The Middle East locomotives that weren't built for the Desert - LMS Stanier 8F 

5:04 Note that 45166 is in Israel, not Turkey. Beer Sheva is a large city in Israel. The locomotive had to be imported in secret to Israel from Turkey due to the problematic diplomatic relationship between the two countries. The locomotive has been renumbered 70414 in reference to an Israeli song about an "aging" mainline steam locomotive (no. 70414) being sent to the scrapyard and being replaced by a "younger" diesel locomotive.

Even less known example of locomotives shipped to other countries for war: original KCR steam locomotives of Hong Kong (built in UK 30 years prior) shipped to the Middle East during WWII. I was unable to find any record of their eventual fate in the Middle East. If anyone knows what happened to them it’d certainly be an achievement.

There is a very good reason these and the American locomotives did not make it to France before it was liberated. That was because the Royal Air Force and the United States Army Air Force took great pains to stop the Germans using it. They even used the 22,000 Grand Slam bomb, or earthquake bomb, to shake down a vital railway viaduct and bring down part of a mountain on top of the line running through it. After they'd finished with it no trains were traveling anywhere in Northern France.

Turkey apparently received these locos as part of a way to keep them neutral during ww2 , while they also received krieg locomotives from Nazi Germany, also in regards to ROD locomotives at the beginning of World War Two , Britain had in France a couple of jinty 3fs and a couple of William deans 2251 class fitted with pannier tanks, some were captured by the Germans when they invaded France and the dean 060 was one time pictured at Smolensk a few years later

I’d be amazed if an 8f showed up at my nearest heritage railway… I don’t think they ever travelled as far as Australia

It's interesting how different the exact same engine looks with different fixtures and fittings put on it

Fun fact: the 8f 8233 as mentioned in the video is currently a memorial inside the Highley engine house on the svr to royal engineers and rail personnel who served on railways in the middle east and north Africa during world war 2

I either don’t work or I finish early on a Friday. These videos are the start of my weekend, every weekend

The 2nd NZ Expeditionary Force (mostly railwaymen) has drove one of these Stainer 8fs in the western desert during the Second World War and there was a book I got called "The Desert Railway" by Brendon Judd, only in New Zealand.

Its interesting to me that many British locomotives when exported overseas ran into the repeated issue of having to little capacity for fuel and water. That was one of the big issues the D&RG ran into with their Double Fairlie Mountaineer in Colorado, it simply didn't have the kind of fueling range they needed between stations and they eventually took a flatcar and slapped an ad-hoc tender on top. I think if anything it shows how tightly compact the British network is with frequent water and fuel stops available, verses overseas networks especially in arid regions. Its not like American exports were perfect either, especially in wartime... as the issue with British crews understanding how to read American water sight glasses attested to when a handful of various S160's had boiler explosions over the course of the war. While all the core basic engineering mechanics of steam were the same everywhere, those fluctuations in appliance fittings or tender capacity or a myriad of other small factors seems to be the main issue in localizing an overseas export to any railroad.

Countries like India, Pakistan, Malaysia, etc mostly have British Built steam Locomotives, because they were British Colonies, so another reason why British steam locos are in abroad is because they were a British colony!

I once followed the Nile up through Egypt on Google Maps. At one point I spotted some black lines close by the Nile that turned out to be a lot of abandoned steam locomotives. Does anyone know if they disposed of the engines somewhere random in the desert? Didn't seem to have any connecting tracks either. 🤷🏽‍♀️

In the early eighties, I was working in Iraq and was surprised to see an 8F in the bay platform in Baghdad main station with one con-rod missing. The only concession to Middle East conditions appeared to be a double skin on the cab roof.

"Didn't arrive until the fall of France" That could've made an awkward delivery hand off. "Okay here's the trains and... Er... You're not British are you?"

Lyrics to Around the World - Daft Punk: "🎵Around the World🎶" x144

In Italy we had fifteen of these engines, registered in Italian State Railways as 737 Group. They served until 1956.

The GWR provided 62 Dean Goods locomotives for the war effort in WW1, working for the ROD in France. 55 of these returned home after the war. When WW2 happened, the WD requisitioned locomotives for use in France, including 108 Dean Goods, but only 79 of these made it to France before it fell. Of these engines, 24 had been sent overseas in WW1, making them veterans of both world wars.

