WHAT IF Vegeta Was The First Super Saiyan? Part 2 

No, because he would not stop begging Whis to get done eating so he could train. He would do the same thing for Vegeta.

But remember, it was because it "Wasnt fair for the fight" If you fought a player with no ssj in XV2, hed as for the same thing

Lu1z 4 3v3r And the voices true

Super Vegito " I trained for a whole year last week" I love tfs

Super Vegito I don't think you finished

Ok

Push ups, sit ups & Plenty of juice

Ooh you think you been cute?

I think Beerus was holding back enough that she wouldn't become a mile-long stain.

Wilfred Cthulu What about yamcha?? The way he pat beerus back almost hurt that hakaishin

utopianking It's a joke dude.

Wilfred Cthulu Bulma=God

Wilfred Cthulu Yamcha was the first person to do damage to the God of Destruction Beerus. He slapped him on the back, not seeming hard, but still hurt the cat

Vegeta*

It’s vegeta not vegita

@Svb_Zer0 doesn't matter

Goku not having a whole lot to strive for does make sense in the original story when you realize Goku was supposed to pass on the torch to Gohan originally. Toriyama just couldn't quite make it work even with mystic Gohan during the buu saga.

DarkvsLight346 Gero had a surveillance bot on Namek, so he already had the DNA from Frieza.

Zeke Moore no he didnt beacuse he didnt know about super sayian

This isn't the cell from the OT

this cell is from a timeline where frieza came

Have you guys watched the anime? When Goku asked Dr Gero if he was spying on him while he was off world on Namek, Gero replied that they was no need to send robot spies off world as he stopped gathering data after the Z-fighters battle with Nappa and Vegeta.

DBZtheKingPersonaOfDigimon most likely he'd master ssj2. He would wipe out debura without any difficulties. He could possibly even reach his full potential just through intense training through the time gap between the end of the cell saga and the beginning of the buu saga. If this happens it would render the threat of majin buu completely useless as gohan would wipe him out with ease.

Given that the Ki injection into majin Buu's pod was about half of what was needed from Gohan's incredibly weak state from not training at all, if the events of the tournament played out the same with Shin holding down Gohan with magic to act as bait to find Bobidi's ship, Buu might have been released on the spot instead. The question then becomes whether or not the fact they knew nothing about Buu's abilities would keep it alive through the onslaught of 3 saiyans at full strength. Particularly Goku if he decides not to be a shit and hold back while in SSJ3 if he were to pull it out. If Buu manages to stay alive the arc probably plays out somewhat similarly. Vegeta is however not majined, since Bodibi had no reason to, and probably not dead for that same reason either. With Gohan and Vegeta around they might use the room of spirit and time to train rather than the kids and perhaps not made it to the realm of the Kais, which means Goku's not revived at the end.

He'd be ssg level. Gohan was supposed to fight Beerus not goku.

