Funny thing about that scene was, she talked that bullshit to Bruce fuckin Banner of all people. And then in every situation it would have benefitted her to control her anger, she throws a made for TV bitch fit. I watched it with my daughters, but my God this was a fucking double decker nothing burger. And the special sauce was made from liquid bullshit...
We went from Spider-Man and “with great power comes great responsibility” To She-Hulk and “saving people are for narcissists, billionaires, and adult orphans” That, in itself, is a narcissistic statement
@@derrickdaniels3955 there are several in fiction. Bruce Wayne and Tony Stark are two notable examples. The “narcissists, billionaires, and adult orphans” was engineered to be a direct stab at Tony Stark. As is the fad nowadays in superhero movies: make fun of what came before
“Men are too masculine, that’s toxic” Proceeds to create female characters that are extremely masculine and present that as great strong women. Say what?!?
Executives: "We're going to empower women! Let's make our female character a hard-drinking tomboy who acts more like a man than an actual male character." Watcher: "That's not an empowered woman. That's a man in a woman's body. It's cringe." Executives:
My wife loved her. Was her favorites character (she HATED Sansa tho 😂😂) She would comment on how brave Arya was and that was because desperately not being the strongest, or the most badass she pushed forward and trained to become what she became. The look on my wife's face as Arya popped out of nowhere to save the day at the end was priceless... I even recorded her reaction
@@taylorelliott8824 there's an adage in storytelling that a hero is only as good as his villain, and the same is obviously true of heroines. But I'd like to add that a heroic figure is also only as good as their weaknesses. There can be no courage without fear. We cheered when the Millennium Falcon dropped cover fire for Luke on his attack run because Han Solo overcame his egocentric self serving nature to step up and be the hero. We cheered when Clark Kent laid out the bully truck driver because a moment of pettiness made an otherwise altruistic paragon of virtue and strength infinitely more relatable. I seem to hold the minority view here, but the selfishness of wanting her loved one so badly that she was willing to disregard the fact that a presumably innocent man would be stripped of his future in Wonder Woman 1984 made Diana seem far more human. Giving him up and sacrificing her own happiness to save others is what made her a heroine to be admired and celebrated.
Arya was great because she was writing as Arya, same as wonder women was. Most other strong female characters are written as great men & then adapted to be female, & any preexisting female character are played by a, LBTGQ or ethnic minority, rather than the best actress to suit them roles. I hate this woke era for destroying a lot of characters. & I can't understand why females or +++ can't write there own stories & characters. It would be nice to see some originality, there's enough remakes without adding a female version, some things just don't translate, can you imagine broke back mountain, the straight version hahaha
@@chrissearle6176 You make a very interesting point. These woketards seem to be all for race swapping, gender swapping, etc, but would even they think it was a good idea to make a Black Lightning film with Tom Cruise in the lead role? They'd probably be ok with seeing a woman play Black Panther, but not a white woman.
"Do you know how often I have to control my anger while men explain my field of expertise to me?" - as she loses her temper explaining Hulk's field of expertise to him
Why does the MCU universe respect Okoye? Not because she's a woman who demands we respect her. It's because she's a warrior who is loyal to her king and her friends and will fight to the death for them, and she's a woman.
Kevin Le I dropped the movie once she utter that line, "The Avengers is for billionaires, narcissistics, and war orphans." I know the Avengers are fictional heroes and people, but watching their characters progress and develop through every movie from "narcissistics, billionaires, and war orphans" into better people who help change the world to a better place kind of make me want to be like them (not the superhero abilities). In the end of the day, I may not be a superhero like Hulk, or Thor or Dr Strange, but at least, I can play my part as better human being to help people. Then, out of nowhere you have a movie like She-Hulk where you have a nobody character who is downright narcissistic and typical victim behaviour downplay those characters progression like as if their efforts in Avengers Endgame worth nothing at all.
Never forget: NOBODY had a problem with "Ellen Ripley" taking the lead in "Alien". And we're talking 1979, here. And then again in "Aliens" in 1986. She was badass, and everyone loved the character. Why? Because she wasn't there to make men look stupid and inept. She was surrounded by brave, competent characters, and fought bravely WITH them. "Ripley" is the character feminists need, but don't deserve.
As a woman what I find hilarious is that men have proven more capable of writing a strong female character more than these modern day female writers. All they do is insert their miserable lives into any and everything they “create.”
The joke has it that in order to write believable female characters the male writer takes a man and removes all reason and accountability. 😉 Seriously though, we now have a generation of writers with no life experience other then what they have learned in college AND that they have to adhere to THE RULES. As in no woman can be mentored by a man, lose to a man, be weaker then a man, be outsmarted by a man. When you lack life experience and are constrained by such stupid rules, your character building will be horrible.
Fun fact: one of the best comic book writers for decades was Chris Claremont, and he's best known for his legendary run on Uncanny X-Men, New Mutants, and lots of other stuff. He wrote truly unforgettable stories involving female heroes like Storm, Kitty 'Shadowcat' Pryde, Danielle Moonstar, Xi'an Coy Manh, Rhane Sinclair, Illyana Rasputin, Betsy Braddock...basically it's a DAMN long list! He knew how to give each of those ladies a distinctive voice, and I'm pretty sure his favorite was Kitty, who was basically your ordinary Jewish-American Midwestern girl next door who happened to have the power to phase through solid matter. Dammit, I miss the days when female heroes were written by people who had imagination!
there have been so many good female characters in movies in past, thats whats funny about them making bads ones then blaming us men for being sexist and not liking also She Hulk in comics was a good character.
the entertainment industry has just got so lost with what makes "strong female characters" "strong female characters". they're now stuck printing out invincible unstoppable girlbosses who overpower foes twice their size... none of these obnoxious girlboss characters will be remembered in 40 years like Ripley and Sarah Connor and Leia etc, those old great strong female characters weren't considered strong because they are unstoppable, but THE EXACT OPPOSITE. they went up against opponents far stronger than themselves but didn't back down, their strength was in their character and will to carry on, spitting in the face of terrible odds.
