Using CLICK/BACKING TRACKS Live, Yay or Nay? Here's my experience. Thanks for watching. Check out all my lesson vids at: www.the-art-of-... Facebook: / fansoftheartofguitar / theartofguitar Patreon: / theartofguitar Thanks!!!
Number one rule of having a band. Always have a backup plan. If you rely on a backing track, always be able to go without. If you normally use a click track for effects or timing, always practice without. Stuff happens. Sometimes equipment gets fried or dies. If you use tapes or cds for your intros, those could get destroyed. The fans came to see a show. Play them a show.
A band like Nine Inch Nails or Falling In Reverse can't just go without. The sin isn't using backing tracks. The sin is not having backup files with everything you need. They should have been able to buy brand new laptops and download everything they need on the new laptops. Eddie Trunk would jump off a bridge if he found out what bands use backing tracks, lol Although, I think he is full of shit anyways. He's just making waves for the clout.
you say that like all bands are pros signed into labels and have major events coming. the majority of bands are college kids who practice all day every day and gig at small open venues usually unpaid just offered free beers and food. when you are a pro, you should be able to play WITHOUT backing tracks. this is how Dream Theater and the likes objectively disappoint in their live shows... backing tracks galore.
I’m the drummer for a local classic rock cover band. We don’t use tracks at all. I sample and sounds, effects or intros from my multipad either by hand or foot, sometimes both. And yes, sometimes I miss some. I only use a click in just my ears to set the initial tempo. I cut it once we’re a few measures into the song. I don’t think tracks are cheating at all, I just prefer to trigger everything. Keeps me honest. 😃
I do a solo classic rock show, I sing leads and play lead guitar. So I use professional studio backing tracks, all recorded live with real musicians and background singers. I can play classic songs with all the proper instrumentation! Horns, strings, any special effects! I sound like the original recording, which in most situations it’s what the audience wants to hear.
Great video! Just thought I'd offer my 2 cents from the drummer perspective as someone who uses click all of the time & backing tracks frequently. First thing I'd say is, it's possible to be tied to a click without killing the vibe/groove - but it takes a lot of practice. It's taken me years to navigate the tug of war between the band and the click while making the grooves feel good. It can be done...just takes time. Another helpful trick I've learned from so many rehearsal situations is when to BAIL OUT of the click. I start every song with click so we get off on the right foot, then I know when to reach over to shut it off. That method keeps us on track AND lets us organically vibe.
If the drummer has a in ear with a click that's cool It's easy to get jacked up for a show and play a song way faster on accident An in ear click can help a band stay tight and deliver a solid show
Some songs need it and some don't. We've recently expanded our setlist to the 80s when drum machines were popular. It's difficult to get the right vibe without using a rigid drum track with synths (with or without you, U2; Shout, Tears for Fears). But of course, when we play Hendrix or Zeppelin we don't use tracks.
The trick to backing tracks/click tracks and the like is to either have enough money to pay someone who knows electronics well to do the research, etc into the best ways to do what you're aiming to get or to know it yourself. Spend loads of time working out the best and most reliable ways *that fit with your requirements* and you'll eventually figure out something that works. In my experience it's best if you simply use a bog standard laptop that plays pre-recorded FLAC files and leave the fancy equipment at home for when you make those files. Bonus is you can hook it up to a projector, RGB lighting on your amps, etc and have it all synced up to your music, plus the nature of laptops means they're basically immune to power glitches that can force-restart most digital electronics due to the battery acting as a sort of UPS.
I have been working on a project recently. and the only way I could even possibly do it, is with tracks.. I am one man but can play multiple instruments. I have been putting together a Online show utilizing backing tracks and Midi tracks to control Lighting, Patch changes on my Helix and anything else.. I would rather have a full band and just use some way to get sound effects where they need to be.. Bar bands really don't need backing tracks it's when you incorporate light shows and midi patch changes. nothing worse then seeing a light flash before the band arives at the part.
I think if you are unable to play without your laptops, then you have crossed that line between "live" and "playback". If it is inconceivable to play without your computer, I think that it is a different dynamic than a truly live band. That said, I think it is just a part of live performances for certain music and genres. Pop music has been almost entirely playback for decades.
Thats not true at all. As a band you need to write the stuff you want to write otherwise you will just burn out. If that means having orchestral parts, synths, choirs etc in your music that have vital roles in your songs then so be it. You need those parts live. There is zero way around that. Your songs wont work otherwise. Touring with a full orchestra, synth player(s), choir etc is simply financially and logistically impossible for almost any band. And even if it was possible for you as a band a lot of the venues will simply not be able to do it logistically. At that point using tracks is the only solution
Just done our first show as a blur tribute band. As a four piece we use backing for the brass and strings. Unfortunately our drummer lost signal for his click TWICE resulting in an absolute train wreck! so we're currently weighing up if we can afford to bring in keys 😂
As an electrician I'm still looking for a digital ammeter that will display peak amps for when motors are attempting to start. I am using an antique analog Amprobe meter for this.
