What happens when you stop chasing them……. You realize you deserve someone who can actually reciprocate a relationship, you deserve consistency, clear communication, and someone who is capable of commitment and a secure relationship. You deserve someone who is sure of you and can reciprocate your feelings. No more guessing and detective work. You become more sure of what you want and don’t want, what you can tolerate and not tolerate. You can now set healthy boundaries and find someone more aligned with you and your values. Your life is now a whole lot better.
This is a terrible relationship for a anxious person . Get yourself well and meet a secure person that’s the best gift you can give yourself. It feels like being a alcoholic though that these people may also trigger a response in you.
@@Elenasn There's about 15 degrees left or right between an FA and a DA and a narc. The only difference is the Narc is likely to slander you afterwards, while the FA/DA don't care enough to bother
@@Elenasn Why do you assume that I don't know enough about Narcissists and Avoidants to make the call that their behaviour patterns are similar? It's hardly news. It is a well established view, even among people who out-qualify both of us put together.
Basically what happens is the relationship ends. Because they don't care about you at all. They love when people "chase" them- but that's all they want. The second the relationship moves to a more "serious" stage- they begin belittling you, playing mind games and giving you the silent treatment- followed by attempting to get YOU to break up with them, because theyre like a child when it comes to relationships. They WANT you to continually tell them how amazing they are- without THEM having to put any effort into the relationship. Honestly, it's just not worth it. It's emotionally exhausting, and you feel like you wasted months- if not years of your time on a person who will never give back to you.
Exactly. It's wayyyyy to much effort for the other person to basically try to manipulate, prod or beg them into treating them with just some bare bones attention, it's pathetic and degrading. I had to divorce a narcissistic avoidant personality and it just about killed me the last several years.
@@em77775 I'm fairly confident the guy I was seeing was a Covert Narcissist/Dismissive Avoidant combination, but he also was leaning towards a Psychopath the more I research.
I didn't have your experience, so I may be off on this, but this behavior sounds much further down some spectrum than just an attachment style issue. This sounds awful, like extreme versions of relational dysfunction with Dark Triad tendencies present. I'm so sorry you had to go through this. I am FA and aware of it and it has colored many of my relationships even as I continue to work on it, but despite my fears and confusions I have tried to be as communicative and open/transparent with partners about what was going on. Even if I had to leave, I didn't want to ever play games or manipulate. It was like a combination of fleeing in terror (like an animal running from a forest fire) or completely depersonalizing and shutting down and numbing out while desperately trying to "turn back on." I remember some of my securely attached partners perceived this as manipulation or playing games, which actually was more upsetting because I didn't feel I had control over anything and didn't want to hurt them. I've broken my own heart walking away from people in the past out of fear of hurting them and they thought I didn't care, but it was the exact opposite. I cared enough to walk away. I mention this because a lot of FAs are accused of manipulation and avoided as a result. Your situation sounds awful and like someone was trying to manipulate or play games, despite attachment style. I am glad you got away and I hope you can heal.
@AnthonyTimmers-rz6il Yes, I'm fairly certain he was a Covert Narcissist, with Dismissive Avoidant tendencies- but he was leaning more towards being a Psychopath.
What happens is you stop chasing and caring, your passion dies, they continue not caring, two ships sail at night and relationship slowly dies off. The funny thing is I saw it coming a mile away, even phrased my concerns about it multiple times, tried explaining it logically without emotions, but no results. It was like talking to a wall, no effort whatsoever. After nearly 3 years of being pushed away every time I got close I ended the relationship and the endless torture. I realized that me being an amazing supportive partner for them equals either completely abandoning my needs (which I did in the end) or fulfilling all of theirs and getting pushed away in the end when they start feeling connected or good about the relationship. You can't win this mind game...
Chasing ≠ Caring. You can still allow them a place in your heart while moving the emotional chess pieces to a position that doesn't harm you. It's been two months since my dismissive-leaning FA friend ""broke up"" with me. My feelings have only strengthened and solidified, all the while I've been in contact with her less and less and things have gotten colder and colder... That's because my love comes from a place of understanding and is unconditional.
When someone has an avoidant behavior let them go. This kind of person needs time to heal so they don’t exercise this type of behavior. No one wants a push/pull relationship that’s unhealthy for everyone involved.
On top of it all you don't find out their an avoidant until all this mess comes out .. like you just walked into an emotional tornado.. then they just disappear
It's hard to stop caring about people that you care so much about, but eventually you need to realize that if you're not caring about yourself and they don't care about you... Who cares about you? So why am I then giving all of my care to somebody else? Becomes more self-preservation than it is a relationship. And as hard as it is, the best thing to do is both stop chasing but also to just let it go and let them experience life without you and move on and find someone who sees your value. Most importantly starting with yourself.
As if finding someone is that Easy or simple. Been Alone for many many years now and did not find anyone in those years...he found me and how can i go on without him??? I just can't, I miss him so much. Nobody else can touch me like he can.. He is everything I didn't want but probably need? I know I deserve better treatment but but but. I just can not fathom the fact that he is how he is and be the other one of him as well. He did everything he said not to do .. I am so hurt. Still miss him like Crazy.. Any tips for me ??? This not healthy but but but...i miss his Touch his kisses etc.. Help!!
