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What Do Different Fork Offsets Feel Like? Getting experiMENTAL With the ENVE MTN Fork

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Fork offset is a confusing and misunderstood topic for a lot of riders. In today's video, I take the same exact bike on two back to back runs with different fork offsets and describe the difference in ride feel. Fortunately, the ENVE MTN fork has the ability to swap offset settings in about 5 minutes. Rather than focus on what's happening from a theoretical and geometry standpoint, I decided to just focus on feel. What does it feel like to ride a short offset fork vs a long offset fork? Learn more about this fork here: bit.ly/3gcUby6
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#enve #rigidfork #forkoffset

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28 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 160

@No-ti2sn 3 года назад

“This rigid fork forces me to slow down and stop and smell the roses a little more.” Proceeds to plow through rock garden

@phrides 3 года назад

Awesome! The video I didn't know I needed. Also, you said, "For no extra money" and "your ENVE fork" in the same sentence, which is pure gold.

@RideYearRound 3 года назад

Rigid forks are SO fun on smooth and flowy trails. They're kind of fun in chunky stuff, but probably in the same way it's fun for a bull rider trying to hang on.

@joemader2535 Год назад

when i'm throwing a rigid bike through chunk, those behind me often compare it to saddling a bucking bronco :-p

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Do you need help deciding which bike to purchase next? I offer a one-on-one bike consultation service through patreon. It's how I put food on the table for my family, and how I'm able to provide custom bike advice for my vieewrs. Become a patron today for access: sign up for the monthly bike consultation tier, and cancel at any time. Most people sign up for a month or two, and we work together to discuss their needs, riding style, etc. to narrow down the list of all the great hardtails out there. When they get the info they need and they no longer have any questions, they cancel. Become a patron today: patreon.com/hardtailparty. Also, make sure you check out my links in the description above for coupon codes and discounts to some of my partners. A lot of people like to talk about what fork offset does in theory, and how it SHOULD affect your ride. Today I decided to just focus on how it felt. I was surprised at what a difference it makes. I have friends who love short offset, and friends who hate it. It's noticeable enough, that if someone swapped it on me when I wasn't looking, I'd notice it within the first 30 seconds. Here's how I describe it: short offset feels like heavier steering to me, less likely to get knocked offnline. Longer offset feels like lighter steering, that changes direction easily. Have you experimented with fork offsets? What have you learned from trying different offsets? The best way I have to describe it is that short offset feels like a heavier steering, less likely to change direction on a bump, while longer offset is lighter feeling in the steering.

@danwebber9494 3 года назад

Cool review. It’s all about fork trail. Slacker head angles, big wheels and less offset all increase trail. Fun with geometry!

@daviddauza 3 года назад

thanks for your comment about counter-steering & balancing with the core, that communicated the difference in feel of the shorter offset (at least to me)

@johnnydoe66 3 года назад

I have watched alot of bike fit or geometry videos over the last 3 yrs. It's definitely made me experiment with different setups on all my bikes, road and Mtn, to get the fit and feel I like and want. I went as far as drawing up overlays of different bike geometries to compare Mtn bikes when I was shopping for my hardtail. I still don't understand every nuance of bike geometry, but I am getting there.

@johnnykramolis7469 3 года назад

Amazing how only one parametr changes the bike feel. Great experiment! Also I remeber how tricky it was ride over free stones on my first MTB bike, steel heavy frame with rigit fork. And you shredded with the shorter offset almost like you ride with suspension. Cool.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

I know! The difference was more noticeable than I assumed it would have been. I wasn't sure if I'd feel it with a rigid fork, but I definitely did

@MrFroggy29 3 года назад

Hello from France ;) Since 3 years , i ride a full rigid Mtb, Commencal aluminium frame and Kona P2 fork, with 1x10 (11-42 gear), mavic crossride wheel in 26 inch. I love my bike. Very light, strong, nervous, versatile.

@wbarns15 Год назад

I’m way late to this video and someone might have already said it but it seems like you predicted the Canyon KIS system when discussing steering damping!

@hardtailparty Год назад

I'd sure like to try it sometime.

