The Sound Type 

Great video Wolfey!

Nice, bring in the sponsor money!

If you follow Ruffledrowlet, it really seems like the new gimmicks will be triple types. I know you already made a video on it, but most of the points you pointed out there (item + triple stab, design, …) are solved if you use an item to get the type. Do charizard + water stone = fire / flying / water with a blue recolor. What about that implementation? Still OP? What Pokémon would use the feature (remember, you loose the item) and benefit most? Would it have to be restricted to once per team like Megas and z moves or is it balanced enough by itself because of the no item drawback?

rock should be good against sound because of rock music overpowering the sound

How would pixilate work then? Sylveon has that ability to use moves like hyper voice. Would they change it to be based off sound moves then? @WolfeyVGC

I would explain the fairy one with how so many fae stories have to do with how fairys depend on hearing certain things: Being told they may enter, knowing your name, etc.

cools seeing you here, love your videos and I agree with your thoughts

what a crossover 🔥

Ya, I think fairy being weak to sound makes sense. I believe it's a trope for fairies or fey in general to hate noise; especially human-made noise.

I would imagine the fairy/sound interaction being like a medieval forest filled with fae (fairy) creatures living in peaceful, quiet tranquility. The loud, chaotic sounds of the sound type disturb the peace of the fairy abode. This could justify why it’s super effective on fairy and why it is not very effective on sound. The fae are drowned out by the noise the sound type makes, and are forced to hide away.

Just had a "good" idea. What if bugs had a underlying ability that made any sound type move they use turn into a hug type move, kinda like how dark is immune to prankster ability. And would allow bug to keep they're better moves

Pollen puff can get more common

just make it dual type like flying press

Or if Sound-Types have a +40 Attack (or 1.5, so STAB) to sound moves (that‘s already a category). +40 would be a cool gimmick so that Status moves (Growl, Roar) could deal additional damage.

Bug Buzz could be double typed like Flying Press maybe.

I think Toxtricity ability already work as a workaround to give him 3 types. Just like how Dhelmise is Grass/Ghost/Steel thanks to it's ability.

@@Magnet_Chaos making a 3-type pokemon would open up Pandora’s box in terms of balancing pokemon

@@NovaBurst We already have one with Dhelsmise.

@@Magnet_Chaos Dhelmise has three STABs but only two defensive types. Not quite the same. Also it gets that additional STAB at the cost of not getting any other Ability.

@@codahighland The 3 Stabs thing is what I was reffering to though.

Yeah I never understood why they didn't make psychic strong against steel I mean they literally created alakazam that is based on this specific thing

@@duckyduke954 you’re right, I never even thought of alakazam, he’s literally holding spoons haha

@@ryanwinchester6644 The Japanese even named Kadabra after the guy who's famous for that trick: Uri Geller.

Steel was introduced to nerf psychics

@@lv1543 but it doesn’t do anything to psychic types directly, it was literally introduced as a strong defensive type to balance the game as psychic was a really strong offensive type, but with dark types and way more ghost types than the first 2 gens psychic is just shit whereas steel has remained very strong, therefore this change would balance them

Xenoverse: Per Aspera Ad Astra has that type and... it's pretty powerful, giving Water, Fairy and Flying a new weakness that are also walled by them, Dragon and electric a new prey they also resist and Psychic 1 more resist

I want a Chaos type. Where each time the type do a Chaos type attack...the Pokemon gets a dual type at random.

@@supernintenjoe8911 Because more rng is exactly what the game needs

Well cosmic would also work if you want to separate it from psychic

Cyber type

The only hesitation I would have is concern for ground becoming too strong. It already insanely strong offensively and ok defensively.

Yeah maybe not ground, and we also dont want sound to be unviable as well. I really do like the idea of bug having an immunity tho

Replace ground with rock, and you're on to something.

Kricketune would like to have a conversation

And Fairy is basically the typing of Princess Mononoke's Deer God. It's weak to everything manmade: toxic sludge, refined iron, and the quintessential invention of man: fire. Fairy can be weak to boomboxes, too.

At 8:15 he has her as the banner for it

he didn't mension the obvious ones smh

@@Hadeto_AngelRust Exploud is a quite obvious one and was mentioned

I think Ice type is okay. Coz they have 4 weakness and 4 strenght. But prblm is there is very less number of ice type pokemons and they are not so powerful or cool looking. My favourite type is Ice always but I dont play with Ice just because of their base power is weak.

@@n-zedorai6613 yeah they glass cannon. The best ice type usually have 1-2 stat excessive and always offensive.