ks23 wtf no

Adrian Deutschmann not really. We know ss2 is a saiyan's max potential without help from a god, being fused, or being dead. So Gohan at most would have a perfected ss2. Dabura is stronger than Super Perfect Cell though. If he wasn't, they wouldn't be surprised at how strong Dabura was since they've seen stronger. So Dabura would still be weaker than Gohan, but he sill has some tricks up his sleeve. We know that Gohan becomes extremely over confident and cocky when he's winning, so he'll let his guard down. Most likely Dabura would spit on him and turn him to stone, but let's just say he gets the upper hand for a while. Vegeta gets mad and Dabura notices that. He knows he can't beat Gohan so he decides to kick his other plot into action. Majin Vegeta is still born, and he still fights Goku. Maybe Gohan insists he fights Vegeta because Gohan thinks he is stronger than Goku (Goku still has ss3) but either way two people fight and generate power for Buu to be born. As a mastered ss2 you might think Gohan could break Buu's ball but Buu's regeneration would still save him. Ss3 is 4 times ss2, and even ss3 is about equal with Majin Buu's power. So Gohan would pretty much get decimated. But this time Babidi might be a bit more cautious. He saw that Gohan could beat Dabura pretty easily, and he sees him as a threat. So he tells Buu to just kill Gohan first and then focus on the Supreme Kai. Without focusing on both of them at once, Buu kills Gohan. Then Vegeta jumps in before he kills Supreme Kai and uses his Final Explosion, Buu survives, and everything's normal except for one small difference: Gohan'a dead, and the Supreme Kai can feel it. So instead he decides to go to Goku and see if he can lift the Z sword. For plot purposes let's just say Goku has had time to teach the boys fusion. Then, when his time runs out, he goes to the Kai planet to they begin training. Except Goku gets more headway with his training than Gohan did because Goku can lift the sword easier. Sword breaks, and Elder Kai performs the ritual. So now we get Ultimate Goku. He's much stronger than Ultimate Gohan was, and he's not as cocky. So he saves the boys and Piccolo and tres to kill Buu, but Buu's regeneration is too much, and Buu has time to run away. But this time instead of letting the boys fuse and fight Buu, Goku insists on fighting Buu himself. And we know both boys respect Goku just as much as Gohan, so they listen. Disappointed, Buu instead absorbs Goku. He wanted a punching bag, but Gotenks will have to do. The new Buu is far stronger than any form of Buu we've seen before, and decimates Gotenks. The fusion time runs out soon, and Buu prepares to kill them. Right now, Elder Kai has been performing the ritual on Gohan, but it's cut short because the situation is dire. Elder gives Gohan his life and the earrings, telling Gohan to fuse with Tien. He's not that strong, but it's their last resort. Upon landing, Tien drops the earrings and tries to find them. Meanwhile, Gohan stalls for time and is getting beaten badly. That's when Vegeta arrives. King Yemma saw what he needed to do and let Vegeta go back to Earth to fight Buu. Then finds the earrings and gives them to Vegeta because he knows Vegeta is stronger than him. Now Vegeta is less hesitant to fuse with Gohan than Goku, and they do it. Vegeta an Gohan fused is far more powerful than Buu, and the story continues as normal. But soon the fight with Kid Buu comes, and Gohan acts as Goku did. But there's a problem: Gohan doesn't know the Spirit Bomb, so he can't kill Buu. They all try their best, but it's not enough. So this actually has a sad ending. Buu wins and destroys the universe. TLDR: Gohan gets cocky, Majin Vegeta happens, Buu kills Gohan, Goku goes to the Kai planet, Ultimate Goku happens, Buu absorbs him instead of the boys, Gohan is partially Ultimate, he and Vegeta fuse, story continues as normal, everyone dies due to lack of Spirit Bomb.

Dragon ball abridged would be the official dragon ball series

Dragon Ball would be a lot better... You know... because of consistency.😒

Lord Zamasu Vegeta Black Fusion and MARKETING! Don't forget about the MARKETING!

Joshie You mean DBZ Abridged ISN'T already the official series? Whaaaa?

TheSefirosu200x I will force, the Ningen, Akira Toriyama to, AT LEAST, make Dragon Ball Z Abridged part of the multiverse! He cannot do anything against me because I am not part of the main canon. 😏

MysticFate To be fair, we never saw a winded Semi-perfect Cell fighting multiple opponents.

Room of spirit and time

Exactly if Trunks could wreck 18 and 17 as ss grade 2 he easily could for sure as well no issue.

Hey That was Vegeta SSJ Grade 2 after the time chamber but this Vegeta SSJ is just a little stronger than the original Vegeta that fought against 18. So his increase in power on SSJ Grade 2 obviously is lesser great.

You have to factor in Super Saiyan being a multiplier of the user's base form. This version of Vegeta at the beginning of the Android saga was still weaker in base than his canon counterpart after leaving the Hyperbolic Time Chamber.

Farmer With Shotgun I love that Raditz what if.

To be fair, the Raditz what-if is compelling enough that I (hopefully among others) really freaking wish it was canon whereas this is more an interesting thought of an alternate storyline.

You paid more attention to the Raditz story because he killed you ... Farmer With Shotgun or did he kill you ? :P

Farmer With Shotgun your gun didn't protect you.

