A serious problem in planning against American doctrine is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine.
That's humanity in a nutshell when the rulebook doesn't seem to be working throw it out the window. & try something new cause what have you got to lose by trying.
A very real strategy. One time, I was playing chess against a friend. I was using no particular strategy, as I do not know any. After eliminating my queen, he revealed that he had been using a defined strategy this whole time. Knowing this, I proceeded to make extremely erratic movements until I had completely thrown him off course, and then proceeded to win the game with my more fluid playstyle.
Q has said something similar to Picard in more than one occasion. Those are inspiring and optimist ways the writers found to make us think about our potential. I love it.
I actually laugh at this scene because at first I thought it was a great sign of respect from the Vulcans but then I remembered that Vulcans are dicks and I figured it out: The word Sovak is looking for is: "Gullible" because humans are so quick to trust some nice words just this scene proved it: he just said some nice words and the gullible humans believed him and will now have to live up to better standards.
There is another reason they fear humans. Humans ride the tempest of their emotions and become stronger because of it. This is inexplicable to Vulcans; a non sequitur. What they don't understand is that their emotions are much *much* stronger than humans. Humans can give free vent to their emotions and still rule over those emotions. This is not possible for Vulcans. If they give free vent to their emotions, their emotions will rule them. Therefore those emotions must be ruled, lest they rule.
>This is not possible for Vulcans. If they give free vent to their emotions, their emotions will rule them. Therefore those emotions must be ruled, lest they rule. Then how do you explain Romulans? They are still capable of rational thought and seem to have a firm handle on their emotions most of the time.
@@akiramasashi9317 Because Romulans went the way of the galaxy, by embracing select emotion. Their will to dominate and feel superior to everything and everyone. They don't embrace all of their emotions.
@@akiramasashi9317 And look at their society. It's warrior based. They will also cut hulls at the drop of a hat. They aren't as civilized as Vulcans. They are capable of rational thought, even with the emotions, but they are much less forgiving than humans or Vulcans.
@@akiramasashi9317 The reunificationists were more civil? Really? I suppose you consider what Sela did was civil. And she was a reunificationist. In any event, they still were a warrior society. They would sometimes duel and would practice tactics on practice targets and I would assume on holograms as well. They had an outlet so they wouldn't destroy their world, unlike the Vulcans.
I always enjoy the way humanity is presented in Star Trek: there's a kind of practical creativity to humanity that doesn't seem to be present in other races, and that's why humans seem to do so well in so many situations. Humans aren't the strongest, fastest, smartest, or most technologically advanced - but they're the most creative and adaptable, and that ends up being what you need most of all: not to be any one thing, not to have any one defining trait... but to be the most able to switch between whatever trait is most needed at that moment.
That's because we can only imagine in our sci fi variations of our own existence. Just like in starwars you see entire desert planets and ice planets, that are just variations of the biomes on our own planet.
@@mryellow6918 that has nothing to do with limited imagination. star wars specifically was limited by the technology of the time. the reason all of the planets were/are just variants of our biomes is that effects would have been prohibitively expensive trying to create entirely new biomes. look at more recent sci-fi/sci-fantasy and you can see the difference. not in all of it, but in a lot of it. same goes for why nearly everyone was distinctly humanoid in star ward. all that being said...we do see homogenous planets. Mars, for example. Not technically a planet, but our moon is also fairly homogenous.
True but we all have a core choice or promise that define the individual. No matter what we all try to make what person we wish to be work in any situation.
Admiral: "Ambassador, are Vulcans afraid of us?" Ambassador: "Admiral, with respect, I distinctly heard a Human engineer on my way here. Do you know what she was contemplating? Out loud she wondered if we could tractor beam two stars together for, and I quote "Because that shit would be cool". Now do you understand?" Admiral: "Oh Burke's plan? Okay in her defense, that shit would be kinda cool."
I always liked the idea that the humans in Star Trek are the galaxies mad scientists. That would also be a good explanation why starfleet ships always have to deal with weird stuff like those holodeck malfunctions.
