Was Seneca Crane a rebel? 

Hi friends! A quick reminder not to post spoilers for "The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes". The book isn't out in many countries yet, and won't be for another few weeks, so it's incredibly inconsiderate. Also, many of you have been asking when I'll make videos about it. I won't be making videos about it until the movie adaptation is released, as this firstly gives everyone time to buy and read the book, and secondly will allow us to use the secondary canon that is a movie to base ideas off of. Thank you and happy bubbles!

I definitely think that there is a chance that he was a rebel. I don't think he was apart of the rebel allience, yet. But I think that if he had stayed alive longer, he would have joined hem. I think he was just a rebel himself. Not wanting to listen to Snow's orders.

Omg your like the real life Ceaser Flickerman but where he changes hair colour for every hunger games you change your lipstick colour every video 😂

This could be why Haymitch seems a little displeased when he tells Katniss about Seneca’s death

Seneca Crane was executed because he was responsible for creating the second rebellion

I always liked Seneca Crane Because his beard’s awesome

But I will say, yeah, I do think Seneca had his moments when he wasn’t the sharpest crayon in the box

It wouldn’t surprise me if Seneca was a rebel. Not necessarily a rebel but I think he was tired of seeing kids die or tired of Snow.

I actually liked Seneca more than Plutarch. I never got Plutarch. Plutarch seemed like a low-key psychopath and I was waiting for him to be outed.

It would also make sense why katness got an 11 for shooting the Apple at the game makers. Because he agrees with her rebellious actions.

I didn't get the vibe of a rebel from Seneca. He just seemed a guy who genuinely wanted to do his job as a Gamemaker well. Like he was born in the Capitol, grew up following the route of becoming a Gamemaker because he had watched all of the Games and got inspired to be someone who could create a good show. He had zero idea of the political wheel behind the Game on a deeper level. When Katniss, an intriguing tribute, came along, she was his chance to make a name, to excite the creation that he made. To him, she wasn't a sign of hope or rebellion, but more of a chance to prove himself. If he was someone who was fluent in the language of oppression like Snow, he would never change the rule. Snow was determine on having a Victor as a sign of false hope for the Districts but Seneca took it a bit too literal, ending up having two Victors, an exception never been done before. I think Seneca genuinely didn't realize how much of an impact his own decision was against his safety. He was a man of privilege, never had his life threatened so he didn't take the lurking threat in Snow's tone as serious as he should have. He had given more hope than he should, and that's the reason he got killed.

i never actually realized crane hung himself, and it finally clicked why katniss's thing caused so much backlash (not the words i wanna use but too tired to think of anything else)

R.I.P. Seneca Crane

Although I really like this theory, it is based mainly on the movies, which had a lot of added scenes because the book is written from Katniss' perspective and couldn't have known about the conversations between Snow and Crane etc. I'm not saying it still couldn't be true though based on his decisions regarding Katniss and Peta. For example, giving Katniss such a high score, despite her obvious defiance, seems like part of the plan to get her sponsors and makes me question if Haymitch told Crane to make her mad because that's when she performed best. ?🤔💭

I really love this theory! It really changes your view on him and I feel like kind of changes the whole story. It would also make sense why in your video about the odds being in Katniss's favor, why the arena is set up just like the forest back home for her and obviously why he changes the ruling.

if this was the case than Katniss and Peeta really owes Haymitch a lot to let them both live and actually change the rules for the first time, as he still convinces Seneca that: 1) Katniss and Peeta holds promise for the rebel, 2) changes Seneca's mind as he listened to Haymitch's advice. He didn't just save them but also changes the tradition of the Hunger Games with only having one winner.

He was definitely a rebel!!! I never thought of this before! I have no idea how you come up with this stuff!

I always thought Seneca was a rebel too, most of all after the conversation with Haymitch which looks so weird as they are trying to keep a low profile using a secret language... recalling a tiny bit a 007 situation in a kind of way, if you know what I mean. I like to think Seneca was a rebel even because he decided to "leave" on his own term refusing to eat the night lock. I really liked this character and I feel a tiny bit sad it wasn't explored more deeply both in the books and in the movies, such a shame... I will miss him.