Honestly, facing foes far more powerful than themselves is what makes them awesome strong female characters. In the real world, many of the opponents women face (at least physically) are men, who are far stronger than women so we have to find other ways to beat them other than brute strength. These characters have to be resourceful and can’t punch their way through the problem which is what makes their victories so impactful and inspiring, and what makes them role models for so many women
oh most movies always have been but they did it subtly and entertainingly to make you agree more, today its more like HEY FUCKING AGREE WITH ME written in the script 3000 times
i have a mix thought about it though like shang chi movie lead character ran away from being an assassin for his dad. he knew about his dad's power about ten rings. he avoided his past life to be a valet just to live simple life. one thing led to another and he had to seek his mother's tribe in forest i can't make a judgement for she-hulk yet until the series is ended.
"Is there anything more depressing than dating in your 30s?" Watching all your friends die. Having several near death experiences. Slowly dying of poison. Being turned into a weapon. Seeing your home get destroyed. Witnessing your brother getting strangled to death. Watching your husband sacrifice himself. Your family getting torn apart.
Doctor who: your society is just early English aristocrats, you rin away from your home planet, your absolute best friend of all time becomes insane and hates you now, you commit genocide in order to save the universe, you are now alone in the universe, your female romantic interest gets trapped in another dimension, you have to wipe ur friends memory or she dies, you forced a woman to commit suicide because you became crazy with power, your own ppl trappes you in a torture chamber for 4.5 BILLION years... And the list keeps going and going
there's nothing depressing about dating in your 30s., 40s, 50s etc. why is this an issue to some people? This is just petty. Just like some of these lame movie plots where the mc kept bombarding us with woke ideology.
The problem actually IS that women don't have any strong female characters in movies anymore; instead they have perfect, infallible characters, that they cannot relate to. Characters whose only fault is that they have an ego-driven hatred of men, which they pretend is a redeeming quality
Hulk: - Experimented on as a child - His father killed his mother - Turned into a monster against his will - Is a man - Captured by the government - Experimented on by the government - Involuntarily killed lot's of people without wanting to - Lived in hiding from the government for multiple years in a third-world country separated from his loved ones - Love of his life died - Unable to commit suicide because the monster within him prevents it - Got stuck on an alien planet for years - Got controlled by the monster within him while on that planet - Pressured to save the world multiple times the list goes on... She-Hulk: - Is a woman - Gets catcalled by men "I have so much more experience controlling my anger infinitely better than you!" edit 3 :if you watched the show, you will see that she is ready to kill anyone for simple reasons... she almost killed some dudes that catcalled her or 'insulted her'...
And what happened before she was able to control her anger so well? where are the hundreds of dead construction workers she inadvertently killed and carries immense guilt because of if? oh wait, she's perfect, I forgot.
I vote for a female hero who does hero things: struggles against difficulty, deals with losses and setbacks, learns and evolves, and who has the strength of character to do what needs to be done, while dealing with it all as a woman- which is NOT the same as a man. Men would find her intriguing, and women, hopefully, inspiring. I always felt that Sarah Connor's descent into near-madness and violent behavior was believable as her intent to protect her son at all costs, as a mother naturally would. The biceps were only a plus.
I recall appreciating the 2015 Tomb Raider video game reboot for this reason. They had Lara Croft show some genuine vulnerability - self-doubt, father hunger, fear for her life, etc. I usually can't relate to female action characters because they're all like "Me Stronk Wahman!", but that depiction of Lara Croft was something to which I could relate.
Watch prey. The new predator it's like anti woke, the lead female character couldn't even hunt animals but when she started putting herself and her brother and dog at the same level. Instead of rising above them she rose to their same level then once she realized it her and her dog tore the predator apart. The female had like 'woke' tendencies but when they dropped those values she exploded in capabilities.
It's may be exciting to watch how real-life stereotypes be challenged. Watching some stereotypes fight other stereotypes is some kind of trash movie. Except in satire, it's a waste of time.
I wouldn't say they managed to replace them yet. They have straight up made themselves look incompetent, as well as their attempted female leads. If anything, they have alienated all but the small minded writers/directors/whatever that engage in "woke" ideology. When the trailers just ooze cringe far before the release of a movie, I'd say the female leads haven't replaced shit. Thank fuck for that.
Of course. There's a reason it's called show business. It's designed to make money. It's why they had such strict rules on what content movies & TV could have for decades, which have now been replaced with new patterns. It's why they lean left on most political issues and still make lots of movies about guns (which they euphemistically call "action movies" when they're really revenge fantasies) despite several studies showing they're a factor in mass shootings. Like social media, show business exists for only one reason, M O N E Y, as in "show me the." And like the gun manufacturers, none of them care about their markets except what they can get out of them.
The biggest issue with the Mulan remake was that it completely missed the point of the original story. The thing that made Mulans story empowering was that she was just a normal woman that accompanied incredible things. If you make her a chosen one. That means she only accompanied those things because she is unique.
I like the first Disney Mulan. Despite it centering on prejudice, identity issues and status quo, it doesn't hammer us down with absolute morality and still manages to give us a strong lead character, one that feels earned and not by sacrificing what makes a good character and also without sacrificing the dominantly male side characters, for the most part, although I do appreciate how their problems with her mostly stems from her deceiving them and never discredited her for turning out to be a woman. There's only one guy, but he's a jerk to everyone and an emperor bootlicker anyways
@@azrik6084 everyone in my family loved it, especially my mom and my sis. They'd spend evenings singing Reflection and Mom even had it as a ringtone once upon a time. She was quite disappointed with the remake, saying that Mulan was too perfect there (I think).
@@azrik6084 Oh I meant the first Disney one, to clarify. There are only two versions of Mulan that I watched. The animated Disney one... and that version in Chinese that focuses more on the traumatic effects of war and death Never watched the remake myself. Considering the direction the live action remakes are going, I honestly don't see myself going to. The Aladdin one is uh... ehm, kinda sorta decent I guess.
Thank you for an excellent article, great to see a woman setting the record straight on issues that men are becoming increasingly uncomfortable about addressing, thanks to this insanity in Hollywood and Disney.
My problem with these is that they go out of their way to make all men look creepy and with no redeeming qualities. Tearing others down to make yourself look good is the laziest way to promote yourself. It's possible to be a strong woman without hating men.
