Universal Audio Apollo 8 & The SUM Cable | Pro Audio LA 

This concept saved my $2000. Thanks a lot.

Hi, Marcin! I'm Jason with Pro Audio LA :-) You may have missed the part of the video that explains that there is a passive resistance network built into the connectors in The Sum Cable. This is The Sum Cables internal topology. From 8 channels of line-level input into The Sum Cable, the passive resistance network brings the 8 channels down to a stereo pair with an approximate reduction of 30dB. From the XLR outputs of the cable, it is up to the user to determine which mic preamps are the best fit to provide the 30dB of make up gain. Whether it's a pair of Neve 1073's or a UAD emulation through UA's Unison Technology, this concept gives the user more headroom and choice of tonality for their mix buss. The Sum Cable has helped a lot of customers who couldn't afford an analog summing mixer or wanted more control over the "color" of the make-up gain in their summing path. We have put The Sum cable through it's paces. The Sum Cable shines even during double-blind tests vs industry standard summing products from a range of manufacturers. Have a listen to The Sum Cable vs. the highly-sought-after Shadow Hills Equinox (and also compare to an "in-the-box" mix on our site here: www.proaudiola.com/sum-cable-s/793.htm We also appreciate the benefits of analog hardware! In fact, The Sum Cable performs exceptionally well when paired with outboard preamps. Hardware such as "The Rooster" vacuum tube preamp from Thermionic Culture or BAE 1073 MPL can be used to add true analog harmonics to the mix. For users who don't have outboard pres, The Sum Cable still provides a plethora of tonality. Whether it be a Manley Vox Box, API, UA, Neve or an SSL channel strip emulation, the flavor your looking for is there. Our Sum Cable concept and process in fact has nothing to do with plugins. You use a hardware mic preamp to make up the gain -- just like the make-up gain inside your summing mixer like Dangerous, however, with our concept, you can use whatever "flavor" of make-up gain you desire instead of only having the choice of the gain built into your summing mixer. Let us know if you need any further clarification! We'd be happy to let you try it. It comes with a money-back guarantee, and we've sold many with not a single return. The Sum Cable does what we say it does ;-)

I bought one from eBay and I Never mix without it. Love it

ckjjclan, absolutely! That's the primary way to use The SUM Cable (unless you have an interface with built-in preamps). Both methods are perfectly viable and sound great! Let us know if you have any other questions!

Have been testing out Apollo x8 with The Sum Cable and the results are better than ever! The upgraded DA/AD convertors and mic pres in Apollo x8 make The Sum Cable an even more valuable studio tool. Increased headroom on the input and output stages of Apollo x8 allow for more separation creates noticeably more punch. The "Hex" chip adds more DSP for you to paint the overall tonal characteristic with your favorite UAD "Unison" Mic pre or optional outboard hardware pre.

People ask us all the time if analog summing is worth it or not... "Is it for real?" In our experience, the answer is, "It depends." Some folks perceive immediate, positive improvements while others feel like the differences seem too subtle to even notice. The reason for this is that everyone has slightly different ways of approaching making music. Gain-staging, from tracking to mixing and to mastering varies a great deal from engineer to engineer. If you gain stage and mix in a certain way, analog summing might be of huge benefit to you. If you gain stage and mix in a different way, maybe analog summing isn't a game changer for you. Just like a plug-in preset, it's not one size fits all, so it's a good thing to learn about analog summing and try to see if it is helpful for your sound and workflow :-) We have a summing station in our shop in Glendale where you can try out 8 different summing products and topologies at the touch of a button. You are all welcome at Pro Audio LA anytime :-)

I GOT MINES and its sweeter then my SUMMING MIXER really good CHAMPION you are BIG RESPECK to you

Great video I'm getting the apollo 6 heritage this week I'm ordering the cables now I knew anything of this thanks for posting

Why not bus all the tracks to a stereo audio track?

