7.2.4 is my system, Basx MC1. Fright night, the vampire is walking around on my roof. Jamangi, a hole opens in my ceiling, stuff falls out. I had a five channel Basix amp hooked up to my Denon, added a four channel for my Atmos when I got my MC1. About 2000 for my system, only channels I'm not using are "wide". Couldn't tell you how Emotiva sells a 13.2 channel proc for 999$, but I'm certainly not questioning it. Love your center, now I have to have one. Nice
@@usmankhalid990 I have four, two top front and two top rear. It's basically four Emotiva speakers I had laying around. Done on the cheap but it sounds great.
@usmankhalid990 I shared the location and angles of my height speakers in this video. Thanks for the question. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-qK-3ygCFw9g.htmlsi=24uD9WH5U2d-VUWN
THANK YOU! I have been arguing this point for a few years now. I am planning a dedicated theater now and going to go with 7.4.6. Just in my own listening tests between 5.1.2 and 5.1.4, and alternating between 4 tops and 4 heights (using my buddy's system) I came to the conclusion a couple of years ago that to get FULL ceiling coverage and soundstage would require at minimum, 6 channels on the ceiling as Front Height, Top-Middle and Rear Height. Absolutely NO ONE is talking about this except Technodad, who recently came to the same conclusion. Liked and subscribed and I will be checking out your other videos.
Thank you for the nice comment. I have known this for a couple years. My last theater was all MartinLogan. I had 4 MartinLogan Helos in-ceiling and ran the same type listening tests. Ended up adding 4 MartinLogan 4i’s for front and rear height. Used the two Helos for top middle even though they were forward of the listening position installed as top fronts. I got much better spatial audio that way compared to just the in-ceiling. Hell, even if you just do front and rear heights and not top middle you get a much better spread.
@@magnoliamo I feel that Front/Rear Heights, especially if you mount small bookshelf speakers up there, allows you to precisely aim the speakers to ensure that every seat is hit with on-axis sound. With in-ceiling speakers, most of them cant be aimed very well and you only get good sound in one or two seats. Best case scenario, just one row. It boggles my mind when I see professional installers setting up peoples theaters with horribly compromised seats in that way. Whats even the point of having multiple rows if the other rows cant fully participate in the experience?
Absolutely right in terms of Channa (AKA TechnoDad) being the lone voice of reason. My question is, say an individual has exceedingly short ceilings (I.e. approximately 7 feet), I tend to think the traditional/‘by the book’ setup (i.e. three sets of In-ceiling speakers (for a total of 6 speakers)) may be the right course of action?
@@ts6640 I would think with a lower ceiling, you would want more precisely aimed speakers because the ceiling height is not particularly conducive to maximize dispersion. My ceiling is about 7.5 feet in height and I have bookshelf speakers mounted and precisely aimed. Its the best my Atmos channels have sounded in this configuration.
We (or I) have been talking about it for years on AVS Forums. I used "Scatmos" (Center Channel Pro Logic Extraction using two receivers to extract a Top Middle without a .6 renderer) originally with Surround Height speakers (so Front Heights + Surround Heights + Rear Heights). I now have eight ceiling speakers (Heights + Tops) and also the Surround Heights above the side surrounds for Auro-3D (I've got 34 Auro-3D titles including some music titles like Mando Diao's Aelita) plus 11 ear-level speakers (Front Wides + 7.1 + Side Surround #2) with 3 rows of seating. More is better!
I'm currently using Yamaha a4a running on 5.2.2 setup. But 3-4 days ago I noticed Denon 6700h are on sale for 2100usd I think it's a good deal because I want to run 7.2.6 so So after that I did a lot of research about auro 3d because I never used before. And yeah... The speaker layout is pretty mess with my head because atmos and auro 3d is totally different layout. So I decided to buy more 4 speakers for the 2 front height/2 top middle/2 rear height And I denon just update the fw to make the top middle can be processing with auro 3d now. I think 2FH/2TM/2RH is gonna be the perfect setup now. I can't wait to finished my upgrade soon ✨
Very interesting video, thanks for sharing your honest opinion with us! Did you also take care of the 30 degrees elevation angle which auro-3d asks for? I am just about to install my first surround system. Supposed as a 5.1.4 with top heights and rears. But now I noticed I can not held the 30 degrees angle from auro due to my room conditions if I want to put them over my floor standing speakers.. I am thinking now to still place the top heights above the left / right channel but add the third layer with a Voice of God to compensate for the missing 30 degree angle of Auro. What u think could that work? 😊
ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-qK-3ygCFw9g.html I discuss the height channel angles in this video and provide the angles for my height speakers. If you do front heights above the front speakers and do side surrounds heights plus the VOG that is ideal auro-3D setup.