@adambale2754 3 года назад

Very interesting experiment! I doubt many have done back to back offset tests like you have, so that was great insight. When short offset forks first came out, I would have told you it was counterintuitive to use them on slack head angles just from the math alone. The trail measurement gets higher with slackening the head angle and the short offset increases it even more. Maybe we want as much stability as we get or maybe these things just can't be boiled down to just math and you have to experiment to feel it yourself. Who knows what other geometry and fit-related things we accept as gospel right now should be and will be challenged in the near future. Great video!

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Well said. A lot of people look at the math and come up with their own conclusions before trying it out. I think it's important to understand what's going on, but nothing beats seat time and real-world experience. One thing is for sure though, you definitely have to change your riding technique to learn to ride a shorter offset fork. But once you do... it's bliss (for me at least).

@tobins6800 3 года назад

You're helping me to confirm a thought I have. The more comfortable one is, the more control you have and speed you will carry. This is based off of saddle reviews, tire pressures, and frame materials.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Interesting theory. Yes, comfort (and mental confidence) go a long way, but I still think proper geo is even more important.

@schlicss 3 года назад

I was wishing for this video a couple months ago! Went from 51 to 44 on my chameleon. Much better! Glad I went for the shorter. Also a way to future-proof your fork.

@mikecoulter5243 3 года назад

Is your Chameleon a 29er? I have a 29 AL with a 51mm Recon RL and I'm fork shopping. Really thinking I want/need the Fox 34 140mm in 44mm offset, vs the 51mm offering. Curious if yours was a 29er? I think SC ships all 27.5 with 44mm forks but just wanted to make sure. Thanks

@stephendavies6325 Год назад

Dead useful comparison. I think you nailed the differences. I have a 130mm travel 51mm offset fork on a 69 degree head angle Cannondale trigger 29er and a 150mm travel 44mm offset fork on a 65.6 Whyte S150. When you rid no handed the Whyte is much easier to keep online even though it is slacker and you'd expect more flip flop. I think the offset compensates for this. When you said 66 degree is the threshold I'd agree. Below 66 degree head angle then 44mm offset above 68 degree 51mm would be more suitable 66-68 degree the difference is based on preference. I've recently purchased a 160mm fork with 51mm offset and will try this on the Whyte - It'll be interesting to see the difference.

@juansanchez-tr1dq 3 года назад

I enjoyed the motorcycle comparison with the steering damper and counter steering. It's something some might relate to, keep up the great work!

@A.T.TrailWorks 3 года назад

I would put this video up there with Rich and Rob Drew's Q & A on suspension set up. Super helpful at explaining the differences in layman's terms. Every MTB riders should watch this once they've been bitten by the MTB bug. The offset of the fork is often overlooked. I'm glad you and ENVE did this on a rigid fork so that you could feel the difference without any other external factors. A pretty cool feature that will probably be more common in the future.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Thank you for the kind words. Rob and rich are good friends. I agree, it was a huge advantage being able to do this rigid, on the same bike, same trail, same day back to back.

@russelrivera5044 2 года назад

I learn something new from your videos every time! I never imagined that I would ever notice a difference between 5 or 10 millimeters on my chain stays until subscribing, and really putting the mileage in. Will definitely contact you about consultation when I’m in the market for a new bike!

@pseudomugilidae5897 3 года назад

This was a really interesting and informative video thinking about my own rigid singlespeed setup which is a 2015 kona big unit with a trek bowie fork on it (51mm offset I'm pretty sure) and how the steep by modern standards head angle and long offset make that bike handle. I'd be interested to see you talk about singlespeed gear ratios for different terrains if that's a video you feel like making at some point.

@patchesthejaybird8431 3 года назад

Your observations regarding the shorter offset are right on the money with my experience. My bike, with 44 mm offset, rides so nice when I'm out there, head even with the fork crown. I steer a lot with my legs against the seat, moving the bike under me, and the bike excels. Sitting back on the saddle and steering only with the bars feels slightly awkward. Boy does it carve when I'm charging headlong out of the saddle!

