What If The Crusades Succeeded? | Alternate History

Подписаться 230 тыс.

Просмотров 275 тыс.

50% 1

Invest in blue-chip art for the very first time by signing up for Masterworks: masterworks.art/monsieurz
Purchase shares in great masterpieces from artists like Pablo Picasso, Banksy, Andy Warhol, and more.
See important Masterworks disclosures: mw-art.co/37WwvbD.
The Crusades were a series of efforts by the Christian powers of Europe to retake and secure historically held lands along the East Mediterranean coast; lands which held deep meaning to the West, having been the birthplace of Christianity. The First Crusade succeeded in retaking the Holy Land of Jerusalem, however, for a myriad of reasons, these lands were gradually lost, and each time new Crusades were launched in an effort to re-secure them, but time and time again, the subsequent Crusades would fail, with the Fourth Crusade infamously crippling the fellow Christian Empire of Byzantium, and leaving the Near East all the more vulnerable. In today's video we will ask and answer the questions of why the Crusades failed, could the Crusades realistically have worked, and of course, what if the Crusades succeeded?
_____________________________________________
#AlternateHistory #MonsieurZ #History
New Videos Every Saturday At 11:00 AM EST
______________________________________________
Donate on Patreon: / monsieurz
Become a Channel Donor: / @monsieurdean
______________________________________________
Website:
www.USofZ.com/feed
______________________________________________
Music Used: Desert Caravan

Опубликовано:

28 июн 2024

Ссылка:

Скачать:

Готовим ссылку...

Добавить в:

Мой плейлист

Посмотреть позже

Комментарии : 825

@MonsieurDean 2 года назад

Let's thank Masterworks for sponsoring today's video. Purchase shares in great masterpieces from artists like Pablo Picasso, Banksy, Andy Warhol, and more: masterworks.art/monsieurz See important Masterworks disclosures: mw-art.co/37WwvbD. *NEW VIDEOS EVERY SATURDAY AT 11AM*

@megakillerx 2 года назад

Isn’t this just an NFT-type scheme?

@eagleowl833 2 года назад

Oh god, your advertising NFT's.😔

@nathantripathy 2 года назад

Deception? What deception? Stephen wasn't lying, he had false information.

@forickgrimaldus8301 2 года назад

This is basically my Crusader States in Stainless Steel late game Campaing, eliminating the Ayyubids, maintain an alliance with Byzantium, eliminate the Seljuks ect. Though my Campaings usually have me fighting Sicily.

@lollylefty4415 2 года назад

Monsieur, sorry can a create a video in Italian of your video?

@XxLIVRAxX 2 года назад

A Re-Christianized and "Re-Latinized" (at least partially) North Africa is a fascinating "what if" historical scenario, it would have change the history of the mediterranean world.

@davidturner4076 2 года назад

That would be an extremelly based alternate timeline.

@S3aCa1mRa1n 2 года назад

They probably wouldn’t be so poor

@davidturner4076 2 года назад

@@S3aCa1mRa1n they would also be seen as culturally European, or at least close to it.

@tsv2087 2 года назад

@@memezoffuckery3207 TF did I just read?

@slyasleep 2 года назад

@@S3aCa1mRa1n or they would still be poor, but at least also smug, like many Christians are.

@PakBallandSami 2 года назад

fun fact: The fall of Edessa caused great consternation in Jerusalem and Western Europe, tampering the enthusiastic success of the First Crusade. Calls for a new crusade-the Second Crusade-were immediate, and was the first to be led by European kings. Concurrent campaigns as part of the Reconquista and Northern Crusades are also sometimes associated with this Crusade.The aftermath of the Crusade saw the Muslim world united around Saladin, leading to the fall of Jerusalem.

@obviousgorilla124 2 года назад

Historically inaccurate. Saladin is considered to have united the final parts of the Muslim forces around 1187, when he took Jerusalem, not before (Also the aftermath of the second crusade did not unite the Muslim world, for example how the Egyptian Caliphate was still in complete turmoil even just before the third crusade). It didn't lead to its fall, Division among the Crusaders did, for example how King Guy of Jerusalem saw his only allies as those who were dedicated to bring him to personal ruin (Raymond specifically) so he therefore decided at the Battle of Hattin to take a massive gamble instead of sound Frankish battle strategy when fighting Saladin, leading to his downfall and eventual seize of all powers by Saladin himself... that then led to to the unification process Saladin saw fit to proceed with.

@johnnottellingyou2402 2 года назад

@@obviousgorilla124 you know what is historically accurate? you getting no bitches, HAH got em!

@Massiveboy21 2 года назад

@@johnnottellingyou2402 you don’t need to be rude

@johnnottellingyou2402 2 года назад

@@Massiveboy21 but i was just playin

@quin2392 2 года назад

@@johnnottellingyou2402 lmao 😂

@thomassenbart 2 года назад

The 1st Crusade definitely succeeded and the fact that there were Crusader States in the region for hundreds of years after, also speak to success. Any endeavor that lasts that long cannot be considered a failure.

