@@Tethloach1 He has elevated psuedo intellectualism to an art form. There is only two differences between men and women, cultural and biological. Figure that out on your own Jordan? In what possible way could they differ?
Indeed. He goes against the message and the consensus of the powerful (climate, trans, racism, patriarchy, and all the other mechanisms that have been and are being pursued to facilitate global marxism) in using violence, censorship, oppression, ostracization, and theft to rule the world as oligarch kings for all time. Meanwhile, he used a mean word....I clutch my pearls.
12:56 - I disagree with this statement. Peterson has, absolutely, distinguished multiple times between "activists"' and any random trans person, not least be interviewing, sharing panels, and being interviewed by trans people in which he treats them and distinguishes them from the "activists".
Glad to see someone else call this mischaracterization out. His opposition to the medicalization of trans identifying ppl and vulnerable children, shows him to be MORE caring and concerned about them than the activists supposed "advocacy" for social, medical and surgical "affirmation" regardless of who it hurts. Including trans identifying people themselves, several of whom appreciate JBPs pushback on this topic.
Same with rad islam x feminist union. He never definitely claimed that was the case, more like he can’t put his finger on what’s causing it and one of the explanations (that he admitted sounds like a bizarre stretch) was the one mentioned. Dawkins reposting the vid with cartoon on this same theme shows he’s not the only intellectual thinking about this matter.
The progression and maturation of Jordan Peterson’s positions and pronouncements in later years is completely in accordance with logic when seen in the context of the anti-rational adoption of the destructive policies of left leaning institutions in Western societies. The consistency of his stance stands in contrast to the illogical descent of formerly aware mainstream thinkers into a political and cultural cul de sac.
@@josephbelecky7838 No it's not, it shows a desperate man that is losing to changes that society at large has merited as good. Like accepting gay people, or POC or different ethnicities, trans people should be accepted as another facet of humanity.
This guy is a "don't dare show my face" anon LOZ guy with 40k subs whinging that Marvel isn't as good as it used to be. And that's his "platform" to attack the guy making 100s of 2-hour podcasts, full lecture series, and writing his 3rd bestseller which he is currently pre-promoting on a worldwide tour.
He began as a professor giving lectures in class at a university in Toronto. He was thrust into the role of global celebrity/saint/demon in a matter of a few years. I would not say he's declined. He's had to change due to the change in his life. Anyone would have to adapt, evolve, and grow with the pressures and scrutiny of the world from all angles. I mean, this very video is a testament of the attention he has received and how he has had to change his life. I think "decline" is a very loaded and biased way to frame his adaption. He's had a lot of challenges and has persevered quite admirably amidst it all.
This is the problem with the public eye. He's human. He's faulted. Rarely does someone operate on his level of intelligence and not flirt with insanity. It goes hand in hand. It was a good run and if you return to his previous work, he has given scholars and society enough ideas/thoughts to discuss and ponder for years to come. Everyone needs to retire at some point, including Axel Rose. We just cant maintain that level of peak performance for all of our lives.
It takes even more energy to attack the flaws in your own tribe, but he minimizes doing so as it will lighten his wallet. The fact that he is now with ‘the daily wire’ says it all.
How can they say he declined lol. He’s literally spearheading an organization to promote a positive vision of humanity globally as a counterbalance to woke authoritarian globalists in charge
Is this parody? Do you really believe in a thing that is both corporate and far left? To be far left, fundamentally, is about critiquing capitalism and its hierarchies. The "corporate far left" is like "hot ice cream" or "wet fire".
Yeap But he pass too much time on X (Twitter) complaining against politicians for their individual behaviour. The world is not the same after he became sick and Covid and Ukraine. The political correctness of early and mid 2010's: disappear like a fog by the sun light.
But why did he go through that!!!! Here is the man who is preaching at everyone else and he ends up in a detox centre. He needs to sit down and be quiet. There is nothing wrong with needing detox but when you spend your whole life preaching at everyone else when you have this problem, then you are a complete FRAUD!!!!!
Whilst he has lost his way a little bit since his illness, that shouldn't besmirch his original messaging, which was very positive for young men. I hope he will return to his more balanced approach, as that's why he became so popular in the first place.
They are already wised up, dude. Here in his hometown of Toronto we've always known that he was a con-artist, a fraud, and a phony. He is utterly despised by everyone in the university where he taught --- a university that has produced some of the world's greatest scholars. I never for even a second thought that he was worthy of that noble institution. I listened to his incoherent, infantile pop-psychology and knew it for the rubbish that it is long before he was adopted by suckers like you. He has found a way to get rich by telling idiots what they want to hear.
I have to agree that I don't think Jordan Peterson is the same as he used to be. What has caused the decline I don't know. Dealing with his wife's cancer? Dealing with constant attacks from all directions? His own health and issues with drugs (probably caused by the pressure)? I can't imagine what it would be like to have to deal with all he has had to but it must have changed him. I is can only hope he is able to work out what is affecting him and get back to what he once was.
Well to be fair most of those things were his fault for opening his stupid mouth. Not the cancer of course, though one could argue that he himself is cancer.
Benzodiazepines are one of the evilest drugs in the world. I know. I was on them for 14 years. I sympathize with him on that, but I don't agree with him about religion, and I don't agree with him on men needing to have children for true meaning in their lives. But I do agree with him partly on the gender pronoun issue. I had to deal with that crap in drug rehab, where I was forced to tell others my gender, when it is obvious what gender I am. This gender crap is getting silly.
I do see the decline. But he really went through the ringer. And he was heroically brave about it but you can't keep that up forever. Especially when you get kicked in the head by benzodiazepines. My pip squeak experience with those drugs are nothing compared to his but they were plenty awful. He is probably not all the way through it physiologically speaking. And then how people loved to kick him when he was down. Well I am thankful to all that he gave and all those old lectures are still up there on RU-vid to experience. I hope he levels out and maybe comes closer to being who he was but even if he doesn't, he did give a lot already.