The way I see it, caring about yourself and caring about them are not mutually exclusive. You can seek fulfillment of your own needs and lift yourself up, while still leaving a door open for them. That doesn't mean you continue to chase them, but you stay in touch at a level that's not overwhelming for them and show them that you're consistent, strong etc. Of course this likely necessitates structural changes in the relationship dynamic, but it doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing situation. A dismissive-leaning FA friend of mine ""broke up"" with me after a wonderful initial phase of getting to know each other, so I've been pulling back and giving her the space (she thinks) she needs. However, I still 'check in' very infrequently to let her know I'm not abandoning her. If I had continued to chase her, I wouldn't have had the time or emotional bandwidth to make positive change in my life: buy my first car, get a new job, reconnect with old friends... I feel great, and it'll only get better for me. But I still care about her, from afar, and it breaks my heart every day that we're stuck in this horribly confusing place in our friendship. And that's fine. It's painful, but I'm not suffering. I think about her a lot, but I'm still living my own life and making the most of it. There's the balance.
@@kumoryuuichi that sounds like the Healthy way to deal with it... I am doing the " work on mezelf and my life" because of his inspiring me big time. If he is doing the same now, Maybe we have a chance...by now i am at Peace with me Pulling back for once... Maybe someday soon we will meet again...in What capacity, i have no Idea.. 🌷
We anxious attachers clicked the video to know if they will come back 😂 Even if they come back we should not let such ppl who dont wanna work on themselves hurt us.
DA will love bomb and disappear. I went from secure to anxious and crazy because of such treatment. It’s painful. It’s so hard to heal! I am worried that this experience will leave a trauma in me. I am also so embarrassed that I shared my exp with some friends and they think I’m too crazy for a man :(😢
Thank you for sharing! I'm living through the same experience right now with a DA, the cycle goes on for 2 years already and it killed my self-esteem... and I have the same regrets about sharing my thoughts with my friends.
@@e11erym hello. We are in this together. I pray that this experience though confusing and painful will bring you personal growth in some way. You are wiser and stronger because you have been through such painful experience. I have turned to God to pray for healing and restoration. Listening to sermons about what God say I am. I stopped turning to human friends because going through this is so embarrassing but I also pray you find the support you need. Big hugs. We will survive this and we will be amazing single woman. Next time we will love again as a healed individual.
@@e11erym I hear you! My advice is to share with as many people as possible. I didn't, and a big part of the problem is that you can experience what feels like almost cognitive dissonance or questioning yourself at times - especially when the other person is justifying things or has no semblance (or denies) their own behavior, or worse, blames things on you. It can become really psychologically damaging and I was SO embarrassed and reluctant and I'm not sure why.. just so reluctant to talk about it. I went through stages of like .. questioning my own experiences, or then feeling embarrassed for being an otherwise happy confident person who has had healthy long term relationships to going through something so well.. traumatic, and for doing it for so long while I tried to understand what was happening. it can be REALLY jarring depending on your situation. And one of my friends recently started experiencing similar things and I watched as she also kept things hidden .. in part out of embarrassment or not wanting to relive some of it, and in part out of loving the person and not being sure how to handle it and I was like DUDE, if something feels this off or confusing to the point where you are questioning yourself - please don't do what I did, and talk to people about it. it doesn't have to mean the other person is evil or even bad intentioned - it can mean you are dealing with something that is far beyond being able to see it while in it. And if you are EVER in a cycle oh my god do whatever you need to do -STOP. just full stop, go somewhere, isolate yourself, tell people, ask for help do whatever you have to do. I know that sounds extreme but in some of the more subtle cycles with a DA that can end up making you question your sanity. Even if you end up just being 'friends' after the breakup/situationship etc - there's just a lot there that can be at play that needs a lot of space and healing. the first thing you want to do is stop. take a LOT of distance. Not a month or a few months - legit aim to take a full year of removing yourself from the situation, for me it took almost 9 months to come out of what I later realized was an almost dissociative state by the time I stopped engaging with something that was so intensely triggering my nervous system. I have a past history of trauma so that might not be for everyone - but a month or two won't do it, you really need a good chunk of time away from the situation (fully) to get back in touch with your equilibrium and reality, because otherwise you are slowly adapting to the ups and downs of the situation and may not realize that. the clarity will come. Share with people, don't be afraid. You dont have to agree with everyone or feed into playing villian/victim with your relationship, that's not true and also not helpful - but support is good. Find neutral, emotionally mature and supportive people to talk to. and Just be on your own to regain balance. it can be SERIOUSLY traumatic and destabilizing. I am coming out of a 3 year cycle with a DA and it's been a full year of us not being in touch, and I am only now just barely beginning to feel normal again? I went through bouts of anxiety and depression that were so severe, I did not realize how taxing it was on my nervous system. and this isn't about it being his fault - it is just genuinely taxing on one's nervous system to continue to experience upending to such extremes, shut down etc when it's really extreme. And to trust someone you love and care for deeply, to experience many different iterations of having trust broken, dealing with the confusion, someone blaming you, trying to be calm, then things being ok again and being unclear about what happened - it is really hard. I have a lot of sympathy for DA's, I am an FA myself but - I have never experienced anything like that before and the fallout is real. Please take care of yourself and share with people! you can always be amicable with the person another time but get yourself in contact with others and share your experiences, ask for support. The trauma will ease.. depending on your past experiences. for me it's hard because it triggered a re-experience of a lot of abuse and things I went through in childhood (not his fault, just very much replicated/relived experiences and unearthed repressed trauma due to his behavior, especially the parts where I was made to question myself, was silenced or denied my feelings or experiences and having them turned back around on me, was repeatedly told that I was the problem etc, which unfortunately was something I experienced with a primary caregiver at an early age through emotional and physical abuse, so this was extraordinarily damaging for me. However no amount of being 'secure' would make any of those experiences navigable or not extremely damaging - for me it was just another level that I also have to recognize as part of my own history. And need to note where the reality of his behavior starts and ends and which parts were my trauma coming into play but, either way, it's still not ok to be dealing with those sort of things especially when the other person is not accountable to them.) Bottom line- privacy in relationships is valuable - but if you are ever feeling bad or having these experiences, it helps immensely to have support. you'd be surprised a lot of people might have their own things to share as well.