@thedeadlysquidward1641 2 года назад

I think the first was successful not the rest especially the 4th

@GarkKahn 2 года назад

@@thedeadlysquidward1641 yeah but the 4th was funnier tho

@user-rv4wn5qk7q 2 года назад

@@thedeadlysquidward1641 The 3rd Crusade was successful

@thedeadlysquidward1641 2 года назад

@@user-rv4wn5qk7q kind of a side mission the main goal was to take Jerusalem but they did some other stuff

@thedeadlysquidward1641 2 года назад

im in religion class right now learning about the differences between middle ages Catholicism and modern

@volbound1700 2 года назад

Due to the various factions on the Christian and Muslim side, it is hard to envision what a Crusader victory would look like or what the actual aims were. In Europe, some of the logic behind the Crusades was to stop wars within Europe. The Byzantine faction also creates an interesting scenario as it was both a friend and enemy of the Crusades and in many ways suffered the greatest from the Crusades out of any faction due to the Fourth Crusade. In some ways the Crusades were a success in slowing down Islamic expansion, stopping wars in Europe, and bringing new tech into Europe but in other ways they were an absolute failure. The aims and goals of the Crusades were not defined other than take Jerusalem so this is a HUGE reason for their failure. IMO, the best scenario would have been the Crusaders fighting under the banner of the Byzantines and saving Byzantium. That is the only realistic win scenario that is available. An independent Crusader state as described in the video (and even pointed out in the video) would have many, many challenges that would derail it. However, I agree if it survives to the 1500s, it is likely staying put.

@matthiuskoenig3378 2 года назад

it would likely look like the Reconquista or the northern crusade. 2 similar situations that ended up working out. especially the northern crusade. the holy lands would likely be desert Prussia.

@volbound1700 2 года назад

@@matthiuskoenig3378 Possibly, IMO they were just too isolate and there wasn't much of a cultural influence on the culture. The Christian (and Jewish) populations that came to the support of the Crusader States were already native to the areas and were really more Coptic and Orthodox than Catholic. The main thing that allowed the Kingdom of Jerusalem to even survive as long as it did was its willingness to be tolerate towards other versions of Christian, Judaism, and some less hostile sects of Islam. There just wasn't enough population and manpower in the area for the Crusader States to survive once thy had to go up against a real Eastern Threat like Saladin's united Arabs, Mongols, Mamelukes, Ottomans, etc.

@codyyancey1367 2 года назад

i dont know the point of most of the crusades but the first one was to protect the byzantine empire from the aggression of the islamic nations and take the holy site of Jerusalem

@volbound1700 2 года назад

@@codyyancey1367 that was one goal but, in my opinion, behind closed doors, the Catholic Church saw it as a chance to stop fighting between European countries and get the war elements off to another part of the world. That was the main motivation.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

@@volbound1700 Crusades against Cyprus and Constantinople showed clearly that kings and knights had very different motivation - Money.

@darthguilder1923 2 года назад

I think something you didn’t look at were the non-Catholic Christians in this crusader kingdom. Egypt had a significant amount of Coptic Christians and there are other branches in the Levant. The byzantines had treated the Copts in Egypt pretty poorly before the Arabs conquered Egypt (doing so with far inferior numbers and less adept at siege warfare). If the Catholic crusader kingdoms chose to persecute the other Christians and try to force conversions like the Byzantines had before, I think their time would be limited. But assuming your scenario of expanding into Egypt and a decision to tolerate groups like Copts and integrate them into their armies and economy (with European catholics initially as the elites) they could have more success.

@budahbaba7856 2 года назад

This is a point i think is important. I identify as Christian myself. The eastern Roman Empire had a long documented history of schism with the other Christian capitals. This is not even a conversation about who was wrong or who was right -but it is about the fact that Christians in the east, and in north Africa would feel so alienated from Constantinople and Rome that they would take Islam over Christianity. And i think this point is important because it was the mid East, and north Africa who were the first centers of Christianity. What i am saying is that there is somewhere within the Catholic's church inflexibility at understanding Arianism, and the Eastern Roman empires excessive taxation on these parts to where they found Islam as a more agreeable alternative. And no i do not believe for a moment what a "Hallelujah" moment that was for them. They took what they could get. Take into account too, the thing that allowed Islam to spread militarily, it was WAR! The wars with the Persians, why were those necessary? Both the Christians and the Zoroastrians would be the losers.

@honkeykong4049 2 года назад

@@budahbaba7856 You're either a Catholic, or a heretic. There is no middle ground. Catholicism is the only religion which can trace its lineage back to Jesus Christ and his apostle Peter. All other offshoots from Catholicism are heresies built on lies and/or misconceptions.

@singularityraptor4022 2 года назад

@@honkeykong4049 found the fanatic cultist

@sir0herrbatka 2 года назад

That's interesting because Copts are considered to be orthodox, not heterodox.

@alessiodecarolis 2 года назад

Tolerance was a word that pratically didn't exist in these times' dictionary. With the exception of Federick the 2nd, all the others Christian Kings weren't so pragmatical on religious matters

@Ali-bu6lo 2 года назад

Egypt had a large Arabic-speaking Coptic Christian minority by 1100s. They would probably reach majority again under Crusader rule. Though Arabic language may remain dominant given it became common far before Egypt became majority Muslim.

