@@Mythical_Jelly0 yes bro I am agree with you He used a color layer and low it's opacity and unsaturated it and increase sharpness And last rendered in high bit rate
@ladymindpalace7787 it's clear somebody here doesn't stufy literature, it's not that hard to get attached to a fictional character otherwise we wouldn't still be learing about Romeo and Juliette. You're right that guy is a type
@@yaboizero.thats the point though its not about that, its about Ellie learning that revenge is meaningless and that despite finally being able to kill Abby after so long, she just didnt care about it anymore
@@miragemain105which is shit cus it makes the play feel like we fucked around and played a stealth ammo management Sim for 8 hours for no resolution at all and a shitty ending cutscene
It wouldn’t. Having Joel visit ellie on hallucinations would’ve completely gone against everything the game is trying to tell you about her mental state. She feels alone, she feels isolated and she is polarised by the fact she will never get to see Joel again, having her interact with him even in hallucinations would’ve completely undermined this
Exactly, and all them Abby fans are so mad when we are blaming her for his death. Like one thing it's killing anyone to protect your daughter like girl, and other thing is to get across half the country to take revenge in the most brutal way. I could never forgive that character for that...
@@mihaipostaru131right. and it was abby’s father who started this mess between Joel/ellie/abby in the first place. it the guy didn’t kidnap ellie, he wouldn’t have died, Joel wouldn’t have had to kill him (the doctor was abby’s dad) idk why abby did what she did. her father wanted to experiment on a child who he didn’t even have clarification would be able to save humanity bc Ellie was born after the outbreak, making her immune. there is no cure. What abby did was selfish, disgusting and absolutely insane.
Old Joel helping Ellie on some sort of revenge mission would've been such an incredible and complex game. Joel helping Ellie instead of the other way around. Two experienced killers. Man, we were robbed.
I feel like that would go against Ellie's character arc tho the whole point of the last of us 2 is that revenge doesn't bring you anything and I'm pretty sure Joel wouldn't have wanted Ellie to lose everything trying to avenge him
@privilegedkneecap4428 I agree, I replayed the game recently, and it's aged so well for me. This time around, I felt like Ellie was making a huge mistake taking revenge into her own hands. I still think Joel helping Ellie would've been a cool game, but at least they have a flashback encounter together. I hope tlou3 is a redemption story
I would have loved if Ellie had Joel hallucinations throughout the game. Great way of showing how he is forever a part of her and she could never leave him behind.
It would've been so perfect too. That's actually the route I thought they were gonna take with the first initial announcement trailer. When Ellie was playing the guitar and singing the song. It made sense😭
There was, pretty sure it was only for a single scene, but Ellie had nightmares of going into the basement and seeing Joel get whacked. tell me you didn't finish the game without telling me you didn't finish the game.
@@stankewrx not to mention the like 3 or 4 flashback missions where you're clearly with Joel. It's comparable to asking for more bread on your pb and J sandwich and less pb and J
Joel had no choice to kill the fire flies if his goal was to save ellie, Joel used up all his luck by protecting ellie, if you played the first game, Joel could have died many times in the first game if it wasn't for ellie saving him 3 times during that hunter that almost killed him, & during the hospital part when he fell & plunge himself, also Henry saved him from drowning, & ellie saved him again when he was trapped inside that bus flooded in water...so that's a total of 4 times almost died..like Joel himself said, his luck was going to eventually run out, & his last luck ran out when he went to go look for ellie.
@@Ambar42her father wasn’t innocent putting a little girl to sleep and killing her for a cure without her or her fathers consent , any dad would’ve done the same thing joel did
@@starchild6526 Right, Joel tried to save his daughter, Abby's dad tried to save the world. I'm not saying that Joel didn’t right from his perspective, but those are the facts.
