The Order of Operations is Wrong 

Harald Hey It doesn’t.

yup because it doesn't

Yeah I can’t believe people actually thought that It should be PE(MD)(AS) to avoid confusion

No one has, because it doesn't I agree with Yrok24. It should be PEMA. Because anyone that understands math knows Multiplication and Division are exactly the same thing (as is addition and subtraction).

It's called BEDMAS

Gerry C That’s not the point. PEMDAS is only for kids. When you know math from grade 5 onward there’s no left and right.

If they're equivalent, then there's no need for left to right. Sum them in any order you want.

@@SteichenFamily Division and Multiplication have the same preceding. But if you don't go left to right you may get a very different answer.

According to PEMDAS multiplication and division have the same precedence, and are done left to right. But that's wrong. Multiplication can be done in any order, just like adding and subtracting. But division cannot. Division must be done in the correct order or the solution will change. Also, in most real world math multiplication should be done before division.

@@SteichenFamily no, not true. You cant do multiplication in any order if the operation contains division. 6 * 5 / 2 * 5. See, in this question you would get 3 if you do multiplication in any order. But the correct answer is 75, which is achieved by going left to right. See, addition and subtraction give same answer no matter what order you follow, but not true for multiplication or division. It is good practice to go left to right instead of solving parts of questions randomly.

Mswordx23 thank you, either he misunderstood what he was taught, or his teacher taught him wrong

Mswordx23 No Minute physics understands that, He shows you at 0:24 that you can get different answers by following PEMDAS.

christian garrison No. There's only ONE answer if you follow it, and it's the answer you get if you go _left to right._ The answer 5 is wrong because he didn't go left to right, which is what PEMDAS teaches. At 0:12 he claims that it tells you whether to do addition before subtraction. He doesn't understand.

Mswordx23 That may be what PEMDAS means, but there are plenty of Mathematics teachers that do a terrible job at conveying this, and simply tell their students to just follow the order that PEMDAS tells you to follow. I guess they assume that some future teacher will explain the whole multiplication&division and addition&subtraction rule to the kids, but this never actually happens. He's not getting PEMDAS wrong; he's simply telling us how it is (incorrectly) taught to the majority of America, thus why most Americans on Facebook will say "20÷2X5 = 2 idoits use pemdas"

Mswordx23 I'm surprised he didn't know this or respond to this comment. Now I feel like all his other videos are wrong as well. :(

That's not even an unspoken rule. Every time PEMDAS was taught to me, they mentioned that.

Not exactly though. For 2+5-4, I would still in my head subtract the 4 first.

@@thomasrosebrough9062 well yeah but thanks to the communitive property those are the same thing

that rule was very much spoken every time I've dealt with them

@@thomasrosebrough9062 you still going to get 3 due to number properties unless parenthesis is applied.

Joseph Crespo in Canada its BEDMAS lol I'm so confused

BIDMAS here :P

For me is BODMAS

I was taught BIDMAS

BEDMAS and PEDMAS are the same thing. in PEDMAS the P stands for parenthesis (), in BEDMAS the B stands for Brackets....the first letter consistently represents a symbol of enclosure. You should all know by now the US always has to be "special".

Nope - Not even his country uses it like this. This video doesnt really make any sense....

Yea i was taught the same as you

He learned it wrong

Same, we’re taught this is Sweden too

Even in the US they teach you the correct way. If you don’t listen in class and only remember PEMDAS, though, you will probably falsely believe that addition comes before subtraction

Except the phrasing "PEMDAS" doesn't capture that extra priority tweak you "remember". If it starts "P then E then ..." then anyone who doesn't fully remember the extra rules (or was never taught them) can easily infer it's also "M then D then A then S".

Because this video is bs

Same!

@@irrelevant_noob (can easily infer it's also "M then D then A then S".) Only if they weren't; paying attention the MANY times it is explains as not being like that.

@@MrGreensweightHist not paying attention to WHAT? Did you somehow miss my "or was never taught them" -- because i know i've never seen this before encountering it online. PS Fun fact: Another video on this topic, "How School made you Worse at Math" reveals that the American Physical Society Style and Notation Guide actually explicitly describes multiplication as a different and prior step before division. So it depends on who teaches you.

The same went for addition and subtraction

+A to Rhombus Yes.

me too

same here

same

That's the way I also learned in in the 90s.

Did this *actually correct* rule got lost overtime or something? I mean, in the country I live in, the teachers are still teaching the exact same thing with no modification whatsoever.

thats the way I learned it in the 2010s

And that’s not the way I learned it. You do it with an order. Numbers in brackets first, then multiply, then divide, then add, then subtract

so where do you do exponent.

sounds like an xkcd comic

BUT THE INTERNET MAN SAID... Teacher: Shut up. Student: INTEEERRRRNNETT MAN!!! NO!!!

"YOU ARE DOODLING! BE QUIET!"

robbie haha

robbie Is it bad I do that during my actual classes

Not just the UK. Everywhere except Minute Physics' hometown I guess.

@@jewsrbad antisemitic username AND you're a physics crackpot huh? get a life

"with the explicit caveat that division is really the same thing as multiplication and subtraction is the same thing as addition" That is taught in the U.S. well, but there are students who ignore that part, just as there are in UK, I'm sure.

What the heck does Bimdas stand for???

@@TheBigGuyBillyBob brackets, indices (i.e. exponents/powers), then DMAS is the same.

Same here

Actually, I was taught that not to long ago, about 4 years.

+PotatoMan In the 8th grade I had a hick math teacher (moved out to the boonies for a year) try to teach the class that the order of operations was multiplication then division then addition then subtraction. Being a math geek I told her she was wrong in class, which she proceeded to try to talk her way out of. But then I grabbed the teaching book on her desk about it and proved her wrong. Then she got confused. She talked to the other 8th grade math teacher and conceded she was wrong about it. So yes, some ignorant teachers teach it that way. Even if they have the right way in front of them. It does happen.

But seriously how did he get through school thinking this? My middle school teach would have instantly set him straight.