Having 'free' powers instead of earning them the hard way, wanting priviledges without any sacrifice, irrational hatreds about superficial traits, treating everything that doesn't go their ways as micro-aggressions, doesn't take any responsabilities... That's the exact definition of a classic super-vilain... But they are actually role models. Crazy days huh.
Shout out to the fact that She Hulk bragged about being able to keep her emotions in check while getting cat called, after previously showing her lose her shit just 10 minutes earlier over getting cat called.
You nail it. I love the Hollywood elite who think no strong woman ever made a movie before. They clearly never watch Kathrine Hepburn, Mae West, Audrey Hepburn, or Lauren Bacall in a movie. There have been strong women characters in film throughout history. The difference is those characters were the result of talented writers who could flush out the characters strength not the hacks writing in Hollywood today.
But that is the core tenet belief of the Left now. When we have full diversity and inclusion everything will become magically better. Just like when we have true communism. This time it will work! Also, now it's just diversity and inclusion in writing. What if they start pushing for diversity and inclusion in hiring airline pilots, or brain surgeons?
It's so funny cause there are examples of good writing that includes gay people, and good writing that includes feminist themes. But MODERN HOLLYWOOD has no idea how to do it.
Oh the press secretary doesn't type those notes she just reads them. But yea she was hired based on the fact that she has a vagina, is black and gay. So if I am those things can I get the job as press secretary for the white house too??
Re: the 2017 Wonder Woman: When asked about making a "great female superhero movie" Director Patty Jenkins said something along the lines of "We didn't set out to make a great female superhero movie, we set out to make a great superhero movie where the lead happened to be female."
@@kingp1n817 Wonder Woman being super fine is cannon though? She's supposed to be the ultimate female,smart,hot,strong,etc. So I don't understand your complaint here,care to elaborate?
But 2nd movie undone all good that was done in first movie, i mean who wants fight naked cat lady who not even Catwoman, Steve why do you can't stay alive for 30 min - dying each time before sex scene... no happy end for love birds.
I’m addition to the other great female leads mentioned, I would add that Jodie Foster was incredible in Silence of the Lambs and Contact. Rewatched these recently and I was really blown away at how really great she was.
@@WilliamLyons-ym7eeFoster and Hopkins had amazing chemistry together. And her character development through Silence was flawlessly executed. When we are first introduced to Clarice Starling, she’s naive; inexperienced and dealing with childhood traumas, but by the finale, she finds Buffalo Bill’s hideout and takes him down all by herself. That alone is a badass female right there.
They seriously give her the tag line, "Saving the world is for narcissists," and she refuses to be a superhero because she's pursuing narcissistic goals like dating and a career.... WELL DONE!
I would expect this level of cringe and overdrama from Indian TV serials, not from marvel who has produced like the most successful franchise of all time. Complete 💩
The insane irony we see when she talks about how incompetent men explain her areas of expertise while she incompetently explains Banner's area of expertise to him.
Just my take on character development. The point of a story is to show people an example of an imperfect human who manages to achieve a goal regardless of the inherent weaknesses of that human. Traditionally, this has been men in these rolls. So they are relatable to men who grow being told that they must achieve success in order to be considered a valuable contributor to society. Even though the story has the hero (in this case) taking on some Herculean challenge, men can relate to the man because we all have our own challenges in life and like the hero we have to improve ourselves in order to accomplish the task. But the women being portrayed in these movies are self inserts of the female driven writing team. They are too focused on themselves. Their lives are full of conflict because they are angry about everything. Take She Hulk for example. She doesn't want to save the world. Wants nothing to do with it. Yet is angry that her position in life has her answering to men in her professional world. Her lack of responsibility keeps her from seeking positions of authority within a business. She wants the job title but not the responsibility.
One of the most striking contradictions of feminism is how hard it criticise that so-called "toxic masculinity" and then go to the extreme to portray female action characters that have EXACTLY all those toxic traits they supposedly hate so much.
Kinda gives you a little peak inside their thought process though: Since they perceive men as dominating and irritatingly aggressive, and women to be the victims of it, the only way (in their mind) for a woman to NOT be a victim is by becoming one of the victimizers. Its a really black and white world view, which is ironically promoted by people who want to be inclusive^^.
It's not difficult to see that contradiction in neo-feminists: they loathe men yet want to be like them, or better to say, they'd love to have all of the so-called 'priveleges' men have...and they even go to the extreme of jumping at the chance to invite biological men who identify as women but clearly aren't (cough, Lia Thomas, cough) into the sisterhood. It's like they basically want to break the ideal of femininity.
This woman is so spot on! Its almost infuriating because I could never put her points in words as perfectly as she does here. Well said and I love the light hearted delivery and humor she adds which make it fun watching as well as just listening. Doesn’t hurt that she is also beautiful and clearly intelligent. Kudos and hope to hear/see more!
I feel like many strong female characters are just written as Gaston. Strong, arrogant, conpletely unaware of how they negatively impact those around them, condescending, petty and generally bullies. So they write female leads effectively as bland generic villians and wonder why people dont like the character
I find it even more funny that those characteristics are recognized as bullies on a female but regarded as charismatic in a man. "Strong, arrogant, unaware of the negative impact around them, condescending and petty". Pretty much described Ironman.
@Slla-th5vt literally the entire reason Tony stark became iron man was he realized the negative impact he was causing. And after that he was no less charismatic. You literally just took 4 character traits and a state of being then crammed them together and said this is another character trait. And you still managed to miss what charisma is. The most charismatic people either care about others or atleast make people think they do, if they came off as arrogant Condescending or petty they wouldn't be charismatic. But nice projection there bud.
@@Patson20 really. I didn't see Tony Stark being any more responsible until Civil War. But he is such a favourite since his first solo movie. Want to count how many movies until he grow some empathy and conscience? Also, same thing with the Star Lord. Arrogant and condescending and petty. Yet audiences love his weepy daddy and girlfriend issues.
I just want to take a moment to appreciate Scarlett Johanson and The Black Widow. Here is a character with real depth, whos abilities come from a lifetime of forced training, who has really messed up baggage, and who sacrifices herself in the end... played by a woman who actually said that her job was to act, not promote politics.