It's funny, because it's all just a biproduct of the other species simply being written in a two-dimensional way in the early years, as the goal was to present allegories for different aspects of humanity, rather that believable societies.
I just realized this is Star Trek's explanation of why every species encountered is a Planet of Hats. Humans are the strange exception to this rule in the Star Trek universe. A species that does not conform to one doctrine or ideology.
We humans have a tendency to stereotype other cultures. That's especially so in science fiction when it comes to alien cultures. When/if alien life is discovered, we'll realize the error in assigning human attributes and emotions to nonhuman species, much like we anthropomorphize animals.
On DS9, Nog marveled at how the humans were able to advance so quickly as well. Apparently humans accomplished in a few thousand years what took the Ferengi 25,000.
@Malk Von Batshit That's one of Star Trek's fundamental problems...they make the aliens a 'planet of hats', with each alien species being a pastiche of one specific human trait. It would be illogical, as the Vulcans would put it, to assume every Klingon is a warrior or every Ferengi is an amoral capitalist. Doing so makes the alien races two-dimensional instead of giving them the variety needed for depth and realism.
It mostly has to do with the fact that every human has a dark side, but sadly, too many of us fail to control that side. There are even humans that embrace that dark side. That is what makes Humans unreliable as a whole.
@@paulmichaelfreedman8334 it does. I think it is also telling that pretty much only Humans evolved on a fairly hospitable world. Andoria is a icy moon. Vulcan a desert planet of raging sandstorms and incredible heat. Qo'onos has extreme volcanism (I think). Earth, by contrast, is a paradise of a world, lush and green with plentiful water and vegetation. No wonder, then, that humans are so complicated.
Yeah but he's not sure how to deal with a race. That has a wild range of emotions that they control. Can vent them when needed yet not be ruled by them. Vulcans as a whole can't stand being wrong about anything.
It's why the two species rely on one another. Humans can understand emotions better than Vulcans because Vulcan emotions are just too chaotic for them to process. It's why they are so violent when they lose control or any form of balance they manage to achieve. "Calming down" is as difficult to Vulcans as it is for a Human to flip a car over with their bare hands. It's why they take Pon Farr so seriously as it's one of the few ways they can "vent" safely. It's because of this understanding Humans have with emotions that they can embrace the Vulcan logic. It's why Hoshi goes to T'Pol for help in controlling her overwhelming fears since she knows T'Pol has an insight to control she lacks. And it works: with T'Pol help in making the emotions something tangible Hoshi doesn't erase her fear but control it. That helps her greatly as the series progresses. It's how T'Pol realizes that Humans can control their emotions if they're given the right reigns, but ultimately they have to hold onto them, not the Vulcans. That's why Spock and Kirk have such a good dynamic: Kirk helps Spock understand the problem in front of him while Spock helps Kirk keep control of himself, but neither tell the other what to do, just gives the tools they need.
@@ГригорийГ-ч4н We mustn't forget that Vulcans were instrumental in helping Humans reaching the stars, while Vulcans themselves had no outside aid during their own crisis. Ambassador here was humble enough to acknowledge Human progress without mentioning that, because it's not Human advancement that impressed him, it's the Human traits.
@@Cyberium No they weren't. Humans invented warp on their own. That's the only reason the Vulcans talked to us. "Vulcans themselves had no outside aid during their own crisis. " total speculation on your part.
@@rekcusdoo That was Braxton's fault. He, for whatever reason, had it in his head he could prevent a disaster by causing another one (Species 8472 overrunning the Galaxy comes to mind). If he had not tried to destroy Voyager FOR NO GOOD REASON, his ship would not have been stranded in the the late 20th century. Frankly, Braxton was defective and had no business in Starfleet" or running a time ship at all, forget unsupervised. Also this is why Star Trek should NEVER DO TIME TRAVEL.