There is a broad spectrum of things being described as backing tracks. From simple metronome guidance to keep a drummer from playing at a ridiculous tempo all the way to full on lip syncing. I can tolerate metronome use or an occasional effect to create a noise that can’t be made organically on stage, but that is it. The web of tracks that are used to double, cover or replace instruments or vocals that are being played poorly on stage is a total no-go. Figure out how to do it live or don’t do it.
I can't believe this is actually up for discussion. There's been a lot of talk about this topic (much of it spurred on by Eddie Trunk, and kudos to him for pointing it out) and I am completely stunned by how many people just don't care if the band they are watching are really playing live or not. For me, if a band needs to use tracks to cover a keyboard part or some orchestration that they can't realistically bring to each show, I'm fine with that. What I'm not cool with AT ALL is any band that's using pre-recorded tracks for lead vocals or any of the main instrumentation. Some will say that some of these aging singers (Paul Stanley, for instance) should just get a pass because they're older and they should do whatever it takes to keep playing. I couldn't disagree more. Others throw stones at singers like Don Dokken (rightly so, he can't sing anymore and it's sad), but at least what you're hearing is the real deal. Same with Vince Neil. His voice is shot and he somehow can't even stay in tempo with the song anymore, but at least what you're hearing is Vince live (not the backing vocals...those have been tracks for decades). Why should we keep giving a pass to all these artists who aren't/can't really play?
I agree that backing tracks make concerts sound sterile. I used to love going to concerts because I'd hear something more exciting than the album. Now backing tracks are so ubiquitous that concerts are boring and I really don't go anymore. I"d rather see people play an open mic at a bar for the price of a beer.
I've been seriously thinking about the 3 pick up version St. Vincent guitar like yours. What's your take? I haven't been able to find one to play anywhere around me and I've never bought a guitar without playing it first.
I listen to symphonic metal bands who get like 20 people at a show. Its either a backing track or bring on a 60 man orchestra on stage to please us 20 drunk dudes.
During this whole issue or conversation it's crazy to me how we give credit to backing tracks for stuff that you can easily do without them. Like you want your songs to be on tempo? Just write the tempos on the set list and the drummer can play their own click on a visual metronome at the right tempo for the first few bars and then shut it off and go from there. Don't want big breaks in between songs? Put one band member in charge of counting in the next song. The Ramones never had a break in their whole set because they were pros. Playing to tracks and a click is a vibe and works for certain songs but would most bands have to cancel show and give back that money because they didn't have them. No. Never.
when you are in band and doing live perform, dont do that, your spect want to see your live performance, live perfomance dont need to be perfect but need to be fun, but when like me ,im a session drummer for many thing, like big band , etc, i need that click, simply cause i dont know them, and many of time im not into to the song and just play with notation that composer gave to me.
As a band you have to write the stuff you want to write or you will risk burnout. If that includes orchestral parts, synths, choirs etc that take a main role in the song then so be it. You cant just leave those out completely or replace them with guitars or something. Thats going to sound nothing like the song. Your fans deserve THE song to be played live. Not some completely random extremely different wayy too stripped down version. However you simply cant expect a band to tour with a full orchestra, synth players, choir etc. Thats financially and logistically impossible. Even if it was possible the ticket prices would be even more ridiculous than they already are and you would actually loose a bunch of money trying to do that. In that case tracks are the only real solution
There’s one element of click tracks that people haven’t been mentioning. It’s not always about backing tracks to help out the sound. Sometimes bands use laptops and click tracks to sync the music to the light show. Sometimes it’s for midi switching for guitar effects units. There are a whole bunch of reasons why things for the show might be stored on laptops that aren’t simply so the singer has a vocal guide track or something.
In this instance, I think click tracks are fine because bands like Muse have insane light shows that would not work if it wasn’t for midi signaling getting it in time. They also use it to change guitar effects so they don’t have to worry about running to their pedalboard, but they also have the option to turn pedals on and off if they want to add more.
@@Ottophil what an absolutely tone-deaf thing to say, with all due respect. Midi absolutely belongs in guitar rigs. How can you switch from a distorted raw setting to a clean with compression, chorus and delay seamlessly? I'm talking bout real pedals here, no multifx units, just separate analog FX. Do you have 3 feet? is your schlong that long??? The only term that comes to me when seeing this kind of attitude is retrograde. We've made so many great advances in technology to serve musicians and make our performances better and smoother, only for some people to say "you have to use a 1990's recto with the right tubes and tap with your frickin feet every 30 seconds risking going out of time or even not being able to be comfortable performing if you also sing. I say all this shit but in reality I've used my feet to switch and analog pedals my whole career. But seeing my peers use midi based systems makes me envious of the tonal possibilities and overall comodity. Come on you can't see any lack of integrity in that bro haha
I’ve been wtf last 10yrs seeing everyone do it. Now it’s wtf I’m considering it. The generation nowadays that part does not matter they are ok with it, like the Dj thing.