I always felt releasing Captain Marvel before the Black Widow movie was the end of Marvel for me... Pushing bullshit instead of giving one of their best characters a stand alone before they died on screen said everything I needed to know
its never good enough for those people though. I remember when her backstory/movie got fully announced, people started throwing a fit that this was "yet another woman whos backstory was sexual/emotional trauma" like she wasnt a trained killer and hadnt said so herself in the films... everythings a stereotype and nothings good enough for the people who constantly complain
Right, at least for most of the first phase of the MCU they stay true to the spirit of who Black widow is. I think they kind of screwed up her legacy a bit with that extremely late movie of hers. But I digress..
@@rainestar82 although I would not agree with those people's assessment... It's completely UNDERSTANDABLE that at the time they thought it would turn out terrible and were shell-shocked from all the wokie political feminist push crap that came our way over the last decade
Who was then ruined in a prequel movie that forgot who her character was or what her powers and abilites were. Made her play second fiddle to an EVEN MOAR POWERFUL version of the same character. Played by a woman who went out and made a bunch of dense fucking political statements to promote said movie.
George R R Martin always comes to mind in cases like these. An interviewer once asked him how he can write such well-developed and complex female characters, and he answered 'well, I tend to think of women as... well, people' When characters are believable as people and they aren't just a cardboard cutout of an ideology then they work.
Right? He has all manner of compelling, powerful female characters playing out, each with their own particular strengths and weaknesses. Some excel in soft power and 'feminine' spheres, some take on more stereotypically 'masculine' roles, but no matter what they each have an important place in the plot and are rather compelling for their own reasons. It irks me so MUCH when Hollywood decides women aren't allowed to have flaws.
It was such a heartbreaking moment when Banner said in Avengers "I know, I tried. I got low, didn't see an end. So I put a bullet in my mouth." It shows how much Bruce has struggled his whole life.
In the 1960s there was a British TV series called "The Avengers", starring a pair of secret agents. The man was Steed, who were a suit and bowler hat, and was the archetypical English gentleman. The other was Emma Peel, who could handle a gun like the best of them, and was certainly someone you'd want to have around when you were in a tight fix - but she was also very feminine. A woman doesn't have to be masculine to be "strong".
Emma Peel was Steed's 3rd partner. Cathy Gale, played by Honor Blackman, had been his second partner, and she was just as much of a badass and fashion icon as Emma was. I'm old :(
especially not when guns are involved. Sure in hand to hand combat most women have a severe disadvantage to men but introducing weapons the playing field gets leveled. And certainly at the point where firearms (or "superpowers") are involved even children can become lethal.
it bugs me so much that Jen constantly has to say "I've had it worse" when Bruce was genuinely trying to help her and offer advice as somebody who has been through similar situations. but Jen has to stroke her ego constantly and be like yeh my genes are better and you men don't understand. even the end credits are weird too. why do you have to rub it in our faces that Jen is "stronger than the dudes"? she can be strong without being compared to men. and frankly in the show, there aren't many assholes who are showing shit behaviors to Jen simply become she's a woman. This is just wokeass victim mentality that we do not need.
I may not be a psychologist, but I would assume someone who says stuff like "I have it worse" or anything else that devalues someone else experience (Even if put in a way that sounds like they aren't i.e. "It isn't like I am saying you are wrong, but.....") is known as a toxic person.
@@POIUYTREWQ62 you could also say that they're annoying to be around. toxic or not, nobody likes someone who constantly 'one-ups' everyone else. She-hulk's just not a likable character for any normal person, male or female.
It is a natural outgrowth of applying THE RULES (ominous Critical Drinker voice) to writing Jen's character. And the rules, as formulated by the woke Roddenberry foundation, state when you write a female character no man can mentor a woman, no man can be stronger then a woman, no man can defeat a woman, no man can outsmart a woman, and another one I can't remember. Constrained by such rules that's how you get female characters like Jen. Or when you have a story where you have a male hero vs a female villain, you know she's going to defeat herself. (cough Dr. Strange 2, Star Wars Kenobi, cough). Woke story telling is horrible and predictable.
Thank you. Just thank you. From the bottom of my heart, as someone who has been looking forward to seeing good live action versions of all these various characters, it's been hard to watch all this bad writing seemingly forced into existence ruining great stories that are getting their one shot to be done properly. Couldn't have said it any better than what you've put together here.
The thing about this scene is, since it’s scripted (duh) Hulk has to sit there and make compassionate faces instead of standing up and saying „what the actual fuck? Did you not like, listen to half of what i was saying?”
No she is not better in controlling anger, She is better controlling Hulk. Once Hulk is out, Bruce can't bind him @RedGeraniumWolf just like the scene you mentioned In Avengers, When Tony meet Bruce, Tony poke Bruce with something to check other guy comes out or not and this seen show how much he have control over his emotions.
Agree with you 500% !!!!!! and as a mom of a 10 year old son it makes sad for the way men are being portrayed. As a family we tend to watch movies from previous decades since they are far better in all aspects. Woke and feminist Hollywood have ruined television and movies. It’s like the Peppa Pig vs Bluey debate. Bluey is fantastic and loved around the world by parents and children as it represents both parents beautifully without putting the other down. If you haven’t seen Bluey as a kids cartoon-do!
Agreed, instead of making strong women narcissistic, Caitlyn is both strong and very sweet to both Piltover and Zaun, and Vi, while toughened by going through hell, still has moments of kindness and vulnerability, where she can open up to others about herself.❤💙 Oil and water work well together!❤
There's one thing really bother me when it comes to "strong independent women" in Western media, they almost always involve over-competence, belittling men, or sexually irresponsible
You _do_ realize that the entire concept of a "strong independent woman" is reality-denying garbage designed to subvert and destroy traditional society? Why in the world is a woman supposed to be independent? Because that means she doesn't want a husband or children. These ideologies go all the way back to the atheist/nihilist communists of the 1800s. The history exists for anyone who wishes to find out what's going on and how we ended up here.
I grew up watching the 90's cartoon version of she hulk and that was heads over heels better then the more modern version. And don't get me started on Catwoman.
