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VHS modified as high quality audio recorder Part 1 of 2 

Theo Faber
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Part 1 of 2. It seems to be not clear, that this modification is from 1982! The time that DAT was very expansive or (in my case) not available at all. VHS and tape's where cheap and the 'standard' HiFi recording had it's drow-backs.
This Hitachi VHS recorder was in my collection, from the beginning of 1982, give or take a few years. One of two machines. Not used for all that time, decided to fully overhaul the unit. New belts etc. Because it was somehow special. In my wild years (1982), a converted this recorder to a HiFi audio machine. So designed and build the necessary electronics to use it, without video. The idee was; if you leaf the video out, there is more room for a audio track on the rotating drum. The head amplifiers will give more output, and the quality will be better. I was not disappointed in the results. And after 40 years, it still produces a clean and perfect sound.

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27 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 351   
@movingpixeldeeler
@movingpixeldeeler Год назад
99.99999999% RU-vid viewers don't realize just how freaking AWESOME this is!
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks (and it was 1982!)
@just_passing_through
@just_passing_through 5 дней назад
But we who know, know. And our minds are blown.
@mcpoulet13
@mcpoulet13 Год назад
This is a masterpiece. You are a Bodhisattva of audio engineering Theo. A thousand respects to you sir.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thank you for all your kind words...!
@chrislj2890
@chrislj2890 Год назад
Jeez, that voice over was computer generated? That's the best I've ever heard, as I thought it was a real woman.
@robjordan63
@robjordan63 Год назад
That's a project to be proud of, amazing work, thanks for sharing.
@Brookspirit
@Brookspirit Год назад
I used a VHS machine to record audio from the radio in the 80s. It was the only way i had to record a 3-hour radio show back then. It was also in Hifi stereo.
@HelloKittyFanMan
@HelloKittyFanMan Год назад
Wow, the difference between the hi-fi and standard audio sweep measurements is astounding!
@davedrew9328
@davedrew9328 Год назад
The current date & time is 18.39 and the date the 10th May 2023. I have to say what a great day it is for me to find your website it is amazing I will write more when I have watched some of your video’s. Thanks for all your great work.
@ebenwaterman5858
@ebenwaterman5858 Год назад
I can't believe somebody did this. I thought I could do something like this, back when floppy disks were high tech, for mass storage. And of course for audio too. Terrific job. :)
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks...!
@Papias_GR
@Papias_GR Год назад
Congratulations! I had the same idea back then, but zero knowledge of how to do it. I'm glad you made it!
@IrreverentSOB
@IrreverentSOB Год назад
Wonderful, truly amazing project, one of the best videos I have ever seen on youtube !
@NateTurnage
@NateTurnage 8 месяцев назад
Really incredible. Thanks for sharing.
@jhonwask
@jhonwask 2 месяца назад
Very interesting. I wish you could publish the circuits and DIY kit. It would be very much fun to turn one of my VCR's into a high-end audio recorder.
@guerrillaradio9953
@guerrillaradio9953 Год назад
I've had the idea to do something similar, but even simpler. Start with an old top loading, early, mechanical VCR, but get rid of the video circuit/drum/heads entirely (or just use them as mechanical support, not connected to anything electrically) and use 1/2" reel to reel heads, basically giving you a 1/2" reel to reel cassette recorder/player.
@Sonnell
@Sonnell Год назад
Yeah, but you would need at least twice the tape speed, and different erasing biases and so on. But still a neat idea.
@guerrillaradio9953
@guerrillaradio9953 Год назад
Yeah, the tape speed is the main obstacle, but also as you mentioned, the biasing, as VHS media is a CrO2 type tape, but as some have experimented with reslitting it for compact cassette, it still does not bias the same as a typical commercial type II CrO2 cassette, or sound very good at all... very low levels, no matter how it's biased, etc. Of course, you could change the motor/pulleys to increase the speed, and refill the VHS cassette with normal type I 1/2" reel to reel media, but ehh... might be fun though 🤷
@Sonnell
@Sonnell Год назад
@@guerrillaradio9953 Agree :)
@mbrombert
@mbrombert Год назад
The difference at the end is unbelievable. Really great work and I wish I had the same device in my studio!
@lawrencedoliveiro9104
@lawrencedoliveiro9104 Год назад
This is similar to how audio CD mastering was done in the early days. Machines like the Sony U-Matic PCM-1610/1630 were adapted to record and play back the digital audio stream to the laser machine that made the CD master. I think the 44100Hz sample rate was even derived from the characteristics of the video frame/field rates.
@shiva_MMIV
@shiva_MMIV Год назад
Not really, the standard sample rate then was 48khz, today it's still the same or some multiple, it was lowered to 44.1 so 74 mins of audio could be crammed into an audio CD.
@Vermaakuitdieboonsterakke
@Vermaakuitdieboonsterakke 4 месяца назад
Original comment is correct. 44.1kHz sampling rate gets an integer number of samples on a TV scan line. That allowed unmodified NTSC video recorders to record and playback the compact disc data stream with only a few added synch pulses.
@monkeyengine3954
@monkeyengine3954 Год назад
I used to record audio all the time on a Mitsubishi Nicam video recorder, mostly radio. It was better than the tape deck I had. It also had remote control and index search.