To be fair, first we had to hook up 2 of them, punch a hole in the universe, travel to another universe with a more violent version of humans, beat them up (cause their violence offended us) steal their warp cores to get back, THEN we turned a star into a torus. Granted that was last week.
I feel like it should be pointed out that the statement of humans going from WW3 to interstellar travel within is, more than likely, not considered a good thing by Vulcan High Command. Bevause it took Vulcans 1500 years to recover, they had a lot of time to virtually transform their species. The quick turnaround of Humanity, coupled with them only being marginally different in attitude compared to their time pre-warp travel, introduces a lot of uncertainty as to their mindset in that timeframe. Humanity has told itself "it'll be better this time" in the past many times only to eventually use their newfound understanding and technology to fight greater and bloodier wars. Except now with warp travel, they have the new ability to drive not just themselves into extinction but whole races alongside them. And it's a question that probably persists more than two centuries later - as the mere threat of the Dominion caused Human space to fall into terror and paranoia, with a Starfleet coup almost installing a military dictatorship on Earth.
Looking back as I watched this show as a kid, I'm amazed at how it awakened a sort of pro-human feeling in me early on. I hated the parts where the Vulcans basically played God and tried to control human development. If it weren't for humanity's willingness for cooperation, the Vulcans would've been seen as their tyrannical overlords instead of allies- look at how the Augments ended up when they tried to take over the world. We might not be their version of perfect, but this was humanity's future- not the Vulcans. Archer's initial frustrations for their restrictions were actually justified.
Also consider the 200+ year lifespan of Vulcans. Between 2063 and 2373 is 310 years. That's 2, maybe 3, Vulcan lifespans. Fears and prejudices are changed only slowly, even slower with such long lifespans.
Gary Graham plays the Vulcan Ambassador Soval, with nuance and dimensional depth. Without a doubt, one of the best portrayals of a Vulcan across all of the Star Trek franchise. Jolene Blalock does a superb job, as well, when the writers gave some depth to her character as T'pol. When Soval and T'pol have a private scene together, it's as if we are eavesdropping on an unguarded Vulcan conversation, and see the nuances of their culture. Enterprise writers, took the Vulcan characters to a new level, that portends what humans might have to do in the future to survive self-extinction.
There are many sciencefiction stories in which humans rule supreme, are the dominant species or otherwise 'the best' But in Star Trek, we're the weird ones.
@@ivanelias3916 You only say this because you were born with hands. Mandribles for examples would work as well. Or you could be a social species where individuals are always born as twins and act together as one. Or you could have some kind of chemical reaction or magnetic field to move certain objects. In our own evolution there are many ways which we could have evolved different. But i have to admit - opposing thumbs are the easiest way you could move something.
humans are a spectrum of destruction, we survive by destroying each other, no other sub species are designed to survive, but to thrive within one another, logic is never in our true nature, that is why humans are more frightening than a vulcan showing emotion
@@mmoarchives2542 There are other primates that fight wars, and kill each other. Chimpanzee and Apes both kill and eat each other . It is in our nature.. but we are not alone.
Oh he was in stitches for a long time dealing with humans. Finding us amusing as hell in one moment, then about ready to press the button sending us to extinction the next. He finally got the idea that IDIC really did apply to us and let it be. One of the biggest discussions the Q Continuum had in a loong time.
@@therealtampadude9175 and now he's back in Picard, involving everyone in a time travel plot, back to Earth's 20th. Let's see how badly mangled this script is.
Enterprise was a very underrated show. Like many good shows it takes a year or two to find its feet then settles in with many shows that tell good stories. I will never understand why Paramont didn't follow the example of The Next Generation Series and put all the series in syndication. Had they done that then I believe that Voyager and Enterprise would have been more successful and Enterprise may have gone on to the usual 7 year cycle.
"Are Vulcans afraid of humans?" "Well, of all the species we have encountered, only 1 has been so intelligent, yet still so stupid, to not only detonate 1 nuclear warhead within their atmosphere, but to detonate dozens in a competition to make the biggest, for half a century"
It's comforting to know that the people who made decisions like that are probably still somewhere in the deep state- lobbying complex, at the age of 106. And certainly their children are.