My personal opinion throw all this click track stuff in the trash if I go to a show I want to hear music and art not some “perfect” sterile sounding track
As a drummer that has played with a click for years... After a while you don't even notice it... it actually frees you up because you don't have to concentrate on keeping time.... although I could just as easily play without a click.
Most modern shows use extensive backing tracks that include click track, soundscapes, sequenced synths, string arrangements, backing vocals and information for any lights and projections are all synced. So, yes, if the show is running all of that from a laptop then yes, it’s an integral part of the performance.
I don't use any backing tracks and I have preformed at some of the biggest venues all through Europe , as only talentless frauds do that , If me or a member of my back up band fucks up we make a show of it , its something called improvising , What do you think people did back in the 50's ? , if someone in my back up band even suggests using a back dub I will fire them even if its in the middle of a frozen tundra and make em find their own way home at their own expense . A live show is just that preforming live anything else is a crime.
@@mandrakeblackstone5838 I will tell you what the "talentless frauds" were doing in 1971. The Who used backing tracks on Won't Get Fooled Again and Baba O'Riley for all of their shows, in fact I think that's how they've always done it. If they don't pretend to play the part, there's no fraud. It's art.
“Click” tracks and “backing” tracks aren’t technically the same thing. Click tracks are only heard by the band (predominantly) and backing tracks are heard by the audience.
I have played in both bands with and without backing tracks. It's a hell of a lot more fun and rewarding playing without tracks. Sometimes when playing with backings I would feel like a fraud afterwards or think that if it sounded exactly like the album, the people might as well just listen to the album at home. Eventually, I did rework the backings so they would have different tempos to the album and natural speed ups, also adding or taking away some sounds or changing them and adding extended outros or breakdowns for some songs. It was quite a nice compromise in the end. One really good benefit of using tracks is that you can time your set very accurately, festivals and some venues are very strict about set lengths
I think regardless of how close to the studio recording a live show is, listening to the recording will never feel the same as seeing it live even if it's technically identical. A big part of that is that it's a communal experience, with lots of other people, and the people who made the music are playing it right there in the same room! The other big part of that is most people dont have phenomenal sound systems to make it sound the same 😂
We just saw The Who live. They had a full orchestra to cover parts of Tommy, Quadraphenia, and other songs. I wouldn’t have been upset for them to use a backing track, but was elated at live musicians. I think whatever helps them put on their best performance is fine.
I saw this tour earlier this year. Might have been the most amazing live sound ever. The mix was superb, I could hear every bit of the orchestra along with the band.
Which is interesting because with Baba O’Riley and Eminence Front use a backing track of the arpeggiated synth. I assume they were one of the first major bands to use a track.
@@seanwilliams9168 Don't forget Won't Get Fooled Again. Thanks for bringing them up. Backing tracks aren't all black or white. They have a place. It's the fakery that I think really puts people off, and fakery is a different topic.
If backing tracks are used for some instrument that you don't have a live player for, like synth (as it's traditionally used), nobody cares. The problem is when you have people pretending to play instruments on stage when their part is actually pre-recorded. There are many bands actually doing this, and that's why they have to cancel a show if their "laptop" doesn't show up. This is a sign of absolute lack of talent. You should be able to play with or without your backing tracks. If you can't, you should seek another line of work, because this one isn't for you.
@@TylerGuitar5617 Roger Waters has pre-recorded vocals for about half the songs on his shows nowadays. It’s really shameful to see and I don’t think anyone should pretend to play/sing when they aren’t.
Besides for pop music which has always been a karaoke tape-really bad local ones. I have seen bands where people are basically pretending to play instruments and in reality just playing a tape. I don’t think the guitar or bass were actually plugged into anything. It’s really embarrassing what some people will do just for attention in this day and age. The drummer was playing something but kept stopping and the tape was much louder. When a lot of people who aren’t musicians see this sadly they rarely even notice the fakery. We live in a society with a lot of people used to being fooled. This kind of stuff is going on more and more and it’s getting worse!
@@benbeyer2451 totally against this practice, but considering how old roger is, I’m giving him a pass since it allows everyone to still hear him live. I did and it’s still an experience to be had, backing track or not.
Karaoke singers use backing tracks. The only difference here is a few instrumentalists play along as well. Regardless of what you call it, it's still karaoke.