Sarah connor the original actor was great i loved her she was strong bad ass protected her son her son had her back, when he realised she wasnt lying about the terminators being real of course and they both worked together the love for her dead husband was beautiful she still imagined him guiding her steps the whole way telling her shes a solider keep going i loved terminator 2
imagine explaining anger management to the fucking hulk lmao imagine explaining emotional balance to a guy who had insanely tragic familty life with his own father experimenting on him and he cant get angry about becuase it turns him into a fucking monster and comparing that to getting cat called in a street
@@nil981 They are, but the way those hollywood wastes made it is akin to vegetarians constantly reminding you that they're vegetarians and how much better they are than you, but instead of being veggie they're women. It's so... Forced down your throat for seemingly no reason. Ripley in Alien still is one of my favorite female characters, and her gender is barely ever brought up.
You other commenters don't understand what Matthew is saying, do ya? He's that women are already strong, and that contemporary storytellers, regardless of gender, are sucking.
Unfortunately the gatekeepers won't allow better stories to be told. They're currently riding the woke wave, for fear of being "cancelled". Eventually, they'll lose so much money that they'll be forced back into making what people actually want to watch.
A reminder about Bruce Banner, in the first movie, he admits to trying to kill himself and being unable to because of the other guy. I want you to imagine hitting a point where you want to kill yourself and discovering that you physically can’t. That sounds like hell.
Thats the thing that really hits my gut. I'm a women. I can see and feel the problems a woman goes through. But Bruce Banner. THE. HULK. Who spend 15 years of his life IN FEAR. In fear of killing the ones he loved, of being called a monster. And tbh, have depression BECAUSE of the loneliness he had to deal with as he hid. Not because he's a coward, but because he can't control Hulk! Oh but She-hulk? Oh yes you get bullied at work cause you're a woman yes that sure you can handle in just one day she knows Waaaay more than Bruce (yeah that last bit is sarcasm) Edit: Yeah i fixed Bruce Banner. My keyboard apparently wanted to take brunch
One of the things that really bothered me about the female Ghostbusters was that the male counter part to the secretary was wildly incompetent. Jenine from the original group was never incompetent. She was part of the team. Chris' character just made men look like baffoons.
And they learned that when you make a political battle out of it instead of incorporating it into your story, your product will fail. And then someone will come along a few years later and make a better version of your story, with a twelve year old girl that’s a stronger, more compelling female lead than all four of your leads combined.
Yep the substitution also showed another problem with the movie on a comedy level. For a joke to work you often a straight man to bounce off weirdness. Jeanine and Winston both filled this role in the original movie.
If I recall correctly, She-Hulk is written in the comics as a (occasionally) 4th wall breaking character struggling to juggle her professions as a lawyer and as a super-hero(ine?) plus her personal life. What's with this decision to make Jen not wanna be a hero? Also, Ruby Rose's Batwoman was very cringe.
Not all super powered characters want to be heros or villains. There are plenty of both male and female super characters in comics that are trying to do normal lives.
You recall wrong, she breaks the 4th wall to speed up the story, to rip holes through pages to reach the page she wants to get to, she prompts issue skips for when she's getting beaten by the bad guys, she used the 4th wall to gain an advantage. She broke the 4th wall decades before Deadpool. Also, she didn't want to be a hero in the comics at first either. She hulk is very close to the source material ... written by Stan Lee...
You've nailed it. I'll never understand why success for Hollywood is a woman acting like a man while simultaneously disparaging a man who is acting feminine... There are too many layers of irony for me to even verbalize it properly.
Kill Bill was full of women who kick ass, but it also showed the main character the Bride getting beat at times like getting shot in face, getting almost killed by Gogo the teenage bodyguard , getting shot again then buried. She wasn't always the winner, she was weak at times, she was more human. I miss that type of strong female character.
Exactly. Her strongest trait was her perseverance. Her ability to get up when kicked down when most would just stay down. She doesn’t win because she’s some unstoppable force of nature. She wins because she doesn’t give up. THAT’S a lesson that everyone (not just women) can take away from those masterpieces.
Exactly I loved the Kill Bill series and the women in that were strong characters but they were not trying to shove some ideology down our throats and the movies were actually entertaining.
I remember a simpler time when characters could teach us lessons through the hardships and flaws to overcome, while being likable and relatable. Make us feel good and inspired. And vice versa, where hard lessons left us questioning life and ourselves without feeling like shit.
Mrs Frisby/Brisby is one of the best female leads. She is just a normal mouse trying to do normal mouse things. She isn't strong, she isn't smart, she isn't fearless, and she isn't powerful. In spite of all that, she still forges ahead because he son needs her. And we love her BECAUSE of her flaws. People love an underdog story where the weak hero overcomes the odds and wins.
It's overrun by toxic, abusive feminists. I just assumed all women were abusive since my mom was so abusive. Fortunately I found my own way in life and realized that I was incorrect. However, the damage was done by my mother, sadly. Luckily I have an amazing partner now. Still haven't talked to my abusive mom in over 5 years. We need more atrng male role models. They don't exist for young men any longer.
I (a woman) personally lean more towards male lead movies because they're usually better written, since they're focusing on an actual storyline than SJWness. I'm not even going to bother with She Hulk because Disney now days is incapable of puking out anything good anymore. The older stuff with female leads, as you said, were WAY better. I miss the good ol days when movies were written for good stories and not woke BS. P.S Die Hard is the best Christmas movie ever.
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Disney is where good stories go to die. Big massive corporations cannot do good story telling even when they try. When managers take over creatives have to either learn to play the internal politics game or leave for better pastures.
Legally blonde is a great example of correct female lead writing, Elle breaks the "Dumb blonde" trope, she's kind and compassionate and feminine but she's also snarky and smart and motivated and self empowered, while not needing to tear down men on the way. She does her own thing and empowers other women
In addition, she actually goes through the hero's journey and has to grow as a character, changing from somebody who just wanted to follow her boyfriend to Harvard law school to someone who buckles down, studies relentlessly, and becomes more capable in the process!
But then Legally Blonde, she is pretty much happy to be an airhead bimbo until she becomes the woman scorned. It is pretty much saying women won't make an effort to improve themselves unless it is for a man.
*"Really makes you think."* I hope it _does_ make people think. For those who already understand what so-called "feminism" actually is and always has been, it is not at all surprising.
