2004 GMC Sierra 2500HD, Duramax LB7, Allison Series 1000 5 speed, no EGR, no DEF, no regen. 522,000 miles, 19 MPG daily driver. Mine. What else can I say? Oh, it runs like a dream.
Have we not reached the summit yet? Can manufacturers finally stop worrying about having the highest, most obscene power numbers and instead focus on reliability? If you’re going to charge me 90k for a truck, can it at least last the majority of my lifetime?
Unfortunately 75 percent of the buyers of these 80k plus trucks will trade them in for the next model in 3 years. So the big three have no real reason to increase reliability.
The Big Three Automakers are more worried about the quarterly profits & stock prices. They could change course and get to Toyota & Honda levels of quality & Reliability if they really wanted to.
@@bluesfan6862 this has been going on for so many years unfortunately. Though… maybe owners of newer trucks wouldn’t be trading in so often if the major components weren’t already failing when under warranty
This is why GM isn't concerned with over 1000lb-ft. Gale banks already proved you can never get peak torque with these 10 speed autos and the torque converter flashing. They will never see 1200-1500 while towing
I bought the 2022 Duramax AT4 3500. Let's just say the first thing that I did was drop the 36-gallon tank and installed the Titan 54 gallon tank. To be fair, I pull a 42 foot fifth wheel.
Mr Truck the gooseneck ball just behind the rear axle gives a better ride and leaves more room for a bigger tool box or aux fuel tank in the bed. I know at least one ford 350 guy that moved the hitch back just behind the axle for towing his 5th wheel camper and it helped the ride. Good to see you guys doing these again. Always enjoy Mr. Truck and Andre testing trucks I no longer have a need for but I am still interested in. Hope you guys stay safe and healthy.
I will stick with my diesel, 2003 F250 7.3 powerstroke19 years, 335,000 miles and counting with no end in sight. No engine failures or major issues, gas just doesn't get there.
These aren't heavy duty trucks. Trucks that are 3/4 and 1 ton rating are still "light duty" trucks. Many trucks with 22.5 tires are considered "medium duty" like my 26k Freightliner M2.
Show us the 2024 6.6 gas version of 100 miler, and the Ike in a 2024 GM gasser. I would also like to see a practical tow test, you always max out the ratings. Most of us (in the west) buy trucks with the trailer in mind, and try to stay at 70-85% of the tow rating. Compare half tons with the typical camping load (7-9000), and 3/4 tons with 10000-13000.
Mr. Truck it's always great to see you and get your comments on these new trucks so keep it up and TFL keep having Mr. Truck on you channel as a special quest !
Banks, as in Banks turbo, have a great video where they dismantled a 2023 & 2024 6.6 DuraMax and compared them. You want the 2024 vs prior models. Especially if you are looking at a brand new 23 vs brand new 24 truck. There’s a lot of High Country (2500s especially) sitting on the lots so if you are in the market for a High Country, you have great choices. I would get a 2024!! I much prefer the 1 ton or 3500 HD trucks so this should be a great video and baseline.
It would be cool for you guys to use that trailer and route for any truck that can tow 11,000 pounds. Would be cool to see how some of the half tons do.
Forget fuel mileage. Look at mantniece cost and repair. Love my 2008 cclb duramax. But would not buy a new diesel of any truck now as to much expensive junk and unreliable . Pick a truck you need not what you like . And don't jack them 😂
But I LOVE where they put the 5th wheel..... because now I can pull my gooseneck with the short bed and not hit the cab of my truck! Come on Mr truck.... That was brilliant, not bad...... It tows great. At least on my 5th wheel which is 14,500. Course I'm using the gas truck too which pulls amazing. No more diesel for me.... Thanks EPA
I would love to see an MPG loop of a 'similar' diesel pickup from the 90's or 2000's before the EPA slapped all the emissions junk on them. Maybe something like a 2000's LLY or LBZ.
It would get the results you expect. Those low power output engines get significantly better MPG than the modern ones, not because of the diesel emmisons equipment but due to not demanding 1000lb-ft of torque any time your in the throttle. Early 6.6L duramax with 4x4 could easily get 24mpg hwy. The new one is around 18mpg.
Get a programmer andnturn that one down to 205 hp and 440 lb-ft torque and it would likely beat the early 90s trucks. No one would buy them. Well, likely a few but you wouldn't want to be caught behind them in a hilly area without passing lanes.
