It depends. I live in a maisonette with a 997 year lease, a peppercorn (I.e. zero) rent and no service charge. The only shared liability is the off-road parking area. As this is only used by the residents of 4 maisonettes it should be decades before it needs repairing.
Exactly! If you live in a leasehold property for a few years then you have a legal right to be able to extend the lease. I ended up making a lot of money on a leasehold flat. I bought the property with a fairly short lease at a reduced rate, then lived in it for a few years, then extended the lease as part of the selling process. I made a very significant profit.
The Leaseholder model needs a serious reform to make it work properly, or it will destroy any hope of relieving the housing crisis. There aren't enough freehold properties to avoid the leasehold option. Or prepare to rent for life?
It reminds me of an Indian who wanted to rent property and wanted the owner to pay the entire renovation Renovation were the owner has no say in its design and when he leaves it if it's in shambles that's the owners problem Never go in to business with business men or women from India they're so cunning
Until recently, most leases were for 999 years, and very cheap, like £10/year. Peppercorn leases were literally the cost of a peppercorn, per year. Then about 20 years ago, someone had the idea of bumping it up, and here we are. It's been put to parliament a few times now, but parliament is full of landlords, so it goes nowhere.
You'd already said what I was about too. My parents G-manchester house was 2p a month. It's time to get rid of leasehold, when you buy a property the land is yours. House building system also needs sorting out too.
The Russian super rich bought their way into alot of them in London,and put the lease prices up a while back now. I'm not saying its just them,but a good majority of the properties I've worked in,that are leasehold,are owned by Russians (some are shady,mafia/crime involved,others are businessmen mainly involved in oil) it's a smart,albeit shady investment for them though.its a licence to print money really!! I never could understand why someone would pay all those fees for something they don't ultimately own.
Which is why I've only ever purchased flats built during the 1960s. 999-year leases and a share of the leasehold holding company. I would not touch a property with 99 year lease.
Don't agree. Working from home is going to mean a crash in city property prices as office space is no longer being rented. People can live anywhere in the country instead of living and working in cities like London.
@@well_i_liked_it good. Prices are to high the commute price is criminal and its had a real term effect on mental health and work life balance. Offices normally have a 2 day in office policy and state you can continue to work 5 days in the office so the same space is used. Our head offices dedicated more space to chill was the only difference. My role I'm on the road and only go in once a week anyway. But I've noticed less traffic and peak is far more manageable.
I'd never buy leasehold again. Monthly maintenance bill when nothing is done and bills for thousands without any warning when major works are done. Nightmare.
Sounds like you're suffering from bad management, rather than a problem with the leasehold system itself. I don't have any complaints about my building. I was aware of the costs and the leaseholder agreement before I bought my home. The AGM of the management company is open to all tenants, the accounts are open to scrutiny, etc. There's also a statutory duty to inform all tenants whenever exceptional expenditure is required (e.g. To upgrade all windows in the building), which was executed in my case. Not all management companies are corrupt excuses for wringing out millions from their tenants.
@@theowhite Yes Tads, service is charged for no service received. I contested this and the service charged ceased for a couple of years until the shared ownership company changed hands and decided that service charged is paid because of admin fees! Daylight robbery!!!
@@theowhite I'd love to find out what tenants pay when they have communal areas...I bet it's the same as what I pay but I need proof....I'm going to get back on this because the housing association pay nothing towards my repairs and only take my money for sending me an annual statement of my rent portion. In fact, I'm gonna request they start sending it by email then see what they say... We the people need to share our information more often because it's us against them and the shareholders who simply get paid for doing nothing while we have to work, pay taxes and STILL pay them.....the cheek! Looool, service charges isn't a lot to make noise about but it's a bleeding start! 😆
Shocking that there isn't more outrage about this arrangement. So many aspects of how we do housing are only accepted because we've been doing it this way for so long
The thing is we haven't. Ground rent used to be an insignificant fee. Today its a way of fleecing home owners. Thr council rarely own the roads on these estastes, so like she says these service companies will charge you for anything they can think of. Often vastly inflated by using recursive charging all hidden behind shell companies, so there is f all you can do. Why anyone would buy lease hold houses is beyond me
Robert, it's why I left, emigrated. See ya, UK. You've skinned me up enough over the last 20 years. In the EU now, waiting 3 more years for my Polish passport. No class system here bud.
