The Lord of the Rings: Gollum (Zero Punctuation) 

I haven't watched your videos in years and literally laughed out loud IRL watching this.

Idk if this is the best spot for it but the dice are incredible. Thank you for fueling this dice goblins heart

It was genuinely refreshing. Not of Yahtzee, perse, but in general. I honestly hope they do better next time. They can only either learn from their mistakes, or they can repeat them.

Resident Evil 5 and Metal Gear Survive come to mind.

i disagree with his take that we need to feel bad for them wanting to sit at the "big boys" table. i guarantee you there were employees who recognized they didn't have the resources required to make such a massive jump, and that they were shut down. so i guess i feel bad for those guys, but the company as a whole? nah

@@hinasakukimi do you think it's impossible that higher ups were just really incompetent? i find that very easy to believe.

@@hinasakukimi absolutely. I think Yahtzee forgets that most people don't get sent free codes for their games, and are actually being asked to shell out $70+ bucks for this garbage. THATS what folks are really angry about

This kind of advert definitely felt right up Yahtzee’s alley!

Celebrate? Don't you mean "simulate"? [flashback to five straight natural 1s at the D&D table during the very first combat encounter of my very first session]

​@@jiado6893 it is a perfect fit for Yahtzee! 🤣🤣

I recently lost my level 5 PC to a particularly nasty critical hit so I wholeheartedly agree 🙃

@@Notsogrimreaper98 real

Honestly, if we got a telltale games style game featuring Gollum, I think everyone would have been happier. Except Gollum, but that's just assumed at this point.

Considering that Daedalic is mostly known for games like the Deponia series or the Edna & Harvey series, that doesn't sound too far-fetched.

​@@CoxTHwait they made Edna and Harvey? Damn I love those games. Now I really do pity them.

From the gameplay i seen... I think so too.. a lot of it screams: "This is suppose to be point and click" Especially the escort parts or doing things in the right order parts.

It's like they made a point and click then somebody thought if they made it more of a "real game" it would sell better with the big ip attached to it

They thought they could be EA! (release games they know are crap and still charge $70-300 for them). But this didn't have the FIFA license.

They deserve no sympathy. The DLC is particularly pathetic.

I blame the people that bought the game. They are rewarding this behavior.

The same as in Cyberpunk 2077, Gotham Knights and Forspoken (to name a few) but people became white knights of many of those because they were fans of the franchise or the studios that made em. This is Yahtzee's point if people are gona dog pile em then they should do the same for the other bad games no exceptions. An example many Sonic fans aren't known for taking well if a Sonic game is poorly reviewed because of game breaking bugs or uninteresting boring gameplay, because the fandom blinds them.

@@eduardofrances Thank you for pointing out that Sonic is utter shit and deserves to die. This Gollum game is FAR better made, plays better, and has a better story than any of that Sonic Frontiers bullshit that had a fucking 70 dollar price tag attached to it, but literally crashed on the opening screen.

Even Peter Jackson’s films?

@@zigslotheon Yup.

@@zigslotheon Speaking as a scholar, the PJ films are *not* as accurate as you think. Far too much glorification of combat, for starters. Still damn fine films on their own, just, keep in mind they got a fair amount of details off.

@@Marx_D._Soul Different medium requires changes. a 1-1 adaptation would have not worked.

@@yoashbarak373 Much as I love both the books and the films, I also sort of keep them separate because of the differences. A 1-1 adaptation definitely wouldn't have worked too well. Them also putting certain bits in places (songs and such) or having them said/done by someone else works pretty well. I'm not sure how well the whole section with Bombadil would have worked on film.

Yeah, outside of name recognition, even as someone who has still only seen the movies, Gollum seems like *literally* the worst (major) character in the franchise to build a game around. Someone in the comments of Dunkey's coverage of this "game" suggested that maybe Gollum could have worked as the protagonist for a game in the vein of the _Oddworld_ series...but even that would go against Gollum's wretched, intentionally pathetic character to the point where you'd probably make a better _LotR_ game just by building around a completely original character.