Male Superheroes: Enemy is bad and twisted opponent Female Superheroes: Enemy is society and toxic men 🤣🤣 When u think a character is great just coz main lead is female instead of making a great character who happens to be female, this happens.
@@Changed.User100 I dont think they are trying to make anyone like anything as viewers were never their concern. All they want is to project their bitter mindset and maybe find few followers on the way
I had my wife watched the first episode of She-Hulk to make sure I wasn't just out of touch or something. She said the episode just made her angry and annoyed. She didn't like how narcissistic Jennifer is, nor how she automatically makes herself a victim at all times. She even picked up on how she bested Hulk at all the challenges. This trend in film and TV has ultimately just frustrated her. It doesn't truly represent a female experience and she's never liked the idea of women automatically seeing themselves as victims before anything has happened, or taking an absolutist approach to negative viewpoints on men.
She actually didn't beat him at anything except the yoga pose thing, if you watch closely you'll see he was very clearly holding back. She was overcompensating, and trying to prove a point
"My real plea is for men to have enough empathy to watch movies starring women." I pay for and watch movies for my entertainment, not out of pity, nor will rich Hollywood people guilt trip me to do it. What a sales pitch, really! "My product sucks, but please have empathy and buy it anyway." 🤦♂️
"I hate oppressive men like you, but if you don't want to be oppressive, watch my movie anyway." Does that rank as childish narcissism or maybe cognitive dissonance to send a message so brain damaged?
It’s kinda like what the Democrats are doing, I know you are seeing articles and movies everywhere putting down white straight men, but vote for us anyway please…
Oh man I saw these trailers and couldnt believe what I was hearing/seeing. Every women lead character was so toxic and ironically in the exact way woke-Feminists characterise as "masculine". It's like hollywood is doing an excessive parody on the exact ideology they have adopted. And the most depressing thing is that so many leftists JUST EAT IT UP LIKE PUDDING. Leftists should be the most offended by these movies, since they slander their ideology.
its the same in real life though lol I've met 1,000s of women over the past decade who mimic all the toxic behaviors of the men that hurt or abused them in some way in the past... this is the way of empowerment? To become like men?
I honestly enjoyed the first Wonder Woman movie, with Gal Gadot in it. I love the scene where her boyfriend said "You did it!" and she said "No... We did it!" Men & women working together as a team... no political BS. Each character playing to their personal strengths in that movie. Just like in Man of Steel.
That's exactly how good characters should be written, but if you ask marvel, the first step to make women strong is to make men weak. Goes on to show how good of a writer you are.
Disney Channel & Disney+ must share the same writers as Marvel lately. It just seems like they're on some sort of toxic-feminist kick or something. I love intelligently written, strong, and/or very smart female characters & male characters... instead of politically driven nonsense.
Exactly. I love watching men and women characters, actually work there way into becoming amazing and powerful. It's kinda boring when they already have it all together and are powerful just because. Good character development makes all the difference to me. Then, I actually start to care what happens to them.
That has little to do with anything. For one thing, the entire HISTORY of cinema has been to make men seem strong by making women seem weak. Thats the whole damsel in distress thing thats been in about 75% of ALL movies. Women 'need to be saved'. When its reversed in a FEW cases then suddenly people lose their shit and its oh my god this is politics. The entire HISTORY of cinema is political. People liked the first wonder woman because she was properly girly and deferential to a human male who was a million times weaker, but who still saves at the end. The MAIN difference with Captain Marvel and other Marvel heroes is that the story was plot driven, not character driven. If you took out maybe four scenes and replaced them with a man, the character would be identical. It was obviously a corporate choice not to spend three quarters of the movie leading up to her powers, oh wait, they DID do that. People have no trouble accepting Superman or Black Adam as just inherently strong, but when CM came along SOME poeple lost it, it still made more money than most marvel movies after it.
Cruella its a good example of a strong female character... Her character its about to be the BEST designer and NOT the best WOMAN designer. Female and male characters are great when they are well written, not because they belong to certain a group of people... If thats their only trait, then they have no trait.
My mother was a journalist, my Aunt taught law, in brief, many of the woman in my family were well educated and strong. Yet, not a single one would have signed on to one bit to this woke tripe.
That's because the women in your family are... well actual women; not the indoctrinated, prissy princesses who are classed as adults merely by their reaching the age of adulthood in body, yet slacking in mind.
@@fleurwebber2206 if ur strong, u can prove it, and shut those ppl up, his point still stands, everyone gets belittled, u think successful ppl had it easy? U think they dint have ppl telling them to give up, and that their efforts are futile, that they will never accomplish anything? Please, being belittled is nothing special, everyone have gone thru that, literally everyone
@@itslikemagic3932 yes i agree but people are belittled for different things, all the media bias in films, music, jokes etc about women, you don’t think that’s affected women’s self esteem, their confidence? ofc a lot of women are going to want to ‘prove’ themselves that they can be strong, when they’re entire life they’ve been told they haven’t.
@@fleurwebber2206 still, ur saying things everyone goes thru, jokes, bullying etc etc, why do u think male suicide rates are so much higher, more males suffer from depression, males are told to be strong and provide so on and so forth. my point is the the problems ur saying women face are the same problems everyone face. Facts of the matter is, society shld stop including gender into everything, the strong makes it up to the top, men or women. Infact, women as a whole rn have more rights and privilege than portrayed, the feminist movement worked, but no one is able to accept that. Im not saying all, but most of the feminists i see arent even fighting for equality anymore, they are fighting for supremacy
@@itslikemagic3932 i understand your point and i do agree to an extent, but the difference is women are degraded FOR being women. that’s the difference. when women are told that men are better, it might not always be said that directly but it is often subtle in many things like i said, films, songs, jokes, language etc. hence why now modern feminism tries to uplift women (i don’t agree with making it out as though women are better tho). women have been degraded for so long for being females that it’s really no surprise that women are reacting this way.
If you're making men weak or useless to make your women look stronger, you're doing it wrong. You don't bring down a group to make the other better. You can make your men and women equally as capable and still make a strong female lead character. You can totally go down the brains vs bronze route and have a story of a woman having to outsmart male combatants and that can make a very interesting story - but then you can't make her physically stronger, and you can't make the men so stupid that it's unbelievable. This is basic storytelling 101, idk why I have to say this towards Hollywood script writers (I mean I obviously know the answer, but you know what I mean-)
"Being gay and female doesn't cancel terrible writing" So many production houses need this on a big banner above the door so their writers see it everyday on the way into work.
