Tools, Glorious Tools! #6 - Which Lathe Should I Buy? 

Clickspring could make a video about "What dust pans to buy for your shop" and I would still watch the whole thing.

Stefan gotteswinter had an awesome tip for tramming a benchtop lathe, which he got from the manual of his secondhand lathe; instead of mounting it directly to the bench, mount it on bolts that are secured with some contra nuts to the bench. (Which should be metal with threads ofcourse) That way you can easily tram the lathe just by loosening the nut and turning the correct bolt.

The sight of the Sherline mounted upside down on the lathe bed will never not be hilarious to me!

didn't expect to hear the phrase 'streets ahead' from Chris from Clickspring

I'd love to watch Clickspring build his own lathe

Your videos are so well made and narrated. I felt like the video was just getting going and ten out of nowhere you're thanking me for watching. 11 minutes felt like 3.

Also, it's worth considering whether you'd like your first lathe to be capable of ripping your arm off. I'm quite happy that my 140mm toy isn't.

Timing is perfect, about to buy my first lathe (again).

I can't believe you actually said "streets ahead" 😂

Spot on with lots of tips, especially the hardened bed, lead screw covers and belt drive. One more thing with small gear driven bench lathes, any accidents with large turning will result in chipped gear tooth. Worst with belt driven ones is the belt slipping. Great tips for newbies, cheers!

I made a solid tool post mount for my Emco Compact V8 today. A difference like night and day, even though it is only a temporary one quickly cobbled together. The compound slide costs a lot of stiffness in small lathes and you rarely need the compound anyway. But what you do _all the time_ is operations like parting off, where the extra rigidity of the solid mount makes a world of difference.

The other RU-vidr I follow that does a lot on lathes is @ThisOldTony. He also did a vid on leveling a lathe, which was very informative.

because i work in a lot of iron and steel i found that my first two lathes, a benchtop, and then a 12" atlas were underpowered, i really wasnt happy until i got a "toolroom" lathe. its a 1928 south bend 11" and it needed some minor restoration but was suprisingly unworn. lot of spot on advice here in this vid. id only add, if you are working in iron or steel, you usually cant buy too much lathe but you can definitely buy too little, get the biggest your wallet and space can afford. also pay VERY close attention to his advice on leveling your bed, it really can't be overstated how important this is. also try to get some basic instruction in lathe operation from someone that knows what they're doing if possible and for goodness sake adhere to the safety advice small lathes can easily mangle and big lathes can easily kill. these arnt toys.

Chris had already mentioned it in the video , the best lathe to buy is one that is actually available to you, in the area that you live! there really is a finite supply of the nice old machines out there , and with the occasional exception , they were tossed out because they were worn out and no longer useful. restoring them is a long and costly project, which is perfect if thats the thing you want to do. On the other hand , if what you want to do ,is make parts , look at what Chris does with the same chinese lathes that some would have you believe are useless, that is clearly NOT the case. At the job that i recently retired from we used a sherline lathe and mill to do final fitting of small parts on inspection equipment that we built and refurbished, they were perfect for the task (had to be I conned management into buying them😉)

Thank you. Please keep those Glorious Tools (TM) videos coming. I can't get enough.

@5:21 Love that you called the blue lathe "streets ahead"

My first lathe was a 9” south bend model A that might not have been used ( hunter bought thinking he’d do his own gunsmith work and never did). It was really smooth, nice work size and if you did something wrong would stall. Have a 14” Logan/Powermatic that works, but will be replaced by a gear head since the Reeves drive isn’t smooth enough to me. But unlike the SB, if I try too heavy of a cut or fast of a feed something will either break or go flying. The underpowered SB was easier to learn on. The Taig is nice for small parts, but anything with removing much from steel takes a while.

This is more about the tools: I think it's not a bad idea to start with HSS and grind tools to learn what geometry works well...but something i wish i did way earlier was get a oxy-acetelene set and braze my own carbide. Sharpening carbide to the same level as HSS is such a dream to work with. I use to fear stainless because if you didn't keep it cool you'd need to sharpen HSS every few cuts - no such issue with carbide - beautiful curling chips that just break. It makes 4140 act like it's aluminium. Now carbide insert tools are ok but I find they are not sharp enough on a smallish lathe and have too much tool pressure. But starting on HSS is great cos it's cheap and not difficult to modify.

