Hello you savages. Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - chriswillx.com/books/ Here's the timestamps: 00:00 The Uniqueness of the New Generation 01:10 What Does a Good Childhood Look Like? 07:06 Changes in Parenting Styles 10:59 Lack of Discipline in Modern Parenting 15:16 The Importance of Risk in Play 20:47 Is the Education System Ruining Kids? 27:16 The Problem With Ideological Academia 30:45 Latest Data on Social Media’s Impact 38:47 Primary Harms of Technology on Kids 46:12 Is Social Media Use Addiction or Compulsion? 49:48 How Boys & Girls Use Technology Differently 56:46 The Male Sedation Hypothesis 1:02:37 Are Gen-Z Bothered About Status? 1:12:34 Latest Data on Female Mental Health 1:17:31 Why is Anxiety the Most Prevalent Feeling? 1:21:11 How We Solve the Teen Mental Health Crisis 1:28:04 Where to Find Jonathan
Thank you.I'm truly enjoying this simplified breakdown of the devouring mother, and why the parent must necessarily fail.. as if they succeed In protecting them from everything, they failed their child In being able to deal with anything... oxymoronical As it is it is the truth. And I appreciate it put in terms that more people will be able to digest❤
kids, kids, kids, kids, kids, kids, kids........ why is everyone always talking about the friggin kids? why is it ALWAYS all about the kids!?! Geez, not everyone is a parent, or even wants to be one, but noooooo, we are all steamrolled by all the parents and wanna be parents completely OBSESSED with the kids. I'm tired of it. I don't about your kids.
@@peterbelanger4094 So there's a very important reason Everybody's talking about kids.Whether you want one or not you're economic prosperity or lack of will be in their hands in your elderly age( And this extends to possibly the very salvation of your life/health. the question becomes, do you care about yourself? It is self-serving In your particular case to know what is going on with these kids, EVEN if you don't ever have children, as you will be reaping the benefits of other people's children or detriments for that matter( And you didn't have to do any of the work, all you had to do was listen to us Try making them the best We could, so they're able to manage your situation). Remember when you're in the retirement home MY children are the ones that will be taking care of you, So again the question is, do you care about yourself and would you like to have a competent person taking care of YOU When YOU Are unable to? Another plausible thought, but less directly linked To your immediate surroundings, is if these kids have no idea how this economic system we have works, they step in and destroy the economic and political structures Your life falls apart as well. Would you like your retirement to disappear everything you worked Your life to save, gone in the blink of an eye?.Whether you like kids, whether you want kids, whether you have kids doesn't matter, they will dictate the end of your life, at least the last 15 to 20 years of it. These two reasons alone are pretty good evidence of why you should want to know what's going on with these kids...
My school board is looking to ban cellphones. I listened to this podcast, shared it with my teacher; my teacher shared it with the principal; the principal shared it with the entire staff within our school. They loved it! And the solution that Jonathan Haidt presented is exactly the thing our education board needs!
It's not enough to ban phones. I didn't know this until I worked as a substitute teacher a few years back, but they now start kids on "chrome books" in kindergarten. Instead of engaging with each other and the teacher, kids are now with headphones, isolated from each other as they play computer games that are supposedly intended to teach academic skills, but really just teaching immediate gratification, as if we need more of that. I'm not sure who's more at fault, the lobbyists of Microsoft and all of the software companies, or the gullible, lazy parents who have allowed this. I've wanted to go to the school board to complain, but I know it would be fruitless. When I've brought this issue up with other parents they basically shrug their shoulders or even defend it. My fellow "conservatives" need to realize that transgenderism and women's sports is just a diversion for the real atrocities going on in schools.
Do check out the schools in the news recently in Ireland, I believe it is -- they removed all phones and saw a huge turn around and benefit (kids are much happier!). Their approach was to bring parents on board.
When you give your child a phone, you're not just giving them access to the internet and the whole world. You're giving the internet and the whole world access to your child.
It is called propaganda. I see parents tell children: I used to do this as a child instead now kids are taught through phones what's right and wrong and most parents would start agreeing to this!! What happened to maturely talking to kids about importance of other people and relationships, no they'll learn it from social media or bad parenting as I might say
I love this! I am born in 1972! I was not surveilled after school, I always got out after lunch just to crack my head open by climbing on a tree. I was much more careful the next time. We did stunts, climbed on trees, jumped from high walls and sometimes someone broke something or had a bleeding face. It was pretty normal. This was waaaayy before Internet and especially before Smartphones. I am over the top grateful for this fantastic youth I had!