This dude tells the Raditz story better. Although even that is getting kinda stupid honestly. He is plainly not a Vegeta fan. So this story doesn't have the edge it could.

martijn van weele technically speaking, goku did best vegeta in their initial fight. After the kamehameha galick gun beam struggle between the two, goku beat vegeta and vegeta had to resort to using the great ape power to get the upper hand.

martijn van weele can you use kaijo-ken in great ape form?

Adrian Deutschmann Goku had to resort to the kaioken and spirit bomb and have his friends there to actually do shit to vegeta

Zed Miller in regards to the initial fight goku had the slight upper hand thanks to the kaioken technique and thus bested vegeta. Then vegeta beat goku using his great ape form. Vegeta ' s humiliation stems from the fact that he lost to goku before transforming into the great ape form and also from the fact that goku told krillen not to kill vegeta.

Vegeta says he hates the form, probably because he views it as a cheap trick he's being forced to break out, when in his mind Goku should be able to go great Ape and vegeta should still wreck his shit, He had to use Great Ape to win that's what hit his pride, it was only compounded when that wasn't enough, and then Goku surpassed him by a huge margin,

Nicholi Martin all Versions of Cell and Trunks are based off of the OT version

Alovon *most versions. (What if Nappa turned good?)

Mr. Piccolo but he only fell off in the filler. Hell was never shown in the original manga

Goku Son I changed it

Mr. Piccolo yeah that's cool. Out of curiosity, at what point would Goku come back? Before Piccolo's sacrafice, before Tien's death, before Chaiotzu's sacrafice or even before Yamcha's death?

Goku Son Yamacha dies no matter what

Goku Son I think he should come back before yamcha dies, and since they probably have no use for namekian dragon balls, I want to see how things turn out. Maybe Goku could discover ssj another way instead.

Thanotos Omega thats mean that if picolo dies than dragonball still live because of his kid!

Not Quite this would be an actual Kid like Tambourine and company, not a reincarnation so the Kid would lack the connection to Kami, and probably still be a bit corrupted,

Nail junior!

Then Goku would have went SSJ4 against Frieza XD

He be strong

I always thought of it in terms of raw intelligence. You need at least a 14 to stay out of beast mode, because you literally get a -8, so if you have base 10, an average person goes down to 2, which is animal intelligence. Goku can't do it if I'm right, but Gohan definitely could. I would really like to see a whole sequence of alternate forms based around this, though.

Then the lookout would be wrecked and everyone would fall to their deaths

Otaku Flame39 in regards to this what if I can't see gohan really factoring in that much... vegeta has already obtained grade 4 ssj, while goku (who taught gohan ssj) has only recently obtained it. I could even see vegeta obtaining ssj2 just before the cell games, rendering gohan almost completely useless... goku would also not die in this what if since he doesn't know instant transmission and both vegeta and goku could go on into the buu saga completely mastering ssj2 as they would constantly be trying to out match each other. Gohan will probably only factor in in the buu saga when he goes to the supreme kai's world and becomes ultimate gohan. Doubt that regular fusion will exist. Maybe potara fusion will still be a thing. Ssj3 most likely won't happen. Also gohan and goten would also most likely be stronger in this scenario since goku is still alive and he would be training with them. We could see 3 fully mastered ssj2's and 2 fully mastered ssj's with trunks and goten. Maybe also no majin vegeta, because Vegeta wouldn't really have any reason to give into babidi's manipulations... sorry went of on a tangent and couldn't stop writing my thoughts. These what ifs are quite interesting to think about

Adrian Deutschmann thanks for that in-depth analysis on something I just kind of stated I also want to think that if Gohan and Goten end up do becoming stronger how that affect trunks would trunks be as strong because now his father can teach him at a higher level or wood Goku after catching up to Vegeta cuz we know he would eventually teach Goten the way to become Super Saiyan 2 and possibly beat out trunks

I like Gohan (and Goten), but before he fights Cell, what did he really do that had major consequences? He defeated Vegeta by turning great ape. That's mostly it. Everything else important would be the same. And he wouldn't have reached SSJ2 soon enough, if Goku hadn't even known SSJ1 by the time Cell becomes perfect. So either Vegeta beats Cell, or they're screwed.

