My Dad, who is now 77 years old, was a liberal all of his life, and was at PhD research chemist, working in polycarbonate research for Dow. Smartest person I've ever known. He's spent the last twenty some years, watching Fox "news" exclusively, and in that time, he's taken up Christianity, become an avowed Republican, and this past decade, a ferverent trump supporter. He excuses anything factual and negative about trump, while rejecting objective reality and ALL evidence that doesn't comport with the talking points he's been given and the lies trump and Fox feeds him. It's been incredibly distressing. He's in poor health and won't live too much longer, and at the end of his life, the trump cult has destroyed our relationship. I miss my Dad.
That's an incredibly tragic story and I'm sorry for your loss. It shows the power of propaganda and the monetary success of Fox spreading that propaganda just to make a buck. It disgusts me. Rupert Murdoch has done more to destroy democracy than any other person on the planet.
I am so sorry. I have noticed that I have done some of the similar things but for non-trump media. Turning off my tv, getting out into the world, and currently because we’re going into autumn, looking at the gifts we have changes my perspective. Good luck to you and your family. 💙
The most troubling thing about Trump’s appeal, to me, is that many of his supporters are drawn to him exactly BECAUSE he’s such a hateful, arrogant, egotistical, stupid, inarticulate, and wretched person. I think for them, it’s really gratifying to see someone just like themself in a position of power. He’s living the life they believe they deserve.
I’m glad that now I know that it’s much easier to distinguish people that have severe mental disorders. The ones that are still part of the cult, tell me that they are much worse mentally than the average person. Some mental illness is incurable such as NPD(DJT), others may take decades to unravel. But I can see a red hat and distance myself because it’s not my job to cure them.
@@franciet99 Personally, I think it may be a stigma and humility issue, too. There is ENORMOUS stigma against mental illness in our culture (in world culture probably, in general). Admitting that you feel yourself slipping and need some outside help is something that people see as weak and horrible and "people like this should just kys." I have diagnosed bipolar disorder. After some awful events in my life, I sought out treatment on my own - "What is wrong with me? I know I need help, whatever it is," and that diagnosis is tricky, doctors don't always get it the first time, but... well, let's just say that medication and therapy have helped immensely. With some aspects of my life, I actively worry that I might have gone down conspiracy rabbit-holes. I like to think that I would have NEVER have supported anyone like Trump (even with the old "Christians vote Republican!" junk I got handed in my old church - I haven't gone to church in over a decade) because he is just completely vile, but who knows what I would have been caught up in. I want you to remember that there are LOADS of Democrats, Independents and Republican Never-Trumpers and other categories of generally sane people who... aren't as sane as you think... and have had to undergo a lot of work and vulnerability to get there. Please don't look at Trumpers and just dismiss them all as "mentally ill." Some actually ill people are brave enough or get help or have the right family and friends in our lives to get us help. We are the lucky ones. Hell, at this point, after some of the worst aspects of late-stage Capitalism, Trump's first term and after the Pandemic, I honestly think that everyone in America has mental health problems / we're all suffering trauma and we NEED to unpack it or cult leaders like Trump will just continue to rise. Cult leaders prey upon the vulnerable and especially upon the vulnerable who don't want to admit that they are vulnerable.
He gives them permission to hate out loud. He is surfing on the wave of Face-eating-leopards, and the Face-eating-Leopards would NEVER eat THEIR faces! Only those *other* people's faces. tRump is offering them freedom - but they do not realize that that so called freedom is only free as long as it is what the dear leader wants. Most of those folks do not realize that a rich cult leader is not gonna want the same things as they do, they imagine Dear Leader is one of them, but it will be too late to protest once they find themselves on the menu of Hate DeJour.
The appeal of Trump is raw self interest. They are numerically wrong, but the vast majority will. of course, not benefit at all under Trump. They believe THEY will be better off and fuck everyone else.
My boyfriend and I at the time supported him when we were teens, trying to be edgy and thinking we knew better. But then we grew up, we both can’t stand him.
I feel super lucky that my 80+ year old parents are both Dems. Dad especially hated Trump from the beginning. Then again, during their working days, they were union-people.
@@cici35official19 that is pretty embarrassing, but kudos to you for owning up to it. having that level of self-reflection and growth is really important
Steve, as much as we hate to admit it, the racism is a feature, not a bug. Most of his supporters probably would not admit it, but they love the bigotry. They might honestly not think they are bigots, and are just “telling it like it is,” but they are in fact bigots. Supporting hate, makes one hatful. It really is that simple.
I used to feel sorry for the people who had become trapped in the bubble of coordinated disinformation from their political leaders, dishonest news organizations, and online communities. Thing is, watch a Trump rally and listen to the vile disgusting shit they cheer for. I know they're not all the same, but that sure killed a lot of the sympathy I used to have.
The best quote that I've heard about MAGA and Trump is: "Trump gives them the freedom to be free from decency" - Sherrilyn Ifill It is about the bigotry, He allows them to feel comfortable with their bigotry.
@@dreamivey3405 It's up tp you to think that. I don't really care. Difference is, I did NOT vote for the orange guy. That makes my action speak louder than my words. How about you, did you/will you vote for Harris? Sitting out is a cop out.