Just a follow up 2 months post. By God’s grace during my healing journey I made a new friend online who is my ex’s friend and she shed so much to me that confirm we had the same experience of this guy. A narcissist. A deeply insecure elitist who thrive on his career and finances status and despise those who are of less prestige. I found out he have a double triple quadruple life while dating me. No wonder I felt so confused but just didn’t have the facts. Thank God for revealing to me. I love how he used to love me but now I focus on being whole again and I look forward to a man that I can call 100% mine. Unlike this ex who is all over and for everyone. Jesus will heal all those who are hurt by their relationships. May you all be restored. Amen!!
Yikes!!! You are NOT crazy, it’s evident by what and how your wrote in your comment. Look up Dr. Ramani here on RU-vid She is an expert, thru personal experience and her work, what it is to be with a narcissist. You will begin to heal, regain truth inside and out, and eliminate those from your life who are not helpful or healthy 🕊💐
These people can seriously damage your health. The second you realize they are an avoidant run the other way as fast as you can... These people are ruthless and can seriously damage your life... They are like cardboard cut outs no feelings nothing.. It cost me huge amounts of money. My business my home everything the whole thing was a complete joke...😂 Even when you point out that they have problems they just ignore that.. It's very sad.. But they are just not worth it.. The person I met was the sweetest thing i'd ever known she turned out to be the most horrendous person I ever met... Run run run away.
DA's love drama even though they claim that they just want peace. That's why they often get with the most toxic and dramatic people - or make the person that way. I just started detaching. I'm a secure attachment and this is not what I'm looking for. Just started a new job and trying to get a fresh start. I don't need this kind of drama.
Yes! Any small act of assertiveness of my needs was classed as "drama", when in fact he was the one being dramatic by massively overreacting. It was fine for him to have super rigid boundaries with others however. He had incredibly hypocritical double standards, with me and even other drivers on the road!
@@Alex-bi8sc If the person likes drama, the attachment style is FA. This is exactly what DA's avoid. It'd be great if people could research a little before diagnosing others.
Maybe DA:s avoids drama, but was accusing me that all my attempts to discuss and have a conversation when I noticed he was freezing and pushing me away, were drama 🎭 I felt it was so unfair. He actually made it to become drama with his behavior and by exaggerating and twisting what I said or asked. I felt totally mindfucked..
My DAs last comments to me after I messaged some some sincere words to her were, “lol”. I never messaged her again. Very painful at first, but thank goodness it’s over.
Probably a narc; DA wouldn't have replied because they couldn't find words or replied much later for thinking time. These terms get thrown out way too easily and by people who don't understand the difference between any of them either. Sigh
So tired of the off and on dynamic. It always ends over nothing and then it takes months for him to come back, leaving me feeling abandoned and wondering what he's doing while we're apart. It almost seems like he just wants to be single when he feels like it. It's over for me this time, I can't keep putting myself through this.
I know exactly how you feel! Let's be clear, it's unhealthy and disrespectful to be treated this way, not to mention the emotional pain you have to go through. It's not worth it. Hope you're feeling ok..I've also broken up with my partner. Just too exhausted to deal with his silent treatments. Good luck 🙏🏼
Oh, God she nailed it! They need the space, you give them the space, and then they’re not coming toward you anymore, and then they act like the relationship has lost its passion! And they are the one who asked for it 😢 2:10 Two ships passing in the night..
Just enough to make them feel loved while also not enough to overwhelm. Keep it in that zone and you're good. They'll keep opening up and moving towards you. I'm currently in a dynamic with an avoidant currently and I'm seeing it progress well but I give him time to himself. We chat every few days and I can see movement
I still can't believe he is gone. I've been watching your videos for years learning how to work with his issues, successfully. Then I went through something in my own life and it was easier for him to start seeing someone else. And just string me along. In the end, he was completely narcissistic towards me. Threw me out of the door for her.
The same thing happened to me. Such a traumatic experience I’m still recovering years in. We are better off without.. the intermittent reinforcement felt like being on heroin I was so sick.. I’m getting better but have down days even thinking about the state he left me in. I gave space and he’d disappear and find a new woman everytime I gave space. I’m starting to pity his lonely life even more than my own. I have faith for complete recovery but I’m so hurt it’s difficult to meet new people without bringing this pain with me :(
The issue you are missing here is the assumption that this other person is self-aware enough to know they are avoidant, and also to recognize it ourselves in the beginning when someone is their most magical self. By the time WE realize they are, there is usually an emotional investment. If I knew this about my last partner I would have gone slower and made more space. This all said, a good hearted as many of these folks are, this is an attachment style to run from. Nothing healthy comes from this and it's usually quite harmful trying to connect with someone who is always going to push and pull and make you feel devalued. Go where your love and care are appreciated and also wanted
I was in a relationship with a DA for years on and off. Yes, for a while he was charming, attentive, kind etc etc but as time went on it seemed as though he was always trying to find fault with me. He made wrongful assumptions and false accusations due to his own deep rooted insecurities and fears. His sudden outbursts of rage were always totally unwarranted and undeserved. He never took ownership for his words and actions nor his unacceptable behaviours. Often he stonewalled me and gave me the silent treatment. I tried to be so understanding of him, forgave him on numerous occasions blah blah. I gave him so much on every level but there was no reciprocation. It was always about him. He made it impossible to have a healthy loving relationship.