@@stephaniesummer2663 Because He is correct in that once you get into hign enough levels of algebra it's often more effective to work with parentheses, commutivity, negative numbers etc., and so you rarely use pemdas. He probably forgot what exactly it was, only that at some point he stopped using it. I think there is a valid broader point to be made here but he incorrectly said the stuff about ambiguity and addition before subtraction, which really distracted from it. It's more just about how it's quicker to restructure equations, and often easier to visualize certain mathematical techniques, when operations dont have to be arranged a specific way left to right and instead are focused around groupings. What he probably should have discussed here is common core or something similar, which I think is what he was really advocating without realizing it. Which makes sense since lots of physicists/engineers/mathematicians often end up using methods like that instinctually when they do arithmetic.

TacitIron Hav I do know PEMDAS is rarely used in higher level math, but I’m a little baffled that he thought every elementary math teacher taught it wrong. I do know the benefits of making math more flexible and I usually solve problems that way if I can.

@@IronicHavoc That's why there is a show called "are you smarter than a fifth grader?" It's because adults forget things they learned in grades below 9.

@@IronicHavoc I am taking Calculus 3, and we still use PEMA The D and S are useless since everyone knows Multiplication and Division are exactly the same thing (same thing with addition and subtraction).

In all honesty, those problems are usually made it so they are ambiguous using notation that I haven't seen any math teacher use

I can say people that really is good at math Really hate those instagram math question. They arent hard but i think the "only genius can ....." is what infuriate them.

@@manghariz2211 What infuriates me about them is when they are ambiguous, so they can have multiple answers that are all equally valid from the given information, but then they claim everyone is wrong unless they come up with the same answer the creator happened to choose. Like... if you want everyone to come up with the same answer, then give enough information to rule out all the others. If you leave it ambiguous, then don't tell people they're wrong when they give you a valid answer you weren't expecting.

@@IceMetalPunk But there is one set of rules everyone should understand and it's just pemdas. If there is no enough information, pemdas allows you to get rid of ambiguity. The problem is that everyone one apparently remembers how to apply pemdas in a slightly different way. I am aware that there are many convention for order of operations that differ greatly from pemdas, but pemdas is what everyone was taught in school, everyone should be aware and understand it and apply it where the problem seems to be a basic school problem (all those social media math problems looks like basic school problem, so I deduce pemdas is a way to go).

@@jarlfenrir Oh, I agree. I was talking more about those math "riddles" that usually use pictures or arbitrary symbols to fill in for variables, and say "only geniuses can solve the last equation". And then to actually solve it it's not math, but some trick of inference based on how the pictures are drawn that could mean many different things even if you notice it. Those are the ones that bother me.

PEMDAS is, and has always been PE(MD)(AS) Sorry your earlier teachers didn't explain that well. Early grade teachers are required to know a little about a lot of subjects, but it makes them less ideal for getting any one particular subject quite right.

BTW mine specifically told us that it should not matter what order you solve bodmas so long as you do not cross orders. BTW for 6/3/3 I get 2/3 6/1×1/3×1/3=6/9=2/3. Do all multiplication and division simultaneously and do not simplyfy till you have reduced to a single fraction if possible.

Yes yes yes.... people would show me those math problems that are supposed to be unambiguous and they would never trick me and they were always angry as to why my answers were so consitent

It’s easier to learn if you colour code the order of operations I was always told brackets, indicies, division and multiplication, addition and subtraction. Dunno how it is in America cos im British

We learned it as you follow the order of operations, but you do it from left to right in groupings. So you do your multiplication and division in the same run, from left to right. Same with adition and subtractions.

If an answer can only be attained through order of operations you are doing very low level math that isnt that important anyways. Cough cough viral math problems

@@hassanakhtar7874 like 2+2=4

That's how I was taught and I'm from the US. I find it weird whenever someone says they were taught to always add before subtract and always multiply before you divide. Maybe my algebra teacher was just a badass and taught us the underlying mechanics a little early. Because, as is stated in the video, subtraction IS still addition, just adding a negative, and division IS still multiplication, just with a fraction. So it would make no sense why you would always add before you subtract, etc

I was actually taught BEDMAS which is basically the same thing except instead of "parentheses", it's brackets, and multiplication and division are swapped, only proving my point that the order of multiplication and division does not matter.(as well as "+" & "-")

You know? This would have been really great to go over more than once in school. Im sure this fact was said at one point but never really elaborated on. I now know why randomly I would get an answer wrong in highschool.

Xenxe I think it would be better if the basic concept of the operators were actually thought rather than the function/result of the operators. In many cases the basic concept of addition and subtraction are provided when first taught, but not revisited later, particularly not when order/sequence became important in a string of operations. Otherwise 3-3 = 3+(-3) becomes clear. So would 3x3 = 3+3+3 or 3^3 = 3x3x3 = 3+3+3+3+3+3+3+3+3... any operator. It would sound simple and obvious to you now, because you know this. But to a child learning it, it is really valuable and powerful information. The idea is to present everything in addition (division can be done this way as well) as the common denominator (you do not want to answer why 1+1=2, so it is very recommended to not go further :D ). Not a quick way to learn/do maths? Think again. After a few exercises, the student will soon learn to shortcut the process by doing the actual operation, just because it is quicker than breaking it down to so many additions - and the student wants to finish it faster. But by then, they would have internalized what PEMDAS tries to do, thereby rendering PEMDAS not only unnecessary, it does not create confusion nor what you have experienced.

Agree

But I dont see that in the abbreviation. It clearly has M before D and A before S.

Sayam Qazi and other people write it as BODMAD which mean the same thing

Sayam Qazi “bUt I dOnT seE thAt iN tHe aBbreViaTioN” then you weren’t taught well, sorry. It is taught that they’re on the same level. At the same time I can understand that the acronym does not include “and” , but again that is taught.

@ Sadly, there are teachers that teaches it this way, and arguing or correcting them is just gonna give you an F

Watch the video again, please.

Yeah, you solve then from left-to-right order

That's what I thought, too. Parentheses Exponent Multiplication and Division Addition and Subtraction And orders are from left to right, as you said.

You read it like a book, solving left to right

Agreed

Agreed

LAURIE Q. I also believe that is correct

they did the same for me too but i am a fifth grader btw

That's where the ambiguity comes in because try doing 6 ÷ 2(1+2) = ? Pemdas gives you 9 Old convention gives you 1

This is why fractional notation for division is better than the divide symbol. There's no ambiguity as to which terms are in the numerator or denominator

Aaron Zahradnik I would say that I agree but even in fractional form, there still remains an ambiguity due to the order of operations. One could still argue that 1+2/(x+2) = 1/(x+2) + 2 because division holds priority over addition/subtraction.