I love this scene, but I think I can define humans. Versatility. That is humans strength. Not locked down by one way of thinking but being versatile. The Vulcans needed 1500 years to rebuild through logic. We have logic, but with 'Klingon' passion, 'Andorian' arrogance, and 'Tellarite' stubborness, humans were able to do that in less than 100 years.
Yes versatility but the willing to accept the deference in our species is paramount, how are we able to reach out and make contact with a another species with out accepting their differences from us? Also I think its our adaptability to climate and terrain that has made us who we are as humans, There's very few places on earth that humanity has managed to survive in and create a culture.
Passion, arrogance and stubborness are the exact traits I'd expect from scientists capable of creating great things like the warp drive. The passion for their work, their arrogance of just believing they are the ones able to do it, the stubborness to push on through setbacks, and the inteligence to back it all up.
The defining attribute of humans is foolishness, for better or worse. We fear the unknown, but venture there anyway. We stupidly fake a smile, before we genuinely smile. We're driven by reward circuitry in the brain to be happy in ignorance, and yet we yearn for knowledge, a foolishness we'd rather call curiosity. On the other hand, the same foolishness makes us superstitious around the unknown, we refuse to smile despite the inner call to do so. We may also choose ignorance when knowledge is right in front of us. We're fools, not of a Took perhaps, but fools we remain - for better, or worse.
"It took us 1,500 years to rebuild our world and travel to the stars. You humans did the same in less then a century..." In other words, we got in miles of our own shit and we weren't dense enough to figure it out...
Every time I hear someone say the word Logic. I'm reminded what the 2nd Doctor said to Zoe in the Wheel in Space. "Logic, my dear Zoe, merely enables one to be wrong with authority."
Got another one. "The greatly stupid and the greatly powerful have something in common. They don't change their views to fit the facts. The alter the facts to fit their views. Which can ve uncomfortable if you happen to be one of those facts that needs altered."
And the best one of all... "Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell...BAD." -- Commander Spock, "I, Mudd".
@@CodeAndGin Changing views to fit the facts/changing facts to fit their views was a 4th Doctor episode, S14E04, part 4, "The Face of Evil" - just before Leela [under mind control] tries to shoot the Doctor. Not sure about the other one.
I'm convinced the writers of this ep were author c clark fans. There is a short story by him written decades ago where a group of different alien species come to visit earth because they detected radio signals. The rest of the galaxy takes thousands of years to go from radio to space flight and they are astounded to find not only did it only take us a century but we have completely left the planet in non-ftl ships because of our sun going nova (the aliens were coming to save what they could). The story ends with "and they laughed, wondering what such a primitive species would say to such advanced species coming to their rescue. 50 years later, they were no longer laughing".
@@buckaroobanzai7063 thanks, I had forgotten the name. One of the first Clarke stories I read. Still have the images in my head of the aliens walking through the abandoned cities on Earth wondering where the people are hiding, then noticing the radio telescope dishes all pointing in the same direction, sending telemetry to the fleet of Earth when the sun goes nova.
The Humanity in Star trek is hard to classify.. But when you think about it, Humanity is like a binding agent. We are the glue that holds things together between the different races. We are capable of everything that all the different races in star trek are like. But we can work together with those other cultures. We can be isolationists, xenophobic and xenophiles all at the same time. We are pretty much a paradox of definition. Jack of all trades. Humanity is basically the glue that holds the federation together in most of the series. (without knowing it even in the first TOS series...)
Interesting. This was also the point made by aliens about humans in Babylon 5. Delenn pointed out that only humans created mixed communities, so only they could have built Babylon 5.
General: Oh well...you know thats not really fair. We had some future space engeneers helping cochram to rebuild his ship. Soran: What? 🤨 General: What?
I suppose the reason humans are OP in the show is because they constantly get themselves into trouble, and thus constantly have to bail themselves out of trouble. They've essentially gotten really good at solving problems, by creating problems for themselves, intentionally or unintentionally.