In a day an age where we consume content like crack heads it was inevitable he would become "played out". 3rd act....shit that guy could have retired a long time ago. We should be grateful we even got this much from the guy.
You seem to positively assign the label of contrarian then complain that he critiques, climate alarmism, covid vaccine mandates,trans ideology/children and Liberal tyranny. While I agree he's lost a few steps and isn't what he was, you seem to be more annoyed he's against ideas you support
I'm further to the right than Jordan Peterson and seeing him get into conservative politics annoys me. We really did not a Peterson-tier intellect to make any of the basic-bitch arguments on the issues you mention here. It's a blatant waste of his time, and he could be cutting deeper into the leftist rot by doing something more similar to his old work. To explore conservative ideas at an intellectual level rather than simply reacting to braindead leftists when they say or do deranged stuff, and to not be on Ben Shapiro's payroll.
The first 15 mins you summarise his effectiveness and appeal. The last 5 mins you just mention opinions from others and yours about him, which you are welcome to do. However, he is still saying all the same things he always has for decades. Anything he says is backed up by research and evidence. You mention his tweets, a tiny proportion of what he says, so what? His tours and lectures are still very successful. His alliance with DW gives him more reach not less. His emotion has been evident for decades in what he cares about: people and their plight. He is still a light of common sense in a world of relativism and complete idiocy. Decline? No. Evolution? Maybe. You may not like him but he is still a thorn in the side of people who define themselves by group identity and those who push today’s modern lies and long may that continue.
Thanks for saying this. I agree wholeheartedly. I found the last 5 minutes somewhat disingenuous. He has been through a lot physically and mentally and for much of this time the focus of abuse and constant attack from a deranged ideology (sorry not sorry).
15:20 it was a good idea for intellectuals to collaborate and come together to discuss these issues in a civil matter. But I watched the debate many times and Michael’s personal attacks against Jordan Peterson were the exact reason I’m for JBP. It seems that a lot of these debates are personal attacks against Jordan Peterson’s group identity (straight, white, male) For those individuals who are lumped together in this group identity, it is hard for to us to argue and debate ideas when any push back from the opposing side is as hominem attacks
Indeed. It was one of millions of examples of just why these debates may be ultimately pointless, except to help the few of us left to know we are outnumbered by the racist horde of SJW Marxists.
I was following daily Jordan's stuff. I stopped around 2018 and came back to his stuff not long ago... 2023 - He is just complaining on X twitter against regular day politicians... God knows why! Back in 2014... They were a heavy lot of political correctness. You could be fired for personal opinion in some sphere of work activities... But in 2023-2024 (january), the world is not the same (compare with 2014), Covid, Russia, Inflation, Gaza. No one care of the political correctness, neither your feeling, but we are still respectful so we move on.
Don't think for a millisecond that this video's attempt to tear this man down worked on me. JP is man whom the world needs. He says the unpopular things, he swims upstream and tells the truth of his own mind. He's human as the rest of us. He's salty and that's what people need. We have too much sugar in this world. Jordan my friend, blessings if you read this.
He's not tearing JP down though. He's merely pointing out that the man isn't as popular or relevant as he used to be, which is undeniably true. He's not saying JP is a bad guy, or that his message isn't valid, it just means "fewer people are interested in him compared to the past, and he's in the media a lot less". These are factual statements that carry no moral judgement. If anything, the guy laments JP's waning popularity and relevance. The video description literally says his potential is being squandered. If that's not an endorsement of the man, I don't know what is.
The author of this video made it blatantly clear at the end for his disdain for Jordan Peterson. Woke-ism is, in my opinion is now in decline and not JP. Jordan Peterson is as popular as ever. But not with the leftist ideologues, not that they matter to me in the slightest. Their hedonistic lifestyle will be their own destruction.
"...man whom the world needs." Are you serious? This type of hyperbolic sycophancy is nauseating and unbecoming any self-respecting adult. What a silly comment. 🙃
Jordan Peterson has been behaving in a borderline psychotic manner recentlty. He gets so much angrier over petty bullshit whereas in the past he remained calm. I think it might be to do with the retarded ass carnivore diet he is on lmao.
I think his mental and physical health has had the most impact. Peterson could easily become relevant again but has had to step back for health and family reasons, it took a huge toll on him and his family putting themselves out like that.
@@SeanWinters I get what you are saying, but a reason can be understandable, not "good", if we think the outcome is not positive (in that case, Peterson's anger). Explanation doesn't mean excuse.
He tends to come at things from a different angle, but he is armed with a lot of knowledge and facts, which he articulates in his own unique style. He has the ability to be both straightforward, and profound, simultaneously. He is right about a lot, but not everything.
@@scronx My point is that Jordan Peterson never says anything of significance. He dresses up simple drivel in pseudo-academia lingo that makes conservatives feel good about clinging to their regressive ideas.
Hmmm... I don't see the problem calling out COVID measures. Nor do I disagree that the twitter files are comparible with Watergate. (Have you read them?). It seemed like a really well crafted video until the last few minutes where you seemed to swap deliveringfactual information with idea that you just don't like what he says on twitter. Maybe it needed to be longer?
because calling out COVID measures comes across as thin skinned and selfish. Like the only reason people don't like COVID measures is because they don't like having their normall life hindered, but calling them out is ignoring why they were being done in the fist place: to halt the spread of a deadly disease that killed a lot of a people. A major reason behind Covid spreading was people ignoring the measures and trying to assert their 'personal freedom' in spite of the fact that doing so means the deadly, deadly disease spread further and killed more people. its also a lack of knowledge of history, ignoring how those simialr measures were used in the past to stop similar epidemics to success, and any issues in them was due to...people ignoring the measures or misunderstanding how the epidemic was happening. Yes the lockdowns and wearing a mask all the time was annoying, but better to be annoyed than dead.