@eefjuh5533
@eefjuh5533 Год назад
Nicam2 digital stereo. I had:( two JVC recorders doing that, after setting the switch to audio only
@itchcock1
@itchcock1 4 месяца назад
Came for the tech, stayed for the calendar on the wall. Woof.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 4 месяца назад
Tech combined with real live is my way to go.....!!!
@itchcock1
@itchcock1 4 месяца назад
@@TheoFaber Stay dirty
@cv507
@cv507 Месяц назад
$härp eyy mae id ßuit you well -: -
@FortyTwoAnswerToEverything
@FortyTwoAnswerToEverything Год назад
Incredibly clear comparison at the end when switching between the two.
@nazcaplain
@nazcaplain Год назад
I clicked on your video expecting to see a PCM board inserted into the chassis - so I'm quite pleasantly surprised that you've instead made an entirely analog recorder with similar specifications, magic!
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks..! and it was 1982..
@marcbrasse747
@marcbrasse747 7 месяцев назад
For my early VHS mastering stories see my comment to part 2. still crazy to think that in a time when everybody was drooling over digital the best VHS’s could actually outperform the CD format. Never became a standard though.
@bob4analog
@bob4analog 7 месяцев назад
This is absolutely amazing! Your hifi recordings sound awesome and have no head switching noise, which is common with ordinary hifi recordings. I would love to convert my machines as you have done with yours.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 7 месяцев назад
Most of the profit is the absence of video and the use of the video-heads as audio recording. Suc6 with your hobby!
@Music4Movies-sr8vo
@Music4Movies-sr8vo 10 месяцев назад
I remember in the mid 80s I use the Toshiba DX 900 PCM VCR to do all my mix down to digital and it worked out great
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 10 месяцев назад
Nothing wrong with that set-up! and nothing wrong with digital, if the final mix is ok!
@MadScientist267
@MadScientist267 Год назад
This is great! This is what was making audio great back then - seeking maximum quality.
@elektron2kim666
@elektron2kim666 Год назад
Brilliant idea. I bought an expensive cassette deck as a teenager for the 80s. It was quite popular for 100+ people. I also used it for the ZX-Spectrum. It made me a music collection from the radio/amp deck. All of that became a rescue for some parties. Most players and stereos were crap back then so it all made sense.
@sadaghian
@sadaghian 8 месяцев назад
You're amazing
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 8 месяцев назад
Thanx...!
@rjy8960
@rjy8960 8 месяцев назад
I always wondered how good Hifi audio on VHS could be. To me at the time it sounded pretty good but I didn't know about the track overlap. I guess removing video maximises the potential of a format that could have been incredibly good as an analogue high-end system, but at the time everyone wanted to go to digital systems and the marketing pretty much ended the idea of analogue high resolution domestic formats. Brilliant engineering, Theo. Congratulations on your achievements! I do still love the sound of analogue recordings and my old high-speed Revox B77 is still very much in use! 73 M0SNR
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 8 месяцев назад
Thanx! 73 - PA2THF
@rodrigobelinchon2982
@rodrigobelinchon2982 8 месяцев назад
amazing
@vertujoe2886
@vertujoe2886 11 месяцев назад
This is an epic and fundamental mod. Suppose you made this a product in the days. In that case, this may become an industrial standard piece comparable to TEAC 8mm 8 track digital or STUDER A820 24 track reel to reel, and even be praised and memorized until this day and years after this ingenious design worth a million likes!
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 11 месяцев назад
Thank you Joe for your kind words. Story of my live. Because it's hobby en interesse, i frequently mis the bus and the millions. This project has a sequel. I am puzzling to use more than 2 rf carriers, so multipel tracks can be recorded. F😊ully analogue again. Note: i am not against digital, it's only my curiosity...😊
@Seiskid
@Seiskid Год назад
Like what you've done. Use your own voice though - not the computer generated one, haha. I nearly didn't watch because I initially thought it was a computer generated video. It's much easier to listen to a real person, someone interesting, with real character and I'm glad to see that you're a real human. Your English is definitely easier to follow than the robot girl. Back to the topic, I really like what you've done. I'm inspired to drag out my old VHS and see how it sounds. The scope pictures look really nice - you can see the wobble on the analogue audio that is typical of any tape - very impressed how steady the hifi stream is.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks - and about the voice, it's correct. But i am Dutch and not very experienced with explaining in English. I am insecure about my voice / choice of words, so again thank you.
@yrath5034
@yrath5034 Год назад
@@TheoFaber Your Dutch accent sounds wonderful, your English is great and you shouldn't be insecure. Thanks for the video.
@160rpm
@160rpm Год назад
@@TheoFaber All Dutch people have the same accent when speaking English so don't worry too much 😁
@canaldrive_r
@canaldrive_r 8 месяцев назад
Este trabalho impressionante em um aparelho tão antigo demonstra seu vasto conhecimento em eletrônica. Obrigado por compartilhar.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 8 месяцев назад
Thanx - and all the best for 2024!
@neozeed8139
@neozeed8139 Год назад
Just when I think Techmoan could run out of ancient audio formats, and this surfaces! just incredible!
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777 Год назад
Techmoan could never put this together.. he's more of a collector - shower-offer .. not an inventor engineer. Your comment is actually insulting.