@kaedeschulz5422 3 года назад

Me see's new video from Hardtail party: Grabs bag of Chips/Crisps chills down on couch and watches😎👌 I'm used to always leaning my Bike a LOT for the old school bike's that i come from. Now i'm riding a 27,5 Hardtail with a 440mm reach and maybe 64,5 dagree headangle and very happy that the used fork i got has a 42mm offset 😀 It's like the bike corner's on it's own😁 Instantly felt home on the bike despite it being 20years difference in geometry design between those 2 bike's. Also never even sit on a Modern long and slack bike before LoL. Thanks a lot for making these videos on things that may seem small but actually can matter a lot!😃

@dannyh3335 3 года назад

Awesome comparison, thanks for coming out with these kind of videos.. Perfect for us bike nerds!

@PitDaddy 3 года назад

Your explanation of turning using your body/core vs turning using the bars helped me to know I'll struggle with short offset. In the long run it will pay off for me as I need to become one with my bike more often and enjoy the ride!

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Just to clarify, I BALANCE using mostly body/core (not bars), and I corner using counter-steering.

@andrewdwight934 3 года назад

By going with the shorter offset, you have in essence, increased trail a little bit - i.e. the tire contact patch is a little further back from the projection of the steering axis line on the ground, and what you are describing with the 44 having more stability, and less inclination to turn at the bars totally makes sense. I need a new fork for my 27.5+ hardtail, and I think that I'm going with a 44mm offset despite riding in the PNW with it's tight twisty trails. Years of riding dirt motorcycles makes me corner like I'm on one, and I think the stability will help with tracking thru root and rock gardens. I was on the fence about which way to go before I saw this vid because I wasn't really processing what the difference would be. Now I have a handle on what's going on. - Thanks Again, Steve

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Yup. A slacker head angle will increase trail too, as will a large wheel. That's why so many people struggle to corner 29ers, they haven't changed their riding technique enough.

@Onecogmike 3 года назад

Perfect timing, I just rode my Ti middlechild SS with a Carver carbon fork today. It climbs up the techie hills so well with the light front end. I had to slowly pick my way down on rocky terrain. Great for up, sketchy for down.

@Cassienope 3 года назад

I fall in the love it camp. It seems to get rid of steering wheel flop at lower speeds. Then just feels good from there on out.

@ABFPV584 3 года назад

Enlightening as always! You're a great teacher

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Thanks Aaron. I always try to include something educational in each of my videos.

@jackpittens796 3 года назад

Nice article. Good on Enve for offering the consumer the option. I always find it interesting in the bicycle industry the focus on head angle, fork offset and wheel size, but rarely touch on the thing that ties these all together, TRAIL. More trail, more self centering and stability. Slacker head angle, less offset and larger wheels all add up to more trail. I suspect that two bikes with identical trail and wheel size but different head angles and offsets will likely feel pretty much the same, within the limits of the common range of both. I understand that in the bicycle industry, unlike the motorcycle industry, that a bicycle is built up out of a collection of parts from various suppliers where for motorcycles they tend to be more designed as a whole, so for bicycle part manufactures they are not in control of all 3 parameters, head angle, offset and wheel size so they cannot specify the trail. I would love to see trail be specified by more bike brands for their factory built bikes.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

that would be a really fun experiment. I have a feeling the two bikes in your scenario above would still steer differently. The trail would be identical in a straight line, but once you turn the bars, things would start to get different.

@hardmtnbiker 3 года назад

I have the same fork but have kept it in the 51 offset. Now I think I’ll try the short offset and put my 29x2.8” tires

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

You'll either love it or hate it. It takes most people 5+ rides to adjust to the short offset.

@tomhawk733 3 года назад

I was choosing a fork for my Ragley Big AL build (which I decided on based on your review) and wish I had this video. My research led me to believe I'm a short offset guy too so glad I went with the 42mm not the 51 ☺️

@mattsavage 2 года назад

Coincidentaly, the the Big Al's come with a 51mm offset. I think when he reviewed them he was using a 42 or 44.

@tomhawk733 2 года назад

@@mattsavage that's interesting... Glad I put the 42mm offset fork on my build then 😀 Honestly though, not having the opportunity to run things back to back I rely a lot on Steve's reviews and content. It's amazing how much a small variable can impact ride characteristics of a bike

@jasonmorrow5840 2 года назад

@@tomhawk733 I'm building a Big Al right now and chose a Lyrik with 42 offset not the 51. Let me know how the 42 feels. Also going with either a 45 or 40mm stem to quicken the steering just a bit.