1962 here. I am grateful every day for my parent’s benign neglect. Lived in the country, worked hard, played in the mud, rode the horses ( when we were suppose to stick to our ponies) and learned about the seasons, where food came from and that there are trade offs, not utopia. A bubble is an unhealthy place to grow up.
@@tammys8711 Even better than me, but we speak the same language! My dad was a fisherman and where ever he went, me and a friend were with him. We played in a creek and got our asses kicked by slippery stones :) Knowing your limits is so important, a lot of youngsters never make that experience nowadays, no wonder they cannot navigate in the world.
@@jakesaul9895Spot on! I left social media altogether in 2016 and find it quite disturbing that *anyone* is still on Facepalm, Instacrap, Twatter or whatever, especially knowing what we do about these dopaminergic demons that hijack our limbic systems, mine our data, and destroy civil society and childhood. It’s a predator’s dream, basically. Hard pass on all but RU-vid, where I carefully curate what I take in (mostly old concert footage) and limit time spent.
Haidt is a legend. As a 33yr who didn't understand Gen Z culture, The Coddling of the American Mind gave me insight on why the generational changes happened. His new book was sold out at every Barnes & Nobles in the DC area this weekend! Looks like many others are realizing how informative his literature is.
Fellow DC area fan here! Just wanted to say it is nice to be reminded not everyone in the DMV is a captured anti-meritocracy layabout. There is a big difference between the population of DC proper & the more affluent suburbs. As a friend's dad once said "I didn't become a conservative until I had something worth conserving." I haven't changed much since I registered as a Democrat at 18, but they have moved so far to the authoritarian left quadrant that I am practically a republican myself now. I consider myself a pragmatic, small "l" libertarian. Anyway, greetings from Fairfax!!
Unfortunately, people being glued to tech is needed, as we’re destined to become cyborgs. I’m not joking, that will happen. Implants. I don’t like this, but it’s been our theory for a long time now.
As a former teacher, I can confirm that this is true. I didn't let kids do risky play because it wasn't worth the bashing I'd get from irate parents or my administrators.
Kids and adults are anxious today because no one spends time outside, no one learns actual skills anymore and living in concrete with traffic every where is stressful. Let’s get back to basics: animal husbandry, growing your food, kids spending the day outdoors until dinner time.
The fact that few people realize that diet has a direct correlation to our mental health astounds me. Feed us garbage foods and that's what you get....
That's a failing of parents, mainly. I always do activities and make things with my child, whereas the mother has the TV on all of the time, and is happy if my child is surfing the Internet. It's a constant battle. She's destroying our child. We're separated so I only have influence half of the time.
@@seanfrank4158😂I'll answer you too. I've taught my child to cook and enjoy good, healthy food but the mother hates cooking and often orders pizzas and kebabs. There, I've got that off my chest. 😊
Absolutely, if you can tell me how to financially survive, I say this all the time. Tried moving this way and lost my family because they love the world more than truth and peace. People think it’s crazy but I tell them, God didn’t build these cities and subdivisions, man did. The workplace is a mirror image of what these are talking about the children and why the adults are as bad shape as the kiddos. Plus the kiddos watch us more than they and we know. Someone Leads the sheep to the slaughter. Nature and things of are Gods, societies are humans and humans are stupid and proud. Been proven for thousands of years through all times and all societies.
My daughter's middle school does not allow phones to be used during the day. They have to be off and in lockers. The principal changed the whole atmosphere of the school 2 years ago with just that one rule. We don't allow social media until after high school. My now 21 year old son thanked me for keeping him off it. He only missed out on some slang words but those changed quickly so he didn't care. I'm sharing this with my friends and hoping they spend the time watching. Excellent interview! Thank you!
I was waiting for you to have a conversation with Haidt for the past 2 years. I'm halfway through the Anxious Generation and looking forward to listening to this podcast. Thank you Chris for platforming this legend of a man.
@@ChrisWillx I'm a huge Haidt fan, you brought out more from him than any other interviewer I've seen. I'd watched a few episodes of yours before, but this was the one that really impressed me, you were smart enough for his academic bantor, and candid enough that he opened up on a few extra areas than usual. Well done!!
Dude, many MANY people early on thought it was a really bad idea to give your young child a tablet or phone. I think this is rewriting the past by parents with regrets, to say we thought it was a good thing. Like, maybe you have a small group of friends that thought that, but the science was skeptical very early.
The conservatives were worried, the liberals were excited, it's just the classic cycle of two types of contrary overreactions until cultural shifts hard enough that only the extreme naysayers are remembered.
13:21 I tell my kids about once a week that life is not fair, has never been fair, and won't ever be fair, focus on what you have control of and do your best
tomorrow i will delete my facebook account. Insta's been done already. Im done with this shit. I was one of these who didn't have a phone until 2016 and my mates said I was notoriously hard to get hold of. Im going back to those times.