@@MusicoftheDamned Yeah, "pathetic" really is the only word to describe Gollum: Frodo and even _Sam_ were actually tempted (however briefly) by the world-changing power of The One Ring, but after Smeagol murdered his own cousin and best friend for the most powerful magical artifact Middle Earth ever saw, all he did with it was go and hide in a cave under the Misty Mountains for hundreds of years, eating fish and brooding over his "Precious". While a pitiable character, he's not someone with an interesting story worth examining.

@@ArcaneAzmadi Yeah, even from the movies and what they changed, it's pretty clear that being tempted by The One Ring (and rings like it?) and even (briefly) succumbing to its potential power can occur to basically *anyone* as seen with Galadriel's brief freak out. Otherwise I imagine that she or someone like Gandalf or pre-fall Saruman would have destroyed it long ago. The issue is more, as you said, that Gollum does *nothing* with it beyond hoard it and obsess over it outside of killing a few people and literal tons of fish over apparently actual centuries while losing all sense of himself and his hygiene. Outside of the pesceterian and super long-lived parts of that, that's basically just...the most basic aspect of succumbing to The One Ring in general. So I have no idea how anyone looked that and, if not doing it to try to make money off of name recognition, decided that using the wretch of a character whose most interesting aspect is that he manages to get enslaved repeatedly was a good idea, especially for a (bad) platforming game.

What they should have done, is have gollum seek out perhaps a lesser ring of power somewhere within mordor, or hear of such a rumor, and then guide him along the shadows and underbelly of Baradur and the dark lands, hearing the grander schemes of Sauron's generals from afar, observing their movements; he should be a playable *witness* of plans greater than himself, and the moral choice system should just affect whether the ending has a "Gollum" tone or a "Smeagol" tone (irredeemable vs slightly hopeful). Short alliances and inevitable betrayals were Gollum's bread n butter with Sam and Frodo, and this game implements them in the most bizarre way I've ever seen. Also, Gollum is supposed to be at least as intelligent as Bilbo, capable of making riddles and wordplay even after hundreds of years in a cave. He doesn't get much chance to show this in the Jackson films, but they could've made him a semi-personable protagonist if the visual presentation wasn't so abysmally poor and uncanny. I'd love to play as a coyer Gollum who is written by someone smart, closer to his Hobbit self than his Serkis self, and could be properly smug, resourceful, and verbally playful. The only quality they show for him in the game is that he is distrusting and pitiful. The reason they chose Gollum as the MC is because he is the only morally grey character whose actions in Mordor had a period of ambiguity (between escaping and finding Frodo). They probably wanted a game showing the lesser known inner workings of Sauron's armies and his generals like the Candle Man. But there was clearly some major setback or maybe a full mid-production reboot because it turned out unfinished and the lore is conveyed to Gollum directly by the generals who treat him like a pet dog or something.

I’m genuinely baffled here. I saw the non-zero marketing push, I saw the AAA price, I saw the in-addition-to-the-AAA-price bullshit and I assumed that one of the, you know, AAA publishers had taken a punt on a small studio, possibly as a result of a drunken bet. But Nacon? Seriously? Behind Focus Home Interactive, they’re about the middest-tier mid-tier publisher left. What were they thinking planning to charge full whack for a game _this_ outside the comfort zone of one of their small studios? It would have made more sense for that Spiders game with the clockwork robots and that _still_ would have made frig all sense.

@@Pineappolis Nacon seems to be scummy publisher. For Sinking City: After they were constantly late on payments and sometimes refusing to pay devs till last min, they literally pirated Sinking City and modified the gamefiles and are selling it on multiple platforms without agreement from devs. I wouldnt be shocked they will do same for gollum or refused to budget proper and were part of DLC choices.

@@SurrealLeaf Oh, yes, you’re absolutely right - it was Nacon and Frogwares in that case. I got them mixed up with FHI in that instance, for some reason.