@tomhawk733 2 года назад

@@jasonmorrow5840 I don't have a point of reference to be honest as it's the only fork I've run on this bike. I do love it though! I think a 40 or 45mm stem would be a good idea. I have a 50mm stem and ride a lot of tight trails, I don't mind it but I do wonder what 5mm less stem would do for this one particular uphill tech climb with a switchback...

@matthewsierra314 3 года назад

Watching you go thru that technical section at the beginning of the downhill was gnarly! Lol

@Anthony-ob2lb 3 года назад

This was a fantastic review and explanation. It confirmed my hunch that I need a shorter offset ever since I installed an angleset. My steering has a quick light feel that wants to push. Not very confidence inspiring. I want a slow heavy feel. I'm about to modify my 27.5 / 46mm Revelation with a 37mm Pike upper. Fingers crossed it'll do the trick.

@jasonneff913 2 года назад

Any updates on this? I ride a 27.5 Fuse, stock fork is 42mm offset, the Rock Shox I’m considering comes in 37 & 46 offset, the Fox comes with 44

@Anthony-ob2lb 2 года назад

@@jasonneff913 Actually I haven't been able to try it yet. My first lesson was that the motion control damper in my revelation can't be installed in the pike upper. The pike upper doesn't have a retaining groove to hold the Moco damper. Argh. But finally I just found a good deal on a used Pike with the 2.1 damper and I swapped in my 37 mm upper. But I'm waiting on other parts (after a crash) before I can ride the bike again. But anyway, I would go for the 37mm if I were you. So many new bikes are coming with short offset forks now. Especially if you are running plus tires. I can get back to you in a couple of weeks with some real feedback though.

@Anthony-ob2lb 2 года назад

@@jasonneff913 Finally tested the short offset fork. I definitely like it better. The steering feel is heavier, slower and more self-centering. More control when leaning over in a turn. The longer offset fork was more light, quick and imprecise.

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

That's a great way to describe it as light vs heavy. I like heavy steering.

@Anthony-ob2lb 2 года назад

@@hardtailparty Yea definitely. The short offset mod feels similar to when I increased the front caster in my car. Heavier and more self-centering. There must be a correlation in the geo.

@Allan_Varcoe 3 года назад

Very cool comparison! We have similar backgrounds and I really respect your attention to the geo numbers! Modern Style = Party Style!

@qualm43 2 года назад

you mentioned counter-steering in this video, and NO ONE in ANY cornering video I've watched mentions this. It's the most important aspect of mountain bike cornering.

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

Agreed. Most people don't know how to do this.

@andycjohnston 3 года назад

This is an awesome video, as usual! One of the things that you've mentioned a couple of times recently in your reviews is around "Steering with your feet" instead of the bars? You talked about that too when you slackened your wife's bike, so that it would be better at steering with the feet?? I'm new to mountain biking, so I'm not really sure that I understand what you are getting at, and perhaps my bike it too old a geo to do this? When I'm turning flat corners I'm trying to not turn the bar, but to sort of drop the whole bike on it's side slightly, sometimes dropping my outside foot down if it's a really flat corner to try to get more traction. But really I'm just kind of feeling it out as I go, and trying to watch video's, and sort of just practice. I can't affort 1:1 lessons at the moment as I'm saving up for a better bike, my whole bike cost less than one of your brakes! Anyhow, it'd be great if you could go into what you mean exactly when you say about the steering. Thank you so much for this channel. When I started out riding, I had really bad bike envy, becuase most of my friends have much more expensive bikes, and continue to upgrade components, and get new bikes etc. But this sort of channel has made me realise that even a basic hardtail can be made better, and that with skill, you can really enjoy yourself on a hardtail too. Keeps me motivated to keep going, instead of chucking it in becuase it's too expensive a sport.

@emile345 3 года назад

As usual the content is top notch but I just wanted to point out that also your shirt game is always on point

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Haha, thanks. Partyshirt international for the win. I love their shirts.