I've always agreed with Alice in Chains' philosophy; don't record anything in the studio that you can't do live. Then again, Chris Cornell will always be my favorite singer,but since no one in the band could sing the harmonies he recorded, Soundgarden's live shows always sounded thinner to me.
why should bands restrict themselves creatively like that? The problem here is using backing tracks the way Motley Crue are using them. For example if you're in a rock band abd you write a song that has a synth section but you don't normally have a synth player its fine to use a backing track for that since it makes more sense logistically and financially to just have it be something you press play with for a one off then trying to audition an keyboard player for one song. The same goes for orchestral bits in songs to since it's extremely impractical to bring along a full orchestra for anyone that isn't the who. The problem lies with how Motley Crue are using them where people pay good money to seem them play and sing and they're just basically miming their live shows.
Another con with backing tracks: The constant hi-hat clicking when the drums are supposed to drop out. I don't mind using backing tracks for effects, but I feel like in my band the leader just wants to use them because everyone else does rather than the songs actually needing it. We have a pretty big band (usually 6-8 people depending on who's available), and a lot of the backing tracks cover parts that are already being played (or could just be played) by someone live... Like we'll have gang vocals from the album during parts where we already have 5 people singing.
OK, so where I sit on this... the laptop isn't just for the click; it can also be handling the software that syncs the lightshow to elements of the performance (like having a light sync with the kick drum or whatever) and so on. On that basis, what I find mind blowing is why you wouldn't - as a professional touring band - have spares in case they go missing. You're probably lugging half a dozen extra guitars and basses, pedals and modellers, drum heads and all that noise about. But an extra 3lb laptop, that someone in the band can carry on their person all the time is a step too far with redundancy, when it's so critical to the show going ahead that you *cannot* perform without it, is somehow not a thing that a single person thought would be a good idea?
My guitar teacher from a few years ago played in a metalband and they used clicktracks. Just to keep their music tight which suited them. Wouldn't work with a bluesband, but it worked for them. And they had some songs that were only with a click for half the song. The rest of the song could be improvised, and be more spontaneous.
When I was younger, I used to dislike all backing tracks. Or rather I disliked bands making soundscapes on their albums they couldn't reproduce live without using tracks... I tried to keep things as stripped down as possible in my own bands to not have to rely on anything extra. These days I just don't care anymore, I make music on my own and probably will never again play it live, so I go crazy with adding tons of stuff that would require a symphonic orchestra's worth of musicians to do live. In the unlikely situation I do end up playing live, I'll just pick one of the guitar tracks to play and do vocals, and use backing tracks for everything else. I do think that story of the band canceling a show because their computer went to a different city is pretty damn weird though. I don't know them so I don't know what kind of lineup they have, but unless they use backing tracks for one or more of the core instruments, I don't see why they couldn't have played a show without the tracks. Sure it would have sounded a bit different from what they usually do, but so what?
I think it’s OK if they use a click to stay in time with synchronized lighting or video on stage, or some minor tracks to augment the sound for effects etc. or an intro on a song. But where I draw the line is where they’re using tracks to completely replace live musicians and they’re just pretending to play live.
I always envisioned a function of a DAW or a backing track that would frame the tempo based on what the drummer is doing... kind of like the reverse of quantization - or reframing electronic or programmed parts to sound more human - instead of the drummer playing to a grid the grid plays to the drummer. Sort of like a 'tap tempo' loosely connected to the high hat or something - I dunno I'm not a programmer.
I'm going to fill in for our bass player at church this Sunday and one thing I'm kinda nervous about is we use click tracks and I've never actually played to one before. Also I'm definitely not a pro bassist lol. I do play guitar and I used to do the cajon for youth group at church. Hopeing this goes well lol.
You’ll be fine man, even if the click feels weird you can still just listen to the drummer. It might feel a bit weird but as long as you focus on keeping together with the kick drum it’ll go great.
Usually you'll have an AVIOM / personal mixer in front of you, so you can tailor mix the entire band to suit your needs. If you've ever messed with a DAW for more than an hour, you'll be familiar
Saw fear factory live and their laptop or whatever was playing sound effects cooked in the 40 degree Aussie sun. Burton said "fukin technology". They played the songs with just guitar bass and drums and they still fukin nailed it and sounded killer. Good band first. Sound effects second.
Backups people, backups! Your iPad, phone, cloud storage, etc etc. Never leave it up to someone else to be in charge of something like that, esp if it's part of your show.
no problem but it would have been nice if he could have been given credit by being seen. Saga had an extra keyboardist who also doubled as monitor stage mix.