@@Ambar42 but there is a clear right and wrong morally, abby’s dad knocked a guy out and took his daughter without consent and was about to kill her for his own goal, joel didn’t do anything like that, he went to get his daughter back and they held her hostage and wouldn’t give her back and was shooting at him so he defend himself killing them and getting ellie back, there’s a clear right and wrong
@@dededede9257the actual reason was because they rearranged the story structure after this trailer; originally you were to play as abbie fighting in the city, as her friends were one by one killed by an unknown person. Youd build (as a player) a liking and relationship with abbie and her friends, and then eventually the assailant would come for abbie (about a third the wzy through the game) and it would be revealed to be ellie killing them. (Until this point, you hadnt seen ellie or joel) From here you would switch to playing as ellie, youd kill abbies frienfs one by one, occasionally bumping into joel but being cold and distant towards him, and never actively engaging with him. Then youd have the fight with abbie, with abbie saying "we let you live, and you wasted it" which would then flash back to what we now know as the beginning of the game, with joel dying. That was supposed.to be the twist. All of the kidnapping of abbie and lev, ellie rewcuing them and letting them go was added much later. Also they moved joels death to the beginning of the game because they wanted player urgency as ellie to feel as angry and hurt as she was, which kinda worked i think. But still, id rather they have had the "joel is dead" twist midgame after building a relationship with abbie, would have really made the conflict more engaging i think
@@jx2_23 definitely, as a player I'd have been left far more conflicted because I'd have played as abbie until that point. I think the main reason for changing it is because players (for some reason) seems to think that Ellie and Joel *are* the last of us
Sometimes I wonder what the game would look like if Joel would try to earn Ellie’s forgiveness in a journey while seeing the damage he did as opposed to what happened to him in TLOU2.
Luckily everyone knows TLOU2 is not cannon and is a fan fiction created by Neil Druckman with his abnormal, androgynous, ugly manfaced buff woman fetish.
Spineless, boring, obvious continuation to the story that would run on nothing and end with nothing. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Joel killed innocent people and got what was coming. Thats the point.
As good as that sounds, I would’ve felt like I was playing the same story again. I appreciate the approach Naughty Dog took because it left an impression on me more than a “Ellie and Joel go on another adventure together” plot. I also truly believe Part II is only there to set up Part III, which odds are will be a redemption story for all the characters because that’s typically how trilogy’s go.
100%. That moment at the end salvaged a little of the pain I went through til then. Joel choking up as he says "I'd like that" made my 40 year old arse cry
@@YDHGaming I saw Neil Druckman say something about telling Tommy's story in TLOU 3 so maybe. Tbh I'd prefer it to be just about Ellie and maybe give her a happy ending. Seeing her broken, fatherless, missing fingers, etc was sad
@@enad6737think TLOU3 will bring very different energy, maybe Ellie learns how to seek forgiveness, maybe gives herself up in order for a cure to be made? Tommy on the other hand may become an antagonistic in the next game? Who knows
@@reesetetzlaff8186In all fairness Joel kinda did deserve it.... killed so many people... ruined the ONLY chance of a cure. And killed the person (Abby's father) the only person able too make it and made Abby go looking for revenge so technically if he just didn't kill her father none of this would've happened, meaning.... Joel had it coming it was a cycle, Abby goes for vengeance for her father and Elie goes for own vengeance for her basically father as well.
@@DW_Executioner except the point of the first game was that it was ambiguous if he could create a cure. Abby's father had tried and failed multiple times before, so there was no guarantee on a cure, and if anything, chopping up all these immune people sets us back from a cure. By your own argument, all of these people deserved death since they're all murderers.
"Joel was a wonderful father. He loved and protected Ellie like his own daughter. He did everything he could to keep her safe. joel is a complex and compelling character. He's not a perfect good guy, but he's a man worth loving. we all miss him
You just forgot the fact that Joel killed Abby's father and she was just a little girl, same as Ellie. We cannot simply love Joel by forgetting everything he did...
Joel gunned down so many people in that hospital. He probably would have killed Abbys father anyways since he was the one who was gonna kill Ellie and he would have kept looking for her. @@alphaxan8175
@@alphaxan8175yes because he would’ve done some serious damage with that scalpel lol. I don’t get why Joel wouldn’t just knock him out - you have the option to let the nurses live so it makes no sense.