@ianfurqueron5850 3 года назад

Steering dampers were sold for DH bikes around 20 years ago. The most common (and still made today) was the Hopey steering damper. It required a bracket under the top headset cup (old school 1 1/8" type) although a few frame builders put the boss into the top tube so the bracket wasn't required. Oddly enough, I find counter steering easier on my road bike than on my mtn bike...

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Awesome! I had no idea. Thanks for sharing that info.

@josephnubile1970 3 года назад

What a Great video. Thanks for really explaining fork offset.

@Gyllbonus 3 года назад

Cleanest stepchild ever...how does the oneup bars feel w/ the enve fork? This would probably make a crazy ss29er aggressive gravel bike. 2.00 ratio.

@patchesthejaybird8431 3 года назад

Blah, thinking about my bike, I can't wait for our dirt MTB season to get started again. Right now its snow biking season still, its snowing right now. We have accumulates over 2 feet in the past week. We might be in for a late spring. It sure looks nice down in the Sedona area right now.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Sounds like you're in Colorado? Sedona has seen snow too lately.

@tonyhruzek4250 3 года назад

Before I started MTB I rode a ton of off road motorcycle. I found that I HAD to put in much more bar when turning. I have wondering if it was due to the offset on MTB forks. This has proven to me that I need to try the shorter offset forks to see if its more natural to me!!

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

You had to put more bar input on your moto or your mtb?

@tonyhruzek4250 3 года назад

@@hardtailparty More input in the MTB

@billmcknight7633 3 года назад

Interesting head to head comparison. Wondering about a review of the Fasst Flexx Handlebar on a fully rigid bike. Heavy and costs as much as many forks, but it would be interesting to see the effect on trail clatter. Saw a review using it on a full suspension AM bike, but wondering how it would work if that was the only "suspension" you had. Keep up the good work.

@niteryder50 3 года назад

Great video, interesting you think bike rides better with short offset and was designed for longer offset, seems really isn't any downside it you like pushing hard into corners on slack bike. When I had a 46mm fork it felt very twitchy compared to 42 and going to 37 made bike way more stable at speed.

@enrikitto6948 3 года назад

A lot of valuable insight. Great video Steve!

@danielrgusa 3 года назад

I totally agree with your caveat statement and I think it’s something people need to hear more often. What trail is this Steve? I’d like to hit it with my Krampus.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

0:36

@leanasf821 3 года назад

Super underrated channel

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Thank you so much.

@shannonkeller8003 3 года назад

Thank you! Awesome insight!

@danjdavison 3 года назад

How do you think fork offset and stem length are related? Should you run a longer offset with a longer stem and a shorter offset with a shorter stem?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

That's a tricky one. I feel like head angle, offset, stem length, wheel size, and bar width and bar sweep all work together to affect how a bike steers. I feel like head angle and stem length are more closely related than offset + stem length, but I haven't experimented with stem length combined with different offsets back-to-back yet. I try to avoid generalizations with stem length, as it really depends on the bike I'm riding. I wish I could give a "for _______* hta, use a ________ mm stem", but I often find exceptions to the rule, and it's quite personal. Stem length affects a bike in so many ways. I recommend getting the bike dialed with everything else first (fork offset, head angle, etc.), then experimenting with stem length, as it's one of the cheapest components to swap.

@davidbahr8599 3 года назад

Just changed my fork from lyrik 160mm 51 offset to Zeb 170mm 44 offset. First ride will be this afternoon!

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Dang, that's a HUGE offset! ;) Slacker AND lower offset. You'll have ALL the trail now. :)

@sebastiengiovannelli8556 Год назад

so how it feel ?

@josephfarrugia2350 Год назад

@David Bahr Care to share your update & impressions please?

@codysmtbchannel2404 2 года назад

Thanks for making this video know I can go with a 44mm offset

@nathancouse3596 2 года назад

I run a longer offset fork on my xc race bike. But I've run shorter offsets on my bike as well and honestly the differences are sooo tiny. Changing stem lenght I think makes way more difference than the offset of a fork. Just my thoughts on this.

@chriskimber7179 3 года назад

Sweet shirt! All the best riding jerseys are button down hawaiian shirts!

@anthonys6657 Год назад

Thank you. This is a great video. Helped me make up my mind.