@12SPASTIC12 2 года назад

That's an interesting idea, but I don't see a Coptic resurgence. Crusaders would be unlikely to significantly support the "wrong" Miaphysite Christianity of the Copts. I do think that the persecution suffered under the Mamluks would be avoided, so there would be a lot more Copts (25%-30% maybe) and they'd preserve their language. Whether they are Catholicised or retain their own church depends on the tolerance of the crusader kings. However, I suspect that most of Egypt's population (which was already majority Arab and Muslim by the 11th century) would simply convert to Catholicism but maintain the Arabic language. They would be like Maronites, except not a minority group and probably with stronger European influence. They may even abandon Arabic in favour of an Egyptian offshoot of French, but I think that is unlikely. You would probably also have many thousands of Muslims left. A lot of them would be Shia because of the Fatimid legacy. They might migrate to more remote areas- maybe as far as Nubia to avoid persecution. Alternatively, they might be worked expelled, just like in Spain.

@odinfromcentr2 2 года назад

The Copts could also work out a deal to mend the schism. The Coptic Catholic Church is, after all, a thing.

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

new slave girls for the barbary states.

@warcriminalgaming2359 Год назад

@@12SPASTIC12 I find it unlikely, 1000 years is a long time and even if half of it was spent trying to change the language, one of the easiest things to change of an area (the language would be changed due to the connections to Islam) I find it likely that it would be

@Tracer_Krieg 2 года назад

Here's something else to consider from this timeline. Aside from obvious religious differences due to there being now more powerful Christian theocratic states, there is one event that may prevent all the events that made the Reformation inevitable: the destruction of the Knights Templar. To provide context, the Templars relocated to Paris after the destruction of Acre, where they loaned a considerable amount of money to the French King, Philip the Fair, in his wars against the English. Unable to pay them back, Philip arranged for the seizure of Templar treasury and lands under the pretense of persecuting heretics, even going so far as to attempt to kidnap and eventually kill the current Pope. This then led to a French Bishop and puppet taking over the Papacy, moving it to France where it incur much of the corruption that led to the worst years of the Papacy. Even after finally moving back to Rome, these corruptive practices would lead to a severely weakened image, with none of the Christian Kings paying it tribute and thus forcing it to take on political indulgences instead. This prompted Martin Luthor to post his 95 Thesis and lead to the Reformation. Because the Templars remain in the Holy Land and have no involvement with the French Court, the circumstances that led to the takeover of the Papacy do not occur and the Papal States remain a powerful political figure in Europe. How does the Christian world look from this point forward?

@matthiuskoenig3378 2 года назад

martin luther, if anything, would probably just want minor reforms in this timeline (like the so called 'counter-reformation' in OTL) and protestants don't really form. without the 30 years war European colonisation is probably faster earlier, and north america in this timeline probably resembles south America alot more. i wonder if the holy roman empire would not also spread more.

@EPICoutcast24 2 года назад

Butterfly flaps its wings man

@genghiskhan5701 2 года назад

I like how this implies France, the first daughter of the Church, single handedly destroyed the power and prestige of the Papacy.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

Papal states would be more powerful obviously. Maybe they would win Cambrai League war? And Unify Italy under the Pope?

@singularityraptor4022 2 года назад

Or could crumble even harder being drunk on power. Such things are common throughout the history and the most likely outcome out of all idealistic ones.

@no1ofconsequence936 2 года назад

Just seeing Armenian Cilicia was a treat, and getting mentioned was even better. I can imagine in this timeline Armenian Cilicia would eventually push for retaking their historic homeland in the Armenian Highlands, whether as part of the Crusader States or as an independent entity. That said, this mention alone may have just made my day.

@matthiuskoenig3378 2 года назад

i imagine they would also accept byzantine control of the region, after all when the byzantines controlled it sometimes armenains became emperors.

@no1ofconsequence936 2 года назад

@@matthiuskoenig3378 , fair point.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

Nah, a Resurgent Byzantium means an annexed or vassalized Cilicia like what happened under John and Manuel Komnenos. Antioch remaining united with the Crusader states with a resurgence in Byzantine power is also impossible. They considered it dejure their’s and historically subjugated them under Manuel.

@ivokantarski6220 2 года назад

I'm from Bulgaria so not feeling enough satisfied with Ottomans not being a thing cause Bulgaria in this video doesnt exist. In my opinion it would exist soon again. The Mongol hordes would likely put more pressure on the mid east in such scenario since if United it be more wealth waiting for grabs.

@Nimai_Aquino 2 года назад

May I ask why armenian cilicia is so important to you? Are you armenian?

@achaeanmapping4408 2 года назад

Iʻve been working on an ethnic map of such a secnario, for some time now! Great to see you exploring such a timeline!

@MonsieurDean 2 года назад

Looking forward to seeing that. Post it on the site: www.usofz.com/feed

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

What matters is the religion not ethnicity. if the Levant was a Christian majority it would surely be an atheist degenerate place, where women go naked for everyone. like your countries. just like the rest of Europe and America.

@starman1144 2 года назад

13:14 I'm pretty sure that Egypt at the time of the Crusades still had a majority (Coptic) Christian population so that part doesn't make much sense.

@matthiuskoenig3378 2 года назад

yes according to Muslim sources Coptic Christians were still the majority of the population at the time of the first crusade (specifically Al-Muqaddasi). (edit: that said relgious tensions between copts and latin christians might still result in a breakaway, depending on how things are handled)

@dontcomply3976 2 года назад

@@matthiuskoenig3378 It might have been some thing like Norman England with a Latin speaking elite and a mostly Coptic underclass

@starman1144 2 года назад

@@dontcomply3976 not really. The Normans and the Anglosaxons were both Catholic at the time. Here the native Egyptians would be Coptic Orthodox and the Frankish Crusaders would be Roman Catholic. Probably Ireland under British control would be a better comparison.