Leasehold property-holding should have been out-lawed a hundred years ago!! I very luckily and instinctively avoided leasehold properties when I bought my home, because I knew, otherwise, it meant that it would never actually mine. Even so, I've often thought that as my home was built sixty-five years before I was born and will probably be still standing one hundred years after I'm dead, could it ever really mine?
I did the same but still almost got screwed over They've now started moving away from lease holds & having new build houses with management fees built into deeds which are worse than leaseholds with far fewer protections & can up price without warning just cause
My first flat was a leasehold, and was bitten by my own naivety, unscrupulous sellers, disinterested conveyancers, deal hungry agents and caveat emptor. At no point did anyone mention that the part converted loft was not permitted in the lease, nor that the freeholder had never been made aware. Thinking I was going to extend the lease by the statutory available for maybe £10k, I had to also pay for the lease amended, and a fee for breach of lease, tort of trespass, plus their (freeholder) surveyor and legal fees, in total over £40K. Without an amended or extended lease, it was unsellable. The freeholder made £40k for doing nothing, nothing. Try explaining to a mortgage provider why you've just taken out a huge loan....
They won't change the law. Some brave person tried to take them to court but you're up against the might of the Crown, Lords, earls and all the rest. Leaseholding should be gone, long gone.
Same here, I want a apartment not a house. Problem is most apartments are lease hold and you can be paying £3000 a year service charges on top of your mortgage, it's a rip off 👹
@@johnross2924don't pay then! If you think it's unfair then don't pay don't sign anything let them take you to court over it then. What's the freaking problem?!
Back in the 1980’s a couple I knew, I still know the woman bought an apartment on a 999 yr lease. Happy days they thought with £50 p/year ground rent for the lease. Sadly the husband died after a few yrs and ground rent was missed for 3 yrs. not a big deal right! Wrong, there was a clause if ground rent was missed for 3 consecutive yrs the property reverted automatically to the leaseholder, and it did! No matter what was said or done neither the lease holder or Court would assist. Not only did my friend loose her partner but she was made homeless and still owed the mortgage. Within days of court evicting my friend the property was up for sale and sold for a massive (stolen) profit for leaseholder. She declared bankrupt and consequently was not able to buy a property for 14 yrs. Modern Britain thanks to Maggie (the milk snatcher Thatcher.
When you sell. People are advised to have 80 years plus as costs spiral to renew....think 15k. Just to renew a basic document on a property you should own by right.
She's badly misinformed but she's right about there being injustices. She definitely needs to do a little more research to lend herself some credibility on this subject I'm sad to say.
@@petermonk117 she has spent years researching the housing market and written an entire book on the subject. Not saying she can't be misinformed but she has definitely put in research time. What exactly is she getting wrong in your estimation?
@@robertwinslade3104 great question. I think that the way it's presented is misleading. In my opinion she seems to be making out that leaseholds are bad and implied that they shouldn't exist (my subjective opinion based on the short clip). So, if you have a block of flats and they are freehold, the top floor flats need to maintain the roof for everyone's protection and the ground floor have responsibility in order to keep the foundations serving the flats above in good order (a simplified scenario). It's difficult to force homeowners to carry out maintenance in this situation.... hence lenders are less keen on freehold flats. A leasehold flat however has an outside entity to ensure (in an ideal world) that all the appropriate management takes place and in a way will ensure appropriate maintenance to be undertaken. So, it's not that leaseholds are a bad thing in themselves it's bad leasehold agreements and bad management that are the problem. She seems to be arguing that leaseholds are bad (or giving that impression) when she should be arguing that bad leaseholds and bad leasehold management are bad. As she doesn't make this at all clear, that's what I believe she has got wrong. Hopefully that answers your question.
The lesson here is don't be stupid enough to lease anything. A mortgage is ridiculous enough but a lease is straight up a terrible idea! At least once my mortgage is paid, the property is mine including the land it's on. And with rent you can walk away whenever you want, no strings.
Unfortunately, lots of people don't really have a choice because the first time buyers in large cities like London and Manchester that want or need to live close enough to commute into their work typically can only afford flats and the vast vast majority of flats are leasehold.