This was an awesome short! I love the 8F, such a chungus of a locomotive. Sheer power and energy, beautiful and sturdily built.

Love "All Around the World" as the background music

Just discovered your channel. Kind of been binge watching all morning lol

Fun fact about TCDD 45160 from someone who has worked on her some of her parts are actually from some of the 8Fs that reside at the bottom of the pacific ocean and they are some of the most relyable and pristine parts of the locomotive

Turkey also recieved some 80 kreigloks, german WW2 era DRB Class 52 locomotives, which were used till 1980s. It would be interesting to see British and german WW2 locomotives working together in a neutral country.

8Fs arrived in Italy too, where they outclassed all local classes. They were phased out after the war on account of lack of spares. You mentioned this !

There is the remains of a pair of 8Fs on and around the wreck of the Thistlegorm in the Red Sea, they took a direct hit from the bomb that sank the ship, and were blown in two. They are accessible by divers.

My second favorite class of steam locomotive!!!! And also I noticed how this video ties is almost perfectly with train boy’s after all you two did Caleb.

The song choice in the bg is much appreciated lol

Check out the John Bull. Built in the UK. Operated from 1831 - 1884. It survived the Civil War and last operated on its own power last in 1981. Its a cool old train

I love the subtle "All around the world" outro lol

To expand off this, you ever heard of Erie 2524? It was an Erie K-5 Pacific that was donated to South Korea after the Korean war and apparently had a career doing passenger work there. The 1954-55 Erie promotional magazines might have more info on it.

0:37 I didn't know the saying "or Bust" Was around in WW2, I thought it modern thing.

I’ve seen 48624. It’s a beast. Seen it at the East Lancashire Railway and I work there. Been working at the Railway now for 8 years. Another LMS 8f went to the East Lancashire Railway number 48518 only went there to have its frames scrapped. It’s the only preserved donor parts LMS 8F. It donated its boiler to its classmate 48773, don’t know what happened to its tender and it’s last remaining parts are at the Llangollen Railway. Most of it’s part are donated and scrapped. It’s possible to bring it back to how it was before it started donating parts but it’s gonna cost an absolute fortune to make so many new parts for her. New tender, new frames, new wheel sets, new boiler etc. it’s really sad to see it with small amount of it’s last remaining parts and that really makes me want to collect the parts and bring it back to life

We all see what extreme heat will do to the rails, right? I wondered how the railwaymen in the ME maintain them in such a great heat and distance?

I enjoy watching these videos while I’m eating at lunchtime.

one of my absolute favourite steam locomotives, happy to hear about them

Great Video as always. Keep going There are still locomotives, that are a great part of war history and also heavy lifters. That being the german Kriegsloks. Despite germanys attrocitys and war crimes (I am german by the way) the locomotives built by Nazi germany are great in design and functionality.

Does anyone know about the 8F that was preserved in the Turkish town of Izmit? It disappeared around 2014 I think? It’s area was Replaced by a tramline.

Could you Cover the MInature Trains of WW1 they were interesting trains put up in a short time .

I live in Baghdad and apparently, the location of the LMS Stanier 8F is located near where I live. I just need to get there somehow.

Do you think you could do a video on WW2 locomotives? Stories where they were captured or something happened to them? I've been trying to find such stories on my own but can't seem to find much on the subject :/

Wait, that soundtrack though.

@Train of Thought Can you do an episode on British locomotives in India, I don't know much on the subject and easily available information except on a few Bayer Peacock Garrets is hard to come by. can you please shed some light on the matter.

There was also some Australian built locomotives in the Middle East, that actually faired pretty well!

The music choice is genius.

4:40 8247 is actually with us anymore, it doesn’t say online but it’s been moved, I just don’t know where. Great video!

For anyone wondering, the image at 3:37 is of a NSWGR S type Carrige. This originates from NSW, Australia.

The troubles of steam engines in deserts helps explain why Santa Fe -- which crosses northern Arizona, New Mexico, and the Mojave desert of California -- was so quick to replace its steam fleet with diesel locomotives like the EMD FT.

