the beginning. Alays still liked Arrow decently enough, even though it did some big stupid stuff, and Flash was decent outside of its main vallains, most seasons. What killed it for me, besides them ending Arrow was all the political and social commentary. Not saying I'd ever agree with most of the political views of the writers, but they just did it so badly. Like it'd just take you out of watever stroy was going on at the time. I've heard talks of some continuation projects and if those do come about, I'll likely watch them, but besides that, the universe is dead to me.
The main problem with the Arrowverse to me is BAD WRITING. I do agree that the shows are long and they have 22 to 23 episode seasons but the horrible writing and dialogue is on a new level of cringe I've never seen before. Best Example of a show with good writing and dialogue but 22 episode seasons is Supernatural seasons 1-5 when the CW was known as WB. Yeah they had filler episodes but they were so damn good and engaging.
@@jasontodd1226 Supernatural? Yes you should. It's really good. S1-5 is what i consider to be "Eric Kripke's" Supernatural. S6 is when the show starts to fall off all the way through S15 with a few gems here and there but it mostly suffers from those CW tropes alot of people started to hate.
I used to love the Arrowverse but now I'm getting tired of it and it honestly getting worse overtime that all I want is to end it all because let's face it Crisis should have ended and it was a terrible Crossover that it was the last straw,CW deserves what's about to happen.
I think it’s tiring coz there are too many shows. If they would’ve concentrated on Arrow/Flash/Legends and MAYBE Supergirl it would’ve worked out much better. But to add 2-3 more shows? Bruh who has the time to watch like 6 shows? 🤣
i’m still an arrowverse fan, though i’ve dropped some shows and am either not watching them or slowly getting through em. like supergirl. i watched the first few episodes of season 6, and then dropped it for awhile as it’s a literal trainwreck. i watched naomi’s first episode and thought it was super boring so i dropped that. batwoman is a slog to get through, usually just watch it when i want to turn off my brain. legends is ok, but they’re going the doom patrol route and making everything meta and a little too jokey. flash the past 4 seasons was AWFUL, but season 8 so far has been fantastic, a big return to form i think. superman and lois is definitely my favorite show of them all, feels much more like a superhero show, since there’s no huge team where everyone has powers, i.e. no “Team Superman”. i was caught up on everything pre-crisis, but ever since COIE, it’s like the quality on most of the arrowverse shows took a nosedive. like they had this whole event “destroying” the multiverse to put supergirl and black lightning on earth-prime, but then they went and canceled both of their shows, so what was the point of it? feels like there’s little to no stakes now in the current arrowverse lol
I was a bigger fan of the majority of the earlier seasons, and I can agree that the newer seasons of a lot of the older shows have gotten pretty bad. However, I honestly feel like I've invested too much time into this universe that if I just stop now before it ends then all of that time will have been a waste. And I mean, I probably would never have actually watched Superman and Lois or Stargirl if I never kept up with the shows which would be a big shame because both are great. Stargirl is a little cheesy due to it literally being a bunch of high school students either fighting other high school students or just fighting adults, but it's still great. So I'm more or less just going to see it through to the end (unless I die before it ends, in which case, nice knowing you, Tex).
At the time Arrow Season 1 and 2 and Flash season 1 and 2 were great. But then shows like Daredevil came out and set the bar higher then any series out there. It was the breaking bad of superhero television and after it came out small cracks became ravines of problems. It’s too long Story is mediocre Bad CGI or fight scenes So much filler Horrible horrible show runners(I mean the new show runner literally threatened to make more seasons of the flash after the backlash of season 7…yikes) As for recently HBO has done a great job at reinventing the arrow verse. S&L and Stargirl while aren’t Daredevil level are great in their own right. They fix all the problems mentioned above and I genuinely get excited when they come on every week. So hopefully HBO buys the CW and they can build a new and better universe in the coming years. But only time will tell. Great video! :)
The thing is people started watching these shows when they were teenagers and didn’t realize how bad they were until they grew up, but still had the fond memories of watching the earlier seasons.
Tried watching the entire Arrowverse a couple years ago, and it took me an entire year to get to the point in the chronological order of the first season of Black Lightning. The filler was the main issue for me and I could never pick up the show after skipping a lot of the Arrowverse for Crisis on Infinite Earths, which even then was mediocre and disappointing.