@juanvilchez
@juanvilchez Год назад
Mr. Faber congratulations on the achievement. Beautiful mod. Thanks for the video, it’s very informative.
@mrnobones01
@mrnobones01 Год назад
Truly incredible. I wondered about this kind of application a couple years ago, but lack the knowledge and skill to make it happen. Amazing. Great job.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks...!
@michaelcharach
@michaelcharach Год назад
Very cool. Quite a small VHS machine for the time. The portables I can remember from my youth around that time were huge!
@LeoFazio
@LeoFazio Год назад
Nice video!! I've been experimenting with mixing music in VHS using a handycam i have and the results are amazing too!
@nate250
@nate250 9 месяцев назад
Great video. I would love to see an audio only, analog VHS machine in this day and age. Unfortunately, no company still makes the mechanism (I think 2016 or 2018 was the last time) so that a none starter.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 7 месяцев назад
2004 the last units where made in Japan.
@randyjackson5227
@randyjackson5227 Год назад
Toshiba made a VHS VCR that would convert the audio to video using the PCM F-1 standard. This video was recorded to the VHS tape. You could even record two more audio channels the the HI-FI audio channels of the VCR, giving you 4 channels (2 digital and 2 analog)
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Yep correct! But as stated before, it was digital and expensive.
@g-r-a-e-m-e-
@g-r-a-e-m-e- 11 месяцев назад
Do you have any more information on that? Very interesting!
@randyjackson5227
@randyjackson5227 11 месяцев назад
@@g-r-a-e-m-e- it was a Toshiba DX-900 VCR circa 1987. Of course at some point the tape transport died and I couldn’t use it to play back tapes. But the tapes were compatible with the Sony PCM F-1 and also an external unit made by Technics. So I just used a standalone VCR with those units to play back tapes and transfer to the computer (via analog audio capture).
@g-r-a-e-m-e-
@g-r-a-e-m-e- 11 месяцев назад
@@randyjackson5227 thanks 👍. I do remember those days and would have loved to have a Sony pcm system but couldn't afford it. There was even a PC system backup using VHS.
@Oli1974
@Oli1974 Год назад
Your sweep showed me that I can't even proper hear 9 kHz anymore :(
@guerrillaradio9953
@guerrillaradio9953 Год назад
Me either! 🤣 See, there's no point now in buying music on any format better than vinyl or cassette, because it's as good or better than our own ears' frequency response now.... it's hell getting old.
@sdiburro1
@sdiburro1 10 дней назад
i had the same kind is that but with 5 head stereo hifi i even used it with a camera it was alot of money
@chumleyk
@chumleyk Год назад
nice wall art
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
I need that as stimulation.... gives me inspiration...!
@Sergioluna80s
@Sergioluna80s Год назад
Nice poster in the wall hehehe
@Turboy65
@Turboy65 Год назад
In the 80s Sansui produced a modified VCR that recorded and played back linear PCM digital audio. The PCM-F1. A digital tape recorder using VHS tapes.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
But that was digital. This modification cost next to nothing in the 80's and was analogue.
@AiMR
@AiMR Год назад
I think the real question here is why there wasn't a move from linear recording to diagonal HD analog audio.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
@@AiMR There were several attemps to design a system that was not to expensive and only for the happy few. One of the most suc6 full was Sony with it's PCM-F1 (1981) It digitised stereo audio and inserted it, on a black video signal. That signal good be recorded on any video-recorder. Unit als decoded tis video back to audio. Video was recorded on the rotating drum. It worked great, but cost about 1900 dollar (1981).
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777 Год назад
@@TheoFaber it appears it cost you more time than money. I saw the work on that breadboard :)
@djefferson5669
@djefferson5669 Год назад
It would be great to hear that you captured live radio broadcasts with this machine throughout the eighties.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Not much thou. Mostly vinyl (LP).
@quadrant2005
@quadrant2005 Год назад
I found this video really interesting, A nice peice of kit you had built there..
@ConnorDylan
@ConnorDylan Год назад
I've been wondering about this for years. Using all of the tape for audio only, and no video.
@luisvalc2187
@luisvalc2187 Год назад
Trabajo extraordinario. El equipo se ve bellísimo. Felicitaciones, gran vídeo.
@andrelima4876
@andrelima4876 Год назад
Really cool! Good work...
@beardymcbeardface69
@beardymcbeardface69 Год назад
This reminds me of a digital audio recording system which used VHS tapes (like a huge DAT system). From memory there was also a similar system which plugged into a regular VHS machine, which recorded and played back digital audio encoded as a video signal.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Sony's PCM system, very expensive!
@cleverhardy5230
@cleverhardy5230 Год назад
Alesis' ADAT system was huge too, and based on videotapes. It was pretty much the recording standard until it was replaced with hard disks.