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

coptic or catholic or orthodox, you all dayouth infidels who worship the cross.

@HorrorUberAlles 2 года назад

_[Sabaton faintly echoes in the distance]_

@andrewlucero3631 2 года назад

you realize that it was only around the time of Baldwin the 1st of Jerusalem that Egypt lost it's majority Christian Population, the Miaphysites would never allow the westerners rule them for long, if the crusaders did rule Egypt they may either try to mend the schism between Alexandria and Rome, or not wanting revolts they may convert to Coptic Christianity and make Coptic the official language to gain allies in the native Egyptian population, as well as the Ethiopians of the horn and the Armenians who are also Miaphysites.

@SuperCrow02 2 года назад

Egyptians tend to be bad at rebelling against an occupying people. I doubt they would be more rebellious to fellow Christian rule than Muslim rule.

@andrewlucero3631 2 года назад

@@SuperCrow02 it wouldn't be rebellions directly but rather the perceived consequence of a rebellion, like the destabilization, and the ability of the surrounding Muslim states who could use the rebellion as a pretext to attack the state.

@expansionpack4485 2 года назад

Finally, Ethiopia isn't alone for hundreds of years.

@danshakuimo 2 года назад

The Italians would probably have never dreamt of conquering Ethiopia in this timeline.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

@@danshakuimo would Italy even exist? If trade routes come back to Christian hands, Venice, Genoa, Neapol, Milan, Papal states, etc. would be oil-rich far longer. Also there would be always Spain, France or Austria to put down possible "Unifier".

@danshakuimo 2 года назад

@@fkjl4717 Oh yeah you're right, a united Italy was a very recent thing. Things would be a lot different.

@user-kt8yp5ho2y 2 года назад

For the next alternate history, I’d like to see the What if Dollfuss survives from assassination then allied with Italy to avoid Anschluss and declare a war on Germany with the allies and What if Mongolia conquered Japan and see what will be happens. Plus, I’d like to see a new chapter of the Scar Nicholas that Hitler meet Nicholas II. I believe that Hitler become the minister of culture in Scar Nicholas Universe. :)

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

What allies LoL? UK and France totally ignored Anschluss IRL.

@brunoacostasilva 2 года назад

@@fkjl4717 THAT IS WHY IT'S ALTERNATE HISTORY.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

@@brunoacostasilva Oh, i m sorry, but i believe that Alternate History should be a HISTORY, not some random bullshit.

@brunoacostasilva 2 года назад

@@fkjl4717 It's not random, in fact, a Axis Victory would be evem more random and nosense by this criteria, yet it is one of most common and popular Alt History scenarios. You just don't understand the subject or is too proud to recognise an error.

@Tmessy_09 2 года назад

It’s glorious!!!!

@Lukdnuke_Narson 2 года назад

Hey

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

the lions of Arabia and Iraq would quickly destroy this dayouth state once it's 'established' ofcourse it's only in your dreams and youtube videos.

@giddy9831 8 месяцев назад

@@Sectarian.cope

@Cody-5501 2 года назад

In this timeline we can probably see a new sect of Christianity like Catholicism but with a pope on Jerusalem and a stronger emphasis on evangelism

@johnroach9026 2 года назад

I can imagine it being more like a Latinised Orthodox church, keeping the Pentarchy but embracing a predominantly Catholic doctrine and tradition

@bjorntheviking6039 2 года назад

There would need to be a blending of christian doctrines to keep the peace.

@danshakuimo 2 года назад

@@johnroach9026 Isn't that basically the Eastern Rite Catholic churches? Though it seems like you're saying the inverse where its Orthodox but Latinized, vs Catholic but retaining their own eastern rites more closely associated with Eastern Orthodoxy.

@jacksauce 2 года назад

How would the Protestant reformation affect it then? My theory is that we could also see a new type of Protestantism develop in the region at the time oof the reformation.

@Cody-5501 2 года назад

@@jacksauce maybe a slight change but I doubt a schism like the east Catholicism we see here would panic the Catholics enough to reform

@Thebiggestchief 2 года назад

One can only imagine 😔

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

imagine dayouth infidel, only in your dreams. reality is that Muslims will soon conquer Rome inshallah

@elemperadordemexico 2 года назад

@@Sectarian. cope more

@hall511 2 года назад

@@elemperadordemexico You're the ones who lost lmao

@elemperadordemexico 2 года назад

@@hall511 So did you, 1948-2022

@hall511 2 года назад

@@elemperadordemexico Didn't it take you 800 years to take back Iberia?

@georgios_5342 2 года назад

The Crusades were doomed to fail because they didn't stay true to their original objective: help the Byzantine Empire. Only the First Crusade did this. All the rest, most predominantly the Fourth, turned against Byzantium, which was split between Latin and Turkish spheres. The Catholics canibalized their own Orthodox allies for some extra islands and lands in the Balkans.