I agree with some of your points, and I really appreciate that you werent one of those idiots who tried to claim these shows were *objectively* bad, because objective quality is a myth. I’ll also readily admit that there’s been some truly awful stuff in these shows. Most of them are riddled with flaws. And yet, I find myself enjoying them more than I currently am the marvel cinematic universe. I love these shows, in part *because* of their flaws, because it makes them feel less like a machine put them out the way big-budget films with similar characters do these days. These shows aren’t created by committee and pushed out for global appeal, and I love that about them. And yeah, some of them are a joy to watch for me-Batwoman and Superman & Lois are currently some of my favorite shows airing. A story doesn’t have to be perfect for us to love it, and someone else not understanding why I might love Batwoman doesn’t mean I’m wrong to love that show anymore than me hating Ryan Reynolds’ Deadpool films means there isn’t a legion of fans begging for more. We don’t have to love the things someone else loves, but we should respect that they love it and not try to prove them “wrong” somehow.
CW DC shows for me are very dragging. The story mostly started really good but then sinking slowly like Titanic. Like you said, too much fillers. Should've been made like 10 or 12 episodes per season instead of 22 or 23. Making it more compact & more focused, thus the story could've been more engaging.
I'd say I had the same mindset as your friend. I was hyped when I discovered Arrow because the character only ever had appearances in DC animated movies/shows and while I love them I longed to see the Green Arrow appear in a live action feature. When it did, I was in. I fell off the show, not because of time, but like you mentioned, realized it was more of a melodrama soap opera rather than an actual story about the hero itself. Same goes for Flash, before the show, his live action appearances were scarce and not so well done in my opinion. Slightly before they announced the show, I was in some sort of "Flash craze" where I was interested in the hero and its power and was reading a lot on him. I was in because of that. What made me leave the show (I think it was season 4 with the brain dude) was the number of episodes, the anecdotal "freak of the week" villains and very cheap budget, I mean Savitar (season 3) had like just a few running animations that were constantly being reused and his normal appearance was, and I'm not joking, some sort of plastic-cardboard costume
I never really understood people comparing streaming shows to tv shows. Compare daredevil to the hbo max shows like doom patrol or titans And compare arrowverse to agents of shield, runaways, inhumans etc🤦♂️🤦♂️
completely agree with your friend, i liked the early seasons of arrow and the flash because there weren't many other forms of media for those characters at the time. i personally really like season 1 of arrow, although i do skip some of the fillers
Arrow Season 1 and 2, Flash Season 1 were my favorites. Everything after started to really suck. Bloated teams, overly important love interests, bad writing.
Even though Superman & Lois is TECHNICALLY an Arrowverse show, HBO MAX produces it, they just air live on the CW. That’s why the production of the show is so much better in the first season. I haven’t checked out season 2 yet, because I’m waiting on it to be put on HBO MAX
I watched the Flask until season 5. I checked in during the first half of season 6, pretty good, and I watch the crossovers but apart from that it dropped completely and I never watched the other shows.
I love the cw arrowverse shows and I still watch them because there are good parts about It. I think something that would get rid of most of the problems would be the amount of episodes, there’s a reason why shows like daredevil are so much better. They have less episodes, if the flash had less episodes they wouldn’t need a lot of filler which would solve a huge problem and since the budget will stay the same it will make the cgi better since there’s less episodes and on top of all that the writers won’t be very stressed because they won’t have to write as much as before, so this would mean the quality of writing would increase. In the flash season 8 there was a lot of good parts so I think with less episodes that would solve alot of problems (potentially)
It's one of those things like Titans were it has potential and is good at times, but keeps disappointing me to the point where I give up on it entirely
I think season 1 and 2 of Arrow was really good, was good for Season 3 with Ra's al Ghoul, then meh for season 4 and 6, got good again in season 5 with Prometheus and season 7 was alright with Ricardo Diaz. Season 8 was ok, but it was basically just filler lead up to the meh Crisis event. The Flash, Bad CGI aside except for Grodd and King Shark, Season 1 and 2 I thought were really good and had surprises, but unlike Arrow, Flash never got back to being good, each season had moments but ultimately were worse than the last. I usually like to say that Arrow and Flash Season 1 and 2 threw out the cliche super hero book, Main characters died and good guys lose badly, but (mainly for The Flash) they brought the cliche book back and lost their creativity.
It is the Berlanti method. Step 1. Establish a main character like Arrow, Flash, Supergirl or Nightwing. Step 2. Establish a group of supporting characters like Team Arrow, Team Flash, the Superfriends or the Titans. Step 3. Pad the series with episodes that focus on side characters. Step 4. Profit.
