Crazy making. The thing I hate most about toxic family is how much time you waste ruminating, worrying, and second guessing yourself. It literally erodes away at your mental energy and wastes our precious LIFE time.
It is exhausting, isn't it. It took me a long time to realize that if they loved me and valued our connection, problems would quickly be resolved or not occur at all. However, I do ask myself if I contributed to the problem. By that I mean, I always assumed they knew how much I loved them. Maybe I needed to be more explicit in word and action. And yet something tells me it would not have made any difference. One thing we have to admit is that we come from toxic families. The terms of lacking endearment were firmly established for years and years. Our siblings and parents are sick, but so are we. We came out of the forest and looked back and saw the forest for the first time.
@realhealinh7802 OMG...this just happened to me at a temp job assignment. It played itself out. People bring their toxic family patterns to work, I mean what else do they have? They have no healthy template. But God is so good, because another opportunity opened for me through the same temp agency and I never have to go back to that one company. It was their lack of communication and they blamed me. Then one person tried to humiliate me, but it said more about her attitude and the deep wounds she must have to talk to me the way she did. Healthy peoplw take ownership for their faults and make every effort not to do it again. When a person says they're so sorrt, but does not change their behavior, their words mean nothing. Except to perbaps appease their owm conscience.
Judge them by their actions, not their words. Don't be blinded by the concept of family - if their actions are constantly hurting you, fuck 'em and leave. At the very least, protect yourself until you can leave. You don't need their toxic bs, fake apologies, guilt trips and all the other tools they employ to trap you... Get. Out.
There are situations when the family has connections and influence. You can be trapped and unable to get away. Did you hear about Sheikha Latifa? Or how much Britney Spears' father monitored her? There are crazy stories that actually true. Following someone through their phone, listening to conversations, following online activities are not only the government can do, but people who have money to pay for it. These are digital footprints that you can't ask to have a restraining order for. Gaslighting is an other non physical evidence that nobody will be able to take as a proof. They hide reality because reality *is* proof that doesn't serve their agenda.
I still have trouble with this to this very day. Debating or sharing my opinions is a waste of my time because no one listens. Theyre too busy crafting a counter-argument in their heads to really understand what youre saying.
@@blakejames9743 To say what you feel is to dig your own grave Album: I Do Not Want What I Haven't Got Black Boys on Mopeds Song by Sinéad O'Connor At first, the minority group, brown-eyes, resisted. Elliot told them that the blue-eyes children were smarter because of their blue-eyes. Children stopped resisting. Brown-eyes became timid and obedient. Jane Elliot - Blue/Brown Eye Exercise (1968) Adult children of alcoholics guess at what normal behavior is. 🟨Janet G. Woititz Adult children of alcoholics constantly seek approval. 🟨Janet G. Woititz Being honest may not get you a lot of friends but it'll always get you the right ones. John Lennon What you don't own, owns you. Debbie Ford There is no protection against slander. Moliere He has the right to criticize who has the heart to help. Abraham Lincoln
I married into a family like this. Mother in law throws a tantrum. My sister in law immediately starts blaming other people for the tantrum. It’s exhausting, and a big reason why we eloped.
So true! When my then husband saw how terribly upset I got over incidents with my family he would advise me to discuss the situation with them. Good advice for a NORMAL family. Terrible advice for mine! Whatever I wanted to “discuss” would swiftly be turned against me as well as throwing in any other misdeeds or imperfections of mine they could think of from the time I was born. I learned that if I wanted to retain even a shred of self-esteem I’d better not ever, ever, ever challenge a family member’s reasons or memory for why I was treated so horribly!
It is heartening in a way to realise not everyone grew up with or still has unreasonable, 'blamey' family members, but also frustrating if they don't start to see how it really is for you, and why the suggestion of talking things out or having a heart to heart isn't going to achieve anything. It is a reasonable suggestion, but only works when you have something to work with!
Yeah, I’m the one who is breaking up the family because I’ve nicely asked to not be treated or spoken to the way I have been my entire life. I’m the black sheep because I resist abuse.