@arolemaprarath6615 2 года назад

@New History Official I would believe that Byzantine Greeks would reform and end the centuries old as Romans. There were tensions of Greek identity as well. If the Ottomans existed and conquered Constantinople, then by the help of Christian Europe, they successfully pushed the Turks out of Anatolia and freed the Greeks. The Greeks would rebrand themselves as another kingdom of Europe, this time as a Greek Orthodox superpower of the Eastern Medieteranean.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

@New History Official Have the Fleeing Crusaders not tell Alexios to turn back and that’s very much possible.

@ivokantarski6220 2 года назад

@New History Official I got another alternative for the 4th crusade. What if the newly established latin empire doesnt fight Bulgaria but accepts alliance? No1 on the Balkans be able to trouble it. No humiliation near Adrianopole and so on. Could always use an extra hand. After all they werent locals. Couldnt continually maintain decent sized armies.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

@New History Official the Push of Turks out of Anatolia never was a goal for crusaders. Their goal was "reclaim the Holy land" (Jerusalem, Palestine, Antioch, etc.) and create here a Christian state.

@GarkKahn 2 года назад

The byzantines retreating during the 1st crusade must be at least one reason for the europeans to tell the emperor to f*ck off during the next centuries

@HistoryOfRevolutions 2 года назад

"European merchants supply the best weaponry, contributing to their own defeat" - Salahuddin Al Ayyubi

@frigidlava617 2 года назад

@@scottanos9981 venetians

@therocinante3443 2 года назад

Yea that's the kind of underhanded malicious slimy thing they would believe

@themediumcheese 2 года назад

@@scottanos9981 le funny anti-Semitic reference

@MLGSHINGOJI_3000 2 года назад

@@scottanos9981 Italians who emulated the Jewish ways and became successful as a result

@pixelpeoplewarrior4221 2 года назад

Funny that I found this. I was just playing CK2 earlier and was King of Jerusalem but ended up swearing fealty to the Byzantines and later became emperor because I owned so much of the empire (over half) that I managed to get myself chosen as the next emperor. Big brain

@GarkKahn 2 года назад

Similar for me My son instead got the title of king of jerusalem and byzantine emperor after my death, and his sister became queen of bulgaria

@floofyluna2023 2 года назад

I'm in the middle of a CK2 game, and the Crusades actually worked in my game, with the establishment of the Kingdom of Jerusalem. Fast forward about 300-400 years, and Jerusalem controls Egypt, half of the Arabian Peninsula, and is making their way to Anatolia. Note that the Islamic world in my CK2 game is fractured and don't have a lot of massive kingdoms. Kept having rebellions and splitting apart.

@davidogundipe808 2 года назад

Oh God! Please does anyone know how I can get Mount and blade warband phantasy running on my system?

@elsalvadorindiana5322 2 года назад

I liked the first video and I wondered if you would ever do a remake. And I have to say, you didn't disappoint me. Thanks

@blackjannik9458 2 года назад

I waited so long for a video like this

@degoose2447 9 месяцев назад

The best timeline

@alanebrahim6073 2 года назад

What if William the conqueror lost the battle of Hastings.

@PriyankaSingh-jw9ug 2 года назад

Then he would only be known as William the Bastard

@sgauden02 2 года назад

Deus Vult! You should also remake your "What if Alexander The Great lived?" video. Also, how about "What if the Aztecs defeated Cortez?" or "What if the Mongols conquered Japan?"

@youthoughtaboutit6946 Год назад

Would love to see a series based on this.

@The_Struggler_ 2 года назад

Just imagine being able to move to Byzantium today, it sounds beautiful

@eidoneverchoosen1171 2 года назад

What if the Teutonic and Livonia orders successfully became a military power in Eastern Europe. Basically a military order independent of Europe kingdoms and empires like Germany holy Roman empire.

@Steadyaim101 2 года назад

The Teutonic and Livonian orders were already an autonomous, powerful military force in our own timeline. No state (e.g., the HRE) exerted much influence over them because they came from hundreds of German principalities. Its a big part of why they almost immediately went rogue and started attacking the Catholic Poles and Orthodox Russians too.

@eidoneverchoosen1171 2 года назад

@@Steadyaim101 in medieval total war 2 I play them and do just that making the tectonic and Livonia order a powerful military order independent and strong.

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

Well, then Russia wont exist. Novgorod and Pskov areas would be a part of united Livonia order.

@eidoneverchoosen1171 2 года назад

@@fkjl4717 yeah cause in the game version medieval total war 2 Teutonic campaign I conquer them so no Russia just the order of the Teutonic and Livonia order which might become a second Germany in Eastern Europe. An order of men at arms and knights ruling Eastern Europe .

@fkjl4717 2 года назад

@@eidoneverchoosen1171 I respect TW games, i played thousands of hours...but for historical simulation games like UE4 or Crusader kings 2 are much better.

@EXCEZMANIK 2 года назад

We need a part two

@jeffgraham9208 2 года назад

Good stuff!

@Rodzyniastyyyy 2 года назад

I think you missed the one of the most important points when it comes to population, as at that time Coptis was still dominant religion in Egypt,

@eliashornwall8546 2 года назад

I think that after the crusader state and the Byzantine empire stabilized, they would probably unite under a personal union, so long as the great schism is mended.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

That makes no sense. The Best you would get is the historical situation of the Byzantines as the overlords and the Crusaders as Vassals like what happened under Manuel Komnenos. The cultural differences are too strong hence why their alliances often failed.