I had a leasehold flat and was led to believe by my MP at the time that the leasehold reform act of 1989 would help. It made things worse. Glad I emigrated and sold! They've been talking about reforming this system for well over a century and basically nothing has happened. Don't hold your breath!
You only own the lease not the property or real estate. 99 years is likely long enough for you to use it unless you expect to live for a few thousand years. Leasehold is personal property in the context of ownership of the lease which means you can Will it to a beneficiary. Common area costs are shared costs and not singular to one leasehold unit. But never ever ever trust a sneaky estate agent or solicitor they will fk u over with gaslighting legal terms that only their friends in the judiciary will tell you what the terms mean. Even with absolute freehold title the government will fk you over and planning authorities control what yiu do to alter the structure of your property at some point so feudalism is essentially inescapable to all.
Even better is fleece holds where you gotta pay a management fee for the public areas fields, parks, sewage, roads etc the stuff the council tax is supposed to pay for because the council refuses to accept responsibility but will still demand their full council tax for the work they are refusing to do Oh & if you dont pay they get your new build house
Absolutely agree. Leasehold without the freehold included is merely paying rent in advance. Freehold - ground rent is a complete rip-off. Money for nothing and of ourse as the leasehokde you are expected to pay all repair bills etc whereas as a renter you wouldn't.
Yeah I never heard about this until I came to UK. This is totally fucked up .....fact that British people don't protest about this is just mind blowing. Additionally the sizing of the new houses its fucked up. They sell three bedrooms house which has 65 square meters lol
Scotland does not have leaseholds. England keeps voting for parties that keep them poor and will never change the system to help the little man. Scotland needs independence so we can also have full PR and rid ourselves of the unelected house of Lords and the English monarchy.
I bought a former council flat in Glasgow that and I had to pay a factor which is kinda the same thing. When they decided to upgrade the lighting and do something to the outside of the building, all the owners had to pay but the tenants did not have to pay.
@@Matelot123 Factors are just administrators for communal repairs and buildings insurance. You pay a quarterly management fee to the factor, usually around £30. It takes away the stress of trying to track down all owners in a building to get money for communal repairs yourself. You buy English leasehold property you need to rent the land from the freeholder, regardless of whether you own your property outright or not - its money for nothing for the freeholder and can cost thousands and thousands of pounds to extend the leasehold, so greatly reduces the value of your property if the leasehold is running out. The two systems are not remotely comparable.
@vote4penny940 they may have come from Scotland, but they are very English. Just like a man who's parents moved to Scotland from India before he was born is 100% scottish
My brother in law has this in is flat on Gypsy Hill, he’s”owns” the flat, nice place by the way, pays £12000 a year in various charges AND has to pay multiple Thousands every 4 years (whether it needs it or not) for the whole place to be painted and for a survey and any roof repairs. For years he’s rejected the paining cost (which it 2 to 3 time you could get it done privately (note at end) and hired the scaffolding himself, prepped and painted it himself, small fraction of the cost a lease holding contractor would charge. They didn’t agree until he cited his owner’s rights in the contract. Now he’s startled a joint limited company with his neighbors to take on all maintenance. The thing you have to understand, many of these large multi dwellings were bought up decades or even centuries ago by rich landowners and families, they do nothing now but fleece the people who buy into the lease hold. It’s a really shit part of London property scandal, and the government does next to nothing about it, because let’s face it, most of the people in government are, or are good friends with… yes, those landlords. Shocking
A lot of property in the UK is flats and the majority leasehold. If you can afford a house and have the freehold then good. But most new build flats are leasehold.
The only properties on the market I can (barely) afford are leasehold, and I'm thinking it's better than renting... except I'm worried about my liability of anything goes wrong costing thousands
And if the rich, royalty, etc knew all the peasants had machine guns, flame throwers, etc, would it affect their attitudes? Yes, most definitely. How do the rich ENFORCE their oppression?🤔 Coward sheep disagree and stay poor, in chains. smh
Yeah I'm still pissed that I have to pay property taxes wx a year. I bought the damn house and land, it should be mine. But if I don't pay the property taxes, the government takes it away from me. It doesn't matter if you've lived there 40 years and can't afford the taxes nowadays because the cost of cancer treatments, they kick you off your own land. And I paid sales tax on the house and land at the time of purchase! What other product is like this? They don't take my car away if it's paid for. There's no annual tax. There's a registration fee, sure, but they don't take your car away if you don't pay that. You just can't drive it. You still posses it. I don't buy a pair of shoes and owe the shoe store an annual tax. I paid the tax at time of purchase. Property taxes need ti be outlawed. The government can make money the old fashioned way, instead if extorting it from it's home owning citizens. They can supply a utility and make a slight profit from that. Get rid of the utility companies.