I downloaded OLauncher. It's an app that makes your phone look like a dumb phone. Paired it with a greyscale background. Helps a lot! And indeed, remove instagram and facebook.
@@cinnamondan4984Does it really seem true that people need to be on social media to thrive in the modern world? He just said he’s deleting FB; he didn’t say he’s moving to the woods.
Kids need structure. I grew up in a liberal household in the 1960's - 1970's and there were rules but not enough. Several don't (somewhat inconsistent) but no do's. So, my brother and I flew by the seat of our pants and adopted rules from other families. It left me feeling rudderless. I needed more structure.
It was TV that occupied them when at home, even back then parents were attentive. Parenting, or the lack of, is a much bigger issue than is admitted because its an uncomfortable truth. Today it is worse because the modern type of technology is at a much faster pace so there's more impact, more information but still the lack of guidance so its even easier to get lost in it all...
OMG - 15 minutes in... and I have been nodding my head in agreement for the majority of the time. I see the result of gentle-coddling parenting in my now 19-year-old stepdaughter... it's horrible. I see how her mother and father have really stunted her and any accountability for being tardy, sleeping late, wrecking her car, doing CHORES, being respectful etc. is overlooked by them. I stand back in absolute horror... smh. But, for my sanity - I've disengaged because I was viewed as old-fashioned (mind you, I'm 12 years younger than her parents). My role before disengaging was in developing her into a responsible young adult who understood the importance of volunteering, service-before-self, being accountable, learning, being curious, having manners, chores etc - this was frowned upon by her momma... so...yeah - now they have an entitled young lady who is incapable of being an adult...good luck!
I have a similar experience with my niece - we used to get along, but when she hit maturity, she started behaving in a way that is extremely entitled and bratty. I've also had to disengage because the only way I could see to serve her, was to call out her bad behavior, and that was not appreciated.
A friend of mine is a single parent of a daughter. He was really into sports and had her play hockey and soccer since she was young. I chatted with her briefly when she was 15-16. She was remarkably mature for her age.
I think Gen X got really lucky. I feel so blessed to have been raised with a mix of boundaries and freedom. We were lucky enough to be raised without luxuries but entered the workforce just before the digital age.
And the most popular movies of their time had at least a partial adoption of the Nietzschian ideals. The millennials adopted more of a Gnostic world view. Gen X wanted to break away from the matrix while Millennials want(ed) to make the matrix gilded
I'm a Gen X Australian. And for the record, when watching recorded toddler shows on VHS my kids recognised the adds and could fast forward them by two or three, hmm. I'm now a grandmother and the eldest gkids are 12, so technically adolescent. My rules with the internet are that it's used on a big screen and adults are present, or at least walking through constantly. For example the living room or the kitchen. I don't know any kids of this age who have a smart phone. Some have dumb phones incase they miss a bus or something. The computers at school are purely educational. When playing computer games, if they want to play with friends or family, they need to speak to the kids via telephone and arrange for them to come over. Most of all parents need to drag them out. The adventure playground in the backyard, the park, the beach. Most kids have millenial parents. Sadly they learnt the hard way how ugly social media is. The kids in danger are the Gen X parents who were so determined to be upper middle class they delayed parenthood. The rest of us know how to handle kids and the internet. Another moral panic.
@@grannyannie2948I would guess most 12 year old kids here the US have full access smart phones. sigh.. You have a really good point about the "rushing to upper middle class", I never thought of it that way.
Attention fragmentation undermines our ability to focus, our productivity, and our performance. It's not just teens who are prone to this; adults are switching (aka multitasking) and constantly getting distracted by pings from Slack DMs in order to "be on top of everything" at work. This ironically leads to spreading oneself thin and compromising quality in the name of agility and speed in the current Zeitgeist of hustle culture running on sympathetic nervous system with chronic dysregulation.
The vicissitudes of life include indignity, misfortune, and injustice. The more we are able to regulate our nervous system, radically accept unfairness when it's outside our sphere of influence and let go and move on, the more resilient, content and self-assured we become.
This is now my favourite episode of MW. (Watched all of them) ❤️ Chris asked so many interesting questions and Jonathan was so comfortable. What a precious and important conversation.
My daughter turned 14 today. She doesn't have a phone, just a tablet, and we don't plan on getting her a phone for another year, most likely. It gets easier to say "No" if you make a practice of it and incentivize the phone as a privilege that must be earned with maturity and behavior expectations. Almost all her friends have phones so she does feel left out, but not to the extent that it causes her serious distress. I love Joe Rogan but he didn't think that Haidt's list of restrictions would be adopted by parents and I disagree. It is definitely possible and more parents are coming around to the dangers of letting their kids have social media. I am white-pilled on this issue. We can do it!