@ivokantarski6220 2 года назад

@@tylerellis9097 Agreed. I doupt East Roman dignity would allow it to be left out of the Holy lands. Sooner or later it just would go for it. East Rome couldnt have any1 sitting nearby and just have peace. Many of its wars with Bulgaria happent not because of Bulgaria but because of it's to make Bulgaria exit the balkans.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

@@ivokantarski6220 1. Bruh the Bolghars were squatting on and invaded Byzantine lands, raided the Empire, attacked and subjugated Slavs in Byzantine territory, intervened in multiple Byzantine civil wars, and was right next to Constantinople. They had literally tripled in size right in front of the Empire, I don’t think Serbia appreciated that either lol. Byzantium hired the Rus cause Emperor Peter was allowing raiding Magyars through Bulgaria to Byzantine territory while making the Empire pay Tribute. Even then their was periods of decades of peace between the 2. Serbia, Croatia, Georgia, and the Lombards were never conquered. The Serbs and Croats actually had permission to settle in Byzantine lands from the Emperor. Other than the Arab Muslims who constantly raided the Empire, Bulgaria was the only state the Byzantines ever completely conquered and the only one to ever attack Constantinople repeatedly. 2. But yes a Union of Zealous Feudal Latin Catholic Crusaders with Imperial Bureaucratic Greek Orthodoxs is impossible.

@PakBallandSami 2 года назад

omg i really like your voice mr z you should make more podcast on paxhistoria or do voice over like some thing that can be make easily

@shonewarrior2178 Год назад

Gay

@dietervondracek1554 2 года назад

Can you do a continuation scenario on how the age of exploration would go in this world? I doubt it'd be very different. But that really depends on how much time passes.

@atatdude4072 2 года назад

Can you make a metropol part 2 I really enjoyed the timeline and I would like to see it continued

@nubnubdubdeh Год назад

Ottomans not existing best timeline ever

@thecrusaderhistorian9820 2 года назад

Excellent video Monsieur Z! I am sorry that I am late for the party. You hit the information on the nail almost to a T. If I were to add one thing, the Holy Land was majority Christain during this time period. Especially Egypt. So it would be easy for the Kingdom to get a large standing army quickly. I got this information from Real Crusades History. He is a wonderful historian on the Crusades and the Middle Ages

@Ayala-99 2 года назад

This happened to by buddy Eric once

@griffstanker670 2 года назад

been a while since the last "what if" video. nice to see a new one after all this time ... still eagerly waiting for the next installment of Scar Nicolas's League of Extraordinary Gentlemen though

@Christian-Sannino 8 месяцев назад

What a beautiful dream

@IronDragon-2143 2 года назад

I would actually like to see a part two

@ihatemotionblur_3255 2 года назад

I think the mongols would definitely be able to take over all of the Kingdom of Jerusalem in this timeline since the main reason why Mongols failed to the Mamlukes was because of the lack of Hulagu Khan (who had ventured back to Mongolia) and the cavalry culture of the Mamlukes. I doubt the slow and tanky knights of Jerusalem would be powerful against the speedy and accurate mongols.

@j.scottwigginsjr.3946 2 года назад

Would Mongol bows be powerful enough to penetrate Crusader plate armor or Crusader chain mail? I don't really know that much about armor and arrows and whatnot. I do know English Long-bows could penetrate armor, but those were some of the most powerful bows ever made.

@viktorwasielewski5687 2 года назад

@@j.scottwigginsjr.3946 Since they had little problems with that in Eastern Europe during their campaigns in Russia, Poland, Hungary and Romania, they Mongols would ably run circles around and defeat the crusaders, devastating the Levant and conquering Syria if nothing else, moving the center of this Outremer into Egypt. Though this Outremer might have fared better if they adopted some of the local light cavalry culture and recruited christianized arab light cavalry.

@ionutbalta6607 2 года назад

@@j.scottwigginsjr.3946 Considering the succes of the Golden Horde in Eastern Europe id say the Mongools have a good possibility to win.

@robinrehlinghaus1944 2 года назад

Probably not, there are sources telling that small recurve bows of that time were not powerful enough to pierce chainmail

@matthiuskoenig3378 2 года назад

@@viktorwasielewski5687 faced little problems against hungary? you mean defeating the largely light cavalry army in the first invasion and failing to take any foritifcations, and then getting their asses handed to them by the knight and crossbow heavy hungarian army in the 2nd invasion? yeah 'little problem' my ass. the crusaders would kick the mongols asses *hard*, history shows the mongols were weak to european style knights and european style crossbowmen, things the crusaders had in spades.

@garettegear5557 2 года назад

Heck yeah been waiting for one about the crusader states one of the most interesting times in history

@nord_anon4406 2 года назад

Let's go!

@grandmasterbroda1429 2 года назад

For your next alt history video I’d love to see What if the Gallipoli campaign succeed

@ash-vs6tr 2 года назад

I like this mapping style

@FM_1819 2 года назад

Kind of disapointed how it wasn"t mentioned hoe the liberation of the still significant Coptic orthox population in egypt would have boosted the christian cause or impacted it's subsecuent rule. Still awesome video

@pierretawadros2690 2 года назад

Especially considering they were a majority at the time

@MeanBeanComedy 2 года назад

@Leo the British-Filipino I love our Coptic Brothers! Some of the first and most-faithful Christians.