Very pleasant to hear a perspective other than, "if you don't have room for 600lbs of iron from the 60's, then you should stick to arts and crafts". I've been trying to find something like a Hommel UWG, but it doesn't seem like there were ever many other Meccano style machine tools of credibility, and DIY CNC has kinda eliminated much of the demand for them. Maybe a Taig or Sherline with some modifications would be close, but l think I'm just gonna bide my time until l find a deal on a Maximat with a milling head

I have bought a Sherline lathe and am about to buy their mill. For me the main criteria were size and weight. My workshop is my garage. I could make enough space for larger machines but it's unheated (I live in Illinois US). I've already seen some of my less "sensitive" tools rust in the garage. So in the winter, I move the lathe to the basement. I'm just about to retire (1 more week!) and long-term may need to downsize. So my plans for things to make are still interesting and stuff I want to do, just small.

I was today years old when I realised he was using the sherline as a milling attachment and not a seperate tool haha😂

How's the Antikythera Mechanism coming along? I'm really obsessed over that project!

Solid advice. I would also add that if you find a good quality lathe without variable speed drive, it´s easy and relateively cheap to add that provided the motor is an AC induction motor. Also worth mentioning that the threading attachment for the Sherline is a manual affair.

Excellent video as it explains lots of the catches and tradeoffs. I had to buy a Sherline as I need to be able to lift it and store it rapidly. I'm constantly running into it's size and power limits, but the precision is indeed excellent. 0.01 mm without grinding is easily achievable.

A video on how to add a QCTP on the "problem" slide would be a great help to those of us currently without a mill.

8:48 I'm trying to imagine what it would take to make this part easier, like some kind of custom wrench. Getting a narrow style ratchet to fit would be nicest. But, I would definitely try adding a retaining spring to a box end wrench so that you could at least start a nut without having it drop on you.

when i got my lathe i knew little to nothing about it. i sent a picture to a machinist friend and he said it seemed good. problems cropped up after installation though as the bed damage became more apparent and we realized it also didnt come with a tool holder. i managed to make one but the bed is still an issue. so i guess i am saying, even if you find a good deal and a machinist gives you a thumbs up, they might not know what your specific needs are and you might get budgetarily stuck with something that really wont cut it. dont settle. (also this is an old iron south bend 9 inch with a cast iron bed. )

Excellent video. I nearly bought the Sieg SC4 but ended up buying the Paramount Browns FI550 instead. Hardened bed, pulley driven and reasonably heavy. The tailstock casting is horrible but functional and accurate, got lucky I think. No power cross feed but easily rectified by adding steppers on both axes and an ELS 🤣 I can't believe I'm able to turn parts under 5um accuracy on this import lathe, don't discount the China imports.

The lathe is my absolute favorite machine tool ever. Although I didn't get to use it much recently, I'm very happy I could purchase one a couple of years ago. Nice vid as all of the rest, thanks for the upload!

Epic photography as usual, and excellent advice too.

A Southbend 9A or its Australian made Hercus clone are really good lathes if you have the room. The Mens Shed I belong to obtained a Southbend 9a for virtually nothing, it was made in 1943 and had some wear and a fair amount of abuse but it worked. I immediately stripped it down and started cleaning all the grease out of all the places it should not be, scaped the solid aluminum oxide and chip deposits off many parts and spent many a day up to my elbows in muck, getting all the ibs and ways up to spec, etc. I had managed to get most of it in good accurate condition apart from the chuck end spindle bearing ( a plain bearing - don't people understand that hydrodynamic bearings require oil) and the bed, but plans were in place. It worked well, if you were careful to work around its limitations. Unfortunately, despite my protests, the management decided to sell this lathe and buy a piece of second-hand PRC junk, yes it was a 40/14 class machine even though it was impossible to face, let alone turn 14 inches, more like 9.5 to 10 inches (safely). It was also a seconds machine, a bit of a nightmare. Sort of like selling a 1940s Hudson coupe to buy an early 1990s Great Wall Ute Anyhow, the management of the Mens Shed thought the SB a horrible piece of old rusty junk with its antiquated v belt drive system (16 speeds, more than the PRC junk). Just getting them to understand how valuable it was proved to be impossible, it sold instantly just about the instant they advertised it. The lathe was remarkably quiet in operation as long as the leadscrew gearing was disengaged and the back gear was also disengaged. At medium speed you could bearly hear it at all. I think they were surprised at just how noisy the gear headed spindle in the PRC junk was. The SB power feed clutch was also a delight to use, first you set up the power feed and then slowly engaged the clutch with just enough torque to get the job done. When working close to the chuck on small work, especially brass, I would run it slack belted, barely any torque at all to spindle, but safe. With careful adjustment, the feel of the controls was quite good but it really needed far bigger dials. One final irony, I could get just about any part I wanted for a SB or Hercus lathe, many of them such as all the possible change gears, the thread chaser, etc. are available as 3D printer projects. Apart from standard bearings and seals, parts for the PRC junk were unobtainable. I wish I has bought the 9A but my wife would have killed me, we live in an apartment these days. If only it had been one of the rarer short bed models, half dead is better than fully dead. SB even made metric model 9As from way back. Most high precision, tool room, lathes use a belt as the final drive to the spindle in order to isolate any gearbox vibration. Enough bitching