Cult: "A group that has an unassailable devotion to a person, an object, or an ideology. The devotion is not altered by fact or evidence." Check, and check.
@@hmnhntr I think that argument holds true for fundamentalism within religions but I think there are lots of people that believe in god that do not believe all that is written in the Bible because so much of it has been so thoroughly disproven. This indicates a willingness to alter one’s belief in the face of facts and evidence. Given that you cannot either provide compelling evidence of or against deific forces/beings, simple belief in the existence of god and an afterlife is more believing in something that has a complete lack of evidence to support it rather than any particular evidence against it. I say this as an atheist, and someone with a general distaste and distrust of organized religion.
I'd strongly disagree. There is a lot more a cult does to its members that most religions don't practice. To conflate the two trivializes the severity of cult practices.
My father-in-law is a Trumper and I’m the surface. He seems like a nice person. He’s a Christian. He goes to church every Sunday. He’s one of the guys that leads the old ladies to their seats, but I have to wonder like since we know Trump has no policies he can’t fall back on the fact that he likes Trump policies, I was a sexual assault victim advocate in the military during Trump‘s first run for president and when I heard the Hollywood tape come out I 100% thought Trump was done. The whole thing about it being locker room talk makes no sense. Who are you hanging out with in the locker room that talks about sexual assault like it’s nothing. And I just keep thinking that like that is who my father-in-law is giving his vote to. What kind of shriveled petrified shit could be in someone’s heart to let them vote for Donald Trump.
Not trying to armchair diagnose, but there are "do-gooders" who do good because it's the right and decent thing to do, but that they'll do something good because it feeds their ego (something like "main character syndrome"). Everyone is always talking about them, "they'll give you the shirt off their back". What they all seem to have in common is that they're lousy husbands, fathers, sons, etc. They overextend themselves on the performative deed, but neglect their own families.
Christianity has always been deeply misogynistic, just read the Bible on the role of women in the family, as chattel, as the property of men, as instructed to obey and be subservient, as the direct cause of the fall in the garden of Eden and so on. In many churches you won’t find women in charge and good luck finding a female pope or cardinal. It didn’t surprise me in the slightest when they shrugged off that tape
I disagree, it's possible to do good because you want to be good even if unknown & to tame the evil side successfully with artistic pursuits. The problem is that few people actually do that & I don't know what effect that has on a family. Then you have the man who takes pride in doing terrible things to real people Dump.
Yes, and that’s what Maga-ites call “freedom” - being the biggest a-hole you want to be because that’s “being a boss”, that’s being “tough”, that’s being “a man”. All of this kind of thinking leads down to violence and to brown shirts and to Thought Police. It’s all very primitive thinking, fueled by the worst instincts in us. It is so unChristian. These people would hate Christ if they met him. They’d crucify him all over again. But they call themselves Christians.
As a former Evangelical Christian, I think that cults fill the cultists' need for a sense of identity, belonging, and certainty. Cultists are adults that _need_ a parent figure.
Considering that his most fervent followers tend to be evangelical protestant Christians, their reverence of him as if he is their new messiah is weirdly fascinating. Unlike their God and Jesus, who might as well be absent fathers, Trump is tangible and actually does things that they think benefit them. He breathes new life into their stagnant, antiquated belief system and feeds into their persecution complex. They remind me a lot of female Klan gatherings, which were usually just overhyped book clubs and baking clubs. After the end of Jim Crow, when interviewed if they regretted their actions, they effectively said, "Of course I don't regret it! I got to hang out and have fun with my friends a lot." In other words, the racism and hateful rhetoric was just a pretense for them to feel like they're part of a community. They gladly threw marginalized people under the bus just to chase the high of tribalism and to feel less lonely. People really are not okay.
It's exactly what it is. Even for the non-religious but have a major religious upbringing, from my one experience, they just want a big Father Figure to Make All The Bad Things Go Away. ...because their own fathers and mothers have damaged and failed them in ways they won't admit they need to get therapy for. They can't let go, so they grab onto the hypothetical ideal of "The Perfect, Good Dad" where very they can make up for all the anguish and grief and rage they have felt for decades.
Take a look at the BITE model a lot of us in the ex-evangelic, ex-mormon, ex-jahova etc. circles use it to explain why we know that these "high control religions" are cults.
My best and oldest friend, a very smart person with a technical job, voted for Trump in 2016. Ever since, he has been working backward to justify that choice, and as his Trump apologetics became more and more tortured I had no choice but to counter them, over and over again, with facts he could not actually deny. I never judged him, I never rejected him, and I never shamed him. I loved him enough to tell him he was wrong and I accepted him anyway. He cut me out of his life. No contact, even when I have reached out, even after my brother, who he was also close to, died. I can only chalk it up to cowardice at this point. He is so afraid of having his worldview challenged that he chose the myth of Trump over his friend since first grade and a family that cared for him when he went through his own hard times. I lost two brothers. Feels bad, man.