@@Watch-0w1 what do you think about Rubber type? The opposite version of steel, flexible body which is super effective against Electric

@@n-zedorai6613 but rubber is made of tree sap. U can probably try make man made plastic Pokemon. Weak to ice and fire, immune to water , and resist rock, steel, fighting, normal, ground

@@Watch-0w1 Rubber can be made from Tree sap for which u r thinking its similar to Grass. But what about Water and Ice, Rock and Ground, Dark and Ghost? These are a lot smilar to each other. But they got their own type coz they have some different features. Similarly Rubber has completely different attitude. You can also call it "Flexible" type. Rubber is a electricity insulator. Also its so flexible and cant be broken. So It will resist Electricity, Steel, Fighting, Rock. Rubber is also similar to sponge, Tires, helly, spring, whip. There are some rubberlike pokemons too like Woffbuffet, Grumpig, Jellicent, spoink, Ditto, Swalot, Lickilicky, Tangrowth etc. Rubber is also waterproof.

The sound type itself should also be immune to sound, it just makes sense. Blasting a sound type with more sound isn't going to be very effective, and it'll make it so that using them becomes slightly more complicated

the hearing organs of bugs are also much more durable

@@MrSamthefan additionally if you know how waves work you know that a positive wave and a negative one negates eachother, and there could be a special sound move that affects sound types or an ability that allows sound pokemon to hit eachother, just for further balancing

@@MrSamthefan sound doesn’t always negate itself, so some sound types just having an ability that makes them immune is probably better

@@ZacTheLit It's moreso that sound type pokemon should be at least resistant to sound type attacks because, well, they've gotta be resistant to loud noises. I'm moreso looking at this from an ecology perspective where if you want to be a creature that can blast soundwaves, you need to have some form of protection against those sound waves.

But then again, Normal Type isn't that great to begin with so it's just there.

normal type is great, its only resisted by 2 types and immuned by 1

Just make moves capable of being normal or sound based on their typing

normal is just decent

@@emperortoho it's somewhat bad because it can't hit anything supereffective

Yep, they hit Psychic with like 4 nerfs at once. Adding Dark and Steel, splitting Special, and arguably the crit rework all nerfed Psychic types. It's not like they didn't deserve to be nerfed that hard, but dang.

​@@LibertyMonk Do you know how OP it was in gen 1? Saying it didn't need to be nerfed is like saying that Landorus should get a BST increase.

​@@theserpent8667 The person said they didn't need to be nerfed that hard, not zero nerfs, they were over nerfed a big part of the issue was the lack of good super effective moves against them, back in gen 1 there was an over abundance of poison types, a lack of good ghost/bug moves, and only one actual ghost type line, and ghost was physical back then so gengars lick wouldn't do much damage anyways

@@austinwolfe1714 I see. Sorry if it sounded like I'd overreacted.

@@austinwolfe1714 also psychic was immune to ghost in gen 1 instead of weak to it, not that it mattered anyway since lick was the only ghost damage move in the game

At least it’s weak to stealth rocks

Resisting water fairy steel and flying seems nuts lol

i agree and i think the big problem is that new types cant balance the meta at large, only affect a few types. the real fix would be sharing fairies' opness between fairy n sound n slightly reworking the existing type chart. no reason fairy should be se vs fighting. draggos are creatures of nature so either ground or grass should resist it. steel is wayyy harder to melt than rocks so get rid of its fire weakness, and grass can be dormant under ice for months its only drough+fire which fk it up. i feel like draggon is meant to be an offensive type w no major defensive flaws, in order to not promote evil stall i think dragg should largely maintain its all around offensive nuetrality and just pick a weakness or two

@@Jonathanking88 That's...also not how game metas work, though. Just introducing a new type isn't going to instantly make those types work - it's what that Type is attached to, what moves and Pokemon it's attached to, that will affect its relevance; if those elements ARE solid, then it wouldn't necessarily 'balance' the metagame to make it more fun to play, because then the meta revolves around the new type, and just replacing the problem with the new hotness isn't any more interesting than just keeping it the same. ...If anything, creating a type that nerfs Steels and Fairies could just bring the Dragon meta back...

I think that's not terrible if you look how mundane the sound reworked pokemon would be, but it wouldn't be game freak if they didn't throw 10 new busted Pokémon with sound type in. I get trying to bring up some of the weaker types but let's be real it'd just do to fairy what fairy did to dragon whilst rock and bug still would suck poopoo imo. I think you pick fairy or Steel to counter or at least just take one resistance or super effective. Don't have to resist and hit both for x2

That would be too strong

Total 305 damage

Your “and then some” comment was to make sure the new type wasn’t OP like Fairy. The whole point of the video was to counter Fairy while not being OP itself. That was his problem in the first place! Edit: Don’t even argue with me because you clearly don’t know how to pay attention, anyway.