@giuseppelavecchia775
@giuseppelavecchia775 3 года назад
Il suono del VHS e' PERFETTO,IMPECCABILE!.bel video
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Dear Anthony. Your question (s) is/are the wright one(s). Indeed, I was in the process of making better use of the video track from in this case VHS. And for your info .. VHS also makes use of ‘depth recording’. By writhing the audio first and then the video on THE SAME PLACE with an other azimuth a major part of the audio is simply erased by the video recording. Indeed, the audio is under the video, but in reality, the are on the same place. (see my video) By switching of the video recording signal, audio is no longer erased. RF output in play-back is more or less 500 precent higher. Because audio is FM modulated, that’s beautiful for the playback of the audio. Together with the low frequencies used for the audio, normal drop-out are not of influence. Also the ‘take-over’ in de head can not be found in playback. That was on my mind when I designed the recorder in a old portable VHS. Wow and flutter are superb (can not be measured). Frequency response is over 30kc (see video).
@anthonya7990
@anthonya7990 2 года назад
Thanks for clearing my doubts and errors from old rusty video info which I had played around with abt 20 to 23 years back. Will catch up direct.
@andydredlox8686
@andydredlox8686 3 месяца назад
I have watched your video over and over and over again. And always wondered especially in the wake of excellent video compression i.e. mpeg4 x264 and x265 and now x266 is it possible to "stream" encode/decode an MP4 stream to VHS?? Especially when we can get a 4k acceptable film down to about 3gb or is the analogue bandwidth just not there?? I would love to see any sort of digital 4k video stream on VHS...
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 3 месяца назад
There is enough bandwidth to record MP3, MP4 that's not the problem. But at the end of a (video) frame there is a cap. In 'normal' VHS recorders there are 2 video heads. They switch over at the end of a frame (25or30Hz). So it's necessary to overcome that problem because the fault compensation can not handle that switch over distortion. Sony (but more marks) had a solution, in those day's. They time compressed the digital package and used only the visible part of the video track. The end of a frame was not used. By playback, they expand they package and the original stream became available. BUT tha's all digital, and there are so many good recording formats that can record digital. My design comes from the 80s. And is ALL ANALOUE. In those day's a perfect alternative for the costly digital solutions. (in fact, it costed next to nothing) But the idea is not so bad, i to wondered several times. Sorry for the bad English
@desreb740
@desreb740 2 года назад
Great info.
@riawerfwortel1083
@riawerfwortel1083 3 года назад
Man wat ziet dat er prachtig uit. En zo mooi ingesproken. Complimenten. Ik weet wat een enorm karwei het is geweest. De moeite waard. Geweldig. Met genoegen geluisterd en gekeken. Xx ik
@AndyNL
@AndyNL Год назад
Theo , amazing work, I hope somebody in your family can pick it up when you end the hobby.
@geraldspitzner4932
@geraldspitzner4932 Год назад
Interesting, great Video...
@AlexandreLollini
@AlexandreLollini Год назад
I did use that in the beginning of CD because the hifi vhs enabled me to have 4 hours of non stop music and in the order (playlist) that I wanted. I did use a yamaha DSP audio video amplifier to generate a uniform flat grey picture to feed to the s-video cable because this way I got less noise on the audio recording, but clearly your method of removing the video signal all together is much much better. My S-VHS was a panasonic, and it had very clear picture by picture replays. (for the time) also Amiga and genlock to insert titles etc ... lol nostalgia.
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777 Год назад
yes it may be better but it took a whole lot more time for a marginal improvement and if anyone had crucial audio to record you would be going to a professional studio to have it mastered anyways.. so it is more akin to a novelty - a cool novelty though ! Impressive .
@EdEditz
@EdEditz Год назад
Mooi project! Klinkt fantastisch!
@georgH
@georgH Год назад
That was great! Thank you for the video :)
@scottstrang1583
@scottstrang1583 8 месяцев назад
AFM still have that same compansion NR method like dbx. Instead of tape his there was head switching. Still the system sounded awesome when it tracked well. Also slp or ep had more head noise.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 8 месяцев назад
Correct, the only drawback (FM) was indeed compression / decompression and sometimes pre-emphasis. Strange that there was a difference between some brands in 'how to' handel nr. BUT BUT BUT - it was 1985 and the end-result was, that correct calibrated machine, with in this case the absent of a video carrier, the output (RF and audio) was magnificent. Beter that all my open reels in that time. As well as my ears - as the measuring equipment. And still to day, (for a few Euros) only surpassed by digital solutions. And there is room for more channels than 2 (or4).
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Yes Hasjelu, that switch is the original analoog audio-switch. Two tracks, so stereo if you want to. And still operational. So the recorder has after the modification 4 tracks. 2 analoog and 2 HiFi on the place where the video use to be! Great New Year!
@Kylefassbinderful
@Kylefassbinderful 2 года назад
To this day I make 6hr-8hr VHS hifi mix tapes with my LG VCR connected to my laptop running Apple Music or RU-vid Music. I don't plug in any video signal while recording. So far my oldest made tape is about 3 years old and it sounds great. You want to record some blank space at the beginning of the tape because that's usually where the dropouts start happening. Once you're about a ~1m or so into the tape it's smooth sailing. You gotta store your tapes properly and take care of your VCR because playing mix tapes on the same hardware that recorded onto them in somewhat paramount. They'll (probably) play on another VHS _hifi_ device but sometimes you get mixed results depending on how good the hardware is. Even with all these caveats I love VHS hifi audio. It sounds so clean, no tape hiss, long recording times. I have had quality mixes made even while recording on slower EP or SLP speed settings.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
You can win a lot, when you switch of the video-recording to the heads. Thereby your sound will no longer be partly erased!