Cool reply... I was just thinking to myself, like @strawberrylotlizard referenced, about the strong women I have known (cougars were still the stuff of zoo's and the great outdoors but that was generally the gig). Unmoveable, but not unmoved. A place of calm. And indeed, a place that fosters reflection. Men and women need to beat this crap, we have much to offer to one another in many ways and combinations.
Automatically fearless or stronger, when writers make female characters 😢! But yeh like he said ! Black widow is better than any characters nowadays we get ! She has fear ! She conquered it to overcome,and that’s the strong female character ❤
Agree. I've thought for a long time that Black Widow is the strongest female character in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. She is the only Marvel female who knows how to just be heroic, while still being open and vulnerable as a character. She is the glue for the team, and doesn't have petty fights and comments as her focus. Being a strong woman is about being a strong person that steps up to do what is necessary, is brave enough to remain vulnerable, and just happens to be female. Most of the others seem to have identity agendas as their focus, and substitute "power" for strength. Arguably black widow has the least power, but the most strength as a person and character. While, Captain Marvel has the most power but is a weak person. She's narcissistic, showboating, and flippant, and constantly trying to prove why she's better than others. Those are all signs of weak character and self confidence issues... Not the definition of a strong person. She is not a strong roll model, and it's sad she is being marketed as such.
@@Halicet your description for cap.marvel is everything ! Can’t deny anything! Facts! In endgame, black widow character development is really sad thing . The more u think about her , the sadder u get. She just wanted her family back .But the only way she could get those,is she needed to sacrifice her life ! If not, there’s only 5 stones and couldn’t undo what thanos has done
She-Hulk: "I have to deal with anger infinitely more because I get attention for how good I look" Hulk: "I put a bullet in my mouth but the other guy spat it out, I was defeates by a mad titan, lost my love interest, then brought back every single person affected by the snap, but I couldn't bring her back"
Let me tell you something, I'm latina and I grew up watching soap operas with my parents, and if you know anything about those shows, you know that the protagonist is always female. I never heard my dad, uncles or grandpas complaining because the protagonist was a woman, indeed, they rooted for her. Those protagonists were relatable to latinas, and that's why we like them.
Same here around SEA. The story usually revolves around the life of a female lead discovering her "soulmate" and/or reaching her dreams. Even Korean Dramas and anime (usu. shojo anime) have likeable female leads with really interesting stories. :)
Because most Latinas are crazy I know because family members and past relationships all watch telenovelas and it promotes the crying, manipulative, crazy but beautiful woman concept and they always faint just because and scream at everyone.
I was so pissed at She-Hulk saying she was better at controlling her emotions than Bruce. Bruce saw no out from being Hulk, causing him to talk to BW about him attempting suicide in the movie. "I put a bullet in my mouth and the other guy spit it out." But hey, a cat call is infinitely worse than that. Seriously, the lack of empathy the writers of She-Hulk for men's battle with mental health and higher suicide rate is insane.
@aadd2935 she did invalidate his pain, the trauma I was referring to was his suicidal attempts because he saw himself and the hulk as a monter, he saw no way out of his predicament and attemped to kill himself, I was not referring nor was hulk referring to his time as an avenger. The fact that you injected your political views into this is sad and pathetic.
Also, 'i have to control my emotions everyday or i will literally get murdered' what??? When has any woman died because she was emotional and not the perp???
@aadd2935 you have said right wing in both of your comments, and yet you can't see where you brought politics into it? She-Hulk had terrible writers and was nothing more than wasted potential.
As a woman who has been packing my own grocery bag for 30 years, I always listen to my grocer when he advises me because he literally does it 10 hours a day and also for 30 years. You can always learn something. When he does it I let him because I won't get home with broken yoghurts. And the teenage eye roller, well I bet she NEVER packed a grocery bag.
Conversely, _sometimes_ -albeit rarely- people with a lot of experience still sometimes are wrong about things related to what they regularly do. So they shouldn't be trusted as an infallible source, just generally relied upon compared to what you might think yourself. On the issue of grocery packing specifically, while there are certainly optimal ways of packing, I'd assert that most of it doesn't really matter if you're careful with your bags. For instance nothing on top of eggs is going to crush them, and eggs aren't going to crack unless they're dropped a considerable distance from a high enough height onto a hard surface (and in a backpack for instance, dropping simply cannot happen, making eggs-at-the-bottom very viable)
That's something about society today that irks me. Hardly anyone accepts helpful tips or constructive criticism, everyone thinks that they are masters, like she hulk thought she was, and that no one else's input could possibly help. We are ALWAYS learning and nothing will ever change that. We grow when we receive feedback, otherwise we'll be stuck with the limited knowledge/mindset that we currently possess.
As a man, I recommend that you don't put all your eggs in one basket. Hmmm...I don't know if that phrase has anything to do with groceries. Okay...where'd the "delete comment" button again?
Exactly. If someone offers me advice and I already know what they're telling me, sometimes I'll say "yes, thank you, I know" and brush them off. Sometimes I'll listen because maybe the first thing they say is something I already know, but if I let them continue they'll go on to tell me things that I don't know. And in any case, I have never gotten angry and snarky with someone because they told me something I already know. That would be pointlessly rude. How do they know what I do and don't know? They're trying to help. Why get nasty about it? Even if I don't need their help.
Exactly!!! and SHE-HULK is a very good example of this failure of feminist rn in Hollywood, they need more time and a good script instead of forcing it!
Nothing says "strong character" like needing to emasculate everything else in a 10 mile radius. "Back in the day," strong characters - male and female - were surrounded by other strong figures who all reverberated off of one another - it was a positive feedback loop that showcased their strengths - and one rose to the top in the end. The clowns of woketown think they can achieve the same "victory" spectacle by injecting a forced superficial power disparity. Unsurprising, coming from a crowd that only ever concerns themselves with the ends and not the means, and completely loses the plot.