To me, rock music is based on drums guitars and maybe keyboards. If your music can't be distilled down to those elements, then you are a performer or a personality, not a musician. I'm willing to bet if NIN or Ministry ran into this problem, they could still get up and put on a show with just amps and mic'd drums. Different genres have different standards for what makes a live show. For pop music its more about the lights and choreography. Heck, Tupac doesn't even need to be alive for him to show up a Coachella! When it comes to live rock, you NEED that tangibility.
As a band you can never restrict your creativity or you will just burn out. That means if you want to write songs that have full orchestra, synth, choirs etc in them then you ABSOLUTELY SHOULD. However touring with a full orchestra etc is simply financially and logistically impossible for almost any band. And even if it was somehow possibe for you as a band a lot of the venues will not support that many musicians. That means you have got one solution which is using tracks.
IMHO, no band that is only drums, bass and guitar(s) should EVER use a click track or backing tracks. Could you imagine Iron Maiden playing to a click? it would completely ruin it.
You only mentione one band that happens to do fine without tracks/click. That makes zero sense. Its just a fact that as a band you need to write the stuff you want to write. If that includes orchestral parts, synths, choir etc then so be it. If you restrict yourself you will burn out. However touring with a full orchestra etc is simply financially and logistically impossible for almost any band. And even if it was possible many venues wont support that many musicians. You also cant just rearrange the songs to fit into a pure rock band context. That wont work musically. And your fans expect to hear the real thing with all the extra instrumentation. That means the only solution is to use tracks
Tbh When I saw the live Performance of Meshuggah and bleed I would not begrudge them having a backing beat to help, knowing how hard it is....I imagine playing very hard technical stuff could potentially shorten the career
for me click tracks are perfect when you rehearse, to improve the timing precision of the band overall (and especially of the drummer): you get tighter after a few weeks when it seems it kills the mood of the band, you stop even noticing it and flow in a right timing. Live, unless you need special FX you cannot reproduce otherwise, I would not use it for rock, blues, jazz and any other music style relying on interplay. For electronic, techno, industrial, etc. of course it is indispensable.
If you have a drummer who rushes the tempo every time he starts having fun, I think you might find a click track useful as a sort of bridle to rein them in. That's been a fantasy of mine anyway. 😉 Oh bless 'em! They just love what they do, but it really can hurt the sound.
i was a touring guitarist for a hard rock band in 2007-2010 and they were doing this way back then and even THEN it was nothing new. it was pretty much widely accepted that every band we were contemporaries with were doing the exact same thing. on that level, there is very limited room for slip-up. our entire show was clicked out, the drummer controlled it all so we could hold if need be. instruments and vocals were live, but 808s and rap beats and some of the extreme BG vox were on the track. this is old news and eddie trunk, honestly, should know that
Way back then??? You make me feel so OLD!!! The Who have always used backing tracks with a click track for their 1971 songs Won't Get Fooled Again and Baba O'Riley. I believe others as well (someone above mentioned Eminence Front from 1982 I think?)
I use backing tracks because I'm a solo artist. I have used them in a band situation, it was an 80s style pop band with loads of electronic percussion and synth/sequencers so didn't really have a choice. Worked for the style. I've been in bands without them, but found that a lot of people don't take the time to learn their parts or the song sequence. This put so much pressure on my having to que certain band members all the time my own performance suffered. It really put me off playing with bands again tbh
As a band you need to write the stuff you want to write. If that means having orchestral parts, synths, choirs etc in your music then so be it. You need a way to have them live if they are an integral part of your songs. Touring with a full orchestra, synth player(s), a choir etc is simply financially and logistically impossible for almost any band. And even if it was possible for the band many venues wont be able to deal with that many musicians etc. In that case the only way to get the songs on tour the way they are supposed to sound is to use backing tracks.
Examples Of Backing Tracks In Music (According To Wikipedia) -- Playback of pre-recorded backing vocals (reducing the number of touring backup vocalists) -- Rihanna, Mariah Carey, The Pussycat Dolls, KISS -- Playback of additional or selected lead vocals -- Journey, Justin Bieber, Roger Waters, Beyoncé, Rammstein, Taylor Swift, Weezer, Selena Gomez -- Lip syncing to pre-recorded lead vocal tracks -- Milli Vanilli, Britney Spears -- Playback of additional vocals along with some additional instrumentation -- Black Veil Brides, Mötley Crüe, Skillet -- Playback of keyboards -- The Who, Madonna, Muse, U2, Panic! at the Disco, "Weird Al" Yankovic -- Playback of large portions of the backing music -- Buckethead, Pet Shop Boys, The Wiggles, Twenty One Pilots, Coldplay, Fall Out Boy -- Total playback of backing music -- The Pussycat Dolls, Ariana Grande, Selena Gomez, Britney Spears, Village People
I know several professional drummers and they all use click tracks to hold the tempo steady. I have played with many drummers over the years and many times they start way too fast or speed up as the song progressed, so that’s a big plus for me!