Yes! My entire family thinks that just because I'm the youngest child, I'm also the most gullible and stupid. They literally think they can make me believe what they say.
As a child I had no rescuer. And I knew since about 8 yo that it aas a sick situation, and never wanted to invite friends there. Maybe I was not so much affected because I withdrew and try as much as possible , to not have real relationship with any of them. Practised piano from 14h00 to 17h 00....for dis all exams available in piano. My wealthy uncle paid for my piano education. I think he saw what was going on.
We all have different stories how we dealt with abuse. The power what the perpetrator had over us was maybe different, our family structure was different, our own personality types are different, many many details maybe different. One thing we all share: we didn't deserve to be treated like that. We worth just as much as any other person and definitely not less who is abusing others. I don't like to participate in "survival competition" other than we survived in a way that we don't want to see abuse happen to others either. We learned that everyone should be treated right and that what matters. (I hope you don't think you are in a "survival competition". I meant that I fought back, but it doesn't mean that I don't understand those people who couldn't. i had a mother who physically didn't hurt me behind hair pulling. If the person who abused me would have been male, with physical strength and maybe with sexual assaults, I probably would have been unsuccessful to fight and would have learned to not to call attention to myself. I am very sorry that you had to "disappear and not to be seen to survive! I hope you find people these days who see you and appreciate who you are! I hope you don't just survive but find a way to thrive! That is so reassuring when I see someone like Patrick. Being happy that he is thriving. For me, justice matters. Even if it is not my own, I am happy for those who could find it. I wish you will be one of them!)
Yeah, I know it about age seven when I was openly bullied by a guest of the family and physically restrained for "fun" until my arms made cracking noises. "Yeah, he kind of seemed like that. Don't upset him" was all I got from my mother. Dad didn't even bother responding. There wasn't any rescue and there never was going to be. I never trusted anybody very much after that for a very, very long time.
You can't resolve conflict with them because they only want to blame you, whatever happened. It's so confusing and you end up blaming yourself for not explaining properly. They still "misunderstand".
Yes, it helps. They don’t want to be accountable for their actions or behaviors, so they put it all on the person who doubts themselves. Never doubt yourself!
Feeling like no one will believe you because you were told you were wrong when you were the truthful one. The worst was getting really upset and triggered and then just being seen as "going off" because of something they did wrong. They aren't wrong. You're wrong for getting so upset about it. You can't win with liars. And liars won't change. It is a hurtful reality. You either accept that they're always going to lie or you leave the situation. Unless there is some in between that I'm missing. I do have BPD and often think in black and white. I have this anger and sadness about injustice and people believing I am a certain way when I'm not. And what sucks is having moments of guilt or even missing certain parts of their company like a time they made you laugh, but knowing that they are more harmful than healthy for you.
I understand! I too have BPD. I finally did a total "no contact" with my toxic siblings and it is so wonderful to be FREE from the pain caused by those relationships!
@@marcellakramer5871 Whistleblowers are continually being labeled and misdiagnosed by CBT and DSM as being borderline - while in reality they are truth tellers and they expose narcissistic abusers. It is much easier to shut up and to scapegoat the morally and ethically person as crazy, than to deal with evil people in powerful positions. Read: Martha Mitchel Effect.
Thank you! This very much helps, not only in regards to my family situation, but in another situation I'm going through involving a betrayal of my trust in which I'm having to advocate for myself, as well! Your advice, as per usual, is spot on, and very deeply appreciated! ❤️🙏
We humans are not just craving love, but justice too. Justice and love are so closely related. When there is no justice, there is no love. Where there is no justice it means you don't matter. It means someone else's transgression wins because force and power what matters, not love and your self-respect. You don't have value, power does.
@@nancybartley4610 the creation of laws is based on at least the basic valuing of human dignity. which can be considered a form of caring for the wellbeing of people other than yourself.
Carrying unprocessed emotions around is one of the most horrible things in the world. They keep piling up, and over time they can drive you to psychosis, and destroy your entire universe. This is why your number one priority in life should be finding safety; escape danger, find people who actually love and respect you. It’ll be exhausting, but even if it takes everything you have, it’ll be worth it.