Many years ago, I saw a flat for sale in a road between South Ken and Knightsbridge (in other words a posh area), and its cost was £140k (or there abouts). I wondered why it was so cheap, I decided to view the flat for larks more than anything... anyway, speaking to the agent there was 3 years left on the leasehold. The renewal of the lease would have been between 750k and million quid.
My late wife was a lawyer, from the very first week's of her practice she came out strongly against leasehold properties, she always believed that the field needs adjustment!
I used to live in London and was looking at several properties in the late 80s . All leaseholds. I'm not the sharpest tool in the box but figured that this is basically a bad business deal. Bought freehold in Gloucestershire eventually.
Lease is a beggars last resort. They have 💯% responsibility of anything going wrong and yet all profits and proceed goes to owner of. Things were meant to be for all mankind. French came out with this BS.
Paying rent is a condition of all leasehold. It might be as little as a penny a year, but it's still rent. You only pay rent on something you don't own.
I have little sympathy. These people are adults. This isn’t new. People should know this. It’s basic. If you don’t know the difference between having a lease or owing the freehold, then it’s al on you
You need to look at The Torrens System of property ownership which we have in Australia. It’s light years ahead of Britains antiquated and outdated leaseholder system
I mean... if we take this all the way back to the source then it's CAPITALISM, HEIRACHY and MONARCHY that are the problem. I suggest we abolish all 3 for a brighter future for everyone (bar the rich, they've had their fill)
Capitalism isn't the problem. Its capitalist greed. Chasing big numbers NOW NOW NOW. doesn't provide long term sustainable growth. And when you jump 10% in sales let's say. Next year its 12% they want. So now it's harder to make same profits so to make up they don't give you the adequate pay rise and inflation passes you by. Now you are in debt as the cost of goods go up but real term wages are down. And the cycle continues. This is what's brought this country to its knees. Greed by those with the most.
So if someone started a business from nothing and makes money from it, they've got to go have they? I can certainly see things are out of balance at the moment but I'm not sure what you're proposing is the solution.
Its always been a scam. But its one of the only ways to buy flats or property in multi share buildings. I've always tried to buy freehold only, but if you want something near town centres, its mostly lease hold or you end up paying a gazilion pounds for something thats normally not worth it.
Sadly this is not the whole storey. There's a very good case for having a leasehold (or similar) when you have a flat. A management company to run the affairs of the leaseholders is also advisable HOWEVER, the real problem(s) appears to be with regards to the lack of appropriate legislation (or lack of enforcement) in order to protect leaseholders against bad practices. I'm a surveyor and if I was buying a flat, I would want a leasehold and not a freehold but would be carefully scrutinising the leasehold and management arrangements. There's plenty wrong with the system in this country at the moment but we should be even handed and look at the protections that the current system offers and keep them. Where leaseholders are being served badly, legislation should be considered to stop injustices.
My Freeholder took me to court without my knowledge and took my flat off me by law. White collar crime. My whole life savings tarn of me by the freeholder and the courts.
Quater of a million to manage two small tower blocks by the owners so called management company . New double glazing fitted to both with contract given to a silent partners company.
Its shocking, I’m considering leaving England in the future if I can’t afford to buy a free hold house, I love apartments, but I can’t pay for something that I won’t be the owner
Even when the house is paid for you still have to make property tax, so yeah, really you don’t own anything. You always pay the rent to live on governments land. Freedom is not free.
When entering into a leasehold, thoroughly check the agreement that there's no surprises. If the lease has been extended "informally" they will try to sneak things in, with mine they wanted the ground rent to double or quadruple each year meaning after 25 years it would be over £100,000 or something equally ridiculous, thus making the property unsellable and guaranteed bankruptcy. Live in the property for 2 years to gain the right to extend it formally and it goes to a peppercorn rate and they can't try to screw you over. Still costs more than ten grand just to do that though
Its not always like that. I bought a leasehold Maisonette (a flat with its own entrance and garden), a 1000 year lease, a peppercorn rent of £1 a month and no service charge..