@lasqueiralasco1523 Месяц назад

Make a part 2 ezploring how the age of explorations, colonization and indistrialization will work in these tl please

@volbound1700 2 года назад

This is very nitpicky but the northern coast of Turkey (especially around Trembzond) should be Byzantine and not Turkish.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

None of the Byzantine borders in this vid are accurate lol. He’s just generalizing to visualize the general situation.

@volbound1700 2 года назад

@@tylerellis9097 True but overall, the borders are not that far off from reality. Better than some Medieval maps that even appear in major textbooks.

@tylerellis9097 2 года назад

@@volbound1700 Ehhh it’s about on par with the high school textbooks I had in history lol.

@stetsonpowers5010 2 года назад

A part two would be cool, maybe some crusade colonies.

@J4R0D 2 года назад

Deus Vult!

@koderamerikaner5147 2 года назад

Ariovistus achieving victory at the Battle of Vosges in 58 BC would have had a massive influence on the history of Rome and Gaul, and would be a really interesting "What If" scenario.

@CountryFrenchyBoy 2 года назад

Beautiful story :')

@JW-zx5dr 2 года назад

Very interesting

@icycrusader1947 2 года назад

Glorious

@Da__goat 2 года назад

As one who enjoys making maps, good sir, what do you use to make your own?

@gayfrogs9705 2 года назад

If only... if only

@janrudnicki6111 2 года назад

Very good

@VOTE_REFORM_UK Год назад

My God… it’s… *beautiful*

@andyreginald9272 Год назад

I wonder what the long term effects of this scenario would have on Western Europe

@VOTE_REFORM_UK Год назад

Well there would be no Ottoman Empire. That’s already huge enough of a break that the amount of butterfly effects would be insane and incalculable.

@kellerblair2952 2 года назад

Idea for the next one what if Edward III had won the Hundred Years’ War.

@fastestfail2645 2 года назад

Better time line to be sure

@chamberlin9883 2 года назад

Part 2!

@dannybermingham197 2 года назад

Monsieur Z are we ever going to see more of the Scar Nicholas saga?

@madmasseur6422 2 года назад

I'm curious how the exploration of the new world would happen in this scenario, if it happens at all that is

@HockeyLax50 2 года назад

oh yeah it’s all coming together

@JohnSmith-rk7zy 2 года назад

I feel like I know this will be based without even seeing it yet.

@NChatterjee 2 года назад

Though fanatism . But surely it would be better than this world . I am not christian but i can say this undoubtedly.

@hopeintruth5119 2 года назад

Though a dumb comment. I don't think it would be better probably be more problems

@NChatterjee 2 года назад

@@hopeintruth5119 keep your baseless comments to yourself. Atleast think before you speak . You islamist .

@hopeintruth5119 2 года назад

@The roots are deep first off I'm an atheist, second off you mean Muslim, third off I don't sew how I could be when I don't like any abrahamic religion

@Avicerox 2 года назад

Its pretty idiotic to think the world would be better if the Crusades succeeded.

@NChatterjee 2 года назад

Ya it would surely hamper the spread of the green fungus. I understand your pain .

@NChatterjee 2 года назад

You could also touch the points about . The baizantines holding the status of protector of the slavs and orthodox christianity. Potentially bringing them in conflict with russia later in the timeline. Another nice one would be ,your thaughts on the age of exploration as it was primarily fueled by the seizure of the land trade route between india and europe by the muslims. It would be nice.

@collinpimentel8888 2 года назад

Kind of late to recommend this on this video but the idea just crossed my mind for a scenario. What if Pontus was able to win the Mithridatic wars and become a rival to time similar to what Persia would eventually become?

@karveka4371 2 года назад

Up next: what if Portugal existed. That'd be a cool scenario!

@user-kt8yp5ho2y 2 года назад

It’s too sad that it’s never happened.

@HaDe_Twins 2 года назад

Why?

@Forlfir 2 года назад

@@HaDe_Twins Maybe they would be like many parts of Europe now, not really that religious anymore

@madaranotsoanonymousnowuch1539 2 года назад

What's sad is Suleiman's failure to take Vienna and expand the caliphate into central Europe 😔

@HaDe_Twins 2 года назад

@@madaranotsoanonymousnowuch1539 so true. I would love to see europe with the majority being muslims.

@Sectarian. 2 года назад

@@Forlfir they would be dayouth like Europe, and ofcourse degenerate and non-religious.

@gingazaurus 2 года назад

Great video too bad your sound is a very low, I'm watching it on my phone and the volume is all the way up and I can barely hear you.

@andrewspears8891 2 года назад

Episode 2 when?

@apollo1694 2 года назад

A better world

@Theophan123 2 года назад

The video has a good introduction with showing the importance of the Levant, the Holy Land and Egypt to the Greco-Roman world, and that this region constituted the economic and financial stronghold of the Mediterranean world. As for the disunity of Alexander's successor kingdoms, well one can say that Eastern Rome had gone full circle with bringing out the combined strategic military potential of the Greek-speaking Eastern Mediterranean, anchored in Constantinople. Also, a side note for Constantinople, Antioch and Alexandria forming a three-way economic sphere of influence, these three cities also constituted 3 of the 5 Apostolic Sees of the original Pentarchy alongside Rome and Jerusalem. The Septuagint (Greek translation of the Old Testament) was translated in Alexandria in the 3rd Century BC, and it was in Antioch that the followers of Jesus were first called Christians.