You hit the nail on the head with this one. I began to notice how terrible the writing, storylines, villains, and filler episodes there were until I was well into season 5 of Arrow and like season 4 of Flash. I was turned off at the melodramatic scenes and it’s characters. Then it’s this narrative that everybody shared: “I lied to protect you” mess.. it got tiring at that point. However I thought the crossovers were cool until they tried to do Crisis on Infinite Earths WITHOUT Batman, Wonder Woman and the main Justice League characters. It was cringy to watch ESPECIALLY when some of the storylines didn’t add up to the comic books. And I think that’s what most of us wanted to see at least. Sn: we were robbed of an Oliver and Laurel relationship. They got Barry and Iris right but dang…. I’m just saying lol
I probably used to be one of the biggest arrowverse fanboys mostly because of flash season 1-2 and arrow season 1,2 and 5. But now they’re all bad. I used to watch every show but now I don’t watch legends, couldn’t stand bat woman, stoped black lightning after season 1, supergirl was always bad and I’m glad arrow finally ended. I only watch the flash cause it’s one of those shows that I need to finish. Season 1 and 2 of it are my favorite tv seasons ever. But I can see why people wouldn’t like the shows at all and I won’t try and argue that you’re wrong cause everyone had their own opinion. At one point they were good and about superheroes developing themselves over a season so that they can eventually beat the big bad. Just gonna say the flash season one had those filler episodes so that Barry could learn how to use his powers to his full extent and defeat reverse flash eventually because he learned from those experiences . But now all the shows are drowned out by this character needing a love interest and it’s about feelings and it’s just bad. That’s my take on it
I watched Arrow Season 1 and 2. Never watched a full of episode of the Flash. I did watch Season 3 of Legends of Tomorrow. I think that covers everything
I don’t care what anyone says, I love the Arrowverse. I love the whole idea of many series being in the same universe. Arrow and The Flash are awesome, Legends of Tomorrow is surely underrated. I bet there are millions that agree with me 🫡
Even as someone who liked the arrowverse I agree. I think what made the arrow verse so special for me at the time was it was one of the first networks really attempting to have a shared universe on the big screen. But then Daredevil happened and it blew everything out the water lol. As a former fan I really do like a lot of the ideas the arrowverse have but even after all these years it really seems like the cw doesn't understand that just having 13 episodes on these shows and not streching out the runtime would do them so much good.
I liked Arrow at the beginning, but Flash… Can’t sit thought a single episode. I think the stigma of the later season reinforce my laziness on watching the show, my friend loves the CW shows too and always tells me to give it a shot. Back when Arrow was just starting it all made sense and the story was able to match the budget. But now I think the story and concepts have become way way too bloated and don’t fit the budget they have.
First 2 seasons of arrow are awesome I think if I rewatched early episodes of the flash id probs hate it nowadays and seasons 2-4 of legends are always fun
There's a lot wrong with the Arrowverse, and the CW as a whole. 1. Terrible writing. They care more about shipping and filler. 2. Lack of direction. A complete failure to properly plan out the seasons from beginning to end. 3. Too many episodes. The whole 22 episode format got tired around Smallville season 4. 4. The biggest problem with the Arrowverse and the CW as a whole is not able to keep their politics out of their work. Thats been the problem since day one.
I agree that the seasons are way too long but I do love the first two seasons of the flash and I love Arrow with the exception of season 4 and 6, legends of tomorrow was good for the first three seasons and I don't care about supergirl, but it's nice to see another opinion even if it's pretty close to yours.
I’m one of them people who are obsessed with Arrowverse. I have seen all shows up until Superman and Lois. Currently rewatching it all up until Superman and Lois. On Arrow S1
I agree. Just watching daredevil really goes to show how underdeveloped the CW shows were writing acting wise. Daredevil is like the gold standard and it wouldn't hurt to take notes from those guys
The only show I like out of the Arrowverse is Arrow. It was a fun ride for me. Thats all. Its just my opinion. I'm not here to hate on anyone's and I hope no one hates on mine.
These shows (even Smallville) have always ran much closer to One Tree Hill than their blockbuster superhero counterparts or even other superhero shows (Daredevil, Doom Patrol ect.) to which I actually appreciate as it feels much different than the aforementioned superhero media out there. This is not a comment about the shows quality but more of it's categorization.
On the topic of The Flash being like a soap opera, it felt like every couple of episodes at least in the first two seasons, Barry would say to Joe West that he isn't his father, or Team Flash have some fight for no reason.