It's the same in almost every sci-fi series. Humans are the underdog, a jack-of-all-trades, always a newcomer to the galactic world but clearly on path to become the dominant ones one day.
@@voorachter2733We need more sci-fi and fantasy stories and settings that lean into Humans are Persistence Predators. Like that one short story "We who Run (Chase)" - it's so rarely touched upon. Humans are always average, or curious, or innovators, or whathaveyou. Nothing turns around and says "Humans start to get sore legs at the time other races collapse from total exhaustion, and can march four times further than that before exhaustion begins to truly set in."
Despite this scene, the Vulans and Humanity have the closet relationship in the Federation. First Contact, Spock and Kirk best summarized this relationship. Even if Vulcan find us unpredictable and unruly in nature, they seem rather fond of humanity, seeing much of themselves in them and so decided to help them form a better world for their new allies.
No it isn't. It's absolutely not true. During the black plague, what did we do? We killed the cats. We blamed it on cats and we killed them. THAT'S what humans do when things are worst. Humans should be eradicated from the universe. But go ahead, give yourself a pat on the back for being so awesome in your own opinion, that's the level of humility one should expect from a filthy human after all.
@@Thulgore I mean only if your overly reductive. We don't have dedicated soldiers any human can be one, a good chunk of the world is democratic or at least not a hereditary dictator ship. we don't have truly communal young, we tend to pair off. most mammal family groups would be a better comparison for social structure, predatory pack animals or great apes would be closer still. the only thing we have more in common with ants than them is scale. Additionally agriculture is not a social trait but a prerequisite for a large colony of any sort as a stationary population has to renew food sources or starve.
@@arhalts Our society is very close to ants though. Ants farm, they wage huge wars, they build up various departments to their colonies, all with a specific task in a functionalistic system of different organs. And even though the majority of the world today isnt a dictatorship or monarchy where one person has the highest power, it used to be like that for almost all our existence and is clearly just as natural of a system for us as concepts such as democrasy.
I think the reason that Humanity evolves technologically so fast is that Humans are infinitely curious and willing to try anything. That curiosity and drive to know the unknown is what made Humanity advance so fast while other races were slower in their development, whether it was because they were held up by religious doctrine like the Voth, scared of going to fast like the Vulcans, consumed by war like the Klingons, etc, Humanity drive to discover the unknown allowed them to bypass anything that would slow down their development, hell the creation of the Federation, while made in order to unite races against a stronger threat like the Romulans, allowed Humanity to learn from all member races and to pool those races creativity to force a even greater technological leap then they or the other races could have done on their own.
They had very good reason to be afraid of us if the Humans of the Mirror Universe are any indication. He should just count himself he lives in the good Star Trek timeline.
A species that can expect to live what, 200, 300, 500 years or more on average will naturally make most advances far more slowly than a species with an average life expectancy of 100 years or less. That longer life span results in being that much more methodical in planning and study both.
I remember one scene where a landing party was in an ice cave with some nonhuman members. The humans were just fine but the others were suffering. Humans had long ago adapted to heat and cold. Not so the others.
One of my favorite moments from all of Star Trek. Vulcans appear to look down on humans but hide their true feelings. They see themselves but without the need to rely on logic above all else.
The human/vulcan relationship is like a tug-of-war. With the emotions humans able to pitch tons of solutions based on feelings and reason and vulcans eager to slap them down with brutal logic until both agree. Consensus between the two species is possible but you have to work for it.
If aliens do exist, and are watching us, it would only be for the fascination of how quickly we progress despite our many failings. It's like thousands of years of technologically dragging our feet, and suddenly, within a century, we go from covered wagons to jet airplanes. The only thing more fascinating than that is how frightening it is!
This clip from Star Trek: Enterprise reminds me of Babylon 5 in that even the Vulcans understood that the human race's potential for destruction was legendary. Humans...heh. If there is one thing that we are good at, one thing all other alien races can agree on, is that we are just so fucking good at killing.