Perhaps he IS wrong. He tried to look smart by correcting an issue that isn't there in the first place. I'm from a third world country and even our schools aren't this bad

@@69elchupacabra69 true. Except there are still too many people who have gotten confused with the order of operations because of the acronym PEMDAS. They remember what each letter stands for but forget how to actually use it properly. I know a 30 year old who doesn't remember and i consistantly have to remind her and correct her on it. Her mom who is in her 50s also does not remember how to use it properly.

@@ballroomdancer2010 in that case PEMDAS is not wrong, it's the people. Otherwise that's like saying long division is wrong because there are people that get long division wrong. Heck even people do simple addition wrong.

Sore wa chigau yo!

Luciano Martinez I mean, he is wrong; multiplication and division have the same priority, same with addition and subtraction, and for operations with the same priority you always go left to right so his examples at the beginning weren’t ambiguous in the slightest, and his example at 0:46 is just completely incorrect based on how PEMDAS actually works

Ex: 5*3-6/3*7. 15-6/3*7 15-2*7 15-14 1

The way I learned it was (P-Parenthesis)(E-Exponents)(MD/DM-Multiplication & Division)(AS/SA- Addition & Subtraction)

Your lack of faith disturbes me.

In elementary I did p-e-m-d-a-s but in middle school I'm doing p-e-m/d-a/s

Agreed about missing a huge part. This video confused me, because I thought everyone knew that the MD and AS part of PEMDAS meant to complete those in the order they appear. So, on 8-2+1, you'd do subtraction first because it appears first. If anything, this video complicates a very simple operational theory of mathematics.

P.em.d.a.s makes a lot of sense .because it's not a mathematical law, it's just a guidance in the order of operations especially for fourth form students until they come to learn mathematics inside out as pro just like us. Videos like these are misleading to beginners in mathematics and should I say quite confusing and discouraging to the learning of mathematics which is so important in life's journey .

​@@barnieclarke7829Just remember the thing not done stupid acronym.

According to this guy, it'd look more like (P(E(MD(AS)))).

punkducky69 actually it would have the P as the innermost parentheses. ((((P)E)MD)AS)

This is actually the real pemdas cuz teachers are stupid

Kyle Miller roots are x^(1/...) so they're already covered

What would Parentheses mean? This statement is a paradox.

This; all order of operations teaching will say 8-2+1=7. If it doesn't or didn't then it is 100% incorrect and the person teaching it taught you wrong.

I agree it is seven. I don't know what you're trying to get at here.

It's always addition - subtraction from left to right.

Blab Morrison "It doesn't mean addition before subtraction" It does on the BBC Bitesize page. A well respected revision tool used by almost all secondary schools in the England. www.bbc.co.uk/education/guides/zsnycdm/revision Children ARE being taught these rules and it's confusing all of the mathematics they try to learn there after. I don't think people realise what a problem this is. If I had been in school the day they taught this (I happened to be ill that day) I think I would have struggled with maths a lot more

Why can't we just add +ve terms and add -ve terms and then subtract -ve total from +ve total. easy right?

Yes, because in a sense, you're not subtracting a positive number, you're adding a negative. It's something easier to visualize why an equation of all addition/subtraction can be solved in any order. The standard Order of Operations is really just required when using anything above that, however.

Ran, that does not work. Unless you change the subtraction into a added negative, it does not give the same answer. The associative property, if I'm correct, is the property that you can do a problem in any order you would want to if it is addition OR multiplication.

gameguy8101 But subtraction and negative addition is the same thing, just viewed from different perspectives. In fact, an equation like 7+3-4+9-8 could be simplified into 19-12=7 by lumping together the positive and negative values. 7+3+9 = 19 and -4+(-8) =12. Addition and Subtraction can be done together in any order, no matter what. Like I said, it's only when you tie in higher expressions like multiplication or exponents do you really have to worry about order of operations.

I've been told that, but after learning from that same teacher that they were interchangeable. I mean, it doesn't make sense that one day she just teaches me all that they're interchangeable, then the next she yells at me for not strictly following the acronym. If I remember correctly I brought it up in class that they were interchangeable and she specifically told me that I can't switch up the ordering on PEMDAS... *sigh* But yes, that is not a part of the US Standard, it's just idiotic if teachers decide to contradict themselves day by day by day.

Go on Instagram apparently it is😂

+Alexandra Roceanu I think their problem is that they thing you literally have to follow everything in the "PEMDAS" rule. They are not taught that Multiplication and Division, and Addition and Subtraction go hand in hand. As a result, they think addition must always be first.

+Daniel Ramos who is taught to not do those hand in hand? Is the rule different in amarican education? if so, that's dumb.

No, of course the rule isn't different in the USA. My guess is that Math Teachers over there emphasize strongly on PEMDAS without strongly emphasizing that M/D and A/S are of equal rank. So you end up with students who know PEMDAS but don't understand that M/D and A/S are of equal rank.

don't know what this pemdas is but it sounds like our bimdas XD lol. unless it wasn't taught very well to us or the teacher at one stage, my classes were always taught that it was in order for bimdas (pemdas) multiplication then division, addition then subtraction. could be as i stated it may of not been taught to us/other people with emphasis. but this explains why that system always seamed retarded to me, mainly bcos i was most likely taught wrong XP

+ChaosPod If you learned PEMDAS, you learned it in the US, since it's written in english. Also it has 6 letters, when you separate 4 operations. The rule officialy taught where I live has the operations addition and subtraction as one and the same for multiplication and devision. So actually, it is the US's fault, or at least the english education System camera up with it, either way PEMDAS is intirely wrong!

I dunno, that doesn't roll off the tongue as easily...

Klaty lol

+beto hax The 'left to right' rule is crap. You can still perform the expression 8-2+1 right to left as long as you understand that you must perform it as 1-2+8 left to right: 8-2+1 =6+1 =7 right to left: 1-2+8 =(-1)+8 =7

Exactly what I was thinking'. Yes, that is, in fact, grammatically correct.

P E MD As

Oh, I had a math teacher in 6th grade who was THAT bad. After learning (from her no less) that they were interchangeable, I argued over one of my answers because she counted me wrong for not strictly following the order of PEMDAS. It was not a problem of clarification, I explained to her many times in many different ways that they were interchangeable, she just decided to ignore the rule that those operations are interchangeable. Granted, the US Educational System is not generally that bad overall, though there are a few imbecilic teachers out there... I wouldn't be surprised if some of the teachers in the US Educational system "forgot" to teach that some operations are interchangeable. Then there was that time our whole class took 20 minutes to teach her how to say "crayon"...