Sercil I honestly think this whole one if is really just throwing Gohan in the back burner because a lot of Gohan's achievements showing that he is definitely gotten stronger was when he did that rush against Frieza second and third form he didn't beat him but he definitely did a lot more than Vegeta was packing so I think with my original comment this whole but if it's just throat Gohan to the back burner and let Vegeta take spot

Elliander Eldridge Vegeta forgot Sleep

@@RickyUzumaki993 This is like Pokemon.

Michael Sarmiento Sure is

Apekecik 207 I doubt 17 and 18 would just sit around twiddling their thumbs while Vegeta charges the Final Flash for 5 minutes straight. Especially after what 17 did in the last episode of super

This is also pre-HTC. The form was not the only thing he gained in there. The transformation is merely a multiplier of their base power. And spending a year in there, Vegeta's base power level spiked heavily as well.

Except his base power already spiked heavily compared to the Original Timeline. MasakoX says so flat-out at 7:00. Goku has barely struggled to get to where Vegeta was when he was at that point in time in the OT.

At that point in the anime, yes. However, Vegeta in the Anime post-HTC was still far stronger than this scenario's Vegeta pre-HTC, despite having the same transformation.

Final flash I believe was created in the time chamber people seem to forget that most of vegetas signature moves were used post 3 year time skip

Jonathan Cottrell And then gohan n goku trains on king Kai planet

Jonathan Cottrell maybe goku would have turned super saiyan seeing his gohan die? Well, not like he reals cares much for him, but thinking about it storywise, it'd be cool to have Raditz freaking out that he's seen the legendary super saiyan and so Vegeta and Nappa go to earth because they need to see what Raditz was talking about before he died for themselves.

keeping a physical body and being able to train with the kais was a good guy warrior thing, gohan was like 4 and not a warrior when radits kidnapped him, so if he died he would have just went to their heaven. even possible he wouldn't have been brought back with goku and been left for the next summon because these characters sometimes don't think and do things like that. then he wouldn't have been there to fight with krillin a nd piccolo so they would probly both be dead, leaving only goku, and possibly yajirobe to go to namek, if goku wins because he needed krillin and gohans help and their kinda dead or not a fighter in this scenario

Ralph Nettleton Interesting point. I also thought if Gohan would just totally disappear from the series if he died at this point. Possible alternative to the above: what if Piccolo didn't sacrifice himself and Gohan was killed by Nappa instead?

without the need for namekian dragon balls to bring piccolo back to have the earth dragon balls again it would likely never be revealed to the cast that there are namekian dragon balls and they would have to accept that chiaotzu, and likely tien not wanting to come back with chiaotzu dead, are now gone. series then branches into goku goes super saiyan for gohan death or not. either way goku probly doesn't let vegeta live in this scenario, even if it was nappa that did the deed. if not only fused piccolo can stand up to the androids, cell kills everyone. if he does then androids goes the same until cell. gohan never had to deal with frieza and all the zenkais in the arc, as well as unlocked potential, buuuuut goku on earth all that time may have had gohan already training somewhat when chichis not looking. can this version of gohan stop cell? no instant transmition if cell decides to blow up. also no trunks in this scenario because vegeta dead, yajirobe survived so i guess either him or bulma come back in time. goku and gohan used the chamber and finished when vegeta/trunks initially did, maybe cell never gets to be perfect because it was goku and gohan on the island not vegeta everything work out? gohan never saw ginyu force, so saiyaman might be different, or possibly just left as the golden fighter as videl called him. also since goku couldn't do the heroic sacrifice with cell he's probly alive. no super saiyan 3, likely mastered 2 though. no trunks to make gotenks, maybe yamcha and bulma ended up having a kid and it's a super genius human sent back in time before and they take trunks place? not sure if scenario allowed 18 to survive to this point. judging by super, goku being around doesn't affect gohan training this time with no known threat. whole buu saga probly goes a lot smoother, no majin vegeta, piccolo and goku probly trained together a lot in the 7 years because no one else to fight, piccolo probly gets a lot stronger. goten is probly a lot more normal of a kid, chichi seemed to train him purely to have someone around remind her of goku.