First, I understand time is always an issue but it would be much better to do a longer loop to get a better average consumption. 2 or 300 miles would be much more accurate. Second, it would be interesting to see comparisons of say half ton vs 3/4 ton for the 10,000 lb towing range. That's at the upper end for a half ton but with some now advertising 14K well within reach. Myself I wouldn't advise buying a half ton truck to tow that much weight very often but it would be interesting to see an actual comparison of how the two would stack up in comfort handling the load, ride comfort, and especially economy. The bigger truck should start off lower but take less of a hit with only a partial load vs the smaller truck working at maximum capacity.
It’s a durajunk! I bought one new in 2005 and wad on a roll back at 1200 miles and this continued for 3 years every couple of months till I traded it in on a dodge w a Cummings 6.7
I personally don’t think the gooseneck placement is in the wrong spot . Actually I find it perfect because us blue collar workers carry big tool boxes in our trucks . The extra spacing between the cab and gooseneck makes a huge difference when needing to tow our 5th wheels across the nation with our tool boxes . In my case it’s a good difference .
Agreed. They even tested how much weight having the ball farther back takes off the front end and at gross tongue weight it only took off about 100lbs. That extra space in the front of the bed is well worth the minor unloading of the front end. Especially on the short beds.
If you are really particular about where the gooseneck hitch is in bed and must have drop in tool chest in front still. Wouldn’t a long bed configuration be ideal in 3500 or 2500
The extra room is nice but you can definitely feel a difference while towing. Our short bed Ram was more stable with the 5th wheel (I run a Goosebox on a 35' 5er).
Nice video I really enjoy these and feel they are unbiased and honest. I have a 2500 22 ram with a close set up only 8k mini x. Thought about trading for a durmax. Really wish toyota would just build a 3/4 ton.
11:23 you also missed GM gives 3500 the 12 inch rear axle with NO torque limiting. 2500HD gets 11.5 WITH torque limiting. GM is the only one that does this.
People comment on the expense of these trucks. You either need one or you don’t. If you do, then the cost shouldn’t be a deterrent - if it is, whatever you are doing that you need a HD truck for , you aren’t charging enough. If you can’t write the check for it then it probably isn’t for you. It’s a business expense , and if it’s used as so , your business should be generating enough cash to use the write off and make the purchase. If not , stick with a old beater , or take a job working for a company where you can drive a Toyota to work
Fun. My 17 year old truck brought 13mpg to the table from San Jose to Eugene, over all those passes, diving hard, wth a GCWR of 24,400 pounds on the state scale 3 years ago.
Sweet vehicle, I have a duramax lml and the 6.6 is nice. People should realize that you are never more than a $75 sensor away from the truck going into limp mode because of EPA regulations for diesels. In addition, all repairs are measured in increments of $1000. For example, a cheap repair like a new thermostat is only $1500.
I just had my sensor in front of the catalytic converter replaced and the converter manually cleaned. $76.00 for the sensor and the remaining cost of the $560.00 bill was for labor. I changed out my own thermostats a couple years ago for the cost of the thermostats from Rock Auto and the Walmart antifreeze. I've had an Edge Programmer for years. If I get a check engine light I can see what the code is and reset it while driving or parked. The programmer is about $500.00, but no limp mode ever. Plus, I can tune for mileage or power. 92K miles and counting.
I read several places that the 10 speed is not actually made by allison, instead it was co-developed with ford, and shares lots of the same parts. they are also built inhouse at gm and not at allison factory. the allison name comes from the fact that allison put it thou inhouse testing and then licensed the name allison for use on the 2500/3500s. the 4500/5500 actually have an allison built trans.
My 2006 LBZ Duramax gets 12.5 towing 10,000. Y’all have fun spending $90,000 for fancy buttons and screens. The trucks aren’t all that much more capable than 17 years ago. It’s just a bunch of flash.
While I would venture to guess most people here agree with you, finding a 2006 with less than 250k miles can be a feat, and many people here work so much out of these trucks and put so many miles on them that in the 17 years they have owned 2 or 3 or maybe even 4 trucks like this and out 300k to 500k miles on each. Although they certainly don't make things like they used to, we get what we get these days.
I live in Clio, Michigan but am from East Tennessee, we go back a few times a year I usually take my Wife’s 2019 GMC 2500 Crew Denali can drive from Home to Knoxville Tennessee on 3/4 of a Tank of Fuel, The Truck has a 36 gallon tank like the. Other Three we own and I have say we don’t let much grow under our feet. We make a (9) Nine hour Drive depending on Traffic in (7) Seven Hours.