I mean technically you’re right but he became a father figure to Ellie, taught her many things and picked up on some of his habits, Ellie was basically the second chance that Joel needed as to what being a father is since he lost his daughter in the first game
in a story where Ellie could have been seeking revenge for something that happened to Dina, having Joel appear despite their estranged relationship would’ve provoked some damn emotions
I feel like the revenge wouldn't have mattered as much then cause we didn't know Dina or cared about the events that led to her death Maybe tommy like I originally theorized but personally I prefer the story we got
@@xdarkwolf2255Rightly said TLOU2 is not for everyone...it's so strong and heart wrenching at the same time, it had a great msg in the end which majority did not understand. specially not for the ppl who are socially and emotionally week. But I still prefer Joel would have lived.
@@Fanthomas1742 Joel, Tommy, and Jesse all were all done dirty by the ridiculous roidhulk. I wish there was an option to leave her where she was at the end.
In a non-decision based game it is not up to us, the players, weather beloved characters die or not but it is up to us in a decision based game and like Arthur said in the passengers movie "your not where you want to be. You feel like you're supposed to be somewhere else. Well say you could snap your fingers and be wherever you wanted to be. I'd bet you'd still feel this way. not in the right place. the point is you can't get so hung up on where you'd rather be that you forget how to make the most of where you are. take a break from worrying about what you can't control, live a little".
@@JoshBonesJones I did enjoy the game ngl, the ending was horribly rushed but the combat and scavenging mechanics kept me sort of interested, a 7/10 game in my opinion.
@finnish_hunter the gameplay is flawless of course, i cant hate on that. Just as a hardcore fan of the first game immensely disappointed with the storyline and the pacing.
Shit that couldve been fire, then have joel die at the end as a consenquence of ellies thirst for revenge. That couldve been amazing and we would have lots more screen time between the two
@@poordude2175 ellie wouldve still been a playable character with the game focusing on her, joel would be a teamate and possibly be played once if ellie was in danger/critically injured
@TheHumbleWaffle That would have been epic. Imagine Joel going on one final rampage for Ellie's safety, all his skills maxed out, and maybe even a larger health pool, tanking everything from the Wolves and Scars.
Would’ve been interesting because Joel grew up a happy life lost and regained, Ellie grew up with nothing, gained and lost again. Her hallucinating would’ve been a good way of saying she’s more cooked than Joel instead of her being just as violent as he was
While that’s not healthy, I fucking get it. Humans can get so attached to fictional characters and I understand that Joel meant a lot to the fans. I hope you’re doing better now ❤
lol the only reason why they added Joel to the trailer is because SOOOOOO many ppl guessed the entire plot of Part 2 just by the teaser released 3 years before the game came out (Joel gets killed by fireflies, and Ellie avenges his death), so the next trailer was designed to imply that it wouldn't be Joel who died. Hell, 1 trailer implied Dina would be the one, and Joel will help Ellie avenge her. We were too smart for our own good 😢
@@Gojo-sm6xl most ppl were spoiled by the death, so they trashed the game out of context. I...mostly avoided spoilers at the time. All l knew was something bad happened to Joel, a new character was hated, and the game was being trashed. I honestly thought that maybe the new character convinced Ellie to kill Joel for lying to her in Part 1. At the time that's the only thing l thought could have gotten ppl to hate on such a beloved franchise.
@@Gojo-sm6xl I suggested that the game should have started us as Abby. I know it kinda does, since the opening combat tutorial is as her, but there's no story there. Nothing to connect to her emotionally. Remember how Part 1 started? With that epic escape as we play as Sarah? Imagine if we played as young Abby while her and her parents escape a Scars attack, and her mom ends up dying during it? This would have accomplished so many things. It would have gotten us to connect to her emotionally since we would have saw her deal with trauma early in her life. It would have shown us why she would later join the WLFs, since they hate Scars as much as she does. And it would have shown us why she's so protective of her Dad, since she was too young to protect her mom, and now because of Joel, history repeated itself. She failed to protect another parent, and it broke her mentally. We actually would have cared about her BEFORE she killed Joel, instead of the game trying to force us to afterwards. Hopefully the upcoming show adaption of Part 2 does something like that.
I had no clue so many other people played through this game like I did I actually enjoyed it but I do wish they had kept Joel around him and Ellie’s bond is what made this game so great
@@glennfordsolinap8606 Almost as if they wanted you to experience a monumental loss and express that this world is unforgiving despite who you are. The entire point is for you to feel so conflicted.