That's great parenting, and your daughter will thank you for it later... probably not now though, and I'll be doing the exact same thing with my own daughter
@@alexdavila1356 Good question. I have found that while she does complain about it she is not overly obsessive or distraught by her lack of a cell phone. She uses her tablet to communicate with her friends on Kids' Messenger or Roblox chats so she isn't isolated from the virtual world completely. It isn't something she fights about with us and she doesn't seem to be too emotionally distressed about it 97% of the time. Her interactions with friends at school and through chats on her tablet are already filled with enough drama (which she hates) so I think she understands that we are protecting her and are not being unfair or unreasonable. It is also pretty rough in schools now and she sees the behaviour of her peers and is turned off by it all. She is into art and making animated videos for RU-vid so we have encouraged her in this area and I think it has been enough of a distraction to keep her content for now.
I did my own experiment snd stayed off social media for 2 weeks and my anxiety was decreased dramatically. I see the same in my child. Now, we stay away from screens with the exception of intentional use for necessity. As a parent the hardest part is being more present and creating activities and family play. People are so distracted and not living in the present. Great conversation.
"Have you read a book for pleasure" They have SOOOOOOOOOO much more homework. Even if they don't have social media or are on the phone like my kid. It's all busy work when they get home. They are exhausted! I'm too exhausted because I'm having to help a tired frustrated child with the dumbest busywork you could imagine. This isn't normal.
Exercise through out the day helps with ADHD so your kids can focus better 😊 exercise in the morning is best, gets oxygen to their brains and gets the excess energy out like they would be in nature before man made school were we have to sit
I work in a high-pressure private school where we push kids hard. They have a lot of homework. And yet when you ask them to answer honestly, they will tell you they STILL spend several hours a day on their phone. Without that there'd be plenty of time for sleep and R&R.
The homework level is way out of balance. Kids need time for other responsibilities and learning beyond academic subjects. Screen time should be limited. More parents need to take charge of their children’s development instead of outsourcing it.
Enjoyed listening, thank you. This is so important and needs more attention than it gets… I’m 46 and struggled with the beginning of all this anxiety of depression in my teens, the 90s, and still do. I’m also a very sensitive person… I always think how much I feel for the youth today, can just imagine growing up with the internet and social media to boot, how politics have infiltrated everything... Our rush-rush consumer society is sick, and out of tune with nature, our true nature. It’s no wonder we’re all screwed up… And unless a disaster happens, it isn’t gonna change any time soon. It’s all about Big Business, at the expense of everything else… We all just have to do the best we can, considering. It starts with us.
@@greyfoxice I think someone said that sarcasm is the reflexive emotion for when someone disagrees or doesn't like you but they can't articulate anything positive from their own to counter.
Many young people are not learning social skills needed for interacting face to face with other humans. Interacting thru a screen is not the same as in real life.
Just listening to Jonathan’s book The Righteous Mind - read by him. I used to think he was somewhat mainstream but I did not appreciate how much he is top of his field. He links some of the most significant thinking of our times. I got interested in Autism, then The Red Pill idea, then Ian McGilchrist on left/right brain and the modern world, the whole woke thing, Robert Sapolsky on free will and they have common threads with Jonathan’s work. For me Jonathan nails the key concerns most clearly of those I have listened to. He has a wonderful clarity and perceptual reach and he sees the dangers of our current experiment. I really recommend people to follow his thinking.
Wow, Chris! This dude is really interesting. I completely agree with basically all his points. I thought this was just going to be another boring Thursday. Thanks, Chris, you made my day brighter!
We didnt get dial-up internet until I was 13. My life was awseome when I lived in the world, wind in my hair flying around on my bmx bike enjoying life with good friends. My 20s was a mess, drugs, depression and self worth issues. My early 30's, I went back to being the boy that took one of the prettiest girls in school to senior prom many years ago. Old habits die hard. Preserve and foster the good things inside you, people. Ask God for forgivness and guidance. There are real God-fearing local churches around, same as 100 years ago.
Finding that point in rough playing and throwing around where my son and daughter were delirious with laughter and terror simultaneously is one of the best experiences of my life, laughing beyond the abdominal and chest pain.
One of my favorite pod casters hosting one of my favorite modern intellectuals. Thank you for this stimulating conversation, Chris. Excellent questions. You did a great job making Prof. Haidt feel comfortable to expand on his opinions more deeply than I have seen in other places he's given talks. Bravo, and congratulations on your Austin shoot and your 2M sub milestone!
