The Geopolitics of Indonesia - The Red Line Podcast 

Joko Widodo is not "the first president who did not come from the military bureaucracy." In fact, there were more presidents who came from civil background than military. Soekarno was not a military-man himself. He was educated as a civil engineer in a very popular engineering school (imagine MIT but in the Dutch East Indies). Soeharto's vice president, Habibie, who acted as the president during transitional era, was a very well-known scientist in Indonesia and did not come from the military. The first elected (by the People's Representative) president after the fall of Soeharto, Abdurrahman Wahid, also did not come from the military. Megawati, Sokearno's daughter and Wahid's vice president, who would later succeeded Wahid's presidency, also did not come from the military.

As an Indonesian, I want to add little some untold story in this video. It is well known for Indonesian people, but not so much known by western academics. Question at 08:03. The answer isn't wrong, but it's a half complete. If you want to look back in Indonesian history, why the people in this archipelago have strong and unique nationality in their own? The answer is start *"SINCE"* the ancient history of this nation, when this archipelago is ruled by their own kingdoms at each regions. Aceh had their own Kingdom, North Sumatera also had, Maluku had their own too, Papua had their own kingdom belongs to their ethnic groups that centralized in Fakfak, even in Java Island they have so many kingdoms than the other islands had, Cirebon, Surakarta, Mataram, Siliwangi, etc. These kingdoms are isolated from each other, have so many conflicts time to time, and even they have pretty strict rules to trade with another kingdoms. But it's changed when the strongest kingdom appeared, MAJAPAHIT. Majapahit territory doesn't have sea or port, but they start to growing as strongest maritime power at that time and conquer another kingdoms in this archipelago. Majapahit navy army even start to traveling to Philippine, Malaysia, Brunei, and reached to Campa (Thailand). Majapahit Kingdom open the trade relationship to another kingdoms so well. In this archipelago they start to conquer another kingdom just to opening the way in, because another country don't take Majapahit offer due to the strict rules. Not a good start to starting a war with another kingdom, it's a bloody way. But Majapahit didn't have any other option than through violence. Later after the conquer, Majapahit treat another kingdom so well and even give the local king their authority to ruled his own people and resources under the pact. For the short, something big was happened in that time. It's well known as "SUMPAH PALAPA" / "PALAPA OATH". This is the beginning of well communication between people in this archipelago. Start from bloody war, growing to a bargaining relationship, than it's become well communication to each other as a friendship and brotherhood. It has been built and growing hundred years, over and over, then come the Dutch in western territories, Portuguese in eastern territories, then later it's monopolized by Dutch through agreement. Colonialism just make their connection and brotherhood that has been built over hundred years before become stronger and stronger. It's continues and keep growing by the people of this archipelago under the Dutch colonialism. This resistance movement of Dutch colonialism is driven by the spirit of young people (17-35 years old) in each regions called, JONG. There are Jong Java, Jong Sumatran, Jong Borneo, Jong Maluku, etc. They held a very extraordinary deliberation at October 28th 1928, so that date becomes a national holiday for remembrance of "YOUTH PLEDGE DAY" / "SUMPAH PEMUDA". And it was the story of how the nationality and patriotism of this nation was built. 👍🏻

Decentralisation and local autonomy in Indonesia is seen not as problem but as a good thing, one of the successes of the reform post '98 era, especially regarding development, autonomy makes development more equal across the state because development budget is given to each local govt. and not only used for development project pursued by the national govt.

Such good and deep content, this channel deserve more subscriber. Keep up the good work, man hope the channel grow big 🙌

It seems the first speaker do not necessarily versed in Indonesia. One example is the history of Indonesian nationalism he did not even mention 1928 the crucial date ‘Indonesia’ begin to be used popularly and its West Papuan ties (and aceh ties, which is why its different with timor leste). That is why Indonesian identity is almost preconditioned on papua connections. Which sadly is the usual viewpoints from USA think tank and consequently USA indonesian policy. Though recent years cooling of ties is Trump’s fault (though the warmest period was with Obama and probably due to his old ties). Natalie Sambhi would be better communicating Indonesian POVs. You would expect for a country who had interfered multiple times in Indonesia’s domestic politics in the past (as CIA documents alluded to) to at least know what its doing (or maybe because they dont understand, they need more interference). China on the other hand has been making inroads investing beating Japanese. Their influence is much more subtle and making success just look at Indonesia view on Uyghurs. Meanwhile USA investment is conditioned on Israel policy (tbf Indonesia gov do not actually have much problem with Israel gov), which of course will be duly rejected as its a very unpopular move. If you know the historic ties of Indonesian students during independence war with Palestinians and consequently Egypt recognition of Indonesian Republic. You would need to be really smart if you want Indonesian recognition of Israels to the open. One example one branch of Muslim organization in Indonesia NU has really cordial ties with Israels due to Wahids past ties. There was a plan to create embassy in palestine area (though its really with Israel). That plan fell because of sensitivities of israel. Why not consider that plan in different ways? That would be much better compared to Trump’s overtly transactional relations (which China will always beat).

Very good channel! Thanks for the interesting discussions.

Very interesting discussions

Great episode man!