After watching a few of your videos and doing a little research. My wife has shown so accurately a lot of these tendencies and actions. We’ve been married for about 4 years and it has been hell for me. Talk about not wanting to commit; she’s the epitome of that. Omg when you say being confused, I was just that. She constantly wanted my heart and emotionality from me, but wouldn’t almost ever reciprocate. Man I wish I had known about this attachment thing much sooner, I don’t think I would’ve pursued the relationship at all. The only way I could describe this dynamic; is it often feels like I’m dealing with a child. I’ve never seen this kind of behavior before, and it started to drive me literally insane. I started to record our interactions in different ways thinking it would improve our situation. Nope made it worse. She would literally deny everything as if wasn’t pure evidence in her face. My character and reputation has taken a hit and I’ve ganged up on by her and her family. I just can’t do it no more I’m out.
I'm an FA and I had a very hard time because so many dating videos say, "If you feel anxiety, it's your warning sign telling you it's WRONG for you.". But as you said in the beginning, the fear begins immediately once the ATTACHMENT BOND forms. If I'm not that interested yet, or just casual, I have a good time and no fear. I'm sometimes so out of touch with myself that I will begin to feel intense fear around someone and it becomes paralyzing and upsetting and all-consuming. All I notice is the fear and think, "This situation is clearly is bad.". Only when I look back after I've run away (because I always physically do or literally emotionally check out from the fear) do I say, "Oh, the indicator you were attaching to them was the absolute terror you felt all the time.". So now if I start to feel afraid of someone I have to assess whether I'm attaching to them or genuinely afraid. lol Another big tip-off is, after running away and getting immediate physical relief from escaping, ricocheting into this "You're so empowered you made the right choice go back out there!", is the inevitable crash a week or so later when you realize they are actually gone, you've calmed down, and are now so confused why you are in absolute anguish like you got dumped. I don't try to get them back ever though, because I feel it's already been ruined by me and that I have no self control and would reenact the pattern again at a later point. (I do not have social anxiety and normally do not experience fearful emotions or danger about other people at all, so this is a big tip-off. It seems to be isolated to romantic contexts.)
as an FA as well, i completely relate. Its an unconfortable idea to realize that you self sabotage only after things have hit the fan, which i think puts FAs (or maybe just me idk) in this loop of should I really, or is it worth it? Especially coupled with hypervigilance which is just another mountainhill to move on its own. AM still curious about how we FAs can escape this loop tbh? cz maybe its sthn others or the pds can see n we just cant because were looking at situations from within and not without?
@@vee3687 I have thought about how to address this from both inside and out. If our fear is so extreme, it's most likely a trauma response from something and we probably need trauma-based therapy to get it out of our nervoys systems, not just psychology. Then we probably need to figure out what WE need in a partner to lessen the FA cycle triggers from happening (because different FAs have different needs), and try to find people with those traits we are also attracted to. My particular needs as an FA are that I have an easier time with the "I feel smothered" impulses in myself, because I know how to take time and ask for patience in that regard and if I am feeling smothered, I may feel overwhelmed but I trust my partner is definitely into me. My 5-alarm fire FA triggers are when my partner is too distant/inconsistent for me and needs too much space or moves too SLOW, because I immediately assume I am being used/an option/they are not into me as much as I am into them, and I freak out and run away rather than get used as a placeholder. I've identified that as a childhood wound, so definitely look there for guidance. I know this video tells partners NOT to chase FAs, but it depends on the FA. If I ran away bc I was scared bc I could not determine level of investment and my partner just pushed through that resistance and pulled me out of my own chaos for a minute, I think I would just swoon. Unfortunately, most partners are either like, "Okay, cool, have a nice life," or are hurt (and have every reason to be) and just go away (which confirms my FA irrational fears that they never cared and I was replaceable easily). Look for the irrational parts and that will lead you to the source of the wound, I think. I habe no idea how to fix it though. I hope you have luck on your journey. 💜
After therapy and working on healing my attachementstyle for a while now (not yet fully there) I realised my fear holds on to rules to protect myself just like you described if it feels like.. Then it's not good. The thing is, now you know its your attachement you also can recognise it happens every time if its someone you like. I hold on to the idea I needed a safe attached person and therefor I needed to be healed myself. Now I realise nobody especially at my age has not have some sort of past trauma or bad experiences and it's moreso about the ability to work to eachother without actively trying to fix. It is about trusting yourself that you can recognise what is not acceptable and to be able to communicate your needs and boundries, it sets the president for what you allow. And you know you can walk away even if your feelings are saying differently as you know that would be best for you. So then in dating it is about learning to trust more on your intuition and to express your vulnerable thoufhts and feelings to see if it is receipocated so there can be build a genuine connection. I do think it's still difficult to not demand full transparency from the get go because it looks like intent and authentic communication but it is also fearbased and a need for controll and reassurance in a stage that you should find reassurence in yourself and observe more if that person is truthful and safe consistently not just because they tell you so. But aslong as these things feel forren and you keep repeating the same patterns I would suggest to take a break of dating and actually focuss on yourself and your growth so you can change the cycle for yourself and others and start fresh again when you feel more confident in yourself. :)
@@user-js4mt1nr2yYes. Thank you. Take a break from dating. Be committed to healing your attachment wounds. Seriously. I’m trying to be empathetic to the original poster but also it’s so obvious. You have the data from all the past times you’ve gotten terrified and run away and acted out your wounds. Stop jumping back in and repeating the same patterns. Get therapy, read books, go through the courses that Thais offers (one course is literally called Healing Your Attachment Wounds - have you taken it? What are you waiting for??). Why are you torturing yourself and every single potential partner. Do yourself and the world a favor and get to work on yourself. After 6 months or a year of committed work dip your toes back in and see in real time how you’ve progressed with healing your wounds. I have done this. I used to chase avoidants because I was anxious and I thought if I could get someone who was pulling away or stonewalling me to love me then I was worthy. I married an avoidant and then got crushed. And a year after she ghosted the marriage without barely a peep (sound familiar?), I dipped my toe back into dating and wouldn’t ya know found myself trying to get an avoidant to love me (this time FA instead of DA) but guess what. This time when she pulled away and rejected me, I observed my instinct to chase after her and somehow convince her to just let me love you and love me in return!!! And I had this dark night of the soul where I was up against my old patterns of intense anxiety and feeling abandoned and I wanted to text her call her so bad, but I held off, and I focused on my own self worth and how I’m okay if she chooses to not see the value in me. And guess what. I came into the light of the next day and I didn’t need to chase and I was okay that she didn’t want me. And now I am a new person and I’m no longer sacrificing my integrity and self esteem in order to get someone to value me. So YOU CAN DO THIS but you need to commit to yourself. You have the data now. You know your patterns. Now Get to fricking work.