@@sandyr5407 The OP's argument is that Fairy was broken because it was good against the then-best type, and so Wolfy's Sound would be even more broken, because it is good against the now-best type + a few more types. Adding strengths to Sound against more than just Fairy does nothing to prevent Sound from being broken; preventing Sound from being broken was not the point of adding those strengths.

@@sandyr5407 “Dont even try to argue with me” That’s a good way to sound condescending, close minded, and incredibly stupid at the same time, but I digress What I mean by sound countering the strongest type and then some is that Sound countered not only Fairy but also Steel and Water, those three are the strongest defensive types in-game, similar on how Fairy was made to counter gen 5’s strongest types at that time (Dragons, Fighting, and Dark) Edit: Examples of strong Fairy, Water, and Steel types are: Tapu Fini, Toxapex, and Corviknight. And strong gen 5 Dragons, Fighting, and Dark types are: Hydreigon, Terrakion, Tyranitar

My idea: Sound could be immune to itself and as for moves; Feedback Loop is one that'll do super effective damage to Sound types and if you want a physical Sound-type move, there's Do The Wave that is basically a variant of Beat Up.

maybe grass or ground since wood, cotton, etc are insolators to sound so is the ground

@@JamesDavy2009 my problem with that is that bug types should be (somewhat like ducky duke said)

@@perehahafunny oooh that's smart

I would make the sound type weak to rock and poison... Poison because when we are ill we have a weaker voice. And rock because rock bounces back the sound. (Echo)

move on boomer. move on to the spinoffs

Right, water being weak to it makes no sense

Sound travels faster in water than air, that's about the only thing I can think of and it's maybe a weak justification

Agree, the theoretical type has great interactions but that has nothing to do with Sound, so there’s no way that’s what it actually ends up being like.

@@aelianaevergreen8955 That’s a more solid reasoning than some of the existing type matchups.

@@aelianaevergreen8955 doesn't sound do the complete opposite? Sound can't travel through dense particles like rocks and sound travels worse in water as it is denser than air.

I think boomburst dont need it, bug buzz could be a duo type move

yes because we need water pulse to be water/sound and deal 8x damage to a fire/fairy

They need to revisit dual type moves. Maybe multiplying is too much. Maybe just calculate the damage as half of BP is one type and the other half is the other.

@@marverickbin wow i never think about that what a good idea you have

I don't think that should be like a huge thing. However, there are moves like freeze dry and there should be only a few more moves like that. But only a few more.

It's surprising how few people have mentioned this mistake in the comments. I was scrolling through to check if anyone had noticed and thought I was going crazy

Yep. Came here to comment the same. xD Tiny mistake on the video.

That confused the hell out of me while watching

I was really struggling while looking at the graph. I have it paused to understand it and I'm like yo. This graph is in reverse. Am I thick? 😂

@@philophos same

Yeah but he said that he is going to make it in a competitive way, not a thematic way

@@glaxyl Yeah, that's what they said, it's unbalanced

It's just broken offensivly, a type cannot hit steel types super effectivly if it can also hit other powerful types for super effective damage otherwise it just become a new dragon/fariy type offesively. Currently 2/3 of types that hit steel for super effective have an immunity otherwise those types would be to good offensively by virtue of being able to hit steel types.

yeah this was literally the same strategy used to make the fairy type lol

make sense but most of the sound based pokemon have bad stats, you are not going to see some pseudolegendary stats or dragon like stats with this type probably at most alakazam or gengar stats, glass canons that hit hard with good sp atk only Exploud, Wiggly, Meloetta could be usable

Let’s start a petition to bring back Return to the move-pool

@Choas_Lord_512 This lol

@@jeremy_seymour Wait, isn't return physical tho? Or am I dumb

Normal types and a few other mons suffer to, Special Bug types lose out on their only STAB move in Bug buzz, Skeledirge could lose on on Torch Song, Toxtricity with Overdrive and Kommo-o with Clanging Scales.

@Choas_Lord_512 You presume much. When Fairy was added, the only moves which got retyped were the non-damaging ones. Even in Gen 2, the retyping of damaging moves was very conservative and done to mostly low power early game moves, which says a lot. The fact that GF would have to basicly rework a core game mechanic (sound-based moves) + re-do basicly the entire special Normal type movepool is already a sign that the Sound type is never going to be a thing.

maybe cause getting sick messes up your throat and the ability to make sound? idk might be a reach lol

Gen1: psychological horror for psychic types

I think the difference is that all those things were built on in later generations, whereas Gen6 and up have been more or less one-off stuff.

Special attack and physical attack were separated before Gen 4

The physical special split happened in generation 2 tho

@@hellhound74 no it was gen 4

Have you thought about the sound being loud enough to rattle the steel? I know it's a stretch, but it is an explaination.