Eight years ago, I chose New Zealand and relocated from my home country with two young children. I didn't know it was the only country in the English speaking realm that allowed kids to climb trees. Furthermore, students now are not allowed to use their mobiles at school. I am even happier with my choice.
I've played a lot of video games. My biggest mistake was not persevering in games I wasn't good at, save scumming until I got the perfect play, not pushing the difficulty to the highest I could try. I got used to playing it easy, and restarting anytime I wanted, which didn't help me in real life when something went sideways and I had to salvage what I can. Instead of doing my best I just crashed.
One of the best gaming experiences I ever had was playing the original Half Life for the first time on the hardest difficulty. It forced me to master the mechanics to a level I never would have otherwise, using every weapon to its max potential and memorizing enemy attacks and behavior. The sense of satisfaction when I finally made it through the whole thing was incredible, and to this day I cherish the experience. If I had just picked medium, it would have been good but just another game I think. What a terrible loss that would have been.
I've been saying this stuff about myself for years. That I didn't have a lot of friends, that I wasn't allowed outside to ride my bike around with other kids, most of my time was spent alone in my back yard or playing video games. I remember being little and going outside on my own to explore and my mom freaking out that I was gone. My dad worked 12-16 hours a day, my mom really didn't like her life at home because my dad was very verbally abusive, and I think the lack of a male role model or man she could trust in the house made her much more cautious and fearful. I remember trying to go do things on my own many times and my mom telling me no because I didn't have someone to go with me (I didn't have siblings). I'm now 28, I've constantly felt there was something wrong my whole life, I never made all that many friends, never took any risks, never had a girlfriend, never been out of my parents' house. And as I'm nearing 30, the suicidal thoughts just keep getting stronger. And I'm constantly remembering all the things I've missed, all the developmental milestones that passed me by. I terrified that I'll never recover now, especially after watching this video and Jonathan's work. I don't know what to do anymore, I don't want to live the rest of my life this way.
I’m sorry you’ve had it so rough. Sounds like you missed out on a lot. It’s never too late to grow and develop. Put yourself out there. Take the risks even though it’s uncomfortable. Show up. Try new things that are social. There’s lots of women your age who are struggling to connect as well who would welcome the chance. Take care
As a video game lover and a father to boys who love to play games, I'm kinda tired of people talking down about video games and calling it a "waste of time." Anything can be destructive and addictive ie: food, gambling and social media. Its all about moderation and learning how to have self control, something I've been working on with my boys. Gaming is my decompression time. Does it serves it's purpose? Yes, so its not a waste in my life, in fact, it's very crucial.
It’s great hearing Johnathon speak, no emotional biases, with many references to real data. I like his concept of “phone-based” society. Makes a lot of sense.
22:30 it's validating to hear this because I feel like being made to take tough classes having to do with complex math at 4yrs old in South Korea in 1994 was just not the move my parents should have made. My earliest memories are chronic stress from failing those classes, esp. with my difficulty focusing on academic studies. There were a lot of tears, sadly. Also didn't get to play a lot with kids my age.
My 13 year old daughter has a smart phone but has certain restrictions such as not being allowed to use TikTok and not being allowed to put herself online. She also reads a lot of books and is on pace to read over 50 books for pleasure this year, plus being involved in theater at her school. Additionally, she exercises via bike riding, plays board games often, and goes to church regularly. There is a way to allow certain online interactions while balancing it with other things.
So you've got all of these wonderful activities in place for your 13 year old yet are willing to risk undoing all of that great work by introducing an anxiety inducing phone?
@@bakedbeans9546Stop looking at things in back and white. If your child has a robust enough social life with plenty of activities, a phone isn’t going to destroy them especially if social media is somewhat regulated
It’s so sad that humans have devolved to a point of not being able to face social anxiety, so much so that they are unwilling to experience normal feelings of rejection. As part of gen x, I feel so so sad for the younger generations who find normal human experience something they should avoid at all costs. You learn through your failures. Success, even in dating, is born from learning from the success and failures you have through real life interactions. So, so sad.
Jonathan talks about more play.... backing off on homework in kindergarten and first grade. I went to school from 1974-1987... I never had homework at all, until I was in the FIFTH GRADE.
Chris has been a better podcaster for 2+ years now. Joe was great for a long time and he’s a great man, but Chris is smarter, more clever, more self aware, much funnier in real-time conversation, brings on far more non-famous scientists, and he dedicates a ton of time to reading psych literature.