@Kylefassbinderful
@Kylefassbinderful Год назад
@@TheoFaber I just don't plug in the video signal and then it doesn't record anything extra
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
​@@KylefassbinderfulAll types of VHS recorders are different in how they react. Some rec. need video to operate, others don't! Still the video heads are recording and therefore erasing most of the audio track. You will not here the difference but the output from tape to the audio amp will be only 20 procent or so. Thats whey you need to disconnect the video recording at the heads. Has nothing to do with video input or not! Drop outs will greatly be less than with video recording. Look closely to the video!!!
@Fantabiscuit
@Fantabiscuit Год назад
How is this even possible to do unless you’re a genius
@hafibeat834
@hafibeat834 Год назад
I don't see any sense to record a computer playlist to "tape" instead of saving it to the machine itself, but hey, if it makes you happy... :-)
@joeynrg
@joeynrg Год назад
Great video. That mouse pointer tho....
@bobsbits5357
@bobsbits5357 2 года назад
nice job i am allways pimp up old A/V gear working on a scully 280-14 that's in a bad way using tascam 38 parts as reel are same in kg;s i have some otari mtr 12 spare motors i have a deck motor were left over from the pimp up from mtr 10 i love betacam decks so many around now bob
@moviebod
@moviebod Год назад
Very interesting Theo. I went down a similar rabbit hole with double speed compact cassettes in the 1980s by changing the gearing of the drive, but I didn't do any electronics work which was beyond me. The results were interesting and I thought the tapes sounded better (but they lasted half as long), but I had no way of checking if the frequency response was affected. I have subscribed.
@guerrillaradio9953
@guerrillaradio9953 Год назад
I would think that you're right. Look at 80s 4 track cassette recorders for bands/musicians...they not only use both sides of the tape (L and R side A and B at the same time to get 4 full tracks), but many also ran the tape at a higher speed by default for more resolution/headroom. If you listen to people playing around with them on RU-vid and recording directly in off the tape, they sound amazing for a cassette, and I say that as someone who loves cassettes!
@cepamoa70
@cepamoa70 2 года назад
Fantastic video, and thanks a lot to share your knowledge under open license ! I plan to use my sony slv-E825 to master my musical home-studio analog works (tought it lacks manual record levels) as i experienced it is a little beast when used as hifi purposes. What would be on your opinion the best VCR reference (or modified one ) to achieve the best in terms of s/n, dynamics and regularity ?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Hello Frédérick. Well the best you are looking for are the - semi - professional recorders. They offer manual audio level control and VU meters. Picture quality usually not always the best, although you will aspect that from recorders of that price. Problem can be; that second hands pro VHS is extensively used (duplo houses) and therefor has a bad video drum. The audio heads will go first and you end up with a nice looking recorder and bad sound. Unless you can get a spare head? Google for; Panasonic AG 7350 or AG6810 enz, but there are a lot. Simply Google for professional VHS recorder. (if you have the money) If you are a technician, you can look for a good consumer recorder, modify it (like the one in the video) and select one (recycle shop) that you can easily access. Use the video heads for HiFi audio. My recorders are a hell, because everything is packed together and difficult to access. Complete new design will not be necessary. You can simply make the audio manual and use a separate VU meter of choice. Succes. Theo.
@Helderhugo
@Helderhugo Год назад
That is great.
@yaroc07
@yaroc07 Год назад
Wow! Great job!
@jezgomez
@jezgomez 2 года назад
I love using VHS to record audio. The biggest concern I have is related to the compander and the effect it has on the sound
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Yep, you are wright, it’s compressed. BUT it’s not all that bad. In this case, recordings are only played back on the same recorder. Interchangeability is not a problem. And there is no video (rf) carrier that erases 90 precent of the hifi audio. The audio rf that comes back from the tape, is enormous compared to the original state. So the switch-over is no problem (it’s also the same head). Don’t forget; video-heads are used for audio. The recorder did not have hifi originally. But in theory, there is a change of linearity distortion. But it’s theory. Test’s with all kind of waveforms, small or large, especially sawtooth (is that good English?) there is no distortion that I can see (pro-oscilloscope). from 50Hz to 35Kc. But correct adjustments of the audio-amplitude stay’s necessary.
@jezgomez
@jezgomez 2 года назад
@@TheoFaber that's a fantastic reply, thank you!
@MrVinamp
@MrVinamp 3 года назад
Dit is behoorlijk interessant!
@Netm8kr
@Netm8kr Год назад
Theo, bravo for your research and discoveries. You have definitely built a dream machine. I hesitate to ask... Any chance you'd build another? I'd love to have one in my home studio.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks Netm8kr? and bet you do! Don't blame you, the sound is fantastic, a full tape of 3 hours has nowhere drop-outs in playback because of the great disstance in signal and audio frequency's. BUT it has been a lot of work, so i am sorry that i will not design / build another. What you can do - if you have a old fashion video source - bey a second hands VHS that has HiFi. It's not the same, but you have an analogue recorder.