It's genius really. You buy the right to be a tenant, but only for so long. Ultimately you own nothing, but you've tied yourself to the property by your debt/investment in those magic beans. It's how we do things in this country. You can be your own tenant. If you have a flat in a converted house, a common way of setting that up is that you'll own a share of the freehold in partnership with the other flat owners, but then you are all leaseholder tenants of that partnership. See also chancellery.
Do some research on how many flats and apartments are leasehold- near impossible to find a freehold on a first time buyers budget - particularly in competitive cities
@@insight2749 If nobody takes those deals, then landlords will be forced to make better deals. If people continue to make stupid deals for themselves, they have nobody to blame but themselves for the fact that it becomes common.
I was gonna do this 30 yrs ago when I calculated it all it was cheaper to Buy a freehold House ,You should be allowed to borrow what you can afforded to pay for rent
Of course, you're not obligated to sign on the dotted line. It's only feudalism if you don't have a choice. You don't have to buy the house under those terms. The seller can just sit on his unsold house and pay taxes on it.
What nonsense is this? Serf and a peasant aren't the same, sure. One is stuck on their property and obligated to work it, the other can leave for greener pastures (assuming they can find any). But both still live under feudalism.
Service charge in some of the developments are increasing in an incredible rate that if it keeps increasing at that rate, very soon monthly service charge will be even more than the monthly mortgage payment.
There’s another shocking dimension to this for leaseholders in council-owned properties. As a leaseholder you must pay your share of any major works carried out by the council, regardless of the sum apportioned to you. This can mean being sprung with a bill of any amount - up to £50K, £60K even £98,000 in one London case. Often these people are ex-council tenants of modest means who bought their properties via Right To Buy and simply cannot dig deep enough - they face bankruptcy and losing their home. It’s yet one more way in which Right to Buy has screwed over working class people. The Left could stand to talk about this more too.
There is no left. Starmer is also in line with the same values as the Tories. Check out DDN who recently did a video on how both main opposition parties are working together on the same agenda and working for the British American Project. We are classed as the 51st state owned by the USA which is why we always follow their policies and way of life. We are just a mini version of the USA.
And it seems to me that councils do unnecessary work every few years just to fleece people, either the council tax payers or the leaseholders! It’s like they have to spend a certain amount of money within a certain timeframe so they find stuff to spend it on in regards properties. Of course the council could use that very same money to pay for carers or retirement homes or meals on wheels etc but they do not choose to do so.
@@sufmeister786 That DDN video is great. Agree. I’m not sure the British capitalist class needs the USA to tell it to be as rapacious and grasping as possible though. It’s always been pretty good at that historically.
@@jujutrini8412 That may be true. And there certainly seems to be a revolving door between councils and developers - there are a good few councillors in London who have ended up working for Lendlease and other developers. Make of that what you will. But part of the problem is that councils are legally obliged to carry out major works to meet health and safety legislation (lots of fire safety stuff post Grendel of course) and there is no pool of money to support leaseholders when they do so. Hence every now and then some poor bastard is slapped with a bill worth half the value of their flat.
How is this a fault of "right to buy" ? - so because of greedy corrupt councils people are not allowed to buy their houses (which are not affected by this )? - This is only flats and they've always been like this - or should everyone else be forced to fix your roof/common areas ? - So left wing council rips you off and that somehow is Thatchers fault ?
The UK is a on a collision course with a new revolution, the hardest working of us pay the most taxes, and with outdated systems like this destroying the housing market some thing is going to snap soon
Leasehold is like buying one of those sheds of a static caravan then paying 6k a year to live in it and having to replace it , sell it to the site owner after ten years for peanuts never could get my head round that
I bought a hotel room lease 80k the company liquidated , new free holder billed me 17 k for one year even though no one lived there and the money was for the hotel ball room gardens which were not mine and now because I don't have the money to pay the took back the room for free under forfeit
And this is why I bought an old freehold semi built in the seventies with my wife. I got laughed at by friends and colleagues but I’d rather own it completely outright 😊