Darticus the Great Haha, my god that is bad. What state did you live in? And what is it about the pronunciation "Crayon" that gets people so mad? One time a big argument broke out in my family during a reunion over whether to pronounce "Crayon" as \'kran\, \ˈkrā-än\, or \ˈkrā-ən\. Is she one of the people who pronounce Crayon as "Crown"? xD

this video is a big lie

This was the motive of the vdo still everyone missed lol

Exactly how I learned it in high school, after being confused from it by being taught something completely different in middle school.

Yeah, paused at 20 seconds just to see if anyone stated. What on earth were they thinking?

yeah, that's how i learned it in middle school. makes sense, why else would everyone get taught that

I learnt that as well. It's not weak, it's just not very well-worded. I get what he was trying to get across, but it could have been explained better.

It should be GEMS (Grouping symbols, Exponents, Multiplication and Division, and Subtraction and Addition)

and high school math courses teach distributive property... we learn order of operations first in elementary or middle school...... so dont think we're dumb like that or teachers keep us in some bubble. we DO learn different ways to do algebra, just later on in high school.

+Aboorvaa the way you get 5 is by distributing the - for no reason at all, lol 8 - 2 + 1 -> 8 - (2 + 1) -> 8 - 2 - 1 = 5 When really you're adding 1 to -2, giving you 8 - 1 = 7. Adding 1 to -2 means you should be subtracting less, giving you a greater number than if you had just subtracted 2 (6 < 7). PEMDAS accounts for this, like you said above ^ I don't know why Minutephysics randomly distributed the - as if that's what PEMDAS says to do :/

+Aboorvaa i was going to say that, i never learned that multiplication comes before division, or addition comes before subtraction

Your correct, we learn it like p,e,[md],[as] Know as multiplication and division and equal, same with addition and subtraction. so when you see division then multiplication, just go in order, then do addition and subtraction in order also to get a answer, Min solved it like [8-(2+1)] = 5, when really its [(8-2)+1] = 7..... Kids are going to take over at some point xP

+Abby S yeah addition and subtraction can be flipped, just like multiplication and divsion

Me too.

exactly. that's how it's taught across the country to my knowledge. I don't think they knew that...

I was also taught this

I'm in the US and that's what I was taught here. I also wasn't taught any kind of acronym, which I suspect is what led to such a misconception. You can't say 'parenthesis before exponents because P is to the left of E', and then go on to say 'the M and D are simultaneous'. Strangely though, this did remind me of a calculus problem with an infinite number of 1-1-1's. For some reason, the way to solve the problem was to insert your own parenthesis at various points. Now thinking about the order of operations, this strikes me as a flawed argument.

pinkyfull yeah multiplication and division are grouped together and performed left to right. As well as addition and subtraction

Roses are red Violets are blue Existence is pain I just wanna die - Random meme I found

I like this better than the actual pneumonic.

its also spelled like that exactly

What if you got a friend

Jazzy S *Mnemonic

James Foley please

No

My friends and I said Please Enjoy My Darn Awesome Spaghetti

Shawn Elliott what does that have to do with order of operations?

It's an alternate mnemonic device, XpertDre.

We follow the same rule in America. The people who made this video are idiots. I love most of their work, but... this is just stupid. We learn PE(MD)(AS), the same as BE(DM)(AS). 1. Parentheses (Brackets), 2. Exponents, 3. Multiplication/Division from left to right, 4. Addition/Subtraction from left to right. Seriously, this video needs to be removed. I can't understand how it has ANY positive votes.

You Sunk My Fishy Sadly I have to agree with you. I love these videos, but this one solves a problem that never existed. You described what was taught in my school and my mother is a grade school teacher that teaches the same thing.

You Sunk My Fishy Adam Brackney That's probably the best response i ever got to a hate comments. Thanks for being rational.

***** That is... quite possibly the saddest information anyone has ever shared with me.

***** Maybe the word PEMDAS is the wrong way of teaching people the order of math operations since it seems so misleading. I always thought about the hirarchy that way: 5^3 = 5*5*5 = 5*(5+5+5+5+5) = (5+5+5+5+5)+(5+5+5+5+5)+(5+5+5+5+5)+(5+5+5+5+5)+(5+5+5+5+5) So oviously the brackets first - then the most complex operations beeing Exponents/Roots, after that the less complex operations - continue in that order. And the complex operations are just the short notation of a chain of more simply operations. But if you need it you can think of it as the chain again. Because of that I never learned anything besides the multiplication table until 10*10, like the square numbers until 25 or things like that, my teacher wanted me to^^ If I have to multiply 16^2 without a calculator it is 16*(10+6)=160+6*(10+6)=160+60+36=256. That's the beauty of math - you don't need a clue of anything and can still get a good grade. Only a small set of rules - go play around. So if the acronym PEDMAS dosn't help people understand that concept - I don't know why anyone would use it. I don't think we have that problem here in Germany - but maybe I just didn't recognize it...

Implicit multiplication should not be avoided.

@@okaro6595 "properly defined"

" two possible answers" - no, there's only 1 correct answer, 1. I wrote a whole order of operations thread - textbook references, proofs, the works - which you can find if you search for it (RU-vid removes links, except for Wikipedia). In short 2(1+2) and 2x(1+2) aren't the same - the former is 1 Term, the latter is 2 Terms (and so the latter term gets flipped out of the denominator and into the numerator... which is precisely why you should never break up terms).

@@okaro6595 There's no such thing as "implicit multiplication" - it's a made-up rule by people who have forgotten about Terms and The Distributive Law (both found in Maths textbooks).

@@smartmanapps5588 and what do you base your argument on?

lmao

which exactly? if he learned it with pedmas, or if he learned math?

No, his version of PEMDAS is completely wrong.

Which is good, because PEMDAS removes all the principles and beauty behind arithmetic. Who cares about PEMDAS and whether someone has learned it well and getting right answers in tests when you can do so much more?

He did point out that multiplication and division were basically the same operation and addition and subtraction were as well...

yes you do the mutltiplication or division in the equation as they are chronologically displayed, not just multiplucation first then division so that's why I hate all teachers now for not having standardized this

This.