Since his daughter has become involved in his business and speaking engagements there has been a noticeable decline: quantity over quality, poor selection of guests/interviewees, lack of focus and polish, looking for $$ and basically spreading himself too thinly instead of focusing on his strengths. He's running himself ragged and I really think he needs to take a break from public life.
He still puts up interesting stuff, but it's not the same. Hardened. Captured. I can't see him as the same free thinker he once was, and that breaks my heart.
This video seems extremely anti JP biased... DailyWire has literally better view numbers than almost all mainstream media now, no? Not sure how that makes him less mainstream lol. Obviously, JP got some issues on some fronts. Definitely getting a bit bitter, but to say he's in decline is a bit silly when the fastest growing media network is paying him probably millions *rolleyes*
@@meaningoftheunicorn any of us remember the twitter weirdoes that championed him getting sick with covid and the hypocrisy of them laughing at him getting over emotional despite the fact a few of them could be just as emotional as him?
I think the issue with Daily Wire is preaching to the converted. Jordan did more than anyone can be expected to do and I think sought the comfort offered to him, so I don't judge him for it but can't agree with him about some of those tweets.
@@guyskillen he has brought many more traditionally left or liberal leaning ppl over to listen to the conservative media sites perspective, than he has turned away.
I have noticed the same thing in the past year and I'm glad to see I'm not the only one. I can admit that I was a huge fan(boy) of Peterson for years, in fact back in 2017 when I discovered him his lectures pulled me out of suicidal thoughts after a big breakup. But recently you can notice the change in his behaviour and approach. It's not about *what* he's saying (although he talks about more diverse topics with more confidence like climate change and similar), but *how* he says it. As he says himself - be careful with your speech. It's one thing to say "I think we should be careful about those new policies which are intended to help with X, because there are potential huge drawbacks" and it's another when you say "Climate change fascists are trying to destroy...". Siding with a specific political wing, when he was the one who taught me that every view is worth listening to and there's always something good to learn from every side, is particularly disappointing to watch. I don't think that him crying more often during interviews is something to criticize him for. It might be sign of emotional dysregulation, but maybe it's him embracing his emotional side more and more, and being comfortable with the world to see it. He is, after all, talking about some serious and heartwrenching topics when speaking in public.
Great observations. Much more in alignment with ppl who have described themselves as politically homeless. He has gained many more traditionally left leaning peoples attention who previously had dismissed him based on nothing but smear campaigns from their own side. The realization that one mustn't agree with everyting someone says, does not mean their character should be slandered or their speech shut down.
He opened himself to scrutiny by his initial objection to the controversy about hate speech toward transexuals. In his previous profession it would have been more positive to explore the subject rather than object to semantics; 99% of transexual men are macho heterosexual caricatures who feel the need to conform to them & find it intolerable; when most men say they feel like a woman it is that they are uncomfortable with their facade as a man & want access to traits attributed to women. It is easy to avoid new pronouns & the bill was about hate speech toward them rather than enforced speech. His emotional outbursts are relevant as a psychologist who has failed to address his own depression while boasting about how he has saved others from extreme depression. To be content requires self awareness of the thought process rather than an endless need to accrue more fame or wealth. He knows he is a fraud.
I noticed all of this happened when he joined the daily wire. He got way more aggressive in his mannerisms and speech a lite after he signed up with them. I get they give him protection from the woke lunatics, but he sold out his integrity for it
To call Peterson contrarian is absurd. I mix with loads of people of all ages, it is very rare to find someone who doesn’t find the current obsession with trans issues and rainbow flags completely bizarre. Most people are happy to treat others with respect, and that includes respect for gay people, but what we see today is an enforced silencing of any opinion that goes against the so called woke agenda. Peterson is one of the few people who has the freedom to stand up and speak out. Most people are too scared of having their careers destroyed. And I suspect he is angry as a result of the appalling treatment of him by fellow academics. Your video clips illustrates well how thoughtful he is. One might not agree with everything he says, or even most of it, but he is thought provoking and has so many insights, and interesting ways to look at the modern world. I grew up in a poorish family surrounded by left wing nonsense, that encourages victimhood. How I wish he had been around back then, teaching the virtue of self improvement and taking responsibility for oneself. He is a marvellous man.
The only people obsessed with trans issues and rainbow flags are the Christians Who Vote Republican. They can't mind their own business. They are the only ones trying to silence people, deny rights, ban books... and on and on and on. They are fully open about their hatred and malice toward other American citizens.
The obsession, as you call it, is a response to legislation that is being pushed through by a group of people who would see America become a theocracy. There are people out there who use identity politics for their own gain or to manipulate, left and right, there's also people genuinely affected by policies being pushed by a section of society that either doesn't care about them or doesn't think they should have a right to exist. Identity politics and fearmongering is all the GOP is anymore. "Anti-woke" is the only plan on the surface and Project 2025 is the end goal. One can only hope this is the final death throes of a dark part of America's history. We'll all find out in the next few years.
He is absolutely a contrarian. Just look at his discussion with Sam Harris where he takes so long to admit that the worst imaginable state for all living things is bad. Or his discussion with Matt Dillahunty where he initially disagrees with every point Dillahunty makes before eventually conceding most when it becomes apparent he hasn’t actually thought about the points being made. He is the definition of a contrarian.
He can be a contrarian. And vain. But everything else posted by @stillaliveandkicking rings true. We accept his flaws because his fundamental message is on point and his compassion is grounded in sanity.