Now that I've seen this. This could have been a pretty cool spin if we went from flashbacks of younger Ellie and Joel together, to all of a sudden older Ellie starts having a mental breakdown and every time she was having an episode in a dangerous moment there was Joel "coming back from the dead" to be the calm in her head. Like imagine a scene where she starts to breakdown right before she goes looking for more WLFs that are on the other side of a destroyed wall and Joel comes crouching up next to her, says he will take care of it. Then you get to play as Joel for a moment, but once you leave the area it enters a cutscene where we find out it was actually Ellie the entire time.
Reminds me of Lee and clementine from the walking dead game, where clementine has encounters with lee in her own mind but at the age she is at that moment and him knowing exactly whats going on even though he is dead
Yeah me too. I’ve also never played the games, but I’ve seen the first little bit of a RU-vid walkthrough of TLOU Part 2, and spoiler, I actually cried when Joel died
@notyourbodypillowofficial in that case I would recommend watching a playthrough on YT. Both TLOU games are incredible, but part 2 is amazing (probably a controversial opinion but I stick by it).
This hits so much harder and would have been so much deeper. Joel was one of a kind the man a lot want to be yes he has issues but his loyalty knows no bounds and I think we have lost that
This is the kind of wish fulfillment people who grieve feel It made sense that Joel would let his guard down to save a girl of Ellie’s age It’s the closest a video game could get to us feeling the real loss of a loved one
@Silver-300 we really don't. This is a story based game series and this is the story its telling. You want Uncharted with the same person with no stakes. So go play that.
Would you as a player really cared about getting your revenge for Dina the way we all felt when getting our revenge for Joel like the devs wanted us to
@@FA_Machina that's why i felt like a silly joke 🤣. Also I thought maybe we were exploring more of Ellie and her trauma of losing beloved people, she lost Reilly in the past so I thought that background make her vebgeful?... I don't know I'm glad I was wrong 😂😂
@@strikebomber2944 but we didn’t have any real feel to get revenge for her or have anything to do because of her. yes she was the reason joel went all the way with ellie but that was how he felt, not me. maybe you felt differently im not sure
Joel is a great character he’s like a great father figure to Ellie his job was to smuggle her but he ended up loving here he’s a real misunderstood character
"I know you wish things were different I wish things were different... But they ain't" - Joel Miller Edit: yooooo 1k that's the best I've gotten thx Edit:2K!?!? how much do you like this comment?
@@ASIANMORTYWell, me and a Lot of people understood Abby's side, and also understood that there is no right side in this game. This requires a certain amount of maturity, so I already imagined that a lot of people would hate the game just because the beloved character died.
Yeah, they could've milked Joel and Ellie for every dollar, they chose to tell a story instead. Not the story a lot of people wanted, but at least it wasn't a soulless cash grab.
@buenosdias232 The writing was some of the best in video games. The sex scene wasn't that long, it was meant to be awkward, and the cheating had consequences. It also contrasts with Ellie's confession and sex scene with Dina, continuing the theme of her and Abby's story mirroring each other. I don't why you would choose that as an example of bad writing.
There's a big difference, which I'm sure we all understand, between wishing that something might happen, and what SHOULD happen, to make a story interesting, powerful and compelling. Good story telling isn't about wish fulfillment.
@@LogicWinsEventuallyBrother are you some kind of Santa Monica studio advocate? ;d Gow did win game of the year, but Rdr2 won best narrative, music and many more awards that same year. You guys argue about the best character development and story, well lemme tell you winning the best "NARRATIVE" means it's better story than the "Game of the year"... Gow is the better gameplay "game" for sure, Rdr2 is the better multimillion dollar "movie" though. Nothing beats Arthur Morgan as thats on another level, but yeah I'd definitely put Kratos second, above Joel as I didn't really connect that much with Joel in general, idk why. I find Ellie being a much more interesting character than Joel. Ellie is number 3 and Joel number 4, best video game characters of all time for me.