Sound travels better through solids than air. Same with liquids. So they actually make a lot of sense. You can also say that it just ignores steels defenses as its attacking the ears. So those two streangths make a ton of sense. Its actually all the other types with the major problems thematically

@@ivanbackfromthecardshop8093 fairies have tiny ear drums. We could reasonably say that that's a thing.

@@kanecrotty2576 fairies are also small but their big in the pokemon verse, same with bug types. Ariados knows minimize and stalks it's prey...

@@youtubestudiosucks978 true, but bugs don't have ears. And a better explanation could be that fairies don't like loud noises.

I read all of Milotic’s Pokédex entries (from the games and the anime), and none of them are about its voice. You may have confused it with Altaria, whose entries all mention its beautiful singing or its voice in general.

Also does toxtricity Need to be poison?😅

Or maybe mixed up with primarina

@@insertnamehere1398 I think it would be cool if they made one of toxtricity forms an electric/sound type, and the other a poison/sound. But still both of them would learn electric, poison and sound moves.

Milotic should have fairy type its literally the ugly duckling but fish version its literally a fairy tale

Yup

Not only does it travel through them, depending on the material, it can travel much faster than it does through air.

On that same note, being weak to rock would not make much sense, but that ain't the point of this video.

yeah....This type just seems really overtuned.

@@noah9942. I'm pretty sure that that's exactly what OP already said

Yeah, you are right! I mean some details that he mentioned I like really expressed my anger when not agreeing, but overall this is an excellent proposal. IMO Perfect in every way for me. I love it so much that I actually post it on Pokemon's FB page to support the proposal. Hope they see this.

he alrdy made a bunch of videos, adjusting certain types to make the ultimate perfect type chart ;)

Plenty of perfectly balanced type charts have already been made. His would likely just end up being a copy of those.

Yeah I thought it was very uncreative when he did the type interactions. “Let’s make it resist fairy, steel, water and make it super effective against fairy, steel, water!”

Except Fairy also just randomly resists an already really bad type, Bug is now the Steel type of Pokemon resisting it, with a whopping 7 types

he's trying to do too much for the meta with just one type

@@sprucefox2239 He should just directly nerf Fairy and directly buff Ice, Bug and Poison, it's easier that way and doesn't involve making some.of the issues he's technically trying to fix worse (Bugs no longer get STAB Bug Buzz? One of their BEST Special Moves?)

I was thinking of a few realistic Nerfs too other than the resistances like a Sound Type would struggle offensively after an enormous crit but would fail to do half as much again- It took up too much energy, Vocal Noise, or Body Strength in general

Psychic should be super effective against Steel. Kadabra and Alakazam are holding bent spoons, afterall

Types and there weakness that I'd be giving- FIRE- Water, Ground, Rock, Air WATER- Grass, Electric, Poison GRASS- Fire, Bug, Ice, Air POISON- Psychic, Ground ICE- Fire, Rock, Fight, Steel ELECTRIC- Ground GROUND- Water, Bug, Ice, Grass STEEL- Fire, Electric, Ground, Sound, Fight GHOST- Dark, Ghost AIR- Rock, Ice, Electric PSYCHIC- Ghost, Bug, Dark, Sound FAIRY- Steel, Poison, Dark BUG- Poison, Fairy, Rock, Fire, Air FIGHT- Air, Psychic, Fairy, DARK- Bug, Fight, Fairy ROCK- Steel, Water, Fight, Ground, Grass DRAGON- Ice, Steel, Fairy NORMAL- Fight, Dragon SOUND- Water, Grass (Note: Changing name of Flying type to Air type, Fighting to Fight type. Air should super effect Fire as strong Wind can blow fire. Steel can conduct electricity like Water. Poison should be effecting Bug and water coz people use insecticides in the field and home to keep away bugs. Poison also means pollution, water can be polluted. But not giving Air pollution coz all creatures take breath from air not only birds. Bugs make hole in the ground for colonies. Sound moves 15 times faster(5150 m/s) in steels than Air, so sound is super effective against Steel. Sound weak against water coz water muffles sound. Also nobody can create sound underwater coz when u open mouth to create sound, water will get into your mouth. Grass is super effective against sound coz cotton can isolate sound, trees can block some sound and trees are quiet. Also Poison will be immune to sound coz generally poisonous snakes hearing range is too low(10-600HZ only). Dragon should be weak against steel instead of dragon coz at the end, the knight slays the dragon. Also there is no strong logic for dragon weak to dragon and dragon vs dragon rivalry ends so early in battle which doesn't give fun. Giving dragon super effecting against Normal just to give dragon strength. Dark and Fairy both should super effect each other coz angels and Evils both works against each other and wants to harm. Also "good will always prevail" this already applies for fighting so no need fairy again and this is not correct everytime. Fairy super effective against Bug coz fairies also means light (angels are created by light) and light attract bugs. Also bug should be super effective against ground coz bugs dig holes in ground to make colonies.

