love this i made beats i dont like trap beats they sale lol my friends are artists ill play stuff i like they like wow thats the best you ever did me i like funky stuff im looking something never been done when i heard beasty boy for first reverse 808s i love when i first heard drill drum rolls pop smoke i still suck at it i jus wana make it my own next level navie D the professor salute
Steven King once said that reading awful books can help him to realize what words or sentances can sound ridiculous and awful. Ed Sheeran also said that he used to write songs non-stop. So that he could "put-out" all of his bad ideas. Sometimes, failing helps a lot.
this is all very true but you fail to consider the fact that ed sheeran still manages to never get over those bad ideas and thats what gets released in his music.
Another thing I notice with bad beats is either the lack of confidence or too much confidence. Producers need to learn that not every beat has to be made to be a hit and not every beat you make is gonna be the best beat ever. I have so many projects that I went into knowing it won't ever be seen by the public, but I made them because I wanted to practice and experiment with new ideas before putting them into something I want to use.
Taken from experience this goes for every work of art. Drawing, making music, making games, etc. I personally make charts/maps for community ran rhythm games (if you don't know what this is, a simple way to think of it is a level designer, or someone who paints living things, if we are to compare the task to something more well known) Not every "map" I make is going to be a great one, but I can always try again, or run it back and try improving it. Make many things, learn from the mistakes and come back later to ideas that might not have taken off. Sharing with the community is important, at least sharing with fellow creators, getting tips from both more experienced people with a good view, and less experienced people (that have an interesting perspective) is very useful and has often made my maps much better.
For me it's too much contradictory tutorials. I get told do this for better beats then 3 videos later it's don't do this cause this actually does this and that instead or something
the thing is, trash beats for some reason keep getting picked by (trash) artists, and the beat you made that really sounds special gets overlooked most of the time
The beat has to start somewhere. Throw a bunch of sounds at it. Subtract what you don’t like and work with what does sound good to you. Kind of mold the beat to work for you. 😎👍🏽 I like making music this way. Works for me.
i do this almost every beat. i make an 8 bar loop with almost all the stuff in there, like super maximalist. then spread it out to never really have everything in one bar, except maybe at the most dramatic point. but only if it makes sense. maximalism for maximalism sake is not good imo. try to make the beat a journey to ramp up to something. but sometimes, especially with boom bap, simplicity is king. listen to rza, kool keith or mobb deep. many of these beats are almost just 4-8 bar loops basically. but they still work. i feel like with rap instrumentals in particular, you want to serve a possible mc and give it some space and not have your beat to be too distracting because of weird sounds or too much intensity in the wrong places.
@@brainrottedindividual word. I open a session and start with whatever sounds good and build from that. I do believe complexity is a real good tool if used correctly. You don’t want to over stack a bunch of melodies and ideas all over each other. But if you work with ideas and mold them to work with each other… that is magic. I know hip hop beats are made to be simple. I use hip hop to make more complex structures and changes… where it’s no longer a beat but a song on its own. Instrumentals all day. 😎👍🏽
I think it’s cool sometimes random shit be good when you stumble but your inside instinct and others will let you know is if it’s trash and it’s cool pushing boundaries just know 9/10 it maybe trash
i’ve been producing and learning on the internet for 7 years and ngl i was skeptical of ur channel at first bc many yt producers are the same. but you always have good takes and i always learn something new. keep uploading so i don’t have to watch anyone else
#3 is so true. In my experience you generally only want 1 or 2, mayyybe 3 complex parts going on at once, and absolutely no more. I honestly usually stick to one; use an interesting sound with a couple effects on it and give it a good foundation with some background chords and bass and you're good. That way the beat is easily memorable (only 1 complex part at a time to remember) and there is enough room for vocals to go over it. That being said, when I first started out, I absolutely was in the mindset of "every part needs to be super complex and tie into every other part perfectly and if every beat I make isn't All of the Lights, then I'm a failure." I think that wanting to be great and fear of mediocrity can sometimes cause artists and producers to overcompensate and try things that they aren't ready for yet, or that might just be a bad idea in general. On that note, I think just calming down, taking a moment, and treating each beat like it's just another beat and it's not the end of the world if it doesn't work out can actually not just make you feel better, but will lead to better results too. At least, it's working for me now.