It's so sad when people let politics turn them on those they love. I'm sorry for your losses. I can only imagine that your friend misses you terribly, but his loyalty to Trump has clouded any rational thought. There may be a day when Trump reveals himself to the point that no one can support him. My folks are MAGA and I know their loyalty to him is solid, but hope springs eternal that they will really see him.
Trump also gets a lot of support from people who hate minorities & are disgusted by the marginalized. Those aren't cult followers. They just are bigots.
They are also looking for permission to be cruel to these groups of people they feel offensive in their mind. The extreme right gives them the feeling they have that permission.
Nailed it. I’m a 30 year old straight white dude who grew up in a very conservative/Catholic family in suburban Ohio. I saw through Trump’s bullshit immediately 8+ years ago. What the fuck do people see in this guy? I just don’t get it.
Trump was able to tap in people's fears, insecurities, and anger in these people. He did it so well, that there's people who believes that Trump is a "savour of the US" himself, and anyone who questions Trump is an enemy that is "dooming everyone from being saved".
@@beefandbarley Maybe so for some. At least with my family they’re 100% single issue voters: abortion. Best I can say for them is that they’ve never put a Trump sign in their yard, while they did for McCain and Romney.
@@donovanphillips419 some people love seeing someone do whatever he wants and getting no consequences for it. they would love to be immune. to be "superior".
For some members, yes. But most common reason is that person is at more or less bad place, and cult first makes itself look like place where they can get what they want, usually community, and only start showing horrible side after member has invested too much to leave; cults have lots of common with toxic relationships 😰
That's definitely a tendency of cults, but you should be careful not to oversimplify. Cults tend to separate their followers from broader society, tend to require some form of sacrifice or abasement, tend to have slang, tend to to have authoritarian leader figures and so on. There's probably a cool Venn diagram in this somewhere.
A vote for Trump is not just a vote for Trump. A vote for Trump is also a vote for Kenneth Copeland, Greg Locke, Logan Paul, Dr. Phil and many others who represent the worst examples of society.
Conservatives almost always have to appeal to horrible people to gain power, because they themselves are horrible people. I genuinely want more people to point out how indicating it is that Conservative Movements are almost always backed by shitheads.
@@BasicallyBaconSandvichIV Let's be honest, he's a very forgettable person. I genuinely catch myself fairly often being somewhat surprised that Tesla and SpaceX are "his."
I myself grew up in a cult called Jehovah's Witnesses. Its really fascinating to me that with that experience I basically have a 6th sense on if something is a cult because it will remind me of Jehovah's Witnesses. Its fascinating how all cults take on different forms yet EVERY SINGLE ONE has a near identical framework. Trumpism is not different.
@@multinator2004 ExJW here too! I couldn't agree more. Read Leaving The Fold by Marlene Winnel. She really lays it all out. Cults are all the same at their core
I often read comments from people who are bewildered by Trump's supporters, which is understandable. If you look at them as just a political movement. If you see them as a cult, everything falls into place. It all makes sense then. The one thing we should never do is give a cult political power. That never ends well.
Exactly. For many of these people it is the first time they have ever felt included in something important. These are people who live in the background annoying only their family with their fatalism and lack of compassion.
Margaret Atwood’s The Handmaids tale is a prophetic book. Trump is so very dangerous and stupid at the same time. Easily manipulated by big corporations like Musk!
Perhaps the worst feature of the MAGA cult is that it's members don't go away and live in a commune but instead insist on living beside us normies, fucking up Thanksgiving and family group texts for almost a decade now... 😖
My father-in-law has a little dresser covered in Trump memorabilia, and front and center is a “signed” photo of Trump. It looks like a shrine someone might have for a saint or a family member who has passed. So yeah, the cult-vibes are real.
Speaking as an atheist with a M.Div. degree, we had a definition of cult that separated it from sects/denominations/religions. It has to do with the use of violence (which can include sexual violence) to maintain the group. MAGA would definitely fit this definition.
Yup, High Control Groups is the most common term that I'm aware of today. Because a lot of non-religious groups use /exactly/ the same tool sets to control folks, just differently flavoured based on that group's identity. Quite a few have been ostensibly self-help groups, mutual aid societies or the like. There's been a few that started off as perfectly innocent social clubs until somebody managed a change of leadership. Some of the pyramid schemes and whatnot also function as such. They always have some sort of "that problem you have? we're a solution!" vibe to them, because they're all looking for folks who are feeling lost, isolated, depressed and otherwise in need of support, so they can become the support and control you by threatening to remove that support the second you don't do what they want. Religions is a good fit for that, but anything you can turn into "all you have to do is trust me/us" can be turned into that. And of course, another reason why not to use 'cult' is that the word has a pre-existing meaning that kinda gets lost in the pop-culture hijacking of the term.
A friend is voting Stein over the Gaza conflict. So I wrote an anecdote: Do you know what a protest vote sounds like? Neither do I since no one has ever heard one...
I hate your friend. gonna take a small step in logic that they aren't in one of the groups who are in immediate danger from Donald being elected. standing on njave principle is a gross privilege to have.
@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 We're also in IL, which is solidly Blue. Electoral votes are going to Harris no matter what. But it still feels antithetical to her proclaimed values.