We got our '24 AT4 (3500) about a month ago and took the 5th wheel (12,500lbs as measured on a CAT scale) out for the first time last weekend. The trip was short at just under 100 miles each direction and we averaged roughly 10.1mpg on the dash. The route is fairly flat and we maintained roughly 72mph (typically around 1700rpm). I never noticed the trans break 146 degrees. We have the short bed and I gotta say, it doesn't tow as composed as our Ram MegaCab short bed did; there is a little lateral wiggle that feels more like a travel trailer than a 5th which I figure is due to the pin placement in the GM but the tires could be part of the equation as well (I've never towed on Goodyears). Ride quality was very nice over road imperfections (we ran 28psi in the airbags to sit level) and cabin noise was quite low. Overall very happy with the truck but I wish they wouldn't have moved the pin back.
Have you noticed dead pedal in the 24 Duramax? I just did a test drive on a 24 LTZ. From a dead stop if you hit the throttle quick at least 1/4 or 1/3 down, it had dead pedal for almost 3 seconds. I mean i hardly responded then hit real hard. Also driving around the diesel just didn't seen responsive till it spooled up. I found it rather annoying. Seemed like a lot of turbo lag. What's your experience? Did the truck learn and improve?
@@CS-rb9jk It is very lazy until it hits about 1700rpm off idle. It doesn't matter how much throttle you give it, that just happens. I've considered a pedal monster but the more I drive it, the more I get used to it. Nowhere near 3 seconds but it's certainly noticeable. We only have 1300 miles on it but it hasn't changed at all.
@@madweazl The new 2024 has a new turbo actuator that is supposed to be very responsive and the engine upgrades are suppose to give it quicker and more low end but it doesn't seem like it.
@@CS-rb9jk I've never had another Duramax so I don't know what previous models were like. I've owned a 6.0 PSD (much the same with lag off idle) and a 6.7 PSD that was very responsive (more like a gas engine). I know the controller is supposed to be quicker and the torque is supposed to be available lower in the power band but that doesn't necessarily mean it would be more responsive. It bothered me initially but I hate less now that I'm getting used to it lol.
@@CS-rb9jk - try putting it in tow haul mode if it has that. Also, when it takes a crap when you push the throttle down, quickly let up and hit it again hard. If that doesn't work, get a Ram. It has a dead pedal too, but using the tricks I gave it at least wakes up. Drive by wire is sh!+. When I push down on the throttle, I want it to respond. All this effing money for these things, and they are like bulls with their nuts cut off. Don't work all that well.
One of the benefits of GM listing the max trailer weight for a configuration is when you get pulled into a weigh station. If it was the actual max weight for your configuration you can get an overweight ticket, and perhaps required to unload some weight before they let you leave. So having a few hundred extra pounds on the sticker might save you an expensive ticket.
My '05 Ram 5.9 Cummings will beat that, the worst I ever gotten was 13 mpg and I personally believe the head wind cost me a couple mpgs''. I don't want any of these new trucks that cost more and more and the materials are cheaper and will not hope up to the test of time.
So I like watching you guys, especially Andre and Mr Truck doing towing test. But you all really need to clarify this towing sticker. It’s always been configuration specific so this very truck being a crew cab 4wd diesel 3500 SRW with 18” or 20” tires has a GCWR of 30,000. The GVWR is 12,100. The trucks payload was 3760 pounds meaning the truck weighs as shipped from the factory 8340 pounds. So 30,000-8,340= 21,660. Now the sticker says 21,600 for gooseneck and 20,000 for conventional. So of course you have to allow for your weight as a driver but this is always the case for determining a tow rating. It can’t be VIN specific because everyone has a different body weight not to mention any stuff people carry along. The GM sticker is the best in the business because it tells you your trucks configuration and then it’s up to the end user to determine at a scale, if their trailer and setup fits that. I just can’t understand the complaint here. If that truck had 17” wheels those numbers would be different. If it was 2WD those numbers would be different. If it was a long bed those numbers would be different. And with the tow sticker you don’t have to look at the owners manual or an online configurator to determine your ratings.
You guys couldn’t be more wrong. The EPA doesn’t give a damn whether you know the mpg or not. Since it’s not required, the manufacturers don’t want you to know.