I have a DA who has been doing this over and over - for years. I thought it was a DA thing. We were friends for a long time (although there were strong feelings and a real connection) and every time we got closer, he would look terrified and then leave in a hurry. Then he would come back months later. This last time we spent more time together and got closer than ever and he freaked out and ran again. This time I have left him to it and have not attempted to go to any of the places that I know he goes. I can't take the rollercoaster ride of getting my hopes up and thinking that this time may be different; and then he does it again. This has been going on for so long - I don't get why he hasn't got help. I know that this is probably as awful for him as it is for me.
The DA I was seeing for a month did the same thing. If he’s not into exclusivity then how was he in a serious relationship the past 4 years? Cuz I’m not good enough, and she was.
As an avoidant, this is the best video I've encountered. It gives clear explanations for the roots of behaviors, It also gives an example of an actionable attempt at a fix. Lastly, it gives both parties a voice. This avoidant does want to meet halfway. I just don't want to crucify myself in the process! And, I get braver asI get older.
i met many women in my life, but only now for the first time an avoidant. so confusing, so painful. i cant even believe there is a whole science about it and people made so similar experiences to mine. everything happened exactly like that. it helped me a lot thank you all
I never knew what a DA was until I saw one of your videos. It completely explained my ex. She was sexually abused by her Dad as a child. We were best of friends as kids, both went our ways after high school and reconnected on social media. After dating for almost two years, she completely shut down and pulled a 180. Knowing what I've learned from you, it has helped me immensely to heal. I feel like I have gotten answers to so many questions.
What's uncanny is the ones criticizing the most usually have the biggest problem with being like this and haven't realized it yet. Self awareness is key
Having a relationship with an NPD and a Psycopath would be better then with an avoidant, avoidants are just bad, at least with the NPD you will have great intimacy
Thank you for this great video, Thais! Could you do a video about the Red Pill community and toxic masculinity as it relates to Avoidant relationship styles? I’m seeing it in action with my exboyfriend and his envy of his best friend (who is single, lives in the tropics, dates yoga teachers and travels whenever he wants to because he bought Tesla stock early!). These men are building walls around themselves, don’t want commitment, have multiple girlfriends in multiple towns. Good-hearted women are getting steam-rolled. Thank you for empowering men and women alike. 💜
Here's some from Dr Sam Vaknin and David Tian. The Uncensored Truth About Alpha Males -;David Tian PhD The Masculine Psychology Project podcast Man Up Uncensored Opinion Of The Red Pill-David Tian PhD Man Up Show The Unfiltered Truth About The Red Pill-David Tian PhD The Masculine Psychology Project podcast Episodes 1 and 2 Women Red Pill Nonsense Refuted - Dr Sam Vaknin podcast Manosphere Misogynistic Suicide-Dr Sam Vaknin podcast Tinder Myths Debunked - Dr Sam Vaknin podcast
@@MD-gk2un no changes for sure and no apologies from them for when you tell what your needs are in the relationship. Sometimes just radio silence - that’s what I got. Haven’t heard from them since except for a couple of emoji crumbs.
Where are the videos for avoidants to work on being IN a serious relationship? Why does all the work n consideration of needs feelings and basic requirements of a committed relationship fall on the more anxiously attached partner to consistently tip toe around the massive lack of connection and thick walls avoidants have to connecting in a meaningful way? Bizarre to always be told to tolerate and endure such coldheartedness, when there is rarely a focus on what an avoidant could do. Ahhh right... they don't seem to care to even attempt to improve, grow or heal.....right. silly me!
Exactly! If they were aware and know or even care about what they are doing to those that love them they would try and get help. Instead we have to look at these videos and decide how to move on for our own good.
She gave a good example in another video. Basically as follows: Let's say you want to go nice skating with your DA. But they've never been ice skating. If you want to skate with them, you have to go at their speed because they literally have no idea what to do. You cannot go any faster because they will fall, get frustrated, maybe give up. They can learn to skate but you have to be patient and help them along.
Thank you Thais for sharing your knowledge. Massive gratitude to everyone else in this community for openly sharing your experiences. It's a HUGE help to me. 🙏🏼💓🙏🏼
I wish I had seen this video when it came out, and I needed it... I got the "give them space" and "self soothe" down from all other videos before this one (from literally every channel) but still felt us drift apart and I didn't know how to handle it until it was too late.
I don't understand the avoidant attachment style. They want to be in a relationship but when it gets too close they turn it off!!!! It's like when you're really hungry and then you ignore food. I understand now.
Much better is how to know it’s not salvageable. If they think you’re the problem and they’re not working on themselves, it’s absolutely not salvageable.