@@magnoliamo thank you so much, watching your other Videos now🤘 So you think it will work even if I have only a 15 degrees angle at my front heights + having the Voice of God in a 3rd layer?
Sure. Please checkout my home theater tour if you haven’t done so. Thanks for the comment. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-D2b7M_YeGQg.htmlsi=L53goYQhlNwB-hQ4
I actually have a 9.3.7 channel Yamaha Dolby Atmos speaker system with the Voice of God speaker in the middle of the ceiling. I’m hoping to expand that into a 32 channel speaker system in the future.😊
@@magnoliamo That’s in the near future MagnoliaMo, but what I really wanted to look into getting is the Storm Audio ISP Elite MKIII 32 Channel Surround Sound AV Processor because I think that their room correction software, DIRAC Live will be a little bit easier for me than the Trinnov Altitude 32 system. Because with the Trinnov, I would be lost on how to use their Linux software.
@@ChrisMaherJr-CarCreditNation Um, there isn’t much happening with the voice of god speaker because I’ve gone through 3 Denon receivers and one budget pre-pro from Summit Hi-Fi which is the Tonewinner AT-300 16-Channel Surround Sound AV Processor, which I’ve gave that to my mom for her budget Atmos setup and that was a little too bass-heavy.
Having the Marantz 8805 pre-pro, would you consider staying at 6 tops 7.2.6 (FR/RR heights with Top middles (now that it can also process Auro 3D using TM) or would you consider going 7.2.8 (FR/RR heights, CH, V.O.G., Top middles) to cover ALL audio formats. or go with 9.2.6 (FR/RR heights and TM)... lots of options.
I would much rather go with 9.2.6 because I believe front wides would add more value than having a top center or VOG. VOG and TC are more for Auro-3D and not much out there in terms of physical media here in US. Going in either direction requires the addition of another amp. So added cost is an issue. ROI is simply not there with expansion to 8 height channels or wide channels in addition to having 6 heights. The configuration that makes most sense is 9.2.4. No need to add an additional amp and you are expanding your base layer.
Setting up my own 7.1.6 setup. With 6 in ceilings... Looking at the AV8805a I have been tempted by the av10 but the money could be spent on something else in my case. Love the vids 👍
Thank you. 6 in-ceilings would be awesome. If I may suggest, go with top middle and front and rear heights instead. That configuration works best for all formats, Atmos, DTS-X, and Auro-3D
@@magnoliamo Thanks Mo, stay awesome. That's a good suggestion. I'm going to be using kefs all around Ci3160rl-thxs upfront x3 then ci200q R and S for the 6 celeing and the 4 surrounds. Kefs have an amazing dispersion so great for non ideal or dedicated rooms..
@@magnoliamo If using top middles, does that work for Auro 3D? If not, which speakers DO work in A3D ith a FR/RR heights and top middle set up. Would you prefer doing FR/RR Heights, CH and V.O.G., that way you can still use all 3 formats. tank you. Great content!!!
@@sergiobarrena6626 with the latest firmware update on the Marantz 8805A, you can use top middles with the front and rear heights on auro-3D and DTSX. Yay! I don’t have any experience with center height and voice of God to tell you if Dolby Atmos would work with that alignment. I am assuming it would.
I argued that on AVS Forums for years. People just told Heights suck. Tops are so limiting by comparison. I'm now moving to Heights + Tops (plus Surround Height above sides for Auro-3D which also uses Tops for 4 channel mono VOG). That gives even more precision for more seats, particularly with multiple rows.
They told you that because that is correct. Atmos wad not designed with a heights conifg so any atmos movie is going to be handicapped with that configuration And don't even get me started with the nonsense of some people using aurod3d for atmos movies. You need to set up atmos properly and that is the issue. A lot of people don't understand the proper angles
Woah... I just noticed that he runs his setup opposite of what most people do. The room is much wider from side to side than it is from front to back. To me that changes everything when it comes to his preference for heights instead of tops because the angle is much higher from his MLP to the heights than it would be if he configured the speakers in the room the way most people do it.