I just realized what the thing katniss did mean omg I thought it meant she hated him but no omg

I like to think that Seneca was a rebel, and used his influence in the Capitol and the Games prior to ascending to the role of Head Gamemaker. Katniss mentions that outer district victors (who by their nature would be more prone to supporting a rebel movement) tend to win due to Gamemaker-influenced factors (mutated lizards and floods affecting Career supplies, for example). Who is to say that Seneca played a part in helping to make sure these events happened, thus bringing more rebel sympathizers into the victor's circle?

wow fire is catching

I feel like Seneca was indeed a rebel and was part of plan. However, putting that into perspective, we also have to realize that that could be the reason he was replaced with another rebel, Plutarch Heavensbee. So it would make classical sense for Seneca to be a rebel.

I think that Seneca listened to what Snow said about hope, and probably took it to another level by changing the rules, right after Katniss lost Rue.

Snow might have felt the need to explain the reason for the games to Crane because, like most Capitol people, Crane might have been just mindlessly going along with them, as they've been a thing for all his life. Of course, he wouldn't have been AS mindless as your typical Captiol citizen, but not questioning enough to realize the main reason for the games.

The Rebels could have originally planned to start the rebellion as Seneca Crane playing the role Plutarch played in the rebel plan but Seneca Crane was killed by President Snow before they could put their plan in action. They then replaced him with Plutarch so the plan could still take place.

Seneca is a rebel because he flowed haymitch idea and save both Katniss and peeta

its actually impossible and possible at the same time since he is already a gamemaker of multiple games in the hunger games and was executed since snow saw a glimpse of hope from the district people due to seneca negligence for having 2 victors and breaking the rules

You’re a very nice person, always replying to basically every comment, and reacting to everything. (i know ive said this before but I just find you so amazing)

There's a huge window in the berry room............ I know it's probably not an option but still

He was a rebel. It all makes since.

I believe Seneca was on the same page as Snow but began to see the bad side of things, which causes him to disagree with Snow. He was Head Gamemaker turned rebel, unlike Plutarch, who had been in on the rebels plan before he became head gamemaker

I would say he isn’t a rebel but he definitely has some resentment towards snow since he probably blames him for his family members death.

Wow thank you for explaining this I was very confused about the whole Seneca situation x

His voice is so nice I don’t know why 🤷🏽‍♀️

Great video and I love that you change your lip color for every video like Caesar with his hair!

This argument, out of all the ones I've seen actually, does make sense. I always wondered why a game maker would even allow a mentor to even talk to him. It's a conflict of interest. Besides, Seneca Crane has had a few years of experience. To be a game maker, the candidate handpicked, and with Snow in office, you would think he would be more selective given his own history. But that question we will most likely never know just like the other million dollar question that we would have to ask Suzanne Collins. That being.. What relation does Lucy Grey have with Katniss? And more importantly, what happened to her? Or why did she have to kill Prim?

Oh totally a rebel.

HI I REALLY LOVE YOUR VIDEOS THEY ARE SO ENTERTAINING. I hope you are staying and safe and still being a wonderful person. God bless 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

Never thought of him being rebel, but I like the Idea so much. It would be great to have more people from capitol itself being rebels.

Awesome video! I think that's a very interesting theorie. Hey, I have a question. Could you maybe do a video about the ship Clato (Clove and Cato from the first part of the hunger games 😁) ? Like, what you think about it, if you think it's real... This stuff. Have a nice day, love ya 😘❤️

I don’t believe he’s a rebel that was just put in the movies so that we can see some of the behind the scenes on the decision possibly why they made the rule change in the books the reason why they made the rule change supposedly is to make the grandest most epic showdown in hunger games history Peeta versus Katniss and it was a very epic showdown but they called their bluff Katniss and Peeta decided either you were going to let both of us win or nobody wins and then you’ll be in big trouble

I'm not sure a proper rebel. But the bit on him hanging himself instead of eating the poison berries is interesting.

I'm still sad that Seneca crane died 😭 his game is more interesting than Plutarch's.

I don't think Snow would choose someone dumb as a Head Gamemaker and keep him there for several years.