Asking directly what they want. If they can't own up please move on or else you will get deeply entrenched with mortgage marriage kids and decades of frustration
i wish i had seen all your videos when i still was on time to come back with her. Not sure though that i would have been able to adapt to her behaviour. We wouldnt have last any longer probably. At least thanks to you i know why. Specifically Thais, your concept of "feelings minus fears" explains why she acted like a robot driven only by the gap between the two elements
I think people are mixing psychopaths with aa. Trust me they’re not the same at all. They might have similar traits but they are so different. I have aa style and I am working on improving it so hard. I was a victim of narcissistic abuse for 10 years and it was so bad. After 4 years now I am trying to start a new relationship and suddenly all these problems come up. I realises I have aa style. I might sound like I am playing mind games and want to be chased but I didn’t mean it at all. The difference is I know I am wrong and I want to change but narcissistic will never want to change and they never admit they’re wrong. I am in new relationship and it hurts to read all the comments. I am not trying to be abusive at all. I am just too scared to open up with him and then get hurt. For the last 3 weeks he’s been very gentle with me and he really pushed me to open up. One day he pulled away a bit and slowed down and it made me think and realise how good he was. The video is right , and it does work but only for people who want to change. I am always trying my best.
@Sarah half the time people don't know what they're talking about, they get hurt then lash out verbally and in comment section. When there's a will there's a way, and recognizing the problem is 50% of the battle won already. We can heal fully ❤
I have never chased, BUT he continues to look for me. Once he gets close, he ghosts and then tries to come back. He did mention that i am the only woman who has never chased him. I will not ever chase a man. I also need to block and stop talking to him again. I'm exhausted. He has been looking for me for almost 3 years! Smh!
Had a deep connection with a DA over five months. They spent two -three days a week with me. Said they really loved me. Started to pull away so I ended things then without really understanding them. Beyond the gaslighting and lack of transparency I still think it could work. It’s been one week when should I reach out again?
@@ritapeters1330covert as in, narcissist? DA and narc are different things; attachment style vs. personality disorder. Narcs like conflict and FA seems to fit their nature best... Speaking as someone who became DA after two long term relationships, including a marriage there, with narcissists with FA attachment styles. One major diffs is that DA are conflict avoidant whilst narcs look for it. Sign of narc: big victim mentality, gaslighting, controlling, criticizing everything and everyone, isolates (covert narc) rage explosions, love triangles, fights and it's always your fault (grandiose). DA can be strong empaths, hence narcs are drawn to us. I find people throw the terms out without having had any personal experience neither studying it
@@ashton1952 I studied it I am a therapist and am experiencing it myself, covert narc / DA, yes, very difficult, I have secure attachment style. So I set boundaries. FA as you suggest is not good for a covert narcisisst nor a DA. He gets 100% security from me as well as boundaries. That works, I can assure you. Covert narc is vulnerable too, no more rage outbursts anymore, sometimes devaluation ... can discuss things now ... DA parts in him refuse closeness, intimacy matters come up, but he is improving ... Greetings from Germany , he is from Slovenia and macho type who misses me
Can avoidants in the beginning of the relationship love bombing you? Text you a lot and stuff and then slowly or suddenly (depends on the case( when the relationship progress stop that? I was dating an avoidant and he was all over me in the begging and when things got more deep he scared and got cold
The DA I know is actually a malignant narc. A lot of DAs are actually narcs. Either way, it’s an abusive situation. Kim Saeed talks about this a lot. Sorry you went through this! It sucks and is very painful.
Yes.....I experienced exactly what you are describing. And over 2 years, it has been off and on. When he gets emotionally close.....poof, he ends the relationship or disappears. I see him struggle with expressing his emotions and feelings and hides behind sarcasm. But, the closeness and openness that was once the first few months of our relationship with morning texts, and frequent phone calls was seldom if ever experienced again. Hope this helps, and NO..... he is most definitely NOT a narcissist. He has a big heart and caring . But for an emotional and intimate relationship, it can be too much and have those triggers.
After months of on / off since our initial "formal" break-up, I gave me ex fiancé an ultimatum, then I stepped back. A week later, he texted me, but I disregarded his teenage emoji attempt, not because I don't love him, but because my new boundary was set that other time. It hurts deep, but the situation was not improving: he continued to fight me instead of save us, sadly.
Thais....I feel like I might of miss what the DA does when you stop chasing.. or did it ever get properly addressed?? YOU elaborate what we should do, but didn't really address from the DA point.
Actually she has been very clear, if you stop chasing you give the DA the time and space he/she needs so they will probably come back. but then the cycle starts again It is the worth?
Yes, if you accept them leaving, or you leave them and go no contact, it will leave a sense of unfinished business, and they would probably want to pursue you again. It took my ex about 6 months, than he started writing again. I was already moving on, but after a lot of thought, we got back together and now have a baby together. Things are better than ever ❤️ They do however have to be willing to take accountability for their actions and to want to get better. Mine was seeing a therapist twice a week for the time we were apart and that made a huge difference!
When you stop chasing them you realise they were never in love with you in the first place. They will never reciprocate and was one sided. I understand that now - I was flattered by the love bombing and kept chasing that feeling when they did that. Really they did it to get you to catch feelings for their dopamine rush and when that supply ends they bail. Very cruel and traumatising.
The comments,,, just imagine all the guys/girls you liked saying the same thing about you, not giving you the benefit of the doubt…. No matter what someone is going through they deserve love, and honestly if you’re not prepared to take on the work of being in a relationship well I’d say stay single.. everyone has some issues they are dealing with, I’d much rather be with someone afraid of being loved then with someone who thinks everyone loves them and they can just be with anyone.. If you see and feel love from them,, maybe it’s worth it to try, maybe not forever but love is always worth it! Always!! If anything you learn something about you and others too! Be kind be love
You must have really poor boundaries. Most of us un the comments have felt the hurt and trauma of being with a DA. No one is saying they don't deserve love. We just don't deserve one side relationships and to neglect and burn ourselves in order to keep them warm. If enough people are saying the same thing about you, who is the common factor? Saying "it's worth a try" while ignoring reg flags is very poor risk management.