Absolute Heat If Toriyama was doing this Goku would have been magically stronger than SSJ Vegeta while he was in his base form but since it's Masako we have no clue.

Absolute Heat Probably, either by getting Bulma to build him a gravity machine, or by using the time chamber during the 7 year skit, depending on, oh you know, GOKU NOT BEING ABLE TO TELEPORT EXPLOSION CELL TO KING KAI'S!!!!

Probably.

I think the fact that it's a 2 on 1 fight pushes the odds in 17 and 18's favor. The fact that they have infinite stamina and Vegeta's stamina would continue to drain during the fight wouldn't do him any favors either.

Natu Perle-Henderson then how come 16 plus 18 couldn't stand up to semi cell. Vegeta > semi cell > 16 plus 18 > 17 plus 18. They are so many steps down.

GodzillaFreak because semi cell was at full power. He had just absorbed 17 and transformed to a much more powerful form, which usually means a stamina refill in DBZ.

Natu Perle-Henderson Semi perfect cell use some of his ki to blast a lot of island to find 18 and he lose some energy when battling vegeta. Cell do not have infinite stamina yet he manage to defeat 16, 18 and krilli.

Natu Perle-Henderson Do you even Dragon Ball? Vegeta finishes the fight before it even begins.

LintyScorpion29 _ On namek or earth

LintyScorpion29 _ Still couldn't beat Frieza

LintyScorpion29 _ he would have died fighting frezia if that's when he transformed

Nah, he's got WAY more potential than that. What if Gohan's full Hidden Potential was Unleashed (the stupidly named transformation people think it is but it's not) on Namek. Remember how strong Gohan became after Elder Kai released his power? Yeah, Guru knew about it and how to awaken it, so he can do that this time.

OR, if he does go Super Saiyan, he does it against Nappa in the Saiyan Saga.

RubberDucky Whis: There is 1 warrior even the Gods of destruction cannot beat. Berrus: Oh you mean shagg-. Whis : No not him! A youtuber with the power of a Disney channel flow. Jake Paul : ITS EVEY DAY BRO WIT DAT DISNAY CHENNEL FLOW!!! Jiren : NANI?! Jake: O MAEO MAEO WA SHINDERU. Jiren: Im not saying NAN!? Jake : TAKE DIS DIDNEY Chenel PUNCH Jiren: (Roblox Death Noise ) OOF Zeno: Universe 10 wins. Grand Priest: Tell me your wish. Jake: gimme moar didney channel flow Dragon : OK

You got ur wish

This comment is legendary

So? Still makes for an interesting what-if. No one can die, and it doesn't actually come into effect until Dragonball Z. Still sounds like a scenario that MasakoX could have some fun with.

Goku was stronger. Remember, before SSJ ever got involved, Goku leaving the medical bath was stronger than Vegeta after trying to kill himself. SSJ is a power multiplier, but it multiplies what is already there, so Vegeta doesn't magically get extra power on top of it. That's why his fight against Frieza was a harder one and one that he really accomplished by not letting Frieza go 100% power. Goku by the time he gets to Namik is stronger than Vegeta and that didn't let up for the rest of that arc. So if Trunks is only slightly weaker than Goku as a SSJ then, he's going to be stronger than Vegeta at that same moment.

Goku was only a bit stronger then Vegeta when he first fought Frieza but he used kaioken to make up the difference.

The point is that Goku was stronger. So Trunks being slightly weaker means he's stronger or on par with Vegeta as a SSJ when they first meet.

SSJ Trunks was clearly stronger than Goku was when he fought Freeza. Trunks took out both Freeza and King Cold with very little effort. Goku was stronger when they met because Goku had been training for a year on Yardrat

Yes and in this scenario Vegeta did the same thing.