Ariz Trad I was taught both in two different states. He probably lived somewhere that taught it P E M D A S Instead of P E MD AS

Yes. Order or operations is correct. Its those who think that multiplication is before or after division who are wrong. They happen at the same time and use left to right to determine order. B,E,MD,AS

Yes, then they teach you how to write it with less ambiguity... From A Level maths, I'd see 6/3/3 = 6... I would tend to see it as a 3 tiered fraction written as (6/3)/3 [rewritten as (6x3)/3] or 6/(3/3) [rewritten as 6/1]. Rather than the 2/3 suggested by BIDMAS (or which ever form you most wish to look at). At A Level you would be corrected from writing 7/3*2 and be told to write it as 7/(3*2) or (2*7)/3 dependant on what you meant; and this is more the point of his video, the answer's given using Orders of Operations can be open to interpretation if you have a deeper understanding of fundamental mathematics.

Thank you

These guys are stupid

I learned this in my first school but when I changed school the people were just I guess they weren't thought that or something.... Like *sigh* It was fifth grade and they didn't know PEMDAS!!??!?!?

No, they DON'T "always specify" that those have the same priority. In fact, our tests' problems were constructed to never conflict with the strict P>E>M>D>A>S order of operations, so we were left not knowing that 5 - 3 + 2 = 4 until a couple years later. Instead we knew only that 5 + 2 - 3 = 4.

iWeeGouldyi Yeah, it is (left to right on equal ranks): 1 (p)arentheses 2 (e)xponents 3 (m)ultiplication/(d)ivision 4 (a)dd (s)ubtract Or, pe(md)(as)

Yep, i don't see what the fuss is about. It's a simple system really

The point isn't about how easy the system is to learn, clearly it is simple to learn since it is taught in elementary schools everywhere. The point is that there need not be such a system if you understand the underlying principles. This video is lamenting the fact that the education system tends to teach students how to "do math" as a mechanical process instead of teaching them how math actually works.

I can agree with you there, some teachers throw an equation at you without telling you how it works. Which i feel is a complete and utter fuck up in most cases. I struggle to apply the correct equations if i'm not taught what the equation is actually doing for us. Differentiation, Curve Sketching and Integration come straight to mind

iWeeGouldyi it’s that way in America too, Minute Physics either changes it for a better video or just didn’t understand what it actually meant

If you follow pemdas literally, then addition comes before subtraction, so " "8-2+1" doing the addition first gives "8-3" or "5". If the rule is to do addition before subtraction then there is implied parenthesis at "8-(2+1)".

+Aeroscience Sorry but I was taught the Addition and subtraction are same priority left to right.

+Marcus Haffcon me too. It was definetly 7 to me.

spaceye Henry is just saying that people are obligated to do the addition first. I mean PEMDAS D U D B I T T R I A O C N T I O N

Zacho Gilman Stupid Device! I meant to but Addition under the A and Subtraction under the S. But our order of operations has it like this.

it made me feel the same way as well. nice way of putting it.

Me too

***** No because in pemdas you do the math left to right so there is no mistake. 6/3/3 can only be 2/3 and 8 - 2 + 1 can only be 5 0:20. He is doing pemdas wrong to begin with so he's stupid and you're stupid. Addition is not before subtractions they are on the same level so whichever is on the left goes first. same with multiplication and division. it could be read as P: First E: Second MD: Third (Depending on order) AS: Fourth (Depending on order)

MattsFat Cat Ooops I was also blaming the video for being plain wrong but now that I see your comments, I have to admit that Minutephysics has a point. I mean either you do it right to left and then 6/3/3 is 6/1 which is 6, and and 8-2+1 is 8-3 which is 5 OR you do it left to right and 6/3/3 is 2/3 and 8-2+1 is 6+1 which is 7, but you can't have a mix ! Now I 'd have personally said that to be correct brackets MUST be used for ambiguous notations and so 6/3/3 is just as meaningless as 4%5&829?8 and one should write either (6/3)/3 or 6/(3/3) but never 6/3/3. 6+2/3 is unambiguous and doesn't require brackets to give 20/3 or 6.6666. Now, casually speaking I would have always interpreted it left to right (just the same direction as one reads ) and therefore to be two thirds, and this is the way any standard computer interpreter would do it. As the wikipedia page states " In order to reflect _normal usage_, addition, subtraction, multiplication, and division operators are usually left-associative while an exponentiation operator (if present) is right-associative". This said, he should have talked about associativity and reverse polish notation... But all in all in the end I realise that what is REALLY wrong is what is taught in the US: PEMDAS (and AFAIK is not taught anywhere else), because PEMDAS gives priority of multiplication over division (which is wrong) and priority of addition over subtraction (which is also wrong). It really should be: PE(MD)(AS)... with brackets :-)

***** ***** So here's the thing: All three of you are correct, along with this video, but all three of you are also wrong(and the video). It is a common misconception to think that every teacher in a nation will teach something the same way as the way every other teacher does. This isn't true at all. For example, Throughout my lifetime, it was explained to me more as I got older that PEMDAS has layers and more meanings than just the abbreviations. One of my teachers changed it up one year and that helped clear a few things up for me, using a seven step process instead, but a high school teacher of mine finally pieced it all together for us(Daniel Poston of McGavock High). He taught advanced precalculus/trigonometry and told it to us like this: P=parentheses along with all other grouping symbols, including above/below the division bar E=exponents and square roots, along with any exponential reasoning in the problem M or D= multiplication/division A or S= addition/subtraction In all of these, you solve from left to right as the standard because that is also how we read, and will be considered the standard form. This still gives you multiple ways to get the same answer, but it will give you the same one every time. I see nothing morally wrong with it, and believe that I was taught PEMDAS the correct way. You all sound like teachers and I'm sure can easily come up with your own examples to play with and try to prove me wrong.

It's an excellent video. Understanding grouping opens up so many more ways to simplify an expression than the literal order of operations does.

I think it’s a great video. Only those who didn’t take higher level math classes think it’s dumb.

I mean, I could say the same thing about SquareSpace. It is an immoral mechanical structure that dictates using just one of the many ways of creating websites, locking them into one path through the beautiful html/etc landscape and robbing them of any insight into what they are actually doing when they are creating web pages.... Do you see how silly that sounds?

yes he left of the parentheses i learned order of operations with pe(md)(as) which put them on the same level and then we were taught to move left to right

yeah, you just multiply and divide left to right

Yeah in Canada we were taught the same thing, but we called it BEDMAS (B for Brackets)

That's not what it implies. He is saying that you basically just do what a computer does. You don't actually ever get to understand what is going on.