I agree with your take. If you listen to modern trap, it's usually a piano or guitar base with chords or a phrase, a baseline, drums, and a thin lead or thick pad that creates the main motif in the melody. This creates a sense of movement without moving. Great comment!
It sounds great on its own but would be unusable for an artist, and would be incredibly difficult to expand into an instrumental song. One thing to keep in mind is that the song isn't your 4 bar loop.
@@NavieDoddwin's another beat content creator who focuses on livestreams and viewer engagement, check him out. Might be your style of comedy and stuff, his trash beats series is a funny watch to see what concoctions get created XD have a good day Navie!
Not only can you learn from this what not to do but you can also choose to utilize some elements of trash beats as a stylistic choice. After all theres all sorts of lofi, hyperpop and other stuff that utilizes sounds and elements that are usually undesirable so choosing consiously to utilize trash beat material in ones own beats wouldnt be that wild
New subscriber to your channel. This is only the second video of yours I've watched. Just came in to say thanks for sharing your knowledge. I haven't made beats in years, but I can totally get behind what you've outlined here. Especially when it comes to knowing the rules first so you know what to break. That's what the greatest producers know. Keep up the hard work, bro!
Good info Navie! I especially agree with keeping it simple. The first time I heard "Paper Plates" by Gza, I understood how dope a very simple beat could actually be.
To be a simple beat it needs a very strong good catchy melody to carry the beat and maybe the artists melody fills out the rest of the simple beat as a song.
@@oblivioxnah bro. There are some very dope beats that are still fire with no vocals at all. To me, some of the simplest ones are some of the most inspiring, because they aren’t at all complicated, but are still 🔥.
@@QwayczarMusic for sure and there’s definitely exceptions to every rule. And exactly a lot of edm or chill have no vocals. Im saying more in hiphop if the beat is simple you need the artist to add some melodic elements if the beat doesnt have much melodically going on
@@obliviox No doubt! I agree w you 100. It comes down to what your goal is w the beat. Are you making it as a stand alone instrumental, or something and artist can lay something down on. If it's the latter, there has to be space for the vocals, and when beats start getting overly complicated, they also (often, not always), also get over crowded and leave no room for vocals without frequencies colliding. It's no right or wrong, just depends on what you're going for imo. Another thing worth mentioning, is you can add texture and flavor to simple beats using effects and some small unique details throughout. A lot of Alchemists beats are fire and it’s those little details and switch ups that make them so dope.
Really good rule of thumb with complicated rhythm patterns is, the more complex it is, the shorter it should be, the more often it should repeat, and the less it should vary. 'cause the main thing you're trying to avoid, if you convert the idea of rhythm into mathematical terms, is an irrational number. This brain we have is a pattern-recognition machine, it doesn't like things that don't end or repeat in chunks small enough for it to digest. In the first example, while I understand it's not the point you were making, I think the bare minimum that would have made that beat "good" would be cutting the drum pattern down to the first two bars and repeating that with only very small variations. You don't need to always make a backbeat but when you are doing something entirely new and unfamiliar you need to clearly communicate what the pattern is. As for that last one, while I'm not really versed on hip hop beat genres specifically, I'll say the thing I often say about things like music theory, and chord structures -- breaking rules and boundaries is great, but you're gonna be so much better at it if you know what you're breaking. :) And, you know, if you just wanna make something you think is cool and not care what it is, that's fine too, but, 1, you gotta be okay with the idea that your skills might improve more slowly without having established techniques and sounds to follow along with, and 2, you don't need to pick a style to fit it into after the fact. All it needs to be is something cool you made.
The important thing with learning a genre is that all the tropes of that specific genre came together for a reason, they all fit together in a specific way and thats what makes it sound cohesive. By learning one specific genre in and out youll start to understand how those pieces fit together and once you understand that youll be able to branch out in a way that still sounds cohesive because you know what you have to change to get a nontypical element to fit with everything else.
Damn!!! I am really guilty of the third thing you talk about, thank you so much for talking about it and please do a separate video on just this!🙏 How to solve it more!🙏🙏🙏
I like your videos. Can you please make a video about what to learn from "Just Blaze" and a series where you break down trap and boom bap. I enjoy your videos. They have taught me a lot of things.