What if like sound and psychic were the old school gen 1 idea of bug and poison. In this gen they were super effective against each other and this could happen with psychic vs sound. Whoever moves first wins since sound can stop the mind from processing the power and mental power could prevent sound from exiting the mouth by closing it shut.

@@digitaltailsmon4096 psychic exiting mouth is not a good logic. Sound is not always made by mouth. Like you can create sound just by clapping. Metal sound is also a move than creates sound without mouth. Next up, if we think like you, than psychic could be super effecting against a lot of things. Like psychics can band spoon, can throw back fire and rocks that coming towards him, can float himself in the sky to dodge ground type moves, can make birds unable to fly by controlling their wings

@@n-zedorai6613 I think the confusion is with what physic means. Is it telepathy or telekinesis? Or both? You're being pretty salty towards that dude and it seems like your real problem should be with GameFreak.

Agreed its all additional

When the gimmicks stick around for more than one generation I’ll start considering them permanent additions, otherwise they’re anything but.

@@OakenTome good point actually.

@@OakenTome A fair point, but mega evolution *was* still in Generation 7...

Wolfe is talking specifically about something central to the story of the game that adds a new way to power up that makes a huge difference in battles. Something easily marketable. Double battles by contrast are not only a mainstay, but the official format. You could argue that reverse battles, sky battles, royalle battles, rotation battles, and also tripple battles are gimmicks, but Id argue they’re still not in the same specific category as mega evolution, Z moves, and dynamax. At the time it was new (and kinda annoying when they force you to fight with an npc) and I understand that 1 on 1 is the standard in single player, but in official competitive, Calling double battles a gimmick at this point sounds like calling weather a gimmick.

Also her entire theme is sound (music), has the normal typing which would fit the new type rework criteria, and relic song is a normal move which could change into a sound type. It fits thematically and has the criteria for it. If there is any pokemon to get sound type it would be Meloetta.

almost none of the other interactions made any sense though

@@beautifulnova6088 well maybe poison is super effective against it cause sound = open mouth and you dont want poison in your mouth although yeah it doesnt really make much sense i agree

@@beautifulnova6088 poison= can’t sing when you’re sick bug= can’t sing when you have parasites idk? rock= destroys the sound system when you throw it at it lol flying= birds love to sing so they wouldn’t want to ruin it for other people duh psychic= can’t sing with a headache

@@tiendungle2145 that doesn't make any sense because not every sound is produced by the mouth

I think he should have talked about this new type and made different videos on how to nerf the best types, like I feel electric should be super effective against steel, Grass should be super effective against fairy, and poison and ice should be super effective against water for instance, and you know why? It makes sense thematically

@@ericlohndorf9166 i think instead of ice being super effective against water i think more ice types should get freeze dry and possibly a physical freeze dry for a mon like wevile

Thinking of Echoes, maybe the sound type would get a 1.2 buff if the fight is inside a cave or mountain?

@@ng42. echoing terrain: -grounded pokemon get a power boost on sound based moves

Sound also travels through water faster due to a density difference so it being super effective there would make sense. This type has too much potential IMO to not be used given how much it would help balance the META, be meaningful to pre-existing pokemon AND still make sense to a high degree with its strengths and weaknesses.

Noivern, seismitoad, Exploud, Kommo-o they should be sound type.

For noivern dragon/sound type? or flying/sound

@@huh-ih5wq I think Sound/Air type fits more. But if Noivern is given Sound/Dragon, then he should get Levitate ability while also knowing some Air type moves. Btw I prefer to say Air type more than saying Flying type.

@@huh-ih5wq Dragon/Sound, definitely.

@Choas_Lord_512 then why not you say surfing type, Burning type, photosynthesis type, freezing type, scary type instead of water fire grass ice etc? The name "Flying type" gives a feeling only of birds. But Air type gives both air, tornado and bird feel.

I think Sound should be strong against Steel, Psychic, Fairy. Weak against Water, Grass, Rock and Rubber(if introduces).

nice pfp :)

70th like

Fantastic comment -- my thoughts exactly. This kind of band-aid fix approach is how we ended up with Fairy in the first place. Existing types need to be tweaked so that they can compete on equal footing while also allowing for extra expansion. Sound as a type is just illogical anyway, it's on the same level as repurposing all of the draining moves and creating a Vampire type. These effects have better interactions as moves.

I agree with this. Normal type currently acts as a budget sound type, as a good portion of sound moves and pokemon are normal (exploud, chatot). Making a sound type and changing the moves would remove a good portion of the powerful special moves normal type currently has (boomburst, uproar, hyper voice), and would serve as a nerf to the normal type in conjunction with pokemon losing the normal type.