Mercy! The many times this has happened to me, and I couldn’t explain nor identify what was happening. I just knew/know it hurt like hell!!! 🫂Thank you for this.
What helps me is stuff like: Assuming the text was way out of line, ruining a wedding is still uncalled for. Toxic "family" doesn't have healthy responses.
Your family is either not to bright or really evil, or both! However, you have to own that the text was your part of the toxic dynamic. We are all contributing to the mess we were raised in. Doesn't justify dad's response.
If they had healthy responses, they wouldn’t be a toxic family! Also, sure we can contribute to the toxic mess but for some of us it’s not possible to get enough distance, physical or psychological, to heal or even develop healthy boundaries even if we recognise what’s happening.
Damn that’s insightful. I’ve known “friends” for years who did that. My family wasn’t like that. But for whatever reason I l kept becoming friends with people like that, I was excruciatingly trusting. Much food for thought.
My mom is both perpetrator and rescuer of herself. She will attempt to gaslight or deflect blame back onto me in order to shirk responsibility for even the smallest thing. Literally everything that happens is my fault, to the point that she’s an Olympian in gymnastics. It used to affect me a lot but now I realize she’s disturbed.
It’s important who gets to be dramatic, ‘cause it wasn’t me. Ironically, I had a reputation for being dramatic and manipulative. Also mean and dishonest.
Wow this was eye opening. No wonder so many times I try to tell the simple truth of what happened and I hear a million “well no it’s because of this” or “no it’s actually their fault or this things fault not my fault” it’s always a twist, never the straight road of what went on and who did what.
I’m really struggling at the moment to get along with my parents. I don’t know what to do but I can never tell if I’m overreacting or they are being out of order.
I suggest speaking with the school counselor, if there is one. Be open with them, and trust they are able to provide perspective for your situation, and advice if need be.
@@Karkussss thank you for your advice. Yes I’ve spoken to a teacher but I haven’t fully opened up, I don’t really want to make my parents look bad as I’ll feel guilty.
@@charlotteedits8705 If you share with a teacher what your parents are doing and they end up looking bad, that is because they are doing something wrong. No need for you to feel guilty about sharing your honest experience. It's probably the best way to get the support and answers you need. I hope that you're able to figure it out and take care of your emotional health!
As usual, you've hit the nail squarely on the head... the videos you make have often inspired done deep oul searching with a different perspective. Thank you
Wrong! What a twisted comment with much grotesque. Many professional counselors have their own therapist. Also, not a lot of people get into a vocation of service to helping others because it makes them feel superior...your perspective is warped.
@@poloparker0420 It is common knowledge for anyone with experience with psychiatry that there is an overrepresentation of narcissists in that firld, and that psychiatry as such doesn't give a shit about context as they wrongly believe everything, quite literally, is in your head. Neither do they care about your overall health and needs when prescribing the nerve toxins they call meds.
Spot on! CBT, DSM are doing incredible psychological damage by victim blaming and ABC method where we pacify and enable predators' abuse. On the other hand Humanistic psychology and Anti-psychiatry are anti-dote to ableist CBT.
@@poloparker0420 actually there *are* a lot of narcissistic, arrogant and other unhealthy people in psychiatry and counselling. They often have supervisors, yes, but what about when the supervisors and people above them are messed up? I’ve been fortunate enough to avoid bad counsellors for the most part, but I know they exist.
My mother’s lack of planning has caused massive stress among the siblings. She gets the affection and reassurance. I get the eye rolls, and condensing comments.
Your mom plans? I feel you. The person who gave birth to me would rather trick & triangulate than work with others. They love making you look like the problem.
This makes a lot of sense to me. I'm always the crazy one. I'm always the one to blame. I'm so glad you posted this. This really hits home with me so much! Thank you!