Hi Michel, Great question! Yes you can connect the DB25 version of The SUM Cable to a patchbay with DB25 inputs on the back ! Both the eight and the sixteen channel configuration can be used on a bay. This is our favorite way to integrate The Sum into studios with multiple pieces of outboard equipment. Doing so allows the user to easily patch or normal any line level signal into The Sum and utilize available outboard preamps and gear to provide the make gain and shape the tone for the mix buss. The TRS version of The SUM can also be used in the same way on a patchbays that have TRS inputs on the back.

Hi, RS! It's actually not snake oil at all. The proof is in the pudding. You can listen to sound samples comparing The SUM Cable to other really-popular (and expensive) summing mixers on the market -- including plenty of great ones that we ourselves are dealers for. We've now sold over 300 of The SUM Cable and not one return -- everybody loves the extra width and depth and detail that they get, and with UA's brilliant Unison technology, it takes it to an even higher level :-) If you're not convinced, engage with us, and we'll convince you. Remember, we offer a 100% money-back guarantee :-)

Great but on any other DAW all you would need to do is put the U/A plugins on the master bus. There is no advantage to sending it out to the console app and just creates extra work. Just put the preamp plugin on the master output bus and its the same thing isnt it?

I WILL BE ORDERING THIS FEB 1ST FOR OO2 CONSOLE TO SSL 6 BACK TO OO2 IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW. THANK YOU FOR THE INVENTION TO REPLACE MY 1/4 SNAKE.

Genious!!! I bought a SUM cable :O

I use the Dangerous Dbox for my summing. Its awesome!!

so just to confirm. you're going out if the daw, through a DAC (internally clocked) then through a cable, then a preamp, then through another DAC stage (internally clocked again), and back into the daw? hmmmmm

It would be great this cable came integrated and built-in inside the interface!!! Im sure it would be a great deal!!

Hi, Ivo Leary! We are very serious :-) We've sold over 300 SUM Cables and not a single return to date even though we offer a money-back guarantee. The difference it makes to headroom and separation is not subtle, and it has beaten out quite a few expensive summing mixers that essentially do the same thing except the make-up gain is built into those devices. We'd be happy to get you one to try. Want to make a video detailing your experience with it? Hearing is believing :-)

T. Farris, that wouldn't be analog summing. Analog summing has different characteristics to digital summing. We've found that mixes sound better 100% of the time when going through an analog topology, especially when coupled with Universal Audio Unison technology to model the vibe of classic preamps or when the make-up gain comes from a stereo mic preamp of your choosing. There are sound samples on our website at the link in the top comment. Listen for yourself how an "In-The-Box" mix compares to various popular summing mixers on the market as well as compared to The SUM Cable. If you listen on a good set of speakers, you too will notice the benefits of this workflow! Feel free to ask us any further questions :-)

it really works better then my summing amp i love it

Actually, I think everyone's experiences are different. "Your mileage may vary," as they say. We've heard summing make a dramatic difference on a mix with only 16 tracks and also heard it not make a dramatic difference on a mix with 120 tracks. A lot depends on the structuring of gain staging that was used throughout the process from tracking, mixing, and onwards. We've found that for the majority of folks mixing, analog summing has a positive benefit that is very noticeable. The DAW world is different than how making music worked 20 years ago in fully-analog environments, and summing is a way to help the more standard rules of analog gain staging apply for those who conform to analog standards and habits. Everyone's situations is unique, of course, but we built this cable/system to experiment with both analog summing as well as with the Unison technology fo the UA interfaces, and we've been really pleased by the results. We do offer a money-back guarantee so we're very confident in the benefits of what can be achieved :-)

Hi, Home Recording Made Easy! Thanks for chiming in :-) It's not the same thing, actually. What you propose is certainly an approach worth trying, but it's still digital summing where everything is being summed "in-the-box." When analog summing, one combines various signals electronically with voltages -- this has very different sonic characteristics, and in most cases engineers prefer the sound of analog summing to digital summing. Depending on how you've done your gain staging during tracking and mixing and what style of music you are making, the differences can be more or less dramatic, but the concept of The SUM Cable is a technique that a lot of engineers are employing in their workflows to great success. It was developed by Pro Audio LA staff engineers who were looking for an alternative to an expensive, dedicated piece of analog hardware to do their summing while being able to use the preamps they already had to make up the gain after combining their stereo stems through a network of passive resistors built into the cable. With the UA Apollo interfaces (with Unison modeling technology built into the Apollos), it provides a whole new world of possibilities to take advantage of the brilliant ecosystem UA has developed. You might want to give it a try! Your mixes are bound to sound wider, more detailed, with better separation, and just an overall "glue" effect that helps tracks seem more polished and ready for release! Let us know if you have any other questions, we're here to help people, "Make Better Music!"