I have climbed high trees when I was a child. These were important experiences: I knew I had to assess the risk, I had to decide whether I would be able to climb back the way I selected, and I had to control my fear. The trees were so high that I was aware of the fact that an error could end my life. Actually, the problem is that I wouldn't like my kids to do the same. I have photographs of mine showing me smiling on a roller coaster, while others were screaming. Actually, I wonder, if I developed a tendency towards high risks because I took chances more often than would be adequate and helpful.
Completely agree with Jonathan Haidt (as usual). Another great person to chat with on the subject of mental health in the young would be Georgia Ede, a psychiatrist. She’s easy to find on RU-vid and has recently published ‘Change your Diet, Change your Mind’.
I agree with pretty much everything I just listened to. One other factor that I think has played into the issues of children and teens not socializing is the cost. Everything costs way too much and there's nowhere to go for free. I think of the malls my buddies and I hung out in back in high school. They are all closed now. There's no place I can think of that kids can go and just hang out that doesn't require them to spend lots of money to be there. Think of how much more gas, car insurance, and even used cars cost now than they did a decade or two ago. So not only have we limited where these kids can go, we made it far more expensive to get there. Early on, you mentioned hobbies, which are increasingly expensive and exclusive. My dad and I were big into model trains when I was growing up (he still is) and he's repeatedly commented, showing off stuff he has now at its incredible quality and detail, but also that a single freight car now costs more than the full starter sets you used to get at Toys R Us and how if we were starting out now, we'd never have gotten into it, as it costs too much. Same with the tabletop wargaming I still do. It's an adult hobby that requires a full time income even though its ultimately playing with plastic army men. The same goes for sports. How much does it cost for a kid to play most sports now? I wonder if that also is factoring into parental risk aversion- who can afford the ER bill when your kids breaks something? Plus the fear of getting sued by other parents because your little King Arthur bonked their little Mordred over the dome a little hard with their stick sword. Or that State taking your children away for the same reason. By today's standards, I would have been deemed far too free range and DSS/DYS would have definitely been contacting my parents if not taking me away entirely.
to Jonathan Haidt: Some video games do have that level of disagreements; usually MMOs or games where you spend alot of time with the same subset of people which is I believe the point you were trying to make about around 42:11. Edit: Also, amazing discussion - gained so much from it.
@@SpecterVonBarenI was thinking the same, but there's much less incentive to actually resolve the issue (if its a random person). It's usually just player A saying player B is shit and player B insulting back. Its rarely constructive, and you're still missing out on other important social aspects like body language, eye contact etc. I think his analogy of only eating rice is pretty accurate
As the famous experiment showed: the kids who chose to give up a small pleasure (one marshmallow/chocolate/etc) for a bigger one later (two marshmallows 15 min after) tended to be better off in life. One takeaway is that parents need to be cognizant of how their choices affect their kids now vs later. You may want to give the child a moment of pleasure now, or you could refrain and allow them to gain much greater rewards later down the line. It's complex, for sure, but the point is to have the ability to judge when it is best to have less happy kids now in exchange for more sustained happier and better people in the future. "What's wrong with kids these days? Why can't they forgo instant gratification?" needs to be superseded by the same question but replacing "the kids" with "the parents".
This reminds me a lot of some of Bo Burnhams ideas that he tries to communicate like one of his quotes where he says “if you can live your life without an audience, you should do it.” And also reminds me of a video essay about him titled “Bo Burnham tried to warn us”
Marshall McLuhan is a hero of Jordan Peterson. Back in the 1950s he talked of, a "global village". A hero of mine is scientist-priest Pierre Teilhard de Chardin. He came up with the idea long before Marshall. Back in the 1920s, he came up with "the noosphere", a linking together of human minds around the world, via technology. Today we call the noosphere, "the internet".
Thanks JH for your comment on - unfair - injustice. I notice that even random illness is now more and more labeled - injust. When, if ever, was life meted out justly. All this goes back to the - because I deserve it. It is crazy and harmful.
A few weeks ago we went out to dinner. A group of 4, younger people walked in and were seated next to us. Obviously a double date thing. From the time they placed their order, to the time the food arrived, no one said a word. All four were on their phones. It was so stunning we couldn't help but watch and wait to see who spoke first. The food showed up and the guys started eating but the girls were a little slower putting down their phones. I couldn't help but think how depressing it must be. No interaction, no conversation, nothing. And they don't even realize it. Go into any gym now. There are people sitting around on benches and machines just staring at their phones. Some forget that others are waiting for them to finish up and move on. I've seen people sitting and mesmerized with their phones upwards to 10 minutes between sets.