People like Jordan are meant to get you to ask questions He like everyone else are flawed and shouldn't be the be all, end all For me, I'm really thankful to dr Peterson. He helped me understand myself better and I cannot thank him enough for that Edit: for those of you who the feel the overwhelming urge to mention every terrible thing JP has done or said, you've missed the whole point of my comment You should focus on your own happiness and that of the people you care about the most. Getting into petty squabbles on the internet because you have to be 'right' is going to be a waste of your time and before you realise you don't have a lot of it, it'll be too late
@@shway1 I remember that, what a horrible take that was, haha. I've never liked his delves into Judeo Christian mythology. I appreciate his attempts to take ancient stories like Cain and Abel and spin them to modern audiences made up often of disenfranchised men, but that religiosity is definitely not my thing. I'm referring to his encouragement to do things like not say things that make you weak, look for problems in your life and work to fix them, seek strength to overcome struggle which will make you stronger, etc. He can be a wonderful influence in an environment steeped in passive dislike and distrust of men. I wish that he and Hitchens could have had some discussions on things like the literary impact of the KJB, Soviet authors, and ESPECIALLY Orwell. I would give a lot to see a long-form discussion on Orwell between those two.
@@free_at_last8141 how do you feel about the "muslim domination" comments mentioned in this video? what does that imply to these men about consent? have you seen "jp doesnt understand george orwell" ?
@@shway1 I don't think that I agree with Dr. Peterson about most of his takes on Islam. I don't mean to be rude, but it's better to cite the specific claims that he's making to get my takes on them. I have experienced "consent" to have been weaponized against young men, especially in Colleges and Universities, where sexual advances have been conflated with sexual assault. This has been paired with horribly poor "studies" to try and push a narrative of "r+++e culture" on campuses. This is ironically counter to much of what feminist protests on campuses were about a few decades ago, when the fight was against mandatory curfews and chaperones for female students. Sexual relations are messy, and treating men like potential monsters who need to be "educated" out of their innate evil tendencies and should be viewed with suspicion and generally considered guilty until proven innocent has done nothing good for multiple generations as far as I'm concerned. I had not seen the video you mentioned. I honestly generally can't stand Tom Nicholas, his presentation is snobbish and he's too stuck in Western "right vs. left" tribalism in my opinion, but I watched it per your recommendation. I didn't know that a statue of George Orwell was installed outside of the BBC in 2017, I find that funny and I don't think that it's a good place for it to be. I don't think that Hitchens would have approved of it, referencing his talk on Why Orwell Matters in Politics and Prose, but that's just my opinion. Orwell was ostracized by the Left of his day because he spoke out against the Soviet experiment in Animal Farm and the tendency to hate the rich as opposed to loving the poor amongst the "Liberal Elites" in Road to Wigan Pier. He also put his money (and ultimately his throat) where his mouth was in Spain as related in Homage to Catalonia. When Orwell said that "liberty means telling people what they do not want to hear," he was referring to these things, as well as his lambasting of British Colonial rule in India in Burmese Days, among other things I'm sure, I'm not an Orwell expert, I've just read some of his work. Tom Nicholas claims that it's incorrect for Dr. Peterson to claim to be similar to Orwell in this way, as he's experienced success for his speech where Orwell experienced ostracization. I disagree though, because Dr. Peterson has experienced severe critique and Professional ostracization for his claims, which I think he's generally weathered well. His interview with Cathy Newman is a good example of this. He's experiencing success because this brand of "I am a good person so any opinion that I have is good, so if you disagree with me you are a bad person and must be fought against" has run roughshod over much of Academia and the Professions generally. Dr. Peterson is seen by many as standing up to what they feel is injustice by speaking what people don't want to be said and is getting success for that. That he's experiencing success where Orwell experienced ostracization does not mean that they can't both be speaking uncomfortable truth. This is getting much too long, haha. I disagree that Dr. Peterson doesn't understand Orwell, and would argue that he instead approaches Orwell from more of a conservative Judeo Christian view, which is why I would have very much liked to have seen him discuss Orwell with Hitchens, who was obviously EXTREMELY well versed in Orwell's work and approached it from his Trotskyist Antitheist lens.
I don't there's been a decline. Just a change of focus for him. He's doing his work with Daily Wire, podcasts (and probably in the process of writing a new book). He's done the majority of his work and impacted the culture in a positive way, so he's prolly just taking it easier...he isn't getting any younger.
I really wish that Christopher Hitchens had been able to stay in the ring for a few more years. I would have given a lot to see long-form discussions between him and Dr. Peterson.
No, I read "Hitch 22" and learned from it that Hitchens does/did not waste time on debating people who even avoid answering a question. Peterson said that it would take him 3 days to answer if he believed in god. As if it is a not Yes/No question. Hitchens would not have waited for Peterson. Peterson clearly believes. He once even told to his friend that he wanted to have his own church and preach on Sundays. Really! There was an article in Toronto Star. If it had been a lie Peterson would have sued. Now he got his church. And his right hand, i.e., his business manager is a russian (also the husband of his daughter's).
I listened and thought very carefully about the points you make here. I have to say I disagree. Firstly, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with having a political leaning if he is saying the truth, and he is certainly still giving the other side a voice. Take your "anti-vax" impression of him for example. He's not anti-vax, just anti-covid vaccinations, and his views were based on careful discussion with professionals in field such as Dr. Jensen, Ridley, and Doidge. You may think it's fringe and the vaccine is safe, but you may also be biomedically uninformed. Which brings me to another point, I think you're failing to see that his collaboration with others is the third act. Indeed he has said what he came to say; there is only so much for one man to say. But inviting others to his podcast enriches his message. Maybe after hearing his conversations with Heather MacDonald and detransitioner Chloe Cole, you'll understand his righteous anger towards transitioning children and the sexual perversion of schools. Peoples ideas differ and you may not agree with me, regardless, I still really enjoy your channel.
Good post. The whole you're anti all vaccines if you're against the Covid vaccine is tiresome. The Covid "vaccine" isn't even a real vaccine - all the vaccines they give us as children prevent us ever catching the disease, while Covid at its best reduces your chances of hospitalisation and death, and at its worst causes unexpected deaths and long-term injuries.