Yeah like I’m sorry but stein is a political opportunist, she claims to support Palestine but in the same breath praises Russia so… not a great indicator of good morals on the subject of sovereignty etc. Also I understand the concept of a protest vote, I think it has its place. But not when the stakes are this high. I support Palestine too, I don’t like that the democrats have been totally toothless. I wish they’d put netanyahu in his place. But I don’t want Palestine to get turned into a parking lot because I didn’t vote and trump got elected. It’s like choosing bleach over vinegar, why would you do that??? And while I see a lot of people personally affected by the unrest, and I understand their pain, I also see a lot of virtue signalling from the left. Yes, many democrats are awful on this issue. But voting third party doesn’t make you morally superior. What about the hundreds of thousands of people who died during Covid because trump was blatantly negligent? What about the women who have died because of his abortion bans? What about all the people suffering because of the hate he cultivates?
Honestly, the first time I saw Trump on TV decades ago, I literally recoiled in absolute disgust. How anyone could follow him, let alone choose to have kids with him, is beyond comprehension...
I grew up fundamentalist Baptist. I understand the Trump cult and what makes him appealing. That's why I'm much more terrified of Trump than the average never-Christian liberal.
@pancakes8670 Only Miquellester still preaches an "age of compassion", is still called " the kind" even by Ansbach, and he's a gay twink with a great (if not incestuous) taste in men. Trump has none of even these meagre things. Miquellester is terrible to have as a leader. But damn it Trump somehow manages to be EVEN WORSE!
@@hmnhntr Same-sex marriage was legalized in 2015, right at the same time he came down the golden escalator. Evangelical Christians believe that same-sex marriage is a special national sin that will cause God to wipe out any society that tolerates it. They believe America is on the hook for this since it's spread to the rest of the world from the US. They see Trump as sent by God as a weapon to set things right and save the country. They win no matter what. Either they get their theocracy, or he burns the country to the ground, fulfilling God's judgment.
@@hmnhntr Ex-Evangelical here, onetime reader of the Left Behind series. My church wasn't even that Fundamentalist, but I used to watch a lot of religious TV back in the day and encountered a lot of what a certain subset of American Christianity that is involved in politics has tried (and successfully) groomed people into: 1. There is this idea that God promises nations blessings and protections. There is also this idea that America is a uniquely special and blessed nation. (Some, recently, believe that it replaces Israel as the apple of God's eye / that since Jews rejected Jesus as the Messiah that God needed a new nation. Others, on the other hand, are the complete opposite of this and believe that Israel - the nation, not necessarily its people - is a vital thing to have intact for the prophesied End Times to happen - hence some of our takes on foreign policy, the "Israel can do no wrong" is a religious tenant of some of these guys). 2. A part of the above is that if a nation strays from God's Will, various disasters will befall it. Natural disasters and so forth. Christian Nationalists believe that they must make America into a Christian-nation or that the land itself will be destroyed. Along with this, they think that being too permissive and giving non-Christians (or even the not-the-right-kind-of Christians too many rights) has lead to untold perversion and sin in the land, inviting God's Wrath. (They love to ignore all of the parts of the Bible, both Old and New Testaments about welcoming the stranger into the land and doing good for the poor in favor of focusing on supposed sexual sins, though, which actually make up a very small part of the Bible, and some of the translations are disputed. Nevermind, just pointing at gay people and blaming them for hurricanes seems to suffice). 3. This subset believes that the world has to get worse before it gets better. They literally believe in the world set on fire / the coming of the Anticrhist / the rapture, etc. etc. before Christ comes bearing a sword, sets the world to Judgement and brings a Utopic Heaven to Earth. 4. They believe (strongly) in the exclusivity of this Heaven. If you believe the right things (often a little laundry-list of things) and say the right prayers, you're in. If you do not, or lose your faith, you're out and you're going to Hell to be tortured forever. Now, they are supposed to want to try to save you - to preach to you and to save your soul, but if you refuse, well, that's on you and with such a mentality, it is very, very easy to stop caring about the world and it's state. If you believe that almost no one gets to Heaven - only you and you're little band of right-believers, it becomes pretty easy to not care what happens to the rest of the world / not care what you do to it. 5. Environmental policy is the same way. "Man was given dominion over the Earth" and, of course, they ignore the many little environmental responsibility verses in the Bible, the same way as they ignore the good treatment of foreigners verses (because they are dreadfully afraid of foreigners, who don't have the right religions / specific take on their religion, you see, and therefore might corrupt their children or something). They also think that the world is going to end soon, they will just get raptured and so not to think about it, or worse yet, that thinking about the needs of the Earth is "going back to pagan Earth-based religions and worshipping Gaia" which God will definitely punish everyone for. 6. An in all, they believe that taking over the U.S.A. expelling the scary foreign influences, keeping women into some artificial "place" as breeders and helpmeets, and forcing people to, if they do not believe in their very specific version of Christianity to at least "pretend to" so that sin will decrease and God will bless us and "fake it till you make it / more people are likely to get saved this way" - well, yeah, they really do believe they can force belief of the heart and that it is their duty to - in order to keep you out of Hell (by force if necessary) or to keep you from doing the naughties that will get God pissed off at everyone. 7. Trump is a supreme sinner, but they don't care about that because he's kind of a puppet for their people. He already did the major thing that they wanted: Appoint Supreme Court justices that overturned Roe v. Wade to "save the babies" and to remind women of their place. They see him (literally, you can look up "Trump Prophets") as their "King Cyrus" a "pagan king who, while an unbeliever / sinner did things to uphold God's People." - In other words, they see him as a puppet and they like that he's a puppet. 8. A few sub-sects of this Christian Nationalism thing, in going back to the "U.S.A. is special and the New Israel" have openly decided that Trump is a "Christ" - a new Christ equal to Jesus or even a replacement for Jesus. Don't ask me why, to this Progressive Christian / former Evangelical, this is INCREDIBLY blasphemous. In other words, *nod, nod* cult leader, with the added weirdness of "he didn't even try to be a cult leader, people just elevated him and he went with it." Sorry for the length. I hope that answers some things.