Imo types like ground and rock,psychic and ghost,etc need to be made more distinctive from each other, right now some types feel like better versions of other existing types

I also think it has the same problems as fairy. It's good against crazy powerful meta types, while only being weak to less used weak types. I think that the sound *mechanic* should stay, but sound-type moves would have the innate attribute of being a sound-based move.

@@ProNoob-vt4sb It would also severely nerf bug by taking away bug buzz

Even though it is more about "fighting dirty" than anything else, which is why Bite is a Dark-type move. (Even though it is strange on its own to call a dog a "foul player" for biting)

Fairy Isn’t Op Anymore , Almost Every Pokemon Can Learn Steel & Poison Type Moves While Fire Also Resist It As Well . 💯 Secondly There Are No Buff Fairy Type Pokemon With Great Defense , You’re Living In The Past .

@@melvondrewhite2674 First up, fairy is definitely still a tad OP. They have one of the most spammable moves in the game in Moonblast, have incredible offensive and defensive capabilities, and pair incredibly well with multiple other types. There's a reason why Wolfey placed so many fairy combos high in his type combo rankings. Also, Magearna certainly fits the criteria of an offensive fairy type with great defense.

@@blazefactor6849 Fairy Is NOT Op , You Obvious Don’t Play Competitive Or Know Anything About Type Matchups Cause You Just Named 2 Pokemon That Are “ Legendaries “ As If That Counts . 😂 , Um Talking About Regular “ NON-Legendary “ Fairy Type Pokemon . Xerneas Is A Damn Legendary , It Doesn’t Count !

@@melvondrewhite2674 Uhh... you never specified that we weren't allowed to bring up legendaries. You just said "There Are No Buff Fairy Type Pokemon With Great Defense". Also, I think you're the one who doesn't play competitive. Magearna has been legal and very powerful in multiple formats in terms of singles, and legendaries are allowed a good chunk of the time in VGC. As for knowing anything about type matchups... What? I don't get what you mean by this.

I do agree moonblast is a bit spam able and should def be nerfed but I would definitely say fairy as a type is not broken it's more that game freak slapped the type on a bunch of legends so for nerfs it would probably be better to directly nerf those mons instead of the entire type like for example adding a bug weakness would nerf those legends but would be too much for the average fairy type as scizor alone would be enough to dispose of most of them

Balancing without following real life facts means nothing.

This is how I'll balance types. Types and there weakness that I'd be giving(copied from notepad)- (weakness↓) FIRE- Water, Ground, Rock, Air WATER- Grass, Electric, Poison GRASS- Fire, Bug, Ice, Air POISON- Psychic, Ground ICE- Fire, Rock, Fight, Steel ELECTRIC- Ground, Rubber GROUND- Water, Bug, Ice, Grass, Rubber STEEL- Fire, Electric, Ground, Sound, Fight GHOST- Dark, Ghost AIR- Rock, Ice, Electric PSYCHIC- Ghost, Bug, Dark, Sound FAIRY- Steel, Poison, Dark, Sound BUG- Poison, Rock, Fire, Air FIGHT- Air, Psychic, Fairy, DARK- Bug, Fight, Fairy ROCK- Steel, Water, Fight, Ground, Grass DRAGON- Ice, Steel, Fairy NORMAL- Fight, Dragon SOUND- Water, Grass, Rock, Rubber RUBBER- Poison, Ice [REASON: Changing the name of Flying type to Air type, Fighting to Fight type. Air should be super effective(SE) against Fire as strong Wind can blow fire. Steel can conduct electricity more than Water. Poison should be SE against Bug and water coz people use insecticides in the field and home to keep away bugs. Poison also means pollution, water can be polluted. But not giving Air pollution coz all creatures take breath from air not only birds. Sound moves 15 times faster(5150 m/s) in steels than Air, so sound is SE against Steel. Sound is SE against Psychic & Fairy. Coz psychic's cant concentrate due to noise and Fairies have a weak nerves. Sound weak against water coz water muffles sound. Also nobody can create sound underwater coz if u open mouth to create sound, water will get into your mouth. Grass is SE against sound coz cotton can isolate sound, trees can block some sound and trees are quiet. Rock SE against Sound becoz hills and walls can reflect sound. Also Poison will be immune to sound coz generally poisonous snakes hearing range is too low(10 - 600HZ only). Dragon should be weak against steel instead of dragon coz at the end, the knight slays the dragon. Also there is no strong logic for dragon weak to dragon rather dragon vs dragon rivalry ends so early in battle which doesn't give fun. Giving dragon SE against Normal to give dragon a strength. Dark and Fairy both should be SE against each other coz angels and Evils both works against each other and wants to harm. Also "good will always prevail" this already applies for fighting so no need fairy again and this is not correct everytime. Fairies also represents Light and Light and Darkness opposite of each other and Super effects each. Rubber is Electricty insulator, Soundproof and we use rubberlike things to clean dirts. So its SE against Electric, Sound, Ground. Rubber also resists Steel, Fight, Rock, Water, Sound, Electric. Some acids distinguish Rubber and Ice makes rubber brittle. So its weak to Poison & Ice. Bug should be SE against ground coz bugs dig holes in ground to make colonies.]

although bug really doesn't deserve it, i always wished bug was weak to poison for thematic sense. Due to the prevalence of pesticides after all.