His main problem is he can not find the right balance between different interests which are mostly legimit. So his thought are inspiring intellectually at the begining but then you realize he does not take into consideration many facts he do not want to understand.
I dont really agree with you. That he does talk about issues that are not his core expertise is true. But then it also takes listeners to consider his words themselves. It doesnt take away from his fantastic contribution. The idiosyncracies of his personality or bahviour also dont take away from his great contribution. One shouldnt mistake a perceived lack of personality warmth for an effective and careful, considered, compassionate rendition of a topic, that in itself, renders a valid conclusion which is highly desirable for many people. Its easy to forget that he was highly contrary and intelligent about ridiculous subjects which most people couldnt express but completely understood! He put that in words and made sense of it and he still does. Your narrative about downfall is really just over-conceptualising.
Thanks for detailing all of the threats against JP, few dare to expose just how scary that must have been for him and his family and the impact that had on him.
He's still pretty redacted though. I thought Jordy Pee was putting on a front stage act the whole time son... underneath he's just a bitter, frustrated closeted little soy infused cucked out pinko marxist...
One year later we can see this trope is absurd, hysterical, and vacuous. A wonderful example of trolling. It shows the worst of human nature when the author uses the fact no one knows who he is to snipe at his betters. But, while this trope will soon be forgotten, the more insidious nature of the mob will not be dismissed.
Echo Chamberlain failed to note two things when delineating Peterson's downfall: 1) In Peterson's recent controversial statements, pretty much everything he has said has been dead-on balls accurate. 2) If Peterson is now seen as a right-wing figure, alienating those on the left, you would think that if anything this would only increase his prominence on the right; so the extent of his downfall is still not explained. I myself am not nearly as drawn to Peterson's uploads as I was five years ago, but I'm really not sure why this is the case. My hunch is that, instead of presenting his own ideas, he now seems to prefer discussions with other intellectuals, and I'm much more interested in his own thoughts.
He used to present intelligent ideas that he had worked hard to develop. Now he's just another commentator who reactively comments on whatever happens to be the deranged leftist nonsense du jour. It's a waste of his intellect.
Yeah, it seems like everything eventually turns into an interview podcast. This seems to be the end goal of everyone who gains notoriety. Same with Andrew Huberman. Personally, I think the decline in popularity/relevance of these people is mostly related to them running out of new things to talk about. Sure, there will always be the next event to talk about, but the message is always the same. Essentially, the core set of ideas is rather small, and there's only so much time you could talk about them before repeating yourself. After a while, we've heard it all, and every new video is merely repeating what the previous however many videos already covered. Besides, I'm not all that interested in commentary on current events; that's just milking drama for views. I'm more interested in the man's philosophy, divorced from the distraction of ${latest_scandal}.
I've enjoyed your insights on The Critical Drinker's live streams, so thank you. I'm guessing that (at the time of this posting) 210 likes and 49 dislikes, puts the ball in an awkward court, so to speak. I certainly appreciate the recall, research and thoroughness of your video. I'm not a "Jordan is God" type by any means and I see your viewpoint in regards to his change. Your assessment is accurate. I have especially noted his shift in promoting his religious beliefs more so than he had done in the past. I do wonder, if his discourse shift is more related to an accumulated frustration in the realization that although he impacted many people initially, he also realized, over time, that he didn't really affect any change in the landscape, as a whole. All this can be seen in his snarky Twitter posts, as you stated. I've heard him say that he thinks he should avoid Twitter, but just keeps getting sucked in. It's easy for me to avoid Twitter and I do. I joined when Elon took over and made one post to him - my only post ever. It simply said, "Institute dislikes for comments, please!". I couldn't give a toss about Twitter and actually loathe its existence for so many reasons, but no one talks about me on that platform. I would surmise that having the public notoriety that Peterson has, makes it irresistible to avoid commenting. In summary, I guess I'd have to say that while Peterson has indeed lost the edge he once had, he's still done a lot of good out there. I'll check in on his RU-vid page every now and again, avoiding the religious stuff for sure, but he still has some compelling interviews with people that I really enjoy. He's still a really smart and insightful guy though, and I'd rather listen to him than all the race hustlers that are regressing society back to the sixties, all in the name of their warped ideologies. "The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long." (Tyrell, Blade Runner, 1982) Cheers, Sev
Personally, I know two persons including myself who changed their lives after reading his books and lectures. He opened the door to so many avenue of thinking that I was unaware of, and it is my belief that a friend of mine who eventually committed suicide wouldn't have done so if I was just brave enough and held together enough to reach out and told him to watch Peterson's videos like I did in my dark times. Years after I got better and got my life in order, I met him in his lecture event in 2022. I cant explain it exactly other than he does really care about people he meet. Its active effort in his part to put people at ease. From various interviews I've watched, he usually breaks down in tears specifically this part of conversation. I think what really put burden on him is unnecessary pain people go through in society at this time. Even though he treated people with despair and mental illness for two decades, I dont think that prepared him at all of the level of despair on this scale. I think thats what really damaged him considering that is the part where he often breaks down in tears talking about it. He is a great net positive to the world, and I dont think its fair to burden him to carry that role. What, sadly, would happen is that in the absense of that role, someone else will fill it, and ones who fill it wont do better job realistically, such examples as the manosphere pollbearers.
He should go down as one of the strongest and most revolutionary intellectuals of our time. That is, if the woke mob isn't successful in erasing all his achievements from 'historical and science literature', as contemporary woke doctrines and dogma like to portray themselves more and more as.
@@giovannigee I don't think so. He "just" resonated to so many people because of his courageous anti-woke stance, so he got immensely popular. And he helped many confused people along the way, which is surely positive. But lately he's been interested in bringing people to Christianity more than anything else. Hardly revolutionary. He's on his way of substituting the woke mob for Christian mob.