This is kinda where my band is at. We haven't been able to find a reliable second guitar player but without the melodies the songs lose a lot of the feeling and thickness. Personally I'd rather have a second guitar player and just run without backing tracks but since we can't find anyone that would vibe with us, doesn't have an ego or is just a straight up pain to work with we're looking at doing backing tracks. To me it has it's ups and downs. To me playing without backing tracks leaves the more raw and untethered feeling to the music and you don't have to worry about issues if electronicsmess up. On the other hand with backing tracks we could have the second guitar playing the simple rhythm parts so I can do the melodies, have guitars playing behind when I solo and even time our light show to the tempo so we sont have to have a separate person running the lights. I guess we will just see where it goes and how it feels. Personally I'm more about the feel and crowd interaction but the backing track might be fun... only time will tell I guess lol!!
Use whatever you want. It's not my place to dictate how you should perform your music. I was in a hardcore punk band that used a drum machine. It was fun and different.
For me, it just depends on the artist. The expectations are different depending on what kind of band it is, how many members there are, or even just how popular they are. If I went and saw a small 3 or 4 piece band and they did a Styx or Kansas song with a backing track for certain parts, swapping instruments as they went to play whatever was most important, I wouldn't mind. A one-man band sort of deal can be really cool even with several tracks if the main appeal is still in front of your eyes. Something where they're moving between instruments a bunch is super impressive, but I don't even mind if a guy just plays guitar and sings with the rest of the band on a track (as long as the guitar part they're playing isn't in the track). I saw Michael Angelo Batio live at a guitar show, and he was great. I saw Natewantstobattle when he didn't have a band yet, and it was way less great. There were guitars on stage but they were being mimed and the tracks had the parts included. Never EVER mime! A small band using a track for one or 2 parts doesn't bother me, unless they're clearly rich and could easily hire a guest performer or another member for the live iteration of the band. I've noticed that Green Day and Aerosmith both have had live members who aren't really part of the band off the stage, but who are very helpful for the show. In Aerosmith's case, I really prefer when that guy's clearly visible to when they hide him in the wings. Maybe these guys are officially in now, but Journey and Styx both hired new members recently to do extra parts (extra keyboards/vocal and 3rd guitarist respectively). I vastly prefer this approach to tracks, but in those same cases, it would probably be fine to use tracks for those extra parts, especially if they weren't as popular as they are. One example of even a justifiable use of tracks in a rock band feeling kinda soulless compared to the rest of the show is with Van Halen's keyboard songs. In the Van Hagar era, Eddie would play keys on those songs, with Sammy covering guitar (sometimes anyway). The songs from 1984, Jump specifically, never really got that treatment, and obviously once Sammy was out, Eddie couldn't do keyboard anymore anyway. So, Jump and occasionally others used tracks (or maybe someone backstage). Since that band had the expectation of being such a live powerhouse, that just felt weird, even though most people wouldn't have expected anything different for those songs. I'm less picky about click tracks, but I'm not a drummer. I will always prefer a completely live show, but others will prefer something more secure and I get that.
I like the idea of live live bands....like if someone is onstage they are playing and or singing and that’s all you hear. Realistic maybe not. But I follow adam lambert. His studio recordings are mostly just him on vocals and backing vocals. So he can’t do things the same live as recordings. It’s interesting seeing what he does. He grew up singing live in theatre and now tours with queen.......it could be an interesting conversation to have with him. His previous album was geared to being able to do it all live before covid hit and canned all the touring.
Thanks for the review. I don't know much about technical side of live performances, I actually heard about click for the first time on the example of Polyphia's drummer problem, when click stopped working and his drum tech had to find a solution fast so he tapped the drummer's leg throughout the show
Click track is cool and makes sense to me to hold a band together but I haven't desired to use it. I like music to be dynamic in time and pace accentuating parts of songs with early or late changes can convey things like urgency and anticipation and make more of a ride out of the song. I its sounds that really cant be replicated on the spot a backing track is pretty acceptable to me but if it is playing instrumental parts that crosses me as lazy and fraudulent. I have a rule against loops or backing tracks in my current one man band project and I manage to make a good full sound live playing keyboard, guitar, drums, and singing at the same time. I appreciate artists who really push their skills beyond what people expect is possible like Santiago Moreno or Roman Kim. You don't see the great performers needing anything but their instrument to put on a great show and that's what I strive to be. I'm even trying to make a fully acoustic version of my set up so I won't be at the mercy of anything electrical so I'll have a reliable backup if all else fails. Look at each piece of your equipment and think, Ok if that part fails what's my plan B. Have a backup for every cable you use, specially the rare ones. I even have all my shit and amp running on battery so power problems at the venue cant even stop me.