People say Trump is charismatic, their definition of charisma must differ from mine. A guy that gives people nicknames, like an 8 year old, mocks disabled people, lies constantly, how is any of that appealing?
I find Trump extremely irritating. It's not just his lies and juvenile behavior. He's constantly mocking and talking down to people, even his own supporters, the sound of his voice is pure arrogance. His supporters are similar in the way they mock and talk down to people they suspect are not in their cult, I've explained countless times to MAGAheads that isn't about political viewpoints alone, I just don't like the guy. If he was a Democrat I still wouldn't like him.
As a Christian, I appreciate your nuanced and charitable assessment of my faith tradition. It pains me to see how so many of my fellow Christians have abandoned their lifelong values to follow after this Anti-Christ Donald Trump.
@@cyber5304 There are three Christian RU-vid channels that make the case that Trump is the biblical end-times Anti-Christ. They are Dr. Cliff Kelly, Brother James Key, and Antichrist 45.
@nmbr1son64 That's the very verse of Scripture that came to me way back in 2016 when I was flabbergasted by the blindness of so many of my fellow Christians.
"Unremarkable" describes Trump perfectly. I have never heard Donald Trump say anything remotely interesting or thought-provoking. I have never heard Donald Trump say anything that showed any intellectual depth or insight into important issues. He's just an annoying dud.
The key difference between a cult and a religion is whether the community can survive a transition in leadership. Cults often collapse when then "leader" dies or abandons them. In which case the religious trappings were entirely secondary to the character of the leader, and it could just as easily been a flat earth society, or bowling club, or a D&D group that got out of hand.
Yes! Which bodes well for our nation should Harris win the upcoming election. If MAGA is truly a cult, it will disperse naturally if Trump is defeated and rendered irrelevant. A Harris/Walz landslide could ultimately free us all 💙
@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 Things that are bad for you succeed all the time. Junk food, cigarettes, alcohol for an example. Religion is just a cult that achieved social acceptance. Success is a bad metric, because cults die all the time: but they succeed in their purpose; which is to trick people into believing in them, and paying out. But you can walk into a catholic church and no one will bat an eye. Walk into the hall of that cult that thought there was an alien space ship in the comets tail; and people will make the disgusted face when they see you do it.
I was in the trump cult until 2019.. lost everything Its because you feel so low that even someone as unimpressuve as the cult leaders feels impressive... You're trying so hard to deal with life to where life is unbearable you finally feel like someone's got your hand.. That's what it was like for me because when I was found I was broken... Lost my partner, my kids, my home everything I didn't fall for a con I knew fine well what he was llke I read his biography but why would I care about others when it was others who took everything from me? That was how I thought at the time
Ex Mormon here, love the shout out to Mormonism. I think often about the parallels between Mormonism's founder, Joseph Smith, and Donald Trump. It is not surprising to me in the least that so many Mormons adore him.
@@waverlyking6045 they also cast out Mitt Romney after he voted to hold Trump accountable after J6. It's interesting how certain people seem more susceptible to cults than others.
@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 Let me put it to you like this. Respect and agreement are not the same thing. I disagree with damn near everything the Mormons are about. However, I believe in allowing even people I disagree with the opportunity to redeem themselves. Regardless of how you view Evan McMullen, he is far more principled than Trump. That was the opportunity they screwed up.
Sorry to hear that you lost that much, but at least you have rest of your life which belongs to you 👍 You are really strong and brave for being able to get out 👏👏👏👏👏👏
The more someone has invested in a cult, be it money or the promise of prosperity, the more they have to lose by admitting they were wrong. The only way people can break their programming is to provide something to replace the comfort a cult brings.
Haha, yea, they never want me neither. I ask too many bad faith questions because I can't take faith as a good faith argument. "It's true because you believe it? Isn't that fucking convenient?"
@@f.demascio1857 Holy shit I hope you anonymously reported them to the relevant state licensing boards, BBB, LinkedIn, Yelp, etc. I wouldn't want them anywhere NEAR my animals.