He may have had a positive impact at 1 point. But doing things now like lying about Global Warming means he has gone into causing a negative impact. Lets not forget Global warming killed people last year in addition to causing economic problems and general annoyances (such as droughts, plus wildfires that made haze and smoky air for many who live in the USA).
While I don’t agree with your characterization I’m glad I watched it and I respect your opinion. Keep up the good work and post more vids like this, preferably delving way deeper if required (as I believe was the case this time).
I think his latest series of conversations (especially with Niall Ferguson) have been absolutely brilliant. Probably his best work so far. And I say this despite being a Peterson skeptic.
I loved that conversation too! I’m not very religious but I love the breadth of mind revealed by these discussions. The atheist humanist position seems both adolescent and also undermined by the terrible state of our society
We're seeing the third act playing out now. His series on Genesis and Exodus have been hugely popular and he'll likely continue with more books of the Bible. He also has the ARC initiative, though that hasn't really taken off yet so hard to tell where that is going. But at least it is very ambitious.
It takes years to full recover from those benzodiazepine addictions. The withdrawal is the worst of any from what I’m told so my guess is he’s still not fully out of that. Maybe never will be
I think the overall feeling you are picking up on is that he's become the character of himself. Some essential strength, be it of mind or will, seems to have waned...perhaps understandably so.
I don't think there's been a decline so much as an understandable response to a series of life shaking events that would send many to their knees. A sudden rise to fame, being constantly slandered and misrepresented, a series of 'gotcha' interviews, serious illness for both himself and his immediate loved ones... And he STILL remains optimistic about the future. I think JP has been through a lot, but if anything, his experiences only leave him more capable of speaking to those in low places. A man I seriously respect for his sheer resilience.
Jacinda Ardern, the prime minister of New Zealand, has admitted that the country will become a two-tier society between the vaccinated and unvaccinated following new government measures. The politician's comments to the New Zealand Herald follow the introduction of a traffic light system, with the policy enforced when district health boards have vaccinated 90 per cent of their region. After a reporter from the Herald asked about the creation of two classes of citizens - between the vaccinated and unvaccinated - Arden said: "That is what it is."
Hardly. There are huge advances being made in neuroscience and imaging and there are... brain disorders. Y'know, like schizophrenia, personality disorders, depression, etc. Those are two of the major fields that study such phenomena.
So essentially you're lambasting Peterson because he is (finally) realizing the hopeless state of the institutions which he had regarded as mainstream and reasonable all throughout his (very respectable) life. Peterson is not the one in decline, Mr. Chamberlain - it is you who, judging by this video, are too concerned with "mean tweets" to realize that the things you regard as reasonable and nice have been decaying for decades, and recently crossed over into the twilight zone. They now do far more harm than good, and are therefore not "sustainable" in the only sense that matters: human flourishing. People of good conscience are gradually waking up to that, and starting to busy themselves with building something to replace it.
I think Peterson still has one more way of looking at things in life and that's to consider the virtues of how he used to talk to how he is now. He's off balance and I don't think he's had that moment of clarity in his life now. Cutting ties with The Daily Wire would certainly help his reputation.
I mean even disregarding the financial benefits, when it seems half the world hates you and it goes on for years , it must be nice to be embraced and have friends.Its not like he joined the KKK.
I was glad to see this. I notice that when you try to discredit him, you tend to paraphrase him in your own words instead of letting him speak. There isn’t anything I see in what he himself says and writes, that indicate any decline. He does mention at times in clips that you don’t reference, that he has gotten angry at being constantly attacked, and thinks he shouldn’t be, but is still recovering from those attacks and medical problems, but you don’t include much of that, but simply mention a “decline”. Then again, I admit to finding him clearly in the right and a necessary voice, even where you think him wrong. It seems odd that you and others declare he has moved “right”, when it seems obvious that the left has done the moving.
He's not moved right, he started on the fringe right to begin with. Nobody starts out as much of an anti-communist fanatic as he is without flirting with a little fascism. He was always a far right lune masquerading as something more. Or if I'm as wrong as I am sure you think I am, I wonder how you think it is that he ended up at far right propaganda outlet the Daily Wire? I knew from the first time I heard him on Joe Rogan he was on the far right. And that's before I found that he'd been on a white nationalist's podcast consistently agreeing with him on a host of issues. That he's now ignobly arguing for a near genocide in Palestine is him completing his turn into the fascist scumbag he was always on the crust of becoming.
Yes - and there is much he is up to, massive projects, like my favorite: constructing an entire new model of what a University can be, should be, a radical alternative to what is crumbling before us, to have the students exit the warping of their minds, and go to where they will actually learn to think wisely inside what is radically unique about them, and will know far more than most upon graduation, especially from their history, philosophy and literature classes.That's why Jordan Peterson will be remembered far into the future, a true soldier, an original, on the front line to Goodness.
The part you call a decline for Peterson seems more like pondering in order to not be canceled by certain groups you want to be ok with, but this concerns he brings into are very well supported and a significantly needed by an academic like him to expose and criticize these false argument made by woke universities, because there's no other psychologist talking about how dangerous is for mental health these moder takes about gender and stuff we are forced to get into if you decide to study social science in college
Ok, and I have watched many of Peterson videos, but its important to also think and not get carried by fancy words.He is wrong many times.And I dont mean the point he is trying to make is wrong but his attempts to justify and prove it.Just because I agree with him on an issue doesnt mean his thought process to prove it is correct.He is a brilliant man, but noone is always right.
Maybe he realizes that calm, mannered criticism isn’t working. He has a lot to be bitter and angry about. The thing that attracts me to Peterson was and is his authenticity.