@@LogicWinsEventually I guess it's all a personal choice which one to like more.. Prove me wrong, but in the game awards 2018, both red dead and gow got the most nominations, total of 8 which is hands down the biggest amount of nominations for all years, 8 thats like all the categories pretty much ;d Then again from those 8 nominations gow won very few, only 2 or 3, one of them being of course the main one "goty" while red dead 2 classified as the game with MOST awards WON. Now explain me this, while "goty" is supposed to be the best of the best and indeed both games have the best music and best performing actors in the gaming industry, how come red dead 2 got MORE awards actually WON not just nominated, and those include best music and score, best audio design, and even though both Christopher Judge and Roger Clark did fantastic job, red dead 2's Roger Clark as Arthur Morgan WON the award for best performance of 2018, now what does that speak to you? Christopher Judge as Kratos won best performance too, but much later in 2022 when it wasn't rivaling Red Dead 2.....
Honestly, Naughty Dog flipped the bird to everyone with that Joel tease. We all theorized that Joel would die but putting him as a tease was just them trying to say, "see he's not gonna die". Personally I think it would have been interesting if Tommy got killed. You could pick anyone else but Tommy makes since for the rest of this idea. Joel, Ellie, and Tommy are on patrol when a horde of infected comes after them. They "happen" to run into Abby's group and they help each other get to safety. Abby and her friends are not Fireflies, they are a different group all together, people Tommy pissed of in the past before going to Jackson. They get to talking and start to bond with them until Abby sees the Tommy's Firefly pendant and realizes that its Tommy. That's when her and her crew leave and as Joel, Ellie, and Tommy sleep till morning they get jumped by Abby's crew. Ellie fights hard, even leaving a permanent scar on Abby but is subdued. Joel is punching people left and right but gets stabbed in the leg. Tommy fights as well but gets restrained by them. Abby comes over and starts beating him up and kills him mercilessly. Joel and Ellie see the who thing and scream. Ellie is both crying and angry. Joel starts screaming "I'm gonna kill you". That's when Abby and friends knock them out and leave them. Cut to black and the Title Card. The aftermath Ellie, Joel, Maria, and others are there at Tommy's funeral. Joel's knee was badly injured in the fight so he can't walk or run as good. Ellie talks with Joel about revenge and Joel knows the location of the group but he insists on going with her. Ellie refuses because of his knee but tells him that she's taking Dinna with her. They hug, and Ellie and Dinna are off. Everything plays out almost the same just Dinna is not pregnant but at one point the two are forced to split up and that's when Ellie almost gets caught but is saved as she realizes who it was. She asks, "What the hell are you doing here?" Joel responses "You think I'd let you do this on your own". I can't figure out how the rest would go but it was just a sper of the moment idea I have. Sorry for the EXTREMELY long comment.
Like I said, the idea just came to me. It could easily be changed to where Joel is killed, Tommy is injured, and Ellie goes for revenge then Tommy joins her despite his injury. I just wouldn't have had Abby be the daughter of the surgeon from the first game. Have her be part of a group Joel and Tommy crossed paths with in the past.
Or just leave it the way they made it lol it’s a perfect game even for me being a heavy fan of the first. Obviously it sold and people STILL talk about it so they did exactly what they meant to do. It’s meant to break us and hate the story of Abby, after 3 play throughs the only Abby part I dislike is the Owen aquarium shit and finding her dad with the zebra
Their relationship is plutonic beyond words. The flashes Ellie kept having of him, especially during the later stages of the game meant she started feeling guilty for treating him for something he really didn't deserve coz he was the most father figure to her above everything else and really loved her as his own. The guilt took her to a level she thought she'd never realize how much she missed and loved him for always being there for her since they had met. I'm sad there won't be a 3rd part coz this series deserves more
Joel was, and is, the reason that Ellie is who she is. She is nothing without him. She NEEDS him..the stability and the love , regardless of the circumstances or the world around them, and he deserved so much better than the BS that he got.
I still hope we get a hallusiation joel in pt3 Ellie going to see fireflies, and she has him by her side, we. as players will have some time to say goodbye, ellie will have time to let him go, maybe some notes written by him I just think thst it would be a beautiful end of the story. both of them going through america to fireflies again for the cure, because ellie has nothing to live for so it's the way to make her life matter, but just like joel she will find her reason, her family and she will understand him, why he did that, why he lied and she will be able to let him go and live even if he is dead
Here's an idea instead of Joel dying, tommy died, saying his name was Joel to save his brother and in the end Jole kills Abby but dies in the process knowing that he has avenged his brother