I'm reminded of Galactic Civilizations. Humans are seen as (and mechanically are) the greatest diplomats in the galaxy. Many of the aliens miss the fact that humans were basically forced to become so to keep from wiping ourselves out with our warlike nature. It's amazing how quickly that advantage can exponentially grow into every other kind of advantage in the game if you play it right.
There are things in the Universe billions of years older than either of our races. They are vast, timeless, and if they are aware of us at all, it is as little more than ants and we have as much chance of communicating with them as an ant has with us. We know. We've tried and we've learned that we can either stay out from underfoot or be stepped on. They are a mystery and I am both terrified and reassured to know that there are still wonders in the Universe, that we have not explained everything. Whatever they are, Miss Sakai, they walk near Sigma 957 and they must walk there alone." Ambassador G'Kar,
We are very good at exploring and settling issues too, we are also very passionate creatures, everyone who describes humans as only violent choose to ignore the glorious things about our species
In a similar vein, in the Terminator 2 movie, one of the best movies ever made, the Terminator tells the young John Connor, "It is in your nature to destroy yourselves.". This is so accurate it's frightening.
“you humans did that in less than a century” probably with all of the normal human chaos and problems and conflicts still existing during that endeavor.
That's because, in the face of death/near-extinction, we humans *WILL* put aside racial/ideological differences in order to survive. Something Vulcans never understood. . .
Yup, vulcans needed to ban emotions alltogether because they couldn't figure out how to use them in moderation. That is probably what the ambassador is actually afraid of - that we are able to harness and use our emotions.
Well, it should be no surprise to any Trekkie out there that the show has a heavy liberal bias... I mean, they aired both an interracial and a lesbian kiss during times these weren't considered ... shall we say ... presentable?
"Why would we worry you?" "Dude, you guys nuked yourselves back to the Industrial age and then a guy built a Warp Drive out of scrap in his garage 80 years later."
The weird thing with humanity is that we have undeniably short lives. In the grand scheme of the cosmos our lives are short. Nearly a hundred years and in half that time our bodies degrade and become frail. Humanity rides the high of our emotions. Almost paradoxically we're stronger because through emotion we gain a semblance of control as much as strength. This is what scares other species. Our capacity to not give a shit when faced with overwhelming odds coupled with our spiteful nature makes us incredibly unpredictable. Among other things.
That's a common theme in fantasy writing as well. Human's due to their short lifespans compared to dwarves or elves, are always in a rush to do great things while they can. So we dabble in things we shouldn't as shortcuts. Sometimes it burns us badly and sometimes it works out.
Humans in the Vulcan logic sense could be considered: "A pre Surak distant cousin". So much like them, but so different. In the non canon book "Vulcans Glory" it tells of the horrifying wars Vulcan faced. And how similar human culture was to their own. Both were violent, angry, always seeking wars and some kind of "trigger" to get everyone divided and pointing fingers. Passages include: "A pumped laser beam through the eye" "ShiKahr faces nuclear retaliation from neighboring Raal after talks break down over a territorial dispute". In fact, Surak was a computer expert. His family was extremely wealthy and important as a prime contractor for computer technology throughout the Vulcan Solar System. His family's inventions include neural interfaces for computer to "virtual world" via the Psi abilities Vulcans possess. Holo networks and direct mind news and entertainment feeds. And of course neural attack blockers and psionic attack resistance to the Vulcan Military. Surak had these installed at great expense to protect him and others from psionic adepts and trained weapons. Basically, Vulcan of the Pre Surak Era were Cyberpunk personified!!! Swords alongside phasers, traditional armor but resistant to slug throwing, energy, and even Psi wave attack. In the book (The Devils Heart)Surak lost several brothers just after the Festival of Moons (Vulcan was renowned for its festivals to every god, spirit, and anything worth drinking and fighting at) and a full fight on the Ichaya Plains. Where a young Surak sat in the cold desert, being warmed by the powerful Devils Heart (Ko'n'ya in Vulcan) considering the waste of lives and the pain of it all. It was where his philosophy was born. To end the desires themselves. While the Devils Heart eventually left Vulcan and helped build the Romulan Empire. Surak could have ruled Vulcan, raised his brothers from the dead, and struck down all his enemies. But he chose the way of logic, not power.