Imagine Indiana Jones explaining why he became an archaeologist adventurer "women treat me like a doormat, friendzone me, cheat on me". The whole victim narrative weakens the main character, massively reducing the connection. I think people intrinsically like those who rise above the struggle, not wallow in it.
The animated Mulan was a great character because she had many flaws, she didn't fit as a typical female and neither she could be a true man because that's not her! She had little chance to succeed in warfare but she didn't care as long as she succeed in saving her father! She becomes stronger by being herself, embracing her strength: she is smart, creative, she is persistent, brave and seeing she doesn't need to be the perfect daughter society says she must be and also embracing the fact that she is not a man makes her having to rely on herself and finding her best self! And that is powerful! She isn't special, she isn't the best choice for the job, but she will do her best at that job and in the end, she succeeds because she was being herself!Working hard, being smart and creative. The message was simple and powerful: you don't need to be special, you don't even have to be like others to be great, you can be great being your best self, and being your best self is enough! And then 2020 Mulan came in and was like "yeah, if you weren't born special, you will never be anything. Screw hard work" 😒
In the animation it was never about being the best warrior, but about ingenuity, about using your head, about putting to use her past and knowledge about being a woman to accomplish things that 'typical manly' methods wouldn't do, and about being brave in duty and what you consider important. Mulan in the animation continuisly puts herself in danger for the sake of others, and she doesn't have superpowers the strength of ten men to bail her out. Never saw the live action, but what they told me of it made me not want to even if paid.
Ideological movie = propaganda. Not so long ago it was widely understood that propaganda is the the worst kind of art. Even worse than hard core pornography.
"Saving people are for narcissists, billionaires, and adult orphans” God, the absolute callousness in that statement. Not only does she diss superheroes but also police, firefighters, and doctors. Then, she blows off being an orphan like it's a lifestyle choice.
Yeah… so many of the “witticisms” in she hulk make it obvious that the writers haven’t even bothered watching the marvel movies. Banner has been through so much trauma to be where he is, that to berate that experience is detestable behavior. Especially from someone who is family, and that she’s ostensibly supposed to love.She is so wildly unlikable that it almost feels like we should be rooting against her. She made a character that is literally a hulk, seem small, weak, and pathetic.
The biggest irony is when she rants at the Hulk about being catcalled, she's literally invalidating Bruce Banner's struggles to prop up her small trivial inconveniences - which is something actual Narcissists do. So in a way She-Hulk is projecting there.
The movie Top Gun Maverick does a really good job with their female characters. Specifically the female pilot. She isn't "I AM WOMAN AND I AM HERE LOOK AT ME". She was "I am a pilot. Let's get this shit done". I really enjoyed her character.
I've seen a lot of comments on other videos saying that she-hulk is only better at controlling it because she didn't get as much radiation as hulk did. If she did, she would be going full rage monster; but I guess that would be bad for the agenda if you show a woman getting emotional and raging.
For me personally the two worst cringe Tv-shows ever: SHE-Hulk (script from whiney-KAREN-like-depressed writers who have a miserable life) and the female DrWHO (script from a person who actually never had spoken to a woman before)....the people who wrote these shitshows should be banned for life to do another script! No more brain diarrhea!
@@POIUYTREWQ62 nah people doing the writing for bad writers imo, don't do that. They fucked up, they made her insufferable because they tried making her better than the original with none of the downsides...
It's a bit sad that writers in the 80's had a better idea on how to write a strong female character than writers today. You can have a female character without making a big deal out of her being female.
What's sad is that Jen's situation could be really fascinating to explore: someone who gets superpowers by mere chance and geniuenly has no interest in being a super hero- technically speaking, nothing is forcing her, but we could see her struggling with doing what she loves versus what her new abilities demand of her to do. Kinda like Metroman in Megamind. But of course, this is an actually interesting idea, so obviously Disney-Marvel isn't interested in it.
I’ve done RPG where we were ordinary people who received super powers We kept running away from trouble and not getting involved. It’s what would happen.
I'll admit, as a female, I'm more drawn to male characters, but am not adverse to well-written female characters. I enjoyed Sarah Conners, Ripley, and Wonder Woman (not the 2nd movie). I liked women who are strong but not at the expense of her femininity. It's not a bad thing, being female. The reason I love the character of Wonder Woman, is that she has heart. She is strong and as capable as any man, but she doesn't have to ridicule or humiliate men to be awesome. She just is. If the only way you can prove to yourself that you are strong or worthy is to stomp on everyone around you, then you are neither strong nor worthy. I hate these woke, feministic movies and TV shows. I find these female characters flat, whiny, boring, and more than pathetic. It's cringey.
Even though most movies today are better than most movies from the 90's or 80's or 70's I would pick a movie from those older years more than today because of 1 thing, character(not the characters in the movies but, well i hope you know what I mean). Sarah Conners had character, so did Ripley and many other female leads back in the days, not because they were women but because they were great characters who had struggles and and flaws, they were strong but also weak. Men back then the same. Now if its supposed to be a "strong" female lead, she is the "strong" one while the men are weak and pathetic and stupid. One example of that would be Chris Hemsworth character in Ghostbuster 2016, you wonder how he survived that long, only to be the sex object of those female characters, while Annie Potts character in the 1984 Ghostbusters wasnt, she wasnt the insanely stupid but hot female sex object, she was a not so good looking woman who had character, she had spunk, and she went hamm on Bill Murreys character, which I enjoyed a lot. Long story short, they don't make movies like they did before, and it shows.
The "when incompetent men explain my own area of expertise to me" sounds especially wrong to me because of one HUGE reason. That is exactly what she is doing to Bruce Banner right there.
Indeed! As if that never happens to men. Oh if only I was male, I'd never be afraid of being bulled, I could walk alone at night and be safe, nobody would make sexual comments at me, everyone would respect me all the time, people would judge me for who I am... Except the social norm is that physical violence against women is less tolerated than violence against men, men get murdered in bad neighborhoods, men are constantly being measured for their physical prowess, men are often portrayed as bumbling fools, men are valued based on the size of their paychecks... It's a bad case of "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence".
Very good point. The whole rant was just awkward, especially considering Bruce’s life has been filled with suffering to the point that he tried to kill himself.