@@connivingkhajiit it actually was in Gen 1 but then in Gen 2 they removed that weakness

@@keffertv304 actually, they fucked it up and poison was weak to bug in Gen 1.

@@connivingkhajiit pesticides are specifically designed by humans for killing bugs though, in fact bugs eat expired food that would kill most mammals and birds, if anything they should resist poison type moves

I think fairy should be weak to fire and bug, and ice should resist fairy. Fire already resist fairy so the same logic could be used to justify it. When I think of fairies I think of them being small pixies, which means bugs would be giant to them (imagine being a pixie in a spider web, it would be horrifying) As for ice... idk I just don't imagine fairies liking the cold.

Dude this is perfect! I will admit that Poison/Electric is a cool typing, but this idea is too cool to pass up.

that or buff punk rock so its basically like dhelmise having stab with out being the type

@@malxire could be, punk rock is basically sound stab anyway

Nah it doesn’t need to be sound type, it already has the boost from punk rock

@@tbone6032 but punk rock plus stab tho

It really needs to be super-effective against Fairy when ScarVio drops XP

Narratively it makes senses a insect should not be stronger than a God or demon. Bird's eat bugs

Maybe make Bug types immune to Sound type moves then? Most bugs in nature don’t have ears and a vast majority of Beetle species are almost deaf.

nah, if sound made to S tier (and I honestly feel like it would in that scenario) Bug would be AT LEAST B tier. U can see what steel became after fairy. It was always a good defensive typing, but after fairy it's actually a B/A offensive type (which it shouldn't). That just happened because fairy became that common. I don't think Bug would receive a buff that big, since there is psychic that hits sound for super effective, but it's a strong enough buff to push it to low B imo

Honestly one of the other comments summed up some of the easiest changes to make, poison hitting super effective against grass and maybe water (pollution) grass being resistant to fairy (thematically fae’s are traditionally forest guardians and or protectors) ice hitting water super effective (freezing), dragons being weak to dark (I wouldn’t want this change but it’d make sense due to big bad evils taking a liking to dragons and whatnot.) and making bug and ice stats better overall.

Exactly ! 💯

I think it would be neat if, instead of having Toxic and Toxic spikes be the ways of applying badly poisoned, if they just made it so that when you get poisoned by a poison type its badly and when you get poisoned by a non-poison type its normal. Would give them a much needed niche.

I mean, they can do both.

Rock should lose its weaknesses to water and grass, imo, makes it way too similar to ground, plus water takes a really long time to erode rock compared to say, dirt and plants don't take root in stone very easily, its why rocky terrain tends to be a bit more barren. As it stands sharing 2 of its 5 weaknesses with ground kind of makes pokemon with both types puts it in a place where it almost feels like a worse version of it instead of its own thing

Naaaah

Lame. This doesnt make sense.

if we're talking lore with salt and crystals then ghost should also be weak to rock according to japanese folklore.

Stealth rock is a huuuuuge gatekeeper; rock is probably the single worst weakness for any type to have just because of that move.

That could also be implemented in something like Freeze-Dry, where a specific move is stronger, rather than the whole type. Although many Pokemon could get it.

Yeah, I am still puzzled why they would make fairy resist to bug - both in terms of balancing the meta, _and_ thematically. It would have more sense intuitively even if bug was very effective against fairy: Many fairy tales depict the fae as small as bugs, so a spider could catch them in their web.

​@@LinkEX not to mention all those stories where there's a faction of bugs or, at least, more bug-like pixies/monsters.

Maybe not taking it away but changing it in a way where it works like the one move from hallucha with 2 types. Or replacing it.

@@sayaztv yea I feel like best case scenario is switching buzz to sound type and then giving it a suitable bug type replacement

@@harrydsgn thunderpunch isn't a fighting type move, why would bug buzz *have* to be sound type

@creature It’s not that it doesn’t make _sense_ for Bug Buzz to be Sound-type, it’s that you’re nerfing Bug by taking away its best special move. To keep things balanced, Gamefreak would have to bring back signal beam, distribute pollen puff much more widely, and/or just make a new, single-target special Bug move.