I got a precision Matthews 1130 large earlier this year and I'm really thankful I sprung for the bigger spindle bore, as I was using it today to make some parts out of 1.5" diameter brass rod.

Was not needing to buy a lathe cause I am not out of college yet, but still an amazing video to just watch and chill

If you use inserts, as I do, a 'quick change' tool-post actually takes longer than a 4 way to use. 4 indexed tools without a change, and more than that two motions rather than one for the rest - so less than 8 tools needed = less time. (Inserts are a standard height, so a single packer attached to the bottom, gives you correct height every time) Plus you can change the indexing as you go, and still return without adjustment.

“Streets ahead” 😂

Thanks Chris for the excellent video. You make some really good points and the video is lovely to watch.

I bought a Chinese "american" lathe / mill / drill. It has served me well with very reasonable accuracy that I can refine when I need to. . I am about to relocate it to my new workshop. I will be looking into all the aspects of levelling this machine again. You're videos are very inspiring. Thank you.

I got a Sherline because of your videos and love it.

Nice little advices for beginners and even not so rookies. Thanks

Thanks, I love these kinds of videos.

Ha, how right you are, the ability to make a few parts snowballs into making more tools, which can certainly try the capabilities of our machines, and I suppose our ingenuity in overcoming their limitations.

Colchester or Lansing Student is always a good choice...but I’m biased as I was a Senior Development Engineer at 600 lathes in the late 90’s

Got the Seig C3 nearly two decades ago. Plenty of web pages on how to "improve it", which is a lot of good practice. Not a precision lathe even after improvements. For a beginner it is a cheap way to start, but it won't take long to desire something better. And those are expensive. Allow for double the cost once you get a bunch of tooling. If you get a $1000 lathe, tooling will add $1000. If you get a $3000 lathe expect tooling to cost around $3000.

I want to thank for sharing this information, it going help me in my first lathe. The information was 👍

Great series. This helped me make a decision, and I'm waiting now for my Sherline to arrive! The actual deciding factor was the ease with which this can be converted to a milling machine, at a much lower cost than buying both.

It's such a thrill for me that the world's best machinist (Clickspring) and the world's worst machinist (me) both use the same Sherline lathe. I don't know why but it gives me hope.

I got a 17 inch sherline with accessories for $500 about a year ago and it's been great for me. It's definetly not gonna be good for taking huge cuts on steel but it eats up brass and aluminum and gives a great finish. I want to make a QC gearbox that also accomadates the lever collet closer. The provided attachment works but its super slow to setup and doesn't allow you to use the lever collet closer either. Seems like a missed oppurtunity, being able to crank out small screws over and over would be amazing.

As an unexperienced operator I would recommend bying a lathe that don't have enough hp to kill you. Had alot of stupid fuck ups on my minilathe. When i felt comfortable with it, I upgraded to a 4m long Mazak. The 15hp motor on that, don't stop for nothing.

Really helpful video Chris.👍👍

A very well thought out guide to buying a lathe. A good lathe is quite pricey and buying one is a big decision. This is one of the few times where i recommend NOT buying cheap to test out how you like the tool. Instead buy the best lathe you can afford. A cheap lathe can and probably will come back to bite you in a variety of ways and a good lathe is a MUCH more pleasant experience.

I've been using my Proxxon PD250 for about five years now on clock repairs, excellent lttle machine, really pleased with it. Why this one? Budget friendly-ish, and I don't have much room. I just bought the PD230 milling motor plus acessories to complete the setup. I'm looking forward to making some gears from scratch!

I'm planning to add a power cross feed to my Vevor 7x14 via a stepper motor and a cheap programmable controller/driver combo.