It's funny to me in the comments, how y'all bash these people so badly. They are wounded people, prolly because of other people. And you are wounded now because of them, so maybe, try to understand that they didn't want to be this way, just like you don't want to be how you were during or after the relationship with them. If they were in a household like that for years, that subconscious programming will not be easily broken, just like your healing afterwards was not easy to break. Maybe some compassion, empathy, and understanding, might allow you to see why they are the way they are, and can make it easier for you to heal and forgive them. "Once you understand everything, you can forgive everything." But most people don't want to understand, just judge others, while they themselves prolly hate when others are judging them for their behavior and decisions.
Its hard when you really do have compassion for their situation. In a way they sort of destroy what they love and its a sad story. I still really care about the person who did this to me because I could see his soul underneath all the pain and trauma and I could see direct patterns from his family members too. My greatest hope is that leaving him might be some sort of gift or sign in his life that will cause him to realize he needs to self reflect and change. I think leaving him was the most loving thing to do for everyone involved.
I like your post, it is my opinion too, I am with a covert / DA, it can work, he shows me love, greetings from Germany, he is from Slowenia, he has built up trust in me, that I want good for him, I think that counts
Do DA process the more serious conversations about the relationship eventually? We broke up 3 months ago, we still love each other, we talked for hours, but he said he feels trapped and suffocated with the idea of being in a relationship, that had we only been together for 2 weeks every time he looked back we would be fine, but looking back and seeing 1,5 years messed with his mind. We've spoken a couple of times about attachment and what each of us are (him DA, me FA) but he maintains he doesn't know how to fix it nor does he think he ever can. I just want to know if eventually he'll let our talks set in, I don't want him to end up alone, it doesn't have to be with me, it doesn't have to be romantically, but i want him to find happiness and intimacy with someone, even surrounded by friends and family he's so lonely...
Your last paragraph.... That's why even if I cease being romantic with the DA due to his inability to meet basic relationship requirements , I would want to keep being his friend He has nobody. I still want to keep him under my wing.
DA easily finds another anxious to pour into so they don't get left alone with their emotions. It hurts but they dismiss, they avoid. We have to heal ourselves.
After 7 yrs he couldn’t commit so I did no contact and he’s with someone new within 3wks. I’m heart broken. Will he miss me at all? He’s always chasing other women and that’s been our only problem. I miss him 😢 He said we have a strong connection, do you think he’ll come back?
They quickly rebound just pretending you, the ex, was no worth and pretending they never really loved you. They quickly fall again into the cycle attraction /withdraw with the new partner after 3 months . So they realize " oh my ex wasnt so bad though". Thats the moment they will come back, therefore ask yourself: do i really want to wait three months to see if this happens and then fall again in the old cycle? If you say yes you will be in and out again (like katy Perry's song) but there will not be a happy ending unless you want to live like an emotional shock absorber forever
Don't waste your time. You need to heal, and move on. Actions speak louder than words- so why would you WANT to stay with a man who can move on from you in 3 weeks when you were together for 6 years? That's a heartless move. You even ADMITTED he has a problem flirting with girls- does he SOUND like a person who will ever be in a committed relationship with you? I would never be able to trust him.
Sooooo…navigating the anxious avoidant female friend who seems to like having you around, was concerned when you had a girlfriend, missed not having you around when you did, likes having you back around because you aren’t dating anymore…can’t see herself with anyone and knows it’s not a healthy perspective… Struggling with the proper level of emotional investment to have…
I've been watching your videos & what I'm understanding is there can't be a healthy happy relationship with someone with this attachment. Too bad I didn’t know about you when I was learning about the narcissist, & getting out of domestic violence. This is just as bad.... only opposite.
The only way to win is to stop caring. Anything else with an avoidant is a losing battle. I love myself way more than I love her. And walking away was like pulling a harpoon out of my chest but how else was I going to heal. I’ve been slowly walking into my new life and it feels so good. I’m getting fit and am already good looking, smart, caring, considerate, yet still alpha, assertive and most of all as unique as it gets as a man. Ultimately, the only thing I lost is the persistent migraine from dealing with an adult baby. She will find someone else to turn her back on and I will consistently attract powerful women with my carefree approach. The most powerful trait any man can have is the ability to detach from any and all outcomes. I’m just as ok being single as I am being connected with a perfect 10. Was always that way until I meet a woman who I think deserves my heart. I attracted a total head case with this one.
Wow, how can I have your mindset bro? Currently going through the same thing but I am sad and hurt even though she’s exactly the way you describe your ex, she’s literally an “adult baby” with horrific level mental issues.
I know this is a video about chasing a DA, but as a DA I agree you shouldn't chase anyone. If woman doesn't want to listen and understand my values and the facts I trust, I am out the door. Life is too short.