@creature To take your example, Fighting has all kinds of strong physical moves already: CC, Superpower, Hi Jump Kick, Drain Punch, and on and on... It doesn’t need Thunderpunch to be Fighting-type too. By contrast, Bug has Bug Buzz and Pollen Puff at 90 BP, then Signal Beam at 75 (except they took that out of Gen 8 too...), and then they really drop off to like...Silver Wind (60 BP). The point is, Bug can’t afford to lose its only special move that’s both strong and widely-distributed.

Can confirm. Literally nothing he said matched the chart and I was so confused

Also when he said water and steel in relation to super effective damage it was swapped in the video editing

The video editor usually does a pretty good job but they sort of dropped the ball in this one...

@@letsgetsomeshoes1239 21:45 as well.

wait gigalith is based on prisms and it only learns round. it uses solar energy for its attacks (which idk why it isnt a special attacker because of that) but it doesnt have any sound based things to do with it just solar power

if bugs resisted fairies it would at least give them more options

I love the rotom idea!

Come on hug man, you just said my thoughts about rotom.

Yeah, that's my issue here. Sure, it wouldn't be too bad for Growl and Boomburst to be retyped, but what about moves like Bug Buzz? Hell, Hyper Voice is a key move for Pixilate mons like Sylveon, but if that gets retyped, then what would replace it? I really want to be on board with the Sound-type as a concept, but with how sound-based moves have developed over the generations, I feel like something wouldn't feel right if we got it now.

You could have sound as a property be separate from Sound as a type. Have "is able to hit through substitute" by the secondary effect of moves like Hyper Voice and Boomburst while keeping Bug Buzz a Bug-type move with a property most commonly seen on Sound-type attacks. Think of it like Scald's burning properties, but for Bug/Sound types.

I feel similarly about the potential introduction of the Sound type. There's just too many mechanics at this point relating to sound moves, all of which would either have to be altered, or have to ignore the fact that the new type exists. For example, how does one justify Overdrive being Electric type now that Sound type is a thing? Or on the other hand, if Overdrive were made a Sound type move, what does that mean for our poor friend Toxtricity? My thought is that if a new type is introduced again, it should stay away from modifying a characteristic of moves that has developed so much over time. Maybe instead of a new type to nerf fairies, we could get a change or two akin to the Prankster/Dark-types adjustment. In conclusion, I agree with Wolfe that if we get a new type in Gen 8, it should definitely be BAGEL.

This is one of my concerns as well with the design as stated. Especially since moving bug buzz out of the bug type makes bug weaker. Which is counter to the design philosophy wolfe has going here.

@@ijpete98 Wouldn't Toxtricity be reworked as a Sound type though? I can't imagine the Punk Rock Pokemon not being sound type. Though I agree with the rest of the premise.

I think dark refers to Evil

@Choas_Lord_512 No need to be rude

@@st8vie282 and light can also mean good. so it still works

My favorite idea for a Poison buff is actually kind of a nerf. Toxic normally badly poisons the target and is on a bunch of different types of Pokémon. What if it only gave normal poison, *unless* on a Poison-type? It would give them a much bigger niche in the meta as the only method of badly poisoning, which helps deal with walls you otherwise wouldn’t be able to handle. EDIT: You could do the same with Toxic Spikes, where instead of two layers badly poisoning, it’s just one layer max that is badly poisoning when used by a Poison-type. You could even go a step beyond and make *all* secondary poisoning effects (like Sludge Bomb) a badly poison when used by Poison-types.

@@BoltTheEmolga Gen 8 kinda did that by not making toxic a TM

I personally think Ice does need defensive buffs because the many Ice-type tanks would benefit from it. Pokemon like Avalugg, Mamoswine, and Glastrier come to mind.

@@MrGksarathy my man obamasnow needs some more resistances

@@bharatsachdeva6683 Exactly.

Also x4 effective against Zacien and faster

If you look up pokemon Xenoverse you'll actually found him Dragon/Sound

Yeah, especially with abilities such as soundproof and moves such as throat chop. Moves and abilities could nullify an entire type, which seems somewhat iffy

@@energyshatty9020 soundproof is no different than the levitate ability in that case

@@codybromley6906 Yeah true LOL i forgot about that ability

@@energyshatty9020 Flash Fire and Volt Absorb already exist so abilities nullifying types isn't that weird, but Throat Chop might be a bit ridiculous if the sound type was made

The fact that it's already tangled up with sound-based moves would actually make it that much harder to become a full type. Seems he should have started with what he wanted from the chart, then found something that fits the mold. Giant type could do (crush fairies, bend steel, swat flyers, bugs are too small to affect, underestimates the mental power of psychics, get beaned in the head by rocks). Then when making new monsters and reviewing the old, we get to interpret them through the lens of the titans of mythology, or just being real big.