@yatharthraman8021 2 года назад

Please don’t i dream about this stufff . This is what i desire.

@GabAk-45 Год назад

Agree

@xELITExKILLAx 2 года назад

The idea of North Africa and the Near East becoming Christian again is probably the most fascinating alternate timeline to me. The idea of a modern world where North Africa and the Near East is considered European and much of it considered part of the western world is just such a cool concept. World history would never be the same.

@painxsavior7723 2 года назад

No Middle East where not considered Europeans even by Europeans themselves ( ancient or modern) even before Persian Greeks wars they have completely different history , culture, values , look etc and since you’re talking about religion Christianity started in Middle East dose that Europeans are middle Easter Arab invaded Europe for a long time are Europeans Middle Eastern ?

@xELITExKILLAx 2 года назад

@@painxsavior7723 at the time they weren’t. But back then most of Europe wasn’t the same as it is now. The Germanic areas couldn’t have been more different to the other places that Rome held. But today, Germanic nations share a lot of history with Rome and are considered part of Western civilization which comes from Rome. What I’m saying is if Rome continued to influence North Africa and the Middle East, those places would probably be considered part of western civilization too. Meaning sharing religion, culture, alphabets, history, etc.

@painxsavior7723 2 года назад

@@xELITExKILLAx and if Middle Eastern nation ruled Europeans for a long time they too would be considered Middle Eastern ? So does that mean Spain is berber ? (Native people of North Africans )

@MissionControlTet 7 месяцев назад

@@painxsavior7723 He didn't mean it like that. Being part of the Western World isn't determined by genetics or location but rather by shared values and ideas. It stands a reason why Czechia and Australia are considered part of the West despite of zero connection to the Roman Empire itself.

@painxsavior7723 7 месяцев назад

@@MissionControlTet oh ok I see I probably should have thought about it more honestly I don’t know why I replied in the comments of a pro west American right wing channel but here we are thanks for the clarification🙂

@ethancash8870 2 года назад

Fun Fact: did you know that king Baldwin the first would get help from the king of Norway in his conquest

@gyver8448 2 года назад

Does anyone know where I can get the flag for this?

@Adam-dd5fx 2 года назад

I wish this was our timeline

@chamberlin9883 2 года назад

Big impacts with a stable crusader state. Major player in northern crusade and later Prussia/ German unification. Prot reformation etc.

@TheHunterOfYharnam 2 года назад

Seleucus I Nikator was a general of Alexander and one of the diadochi (successors) of his empire. Not only did he go from Makedon to India but he almost conquered all of these lands a second time in the diadochi wars. He took basically parts of Asia Minor and Syria all the way to India from Antigonos and also beat Lycimaxos annexing the rest of Asia Minor and invaded Thrace heading towards Makedon where he was assassinated. In case he wasn't its very likely he would reunited Alexander's empire so this is my question. What if Seleucus I Nikator wasn't assassinated? would the empire reunite? what would the effects be for India Carthage Rome ect?

@SunBepisMan 2 года назад

this would change history so much it's fascinating cause this means we get to see possible Byzantine and Jerusalem colonies and they'd also industrialize at some point

@anthonyappleyard5688 2 года назад

With Egypt remaining under Christian rule,in Egypt likely we would see Coptic Christianity and the Coptic language gradually recover dominance against Islam and the Arabic language.

@timcusack9388 2 года назад

It did in my CK2 playthrough

@Chewywrinkles 2 года назад

Yuh pt 2 plz

@pascalbaryamo4568 2 года назад

Thanks for this insightful video! I doubt that the Outremer could be politically united, a) feudalism b) the division between french germanic, norman, occitan and english crusaders c) the opposition between Palestine's spiritual prestige and Egypt's wealth and massive christian population would require at least 2 states in the region. Tripoli, Galilee and maybe antioch and later on syria could, though, be integrated into Jerusalem as their titles were already of lower rank.

@mariaisabelfonseca6098 2 года назад

You should do a what if about asturias being the last holdout of rome, but the timeline would have to have a bit more modifications like iberia being conquered sooner or like what happened to roman gaul having loyal generals like augedius or the region experiencing raids more since the germanic invasions on the republican period werent fend off that early and were more fortified or a mix of them 1

@user-kt8yp5ho2y 2 года назад

Deus Vult! XD

@user-kt8yp5ho2y 2 года назад

@Leo the British-Filipino Actually, the Christianity is the second largest religion in Korea.

@Marlem2 5 месяцев назад

With Christianity in control of Egypt, this would mean that there is no absurd increase in the price of spices. Which is what originally lead to the Portugese and the Spanish trying to find another way to India. So with The Crusades succeeding, the Americas likely would not have been found for potentially a century or two more.

@xCWExSniperWolf 2 года назад

One of my funnest runs in CK3 was forming the outremer empire and mending the schism

@stein3756 2 года назад

Please do a video on ,,what if the thracians still existed?,,

@grumpydixie1645 2 года назад

alternate history scenario: what if the Bering land bridge still existed after the ice age?

@christianwestling2019 2 года назад

Great video! If only... One point: Egypt was much more christian in this period. The coptic population was around 50/60% if I'm not mistaken so a christian reconquest would have a good amount of allied population to help with that.