Del your calm demeanor is something younger sparks can learn from you can Rant and rave but your not going to solve the problem for the client your just gonna get worked up. All you can advise the client is the importance of hiring a competent electrician.
I did Handyman work but did the domestic installer / verification qualifications first so I'd know what I was doing. It was often useful for undoing the messes left by kitchen fitters and plumbers.
Hi Delroy, from old spark from the 60's. I do love your fault finding videos, you've got the patience of a saint. From what I can see from your video, I think you are correct in saying the fault is probably is burred under the paster, I suspect a dodgy choc block connectors sparking with the high load from the washing machine and the kettle creating transient surge spikes overloading that old converted fused board breaker, you will find a scorched connector block partially melted me thinks. Peter.
@@markyd2633 I'm from the states and even I know of wago connecters and a properly sealed maintenance free j box for use with wagos lol Can't use em in the states unless they are easily accesable unlike you can just shove them behind anything lol
Moral of the story: always get a professional in. I may do a replacement of a socket or lightswitch, but anything beyond that I know my limits and call someone in! I'd rather spend a bit of money than put lives in danger
2 года назад
I think there are two separate issues. The tripping MCB is either overload or the old MCB is bad. The noise from the Zs reading smells like Neutral and Earth are swapped within the connection behind the tiles. Without RCD no one will notice until you Megger it. Changing the CU most likely will open another can of worms and leads to a full rewire.
Great video, as always! @ 15:30 the ~ on the left of the meter is showing supply noise is being detected, so it can't settle on a voltage/resistance to use in it's calculations
I predict that the cause of the strangely changing resistance -- the reading that changes over a period of seconds while you're testing it -- is a corroded, wet, or chemically contaminated connection. Now I want to know what it turns out to be!
Yup, it's a wet connection into plaster, I use the same principle to make moisture meters for my automatic watering system, a couple of copper wires in Plaster of Paris in a plastic pipe. I noticed a capacitance when the plaster was wet, so I put some extra code in the microcontroller to compensate for the capacitance. I'd like to see what happens at 240V, but I'm not Big Clive or ElectroBoom 😝
Behind the tile you'll probably find the original 2.5 ring cable joined to a 2.5 via a 5 amp terminal block and spurred off to the new duel and then another spur from that to the single classic handyman tactic. The problem you have now is when you repair and fix the problem your left with the dilemma of RCD protection. RCD sockets required maybe or better still a new board if the existing cables are ok. Keep up the videos buddy.
I watched your video on the schneider board change and noticed some good old school Reggae/ska music in it. Any chance of putting some good old tunes on a few of your videos? I know it's an electrical channel but the music culture you come from is very rich and it all adds to the overall entertaining flavour of the channel along with your life stories. Just a few of my thoughts and thanks mate, keep up the good work.
Overload, the hint being kettle and washing machine at once. Inrush current for the kettle is around 20A trip goes, because the handyman has connected all the appliances together on one circuit. If you've disconnected completely from the supply and protective earth, then it's most likely the neutral and earth are connected together in the hidden junction box. I'm sure the handyman isn't allowed to do this kind of work. I hate hidden sockets with a vengeance 😝
House really needs a re-wire, not great of the handyman to just bodge some more sockets onto an installation in that state, never mind the fact legally it must have RCD protection. Doesn't it seem like the ring is broken, customer loaded it with washing machine and other appliances and something has ended up a melted mess behind the tiles. Don't modify circuits unless you're competent.
@@BoB4jjjjs yes, you are meant to have RCD protection on any cable buried less than 50mm without mechanical protection, any socket, anything in a special location, any light fitting etc with very good reason. But you're not going to get the police around arresting you for not having it, so saying you "legally" must have RCD protection is incorrect
@@codenamenel BS7671 is a non-statutory Regulation true, but The Building Regulation are statutory, and following BS7671 is how you would comply with the law (Building Regs) Unless you are following another countries electrical Regulations of course, then just hope a court recognise that (Reg or Standard) as a safe standard and at least as good and as safe as BS7671. But you'll probably find that all recent electrical standards world wide, now require some form of RCD protection for new circuits or socket outlets etc. So if something untoward were to happen, and there's no RCD protection, saying "BS7671" is not law or its contents are not a legal obligation won't cover your arse.
@@jonanders76 Yes mr "Handyman" SHOULD have added an RCD to the circuit before adding sockets but try phoning the Police to say he hasnt, I'd love to see it. By the looks of things he also hasnt provided a Minor works cert for his alterations, so if there was a legal problem he's just going to deny all knowledge isnt he, Wasnt me Guv. Which is why we all know part P is a farce that no Handyman takes a blind bit of notice to, but decent Electricians get stung with extra costs. Even Part P was only introduced in 2005. After then you could have various circuits with no rcd protection under 16th edition, they added more that should be protected in 2008 under 17th edition and now they've added lighting circuits etc under 18th edition. There are still circuits that dont require RCD protection, ie a fused spur, surface mounted in trunking not passing through or mounted in a special location for instance, So a blanket statement saying that legally people must have RCD protection is incorrect, its quite simple. Its not the Law, otherwise almost every EICR I do I'd be calling the Police 😂
So overall the handyman's electrics were not actually to bad other than the fact he's worked on a circuit that doesn't have suitable protection and put a join in an inaccessible area. I bet moisture has got in that connection by that socket screwing up your readings. Obviously I'm not condoning a handyman working on electrics, always use a professional
The location of the join wouldn’t be an issue if it had been done properly. A decent maintenance free joint would have been fine but he obviously didn’t do it properly.