Thanks for the comment. I used audioadvise.com’s online tool to determine the distances of the top front/rear. The angles are within the Dolby recommended ranges. I am not following the “angle is much higher from his MLP” statement. Are you able to elaborate on this please. Also whether I go the longer way or the shorter way will determine the appropriate angles based on my MLP position, wouldn’t you agree? If so neither would lead to extreme angles of done correctly.
@@magnoliamo What I meant by "angle is much higher from his MLP" is that since your seating is closer to the front wall and back wall with how it's configured. In my room the front wall and back wall are pretty far from each other. I'm not knocking it, I like how it looks the way you have it.
Doesn't ceiling height play a huge role here? I have ceilings that are just under 8 feet, so to me it would make sense that putting speakers in the traditional spots for "heights" would put them at much too low of an angle for my seats. I would think the results would be not enough separation between the L/R speakers and the front heights and not enough separation between the rear surrounds and the rear heights. Solution would be to move "heights" a few feet out in the room but not as far as people put their tops... correct?
Oh i see what you mean. Yes, if the ceiling height is under 8 feet then heights would be lower and there wouldn’t be enough separation between your bed layer speakers and heights. But even then you can get around it by not angling the height speakers towards your MLP. As a rule height speakers shouldn’t be angled towards the MLP. That’s my opinion. But i love this dialogue.
Hey Mo, I’m stuck with 4 channels for atmos due to budget so just wondering, do you think I should do front height and top middle as my 4 speakers or front heights and rear heights? Would really appreciate your input, thanks!!
Thanks for the question. I would do front and rear heights. There are no receivers that will support front height and top middle. If you can only have top middle instead of rear height then I will only do top middle. You can try upfiring Dolby enabled for rear heights if configuration is an issue. Hope that helps.
I liked your home theater setup. I have Denon 6700h and I used the setup for Dolby Atmos with 11.2 speakers. I have 4 ceiling speakers and the front floor stand speakers have built-in Dolby Atmos. How I can get auro 3d with this setup. Moreover the receiver have the option to add additional two more speakers with external amp. Do you know how to set up with external amp and which is the best compatible external amp with denon avr 6700h.
Thanks for the comment. You can use the pre out labeled height3/front wide on the 6700 to get 7.2.6. You would connect your top rear into the pre out. Move your Dolby Atmos enabled front speakers to surround and use the Dolby speaker on that speaker as your side Dolby upfiring speaker. Buy an Emotiva BasX stereo amp to connect the pre outs and the side Dolby speakers to. This will give you Atmos, DTSX, and Auro-3D. Conversely, you can switch to front Dolby upfiring and use the top rear as is. That will also give Atmos, DTSX, and Auro-3D with just 4 height speakers. Key is to use your front Dolby enabled speakers in your setup.
Actually I have another doubt about height speakers. I have 4 ceiling speakers, that’s Dolby Atmos enabled and two up firing speakers on front floor stand left and right. Can I use ceiling speakers as a height speaker.
@@jayankoshy5145 well, i don’t recommend configuring in-ceiling speakers as front and rear height. The only thing you can do is move the up-firing speakers to the side surround location and use as tip middle or connect them as front Dolby with your rear in ceiling as top rear
I have three speakers available to use above the 7 base layer…. How would you recommend I place three speakers? 🤔 Should I raise my rears, not all the way to the top but maybe to create 5.1 with two higher rears (giving 7) and two speakers on the ceiling? (I have nine available speakers plus centre to place overall)
Are the speakers on-wall speakers or in-ceiling. Assuming they are on-wall. I do recommend 4 height speakers. You can do front and rear heights. I prefer 5.1.4 over 7.1.2. Now, if you want to stay with 7 bed layer speakers and if you only have on-wall speakers then all you can do is two front heights and a center height.
Given a 7.1.4 with front/read heights, Is there a difference between top middle and surround height? ie in ceiling above MLP vs on wall above surrounds?
Good question. If I could I would have done surround heights vs top middle. Surround heights works better with auto-3D and DTSX. You would need to do voice of God with that though.
Yes, sorry about that. I have don’t make the video that way anymore. Still trying to learn this RU-vid creator business. I do have a Sony ZV-1F that I use now and proper video editing software. That video was made on my iPhone 13 Pro Max. Don’t use that anymore. Love the feedback!