Maybe i should make drumless instrumental backing tracks for my songs couse i can't find players to form a band to play my songs :D one man singing drummer show with guitar, piano and bass backing tracks. :DD I could have all the mellotrons, flutes and stuff going on there too! Maybe play those to my drum tempos first and then take out the drums so i can have the natural tempo there and play those back with my zoom r16
What I hate is that these days EVERYTHING is on the backing tracks. I've heard guitar solos, doubled-up lead vocals, all kinds of percussion, even replacing the bassist entirely with a track. It's one thing if you don't have a keyboard player and need a to fill out the sound a bit in a couple sections, but the *melody* should never be the backing track! Clients are getting ripped off thinking they're hiring a live band, but 50% of what they hear is a recording.
Up until the latter 80's-'90s drummers had a recognisable sound because they all FELT different. 10 of them would sound slightly different playing Back In Black. With a click, they'd sound almost the same. That said: Some guys can pull it off with a click, but it's certainly not an easy task for most.
For me, it really depends on the experience you want to provide. I do feel like you should be capable of playing your music without, even if it's not the "full experience". I know Devin Townsend uses backing tracks and clicks for all the backing instrumentation and sound effects, such as backing vocals or choirs et because he strives to replicate the wall of sound production he likes. There's many instances of the tech failing but he's always been a good enough frontman to still make the downtime enjoyable for the show by either playing acoustic or making jokes etc. He has also toured and played without and click or backing tracks because that's the vibe he was going for with that tour - for it to sound a bit more loose and to allow for more off the cuff interaction with the crowd etc
I never use click tracks, live or when recording. I’m very stubborn with that. It takes the soul out of what I’m playing. Music today is too perfect sounding, because so many use click tracks
I'm sure the 1 millionth person to say this, but the reason it's pathetic and not okay is because you should be able to do your performance without the tracks. The tracks should be additives to the Sonic value. They shouldn't be the main show and when I pay for a live show the hardest parts should be performed by you. If you have a backing track it shouldn't be the harder vocal. It should be the easier supporting vocal and the same with guitar lines. It's as simple as that. Cheating is not okay. Don't cheat, enhance your show
I'm in a metal band and we've tried playing to a click live a couple of times but it just didn't feel good. We're very tight without one anyway. I personally feel like you lose some of that "live energy" using a click, things become a bit too robotic. I don't begrudge any band for using one, though. But it is noticeable when you look at a band and see a drummer looks very zoned in and disconnected from the show while playing. I'm with you in that the cons outweigh the pros IMO. I like how there still are prominent metal bands out there who do not play to a click live. Lamb of God being one of those. Joe Bad from Fit for an Autopsy confirmed it on a livestream back in summer when he filled on a date Randy was out sick.
With all due respect, Falling in Reverse has been integrating a lot of rap in their music lately oh, it's not like they're heavy metal band is able to produce synthesizers out of their gear. I don't recall the last time I seen Eminem on stage with a band
I have no issue with backing tracks for timing. Click trax or small parts that make no sense to hire another musician for as in a very notable keyboard intro in a band with no keys, I played in a two guitar rock band in the 80's and 90's. several actually and we were very good out covering keyboard parts with guitars. Some bands don't have two guitarists either.
No offence, but if a drummer can't play with feel to a click track, that drummer needs to practice. I think the idea that modern drummers have about needing to be PERFECT to the click is what is giving click tracks a bad wrap. You can play along to a click, and to backing tracks while still working around the beat, you can be ahead or behind the beat if you need to be. As for using tracks and a click, I think it all depends on the vibe the band wants to put out. A band I was in for a long time, we did hundreds of gigs, toured for a few years all that fun stuff; we never used a click or tracks or anything like that because our songs had written in tempo changes and a lot of time changes. BUT, our drummer did have a metronome with him, and he'd use that to make sure we at started the songs at the right tempo. Any more, though, it seems like bands are afraid to sound like live bands, so some of them tend to rely far too much on the backing tracks. The live performance doesn't need to be dead on to the recorded version. Recorded versions have dozens of guitar layers, harmonies and extra stuff that is needed to fill out the sound in a mix that is going to be listened to in a car, ear buds, or a stereo. One electric guitar can fill that same amount of space in a venue, you don't need a million layers to sound huge live. Sometimes you just want more parts to play than your band has hands though, and that's totally fine. I'd the only hard and fast rules I'd have would be the backing tracks shouldn't include the parts of people who are on stage.
If you are a solo artist like NIN, you either use backing tracks or have to hire people who may not be able to play your music correctly. Trent tends to hire musicians because he can afford it, but people just starting out would use backing tracks.