This is crazy... This just happened to me at the doctor's office with my child. And I had to use my voice to let the doctor know , this is not that, and you will not make our situation your fudged up family trauma and drama. I was so surprised that a doctor would try this but I'm so glad that I found you and you taught me how to use my voice ! So thanks and continue to make this content because it really helps! 🤗
@@ShintogaDeathAngel I honestly don't think she gets it. Most narcissistic ppl, have a superiority complex, which she does. She made me feel like I was beneath her because she's a "doctor" I'm just glad that I've been doing the work and trusting my voice and not let anyone devalue me no matter what their title may be. We're still ALL human beings at the end of the day!
So true. Can you speak about transfer? My mother deals with discomfort by placing her pain at my door. When my dad was in hospital, she rounded on me, stating my husband was horrible. When he died, the first thing she said was that we'd (three siblings) all married beneath our class. She then rang me up, not to ask how I was doing, but to threaten suicide and rant about how disgusting it was to think about me in bed with my husband.
She sounds messed up - what parent seriously spends that kind of time thinking about who their kid is sleeping with? Gross! It’s not her business. I’m sorry you had to deal with this.
D.A.R.V.O. very well explained in the family dynamic. Thank you 🙏🏼 for your vids and for vast positive impact you’ve had on me and my realizations of my narcissistic authoritarian parents and how this influence all areas of my life. I made the choice to go no-contact with both my parents and sister for almost 24mths now and I have been happier ever since. 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Yeah a whole bunch of examples just sprang to mind. I guess us being bad lawyers for ourselves explains why I 'knew' I'd be a bad lawyer when the possibility of going to law school came up. It hadn't been going very well for me lol.
This sounds all to familiar, and perfect sense.😔 I cannot express the gratitude 🙏 I have for this awareness 🕊️ and help. IT will make a big difference in my life and my healing process 💙. Thank you so much, Namaste and many Bright Blessings to you, your family and ALL the beautiful Souls that are here on your channel. May Positive Transformation be Spread throughout the Universe🌌 One Beautiful Peaceful Thought and Step at a Time 💙🤗🌼🙏🦋💚🥰🙏🌷💜🕊️❤️❤️❤️❤️
I don't think I have learned to be my own lawyer very well, after so many years. A few times I can count, which is a small comfort. Too many years of being outnumbered, of being negated and denied. At least I've learned how to extricate myself to survive... One fortunate thing is that I always knew what really happened, and I hadn't done anything to earn that abuse. It was a blessing not to carry shame and guilt, I guess. I am grateful.
Thank you Patrick, thank you for making these videos and making them so accessible. This is especially helpful for me right now, as I decided to tag along on a family road trip to take my younger brother to boarding school. It's very difficult being around an entire family who won't point out the disrespect in one person because they are scared it will be turned around on them/they just live with it every day. I normally only go with my family if I have my fiancé around for support... all of this to say I will be watching & rewatching a lot of your videos this week!! 😂
Holy crap!! Just having this go on in my life!! I watched it growing up but now that both parents are gone, my brothers are trying to pull this shit with me!!
Yes, it helps, thank you 💕🙏 A couple of weeks ago I was telling my dad that I am busy doing therapy and he continued by yelling that they are the best parents because I went to college and now I am just waiting for them to die and don't care about them because I'm not calling daily to give a report on what I am doing...
100% relatable. Eg; Me telling my mother I will never forget the physical & verbal abuse inflicted by my "father." Her reply: Well, when you were 15 you told him you'd piss on his grave ...
I have overcoming it by agreeing with everything "others" are"seeing" the situation. Untill I see a little bit of uppsetance for me, in my " favour" , and being"crossy" with environment... Something like that. Like" the dice is throwen, already" for me. Or I lost my chances... I guess, I guess, nobody has time for me. I have to chase what I want, the school, job, behavior on it, acheaving my goals, ""dream"", community, sociolizing Is for that, and it's a must...it's not something that I like, that much struggle, ...etc.