I have a dear friend that went all in for donnie in 2016. He is quite successful and explained his support was tied to his own wealth and policies for his businesses. Immediately, the first round of tariffs almost bankrupted several of his companies and my friend really had to scramble to keep them afloat. A huge chunk of his labor force is immigrants that have been working towards citizenship for years and he seems to have a lot of respect for them. He is still an avid supporter. Cult.
Cults prey on vulnerable lonely people. Concidering this saddens me that there are so many of these people in America. I guess this is the end result of individualism over community.
Community over individualism may sound good when you say it, but ultimately it's the very foundation of fascism, the notion that the individual exists to serve the state, not vice versa. Individualism comes with its flaws, yes, but I find those flaws far, far preferable to the alternative.
I'm a non-American and my mom is just the kindest person I've ever met and she's always seen the best in everyone. But she's puzzled as to why even a single person would vote for that man. I'll send her this video and I think it'll help her understand.
I'm also an American. But I've been among the lucky 20% of Americans that will ever travel outside of this country for more than a week for non-work related reasons. I was raised, due to the random chance of adoption, by incredible parents who'd both spent whatever time they could afford traveling the world starting in their early-twenties. Dad was from West Virginia, Mom was from South Africa, & they met each other at a youth hostel in London. Mom's tour bus & camping group had decided to stay there that week when planning their itinerary. My Dad was solo-backpacking through Europe during his gap-year, and happened to like the sign hanging above the front door of the hostel for some reason & that's when he decided to stay there that same week. Its been almost 57 years since they met & they've been married for 53 of them. I had the privilege & pleasure of spending at least 2 weeks & up to 6 weeks every year from before my 1st b'day until my early-20s traveling through the non-touristy parts of a foreign country or countries with my parents. There were, of course exceptions to the overall plan to avoiding going to places tourists would normally go, like Stonehenge, the Palace of Versailles Gardens, & Table-Top Mountain, for example. It was my (horrible) decision to get married thst brought an early end to traveling with my folks & if I could go back in time to re-do it knowing my choice is between either 5 awful years in a marriage that ends in divorce, or another 10-15+ years of traveling through 1 or more countries somewhere overseas together with my parents at least 2 weeks each year, I'd _absolutely_ choose traveling with my parents. All I actually set out to say was I escaped the trap of the Americans Exceptionalism propaganda thanks to my parents. I already knew it was a load of bollocks even before I actually heard the term for it used in a sentence the 1st time. So, I've never found the idea of being a non-American even the slightest bit un-appealing in & nowadays I'm finding the idea more appealing than ever before. Considering the horrors that another Trump presidency would usher in now that the functional guardrails & people in his cabinet willing to get in his way or tell him "No," that prevented Trump from doing whatever f**k he wanted during his first presidency were all eliminated, purposely broken or simply ceased to be in the last 4-5 years. Shiz got even more grim in the wake of the SCOTUS decision granting former presidents immunity from criminal prosecution for anything they do while POTUS that's considered an "official act" or a part of "carrying out the 'core duties' of their office" as POTUS. I don't want to be an American right now; the goings-on in the US are legit friggin terrifying!!! Americans fought a Revolutionary War to they wouldn't have to ever be ruled over by a king again!!! But our Supreme Court Justices just basically made the POTUS and former POTUSs into kings, to whom the rule of law does not apply, who can't be held accountable by anybody for their words or actions & have an insane amount of power to wield completely unchecked. What a fantastic idea!! 🙃 I wonder why it's never been done before?! 🤔 So yeah, umm, what happened is the wisdom of SCOTUS Justices became soooo incredibly vast & their knowledge developed such unbelievable depth & that's the reason nobody is able to understand their decisions anymore, except the SCOTUS Justices. themselves. Riiiiiiight....
The difference is usually scale and scope. Churches are often stable cults that have been normalized by the society they function in. Churches usually have a founder that is no longer alive or have a founder that is apocryphal.
@@maartenvanderzwan8281 It's an interesting question. As someone who grew up Catholic but was pretty firmly atheist by early teens, I do wonder how many of the bishops cardinals and Popes actually sincerely believe in Mr Jebus, or whether most (or all) of them actually know it is all just mythology but hey, it's a gig...
@maartenvanderzwan8281 While the Pope is the head of the church, it's not as if the current living pope is actually the one who founded the religion. It's a title and position, but the head of the religious movement for Christians was Jesus and maybe some of the more intense apostles that spread the stories after the passing of Jesus.
I had an instructor in undergrad that belonged to Scientology mess. He was kooky, and I fought him in class so much, he punished me with an a 3.8 grade. Cultists are strange. Cultists/cult leaders can be dangerous
I think the technical term is very instructive here. The technical term for what we call cults is "high-control group". They hold a high degree of control over your thoughts and actions.
I compare maga to scientology along those lines, you're not allowed to question the leader in anyway, if you do you'll begin to be ostracized. Think Leah Remini the actress. When Amber Rose spoke at the RNC she said when she's with the maga people "it's nothing but love". I'd imagine that's what most cultists feel when they're in the middle of it.
This is the result of some research that The Humanist Report discussed in a video that dropped less than an hour ago. Informative, uncomfortable, and important video, worth watching.