Karaoke singers use backing tracks. The only difference here is a few instrumentalists play along as well. Regardless of what you call it, it's still karaoke.
Once you get used to playing to a click as a drummer feel doesn't suffer (if your drummer is good). I can't stand hear a band speed up like 10 bpm because of adrenaline. Bands that can play to a click tend to sound better imo unless they naturally have excellent timing.
There is a time and place for backing tracks. I know a guy who was running a cover band that spanned several genres. They wouldn't have been able to do what they did without tracks. I'm inclined to say that it's not acceptable when you replace core instruments with a track.
Using tracks is the same as any technology. It's best used as an embelishment rather than a replacement. As long as the actual musicians are playing and singing live, I don't mind adding sound effects, samples or even some ambient synths or orchestration but if you are piping in harmonies or pre programmed bass and keyboard tracks in liu of actual bass players or keyboarists, or outright lip synching entire performances, that is just a misrepresentation of live music.
If I go to see a band like Ghost I expect backing tracks to be used but if I go to see a band like Rival Sons I don’t expect them. I get why bands like Motley have to use them to keep up and am a little bit disappointed when bands like Kiss really rely on them.
i personally rather not. I do think a clicktrack can benefit in the studio. esspecially in a 2 guitars band. i think live if your a amature it's also a bit of a hasstle all this laptop kinda stuff. don't rely on a computer to much. When your megadeth it works maybe. but at a local level. i wouldn't.
I wish I could say I was surprised by the narrow views of these comments…seems like we as musicians forget that most of our audience aren’t musicians and don’t have a clue about any of this…nor does the audience really care if you use a tube amp or a pedal…they care about seeing a great show, not the gear that goes into putting it on 🤷♂️
I watched a metal band, Suite Clarity, play with a backing track, looks like the guitar player is also the bass player, so there is a backing track for the bass when they play live. They have some other bits that wouldn't necessarily have to be part of a backing track because they could just be triggered by the drummer when it's time for them to play and probably wouldn't matter if they were playing a bit fast or a bit slow that day. As a fan they had a good performance, so I have no complaints.
In one of his books, MOBY tells the story about setting up his primitive keyboard/drum machine/sequencer and loading the discs taking 5 minutes to be prepared for his first big gig and the power went out and on and he had to stand in front of the crowd loading 5 minutes worth of discs before he could perform. One time I had my Digital Piano tuned down -5 so the teacher could sing 'The Greatest Love Of All' while I played it at PTA night. I did not realize a kid had unplugged and replugged the keyboard so I started playing it at actual pitch and she shot me daggers with her eyes the entire time. Had to apologies profusely. Clicks are all right by me. So many bands use them. What ever works.
The only time I had to deal with a click track was when I played in a band with a drummer who could do absolutely anything but keep time. Even his click track didn’t help.
I saw falling in reverse in green bay opening for papa roach and their miming of the instruments was pretty blatantly bad. Hollywood undead also performed with some lackluster backing tracks.
No backing tracks no click (use a tempo Ref id needed for drummer) but remember the bands from the 70's didn't use backing tracks they had to sing and play live. The whole point (which is what todays peeps seem to be missing) 0f a live performance was it was supposed to be RAW and exciting, extended, jams bad notes, a bit faster and all! That was the whole point of a live album to NOT sound like the studio counterpart. Just my 2 cents but I'm an old boomer to there's that.
News Flash: Even Queen used tracks live. As a band you simply need to write the stuff you want to write. If that includes orchestral parts, synths, choirs etc then so be it. Touring with a full orchestra, synth player(s), choir etc is simply financially and logistically impossible for almost any band. And even if it would be possible a lot of the venue wont be able to deal with that many musicians. You also cant just re-write a song that has all this stuff in it to fit into a stripped down rock band arrangement. Thats never really going to work. Your fans deserve the real thing. That means the only solution is to use tracks
I'm ok with backing tracks to a certain degree. I am not ok with people faking their performance. Asa musician the point of it all is to play and if you can't play then why are you on the stage, get off and let someone who can play get up there
When I go to a live show I don't want to hear a recreation of the studio recording. Live shows are supposed to be spontaneous. They're supposed to be free and the band should be able to jam without restrictions. Using tracks and clicks is cheating. And like what was stated in the video, they make you a slave. The band isn't playing together, they're just following the track. There's no freedom. Simon Phillips said that they make the music mechanical and stiff. They're not needed. Bands should be able to form chemistry and play together and not need to be bound to a track. I can't stand them. We have been using them at my church for the last few years and I hate it with a passion. It doesn't make you better. It actually holds you back.
You simply can not just replace entire orchestral sections or synth sections where those instruments are taking the lead maybe. Thats never going to work. Your fans want the song to sound like the song. Not some non recognizable train wreck.