When I had my children, mid 80s to mid 90s, almost all women worked outside the home. I was the odd duck as a stay at home mom. So these mothers enrolled their children in all kinds of after-school activities because there was no one home for them. My children had to make dates to play with someone. There was no spontaneity. There was no, "Hey, you want to come to my house after school?" I feel bad for my kids, they had a completely different childhood than their parents, when our goal was to give them the same (or better) childhood. I see more young parents today wanting to be stay at home moms and I am glad for it.
Agreed! I have firm boundaries with my kids and they learn consequences and I’m not a push over at all. I just try to be calm and loving even when I’m firm. It works well, my kids behave well yet aren’t scared to tell me things (so far).
Chris ….thankyou and just to let you know I jumped on when you were at 250,000 subscribers as I thought you had an insightful manner and you hit upon super important themes around the health of young men and I also have a 21 year old son who is dealing with all these issues that you talk about …. In the vein of this current guest I suggest a fantastic guest is Christopher hedges to me one of the most knowledgable individuals out there over many years ..if you want to get a very educated and insightful take on many of our societal issues that you are currently delving into… we would definitely tune in as many of your audience would and individuals who may not know him would benefit hugely, I imagine….👌
Haidt seems to ignore the paradigm shift in the social sciences Flower Power Tax represented. Growing anxiety is one of the many effects of heightened sexual competition following “hoeflation”. More frustrated women and violent men. This is why wars escalate. Self imorovement is a base to the bottom for men.
As a big supporter of gender equality, I'm willing to care just as much about the wellbeing of girls and women as women have cared about the wellbeing of boys and men, which is little to no care at all.
Ridicilous statement. This type of reasoning only works if you see the world in terms of abstract identity groups, who compete in zero sum games. Best not to generalise from your own experience, plenty of beautiful and caring women out there, go out and find one.
@@MrMark595Or it's because you've grown up in a world where identity groups have made it their mission to invade and disrupt every part of your life, leaving you with little desire to care when it boomerangs back on them.
I can tell our story of raising kids. Video games were never a big thing in our house. I always said that adrenaline need to be get outside in the woods and mountains. Typical birthday and Xmas gifts were bicycles, downhill skies, kayaks, SUPs, backpacks, sleeping bags for outdoor trips and so on. Both my kids had to go to school by public transport starting age 10, one way trip 45 min minimum. At age 16 both went for a couple months to a school in a country on the other side of the world. Both couldn't stop grinning as this was the best experience of their life at this time. Both had to fly back home alone on 14h international flights with stopovers at huge airports. They had to speak English with German as their native language. I recall an event, I did a dad&boys 1 week canoing trip with them when they were 11 and 6 or so. On some remote spot in the woods, some essential gear failed. In order to proceed, I had to pick up replacement, but this took me some 3 hours brisk walking. So I gave them my phone with the order to phone the god father of one of them - who is a police officer, but in another state - if I'm still not back in 4 hours. Everything went smooth. I was back in time and they were just fine. Now I can enjoy things like backcounty powder snow skiing through the trees with my adult sons. Maybe this is due to the fact that we are from a former East Block region and joint relatively late to the 'Western world ' Oh, I self-idetify as significantly left of center, that has nothing to do with it...
This is correct but it always seems a bit off when this message comes from the thing that is so horrible. Lol, like a drug dealer telling a buyer you shouldn't be doing this.
In the 70s i was a teenager in 1974, we were all into drugs and alcohol and we had no video games or phones, i was fully fledged alcoholic and addict by age 20 but we did come from underprivileged, in my case abusive, neglectful home! So it might not count, but there was a huge drinking culture, that was all we did, i did travel but i was drinking!🎉🎉🎉
I live in New York City. People here don't look at each other, don't talk to each other, nothing. Like robots. I'm a child of the 1970s, and this is totally the opposite of ANYTHING I grew up learning about humanity. In fact, this is EXACTLY what the government wanted back then: they got a taste of the 60s, and they made damn sure it would never, EVER be repeated; not if they could help it. What better to do that but a techno-society, or a technological blight, as I call it.
Even my daughter is 22 year old is affected by this. And she came from Columbia 8 years ago and did not have a smartphone until she arrived in the states. The only thing I can do that has any meaning is give her books and share a podcast like this with her.
Awhile back I made the direct connection between parents that don't let your kids struggle with anything/experience discomfort/fail and anxiety about minor little things in life. The reparenting around that one has been a long slog. It's also interesting to consider that we stop kids from climbing onto 'dangerous' places and hold their hands as they take their very first steps. What if we allowed kids to take 'dangerous' climbs but asked them along the way 'what's your plan' and 'what will you do next' instead of scolding them or telling them 'be careful' (which is meaningless direction to a child).