@Netm8kr
@Netm8kr Год назад
@@TheoFaber Indeed, I currently use a HiFi AIWA unit. I’ve been recording audio from vhs since the late 80’s. I guess, the gear hoarder in me is fascinated with the modified specs of your Hitachi. Not that I need anything else in my studio .🤦🏾‍♂️ You’ve certainly inspired me to use this setup more.
@bobjames2906
@bobjames2906 Год назад
please do BETAMAX next, Awesome stuff
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Unfortunately Betamax was and still is expensieve in The Netherlands. Also this modification was created in 1982, when machine where not outdated. Now day's there are only used machines (old). But I have a design that good be build in any video recorder, so you never know!
@MePeterNicholls
@MePeterNicholls Год назад
Sounds great!
@v12alpine
@v12alpine Год назад
It would be better in my opinion to compare your modifications to standard 4-head VHS HI-FI. It seems like you compared it to the LO-FI version? Reason being I used to record HI-FI audio on VHS with no video signal applied and it sounded really good, close to CD quality. I did not have to modify the VCR to do it. I would be interested to know how much better your version is.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
As you can see in the video, it was better because not the video was muted, but the (RF) signal from the video-part to the rotating drum. So no longer was the HiFi signal partly erased. The audio-rf output from tape, was 10-15 dB more that way. Imagine what that means for drop-out and misalignment.
@bsmith9506
@bsmith9506 Год назад
I had a HiFi stereo VCR exclusively for archiving FM Stereo broadcasts, which stand up to this very day. Many of those recordings are here on RU-vid.
@anthonya7990
@anthonya7990 2 года назад
Theo marvelous job, and that too way back years before DAT. More so this REAL ANALOG not a Digitized ADC to DAC system. I always wondered (comparing Reel to Reel) how it would turn out if full width of Video Tapes of 1/2 inch was fully used for only audio. I suppose we could (as you have shown, after disconnecting & shorting the Video Heads) use a HiFi VHS VCR with a Video signal ( for Head Drum Sync)from any Video Pattern Gen ( such as given in old Elektor Mags) can used to Rec/Play Audio this way. Further, in my limited VHS knowledge, the Hi Fi audio is recorded in the guard band between the video bands ( I may be wrong) as opposed to BeatMax where the Audio is Depth embedded below the same Video signal. In this case ( for VHS would there be a way for eg. modding the Drum Sync ckt, & using ALL 4 heads fully ( repeating/ adding the same ckt for 2 extra audio channels and then use all 4 head & so Full tape area. Would this be any better or just a small improvement ?. This may hjelp to get the full Magnetic Tape area/path such as a Reel to Reel without large Tape usage & low W&F.The TapeHead Forums does Tape Speed mods to get better audio from cassette tapes. Tried to get your email, but does not show. Thanks again, Theo.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Dear Anthony. Your question (s) is/are the wright one(s). Indeed, I was in the process of making better use of the video track from in this case VHS. And for your info .. VHS also makes use of ‘depth recording’. By writhing the audio first and then the video on THE SAME PLACE with an other azimuth a major part of the audio is simply erased by the video recording. Indeed, the audio is under the video, but in reality, the are on the same place. (see my video) By switching of the video recording signal, audio is no longer erased. RF output in play-back is more or less 500 precent higher. Because audio is FM modulated, that’s beautiful for the playback of the audio. Together with the low frequencies used for the audio, normal drop-out are not of influence. Also the ‘take-over’ in de head can not be found in playback. That was on my mind when I designed the recorder in a old portable VHS. Wow and flutter are superb (can not be measured). Frequency response is over 30kc (see video).
@hafibeat834
@hafibeat834 Год назад
This may be "real analog", but the signal is highly degraded by a lossy LF/HF-Modulation. It will never sound as good as a PCM-Recording.
@paulb4uk
@paulb4uk Год назад
Superb work .
@stevengagnon4777
@stevengagnon4777 Год назад
I thought that would be a good thing to delete the video information and do exactly what you did . To my surprise the answer was all ready known . It dawned on me when the VHS HiFi first went in the market. That using the VHS technology for audio only would match the sound quality of real to real in an inexpensive package and readily available tape. Unfortunately the CD format was already on the way and the industry was changing their focus. Just out of curiosity would there be some benefit by shutting down the video record head in the VHS HiFi so it would leave the audio recording intact ? Glad you gave it try . Thanks now I the answer is YES . Also thought an audio only tape format could have been put into a smaller package.
@disraivaaja258
@disraivaaja258 Год назад
wow!! thx for the video
@3dmaxuser
@3dmaxuser 7 месяцев назад
That is such a cool project well done :)
@WeSwapVoices
@WeSwapVoices Год назад
What program did you use to generate the voice over? Also sounds incredible !
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
voiceovermaker.io/ and the voice was 'Amy' (Engl)... The best voiceover voices to my opinion. Google has also nice voices. Note you use a AI voice and not a mechanical one.
@hugoromeyn4582
@hugoromeyn4582 Год назад
Werkte dat zo! Nu snap ik ook waarom ik sommige VHS tapes heb met HiFi audio die op sommige zwakke plaatsen op de band echt ruisen als een FM radio!
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Note: een 'standaard' HiFi recorder schakelt veelal automatisch over naar 'normaal audio' als het HiFi-spoor'tje slecht te lezen is. Dat normale spoor ruist altijd, als je er op let. Bij sommige recorders kun je zelf (afstand bediening) kiezen tussen HiFi en normaal.