I think it would just be a coincidence if they caught a regen during the video. I would hope soot control is at least as efficient as my 6 year Ram. My older ram (2017) would only regen about every 24 engine hours, which worked out to about every 1,000 miles for my type of driving. My 2011 ram would regen around every 200 miles or so. The ‘22 F350 I drive at work goes at least 500 miles between regens (too much idle time).
I don't understand. We had 454 gas engines in 1 ton dually pickups with 220 hp, and 350 TQ back in the 90s, hauling 12,000 lbs. With a 4.11 rear axle. Getting 7-8 mpg hwy. Fast forward 30 years of technology. 6 more speeds of transmission, direct fuel injection, computers totally running the engine, a lower rear axle ratio, lower RPM, With higher torque, trailer, exhaust, braking systems and we gained a whole 3 mpg. And charge an additional $50,000 for this.! Come on.! But 14 camera angles. Makes up for it right.?! What a farce. We used to make fun of a high dollar pickup with lots of options, calling it a "Cowboy Cadillac ". Now it seams to be a nesscessity to have as many bells and whistles as you can get, just to tow a trailer.! How did we manage back in the 60s and 70's.
I think André nailed it with his efficiency versus power output comment. My Duramax gets 3 mpg less than my 2022 F350 SRW did. This is an average over the last 12,000 miles. Love the Chev!
It's effective in the lower gears (can certainly feel a difference). I've never owned another GM so I can't say how it compares to previous iterations but you can definitely tell it's working when you have a trailer behind you.
My 2021 GMC Crew 2500 gets 26 mpg. It was 22 mpg. Strait out of the Gate. I have a 19 same body truck gets just about same. My 2014. 3500 Single Wheel gets 21 to 23 depending.
I got 12.5 towing my 20ft open deck with 4000lb car on rural back roads (160mi round trip), 9.5mpg towing 9000lb enclosed on highway (200mi). 2022 dually duramax
Where you driving fast? Towed a hair over 13k(2011 RR Ghost, 2021 Chevrolet bolt EV, 3400 lb open center trailer) 149 mi at 16.2 mpg 65 mph with a 3.0 diesel. Been wanted to upgrade but based on what ive been reading id get worse mpg.. trip started at 62' elevation, ended at 302' elevation with a few peaks at 1,014' ele.
The only thing I liked about the whole video is the Sinclair fuel station; I thought they were extinct; Nice to see Dino still around. As far as the truck very nice all around, But $ 83,000 get real! No thank you.& that's coming from a Chevrolet guy that owns 7 of them, & 2 of them are trucks; 03 1500, & a 99 C/3500 dually; With a dump bed on it. Both are gasoline; A 5.3, & a 5.7.
I have come to a point that if i have to pay a house mortgage for a vehicle and have the damn emissions fail and leave me stranded out of state ( which has happened to me) then i am just going to lease the damn thing. The idea of buying an older truck and having a mechanic completely restore the truck for 40k seams much more appealing to me
Please test the new 2024 Silverado/Denali 1500 3.0L Duramax with the same load on the same route... I'm interested in that! My expectation is to see close to 20 mpg. The 10K load is the typical load I'm at.
I had a 1988 chevy truck 3/4 ton once and a friend had a 1988 1/2 ton and the only difference I could see between the two was my truck had higher ply tires on it
Enjoy all your videos but you all need to apologize to automatic inquiries for unwarranted business decisions. There are better ways to approach things you feel infringe.
LMAO! My 04 6.0 Ford got better mpg towing my big race car trailer. Just mainly exhaust and mild tune, bullet proofed later on. Put over 400K on it before I sold it last year. I miss that truck, but I really didn't need it anymore. Not with what it could tow. Towing with it was effortless for a single axle, with the CrewCab and full 8ft bed. That long wheelbase sucked in parking anywhere, but towed so sweetly. Most of the time, I towed un-equalized. It was a little smoother. In mountains, nasty weather, I'd hook it up for even more of an ease in towing. 26mpg was very common empty not towing.........if ya kept ya foot outta it.
You guys with these crazy numbers are hilarious. I also had a 6.0 ('06) and it didn't get anywhere close. 16mpg average and 8-9 towing. I grabbed an '11 PSD after that and the difference was night and day. The 6.7 was so much nicer to tow with (20mpg empty and 10 towing); no more lag until 1800 rpm. Our 6.0 was relatively "reliable" (did the EGR delete at 100k along with an oil cooler swap as it had failed) but it was hot garbage when it came to towing vs anything that came after it.