@@glasgowmcglasgowfacevotegr7049 the definition of fascism itself is not far off from the definition of a cult, it's just a cult deeply involved in the acquisition of sweeping political power over the "others" outside the cult.
I couldn’t agree more. I’m a blue dot in a very red state and I don’t understand how he is still a serious candidate. So many of his supporters overlook things that would outraged them in the past. No matter what he says or does they still kiss the ring. I don’t know what concerns me more what will happen if he wins or what will happen if he loses.
I think the concern is higher on "if he wins" because then he has access to the authority of the State (and the nuclear codes). I'm not sure his followers are up for another J6
A Trump victory would be much more concerning,imo. I mean,the U.S. and our allies helped to save Europe from fascist dictatorship eighty years ago but,who’s gonna come and save us?
I have studied cults while getting my psychology degree. I can boil it down to four points. 1. Hard sales tactics. A religion will use soft sales tactics like trying to reason with you or trying to make their church attractive. Cults resort to hard sales tactics like using psychological manipulation, playing on your fears or your loneliness, anything to stop you from thinking. 2. Human leadership. A religion will often codify their beliefs so that you know what they believe. A cult will make you completely reliant on a few humans to tell you what to do so that even if those humans contradict themselves, it's about the human leader, not a codified belief system. 3. Us vs them. A religion might define an us vs them but they don't focus on it. A cult will emphasize us vs them to the degree that they spend a lot of time demonizing, hating or attacking "them" whoever "they" are. 4. Sacrifice. A religion might ask for a tithe or a small donation to pay for the services of the organization. A cult will demand greater and greater sacrifices until you are practically giving your life savings to the leader. There is always a magical promise that you will get bliss in return but it's only a promise easily broken.
The appeal is is something akin to a professional wrestling venue, or a festival. If you ever see those Trump rallies, the people outside they get to wear their weird out in public, without judgment from the people around them. It's a comfort thing, they get to cheer and chant together and it makes them feel better. That's the appeal. And that's why they keep going back.
I think one sign of a cult is that everyone in the cult is told that everyone outside the cult is in a cult who can't think for him- or herself. Also, listen carefully for whenever something like "listen to your inner feeling" "you 'know' this is right" "don't listen to the experts" "don't read this" is evoked. That just puts one's little mind against an entire propaganda machine.
Hell is the biggest problem I have with Judeo-Christianity. I could not bow to a god who would allow such a place to exist. Much less to send people there for eternity for “sins” committed in a finite life.
Hell is perhaps the biggest injustice that Judeo-Christianity would have the answer for. Lucky for them, I don't actually think it exists. Just wish they could see that too. I always saw Hell as a very emotional thing to believe in. I've had it explained to me a lot "but what happens when you see bad people getting away with their crimes? Doesn't that make you want for there to be some kind of greater justice for them?". And yeah, I understand that feeling. I feel it all the time. But like... that's part of being an adult? Is accepting that the world isn't always fair and that we have to use what's in our power to make it fair. You can't just sit around, shrug your shoulders, and say "oh well I guess God will get 'em in the afterlife."
The person is not sent to hell, defined as separated from God’s love, for sins per se. It is the refusal to repent that dooms the individual. God does not demand that a person “bow” as much as for the person to stop his rebellion and attempts to usurp His authority. This is why Satan is condemned for eternity.
It’s interesting to me the concept of a “hell” means we go against the big Christian concept of not judging others. However, WE are judging THEM and sending THEM to hell. Not God, we are.
@@franciet99 : It is true that people in their unjust and callous treatment of others can create a sort of hell on earth but the Christian concept of hell is the eternal separation from God’s love. This is not to say that God’s presence is not in hell. God fills all of space and time including hell. Hell can take many forms all to be avoided at all costs. The most frightening description of hell I have heard is a story related by the late comedian Lenny Bruce. He was put under anathesia for a surgical procedure and found himself in profound darkness, experiencing an electrical shock, and hearing a deafening humming sound. It went through his mind that what if this was eternity? How does this relate to hell? Since God is light, then God’s absence would be complete and utter darkness. The electric shock is the absence of and spiritual pleasure or peace and the loud humming is also disruptive of God’s love whose peace surpasses all understanding. This digression is to remind people not only to not be judgemental but to show justice and mercy to each other and to love God with all our heart. We are certainly not sending anyone, including ourselves, to hell by doing this.
@@johnsnodgrass6769 And it all still boils down to "Do it my way or suffer," and any self-proclaimed deity who can work like that is just another dictator I reject.
I saw someone say that for conspiratorial or cult like thinking to take place in a person two things need to happen: The person has to be deeply uncomfortable with uncertainty and the unexplained. They need definite answers for all things. The other half is a desire for superiority or exclusivity. They want to feel special and in the know.
I think some have unwavering support for Trump because they liked The Apprentice. He's basically a celebrity off of the telly, and I wonder whether that makes them feel like they know him and can trust him.
The whole apprentice thing was a fraud too! Trumps learned well how to impress an audience!! Too well, with nothing but lies, rascism & hate!! VOTE BLUE ALL THE WAY SAY NO TO TRUMP AND PROJECT 2025!!