@@SurrealLeaf Nacon also published a game with equally as greedy if not more DLC in the form of Blood Bowl 3 so considering Nacon and Daedalic's respective track records I would be more inclined to place the blame for Gollum's dlcs on Nacon.

The Gollum game is just the tip of the iceberg for the next decade of terrible money grubbing LOTR adaptations as LOTR and the Hobbit are going to enter the US public domain in 2033. Basically the license holders of LOTR IP are starting to full on scramble to make money while they still can and/or make copyrightable depictions of LOTR/Hobbit characters (e.g. Winnie the Pooh is public domain, but the Disney depiction of him is under the Disney copyright).

Just make a stealth survival horror game with some verticality,like styx but you cant fight.

Very little people have the guts to make a depressing game like that Which is exactly why it would be such a good idea

Most likely yes. I don't know for sure what licensing agreement Daedalic had, but pretty much any Middle Earth adaptation nowadays has to take place during the War of the Rings because that is specifically what Warner Bros. is able to sublicense after they bought the exclusive film and game rights to LotR and The Hobbit. The Tolkien estate has since been extremely tight-fisted with signing any other deals because they hate what Peter Jackson and Warner Bros. did with the IP.

Because that’s what Marketing says will sell.

@@waffles7858 only problem is when it’s mishandled (not if), it’ll be a catastrophic failure, and we won’t see another attempt at that kind of game for like 15years.

I was just thinking the same thing.

Agreed. I think if the game had come out and been $40 with everything included reviews would have been kinder to it. For full price with additional DLC there is a certain level of expectation and Gollum definitely doesn't reach it even if I think there are some pretty good ideas in the game.

@@robwood1987 Most likely he would have been harder on it if Gollum wasn't being called the "Worst game of 2023" after that title was previously given to Redfall only a few weeks ago, Atomic Hearts before that, and Forspoken before that. I'm also sure within the next month or two we'll have a new game that takes that title, and probably one after that too. Unfortunately, with how sensationalized media has become everything that isn't considered "best ever" or "worst ever" tends to get ignored 5 minutes after it comes out.

I think it's a case of "If you wanna hang with the big kids, you're gonna be judged like the big kids".

It's the naked greed on top of a really bad game that makes it reprehensible. And you won't catch me giving EA, aka Mammon Incarnate, any sort of easy ride either.

I don’t really think that’s a good criticism either because triple A devs like Nintendo and rockstar are pulling similar bullshit with their ports of old games. Rockstar for example has recently released a red dead redemption port for modern consoles that’s: 1: full price despite nothing new being added to warrant that 2: is actually missing dlc outfits that are on the game of the year edition for the older consoles, so they’re not only charging full price for the same 10 year old game, but it’s also missing content. I think the point of the opening statement is that it’s ridiculous to give the gollum devs this amount of shit while the big boys are doing the same shit and even worse at a more frequent rate. This game will be forgotten about by the end of the year. Earlier even.

That's not something that typically gets set by the devs though, that's something that's set by the producers.

why do Gamers always say its the devs that do things like this? they do not!! the devs just want to make a fun game! the producers and moneymen are the shitheads making shitty decisions!

@@benwaffleironI never mentioned anything about devs. People review the whole package that's presented to them. Doesn't matter who contributed what, we still end up experiencing it all

@@benwaffleiron Then they failed even at that.

@@BlazeStorm Wat ? You literally wrote „the devs asked for the 70 price“

Very nice

Good site

Good

Nice

good

he was imprisoned in mirkwood yes, but the elves didn't actually treat him that badly. If I recall correctly, half the reason he escaped Mirkwood in the first place was because the elves would let him roam about in the forest every so often. Under close guard, granted, but that's still a kinder treatment then Thorin & Company was given in the Hobbit. So the elves being nice is ultimately accurate.