Goddammit when you're renting and you have a problem with plumbing or electric and the landlord sends out a handyman who is way out of his depth. God the "fixes" I had to put up with in my old building.
Having only 1 30mcb in the flat means that every socket is connected to it, i would also remove that transformer plug (lo level near the floor) as you will be getting a reading across that too.
The term “handy man” isn’t necessarily bad. It’s like everything, you have good and bad. I know a couple of older guys who are now handymen for small jobs. One is a fully qualified electrician with years experience and the other was a carpenter. Unfortunately though the term “handyman” has been ruined.
@@wizard3z868 True. He probably even put the tile over without letting the plaster behind it dry out for a day or two. I bet it's still wet behind that tile.
First though in my head was "is that even up to code anymore"? RCD and everything? Fire insurance comes to mind... Also personal safety. EDIT: Thanks for sharing. About the first time yt had something intersting in the suggestions (I watched a couple of Nagy's videos)
Looking at the surrounding buildings, I'd surmise that this flat is somewhere in Highbury or Islington ? Hence worth a few bob ? As for the job, as a handyman myself, I recommend a long extension lead for the washing machine !
My kitchen fitters employed an electrician for the testing, inspection and certification - and had to call him at their cost when I found they'd broken the ring. Really she should be calling the handyman to sort out this issue (with the help of an electrician if needed), and to provide her with the certificate. Even non notifiable works need inspection, testing and certifying.
@@09weenic i agree, i even prefer them to the modern mk's, the older mk were much better like you say nice big round terminals made from proper brass and the screw got a good bite of the conductors, they were a pleasure to fit, mk have gone way down hill as with many brands unfortunately :(
I take it del mr handyman hasn't bothered to notify his work 😆😆 joints in walls utter incompetence. If the cables came from below why didn't he make a proper joint behind the washing machine. When you took that socket off above the washing machine I noticed a spur taken off a spur and also no fcu either. Looking forward to the next instalment 👍
@@MrJoysiq All home owners must ask for invoices on completion of all trade work carried out. The philosophy of Insurance companies is to reduce or refuse claims. No documentation for trade work may be at their own risk.
That’s what I say Delroy the electrical company I work for get us to replace showers but I refuse to do it. Not that I can’t I’ve done my own but when it goes wrong it’s no good.
A guy told me his story once he goes I once said to my electrician add a junction box there and add a socket he said what’s your trade I said mechanic then he said you be a mechanic don’t tell me how to do my job which was a fair point lol 😂 electrician rewired the whole kitchen luckily the fuse board wasn’t far from the kitchen so wasn’t too hard...
In Scotland the registration companies are pushing for electricians to be licensed yet I see this stuff all the time. I think insurance companies should run this . Plus an important point is I am insured as an electrician but if I say plumb in a dishwasher for someone and end up flooding their house my insurance company would refuse any claim just the same as I am insured to drive my car and not yours. So Handymen think about it you are not insured to do electrics so you are now personally liable for any claim. That means your house if you own it and any savings are on the line. Insurance companies are now asking the right questions of when was the kitchen installed who did the electrics and plumbing
I was very surprised that the socket was in the exhaust of the rangehood (Cooker Hood). The fat and moisture buildup will be something outstanding in a few years. Is this a standard and above board in the UK? I'm sure it's not in Australia. Ours and all of the ones I have seen are always external, Most of the times hidden in a side cupboard.
No that cooker hood does not have an outside extraction. There is no ductwork. They just use filters that need to be replaced. The black cowling on this type is just decorative.
It's perfectly standard to fit a socket and plug in the chimney cover. Most are connected that way. Most are connected to a 4 inch hose to outside, through the wall but sometimes they have charcoal filters and vent back into the kitchen.
A proper maintenance free connection would be in a maintenance free box, that would have got saved from water during plastering etc, more to the point an Electrician would have tested the alterations on the circuit and picked up any issue with the maintenance free connection before signing job off
I came across this on a thermostat wire in a 60's property renovation a couple of years ago. I was astounded and just assumed it was a one off - I never knew it was a "thing"! What's wrong with people!?
Not a leccy but I have done my domestic installer certs, you could assume the wires run from below so you could probably find the wires and make a new safe connection beneath. the guy has run a channel to the new plug so you may be able to fish through to the new socket. But I guess you would never know the cause if the issue and it doesn't make good content! My guess is he's made connections and covered in plaster with no protection causing some kind of path. I wonder if the customer meant to say the washing machine trips when she turns on the kettle as well or if she had the kettle on and went to use the washer and it tripped. Small difference but it probably trips regardless.
is it not time the customer and the general householder must employ an electrical contractor like your goodself by law with years of experience to do the electrical work handymen and kitchen fitters should not be allowed to do any electrical work period unless they are qualified to do so if that lady customer received an electric shock an died the handyman would be held liable in law because he was the last person to be working on that installation and he is not registered to do so what are your thoughts on this keep up the good work Delroy you are a top man from a JIB graded Approved spark your Apprenticeship sounds like mine a good all rounder.