@phonatic
@phonatic Год назад
That is very impressive mod you have come up with. For the 80's it's a very efficient solution. Well done! 👍 I was wondering, can you play your audio-only VHS tapes on a regular VCR as well or will it reject the recording because the video part is missing?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Thanks - and yes, it's technical the same frequency's so it all depend on the VHS machine. Some will work fine, others will simply not synchronize because of the lak of video (indeed).
@MyDenney
@MyDenney 2 года назад
I love putting hi fi audio on VHS hi fi. The problem is vcr’s for some unexplained reason stoped putting adjustable audio level meters on the units. Without them you are operating in the blind.how do you use a vcr to hat does not have audio level meters? As most vcrs don’t have them. Is there a work around?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Yes... as you can see, i made a (led) meter on the front. You must be reasonably technical, to modify a machine, that is not equipped with manual control. Most of the consumer video machines have a automatic volume control. That's the first thing you have to modify. Not easy, because it's inside a integrated circuit. It depends on the IC if you can modify this. Service manual and skill's are necessary! Wish you all the luck....!
@angelomarinato5903
@angelomarinato5903 5 месяцев назад
don"t messy wit these type of shit haters my friend !! good video bro !!!! Thx! analog is gonna be the best practical result for any kinda of music and art ALWAYS !! the process to make and compose music using analog gear is more fluid and seems like a real thing.. not a simulated reality . Salute from Brazil my friend ! aewsome video
@angelomarinato5903
@angelomarinato5903 5 месяцев назад
and your voice are better than this AI. Not a problem if your english is not good
@gregodessite
@gregodessite Год назад
Excellent approach, and is it possible to convert old VHS tape for multitrack studio recording?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Yes, because the bandwidth is more than you use. 500kc to 4a5MHz. HiFi audio uses only two carriers both 150kc wide.
@Aleksei_Nak
@Aleksei_Nak Год назад
​@@TheoFaber 24 tracks on 1 VHS?))
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
@@Aleksei_Nak In theory yes. But it will be very - very difficult. Because all those carriers wil interfere with one and other. Produce inter-modilation. I think 8 to 12 tracks will be more realistic.
@svofski
@svofski Год назад
I had no idea something like this could be possible, amazing project. As I understand it, analog audio is chopped in pieces, one video line long each, or 1/15625s in case of PAL. That's a high but audible frequency. I imagine there should be minuscule gaps or overlaps between video lines, too. Does it not really happen? Or are there some special measures to prevent this? Cheers!
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
NO it's not happening that way. There is NO video involved. Normally video is put on a FM modulated carrier and also recorded on tape. Both video and it's carrier are no longer in use. The audio is modulated on a FM carrier of it's own. Left and right have there own carrier. Those two carriers are recorded to tape. There is only one moment, that the drum is switching from head 1 to head 2. If the recorder is adjusted correctly, that moment is to short to be notist in the demodulator. Because video is not present, the signal (both audio-carriers) from tape is, is now enorm. Because it's no longer erased by the video carrier. So forget video, it's not there! With this knowledge, look at the video again. Greatings...
@svofski
@svofski Год назад
@@TheoFaber thank you! I understood that there is no video involved, my question was about the head switching moment that happens anyway. I realize that the switchover happens too quickly for the FM demodulator to notice. That's really cool. Cheers!
@Dont_Gnaw_on_the_Kitty_1
@Dont_Gnaw_on_the_Kitty_1 Год назад
​@@svofski The hi-fi audio IS recorded in diagonal strip's on the tape (much like the video strips). You are correct. The genius of this system is how he was able to remove the video strip's whilst still recording the audio strip's.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Dear Ilan; no ... speed difference has no influence. The frequency used for sound, is relatively low so there is no difference in play-back. And I did not use the video playback electronics. Pls look at the video one more time, I use complete dedicated electronics for (FM) sound.
@MikinessAnalog
@MikinessAnalog Год назад
why is the video & the audio in mono?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Good question - is it? I will have a look, the upload to RU-vid was stereo? Thanks for the tip!
@rickt1866
@rickt1866 Год назад
I have offten thought about using vhs as a PC tape back up not much need for it in 2023 with the sizes of harddrives but this proves it to me it was possible. I know they had tape storage but i was thinking of a new life for old machines?
@zoomosis
@zoomosis Год назад
There were PCM adapters for VHS/Beta VCRs used in the early 1980s for CD mastering back before hard drives were big enough to store an entire CD. CD-spec PCM audio is approx 600 MB for 60 minutes, so if storing non-audio data you'd get around 1.8 GB on a 180 minute videotape. Though once you add error correction you'd lose some of that capacity. Lastly, the data rate would be very slow for today's standards. Identical to a CD burner running at 1x speed, for obvious reasons!
@papanasos
@papanasos Год назад
Hi Theo ...and Happy New Year!!!!! I'm an AV Electronics Engineer, and this year I' taking my pension. So plenty of time to make creative things for my pleasure...One is music... So a straight question: Can you supply with analytical schematic diagram of your excellent job? By the way I have a couple of U-matic. Thank in advance !
