Neil's journey from pickup artist to advocate for genuine connection is truly inspiring! 🌟 His message about giving validation to others and prioritizing authenticity in relationships is invaluable advice for building meaningful connections in both personal and professional life.
Honestly the splitting hairs was the BEST part. I struggle with this all the time: should I strive to contribute? Is that striving self serving or even arrogant? How do I know I'll know before having done damage? Is it enough to "just" be a good parent, good husband, good family member? I loved the debate because it gave me honest perspective. Thank you for splitting hair!
What a great conversation. I paused many times because Neil description of his relationship with his mother tracked so much with me. Also, I agree with Neil about doing the right thing because it's right, but how I connect to Simon's concept is that we still propagate and plant the seeds for others regardless of if it has the intended outcome. Action ripple out.
YES YES YES - SUCH great content. Hairsplitting allows us to THINK!!! And we are NOT taught to think anymore. We are not encouraged to talk things through with different opinions and views and find common ground - 2 sides of the same coin seen from different places. My favorite quote - not quoted exactly as said but my new mantra... I am responsible and accountable for my actions and my words and will attempt to go through life in a way that I leave whatever situation, conversation, or place slightly better than when I showed up.
So cool to see this. I can't remember how I found out about the PUA community and Neil's book, 'The Game', but I was one of those that bought it hoping to help me get a girlfriend. It's so funny to hear Neil describe the start and end of the book and saying it's about male insecurity. Because I did read it but mainly focused on the middle sections where I could get tips. Neil did release a companion book, 'Rules of the Game' which was more of the self-help book. This was 2007 and I was 20. I then went on learning about other 'gurus'. There was quite a bit of content on RU-vid you could find for this stuff. I thought I wanted to be like a pickup artist. But in the end I wasn't comfortable with that. Going through the phase did teach me to communicate with people. I'm 37 now. Married for 4 years with someone I love, have a 2 year old son, and a daughter on the way. Thank you, Neil. Without you and your book, I wouldn't have gone on this journey and be where I am today - happy
I personally think Neil is 💯 right on contribute without having to taking responsibility. That is healthy! How can I possibly take responsibility for how other people feel and get out of a situation. Everyone is responsible for making the final call themselves, after I “contribute” 😊
Very good debate. “Can we do the right thing without being responsible for the outcome?” My answer: I don’t think so. A) Right or wrong are Cultural narratives (norms etc.). that are bound by space & time. So, they are prone to change, even though certain norms may feel like they transcend space & time. B) For change to take place, there needs to be a feedback mechanism, that could lead to the feeling of ‘heathy shame’ (feelings are cultural constructions too). That feeling (particularly if it’s unpleasant) will inherently make one feel responsible (belief based cue or evolutionary cue for survival). Bottom line: without feeling a sense of responsibility (either towards oneself or others) change is hard to come about - Then doing the right thing is not sustainable… turtles all the way back, doing the right thing is not possible without being responsible for the outcome. Another way to look at it is - if doing the right thing is possible without being responsible for the outcome, then doing the wrong thing too is possible without being responsible for the outcome. It’s another debate if one should be retributed for the outcome or restituted. I second the second, because free will doesn’t really exist in absolute terms.
The Game was such a fun and fascinating book. I used some of the tips when I was younger and they do work! However picking up girls is not the ultimate goal in life. I’m happily married with a wonderful wife and kids and experience a lot more joy than when I was younger. We all evolve over time, hopefully towards more meaning and fulfillment.
I'm a bit surprised at Simon just pushing on his idea. It doesn't look like him. Neil is just saying "hey you don't know , so maybe let People alone sometimes" and Simon just keep pushing and pushing, not willing to admit that Neil is right or that there is a middle ground. It's weird to see him like this.
The aim of a podcast interview is not only to listen to people's perspectives but also question them. Simon is right to question Neils ideas so that we get a better idea of how it's formed, why he holds those views and how impactful those viewers are to this own life. I loved seeing that exchange and will watch more of Simon's podcasts from now on.
@@clem9830 Simon is disagreeing with the perspective neil has. In my opinion, It's a good thing because you don't want interviews where you listen to someone's perspectives on things without fundamentally understanding how it was formed or whether it could be defended if it were scrutinised. That's probably why I enjoyed the back and forth so much. Neil explained why he believed what he believes in and Simon did the same thing. Both explained their stance passionately. Overall it's important to note this disagreement they've had is on one perspective of the many perspectives both hold in life. Keep in mind, people's perspectives change over time. Neil used to have a pickup perspective back in the day which he no longer does; that perspective which I'm sure he defended at that time and lived life by, ironically he no longer cares for today. I get where you are coming from in disagreeing with Simon's approach. It can look rather combative. But I'm looking at the exchange from a different perspective, more of a challenging the views of the person being interviewed. I really dislike podcasts where someone is interviewed and their ideas never criticized or have them explain their perspectives indepth. The listener is left with hearing a bunch of surface level questions.
@@JamesO-cj3dp i totally agree but it's the way he did it. Pushing, forcing instead of calmy talking it out. You can read on his body language that it's really bothering him.
The Bible reference, in the chapter’s context, is not about “be happy planting your garden and building your house”, it’s about (paraphrasing) “I thought I was satisfied on all this things but it was all vanity”
That was a tough one to get through... I found myself agreeing with Neil early on in the conversation. Near the end, and maybe it's that we are surrounded by self serving people living on a fantasy "island", but all I could feel was cowardice. People that are afraid to even attempt to make the world better because they may be held accountable. It made me sick to my stomach.
The Outcome is not the Outcome … it’s just the first ring of an ever-expanding series of rings, rippling forward through time. We do our best to decide and act - and, if these decisions and actions result in slightly better outcomes in the world, then perhaps we are living with virtuous purpose. Of course, we cannot know much about the sets of consequences beyond that first ripple … we can try our best, with all good intentions ... but we can never fully know. Simon - with all due respect - I don't think it's so simplistic as 'As long as you're intentions are good' .... history is replete with examples of people with good intentions - killing millions. Interesting chat though. thank you to both.
Personally, I REALLY struggle with this. I feel like it always sounds fake, like a Hallmark card. I tend to have such high expectations of the world around me, and "meeting" my expectations doesn't deserve praise, exceeding my expectations does. It happens so seldom that it feels disingenuous to praise what feels like mediocrity to me.
I think the point is that in the larger scheme is that if everyone does something with a positive intention to contribute VS people just do whatever. The end result will be that the world and all its people as a whole are better off when everyone acts with the right intention. I do think Neil’s view on this is quite cynical.
Simon and Neil should test their MBTI. I suspect that Neil is an introverted thinker, and Simon is an extroverted feeler. No one is more right than the other, just very, very different.😂
The first step to contributing is being able to take care of yourself. There needs to be a solid foundation to support yourself and others. Neil's point is that sometimes that's all a person can do is care for themselves, and Simon's point is you should be aiming to contribute, meaning take care of yourself plus others. They are both correct. So sometimes all you can do is focus on yourself, especially in hard times, and then if you feel secure enough, you can take on the responsibility of others which should be the goal.