Forgive me if I misunderstand, but how is this different to putting a mic pre emulator plugin on the mix bus, and never having to leave the digital domain?

The examples in the video sound fantastic to me!

Good idea!

Could you please make more videos based on this Sum cable? Different genres, hip hop, r&b perhaps? I’m really looking forward to purchasing this.

I have an raidal workhorse 500 rack & summing mixer with 8 slots...this will workout very well! Hell yeah! Lol

great way to work with that :) thx for the inspiration!

Thank you 👍👍👍👍

Is this any different from the sum cable used to go with the dangerous d-box? Whats the difference or benefits from your product over buying the d-box?

This is a fancy splitter cable with a 10k Ohm resistor on each output ??

Going through the preamps give you that Analog sound, and summing with the 8 outputs sounds like this is a good idea, where can I get the cables from?

I really want to try this cable.

What's better doing this or using a d'box it looks like it's the same thing

What an amazingly cool idea ... also just discovered you've got the DB25 version, so on my shopping list :-)

Hi Jason, could there be a risk of degradation if we accidentally switch on phantom power ? thank you

Sounds good

Wow this is dope can it be used with other interfaces as well ?

Nice😀

Off the top, is this a way of mixing with the UAD plugins inserted in the console program, unison and regular?

Been thinking this for yrs...tho i have a dangerous D box...this is exactly how i would do it if i didnt have it! Applaud"

I have an Apollo x6, I imagine this would work the same way just with 6 line outs instead of the 8. My question is, if I integrate an Apollo twin quad with my x6 setup would I be able to utilize all 8 channels with this sum cable?

Might be a dumb question but does that mean the analog stereo audio bus track is essentially the new “master track” then you’d bounce from there. If I understand properly the summing of the digital tracks to a master bus is not as good as sending I guess stems through the sum cable to unison pres . Looking to make an x8 the centerpiece of my studio as well and just want to learn as much as possible before pulling the trigger . I’m already getting though the whole thunderbolt 3 connections and port installation on my computer . Anyways thanks for the insight !

Very cool! I have 2x apollo8p. I think i can do this with my patch bay. Curious if you have any experience with luna and its summing features. I just started checking out the daw, but I haven’t spent the money on their api/neve summing packages just yet.

Can I use this cable with my APOLLO Quad Silver Firewire with Thunderbolt 2 option card mounted? Thank you!

If I have a stereo pair of 1073 preamp clones, could I run the cable into the actual preamp to print the mix down?

is there a comparison video (or audio) somewhere?

I'm just curious on how this works. With this solution, wouldn't the summing happen in the cable itself and then the summed signal is just run through the stereo unison preamps? Thanks for clarifying!

I think what you did is pretty amazing but what is the main difference between doing this and routing all channels to a stereo buss and then put the preamp plugins?

Passive summing is the worth solution when summing.

so co-uld you throw a fatso, for example in between this and the Apollo inputs? then its the same process as using a passive summing box?

Does the SUM cable work also if I send a couple of the line-outs from my DAW in mono? Say 7 and 8 are mono Vox and Bass…1-2 stereo drums….3-4 stereo guitar….5-6….keyboards fx and backing vox…. I plan to use an apollo x8

could I use this with the apollo twin?

🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

I have had mine for about a year and half. coupled with my Apollo x8 and it is the real deal. I up the game by buying outboard gear . depending on the mix I have six different recall Apollo set ups. When I get my x16 I know what I will adding to it...Sum more. . My ITB buddy's say how did you get such a huge wide sound. I tell them and say there is no way. Ok no way you just heard it right???...."no you are doings something eels" SMH.