This. Standard OoO learned in the US says that "8 - 2 + 1" equals 7, not 5.

SSJ5Cloufiroth No. The standard one equals 5. PEMDAS- the first thing you do is addition before subtraction in which turns it into 8 - 3 = 5

+MotorsportsX 6/6/3 is still ambiguous. It's not wrong so much as it's a norm not a mathematical truth and it sometimes gives more than one answer.

+Martin Gardner no.. It's definitely not. It's understood you work the problem left to right. That's part of the universal process of doing math. This is a non issue.

MotorsportsX you never stated that in your original post. And it's far from universal, that's entirely the problem. This is a convention, not a truth.

+Martin Gardner then go ask any math professor anywhere how to work a math problem. I know you worked hard on you little video here but that doesn't make you right dude.

It's not my video (which I feel like is a compliment, albeit an inaccurate one), but, no, PEMDAS is not universal, we don't have it in the UK for example and other people are commenting on this video with other system. That's a thing with a convention, people are free to come up with other conventions if they like.

Order of operations are important. If you’re doing the same problem as someone else but they follow order of operations and you don’t and your get different answers, your answer is incorrect.

@@themimsy Certainly getting the right answer is important. The point is that it's just not necessary to strictly follow "order of operations" (particularly the "left-to-right" nonsense) to get the right answer.

@@themimsy The order does not matter as long as you understand how the operations work. For example: 2 x (1 + 4) = 2 x 5 = 10 Or 2 x (1 + 4) = 2 + 8 = 10 See, it doesn't matter whether I multiply first or solve the parenthesis first.

Even if you are doing everything right, there are still some ambiguous cases with hidden operators and signs that mean different things. For example, what is 4 / 2(2 + 2)? You could mean 4 / (2(2 + 2)) or you could mean 4 / 2 * (2 + 2). Or what about -3². It could mean (-3)² or -(3²). You can probably show me a math website that solves these cases, but I can show you a math website that says different.

Indeed, I was told addition/subtraction and multiplication/division were left to right, therefore always yielding the same answer.

that is why the little rhyme thing goes: please excuse my dear aunt sally the 'my dear' and 'aunt sally' are together because when you are doing +/- you are doing it from left to right, whichever comes first. same with multiplication and division.

OMG! Minutephysics, PEMDAS is set up as gen. overload explained. when doing multiplication and division, you do them from left to right, the same with addition and subtraction. I know I basically just said what gen. overload said, but you get the point. Next time, think a tad before you post influential videos. This generation's children is still learning you know.

I agree here. You (the author of the video) have overlooked a very important part of PEDMAS/PEMDSA

well my teachers were wrong... they told me PEMDAS not P E MD AS lol i actually learned something from youtube !!! told u mom lol

lol yes my fellow aussie

Bodmas?

Bodmas sounds like a holiday where you walk around shirtless.

same I'm the UK

Americans like being different. They don't want to follow what everyone else does but thinks their stuff is universal.

+Corné Keetels Yeah! Most people do this.

+toonchagirl doesnt that make this video kinda obsolete

+toonchagirl doesnt that make this video kinda obsolete

+toonchagirl doesnt that make this video kinda obsolete

+toonchagirl doesnt that make this video kinda obsolete

other places in the world dont teach the left to right thing which is why people get it confused, this video is still very informative to the confused group and very helpful, i see no reason to take it down

Benjamin Mourad It would be much easier you just say left to right thing in the video instead of making things more complicated. I actually got more confused by this video. If they say that addition should go before subtraction in US something is clearly wrong with the schools there.

the thing is, he said that subtraction is also technically negative addition which is why you go from left to right in cases of no parentheses and a subtraction operator and an addition operator. same for multiplication and division where division is technically less than 1 multiplication

Benjamin Mourad Yes I know that same goes for roots which is exponents less than 1, but he also said that PEMDAS meant Addition before Subtraction in the rules definition which is very wrong. If that's the way USA learn this rule then it is clearly something wrong with the schools in USA as I said before :)

.

order of operation is same across the whole world, math is universal. "standard in the u.s" does not exist. These PEMDAS or PODMAS or any othes stupid acronyme is just acronyme to help kids remember order of operations. It has nothing to do with rules of math. Doesn't matter what acronyme you use, math is still the same.

@@noncanot Please Excuse My Dear Aunt

@@noncanot math isn't quite universal in that sense, but it's pretty close and something like this woud be a pretty big issue.

ah yes, John with his 200 watermelons, trying to act like that would be a normal scenario anyone would encounter in real life

i noticed that too

You will also get 7 whether you add or subtract first which really makes me doubt minute physics' calculation abilities

+Callan Carne I doubt yours. If you do addition first you get "8-3" which is 5. Please relearn the math I learned in Preschool. I beg you.

(-2+1) is -1 mate. -(2+1) is 3 but there arent brackets in the question indicating to minus the 1

BEDMAS (the way I learned which is the same) was specified that it's actually BE(DM)(AS) and the dm or the as can be switched depending on the order left to right. it's a quick memory aid to help remember the order

Here

im a BIDMAS boy

BEDMAS here

Ah yes, Barentheses Ixponents Division Multiplication Addition Subtraction

Unknown is actually, Brackets Indeces Division Multiplication Addition Subtraction

lol

Yep, agreed. Most math teachers aren't stupid. It's not P, E, M, D, A, S. It's: P parenthesis E exponents MD multipl. & division AS addition & subtract.

I mean we could do PEDMSA but that's hard to pronounce. Besides, the teachers tell us that multiplication and division are together. And addition and subtraction are together.

And left to right.

P - Parentheses E - Exponents M - Multiply D - Divide A - Addition S - Subtraction Yes it does. If someone is teaching you that it doesn't mean that, they're teaching it wrong.

Eirik Sæther What they should teach are the four stages of importance. Brackets (or Parentheses) first, Indices (or Exponents) second, Multiplication and Division third, and Addition and Subtraction fourth. Generally, as long as you do * and / before + and -, you'll be okay.