Fun fact: The founder of the mormon church was actually a candidate for president ... at the time he was killed ... in a gun fight ... while in jail ... on charges connected to violating the free-press clause of the first ammendment. 🙃
I parted ways with a couple of people I've known since we were kids because they not only fell into the Trump cult, but they tried so hard to make me believe he's a good person and why I should vote for him. I refused. I voted early for Kamala Harris because she is clearly the only good choice.
All cults ultimately use exactly the same tactics. Once you strip away doctrine most look pretty similar. They get people through the same combination of tactics - fear, ego, and promises of a greater future. It's never about how smart or stupid or even how racist a person is. Some of the smartest, kindest, most accepting people i have ever known were in my old cult. The way a cult recruits people is by finding their emotional pressure points and pushing on them. Usually it's a combination of fear and hope, but grief and hope work well too. The cult is presented as the solution to whatever problem they think you're most concerned with. There is usually also some promise of a return to a far better glorious past, or utopia waiting just off in the not so distant future but always just out of reach unless we can do, whatever. Living in a cult is exhausting. Being part of the cult means you have been blessed with special knowledge. You are special. One of the chosen few. After awile you've been in for long enough that you can't let yourself think you've been wrong or worse, been duped. It's the Sunken Cost Fallacy. You'd be surprised some of the people i knew or knew of that were part of it. Highly educated people, celebrities, engineers, even a nuclear physicist, multiple doctors, but mostly just regular fucking people trying to make it day to day. You'd never think anything about them. Most cultists don't have any idea they're in a cult. I never did. Most cults also don't live in compounds, or wear black robes and sacrifice animals, most are made of people you know and work with. They will remain separated from society even while living and working in it. In the world but not of the World. They create their own reality for the flock. It's a huge part of the reason breaking free is so hard. Your whole world is wrapped up in the group. Rejecting the group usually comes at serious cost. In my old cult it means everyone, including family, will pretend you don't exist. Complete shunning to the point of crossing the street, averting their eyes, and pretending not to hear you if you speak to them. When the only world you've ever known is the cult, or at least haven't known anything else in a long time, and were taught to fear the outside, it makes it extremely difficult to just walk away after a certain point. I hope the voters reject the GOP fully this time. The only way they'll move away from cultist BS is if stops winning them votes. End gerrymandering and give us Ranked Choice voting. It will be a good way of breaking the backs of the party cults
The problem with cults is that they are really hard to dismantle without harming the victims. Not sure that will be possible with the Trump cult. Also, I really, really hope the Trump cult doesn’t metastasise into a religion.
My church reaches out to the community, feeds the poor, hosts charity collection drives, and generally exists to serve the community. To me, what separates it from a cult is that cults seek to cut its members off from support structures like friends, family, and community so that its members become dependent on it.
I've been saying this ever since I read the book " The Cult of Trump" when it first came out. The author used to be in a cult, so he has first-hand experience. Now, every time Trump supporters do actions are illogical or unexplainable, I think, "Oh, it's because there in a cult." Then it makes perfect sense.
I can explain the biggest reason why people join cults: deep-seated fears and insecurity. The cult leader preys upon these and convinces them (a) they are not only special but superior and that their flaws are actually super powers, (b) that their fears are real and worse than they imagined, (c) that everyone else is the enemy and that the cult leader is the only one who can save them. But not everyone in the cult is drawn to it by their insecurities - some actually observe the power and control of the leader over the cult members and wish to get a piece of the action for themselves. (The J.D. Vance's of the world.) Others have a strong bond with a family member or loved one who is in the cult and don't want to be separated from them, so they sacrifice their own identity just to stay together. And then there are a handful that are naive and simply go along with whatever the majority of their social circle are doing, oblivious to any potential harm that may cause them.
The important thing to note, though, is that when you strip the political "team" away, they like a lot of the policies they claim to hate. Because social equity and financial support are things that are obviously appealing to most people when described as what they are rather than an overblown boogeyman. They turn against it when it's attached to the word "Democrat" because it's the cult's word for demon, and that's all.
But the "Let's go Brandon" crowd *will* follow their leaser(s) in cuddling up to Marxist authoritarians propped up by corrupt oligarchs... and that's why the political spectrum gets described as a 'horseshod'.
As an MD …I made sure to vote early to make sure the cult leader cannot win. As I look around in my area, i know we were not the only one. Early voting in MD started. As I went on Sunday when most would be in church, I talked to the workers who were happy to explain how busy they have been. They clapped first time voters…. They gave me a sticker for my daughter who was so nervous, she dropped it off in the drop box before I went to vote and waited outside. It amazed me as I was leaving a church group came in and were excited and joyful. Then I heard the MG speeches and wished I could help with the extra people making sure to vote early. There is no love for the cult leader where I live.
Some people just want to follow; they either have had their ability to think for themselves beaten out of them (proverbially and/or literally) or worse, never had it in the first place. To quote Eric Hoffer on these types of authoritarian followers: "Without the ability to make something of themselves, Freedom is an irksome burden."
Regarding far right people, the quote at the end of your post summarizes perfectly what I’ve been thinking. They are afraid of Life and resent those who aren’t.