I wanted to say something on the video game addiction thing. I have been addicted to both video games (when I was a teenager) and stimulants (when I was in my twenties), and in addiction from chemical substance recovery it's common to having so-called "using dreams" where you have dreams about the use of the chemical substance. But what I noticed recently is that ~20 years later I still have dreams of playing World of Warcraft. I also had a lot of good times playing that game and think it helped me a lot with cooperation, but I certainly didn't sign up for a lifetime of dreaming about it for the rest of my life when I was 15 years old and unaware. I often also wonder if the video game addiction (which I'm not saying everybody does get addicted to it) primed me in some way for the stimulant addiction, but I'm not a psychiatrist. I also wanted to say that there was another MMORPG called Final Fantasy 11 and it had an entry screen in the game that warned you about getting addicted to it. This was years before World of Warcraft and I think the game companies should be more open about what the consequences of their games are; especially since it was apparently known to game makers in the timeframe of Everquest.
Spend time feeling your body (not with your hands... with your attention). You'll realize that anxiety is actually the feeling of fear, expressing itself in your body as muscles and tissues in specific spots, tightening and tensing. The feeling of fear is a kind of pain, though it's never as bad as you think, and the solution is to face it. What do I mean by that? I mean a) realizing that your anxiety is a physical thing (clenching) that is expressing itself, in that moment, in some spot on your body (around the heart, behind the eyes, in the voicebox, in the abdomen), and that b) you can create a habit in which you dare yourself to put your mind on that icky feeling, over and over and over. It's as if the muscles/tissues (the fear) need to be noticed in their clenched state, and then they'll relax. It's a kind of a faith, because you don't know when or why you're going to feel anxiety. And you can't talk yourself out of it. And yet when it comes, you've learned that the only thing to do is look straight at it, with your mental attention, on the physical feeling of discomfort. And then it relents, and in those moments you begin to act with a grace you never had. And then the anxiety comes back (you get lost in narrative, dramatic thought, forgetting to feel your body) and you feel anxiety again. It's a cycle. It's a game (not trivial). It's you willingly feeling what your body shows you, over and over and over, in as many moments as you can. Again, it's faith - since you don't get to choose what you feel. You just dare yourself to feel it. It's a different kind of courage. And you become, in those moments in which you've accepted the sensation of anxiety - you become a better version of yourself because you stop, in big ways or in little ways, lashing out at the world. You're no longer thinking "I've had it up to here," because you've taught yourself to feel a lot more. That doesn't justify any given feeling, nor any given reaction. Simply, it lets you act more calmly, more fluidly, more gracefully. All from they payment of what I see as a penance: the willingness to feel the icky feeling of anxiety in as many moments as you can remember to. I realized this a couple years ago through singing, and you can hear it on my channel - the improvement of my voice, because of this practice, over the last few years. But it's much bigger than that. It'll change your life.
I agree this is crucial, essentially meditation practice. For those who do not like that aesthetic due to the spiritual connotation, think of it this way: It is like pressing stop on an alarm. Your body is telling you something, and only by the conscious mind saying "yes, I hear you, I am capable of dealing with it" does the "alarm" stop. If you distract yourself from fear, how can your body be sure you got the message?
Can you do a vid on the sharp business practices you have experienced? Trying to find online more on the 'crank-on confirmation' and can't see anything. Lots of viewers have had to face these, no doubt, so it will be useful for lots of us.
Thank you Johnathan Haidt for your work. Great interview. Children need to spend more time outdoors in nature with other kids. Worked great for me as a child.
As a young adult every one of my friends I speak to about this sees it the same way smokers do cigarettes. It's usually the "I know it's bad, but... Some crap excuse to them chasing dopamine or being insecure or fomo.. etc ". Some are starting to catch on to this brain rot and are trying to direct their attention to healthier things, however those seem the few minority of people and as you look at those younger than us it seems to be progressively worse and worse.
An hour in, will definitely be sharing with my family and friends with kids. Its a must watch to help the parents (especially if they're older) understand the dynamics between social media and children.
I was playing Lichess on 📱 while listening in bed. I fell asleep and dreamt I was out in public but had left a RU-vid video playing aloud. Then the dream was like I was in the Corp office, overhearing a fascinating conversation, or witnessing a senior management training session! 😝
Interesting podcast. I want to say, a lot of addictions young people are engaged inares actually coping for bad parenting of their caregivers. The only way I see to fight addictions is to solve the root problem.
I think the person you were trying to think of who invented CBT for dating rejection might have been Albert Ellis. He created something called REBT which was where CBT came from. His book How To Stubbornly Refuse To Make Yourself Miserable changed my life