Eirik Sæther No, no, it doesn't. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations "Mnemonics are often used to help students remember the rules, but the rules taught by the use of acronyms can be misleading." "These mnemonics may be misleading when written this way, especially if the user is not aware that multiplication and division are of equal precedence, as are addition and subtraction. Using any of the above rules in the order "addition first, subtraction afterward" would also give the wrong answer to the problem 10 - 3 + 2 " If you use the mnemonic robotically, without understanding the actual rules, you're doing it wrong and/or teaching it wrong. So PEMDAS is misleading, absolutely. Wrong, not really.

Coding Math Yes! This is exactly what I'm talking about. Maths is beautiful, more people need to understand it.

Exactly! When I was taught this, it was multiplication and division, then addition and subtraction. We only say PEMDAS do help us remember it.

Well that's how I learned it. Addition OR subtraction, whichever is first left to right.

Bingo

same

That's a failsafe method. By doing that, you're guaranteed to keep the negative signs attached to the numbers they're assigned to. But it's just that: a *method*. It isn't the underlying system itself. It's important because sometimes you can't just go from left to right. For example, here's a basic algebraic expression: x - 3y + 2y You can't just start from the left, becuse 'x-3y' can't be simplified. Which, by the way, is really what you're doing when you do basic addition: '5+2' simplifies to '7' for example. You could say 'just do every possible operation in order', but then you get the wrong answer, because you'll attempt to do '3y+2y', get '5y', and end up with 'x-5y' overall. In reality, the minus sign is attached to the '3y', so the expression can be rendered as: x + (-3y) + 2y This makes what you need to do more obvious (which is to do '-3y+2y' to get '-y'), but it's still the same expression.

David Ward Well said. Couldn't have explained it any better than you.

12121212131212 I disagree simply because of the fact that neither I, nor anyone I know was ever taught the "left to right" rule. PEMDAS by itself doesn't say anything about left to right. Now that being said, you're correct in saying that simply acknowledging this "left to right" rule would solve all the mathematical issues with PEMDAS and give you the correct answer. Though I agree with you as well that the overall point is good. It's better to teach the principles rather than one method that gets you the right answers on your homework.

Tristan Fullmer Where I live in canada it is taught Bedmas(Brackets instead of Parathesises) and that you complete them in the same order as bedmas, left to right.

Demon Penguin We were taught it back in the sixties

Barry Smith The more I've talked to other people about this, the more I've found that it really depends on the teacher. Even in the same school the detail about "left to right" isn't always mentioned. Regardless though I still think the overall point is still valid, though the example they used seems to be taken very seriously by other viewers.

***** this is taught to students in the 5th,6th,7th grade, they don't appreciate the beautiful math behind order of operations, they just want to learn the the simple math first, then the great algebra

Yeah, many of us also graduated from college that required us to do our own "maths." He got it wrong.

***** But he doesn't ever use it... So what's the point of using a 6 step rule for algebra when you can just learn math in a proper way, and then do whatever you want as long as you get the correct answer? (obviously I don't mean WHATEVER you want but that you follow the rules of notation). He doesn't have a use for the "rule" and he's really good at math judging from his knowledge of physics. Having a major doesn't require use of PEMDAS.

***** I think you simply missed the point of this video. The video says that the order of operations is "morally" wrong.

Derfoklishe Finally someone with enlightened mind. Thank you for making me think everybody here is ignorant.

+Derfoklishe I at first I felt alone, but now someone is on my side about this shit.

What

@@quantumgaming9180 distributive and associative property are axioms I think

20 seconds in and this is hurting my soul

@@dannyramirez3875 did you actually finish the video?

He did also state that subtraction is really just the addition of a negative number, and that division is multiplication with fractions...

Yep, I learnt it as bedmas. (B for brackets, why call it parentheses?)

michael benzur because brackets are an entirely separate thing and have their own meaning.

so y'all don't even say brackets (half the syllables) when you mean the maths symbol?

You miss the point of the video. As the video states, PEMDAS is just one of the methods, and the way USA teaches. The problem comes when people who are taught different methods believe their's is the ONLY method. The UK teaches BODMAS (Brackets, Orders, Division and Multiplication, Addition and Subtraction). Notice that multiplication and division is ranked the "same" in hierarchy. So the British performs the 2 operations from left to right, not giving priority to multiplication. No one is wrong, but you're just communicating using different language. And as the video recommends, use parentheses is avoid ambiguity.

+HrHaakon Thank you for bringing up polish notation. It does have the benefit of an unambiguous order of operations, and while it seems harder to grok that may just be because standard notation has the inertia it does.

+HrHaakon I was taught that PEMDAS derives from the idea that the most complex mathematical ideas should be dealt with first. The idea is, there is addition/subtraction at the most basic level, multiplication/division are just repeated addition/subtraction, exponents are just repeated multiplication/division, and brackets for grouping take priority. I don't know how right the idea is, but that's what I've been taught...thoughts?

Michael F Well, summation can be defined in terms of counting the same way multiplication can be defined in terms of summing. So you're correct that multiplication is in a real way more complicated than summation. But the crux here is that there is no mathematical law saying that you should do something first, so I don't accept it as a mathematical rule. It might however, very well be why PEMDAS is a thing. That and some things being easier, like you can write 2x instead of having to write 2×x.

+Michael F That is absolutely Correct! Order of Operations began when Multiplication was invented Centuries ago, which has Always had precedence over addition. The Order of Operations is around 500 years old. It is not new, it is not a baseless silly thing, it is based on Logic and the History of Math. All math at its most basic level is addition and subtraction. That is how every machine does every math function, swapping 1s and 0s around, in big chunks. This video is total BS.

Gah I hate prefix and postfix

Joe Daniels Same!

same thing has PEMDAS, just different sayings for Exponents and Parenthesis

And a different order, but if America doesn't care about that then it's basically the same

Same!

what's the 'o'?

I was taught the same way. My little sister and I had an argument about it and turns out she was right. I paid attention in class but what I noticed was my teachers were very old school and hers pretty much was starting off as teachers. Time definitely has something to do with it I’m a since that way things were taught changed.

I feel like you are the only one hear who went to school past elementary...

Toshimahalaketa hear????

sorry.... I have been up god knows how long -_-

Because multiplication and division have the SAME priority, that means it doesn't matter what order you take them. Right to left or left to right will give you the same exact answer..

👏

8 - 2 + 1 Add OR subtract then PEMDAS genius?