The way humans are represented in Star Trek reminds me of Mass Effect. We're not the strongest or fastest or smartest, but what we are is by far the most creative and driven, a drive that could be easily mistaken for impatience. And that drive/impatience, coupled with our unmatched creative thinking, leads us to make progress at rates far beyond the rest of sentient life, and to create things other species would never even think of. And when other species see humanity just kind of show up and get to the point they're at in a fraction of the time it took them to get there, it's frightening because it makes them realize we might be able to surpass them just as quickly. Humans will make progress in a single lifetime that might take centuries for other species, and that's probably pretty intimidating.
I love that they take the 1 quirk per race thing that resulted from the standalone episodic format, and actually made it a near galactic norm to explain why humans matter so much in galactic politics.
@@k1productions87 exactly. The Vulcan fear is that humans will be a species with the technological capability of altering entire star systems, and the lack of moral/ethical framework to not weaponize it.
The line that followed: "We only wish to be your partners in exploration, to work together in common cause." If humans ever indeed encounter peaceful extraterrestrials, who knows what changes will result in our world.
In defense of, well, the Human-Vulcan comparison. Trek Humanity's final great war upon itself *didn't* utterly wreck the planet, annihilate civilizations, and drive them to the edge of extinction like the Vulcan's did. Though, I guess if anything humanity catching itself on the razors edge of oblivion and managing to step back from the abyss of self destruction might scare the Vulcans even more.
So... To reach warp capability faster we should reduce human lifespans. I'll do my part by eating only bacon and ice cream and never exercising. When people tell. Me to eat healthier I'll say "I'm doing this for scientific progress!"
I love that Soval never actually said who humans actually remind him of, and let the admiral answer the question for him. Because of course it's actually Romulans who humans remind Soval of, but he can't say that.
I mean, it's all a holodeck simulation written hundreds of years after the fact - so it's basically a playable historical novel. In that it's realistic in how unrealistic it is ;D
@@HappypandaAJ I mean, consistent with the other acronyms (TNG, VOY, DS9, ENT) it should be - and probably is - DIS. But I think STD is a better fit, too :D
S4 Enterprise was really really good and I still feel cheated we never got a 5th season. We were SO CLOSE to the first Romulan War, Refit NX-01, a pleasant ret-con of the finale episode, all of it.
I will never get over aliens in Sci-fi movies and shows referring to "years". It jolts me out the story every time. It makes no sense that someone not of Earth would refer to a year, without qualify it by saying "X amount of time in your Earth years".
If everyone's running translators or speaking languages, it makes sense. One "year" in English is specifically the amount of time it takes for Earth to complete one orbit.
No wonder the Vulcans needed 1500 years for this, because if you live strictly logically and put your feelings away, good feelings like passion and the good feeling when you have achieved something are also lost. Human passion is not always a good feeling, but when it serves a good cause, humans are unstoppable through their passion and through their positive motivation. Humans achieve their goals through passion.
Vulcans are sometimes disturbed by human behavior. We are Vulcan like in a lot of ways, but not. A perfect example is in Star Trek 6. Spock try’s to appeal to Kirk by telling him that the Klingons are dying. And Kirk says, “Let them die.” Even though Spock is Vulcan, in his Vulcan way he looks deeply deeply disturbed by this. Because his friend, who he knows is highly intelligent and empathetic, is ok with genocide because of the need for vengeance.
You know I have watched almost all the star trek series including this one. And I never thought of it this way. Never did I imagine the Vulcans feared us.