I think the problem is that in using the Karpman drama triangle you can try and be in the victim role as well, which buys into half of their game. If you sent a crummy text then you did, the father blew up at a significant event and he did that and each causes different levels of damage and how do we deal with that? That's too complicated a question for the drama triangle. IMO part of blowing up at the wedding is to provoke another person into the victim role, so the narcissist can then flip the victim role around to themselves. They drag you into the game, then through sheer bloody mindedness the narcissists make themselves win the game.
This is victim blaming. A toxic family will also do this - when we are injured by someone else outside the family - they will spin it too. For example - you're horrifically injured by a drug your Dr gave you. Your family will say "Well why did you go to a Dr in the first place? Maybe don't go to Dr's.?" These are the ppl who when you get raped, theyll say well what were you wearing? Why were you out that late? Aka - it's your fault.
I have a brother & sister-in-law who stopped talking to me because I think I annoyed them or something when I was caught up in an addiction-the addiction happened late in life due to a traumatic divorce and an abusive relationship that followed. They just cut me out of their life after years of going to their home, taking their kids places, etc. They even blocked my phone number and cut me from FB. Never mind that they’re alcoholics that consume at least 2 bottles a night, & I never judged them for it, until now-hypocrites.
I've starting to realize finally that if people can cognitively think of such an excuse like that about their or someone else's bad behavior than they do fully realize what they did and don't want to get in trouble. Just like a child sayin i only ate the cookies, because you put them there. While just before you the adult said No cookies before dinner.
WHY it is hard to accept that without processing reality, nothing can change? Twisting reality is (I am sorry to use the world, but) toxic. So unfair to force someone into a situation where manipulation what you find and all you are looking for is truth and facts. Why don't you deserve reality and people around you who are willing to process reality? Exhausting. Painful that you are not worth to handle with that much care: Your mental health damaged by gaslighting and stress. Is there a hierarchy between people where someone is more valuable and they are worth to dance around, to shelter from their own self on the expense of the secondary people? Secondary or even less, more like "object people". Object people without basic human rights.
Your question actually hits the nail on the head in answering that question! Without processing reality, nothing can change - people who are desperate to avoid self-reflection and difficult work on themselves will twist reality however they can to avoid making a change. Because it’s hard, or scary, or they’re in denial. Acknowledging their toxic behavior in reality would mean they’d have to face that they’re a “bad person” (not that it’s usually that black-and-white), and some people would rather live in a fantasy world until death than facilitate real, positive change for the sake of themselves and their loved ones.
@@maegsunflow95 Let's see who twists really. That comes first. You can't be accused without giving you the opportunity to explain yourself. Off course, not explaining yourself in a comment section. And off course, your words can't be used against you without giving you the place to explain your words. Everything you say can be used against you if someone wants to paint you the bad one. Using your words as a sound bite and they putting it in a sentence and story that benefits them. If someone hides something, there are reasons. If someone wants to be upfront, it is also a sign.
Sounds like no one want a to get along- never is it one persons fault. But at the same time, no one wants to take blame- maybe instead of always playing the “victim”, we could all try to be kind; treat others as you would like to be treated. Everyone can get along, if there is effort to do so- ❤
I have never understood why there is this triangle in the first place... like if person A hurt person B, why they can't just talk about it, set boundaries and don't do it in the future (like responsible adults with common sense, you know)? Why does someone need to be a victim, another an agressor? I know that parent - child relationships are complicated, but it is not like they are mystery or something. I am sure same principles should work
Because person A often gets defensive, victim blames and twists reality - how do you talk things out with someone who refuses to admit they made a mistake, or hurt you? Or even blames you for something that wasn’t your fault? That’s the whole point of what Patrick is saying. It would be great if everything could be talked out, but sometimes it isn’t an option. Avoidance might as well be some people’s middle name.
Me at 15 ( please read 15) crying calling my older sisters who was in her 20's to get help because " Mommy's drinking a lot" MY SISTER'S RESPONSE? " WELL DO YOU THINK MAYBE YOU'RE THE REASON SHE DRINKS?" Hot damn! Ill never forget it. I literally froze . I felt like someone punched me in the stomach. I said nothing. Then I don't remember anything other than knowing no one was going to help me. I was on my own and terrified.