Is it just me is is seneca crane one of my favourite characters? :)

I didn’t realize he died until I watched them when I was older

plutarch a rebel mean while when peeta hit the forcefield plitarxh - prepare the cannon

Seneca Crane is definitely a rebel,working with haymitch,cinna,district13 and maybe plutarch

This is my favourite video of yours

I think he was a rebellious and cool gamemaker!

Weird question: But what would happen if a head gamemaker didn’t make the games brutal enough? No deadly animals, oxygen drop or toxic in the air, blood rain etc.

The thing is, they're wasn't a rebel plan until after the 74th Hunger Games. So Haymitch and Seneca can't be talking about a rebel plan because there isn't one.

I think he was. Johanna was there when seneca was in his first year (possible leader) Katniss and Peeta ( obviously) And the other two years it’s possible not a career trying to find a big ralling point

I recently realized that I dressed like Seneca. Not the worst.

I have one question: why do you say happy bubbles ps I like that saying I just wonder what it means?

I wanted him to survive longer

i loved this theory

If Katniss would've seen this video she would've probably regreted the fact that she hanged him (A dummy she painted looking like him)in Catching fire :))

I always asked myself if the gamemaker didnt stopped Peeta and Katniss from eating what would happen? It seems to me or i think that Katniss would have waited until Peeta had eaten the beeries and she would have just pretend to do so until he was dead.

Published on my birthday!! Not that it matters, but cool😊

I think he was. I think he gave Katniss an 11 so she could get sponsors. Love Senecas Beird too!

the reason senica crane did the rule change is because haymitch convinced him to so katniss and peet’s could win

He only let 2 people win cause if he didnt there wouldn't be anyone to win not cause hes a rebble

I wished there were more scenes with him.

well considering the fact that all the video is based on one scene from the movie, not the book I am not convinced that Seneca Crane was a rebel I do think he was not a very smart man to A. be one B. plot and decieve in order to hide the fact that he is one. I do think that he was an all-in game maker therefore let the public opinion and rating lead his way and decisions making after all the game maker can change the rules to their favor considering the rating it did happen in the first years of the hunger games (we see a lot of changes in "the ballad of songbirds and snakes" which set in the 10th year of the hunger games and after the book probably in the years 11-20 many more changes have been made in the help of Snow himself) I think that Sanka made thous decisions not thinking what his actions would do the country or to him, after all, he was hanged by the capitol for this decision at the end.

People always say I’m weird for liking him smh

I don’t think he was a rebel, but I do think he was disdained by the capital and how they handled things, so he displayed his own personal insurgence.

Are scenes from the films really considered canon at all?

I love Seneca Crane cuz hes awesome! :)

I love the lion king toy behind you

Just feedback, keep taking but keep the clips without audio as a background. If the clip has audio, keep it single without background noise. Love your vids tho

What lipstick is that? It’s so cute.

I feel like Capitol citizens didn’t really have much incentive to join or support the rebel movement. Sure, many of them may have developed empathy for the districts and the tributes, some may have even opposed the Games, but in the current state of things, they had it made. Living in a world of luxury, abundance, and excess. And just like the career districts, they weren’t raised to know any different and bought into the narrative that the Games were a symbol of honor and redemption, rather than the brutal murder of 23 children.

i love your colourful lipstick

A rebel.

I always felt like he was decent

loved your video analysis. but im obssessed with your lip colour

I don’t think he was, just made a deadly mistake. Not blowing up either peeta or katniss during the berry scene

wow, a rebel more interested in a pig than his symbol of rebellion.

Remember, all these little conversations we see between Seneca and Haymitch and Seneca and Snow weren’t in the books. They add a lot of interesting things to the film, but they aren’t canon. Unless the author wrote them or gave her approval. But the way you presented this does look like Seneca could have had some rebel sympathies.

no.

I've always wondered similar things about him, and always been torn as to whether or not to like his character 😂I mean, he is the reason both Katniss and Peeta are still alive

Is the pop toy behind you Effie trinket

I liked Crane

Is there a limit of how many years a head gamemaker can keep that role? Like Ceaser said Seneca’s been doing that role for 3 years, what happened to the others before him ? Do they get fired or killed or does a normal gamemaker work their way up to become head gamemaker as you wold with a normal job and get promoted?