@@avalanche3084 I couldn't give a flying ' f*ck if you believe or not! And you're stupid if you don't think a properly prepped 6.0 is a powerful and a very reliable engine.
How much DEF did the Duramax use? Really need to factor that into the fuel stats since it is a key element of the driving costs per mile. I wonder how the L8T gasser would compare - no DEF and no regen cycles and has a 10-speed as well now.
Ours has 1301 miles on it and has 6 of 8 "blips" left on the DEF gauge. Best guess, each "blip" is roughly 12.5% so we have used 25% at this point. That equals roughly 5200 miles per tank of DEF. Capacity seems to be 6-7g on previous models but I'm not positive on the '24. If 7, it adds roughly $45 to your 5200 miles (roughly 11 tanks of fuel depending on use). Fuel (at $3.49/g which is typical here) would run about $1225 for those 11 tanks or $1275 with DEF added (less than 4% increase in total cost with DEF added).
@@madweazl That's just it - I can't compare my 3.0 duramax DEF consumption with the big boys but the cost of DEF is minimal. I typically see about 5000 miles per tank with just over 30K on it now ('22 4x4 Silverado). 2.5 gallons of DEF is less than $10 at walmart anywhere in the country. I find most people complaining about the cost of DEF, or other added costs (fuel filter, etc) have never actually owned one.
DEF cost is nothing get real even with towing heavy a couple boxes last 3000 miles and if you’re not carrying an extra chromosome you can find it to $10-12/box. Thats $0.008/mile
Time to get rid of DEF, the side effects is that it kills bumble bees. I know I know, some little buzzer who cares. Then slowly their goes ALL of our needed plants. Please don’t tell B.Gates this or he’ll pay off some bureaucrat to have DEF in gas cars.
always had a HD 2500 high country Duramax. However I will not pay around 100k for an auto anymore. Quite simply GM is pricing themselves out of customers.
Wished my 2020 2500hd Silverado LTZ Diesel would tow without having electrical issues. 50k miles and STILL losing trailer connections and trailer brakes while towing "Randomly". GM states, "It's working as design". Back window leaking is, "Working as designed". Squeaky brakes, "Working as designed". I just love going down a 7% grade and randomly lose trailer brakes... They continue to want me to pay for the "evaluation" or "the research" of the problem. I already have and they can't figure out what the problem is. Texas dealership stated, "We can't figure it out so good luck on your remaining 3 hour trip". TSBs are listed but now the dealerships won't replace the parts that the TSB lists them to do. I truly believe they do NOT stand behind their vehicles.
Look for a crack in the rear window frame top abo e or clise to the sliding window. You will see droplets come from the crack. Common issue. Dealer got me a new rear window and used black sealant around the frame to prevent it in the future. Havent had any light or trailer brake issues...2020 ltz 2500hd at about 30k now but rear window issue at 20k.
The rumor that the tow info on the weight stickers aren't vin correct and that you have to use the app is incorrect. The app makes you enter the sticker values and only helps you make sure that your payloads and trailer weights are within limits. I've used the app on several trucks on various lots and have never gotten it to disagree with the sticker. I think you need to dig deeper on this.
I think what they're getting at is that it lists 20k max towing but if you calculate the GCWR vs GVWR, you get a different number (17900 in this case). They'd be better off just omitting the max towing weight (lower sticker). It would be difficult to get to near the 20k number with a real world payload on the truck.
@@madweazl I see it now thanks. It is true that listed towing capacities are generally unobtainium as you say BUT the upside is that under real world conditions the truck is thermally capable (essentially the SAE J2807 is a thermal test) of towing a properly loaded trailer up to the full rated pin weight.
@@TheHwig I don't know about all trailers but in the case of 5th wheel/gooseneck, you run out of payload way before you run out of "tow rating." Our 5th wheel weights 12.5k and the pin weight is 2560lbs which leaves us 1067lbs of available payload. That doesn't last long. 350lbs for me and the wife, 45 for the muts, 250 for a full tank of fuel, 85lbs for the gene, ice chest, misc tools in truck and you're at max payload but 7500lbs under max tow rating. Typical rule of thumb for pin weight on a 5er is 20% of the gross trailer weight (little higher for ours even).