I did the one where u add different sounds but make the same pattern with all of them 😂 only once though cuz I wanted to mess around with the stock sounds on my KO 2 and some of those sounds are really dope, I just couldn’t figure out how to put them together into something I would listen to at first.
Great video @navie I have made very good beats by going against conventional wisdom, protocols, techniques, production rules, and genre rules, but there are certain rules that should not be broken like the drum groove like you said and having a main focus /melody to your beat, so that its an ear worm and gets stuck in your head because if theres no consistency and repetition it wont stick, you can have complimenting sounds but not competing sounds. The bonus for me is i dont sell my beats theyre for me so as long as i like it and can write to it thats all that matters to me if in the end i love the finished product, and if theres too much then i have the control to remove some elements to create space for my vocals, my beats are tailored to my personal preference and palate. I hate 4 or even 8 bar loop beats that just repeat the whole song and everyone is making the same style dark trap beats which are so dull and lifeless to me they sound so stale to the point i learnt to produce just so I can make beats that appeal to me and my taste and i have full control over how it sounds. So it depends on your goal for the beat, if i had to make generic random beats that appeal to the masses because my goal is to sell them they have to be confined in a box and sound on brand for that genre because if you produce in a box you are much more likely to sell the beat because theres a chance a lot of rappers in that genre will like it and buy it, but if it’s too unique and outside of the box you gonna have a hard time selling it. Theres exceptions to the this both ways, jay z will sometimes jump on a weird diff sounding beat, but if you make “type beats” they gotta sound like what is already out to sell. Now if you have to produce that rigid for a specific genre’s artists the most you can creatively express within the confines of that genre is probably like 25-30% the other 70% of the beat has to be in the box of that genre. Which is what I hate. Also i produce and ask myself could someone make a “type beat” of my style and the answer is no every beat sounds completely different you would have a hard time mimicking my style, sure you could make something in the style of one of my beats but you couldnt create 20 beats that are 70% of my style that would constitute producing inside “my boxes” style. If someone can make 100 of beats in your production style that sound just like you could have produced it the odds are that your stuff is way too generic and in a box. You are competing against thousands of producers producing that same style so how do yours stand out? Theres only so many 808 sounds, patterns, chords, same VST instruments and patches and toppers and hi hat patterns and all in the same minor key and same vibe, all low end and hardly any mid or highs leaving way too much room for vocals and they all use the same drum samples from drum packs like the spinz 808 etc. I produce in 2 vibes - light and dark. Light are more upbeat, happy, bright, something to dance or workout to, not all of those elements every beat but in that vibe, and the darker stuff is more minor keys, night driving, late night, emotional. Every beat fits in one of those category or vibes so every beat has a color / cohesive vibe to it. If you played them back to back on a playlist there would be some consistency and even though every beat is way different one track wouldnt sound out of place. And I wouldnt just produce all dark beats or all bright beats, my beats are probably 60% dark 40% bright. So my dark playlist is a bit longer than the bright playlist.
This principles that you are talking about are true in every creative domain. in writing, illustration, movie making. One example that came to mind is the old Eminem knew how to dose his complex bars now he jams to many of them in one song till the point that it's just tiering just like an painter who only uses accent colors, bro give them space to breath.
Both the beats towards the end, while we’re talking about them…I’d still say they’re trying to be an experimental boom bap but I think you can tell the one that knows what it’s doing, even though some elements of it are clearly there to push boundaries
Not at all. Not a single artist worth anything would ever use them and no one would listen to them on their own. Compare them to anything in the genre experimental boom bap (Def Jux, Anticon etc) and it sounds like some kid dooding compared to it... and that shit is 20 years old.