I'm going to add my two cents. OK, maybe 5 or 6 cents 1) Most small lathes out there have too small of a spindle bore. I would want to pass through at least 1"/25.4mm stock. I've seen 8x30 lathes with a #5 taper and 1.5"/38mm through hole. This is more than large enough to use 5C collets. My only concern is the size of the spindle bearings. I am assuming they area relatively narrow tapered roller bearing. 2) Collet attachments and spindle overhang involved. Using some of the aftermarket collet chucks the work is often farther from the front spindle bearing than the bearings are apart. The closer you can get to the bearings the better. 3) Collet type. While ER type collets offer a greater gripping range. 5C collets taken as a whole system have a lot of advantages. Built in collet stops. Different types of collets. Standard, square, hex, internal, extended nose, fixture plates, oversize or pot chucks. Plus small 3 and 4 jaw collets mounted on 5C arbors. 4) Threading options. One thing every small lathe needs IMO is a Single Tooth Dog Clutch set-up for threading. Some lathes have them built in. But in reality they can be added to any lathe. Automatic pick-up of any thread. Inch, metric, DP, Module. Throw the threading dial in the garbage. If it is equipped with a trip mechanism to disengage the dog clutches threading to a shoulder is no big deal. Plus no reversing the spindle when cutting when cutting special ratios or metric on an inch machine. 5) Variable speed drive. This can be electronic or a Reeves type drive. Just as long as its belt drive. 6) A taper attachment. Absolutely required if you are doing anything making tapered tooling. 7) A true running rear bore or OD on the spindle. Running long stock sticking out of the back end of the spindle without any support is dangerous. With a true running diameter on the back of the machine making supporting attachments is easy. 8) The biggest single downfall of most small lathes is the width of the bed. Wider is better.

Like most people I have two lathes. A mini-lathe and a SIEG C0. On a good day I can machine parts to a tolerance of +/- 0.005mm which is good enough for me. I'd love to have a Cowells 90ME but I'm in no hurry to get one. I can do more with the SIEG C0 which is effectively the latest iteration of the Unimat 3. P.S. A QCTP is worth its weight in gold.

So, how do you feel about the Mattel "Power Shop" lathe from the 1960s? I have one I'm thinking of doing a few upgrades to.... (Seriously, for what it is, it's a pretty remarkable bit of engineering. It's a functional wood lathe that's legitimately safe enough for kids, which is not a thing I would have expected to be possible.)

Somehow ended up with a Weiler Praktikant 500, fairly small but did most jobs i needed it for. First thing i did was fitting a 3 axis DRO, second one was throwing out the noisy gearbox and fitting a big 5kW servo motor with suitable controlelr to get variable speed with wnough torque over a large range. Still thinking it should have been a good bit larger (ultimately limited by what i can get in my shop, the limit being around 1.5 tons).

Nice work

I’m always interested to see what you do with the Sherline. I’ve got an old Australian one, with an extremely not-hard brass bed (and thus quite badly worn) and the old-pattern tail stock, which means I agree heartily with your comments about bed damage and difficult tail stock alignment. I’m currently using it to manufacture parts for an old Myford ML4 which I’m restoring as my ‘upgrade’. This early Myford has an even worse design of tailstock, which I’m not looking forward to wrestling with..

Beautifully filmed video, congratulations! As a Myford Super 7B owner, three features I particularly appreciate are the quick change gearbox, the threaded spindle (quick chuck changes) and the spindle clutch. A variable speed drive would also be welcome as would a larger spindle bore.

Colchester, no question.

I just bought a lathe a couple of weeks ago, luckily I seem to have made a reasonable choice based on these criteria! I was torn between old and new, ended up with a new Chinese made one (AL51g from Hare and Forbes). From what I read, it came down to having a project on your hands doing up an old Myford or Hercus, or having a project on your hands getting a Chinese made one up to some sort of acceptable standard. I’m starting out with a project to increase rigidity in the compound mount, but overall I’m pretty happy with it.

I’ve bought a 60 year old high precision high quality machine including all necessary tooling for the price of a new import machine. In this way you can have a lathe which will outlast you and can be passed over to your children. In my opinion you should not compromise quality because of your budget. In my case as a Dutch guy there is a lot to choose from since there are loads of high quality second hand machines available in Europe.

Loving this series! 8:19 Could you maybe tell us more about your dividing device?

I got a brandless Amazon Chinesium lathe. It’s about as precise as a hand grenade.

The blue lathe looks a lot like the lathe Blondihacks runs.

Taig tools makes a great sherline-sized lathe if that’s what you’re looking for and you wanted more options

Vevor has upped the game of choosing a lathe a little bit with their new MX-S650 lathe which comes with a stepper motor driven electronic lead screw. No more change gears for threading or dialing in the proper feed rate when turning. I'd love to have an electronic lead screw on my 7x14 seig lathe but until now the only way to get one is either build one or buy a CNC lathe. My electronic knowledge is limited to plugging things in and changing light bulbs, so building one is out and as a hobby machinist a CNC machine is way beyond any budget I could ever justify spending. So there's a new wrinkle in the "picking a lathe" game.