@@Catasros Indeed, they would take him out for walks in the woods and let him climb the trees. They were kind in ways that no other character can claim to have been.

They could have punched him in the face once a day and it was nicer than orcs. The Elves are freedom loving people and were loathe to cage anyone. But they had to. And Aragorn never did any orc shit to our guy. But Gollum probably hated the elves more than the orcs for their pity and charity.

What you just related was exactly what I thought the game was going to be about. I was very disappointed when I heard it wasn't. =/

It doesn't excuse the price though. It doesn't excuse the lack of support either. Putting out "an apology letter" and buggering off to the next game is not a developer behaiviour you want to support. Don't buy The Lord of Ring: Gollum.

@@vespenegas261 Oh I haven't and I don't plan to, but there's a difference between something like this and the other games he mentions.

It wouldn't receive this much criticism if it had been sold at $10. People would understand. Indie dev, cheap movie game. Most people would only be questioning and pointing fingers at whoever gave Daedelic the LotR license.

​@@IronFishChannel It *is* good to draw a distinction between games that are shit because the devs couldn't pull it off and games that are shit because of profit-maximizing corporate monstrousness

@@IronFishChannel Yeah... Watching Arkane drowning in the mire of *modern gaming* is painful... With this one I was like "Whatever. Rings of Power already took the biscuit"

ok

If anything, they should be taming notes from tell tale games since THAT would be a more natural next step for them

I still hate them for not giving Rufus a satisfying end.

Deponia was a good series. Morepoint and click players should give them ago at least once

@@Zeon081 Really? I though Rufus had a pretty satisfying ending. It certainly wasn't a happy ending, but it did feel pretty conclusive. Out of curiosity, have you played the fourth game? It came out 3 years after the third game so you might have missed it if you thought the third game was the end. Depending on if you played it, the conclusiveness of the ending changes. Also, apparently they are making a Deponia survival game. I don't know what I think about that.

I hated Deeponia. It was good as far as point and click adventures go, but the humor was so dumb it was insulting. There was not an ounce of wit in that game, unfortunately, compared for example to Lucas Arts hits.

More than 60 years, more like 480 years (c. 2463 when he finds the Ring to 2941 when he meets Bilbo). Yes, I went and looked up Appendix B. [/nerd]

the fact that they sell you a DLC taunt animation (... in a singleplayer game...) where he does "my precious", pretty sure the pitch was just capitalizing on a meme from the 90s for ez nostalgia money

@@ckorp666They did what??? H-how? Who approved this? Is this harbinging of the end times when ET rises from its New Mexico landfill grace to once more haunt the games industry until it crashes?

There is this very neat underlying theme of mistrust, the conflict between the desire for friendship and the inherent inacpability of allowing it due to the prolonged effect of the ring. From what I've heard more well read Tolkiens fans explain on RU-vid, this Golum-Smeagol dynamic only came up once Frodo and Sam met Golum, with Frodo showing kindness. In this game they kinda have Golum experience a precursor of all that with other characters. Yahtzee glosses over that a little bit but I believe it had some potential for an interesting story. Not executed well, but the concept was good.

unsurprisingly little, you mostly are just haplessly held captive by orcs. presumably the tolkein state only allowed the story to take place strictly between the hobbit and fellowship of the ring, i don't see why else would you radically limit the entire tolkein universe to this

you are mad at the developers because the publisher put the game for AAA price. thats kinda dumb don't you think?

@@pureexile1702 Publisher then. The publisher actively made everything worse for the developer despite not being an EA or Activision or what have you

​@@pureexile1702if they didn't think they had a product worth 70$, they should've made it clear to the publishers.

That's really the kicker that got the hate train rolling on this one. A failed but ambitious attempt at a game wouldn't have made much of a splash if it was sold as the $10-$20 indie one-off that it is, but selling it for full AAA price and then locking incredibly basic features as "Extras" behind a $10 day-one DLC will get tongues wagging.