@13thbornpr Год назад

Great video. Its the opposite of what i thaught was going to happen. Now, what if i want to swap out my 120mm/51 fork for a 130mm/44 or 42 offset? That should slacken the head angle from 66.5 to 66°. Its a 2022 bike so modern geo. I have a modern riding technique but i do ride a few tight single tracks that are better ridden with " turning the bars" technique.. I cant find anything on this.

@tazmystical 3 года назад

Would the 55 offset for a slower speed winter/snow setup work best? Or would going with an angle set and making HTA steeper be better way to improve slow speed handling?

@anthonyharris483 3 года назад

I run a 45mm offset titanium fork on my rigid steel frame with 67 degree head angle

@jasonneff913 2 года назад

You definitely rode with more confidence on the shorter offset

@josh_on_bikes 3 года назад

When you said what bike you were riding I thought you named it TYy, then I realized you said ti for titanium.

@mikecoulter5243 3 года назад

Question : I have a SC Chamelon, 29er. Shipped with a 120mm Recon RL in 51mm offset. If I went to say a Fox 34 140mm that would technically slacken the HTA by 1 degree right? (every 10mm = .5 degree?). Stock is 67.3 HTA so in "theory" just moving to a 140mm fork would make the new HTA 66.3. Trying to factor in how trail and mechanical trail maths, and also considering 66 is now right on the border of 44mm or 51mm offset... The question is, should I be looking at a 44mm fork now? I think SC configured a 51mm offset on the stock 29er because 1. I don't think Rockshox even makes a 120mm Recon in 44mm (conspiracy me thinks this is also why SC made the Chameleon 67+ HTA, due to available fork configurations they could bake margin into) and 2. The stock HTA is 67.3 and likely over some invisible dotted line when designing a bike. As it stands today I have an XL Chameleon (correctly sized) but it does feel like I"m riding on top of the bike and steering with my hands (for sure). Just curious your thoughts on 44mm vs 51mm in this scenario?

@rufant6110 3 года назад

Great stuff mate 👍

@tonyhruzek4250 3 года назад

One of these days the fork manufacturers are going to figure out they can make customers happier by designing their forks with the variable trail just like this. I don't believe it is a technology issue. It's just a matter of the manufacturers wanting to sell more forks.

@williamkinzel3635 3 года назад

Nice work! very interesting. now i wish i would have made sure to purchase shorter offset fork on a recent build! that ENVE fork is so cool. Are you aware of any other forks with long axle to crown like the ENVE that might be slighly less $$$?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

There's a reason all the short offset forks are sold out, and the only options are longer offset now. :) Check out RSD's rigid fork. I've got it on another bike and I like it a lot, though it's not as light and doesn't have the adjustable offset.

@mrbretward 3 года назад

This has inspired me to put my ridged fork back on my old Vassago. Where do you get your awesome shirts?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Party shirt international.

@anthonyharris483 3 года назад

I noticed with my steep angle bike with a short offset I would need to be over the front end to steer. It's ok just more work

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

How steep is your head angle, and what's your offset?

@anthonyharris483 3 года назад

@@hardtailparty the head angle is 71 degrees with a 40mm offset

@jaydenbourke3722 2 года назад

I can’t stop watching this video Will we get more rigid content?

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

Yes, but my trails don't really suit a rigid fork. It's bumpy out here and the rigid forks beat me up.

@jaydenbourke3722 2 года назад

@@hardtailparty also another queston have you ever seen the fastflexx handlebars? i feel they would work great with a rigid setup

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

@@jaydenbourke3722 yes, i hace. what about rigid do you prefer over a suspension fork?

@jaydenbourke3722 2 года назад

@@hardtailparty i am yet to have a rigid fork but i like the old school simplicity it reminds me of what mountain biking started as it just looks fun and im dying to give it a try also paul klampers ive got to get a set of klampers

@zap... Год назад

I'm confused. First off, Ive been riding for 30 years. I am getting a new frame and fork. Seems like riding both offsets is truly the only way to know what is going to float your boat. But can I figure this out with some degree of certainty on paper? I am getting a new Salsa Fargo Ti (cuz I just broke my Salsa Cutthroat frame in Bentonville) and getting a Fox 34, step cast 100mm travel fork. The rigid fork the Fargo Ti comes with is a 51 offset. But the Salsa Fargo Ti FAQ's state that if using suspension, 41 offset fork is preferred but 51 is ok too. I'm confused. It's a 69 degee head angle. What direction do I go?