I leave the Auro-3D at its default setting for movies and music. I know you can add more immersion but it sounds over the top to me. That’s just me. I just enjoy it as it is. You should experiment and decide what settings work best for you.
Hi ,I need your valuable suggestion on my Denon 4700H amplifier.I would like to update my Denon 4700H as i heard that there are some new features available in the updation.My query is 1)Is it safe to do firmware updation 2)If in case the power went off in between the updation.Will it wont work again 3)what precaution i must take if in case i am doing it.
Firmware updates are safe. You should always update the firmware. They tell you not unplug the power during updates. You will need to check with Denon customer service but I would say power loss is a risky proposition during a firmware update. Just make sure you don’t unplug the receiver during the update. It’s a simply process.
I agree! I do prefer top middles in addition to front and rear heights. 7.2.6. Some people argue that top middles are not necessary. I say try it and you will never go back.
Do you have a video where you show exactly where each height speaker is? When I see your configuration is hard to tell what is what..theres speakers everywhere. I can't tell where your middle height speakers are. Thanks
Thank you for the question. The middle speakers are above the main listening position per Dolby’s specs. I have two front heights and two rear heights in addition to the top middles. I will do a video soon that will show where all the speakers in relation to the listening position with exact distances. I used audioadvice.com’s free interactive 3D Home Theater Design tool to map out the locations of all the speakers.
@@BobbyJ337 thank you. The audio advise tool takes the guessing and use of angles out of the equation. It gives you straight distances to the main position based on Dolby’s recommended angles
@MagnoliaMo I honestly thought I wouldn't heat any chan separation since my livinroom is only 18x14.5 with 15 speakers. But boy was I wrong. With atmos & dts every speaker does its job. My Anthem makes sounds so clear. I literally have to rewatch every movie again since I've calibrated this 9.2.6.
@@josealfredfernandes Having the wides fills the gaps for people who are not sitting in the primary listening position. For example If you are sitting in the left or right listening positions, the delay when the sound pans from your center to left and to the sides surrounds is different than the primary position. I think with both the wides and the extra heights you are trying to get a more balanced and immersive sound.
The only receiver that will do 7.1.6 without the need for additional amps is the Denon x8500HA. Denon x6700H will do 13.2 but you need an additional stereo amp. Obviously the A1H as well will support full 15.4 channels.
I finally upgraded to the 6700. I updated the firmware but still struggling trying to figure out how to enable Dts X Pro. I played both atmos and native dts x content, still don’t see it. Thoughts?
Congrats on the upgrade. You don’t see the audio format as DTSx Pro. Prior to the DTSx Pro update if you had 6 height speakers the top middle would not be used/lit up. With DTSx Pro the processor scales to all height speakers. That’s my understanding. The processor will still DTSX as the surround format.
@@magnoliamo I see. I am used to being able to switch formats on the app and couldn’t find it for instance like when you ever want to select neural X or Auro 3-D. So in the case of DTS X pro, it’s not something I can select manually?
@xanderx9988 DTS:X PRO is only relevant if you are using more than 11 channels/speakers (no subs). What DTS:X Pro does is expand it to more than 11 speakers. There is no way to verify as the audio does not present a flag for DTS:X Pro. Only way to validate is to configure your AVR for more than 11 speakers, if it supports more than 11 channels, and see if they ALL make sound when decoding a DTS:X soundtrack or upmixing using DTS Neural:X. That was my point earlier. In my 7.2.6 setup top middle speakers would not be lit up on the app and would not play any sound with DTSX. Once I got the update on my AV8805 and then with my AV8805A top middles are used and play discrete sound as in the movie The Equalizer 3.
Great Video👍.Can you help me out with my query.I am having denon 4700H amplifier with auro 3d setup in 7.6.3 mode with additional 4 channel external amplifier. My concern is that im not getting loud sound from my Height speakers.Speakers are working but its not reaching my listening position. Below mentioned are my setups Front klipsch 620f..Large.. Crossover 80hz Centre kef q650..large.. 80hz Surround..Small..80hz Height.. Small..110hz Subwoofer.. Lfe+main.. 120hz Is this setting ok?
Thanks for the question. What brand and model are your height speakers. Are you running only 3 height speakers? Are the height speakers connected to the external amp or to the 4700H? I would set all speakers to small and set the crossover at 80Hz. Next you should use an SPL meter to validate the Audyssey channel levels? If not correct you will need to rerun Audyssey.