Bruh i find it so hard to find decent discord communities for production.. most people on there are NPC that fit into one of these catagories: 1. The "Listen to my song" guy who just recorded a freestyle onto a youtube to mp3 beat and has 2 channels open in FL 2. The guy that asks for advice or help on the beat but pushes back when you give constructive advice or just straight up insults you for it 3. The ones who are actually good at beats but have a massive Ego and either have a superiority complex or escape to their private servers :/
why did this video pop up when i was searching my prod name to see if anyone was using my beats 😭wish i was making it up too like that's a wild stray from the youtube algorithm
@NavieD I can tell you, I use the sequencer and I don’t make trash beats. I’ve worked with 50 cent, Lloyd Banks, Fabolous, Black Hippy and more. I’m not saying I’m the best producer but my beats definitely aren’t trash
Recording your sounds in can help you like looking at the grid for the first time is kinda confusing but if you hit record and flow eventually you’ll figure out that 12 CLAP 4 12 CLAP 4 sounds good, and if you hear a snare doing the classic trap bounce just sound it out don’t gotta use a grid, it’s literally maths it’s literally a time and pitch graph so don’t worry bout that for now just 1 2 clap 4 snare 1 snare 2 clap 4
I think the "random drum placements" and "making every pattern as complex as possible" approaches CAN work if your beats are just meant to be instrumental, aren't made with intentions of people doing vocals over them and are just meant to be showcases of your own creativity (and even then it needs to be done right). But if you actually want people to rap over your beats, those are terrible approaches lol.
Well the drums could work in an instrumental track, if the person producing them has a clear idea of how the drums will fit into the structure of the music. At that point, it's more like programming a drum solo. Same goes for complexity. If you're a genius, you can make music that has hundreds of extremely complex layers that only make it easier to listen to the other layer due to rhythm and harnony stuff. But more often, it'll become overwhelming and in an artistically uninteresting way.
I respect your take here, but I feel like you can use a different rhythm than just the 2step for a drum line and for the sound to still be cohesive. What I would have done is to loop the first bar of the "free" beat and add variations to that foundational rhythm to make it more interesting.
I have a question.. do you put the effects on instruments before you start your melody, or do you create the melody then put the in the effects, or do you just do all the effects at the end before you master?
Usually depends, if the effects change the sound a ton I think its best to add them initially but if its just effects for mixing or something I would wait until its semi-complete
As someone who makes music that is extremely reliant on sound design, I tend to, as a rule of thumb, make a sound that I think sounds cool and blends well with the rest of the mix first, then, once the ideas are all laid out (albeit not final!), I will refine the sounds to make them as good together as possible. Basically, just try to get the sounds in the ballpark of what you're hoping for, focus on the structure of the music, and once you have a solid foundation and solid ideas, you can refine the sounds a little more to make them play even better together.
I have amazing layers but everything is at the forefront. I been making music for 15 years learnt reason when only reason 4 was out. No teacher just winged it. Thankyou
That's because he's never done anything good that anyone ever likes on its own merits. I disagree with every single thing he said in this video. My professional advice to him, would be to stop at "garbage" level and understand that he's not capable of making full beats. Someone half his age could absolutely kill some of his "awful" material if used as loops. ..But that's why he's a content creator. He needs full control, but isn't good enough to have full control when it comes to released music that people actually care about. You can absolutely be both a content creator and a great producer with accolades; he just isn't that. He makes 90% of his money giving people advice, doing something he has never succeeded to do himself. Beats are actively worse with his advice, but his business model is to keep people paying for his no-credential education; so we will keep doing it.
@@Prod.Pumpkin Talk about anything related to it and actually refute my points then. We are talking about a person who quit his dayjob and thought he was making a Kendrick record because he spoke to someone on Skype.
@@notreally-sf3df So you’re watching his video, know history about him and know that he ACTUALLY has worked with artists “Joey Badass”, and you’re choosing to be like this? You sound like a hater more than a debater to me. Bro choose to be a RU-vidr and teacher maybe that’s why he’s not making music with people?
When you start you should stick to the genre you like to listen to but the more you understand the more you should be genre less. It’s much easier to make dnb when you try to make a cool edm song rather than trying to fit the dnb criteria, just vibe and laugh while you’re doing it and it’ll end up good and even if it doesn’t you vibed and laughed so it was worth it
When asked who u should write music for, the musician or the listener? “I heard you should write for the listener but the person who is the first listener is the musician.” -Wynton Marsalis
The last one made me cringe 😂😂😢😢 But I thank God I've passed this level of producing. I'm still learning, thanks so much. Now, I will be able to discern people who will lead me into making over complex stuff