Schaublin 102N or a Hardinge HLVH would be my choice.

Sherline hands down

That last point is important; the sooner you start making chips, the sooner you start learning what you like & dislike about the setup you have.

I'd like to see a clock with magnetic bearings, where the gear neck literally floats... No friction. Beautiful clock though

For LH threads, can reverse the cutting tool and do it backwards!

What a coincidence, in BHI DLC course in sixth lesson they cover the same question)))

I'd love to see what kind of chess set you would come up with. You could use brass for both sides and just blue one set of pieces. It'd be awesome.

Eventually Chris will graduate to a 9" South Bend. He keeps using space as an excuse, but we all know he could be in as big as a shop as he wants, but is only using the small lathes as an excuse to stay in the small shop. Admit it Chris! :p

Is there a good lathe (that you know of) that might be good for both machining moderately sized parts, and woodworking larger pieces like chair legs?

Would be nice to do a video purely on lathe accessories!

Thanks fore a very good video

G'day Chris. Any chance you could do a video on hand turning? It's something that appeals to me but I figure there are things I need to be aware of so that I don't cut my hand to pieces when the high speed steel tool gets ripped from my grip. And I figure there must be some upper limit on the diameter, depth of cut, etc. I'm sure your guidance would be very useful to many of us.

I’ve been looking at quick change posts for a 7x14 import lathe. Did you buy the next size up change post and then grind down the holders to get the centre height? Absolutely love these tool tours.

The issue with the brushless motor variable speed systems is lack of torque at low RPMs, which is going to affect your depth of cut. Not a deal breaker, but something to be aware of.

Precision Matthews 1640 for a new machine that doesn't need a remortgage on your house. Great quality, can do anything from gunsmithing to heavy stock removal.

Clickspring hello there is a question I’ve been wanting to ask for awhile now since before you started the antikythera mechanism videos is where and what kind of needle files do you use as I am in the market for some very high quality high prescision needle file, also since those videos I’ve been trying learn how to file small metal parts by hand as precisely as you do. Thanks love the videos huge fan.

I found a working 13 x 7 south bend 10 minutes from where I live for $500. There are deals out there.

IMHO the right lathe to buy is the heaviest, largest, within the realms of what you are making machine. consider the spindle bore - limited by your chuck size of course. For super accurate work you can always make a master and slave chuck. but yes best of all have fun its only metal.

as a hobbyist , a EMCO is always a good machine !

Trying to comment here before there are too many comments. This is probably unrelated to the video (forgive me, as I haven’t had a chance to watch it). I just wanted to go ahead and ask this: do you happen to know about how much longer it’ll be until you’re able to finish the Antikythera Mecahnism series? I know it’s no small fear and takes time (likely only possible in whatever free time you may happen to have at any given time), but it is a playlist that has been going on for a fair few years now. I’m just sincerely curious as to whether you may or may not have a potential expected timeline of completion for it. Thank you for your videos and your work!

Is there any crossover between wood and metal working lathes?

Also important criteria when selecting a lathe: Is the lathe I am looking at going to fall apart in 10 or 15 motnhs, or perhaps sooner? Chinesium trash.

I have the same lathe as your weiss

The assorted 7x12 or similar machines aren't great out of the box, but improving them is well-documented and there are many accessories for them.

This is similar when choosing a 3d printer, there is a lot to consider.

Any news on how the Antikiteria device is going?

"The scale of the machine should match the scale of the parts you intend to make" .... so any advice to somebody who inherited a big heavy duty crown lathe and dreams to make a pocket watch lmao

to get a schaublin and polish the plaque for next 2 years like RotarySMP... and to slab a pc with linux CNC to it

I'd be curious of your thoughts or experiences about the little PROXXON hobby lathes for the ultra-beginners and tinker-hobbyists. :)

What's your opinion on the Taig lathe? Thanks!

Couldn't you run a long boring bar down the spindle and true up the rear spindle bore.

The red one. The blue one. The green one.... it's like power rangers in there

consider the how clean you are to say you have spent 1hr lathing cast iron or brass are you the type of person to walk in side for dinner or and you going to brush your cloths down and remove you shoes and put on slippers at the door. walking around the house with work clothes on with lath chips embedding into you house carpet to later have it in your bare feet. ---- go ask a tile shop if they have any outdated vinyl flooring or 2m by 2m scrap cut off