Preserved LMS 8233 worked as BR 48773 from 1957 when no longer required by the army as WD500. See en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMS_Stanier_Class_8F_8233. It carried a distinctive non standard top feed for a while.

Great work ToT!

Nice to hear Hong Kong is mentioned 😌 Our rail was powered by WD 2-8-0 after WWII for a few decades

Amazing history❤

You used some fitting music for this video🙂

nice choise for outro music haha

Speaking of war engines Do you think you can a video on the USATC S160?

Haha classic ANZAC Larrikin's in that photo at 0:50

great video

Whoa, an 8 bit version of ATC Around the World for a music bed.

New sub! Liked 🙏😮

I read that Iraq had some streamlined steam locomotives delivered to them from Britain during the war, but one was lost en route (probably because it was during the war).

If you think that's amazing then you have never heard of the DRB Class 52 they are the only WW2 era steam locomotives still used to this very day and there are a lot in preservation unlike the other WW2 designs

0:10 *WHEN THE WIND IS SLOW, AND THE FIRE'S HOT, THE VULTURE WAITS TO SEE WHAT ROTS, OH HOW PRETTY ALL THE SCENERY THIS IS NATURE'S SACRIFICE, WHEN THE AIR BLOWS THROUGH WITH A BRISK ATTACK, THE REPTILE'S TAIL RIPS FROM IT'S BACK, WHEN THE SUN SETS, WE WILL NOT FORGET THE RED SUN OVER PARADISE*

I saw 8233 like a week ago in the Engine House at Highley, so annoyed that I thought it was just another 8F and didn't know this 😑😑

the american diesels they would have had wouldve been RS-1s GP7s also there are no 8F's in my country and my local heritage railway only has a few old northern pacific and Canadian Forest products locomotives

Queensland rail depot at Ipswich had an obscene amount of engines stored in 2009. Don't quote me but I think many have been donated to India.

Wow 😯

0:41 I just realised was Australian rollingstock

Here's a thing you see there's the class z witch is a tank engine from us it was a Baldwin locomotives work one

If, like me, you were baffled by a Turkish engine on display in Beersheba which in Israel, I discovered that there is a Turkish railway museum there, celebrating the long political ties between the countries.

I'd love to see a video of the usatc locos and their survivors

You would think that modifying some South African locomotives designs would be ideal for conditions in the Middle East?

I'll try to hop on the 8233 as I am currently working in the Derbyshire and can easily go to the Severn Valley Railway :D

Was that around the world by ATC? Lol nice touch

Yey I've seen the bowness and kinneil engine! Or what's left of anyway due to its over hall ! Think I have pictures of it 😂

I'd forgotten the Tony Orr version was a parody cover, so the background music was quite a trip.

You forgot to mention that ex GCR 8K 2-8-0 s were also sent to the middle east and some were RODs who saw service in France duringWW1

What happened to the engines in Egypt are they still there and are there any photos of them?🤔🤔🤔🚂🏜

Interesting to see

Thank you

I did noticed that there is one USATC S100 is also at Israel as well.

hmmm,there are a lot of steam locomotives left as display in many stations in romania

Only realized at the end that the background song was ATC.

I love the representation Australia got with the first troop train

How many Stanier Class 8Fs were lost at sea?

they're like the trains the germans used, some of them have travelled all over the place, fact i believe some might still be in use

I'm in the thumbnail

sandworms of "Dune" by Herbert

I'd like to see that China Rail KF7 run again. It's a pretty interesting looking engine, looking a lot like an americanized British engine but I'm willing to guess it's probably too large for Britain for either loading gauge issues or just the fact it's a 4-8-4.

I don’t care about trains. Subscribed.

There is a weird beauty in a steam engine being at the bottom of the sea…

is an 8f a black 5?

What’s the song called

The 8fs having the requirements to run on the railways kind of look like flying Scotsman While on her American tour

Can you talk about steam condensers?

Philippine steam engines when?

Misters Worldwides

And even Italian railways!

Italian 8Fs have been all scrapped in 1953. They briefly served with Italian State Railways as 747 class.

Henry in middle east????????

Why didn't they have two tenders, like Flying Scotsman?

"Something we all love: WAR."

Stram trains are beautiful, but I wpuld never want to drive a steam locomotive in a hot climate because it's shoveling coal into a hot furnace