This cable is sold on platforms such as eBay or Amazon? I have a process with a similar type of chain, but it works for me, I will go for this alternative, my other question can only be that send and return with the apollo interface? i have an antelope zen tour is it possible to do it too? thanks for the reply

Good morning to Pro Audio L.A. The question I have a Universal Apollo Twin and a satellite 8 dsp, is it possible for me use this type of cable in my system?

i'm new to this and i'm immediately wondering if this is something I could do with an ssl2+ interface

I don't use Pro Tools but Logic X ... can I still use the cable to do the same thing that is shown on this video? I live in Italy: can I order the cable in question and receive it in my country of origin (shipped to ITALY)? Thanks again for any info you can give me about it!

I just stumbled across this and..... Fucking WOW! Really? I saw on your website that you consult on all manner of builds. Can you handle Mobile Audio, like turning an RV into a mobile studio?

So basically your cable is summing audio... Not any summing amp.... Who does that

Hi, Dilla! Analog summing sounds more 3-dimensional and warm/analog compared to summing in the box. Check our website for audio samples :-) www.proaudiola.com/sum-cable-s/793.htm

What is needed is a double blind audio test.

I need a sum cable for Apollo twin USB its only 4 outs and 2 inputs.

I can do that with my antelope interface, no cable needed. just routing and processing with my Antelope effects.

I don't get it.... That's why they invented the master bus thingie? And using a mic pre for mastering...?

I have 2 apollos 8 and 8P. These are chained so I have 12 mic pres for live tracking. Do you know if I can sum all 16 line outs of the two units into 2 mono pres i.e. routed to a stereo master channel in PT? Or can I only use the 8 line outs of the master apollo?

I have a summing mixer made by Phoenix Audio, Will those cords work my interface until I purchase an Apollo X8?

Hi there... I have few questions... do you plan to expand the number of channels and make the cable for 16 channels of summing or even more? Also, do you plan to make d/sub version of summing cable... I have an audio interface (Antelope Orion Studio) which have 16 outputs in d/sub, and this version of cable doesn't work for me, but d/sub version would work?

Do you have a cable for Apollo Twin Quad? Sorry man I don’t own Apollo 8

Is the cable compatible with presonus firestudio project?

Can this cable be used backwards? Out of my interface L R 8 in to my digital mixer?

Can this be patch to a patchbay ?

helo, i saw u got dangerous summing mixer, have u try to compare that? any difference?

neve summing is out also for $300

Are this cables available in UK?

Wow. This is the biggest snake oil EVER LOL.

Hi whats the diference between having 4 pairs going into 2 xlr inputs and directly going from a stereo output to the xlrs input? Wouldnt be better? cause the cable isn´t doing anything by itself more than putting the outputs togheter, and even more you are using 8 D/A conversors that even if they are top of the line (wich are not) are degradating the real signal. Thanks!

Hi, Alexandre94120! Nope, there is no risk at all. We tested it just to be sure :-) It's completely safe!

Has anyone patched it into a patch bay routing?

Make one with a dB-25 connector on one side

How do you set up the gain for the two mic pre?

I have an apollo twin duo.. would this concept work?

Will this work with the focusrite 18i20?

Can I do this with the SPL Crimson 3?

Does this work with Apogee Symphony

Is it possible to sum with only 6 outputs?

Hi, can this process be used to take the tracks down from high resolution audio to cd level of 16bit/44.1khz? In other words, can I use protools to capture the incoming stereo track at that resolution instead of having to use bounce-to-disk?

Can u do this with Apollo twin

trying to imagine how I could incorporate it into a patch bay

How much and how do I order the sum.cable

Will the SUM cable work with the new Apollo x?

Can this be used with the Apollo Twin?

hi

summing is only required when you have a mix with more than 100 tracks, and hardware.

😂

Apollo 8p has only 6 outputs🤷🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️😭

This must be a joke, right?

This is not analog summing 🤦🏾‍♂️ IMO

Hahaha with all due of respect, this videos looks like a parody. You guys cannot be serious that this would make any difference.