They feared what path humanity might take. It would have been SO EASY for humanity to go “The Vulcans won’t stop holding out on us? Won’t share their technology? We’ll have to take their ships by force, and they’ll never see it coming,” ESPECIALLY during the destruction of the Romulan War. Given how brash, irritable and angry much of humanity was over the Vulcans’ reluctance to share higher technology, they had very good reasons to be hesitant of that. Humanity could’ve so easily gone the way of the Terran Empire.
As the Admiral figured out are that vulcan like species; you see the intense respect, almost to fear, in Soval's expression. He then explains how humans are superior. That expression is superb acting. Nowadays there's only mindless action and absurd circumstances.
Yeah... using the technology and scientists who created all those weapons for the evil people in the terrible war. I guess that is what makes it great: forgiving your enemies and making them your friends even if they did bad things or were forced to.
"...you humans did the same in less than a century." So: Captain "Set phasers to 'mama's fried chicken'and FIRE!" Vulcan weapons officer "What? I don't..." New Yorker helmsman "For God's sake man she means let 'em have it with both barrels!" Vulcan "..."
I ignored this series when it was in production. But recently I watched the whole series in order via Paramount's online streaming service, and reached the conclusion that this series is very underrrated. It should have gone on longer by at least two more seasons. However it seems like it was carefully planned to last four seasons, no less and no more, from the very start. This gave it a continuity and integrity that is noteworthy.
"It says here that Humans didn't even have currency until five thousand years ago, let alone banking, speculative investments, or a unified global economy." "They're a primitive, backward people Nog. Pity them." "But think about it, uncle. That means they went from being savages with a simple barter system to leaders of a vast interstellar Federation in only five thousand years! It took us twice that long to establish the Ferengi Alliance and we had to buy warp technology from the…"
In many Sci-Fi series humans are one of most adaptive species that within couple of years can reach impossible when faced certain doom. And then one of the civilisations that humans are afraid of in Star Trek is the Borg, or Replicators in Stargate that whole idea is that they can adapt in manner of seconds.
Hell yes. Irony abounds. Met the guy back in the day. Spent so long talking with him about the show and the like.....I forgot to get him to signmy DVD OF the show. :(
I think this sums up why the Borg are apparently so obsessed with assimilating humanity they're willing to go back in time to do it BEFORE humans even developed warp drive despite the fact they habitually ignore prewarp or otherwise socially or technologically primitive warp-capable cultures IE the Kazon.
Humans are like Vulcans before they surrendered to logic. Humans teeter along the cliff's-edge of violence and madness, but somehow only relatively rarely fall. Humans are like mobile, self_aware bombs, traveling along a path with infinite triggers present to set them off.
I believe this falls into the main belief of humanity's ability of adaptation. Humans can adapt to most situations, and environments. Humans can live mostly anywhere on this planet because of our ability to adapt to the environment and situation over a few generations. Given time, we can adapt to our own destructive nature, and pull together for the survivability of our species. I believe that's where he's saying, "you Humans did the same in less than a century."
Its not just the rapid advancement. Its humans ability to interact and empathize with other species that Vulcans cant wrap their heads around. Vulcans have been out there for centuries and have no good relationships with any species. At best they have a few diplomatic encounters. Humans went out there and immediately made allies and got everyone to put aside their differences and work together. The Vulcans could never have considered that as a possibility.
The Vulcans choose to suppress their emotions while those that would become the Romulans embraced their emotions but fell to pride. Humans never tried to suppress their emotions but understood they could not be controlled by them either.
We're unpredictable and as somebody who has been in a toxic relationship in the past the worst aspect of that was how incredibly unpredictable my ex was.
Innate adaptability might be a trait among life that came up on a 'geologically impatient' planet like ours. Maybe the 'Elder races' are from 'Elder worlds'; planets that never had any 'asteroid resets'? Rapidly adaptable monkeys with warp drives might take over the galaxy... The Vulcan's knew it.
I like the idea that humans are a younger planterary species than the others, and thus a step forward in galactic evolution. A bit like homo neanderthaliensis and cro magnon. Just enough difference to be relevant.