...this video was unwatchable by roughly the 18th minute mark. The narrator devolves into blanket assertions that indicate a rather venomous bias. All good if the bias is more honestly asserted, but it proves nothing to those who are observing without attachment to any colours, fabrics, or pages of the 'culture war'. Peterson's emotional centre has been shredded. He continues to lay himself bare in front of the digital masses. He may have a Christ complex, but i hope he never stops speaking -- and not because i agree with everything he says. JP is an honest voice in shockingly corrupt times.
he's only famous for being one of the very few public "intellectuals" to promote god belief. But his own spiritual beliefs are super muddy... He seems to think if you can dream or imagine something then it's "real." And he's only "Christian" in the most loosey-goosey sense of the word... Basically he believes none of it but just likes the stories. The smarter the person, the less they take the Bible literally.
I think he is again returning to the center, especially after watching his last interviews. He has people in his life with opposing values and political views that he trusts and are his friends, and they have strongly critiqued his recent behavior of reactionary mean tweets, mean tweets that have done nothing but push him more to the right and alienated reasonable left-leaning audience. I think there is hope to see a positive change, he had a strong fall and I hope to see him calmer and collected again, no human is infallible... he has helped me out of some dark times with his lectures, and I'm biased in my opinions about him, but I feel I owe him at least a couple of more chances. Hope you had a merry Christmas people of the void!
He is not. You are imbibing in the Flavor Aid. He says nothing on import. He is full of white supremacy dog whistles-not white supremacists aren’t meant to hear them. Also. As a drug rehab nurse-his addiction story is a lie. And he entirely maintains his composure due to outside influences. His weepiness is due to his voluntary coma-that basically resulted in a head injury. And those will make you cry. You personally need to be careful as you are about to be a good German.
For many years, the ideas of Jordan Peterson were very influential to me and in so many ways, they still are. I don't go as far as you do in your criticism (dismissing the likelihood of a 'third act' is pure speculation). Nevertheless, and as painful as this is for me, I agree with the substance of your argument - both in describing the situation and in your analysis of the underlying causes. It makes me wonder: what does a person say after they've said what they came to say?
thats the problem with the internet. Noam Chomsky at least never felt bad saying the same things over and over again. These 'internet gurus' know they have to keep coming up with new stuff.
Jordan was in I am true fallacy where i have accounted for everything and this is the right way but when he understood the slice pf reality that people go through he was fcked up and weeping...
It isn’t bad to weep for others when you see what they are going through. It’s actually very, empathetic, and compassionate. He sees … that’s more than most people do for others
I listened to an interview Peterson did with a pastor on zoom (its the only one i think hes done where he has complete contempt for his host, down to his disinterested body language) and he was asked if he sees any parallels between himself and CS Lewis. Peterson wasnt too pleased. I think the comparison is warranted, but a little too generous. CS Lewis played with his thoughts, and could smash them together with very little regard for what the results would be. He played with his audiences, and enjoyed verbal tennis. Most importantly, he tripped into the spotlight accidentally, never got used to it, and bowed out rather quietly once he realized he couldnt compete with the generation to come. Im not interested enough in what Peterson does now to check my work, but it seems like he used to be desperate to teach, and on fire to pass on what he knew, because he saw people needed it so desperately. He was having fun ,and he was fun to watch, and he let you know that everyone was in on the party.Then he got into the conversation, and hes shifted focus onto personal intellectual development, using the resources he now has at his disposal. Good for him, but its not really about me anymore, which is also fine, but im not obligated to join the crowdfund for Petersons extended education. I mean, even Hitchens is polite enough to call me stupid sometimes. Its nice when a famous guy like him takes the time to make me feel included...
Why would he be displeased? I think C. S. Lewis's reputation has not suffered in the years since his death, either with religious or even secular people. He is still cited regularly in social and religious conversations, so I wonder why JP would not liek that comparison...
Do you have any more details on the interview with the pastor? Sounds interesting. I would have thought a comparison with C S Lewis would be flattering! Wonderful quote: "You see, we are like blocks of stone out of which the Sculptor carves the forms of men. The blows of his chisel, which hurt us so much are what make us perfect".
Yeah, his theory about Russia's war against Ukraine being a battle against wokeness was instantly retired once he realized that everyone else with Internet access found it laughable or indefensible. Just like the Kavanaugh tweet made him quickly do a 180.
Writing this comment four months after you posted your video, JP has stepped back from the vitriolic Tweets and mostly returned to his formerly contemplative demeanor. It's certainly for the best. By the way, I think JP's remark that progressive women have a desire for "brutal male domination" was meant jokingly. JP could do a better job of balancing his seriousness with humor, but he has his moments.
I was going to lodge some middling protestations about JP, but after your screed on his compelling and logical arguments , I found it reaffirming ofm his strengths and why he is a force of posotive , despite his B Shapiro Israel problems and many of his religious non-sequiturs about God and faith.
If his popularity has waned, it has not for me. I find his work interesting, accurate and useful and believe him to be a great leader of our time. His personal trials and tribulations to me only mirror my own and undoubtedly millions of others as we grasp for anything useful to heighten our understanding of this world and this life.
Never been a big fan of JP but he's right about one thing namely the Twitter files are way worse than Watergate. To deny this is being part of the downwards spiral.
Check out his old work. He was a talented personality psychologist & practically the only interesting user of psychoanalytic theory until fame started to chip away at his sanity.
He did in way if we compare 2016 to 2023 things got even worst even right wing people has shifted to radical left its insane I tell ya few years he will be either cancelled or irrelevant ya know here is what I found say what u say about islam but lately Islam has more family union then western world insanity no religion no morals no identity only mass migration porn addiction atheism and feminism I know I understand what Islam is strict with rules about lbgt and faminism its insane times I have big feeling that about 10 years from now its gonna be so radical what happing in western world a dictatorship in democracy clothing trust me
You must not forget that he was an academician in social sciences where education got huge hit by woke academicians. The university educations system in those departments are enormously hindered by that effect. So I believe it to be more redeemable for him to have a not so outspoken enmity toward those people. "Equality of outcome" argument is very at the point by the way.
I find it difficult to listen to Peterson's more recent discussions because he speaks over his guests, pontificating on his own thoughts rather than bringing out the thoughts of his guest, who tend to get maybe 1/3 or less of speaking time.