@mellissanash7517 3 года назад

I found this very informative, thank you. Which offset did you find was better climb with? I usually have few mile climbs before getting to the downhill.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

I optimize my handling for the downhill and make it work for the uphill. When you're over the bars sprinting, the shorter offset felt less twitchy.

@greentransmission 3 года назад

Great information! How are the mechanical disc brakes!?

@CasperRc81 2 года назад

Sound goofy but what about rigid on a slacked full suspension obviously wouldn’t be after the switch. But to me it’s all about the light front end. Idk idea.

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

I actually had that exact thought last week. I may have to try it...

@ChrisBakerElToro 3 года назад

Great video, very informative. Would the benefits be the same when running a reduced offset fork on a bike with older geo? I.E. 69* head tube angle 74* ST angle Or do these benefits only apply to reduced offset forks and modern geo where the HT angles are slack and the ST angles are steeper?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

STA doesn't really have anything to do with it. I've never tried a reduced offset fork on a steep bike before; that would be interesting.

@timnoonan2786 Год назад

Did you ever say what rake the fork was originally intended for? Think that would be a big factor.....

@hardtailparty Год назад

I doubt it makes a difference on a hardtail. This bike was designed around a longer offset fork, but I prefer it with the shorter offset.

@harizavdic4893 3 года назад

Great video. Would you put a short offset fork on a 66.5 HTA bike.

@spencerh1803 3 года назад

I do wonder what would happen if there was say a 20mm offset, or maybe even 0mm. That could be very interesting to try

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

like all things, we eventually reach a point of diminishing returns. Personally, I wonder where that point is. On a 27.5 bike, you can go even lower offset.

@argonaut04c4 3 года назад

Thanks man! This video answered so many questions for me. I ordered a Lynskey Pro 29 hardtail and the geometry recommendation says 51mm rake for the fork. Unfortunately, I got a 44mm and was initially worried. This just made me more confident that 44mm will suit my riding style. Just to confirm, with a head angle of 68.5° a 100mm travel fork with 44mm offset will give me a much more stable ride and handle will feel more stable on high speeds, correct?

@DavidMaruca_ 3 года назад

no, at high speed having a steep head angle, low travel, and low offset, the wheel base will feel smaller and therfore more playful, but less stable

@argonaut04c4 3 года назад

I think to avoid confusion, what I meant is having this shorter offset should increase the trail. Therefore, should equate to stability on high speeds. I got confused by your comment @David Maruca as it seems to be contradicting the video as well as articles I read.

@MikeinCC 6 месяцев назад

What rise on those bars Steve?

@r.c.r.rproductions8462 2 года назад

How do you think this fork would do on a steeper head angle?

@mateomateo966 2 года назад

44--55 offset? According to ENve offset is 44-52. is it some new version fork?

@matthewbenedetti490 3 года назад

I know you started by saying it all depends, but how much of this preference is trail dependent? Here on the East Coast I’ve always shied away from going with the short offset because trails often have unbermed or unexpected turns, and that makes me nervous about giving up bar control... that being said I usually get used to whatever changes I make to a bike after a couple rides and no longer notice the difference.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

It's more technique dependent than trail dependent. This is a pretty flat trail, with mostly flat corners. Even in the east coast, I'd prefer the shorter offset. Then again, I've adapted my technique to suit it. Most people don't like the short offset on their first few rides on it.

@findtherightbeat 3 года назад

How do you think the fork offset affects those that enter corners by "pushing the handlebar right to go right" then follow through with steering with the knees/legs? Thanks!

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

This is called counter-steering. Shorter fork offsets reward countersteering technique. Most riders don't know how to do that. This is what I refer to as "steering with the feet" instead of at the bars.