@@magnoliamo My height speaker is of q accoustics brand. 6 height speaker i have. Front 2(above screen)..middle 2(above first row)..and rear 2(above second row).
Ok. If you have verified the speaker trims using an SPL meter and the speaker trims for your height speakers are matched with the rest of the speakers then all is good. You can also boast the height speaker levels, although I don’t like to do that nor do I recommend doing that. Some movies don’t have much going on in the heights when it comes to Dolby Atmos. You actually get more in the heights when up-mixing standard 5.1 or 7.1 soundtracks using Dolby or DTS up-mixing. You can disconnect all the bed layer speakers and only listen to the heights to see if there is indeed sound playing in the height speakers.
I’m asking for 6. I have a Yamaha Rx-A8A and have 4 set up. I’m at 7.2.4 which is maxed out. How do I get 2 more speakers in there with no open amps and can the processor handle them. Thank you for your very informative video.
@mikemalter The RX-8A does not have the option to expand beyond 4 height channels unfortunately. I apologize. It’s a very nice receiver though. Do you have the heights setup as front and rear heights? Or are you using the top front and top rear in-ceiling or on-ceiling configuration?
The Dolby specs for Atmos surround speakers in the ceiling are the specs used by the Studios, albeit the Dolby Studio Atmos Specs require the overheads to be much much closer than the 'home' specs. Nevertheless, the overheads are placed to the listener closer than the Auro-3D specs. Basically in the video, you are advocating that you find the Auro-3D speaker arrangement better than the Dolby Atmos arrangement. The Auro 3D speakers are further away from you. The studio engineers at Dolby when mixing material have to equalize their sound so that it follows Dolby Specs and the distance to the listening position(s). If you go down the Auro-3D speaker placement, then the volume that it has been mixed in will be lower as the distance is further away. You would then have to recalibrate the speakers (all of them not just the overheads) so that all the speakers were equalized volume-wise as per the original film mix. Sure you can play about with speaker placement and settings, but the more you do that the further away you are getting from the original audio mix and intent from the filmmaker. I agree with you that the way Dolby has set their stall is biting their behind, as the Auro 3D speaker placement makes more sense. They have created their design solution and that's why they are stuck with it. However, the MIX ENGINEER still has to work along the DOLBY ATMOS specs and unless you want to up-mix everything into Auro 3D, then you are stuck with Dolby Specs too (if you want to listen to the material as it was originally mixed). To maybe put it in perspective, you can count on one hand the number of Atmos movies that have been mixed properly and even has any sound emanating from them. Most films barely use the overheads and the ones that do, use them sparingly. Your money your choice.
Agree that the whole Atmos format has become watered down. Thank you for the detailed comment. I am using the 9.1.6 mounted/overhead speaker setup on the Dolby.com/about/support/guide/speaker-setup-guides/9.1.6-mounted-overhead-speakers-setup-guide/ without the wides. So, per Dolby you can setup your system this way. I am not advocating using the auro-3D layout. The Marantz manual and Dolby’s site both have this as a layout. The receiver/processor then uses the location, distances, etc to apply room eq while appropriately setting the volume levels. I don’t touch boost the height channels. Just make sure they are at the same db levels as the rest of the speakers. This whole topic needs a panel discussion in my opinion.
Not a problem. Denon and Marantz receivers and many higher end processors can support multiple calibration profiles. I am designing my theater for all three formats inluding Auro3D and I will be setting up two different profiles...one for Atmos mixes with Top-middle and one for Auro3D config with Voice of God channel.
The Dolby Atmos Home specs for 7.1.6 and 11.1.8 have the Heights at 20-45 degrees (20 ideal) and either Top Middle at 75-105 (90 ideal) and with Tops 45-55 degrees. I get the feeling most people have NEVER looked at their actual home, studio and cinema setup PDF files. The actual renderer couldn't care less about your angles. It measures by equal distance between speaker sets. If you do an allocentric (room based) layout instead of an egocentric one (main listening position based), you actually space the speakers equally across the room as that's how the renderer actually sees the layout. Dolby provides angles for convenience in egocentric setups. I have 20+45+135+160 (Heights + Tops) here with 11 speakers at ear level (FW + 7.1 + SS#2) plus Surround Heights for Auro-3D/DTS usage. The floor and ceiling layers have total room coverage.