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Hai Papastylianou. Good year for you to, and welcome to the world of pensionaries. This design and modification, I made in the 80s. So long time ago and I do not have the schematics any more. It wont help you ether, because I used for the FM (audio) part a complete print of a damaged HiFi VHS recorder. I made some modifications around the video drum and amplifier and servo section. Because this recorder did not work without proper video sync. So many things are coupled to this specific recorder and the used print. You can use your UMatics for this purpose, but the large tapes are not so handy? If you do; don’t forget to disconnect the drop-out compensation. Possibly they will give problems in the audio. And the drop-outs are relatively short compared with the use (audio) frequency’s, so it will not be a problem. Short; you can not copy my design on a different machine. All machines will need different modifications. Wish you luck and you can contact me, if you have more questions. Greetings from The Netherlands.
@papanasos
@papanasos Год назад
@@TheoFaber Thank you Theo for the complete and straight answer. Just I'm starting to think how I can modify a VHS to multitrack recorder (!!!)
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
Bandwidth enough !
@josnqn
@josnqn Год назад
Great job!
@williambock1821
@williambock1821 Год назад
Find a way to add tracks and this would be awesome.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
No problem in that - but it means to make 8-12 of these modification in a separate enclosure. I made this in 1982 and only refurbisch the recorder, take the dust of. But it still gives a perfect sound. Crispy and very low on noise!
@swilwerth
@swilwerth 7 месяцев назад
Hi! I've done decoding in software of this kind of FM stereo. The method is the same but the analog RF is sampled and decoded later in software. It have been hard to find documentation about the noise reduction compander/dolby like the encoder/decoder has to reproduce it in software. The most detailed instructions I found are from the IEC60774-2/1999 specification but they are vage on the actual implementation. Do you know where or how to search for that?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 7 месяцев назад
Correct; it's hard to find details. Mostly because different brands use different standards. To crazy for words, but they are more or less interchangeable. Like FM radio they all use standard pre-emphasis. On top of that, most use a kind of DBX compression. So a simple 1 band compression. (Dolby uses more, but is not used in HiFi VHS). Big problem is, that most consumer VHS have an automatic volume control, that disturbs the audio volume info. Because the noise suppression is not all that aggressive, the influents is (almost) not heard. Like digital (MP3) it's there in theory, but you need measurements or somebody with a lat off fantasy to tell the difference. Is it a mastering norm? - no. Is it one of the affordable analoge audio recordings? - yes! BUT - you have to unable the video heads / track and use it only for FM audio. I use the video heads for that. Standard 2 track's but there is room for more (8-16).
@bob4analog
@bob4analog 7 месяцев назад
Is that all that is necessary is to disconnect the video heads on a hifi machine?
@Capturing-Memories
@Capturing-Memories 2 года назад
The sync pulses are recorded at the bottom edge of the tape and audio on the top edge, I don't know where you get those illustrations from?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
Possibly you are wright, I never checked this detail. It was irrelevant for the story I had to tell. The illustration came from internet. In all my years as technician I only repaired (semi) professional stuff. But thanks for the correction. And it’s not the sync pulses that are written longitudinal, sync simply is on his place in the video signal. But if you mean by sync, the servo puls than - again - you are wright!
@Capturing-Memories
@Capturing-Memories 2 года назад
@@TheoFaber Yes the capstan synchro pulses, There are projects going on now for VHS capturing if you are interested in contributing, e-mail me so we can talk about it.
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber 2 года назад
@@Capturing-Memories Then I need a e-mail adres or pm on Facebook?!
@Capturing-Memories
@Capturing-Memories 2 года назад
@@TheoFaber I have an email address in my RU-vid channel, just go to about and show email address.
@hernanvassallo9902
@hernanvassallo9902 11 месяцев назад
Amazing!!!
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777
@SPINNINGMYWHEELS777 Год назад
oddly this is being promoted suddenly in the side bar.. I see many comments posted in the last hour. I wonder why?
@arieloxford6790
@arieloxford6790 Год назад
Yep! I'm here for that very reason. Very glad I am to be so as well.
@TheKoodus
@TheKoodus Год назад
I was also got by the algorhythm
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
I to! and have no idee?????
@WelderMetal
@WelderMetal Год назад
@ramonfelizjr
@ramonfelizjr Год назад
Can you make 8 or 16 channels in and out ? For recording and mixing ? The quality goes down more channels ? Thx
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
The quality will not deteriorate by the nr of channels! - I used the 'standard' frequency's for HiFi sound. But by selecting the other freq very carefully, 8 (stereo) channels will not create a problem. You need 8 times the electronics that i used and the displays to adjust and controle the recording levels. So no small deal... 16 channels ... a challenge!
@tatteredhope911
@tatteredhope911 7 месяцев назад
...i was talking about this with my dad the other day! This is absolutely amazing!!! Sir, is there a way that i can get ahold of you and talk to you about this 8 track audio recorder?!?!
@rover8772
@rover8772 Год назад
Mooi gemaakt Theo!
@ilanurielilanuriel
@ilanurielilanuriel Год назад
How are you connecting to the stereo amp? Through the video out? If so, do you demodulate the pal signal somewhere? Or did you add an amp that takes the signal read by the heads before it is modulated to pal?
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
see above
@TheoFaber
@TheoFaber Год назад
see above
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