@allanridesbikes5856 3 года назад

I see different offsets on forks also based on wheelsize. In general, is it because they are going for the same riding style across all wheelsizes? For example, I see the same fork for a 26" with a 40mm offset that becomes a 46mm on a 29er. Because of the wheelsize does this in essence ride the same (granted wheelsizes already make the ride different)?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

It's because the different wheel sizes create different trail measurements.

@CherylParker64 3 года назад

What about slow speed handling of a 29er? ie. downhill into a tight switchback corner? Or bike packing with weight tied to the bars?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Depends on your technique. If you have the skill and confidence to dump a 29er into a downhill tight corner, it'll do really well. If you prefer to stay on top and steer with the bars, it'll still work fine, but you'd prefer the longer offset.

@chadashton7029 3 года назад

@hardtail party Hey...I value your opinion so I was hoping you'd be able to help me out some...I'm looking for a new frame for a single-speed build. Something a bit more aggressive but not crazy. Coming off a Jamis DragonSlayer which is definitely more XC or even bike packing. Looking at the Hozo ST, RSD MiddleChild Chromoly, and the Nimble 9. The RSD is the more aggressive geo of the three...I could possibly throw the Honzo ESD in there too but that might be a little overkill for my needs.

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Hey Chad thanks for watching. It sounds like you'd be a perfect candidate for my bike consultation tier on Patreon. I'd be happy to help you over there. Otherwise, my free review videos should help with the decision process.

@germi1 3 года назад

That shirt, man, that shirt!! 👍🏼

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Check out party shirt international. They've got some good ones.

@chriskimber7179 3 года назад

@@hardtailparty u sponsored? discount code or kickback? That would be cool

@graemefolks9420 Год назад

Did you predict the future?! ie canyons k.i.s. Technology😂

@gusblanco8539 Год назад

What kind of single speed do you use? Brand and specs recommendations…

@hardtailparty Год назад

Binary Maniak.

@gusblanco8539 Год назад

I meant your single speed cog ⚙️

@gusblanco8539 Год назад

What brand ? Is it a spacer set?

@Stoo61 3 года назад

Is this the ENVE Adventure fork? Same idea right.... Oh and did the brake spacers come with the fork?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

This is the MTN fork. The adventure fork has the same features, though the atc and offset are different (49.5 or 55mm). Your fork will come with the brake spacers.

@Stoo61 3 года назад

@@hardtailparty Nice one thanks! Interesting video.

@kizmack7772 2 года назад

Hi HTP been planning to swap my fox 36 160mm with Enve mtn rigid on my Chromag stylus for more road use will it still be fine? tia👍

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

The geo will be very different but it'll still pedal down the road

@kizmack7772 2 года назад

@@hardtailparty thanks bro, btw, im running on canfield 150 cranks which i got from your review👍cheers!

@hardtailparty 2 года назад

Awesome!

@TeamCykelhold 3 года назад

I have both short and long offset and I think the difference is vastly exaggerated by almost everyone. There just isn't that much difference IMO.

@s14tat 3 года назад

Leaning the bike and using body english is the only way to corner.

@clintnieves 3 года назад

Does that fork fit a 27.5 plus wheel with 2.8 tire?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

Yes. It has a 27.5x3.0 here.

@clintnieves 3 года назад

@@hardtailparty thanks! Keep up the great tests and reviews. Love the honest critique

@BrianVaughn 3 года назад

Carving bike.

@spills_n_thrills 3 года назад

Is there a reason why there are only two main options and why they are specifically 44 and 51?

@hardtailparty 3 года назад

there are many different options, from 41 up to 55. I'm sure there are others out there that are even more/less.

@christopherhauser1376 Год назад

Attack mode vs slack mode! Gen Xers, might llean towards the latter. We're often called the "slacker generation" by our Boomer peers, and I definitely agree with work life balance and modern geometry MTB riding.

@nikoyannaros48 2 года назад

After 2 years of usage (nomad) the long offset is really annoying me. The bike doesn't go straight. The slower you go the worse it is. With a smaller frame it is even worse. To me the longer offset is better when you go crazy fast in steep terrain. But most of the time it is just annoying and not better. I know it is very difficult to describe the difference. To me the difference is significant even some people won't feel a difference. Maybe they will just wonder why they can't ride. 🤷‍♂️