Short of a rewire. The handymam could of either made the join into the ring above the kitchen cupboard or below the work top and put a blank plate over the back box. I guess he doesn't have fault finding experience so doesn't realise he's creating a potential problem.
Omg buried junction points are the bane of a sparks excestance pulling hair out from the otherside of pond(yet you can bury j points under floor boards because there accesable) smh
The phrase we should be looking at is "Competent Person", it is mainly corporate interest and lobbying which has led to the criminalisation of competent householders who are capable of safe wiring practices. With just a CSE in Electrical and Electronic Engineering I rewired a complete house for my sister around 30 years ago, a qualified electrician had to be employed to inspect, test and connect the new system, including MCB to the supply, there was no remedial work required and it is all still functional and safe today. Unlike some of the "Professional" work I have seen from utter chumps who can't even fit a socket level!
So you was only competent to a certain extent. You had to call a qualified electrician to certify and test that the installation was good enough to be put into service, i get that, it was the right thing to do.
None of this work was notifiable under Part P as only existing circuits were extended. The handyman would only be in trouble legally if he ran a brand new circuit, changed the CU or did certain types of work in the bathroom.
Seems like a case that needs a new circuit board with appropriate new style protections -- and several new circuits. Those "ing" circuits that seem so prevalent in the UK are disasters waiting to happen. Take your power circuits (15 amp breakers/fuses) on direct spurs from the circuit board to selected sockets, ditto take lighting circuits (5 amp breakers/fuses) direct to selected lights in a section of the house. DO AWAY WITH THOSE ABOMINABLE "Ring Mains". In New Zealand we have 220v mains, with separate feeds within the dwelling for Sockets and Lighting. We do not allow Ring Mains. For Domestic installations, Cables supplying 15Amp sockets are triple conductors 2.5sq.mm. (minimum), cables supplying 5Amp lighting are triple conductors 1.0sq.mm. (minimum). Each circuit path protected by its own fuse/breaker. Cables to cooking ranges/ovens are dedicated supplies from the Circuit Board, triple conductors, 4sq.mm. minimum, fuse/breaker at 40Amps.
I’m a Sparky in Australia and seen the work in NZ. So please don’t throw stones in glass houses. The “Ring” is being phased out. Also you don’t have combined lighting and power circuits in the UK. So I’m puzzled to what your alluding too?
Rings were designed to save on cable and load balance cable in years gone by at the time many appliances used to pull high currents and generally you would only have one possibly two ring mains covering the whole house , .It allowed the circuit to be rated 30 amp apposed to 15 amp prior to this you had 5 amp and 15 amp circuits all unfused apart from the board . All our power needs are now from one type of socket with plugs able to carry a range of fuses up to 13 amp. On new builds now ring mains are being phased out , we also have RCD protection
A "handyman" has an excuse... what excuses do the professionals have with some of their electron butchery ? I've seen enough vids of qualified electricians going in after another qualified electrician has fucked it up... 🙄😏
Jeez Delroy what a rotten thing to do to those people and for my money to leave that wall behind the washing machine in that state is disgraceful and all for the sake of a bit of prepping and paint eh? The electrical problem I think the handyman should be charged for putting it right cos I think you are going to have to remove the tiling and do whatever you have to. Plus why was the circuit breaker board so small?? It must be so frustrating for those people who probably have sunk a fair bit of money into that new kitchen eh??
This is the problem using handymen people assume they are tradesmen and they are not , kitchen fitting is the worst bodge it bill who's read the how too leaflets in B&Q comes in slings all the carcass in without a consideration for plumb and level choc blocks off existing electrics doesnt do worktops as its a seperate trade (it isnt but they don't know how to join them) customer thinks they have a bargin price then the fun follows.
After looking some video's of this channel. I'm still surprised how horrible the electrical wiring is in the uk. Everytime when you are troubleshooting all the sockets has to come off the wall . test all the wiring. Cost way to much time and money. Old school construction.
there was a copper shortage after world war II in the UK, so everything was ring main wired. it's not necessarily bad; considering we have one of the safest plugs/socket outlet designs in the world
🤔 handyman electrics. Looks like he spurred of a spur for the washing machine and his connection is behind a tile. Another rubbish install without a certificate or LABC notification. Before he even started, the install needed an RCD minimum or even a board change.
im a handyman but also dose a better job with electrical then that do it to code or or dont do it at all electrical is not a professional thing its just u need knowledge
Anyone know what/s causing that ZS reading to take forever ? Never seen that myself either; you either get a reading or you don't . Unstable earth perhaps ??
Purely from a theoretical point of view (I do electronics, not house wiring), I'd look for a chemically contaminated connection -- damp, corroded, or something. It seems to change resistance as current flows through it. I've seen this with a telephone wire connection that had gotten wet.