I haven’t noticed that. What I do think it’s an honor for anyone to be asked to sit down and talk with Jordan Peterson, so he may be interviewing them, but they are highly honored to be able to speak with. Someone educated as he. I do think sometimes… JP takes a little too long to get to his point. I find that to be a personality trait, rather than your suggestion: pontification. he could possibly work on closing his thoughts more quickly.
He has now developed a highly intelligent and well thought out approach to religions and Christianity in particular which is a rational progression from his previous critiques of post modernism and social construction-ism This is a cogent and much needed antidote to the materialist world of no purpose other than consumption ,egoistic self satisfaction, and entrapment in identity.An epiphany which he shares with renewed vigour.
Even though i apreciate and feast on your views on movies, actors, etc, with this video (as someone here said) i've got an ideea on where you're standing in regard to climate stuff, transalphabet people, left, right, plandemy. Thank you sir. Even though it's been short (4-5 videos) our ways will take part. All the best.
So you like the guys vids on movies and now you deduced from this video that he maybe doesn't agree with you on said subjects and the first thing that came to mind was to cut all ties with the channel. Wow. That's literally what JP warned about years ago, isolating yourself in a bubble with likeminded people and cutting out everything that's remotely opposing your views is the road to the bottom. It's not that hard to agree to disagree without burning all bridges.
I think its pretty pathetic to criticise the person and not argue against the topics. It seems to be a common way of shooting down someone's argument. Personal criticism. How about present a better argument. Be original and put your own stuff out there. Do we want a society where anyone that goes out in public and gives a view leaves themselves open to personal criticism and ridicule. Is that a way of intimidation. In an democratic society everyone can speak. Enjoy the market place of different views.
Peterson is a brilliant man with a brilliant mind, he is not ideal and has some excessive moments, but that can be justified given his experience with the extraordinary circumstances of his life.
I respectfully disagree on a few things. 09:04 It was kind of Channel 4 to edit out the sound of gears grinding lol 12:30 I've heard a few interviews he's had in which he's elicited a laugh from the audience, by stating facts, *thats* more impressive than dry wit (maybe only imo). Also, he debated some race-hustler in the US who was *'all flash, no substance'* whereas Peterson was *'all substance, no flash'* (the Munk debate) The thing is; he's *not* a political pundit or a Hitchens' style provocateur. He's just a guy. A professor articulating what he sees wrong with the world. 12:40 I think he said something like 'feminists have made a concerted effort to eliminate masculinity they find troubling (or they dont understand e.g. boys roughhousing) but the average woman finds masculinity appealing, so they date men from relatively more masculine cultures'. I know a few men who only date asian women because they're "more feminine" than western women, I guess Peterson is highlighting the female version of that phenomenon. 12:44 His message has always been "dont force me to say something under penalty of law". plain and simple. Check out his Bill C16 video, it's insightful. Regarding his drug use: Nietzsche said "Suppose I have the key to your chains, why should your and my lock be the same?" His advice is still solid, but he's still a man who has been through a lot. Also, it's not a good idea to portray someone's opinions without understanding *why* they have those opinions. (He says Canada switching to green cars is silly, *why does he think that?*)
@@gordoncarr9747 « Ad hominem » Nope. Just that I find always delightfully funny to see supporters of traditional values, flag, country, heritage, etc, being too lazy to even respect their own language.
“Sentimental and brutal” (spoken by a character from a Hollingshurst novel?) That does seem to have emerged in JBP. But among his adversaries in ‘woke’ academia, mainstream politics and NGOs, confronted with serious and evidenced opposition from critics (incl JBP) and grass roots, actual argument has given way to withdrawal and concession (as with the craven gender doctors behind ‘WPATH’) or fanaticism - which has its own sentimentality. Nicola Sturgeon for example.
He started to mindlessly pander to Israel that's where he cracked. I don't if this is before or after his interview with Netanyahu but jeez, he fell from the grace Infront our eyes.
I think that when Dr Peterson first arrived on the scene that his bravery and push back against the far left and right was novel, eloquent and loud. He was saying things that everyone was thinking but too nervous or I’ll prepared to say publicly. I believe what has happened is that he has led a whole generation to start pushing back with well thought out and careful arguments. He might have diminished only in that the volume of the push back has increased but his voice is just as clear and mighty and until the extreme left and right stop spewing their same warn out ideology I think it’s fair to say that Peterson fans will want to keep hearing from him. As well he seems to be an excellent long form interviewer over many topics so could be relevant by applying his clear thinking and insight with many interviewee’s.
As broadly Secular Humanist I criticize his positions in debates/interviews over the years, notably against Matt Dillahanty, though also appreciate and quote him on various topics. Sympathies for his partitioned decline into rightwing ecosystem.
Change, sure. Evolve? Intelligence isn't an absolute. And someone who is well versed in a topic can get said topic incredibly wrong. People can also cognitively degrade, individual neural connections can form that don't make much sense. Erroneous conclusions can be reached from brilliant mathematicians. Intelligence isn't an absolute and what counts as "evolving" is contentious outside of the biogenerational phenomenon of evolution.
Where is compassion for a great and courageous intellect beset by a catastrophic life crisis of huge emotional and physical proportions…… do we only continue to respect those with whom we can COMFORTABLY agree %100 , all of the time??? SURELY NOT. Keep thinking and keep feeling. This man loves humanity ……..
I agree some of this video, e.g. - Twitter is too brief to convey what he wants to say. However, it's incorrect to say that Jordan Peterson is like Christoper Hitchens (or his brother Peter Hitchens). This is because the Hitchens brothers are both cypto-communists: they have a 'chocolate box' opinion of Russia, e.g. 'Russia is full of beautiful dancers who make merry all the time'. This is why the Hitchens brothers criticise almost everything the West has to offer.