I think many people wish to see the podcast video. Nevertheless, a great discussion. However, I think it's important to address the perspective behind this question which I come across with some Australian politicians, journalists and activists. 29:19 I don't know what is it with some Australians and their obsession with Indonesia's Papua but this support for separatism covered in flowery concerns just needs to stop. Maybe start focusing on the rising discrimination against aboriginal people and their rights in Australia and first then we can discuss about Papua. Let's break it down - "Papuan people are very different from Javanese people" so what? What that has to do with the make-up of a country? From the smallest of Singapore to the big country like the US, all are diverse people. There're hundreds of ethics in Indonesia and they're different to each other. It doesn't stop Indonesians from being united under 1 flag. Same with the US, you've got white, yellow, black, and brown skins there. Stop thinking with false analogies and divide people by their races. - "Many Papuan losing their life in the struggle" How many are many? and what does "struggle" means? Separatists and terrorists are also "struggling" for something, right? And I'm sure these so-called activists in Australia are not gonna support their "struggle". That's why it's not a valid argument. The vast majority of 3.5 million Papuans are proud Indonesians and they all play an important part in Papua, They become governors, mayors, civil servants, diplomats, football players, soldiers, singers, celebrities, comedians etc. Only a small number of probably 70-100 separatists cause trouble and have been hiding in the mountains and forest or running away to PNG or even becoming a refugee in Australia. What do you say if 100 Aboriginal people in Australia started to revolt against Australia wanting to establish a new country, will the Australian government just gonna surrender and ceded the sovereignty to the separatists? I don't think so. Maybe next time, when discussing the separatist movement in Papua, please also mentioned the regular Papuans and TNI soldiers they've killed. This is rather long already. So just a brief explanation about Timor Leste which is a completely different case from Papua. TL independent is legit and follows the international norm of Uti Possidetis Juris. Indonesia's Papua is a Dutch colony whereas TL is a Portuguese colony. People who studied IR will understand. I just gonna stop here. Lastly, Indonesia will always remember and be thankful to the USA (politically) and USSR/Russia (military) who supported Indonesia in expelling the Dutch from Papua. The same is true for Australia's assistance to Indonesia.

I was hoping for a video on Indonesia, this looks good

Red, your first correspondent was quite biased in explaining Indonesia's history & current geopolitics Soekarno & Soeharto were both dictators who ruled Indonesia which was only nominally democratic. Soeharto in particular didnt develop Indonesia as well as he said. instead of making a capitalist country, he built an oligarchy of crony capitalists who racked up debt without using it to make much of use. his economic-political system made corruption extremely rampant. his control of the military did bring stability, but by extreme force, propaganda, genocide, and the 'erasing' political dissidents. only after the asian economic crisis did the country realize how much unpayable debt it had which caused the economy to free fall, requiring help from international banks and the IMF When explaining indonesia's geopolitical situation, he mantioned the PRC's economic influence through the BRI but didnt mention western/US influence, mainly through companies, and at times, force (the crisis that led to Soeharto rising to power was blamed squarely on the communist party but recent records have discovered that the US played a part) other than that the 1st correspondent was mainly factual Edit: spelling & grammar corrections

58:28 how did many australian didn't know their neighbour? I mean they didn't really have much other neighbors at all left is ocean down antartica right is ocean.

Indonesia has the strength of the Unitary State of the Republic of Indonesia, namely the ideology of the Unitary State of the Republic of Indonesia.

Kami bangsa pejuang

I really like your channel. If it's not too much trouble, please try to bring in guests with differing points of view.

Third speaker was good. Second speaker was the best. First one was a meh tbh...

Indonesia joined the US block after a long series of efforts by the CIA and other US intelligence agencies to remove communist-aligned forces from power in the country. Before then Indonesia was a committed member of the nonaligned movement and squarely in the soviet aligned block as it had close military ties with the soviet union similar to Egypt.

East Timor aka timor leste is in deep economic trouble. As one of the poorest country in the world, timor leste is trying to get anything to survive. China would be her saviour obviously. Australia keep the distance, too slow to react.

Jokowi Mr president the full power economic indonesia ,thanks Mr jokowi,borneo 🇮🇩🇮🇩

The Indonesian text here can be easily and quickly translated in a good web browser (Vivaldi). Formally educated people only know European (Abrahamite: meaning Jewish, Christian & Islamic) versions of history. History, as taught as history, is not truly aware of geography and actual reality. foreign invaders had often overwhelmed each culture. Currently, the Abrahamite invaders and 'traders' infect the native people. This is how evolution and cultural evolutions 'progress'. All of East Asia, including Indonesia, Malaysia and here in Australia, was invaded. Originally, and still existing today, are hundreds of isolated tribes. Each tribe had its own version of language, religion, and anthropology. With each foreign invasion, the survivors generally continue with that older tribal customs. Sometimes the newest invaders have converted. These converts then try to force the older traditionalists to the newest infection. This is standard biological evolution. The creators of this video seem not to know how biological evolution really works. The 'flying monkeys' (used by workers in the narcissistic treatment industries) have the emotional drive to promote the infections of the newest fashion leader. Here in Australia and elsewhere, these hero admirers use 'nationhood' metaphors to simply the diverse reality of the real population. So we have many misunderstandings here in this video, and its comments.

Kalau mau damai jangan coba coba ganggu negara kami Indonesia bambu ketapel apapun itu semua rakyat Indonesia siap bantu militer merdeka 🇮🇩🗡️

Long Live Tan Malaka, Soekarno, Hatta. Lets go crush neo colonialist and imperialist.

Indonesia do not joint USSR that time, because Soekarno politics stand as non-aligned movement, not because military act that Soeharto used to oppressed and masacre comuniest party IMO, Indonesia-Australia problem are always coming from Australian side, they are always the first party that provoke Indonesian with all the matters that was actually Indonesia internal conflict, so now you speak its better to be a good neighbor to Indonesia, dont you? Guess what? Show some respect, stop provoking us, leave alone west papua to us and start everything with a good faith, so we can make benefit for the both side. Your second guest speaker, Natalie, is the best, very well knowledge.

It's alarming how many of the facts are ignored or just plain wrong in this discussion

why are you doing a weird voice?