The power of plot convenience or "POWER LEVELS ARE BULLSH$%^"

+William Cortelyou i theorize that zenkai boost's work like training, when you train you end up damaging your muscle fibers and when you rest your muscle fibers are repaired and or replaced and then you become stronger, i think zenkai boost's work like that, only it's external damage rather than internal damage, the more the user get's hurt (preferably to the point of reaching death) the better the results. i also theorize that primitive saiyans that got zenkai boost's ended up misinterpreting how they work and just falsely said that it only works when they are at the brink of death rather than how much damage they take. AND i theorize that had krillin hit vegeta with a barrage of rapid ki blast's instead of just shooting him through the chest, then vegeta would've gotten a bigger zenkai boost, whether it would make him as strong as goku i don't know. PS: this is my last theory. i theorize that the strain the user goes through when using kaioken is not that different from the strain they go through when under high gravity, i mean goku could use kaioken x3 without problem after training at x10 earth's gravity and he could use kaioken x20 after training at x100 earth's gravity, so maybe had goku continued gravity training like let's say at x400 earth's gravity, then he could've accessed higher multipliers without an issue.

Spoons McSpooner 12:44 “Since Goku doesn’t know Instant Transmission, he cannot get to the pair in time...”

Vegeta fan boi alert, Goku bested him five or six times lmao.

Saber Tiger id say the tl;dr was the first sentence

f0nZ Oh yeah, didn't even notice that my bad ._. ThisName DoesntMatter I'm certain Picolo (or whoever that was) mentionned that Freiza was with someone even stronger than him, and at the time Cold was in his restricted form. Plus, knowing their family, Freiza would have killed Cold long ago if Cold was weaker than him

Saber Tiger Frieza is actually the strongest person in his race, Frieza was genetically modified to be the strongest. Plus its been implied that Frieza was is the only one able to transform so we are not sure King Cold can transform into another stronger form.

wasn't mecha freeza weaker than he was on namek?

LivinNRG YT I don't remember this being said anywhere, where did you get it that Freiza was genetically modified ? As for the transformation thingy, Frost (and to a lesser extent Cooler) confirm that it's a thing for this race to transform. But then again, we don't know about Cold, yeah. glen coco From what i remember, he was said to be stronger, but then again, i could remember wrong.

TheOlimpicGamer Cell lose and goku will end cell life instead of toying with him.......or let him live just like how he did with freezer

Nothing really changes imo

Goku wouldn’t die so he’s be weaker, and never achieve SSJ3. Fat Buu would end up killing Goku, Gohan, and Vegeta. The Earth would be destroyed.

Fusion

Rejhan Jakupi good idea

then everyone wouldve been dead by the saiyan saga

Surprisingly, Gohan doesn't contribute all that much before fighting Cell. Except when he went ape against Vegeta. Without that, I think Goku and Krillin would die. Bulma would go to Namek alone and be powerless. Vegeta could not defeat the Ginyus. Even if Goku was alive, there'd be no Krillin to die for him to become super saiyan. I like Goten, but he did nothing besides become Gotenks. And Gotenks is practically a complete waste filler character who did nothing except feed Buu, which didn't matter at all once they de-fused.

Rejhan Jakupi Goku and Piccolo would be killed by Raditz

What if Goku never married Chi-Chi.

Blaze haters gonna hate

Blaze his self centered nature provides a hell of a foil to the rest of the fighters. However, he is also one of the most well developed characters, as he grows throughout the entirety of Z and even in Super. While Goku is kept relatively static save for his power and fighting skill, Vegeta actually matures mentally.

That's part of the reason why he was so liked. His personality, the interactions with the goody goods, the choices he made, his development throughout the series. He also had some badass moments in the series, his voice actors did a good job portraying him. He was a cool douche that became a well developed character.

He's not my favorite character in z but he is my favorite in super

Blaze During his fight with majin buu, vegeta starts to care for his family and sacrifice to kill majin buu. In super, he cares about future trunks and bulla/bra. This prove that vegeta from a selfish dickhead develop to become a greater father compare to goku.