do you see a difference in "chasing" & "fighting for"? i'm in a ldr with a da who has repeatedly expressed sentiments about not chasing or holding anyone hostage but not too long ago floored me when referenced continuing to fight for our relationship though always felt i understand certain aspects of their da-ness as an fa & have actively tried to understand their perspective & values rather than projecting my stuff on them was admittedly shocked they'd felt like they'd fought for our relationship when i could pull back from my own fears & patterns to look at our history, i saw they've done things that probably feel like "fighting for" our relationship to a da (not trying to be judgemental or condescending just noting different perspectives) i love, respect & appreciate them for so many reasons, including how our dynamic organically encourages me to work on becoming more secure & less controlled by insecurities, etc but admittedly can be tricky especially when our natural tendencies clash they've acknowledged being with people less open & supportive as i am has led them to be more closed off which they've definitely worked on, still i often feel a little lost with how to balance the amount of reaching out i need with their aversion to being chased obviously you can't answer for them, lol, just wondered if you might have some insight on how a da may differentiate "fighting for" from "chasing" &/or anything else that might be helpful (das sharing their perspective has been super helpful in general) if you actually read all this (get life's short & strangers online who ramble aren't necessarily the most rewarding use of people's time 😳) thank you & best wishes with your healing journey even if not 💚
@r_and_a Your first part is definitely a da trait. Da people prefer long distance relationships because they can keep you at an arms length and they don't feel too close. So when you first meet someone you're interested in, that's pursuing. Totally fine and normal. If they end up telling you directly or indirectly that they aren't interested, and you continue to pursue, that's chasing. And that's not something you should do. You're basically trying to convince them of why you are a good person that you should be liked by them etc. If someone doesn't like you, that's totally fine. Doesn't mean you're not likeable or not a nice person. You should absolutely refuse to chase or fight for someone who isn't interested in chasing or fighting for you. I agree that da people take things slow and are slow to open up and be vulnerable, but if they like you and trust you, they will. You need to be patient. They also absolutely hate conflict and criticism, so you'll need to be careful about how you talk about your needs and concerns. There are plenty of pds videos about all this. Da people will also prefer the type of partner who has less emotional needs and from an fa point of view, someone who 'doesn't care'. I'm an fa so I understand all this. They just don't have to emotional bandwidth to understand and comprehend our emotional side. If you feel that your da is understanding, and meeting you halfway with your needs and concerns, and you feel they are interested and do like you, then go for gold. Just be aware, that it will be a totally different dynamic if you 2 were to be closer in person. My last thing with a da, who lives 5 minutes away, felt like a ldr. But that didn't work for me. Plus they refused to see and understand my point of view so I had to end it. Granted I didn't know a thing about attachment styles and I went at it all wrong and essentially was my own doing. But now I have learnt about it, im working on myself a lot, I have apologised and now we are nc. Maybe in the future we will reconnect, but not right now. I know I have rambled on too lol and i hope i have helped and answered your questions. I wish you all the best in your future journey.
@@psi23k as a fellow fa, unsure one could ramble on too long about this sort of thing, lol, thank you for sharing your experience & understanding pds videos (& webinars during my trial, lol, if only had the resources to continue, grateful so much is offered for free) have been super helpful since found them 6mo ago 💚 i'm trying to move closer (not because of or to chase them just have always wanted to live where they are) so guess i'll see how things change then as i'm working on healing from c-ptsd & major trust issues long distance has benefitted both of us, unsure either of us would've persisted to this point if we'd lived closer initially my emotional bandwidth/needs/etc are definitely too much for them but many of those are easier for me to meet in other ways than what they offer thank you again for your reply & best wishes ~ hope you have a wonderful weekend, you've certainly helped mine start off better
I used to be an avoidant listen just dont get involed its never ending circle its toxic its push pull its just horrible.. I feel sorry for all my exs that had to deal with that fucked up version of me
How do I give my DA “space” when our relationship is mostly over text? (Phone calls make him uncomfortable and we see each other once every 1.5 to 2 months, for maybe 4 hours average.) I keep wanting to text him words of support, is that okay because he can still choose when to read? And if I don’t text and just wait, how do I know when he’s ready to talk and how does he know I’m waiting and willing to talk?
@@davemaurer7341 Thanks for the answer, I was basically joking with this question because my comment was directed at this lady ☝🏾 who is able to babble for 18 minutes without getting a clear answer to the title of the post... Your comment answered me more than 6 min monologue, I like👍🏾
And what if he told me he has to learn to love himself first before he can love anyone again(he is divorced)? But now he is spending time and having sex with a woman he had relationship before me. She posted a pic of them kissing. We met once, he said I looked great. But now he is ignoring me if we bump into eachother, he is very serious and not smiling anymore. He ignored a text I sent him. What should I do in this case? I did no contact for 2,5 months. Then he started communicating. We had sex aswell. And now he's with that other woman... Any advice please?!🙏
@@elenalimberg7364pds several videos on how to heal from breakups & even if that's not exactly what you're going through, imagine you might find some of it helpful particular aspects thinking of include getting clear on your own needs, especially those the relationship triggered & others ways to meet them pds videos on the topics of limerence & reconnecting with an ex might also have some helpful insight or tips for you as you navigate your situation the best advice imo is working on becoming more secure, as that will help you regardless of what happens with your current situation & pds is a great resource! i'm so sorry for what you're experiencing & wish you the best on your healing journey 💚
I’m saying this from very personal experience - Maybe ponder why you’d want to chase a man who treats you so badly and doesn’t seem to want you. For me I felt like I was throwing myself away by just treating someone like he was treating me and I wanted someone to treat me as special as I treated him. And recently BINGO I finally understood-- I needed to treat myself as precious and not throw myself away. Turns out I was constantly abandoning myself my whole life. I’m in PdS (and in a very positive church) and they are providing me skills to treat myself very well and heal from a lot of stuff. I wasn’t taught these skills ever and turns out they are fundamental for life. Maybe that gets your wheels turning? It helped me to listen to others’ stories too.
It seems a big demographic of viewers here are the "just broken up and still bitter about it" group lol 🫶 I'm sorry you're going through tough times, but this attitude that they are simply undateable and unlovable stinks, and it's wildly inaccurate. It's so strange to broadcast that immature attitude in the very place that's handing you the resources you need to grow out of it on a plate. All you need to know to *understand* partners like this instead of shaming them is right here, maybe come back when you're ready, listen and learn.