​@@Mernom that's not exactly how publisher-developer relations often work afaik

My god that line had me dying laughing

So you lost your woody? ;)

maybe that will fool the algorithm to avoid getting demonetized for mentioning unaliving

​@@AgentAnderson01self-delete is the go to term nowadays

@@akmal94ibrahim aliven't

@@umlautabuser2769 Decide to let your subscription to life expire early.

@@AgentAnderson01 Algorithm: noun. Former vice presidents' attempt at playing music-genre games, such as Guitar Hero and Dance Dance Revolution. (See also: Al-Gore-rhythm.)

THEY didn't do that. The publisher and distributor decide the price, not them. The publisher also is often the one calling the shots on decisions like that DLC. Given we have decades of Daedalic NEVER doing anything like that, then suddenly doing it with a new publisher, tells us it is very unlikely to have been their decision.

From what I heard the team behind those point and click games is mostly gone and it's new people that developed Gollum.

@@perfilov4 ahhh...that's so unfortunate, I hope their is a spiritual successor studio.

Sadly it seems that the OGs left deadalic and what’s left are higher ups with unreasonable demands and inexperienced newcomers that aren’t given any direction. I even heard of an intern who had to stay longer during crunch time

Gollum

I don’t buy it, he was nice to Balan Wonderworld and then at the end of the year,BAM, he blasts it to worst game of the year.

who was the shark's face in the credits?

No it wouldn't have. Because the devs that made point-n-clicks left Daedalic Entertainment a long time ago. They are Daedalic in name only, like the BioWare that made Anthem.

@@NathanCassidy721 Ah, didn't know that, thats sad to hear.

Looking forward to them!

YAS

Can't wait to get some Grinderbin Dice

Yeah, this screams of publisher morons picking the wrong guy for the job and the job itself being a bad idea from the get-go. That or devs were making the game on their style, then publisher assholes said "no, we want this" mid development

Why does that matter? In fact these “small guys” make you pay to look at the lore compendium AND sell fucking emotes for a single player fully triple A priced game in what world that’s ok for them to do it?

@@arturzinurov4781 Pricing schemes like that are usually up to the publisher rather than the developer. And given that the publisher here is Nacon, who are known for publishing shovelware and screwing over small developers, that shouldn't be a surprise.

Its priced as a triple A game with innovative day one DLC such as: "A codex" and "Iconic Emotes in a single player game". They rightfully deserve to be shit on.

@@shaheedk.3386 not saying the game doesn't deserve scorn. But Yahtzee took a more humble approach of simply leaving it marked as a bad game made by people not ready to create what they aimed to

@@shaheedk.3386 And missipple the name of their own game in the "apology" letter, that's a special kind of sloppy, no wonder the game is this awful XD

Erm, pretty sure he's a Brit?

@@hitotsudaketsukinoko Well he's a Brit if we go by birth, an US-American if we go by where he's currently living, and an Australian among others if we count every country he used to live in as part of his identity.

From what I heard the team behind those point and click games is mostly gone and it's new people that developed Gollum.

@@perfilov4 Maybe Daedelic got tired of being an idie studio and wanted to compete with the tripe A scene and failed???

The thing is even if the game was polished and was mainly bug free the game would still be shit. The core gameplay is shit, there is no fixing.

Balan Wonderwold.

I wish he mentioned the micro transaction lol. They charged you for better voice actors it’s crazy

No. The developer takes a work order and delivers a product. Saying mean things about the ones making the game because you're pissed off at a bunch of suits is about as midwit-layman as you can get, Mister Animepic

Feel bad for the devs, not for the publisher that decided on the price and the dlc bullshit

You start doing 14 hour days with unpaid overtime and see what kind of game you make…

@@brianmcdaniels6321Actually his name is Ani Mepic. I believe it’s it’s French Canadian.

Arg yes the same way I blame the waiter when my foods undercooked. Why is gaming for some reason the only industry people just seem to forget the concept of higher ups making decisions?