The Edmund Fitzgerald Investigations 

I find the presenter’s assertions that the Fitzgerald didn’t/couldn’t have bottomed out unconvincing for several reasons. First, he offers no plausible explanation for the damage reported by the Fitzgerald immediately after passing near Caribou Island. Second, he seems very comfortable in the notion that the Shoals were not shallow enough to cause a problem. If there were twenty to thirty foot high waves, that does not mean they are that height above the normal lake level (which is the datum the depth soundings are taken from). When there are twenty or thirty foot high waves, the troughs must be BELOW the normal lake level. The water that makes up a thirty foot high wave is displaced from the trough, therefore the ship must drop below the normal lake level when it drops into the trough. This is of great importance when you are sailing over shoals of approximately 40 foot depth in very heavy seas, and your ship draws 25 feet. Third, I don’t agree with the statement saying if the Edmund Fitzgerald had bottomed at Caribou Island, it would have sunk at Caribou Island. That would depend entirely upon the extent of the damage and the rate of water entry into the ship. If, for example, the damage was such that the rate of water entry was slightly more than the ship’s pumps could handle, it is entirely plausible that the ship could have continued sailing until the net incremental water sufficiently overcame the ship’s reserve buoyancy. Under this scenario, this ship might not be able to recover from a large wave that would have otherwise posed no risk of foundering. Fourth, the front 270 feet of the ship is buried deeply in the mud, and the middle approximately 200 feet of the ship was essentially missing, preventing examination of most of the bottom of the ship. Finally, Captain Cooper was following the Fitzgerald, watching it on his radar, and in communication with the Fitzgerald’s captain, and he thought the Fitzgerald had passed over the shoals and had bottomed. I think Cooper’s account and opinion deserves more weight than the speculation of outsiders.

Great tribute to the aspirations and professionalism of everyone associated with this ship.

Hats Off for Capt. Cooper taking his ship back out to search after making it safely through.

The US Navy constructed two warship classes by modular design in the '70 & '80s. Both classes were plagued with cracking of superstructures, hull plates & fuel tanks throughout their careers. The Fitz had her max load increased three times. She carried very heavy loads and her hull did a lot of flexing throughout her career, by loading & offloading and of course the wave action (30 foot waves on her last trip & 26,000 tons of load). She lasted only 16 years. No one should discount the stresses on that hull which very plausibly caused her loss.

I continue to be impressed by Ric Mixter's down to earth nature. Ive even reached out to him online and he was most gracious. I have noticed an arrogance in some, who are in the upper echelons of Great Lakes lore. Ric is not one. Also, Jeff Thomas, I believe of Alpena gives a very solid impression of knowledgeable but approachable and humble. Ric Mixter has done amazing work keeping memories alive and educating us nerds. A balance between reverence for these tragedies, our human desire to remember, plus the need to learn safety lessons. I appreciate Ric's candid views on visiting the Fitzgerald again, as that can put you in the crosshairs for great emotional abuse from others. Further, I agree with Ric's stance on re-visiting the Fitz. Thank you, Ric and The US Army Corps Of Engineers Detroit!

Awesome. Great job.

Thing that gives me pause on the Shoaling theory is Canadas coast guard dove the popular spot Fitzgerald supposedly hit not long after sinking and found no red paint skid markets or broken rocks indicating a collision. (Of course they could have just missed something, or even could be lying) The rocks west of Michipicoten island around Chummy bank north of Caribou Island should been dove too but weren't. Also the testimony from former Fitzgerald crewmen Richard Orgel and Red Bergner about the unusual flexing of the Fitzgerald during bad weather, McSorely himself supposedly calling it the "Wiggling thing". And the fact the keel was worked hard, McSorely never anchored in bad weather, and Fitzgerald was occasionally taking loads in the 70s that were more than what was intended in the design

Very great video! But there's so many videos about the edmund fitzgerald, which is great, but I'm honestly fascinated with the story of the SS Kamloops. I would love it so much if you eventually did a great video about that story and what happened to captain William Brian, Alice bettridge who wrote the letter and died on isle royal with 8 other men, and miss Jennet Grafton who went down on the ship. I feel like it deserves a solid video of its own to honor the whole crew of that ship. 😁

I missed it if he said it, but what did he suspect caused the list?

I can not find his new book to buy not even on Amazon...anyone knows where to buy it in England??

FANTASTIC loved the video warm regards from england....ps/ how can I get your book in the uk please

Great job. You’ve changed my mind on the root cause. Admittedly I was a “hit the shoal” person. This is enormously complex and fascinating story. Thanks!

Wrong a few points Mr Mixter, she was overloaded on her final run. With much more then she was designed to carry. Also, ask any captain or the lake carrier's association, the hatches have minimal leaking. Had she been leaking top side the pumps could have handled it. Also Captain Cooper was on deck for the entire time.

I DEEPLY RESENT the eternal nit-picking at Gordon Lightfoot for these bloody "errors" in the lyrics. He got his info from one of the first articles...but that's incidentsl, eh, fellas? REST IN WELL-EARNED PEACE, GORD. YOU ARE TERRIBLY MISSED! 🕊🕊🍁🍁🕊🕊🍁🍁🕊🕊 Jeff Thomas-who, BTW, is my favorite storyteller is OBSESSED with the "errors". He cant touch this guy. FYI... Gordon Lightfoot set up a scholarship fund with the lion's share of the income from that "erroneous" song. He's dead now...with McSorley and crew..and I'm betting THEY didnt bitch at him for "mistakes". People like this guy can keep poking away...he's gone now. I saw him in concert..and his kindness was warm and WONDERFUL. Not like his always-ripping critics.

Yes i agree

I have a feeling some of the welds holding the. Keel in repair didn't make it

I like that Ric ruffles people's feathers. Seems they tend to be the casuals and people who mostly know Fitzgerald from the song. While shipwreck enthusiasts and researchers in general arent as ruffled by him.

I've always been fascinated by this story and the history of the great lakes. I tend to lean towards the idea that the EF did a nose dive and one thing that comes to mind is the condition of the 2 lifeboats. I can only see one reason why the steel on those lifeboats being ripped apart like that is due to them being drawn towards and making contact with the propeller

PROPELLER shredded life boats

I used to look up to ric, but the more he talks the more bs I call him on. What a shame.

Please only have the speaker on camera; too many distractions on side. Thank you

My theory is Edmund Fitzgerald sank by a gigantic rogue wave. from what I understand two 30 foot waves hit the Arthur M Anderson and caught up with the fits. My theory is those two waves became one giant one. Just a theory. What are you guys think?

Thumbs out to the interviewer she let her guest talk. 👍

I like his knowledge, but him critiquing Gordon Lightfoot is a bit much. I don't think Gordon said Wisconsin and Cleveland to be accurate, those fit the song better. Saying coming from some mill in Minnesota, or fully loaded for Toledo, just don't fit the song as much.

According to him he's the best and only expert on the Fitzgerald, the others must be cosplaying as a expert/scientist. And every woman he slept with gave him a standing ovation afterwards.