+Rayres he meant in order, use common sense

+Rayres =7 which ever comes first homeboy

Adam Fauver I have no clue, i didn't learn murican

GamingKing2436 it’s 4

@@SkKedDy it's 10^3

You’re The problem: 8-2+1 8-2=6 6+1=7 Done If you want to do it the other way (technically you are supposed to go left to right, but addition/subtraction is an exception to this ): -2+1=-1 8-1=7 Done Same answer Always go left to right though, safest option

Nuclear Unity Adding negative numbers is not an exception to the left-to-right rule.

@@leoalper4530 idk how he ended up with 5 in the vid smh it dosent make sens

***** Exactly! You do multiplication/division and addition/subtraction from left to right, not the way it's stated in PEMDAS. (I just think he's a little confused).

So it was a flaw on minute physic's behalf to assume such information?

Yup. Flaw on minute physic's behalf. You're right Diddy, it gets me aggravated seeing "Pemdas" called wrong >-> - There's nothing wrong about it!

But by simply looking at the acronym, it DOES say that addition and multiplication come first. The acronym needs to be supplied with additional information about interchangeability for it to be correct. Arguing about the concept as a whole, the video is incorrect. Arguing simply about the ambiguity of the acronym, the video is correct.

Absolutely not. The video is not correct, because they displayed the acronym wrong. It supposed to be written as: P E MD AS In this one, multiplication, division, etc. are on the same level and you must do which ever one comes first. The acronym is not ambiguous, he just displayed it wrong.

Darticus the Great The entire point of the acronym is to be easy to remember. Adding additional information would make it harder to remember. The acronym works because everybody knows that addition is not before subtraction. That's something people are told when they're taught the order of operations in the first place.

Or dividing and diving, adding and adding, subtracting and subtracting, or multiplying and multiplying? Either you're teachers an idiot, or you are

+Carson Reidy *your

actually, you do which comes first. Say you have 3-2+1, you do it from left to right. SO it would equal to 2. Same with Multiplications and Divisions. So if I had 12 ÷ 2 x 4. It would equal 24

Infinatis ...my point exactly...

8-2+1 8-2=6 6+1=7 2+1=3 8-3=5

But it's not 2+1, it's -2+1, so it should be -1 and it should be 8-1 which is 7

jstyledipset Actually it is in PEMDAS. 8-2+1= ? Standard Form (left to right) Taking the first two numbers I subtracted two from the first number which is eight. Equation so far: 8-2=6 Now I am left to do the last equation. Taking my sum of six I add it to the remaining number which is two. Equation so far: 6+2=7 The answer is seven (correct). PEMDAS styled equation giving correct answer: (8-2)+1=7 Order of Operations (PEMDAS) According to PEMDAS, we add first as the A(dd) is in front of the S(ubtract). Equations so far: 2+1= 3 Now we subtract the sum from our remaining number. Equation so far: 8-3=5 The answer is five (incorrect). PEMDAS styled equation giving correct answer: 8+1-2= 7 Enjoy.

Katarine Karakove But it's not 2+1, it's -2+1

thats what u think but not americans fuckhole

yeah i was thinking that and im like, no you're wrong mr.video

3 years later, I also support this. PEMDAS only works correctly if it goes from left to right. This video is annoying.

"And depending on how long the division bar was, that determined when you divided." That isn't a thing.

​@@MrGreensweightHistMaybe they are referring to nested fractions? Like one half divided by one quarter. I'll try and write it out vertically 1 -- 2 -------- 1 -- 4 Instead of one divided by (two over one) divided by 4 which would evaluate to one over two over 4. This then either becomes one half divided by 4, or one divided by two fourths. This branch means it could be 1/8 or 2. Of course the implication here is that you're supposed to make the lines either shorter or longer depending on which two numbers the fraction is dividing. However this is functionally the same as including parentheses around each component fraction. You could also multiply by the reciprocal and avoid the nested divisions anyway.

@@EnderSpy007 yeah, nest fractions are annoying, and that could very well be what they were thinking of, though () would be needed to make that happen in linear Using your example.... 1 --- 2 ------- 1 --- 4 Would have to be (1/2)/(1/4) Otherwise we get left to right priority. leading to 1/8th instead of 2 I think they missed that aspect.

duuuuudde rally kevin if you actually listen they do everything correct.

Winston lam no they don't

Kevin Zhang Yes he does. It may be true that some schools teach you that multiplication and division go left to right (and same with addition and subtraction), but the moral concept of pedantic order of operations is actually correct. The video implies that although PEMDAS is not exactly wrong, it takes away the true meaning of Algebra. How do we know this? -8-2-6. With this problem, I am easily free to proceed in any order I wish. Instead of doing PEMDAS and going in the "correct order" and getting -16, I can factorize the entire problem. -2(4+1+3). Now I can proceed the operations within the parentheses in any order I wish. Regardless, it will give you 8. 1+3=4+4=8 because addition is both commutative and associative. -2(8) = -16, f3(8-1)=. As stated by minute physics, multiplication distributes. Lucky for you i know what that means. The following problem asks (in words), what is the numerical value for 3 times the quantity of 8-1 or 8+(-1). Now if you proceed with PEMDAS, you would solve the operation within the parentheses first which is 8-1 giving you 7. Multiply that by 3 and you get 21. However, here is where you are wrong. 7=8-1 am i not correct? If 7=8-1 therefore, 3(7)=3(8-1). now the number within the parentheses can be changed in any way as long as the operations within the parentheses are finally equivalent to 7. Therefore, 3(8-1)=3(2^2+4-1). Now here is the part where PEMDAS is NOT entirely wrong. If you impassively solved the previous problem, you are probably thinking that "well 3x2^2=6^2=36. If you add that with 9 (12-3), it obviously does not end up with the correct final answer (21). But, before we multiply 2^2 by 3, we need to square it because exponents come before multiplication. Therefore, 3(2^2+4-1) when distributed= 12+12-3=24-3=21. Now i could keep rambling about why PEMDAS is wrong with polynomials, quadratic equations, variable expressions, imaginary numbers, square roots and other mathematical concepts. But before you accuse anyone of being stupid, be sure to have some evidence to back yourself up. Learn some math kid. If you need some more explanation, I'l be here waiting for a reply.

The Hero Software: Matt Hero11 did...you just re-explain the video? why? if he didn't get it the first time, he wont get it this time.

true that.

-radiating?- you mean rooting

@@connorconnor2421 thaks, I do not speak english very well ...