I feel like it would make sense that he was a rebel because when Plutarch saves katniss and finnicks and beetee he said to Katniss that she's was doing the right thing from the beginning like that and since crane was head gamemaster he could of rigged the game knowing that katniss will volunteer for prim seeing as they think she has potential then he would of purposely change the rules with 2 victors and then when he changed the rule back he knew that katniss will be out but when she threatened to do double suicide he was supposed to blow her up but he didn't knowing that she will be the Face of the rebellion which then led to his death

Did you read the books because they only did the 2 victor thing for the extra entertainment and it was always a plan for Seneca to remove the change at the end.

I Always thought that Seneca Crane did from eating ghe nigthlock berries. When Plutarch tells Katniss that Seneca stopped breathing i thought it was meant as a Metapher for dying. Is there any other profe that we can know he actually hanged himself?

I think he liked the hunger games, or broader the idea of entertainment, but he didn’t like snow, a bit of a grey character

I don’t think Crane was a rebel. I think growing up in the Capitol he aspired to GameMaker for status. I think the rule change was to milk the star crossed lovers angle. I think he wanted record viewership for his games. I think his intention was always to have Peeta and Katniss decide who was going to kill the other for a climactic ending. I think when they decided on the double suicide he panicked. I think he thought if they both died, people would hate his game. The movie shows him at odds with Snow but there is no way to know that from the books. BTW, StoryDiver I love your channel! I obsess over books I’ve read and the characters never die for me, I feel like you’re the same.

IMO, I don't think he was a rebel. At least, I don't believe that his character was written with the intention of him being one in the books. It's very possible he is in the movies, especially since he is much more present in the movies than the source material, and all of the scenes of what's happening outside the arena during the games only exist in the film adaptation. This is how I read him: he's a capitol citizen, and likely from a very prominent family. He's had gamemaker, but he's still fairly young, but that's not unusual because most (if not all) high ranking capitol citizens got to be where they are because of nepotism. He obviously understands the games very well, but not necessarily the deeper meaning behind them. It's reasonable that he would have never thought too deeply about the hunger games beyond the spectacle and pageantry. none of the capital citizens do, and this is a point that's mentioned repeatedly in all the books. Because they're the elite 1%, they grow up in a system that puts them at the top, so why question it? He grew up watching the games, and is therefore completely desensitized. when he became head gamemaker, he wasn't thinking about how the games are a psychological tool of oppression, he was thinking of making the games as big of a spectacle as he could, per his job title. I think when the star-crossed lovers from district 12 became hugely popular, he thought making the first rule change would just increase the spectacle, raise the stakes, without even considering the bigger picture. after the rule change is announced is when we get the first scene of him and Snow. I believe this is because he never told the president his plan and just did it, not realizing that it might not be a good idea. he never asked permission because he never imagined creating a bigger spectacle could be something Snow would be unhappy with, but by then it was too late. the rest was damage control, which ultimately failed. i think it's a cool idea, but I don't think he's a rebel.

I never thought he was a rebel... just a little slow, too much of a sook

I wouldn't be surprised if he was a rebel because I feel like letting two tributes win isn't a mistake a head gamemaker just makes. There must be protocols for such an occasion.

Actually the 74th rule change was not the first it was actually the third so the hunger games were initially meant to be public in the Capitol like the games would be hosted in a arena more like a Roman Amphitheater and high ranking and very rich Capitol citizens would be able to attend inside the arena in the seats that are above the actual stone arena than this "Public" rule was revoked and was changed to be recorded live on TV than there were a few years where the President and their family would have a special place that would be heavily and by heavily I mean KICK ASS *HEAVILY* because with the "public" rule you can kinda see how it gave the tributes an unfair advantage than after the Tenth hunger games when the Amphitheater was bombed and destroyed they changed another rule you can kinda figure out what that rule was an arena that changed every year

And remember in the first movie some one says Katniss was 2 meter away from the nearest tribute he then said that they should turn her around like he was trying to keep her alive