What is the WP 6500 Kit? | Trick Suspension Upgrade | TBT Racing | Highland Cycles

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We just got our first 6500 kit for the new 2023 KTM 300XC and I am excited to get it valved and installed on our bike!
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Опубликовано:

28 фев 2023

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Комментарии : 147

@wayneleonard8367 Год назад

140 hrs on my 6500 kit. Absolutely the best fork setup I’ve ever invested in.

@lbeck119 Год назад

Did you feel the need to revalve your 6500?

@wayneleonard8367 Год назад

@@lbeck119 I had my shop re-valve the 6500 kit for my riding style when the kit was installed. IMO having the forks re-valved to how you ride is best practice, and I’m sure Morgan has the same opinion.

@jeff40 Год назад

Spring forks are awesome to me. Ohlins has a single shock that works on the WP air forks that look to be the best of both worlds.

@matt2437 9 месяцев назад

Have you tried the mx tech lucky cartridge?

@matthewfurubotten4564 Год назад

Morgan, Can’t wait to ride my new bike with this 6500 kit you installed “Ride or Die”💥💥💥

@evo5349 Год назад

Everyday is a day at school and sometimes you come across something that is better so yes looking forward to the next technical transplant of the kit.

@scottphillips445 Год назад

Oh yeah keep up the good work you are doing. I appreciate your input on the new dope!

@donpizzo8963 Год назад

Thanks for uploading again, great information.

@highlandcycles Год назад

My pleasure!

@ronhartle3268 Год назад

This makes for a good video. Many people tune in to channels just for the sole purpose of seeing what is available out there wheather it is good or not and can/should they afford it.

@lostinpa-dadenduro7555 Год назад

I’m a fan of cushy. I feel like it lets you ride longer without getting worn out. When I get tired I start riding like a total fool and sometimes I just know it’s time to go back to the parking lot before something happens. 😂

@dmcdevitt8 Год назад

There is nothing worse than when the fatigue sets in, and you still have to go back or forward a ways. Especially those tight enduros in jersey.

@scottphillips445 Год назад

I had my 88 honda CR250 revalved by race tech. The shock was amazing. My advice is to catalog everything that you do to including clicker settings for each place you ride.

@JacobYoces Год назад

Oh sweet, I just bought a set of these and I'm so stoked to get rid of my AER forks

@scottphillips445 Год назад

I like the idea of compression on 1 fork and rebound on the other, but the 6500 kit is 100% the way to go. Mid stroke plushness is the name of the game I like a lot of late stroke compression on forks

@SingleTrackTherapy Год назад

I'm on the fence on this kit for my 22 EX300, this was very good info, thanks!

@highlandcycles Год назад

Its really good! I have a lot of hours on it now and I feel like it is worth the money

@SingleTrackTherapy Год назад

@@highlandcycles I ride primarily technical and find the AER fork is okay some days then just bad others and deflects a lot on the choppy rocks. I'll probably go with this kit.

@johngray722 Год назад

I have the WP single fork conversion works really well

@joeb10p69 Год назад

I have the same thing and agree completely. Fork is super plush but holds up and tracks through corners much better than the air fork could.

@stevesmith756 15 дней назад

Also one fork keg is heavier than the other for an imbalance

@erikk.2435 Год назад

Behind the Bars Braap shop is the place to go in the Denver metro!

@HP-hm3pn Год назад

When researching this kit I found it interesting that some thought these were better than the cone valve set up. It's more forgiving and a lot of slow riders that have cone valves can't go fast enough to make them worth while. They're too stiff.

@highlandcycles Год назад

I agree with that. The only folks who can really utilize a cone valve setup are pros in my opinion.

@wfo_racer Год назад

Thanks Morgan

@highlandcycles Год назад

You bet

@wfo_racer Год назад

@@highlandcycles Good luck in Hawaii

@toddrobison8929 Год назад

I just bought a 6500 kit for my '22 450 sxf

@200xcBruce Год назад

Really find this interesting. Seems like it is speed sensitive design giving you small bump compliance without a G out control loss. But fact you are not just dropping in and trying kind of disappoints. Like to see if springed for weight and dropped in would satisfy the average rider. And thank you for not calling it the "mule". Cannot wait to watch it come to be.

@highlandcycles Год назад

I know I should just drop it in but I’m running out of time before riding season and races.

@hachtenduro7824 Год назад

Remark: A damper is always speed sensitive. The art is to have the damping high enough for low-mid speed and not too restricted at high speed impacts.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@hachtenduro7824 the ics is what helps it be easier to be more speed sensitive

@Andy-co6pn Год назад

Keefer has a comparison of these versus the Cone Valves , both "straight out of the box "📦

@kevinearls7496 Год назад

@Bruce Kennedy I'm running the 6500s as they came, my suspension guy just setup the oil level a little lower since I'm not doing motocross. I've really liked them, got a lot of confidence in the past 42 hours riding them.

@bogusfranz1503 Год назад

Can you also explain in your next video how the stock Xplorer shocks differ from the 6500 upgrade? Thinking next year's Husqvarna 300 TE with Explorer and linkage would be a sweet setup.

@wayneleonard8367 Год назад

Xplorer one side is rebound and the other is compression. Correct spring rate and valving made my 2020 501 more compliant. On my 2022 gasgas ec300. I wasn’t to happy with xplorer day one install 6500 day 2.

@TJC510 Год назад

I was riding with a guy back in December, he broke a front axle at the fork lug, on a 21 or 22 XC. My first though was the two fork legs fighting each other causing flex and fatigued it. He hit a free pretty hard because of it. I have a picture to show but can't upload it here.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Crap

@silkrot Год назад

something about spring forks, just can't beat em. I feel like air forks are like getting back with your ex, no matter how good you can make the situation; The religious girl next door you grew up with would be a better choice hahahaha. Just ordered an MX-tech lucky kit for my 2023 Tc250

@scottphillips445 Год назад

The 1st thing a serious rider does is revalve the forks and shock. Revalving 1 end and not the other will likely create an imbalance. It is a 2 way street. Some people have a problem with spending money on suspension set up and I believe in testing and tuning. Stock valving stacks are generic, but recent WP has improved their stock settings. If you just ride casually then it's a waste of money. I like a lot of late stroke progression in my forks and I like a lot of sag in my shock. If you get your bike working better you will likely keep it longer. The older ktm set up is cone valve forks and an ohlins shock. I believe in revalving and springs for average Joe's. Cone valves and ohlins for pros

@fuellerr Год назад

SXF bikes and EXC's should come with this kit stock

@learningtofly6804 Год назад

Pretty cool exercise Morgan. Any idea how much extra weight it add's to the aer? (I like how light the steering and front end is on my bike with aer vs my kyb's... I know the kyb has benefits.... cheers

@TheTrailmeister Год назад

There is a noticeable difference in weight between AER and the Xplore forks. The Xplore forks are more plush but the cost of the plush is considerable added weight. You can feel the difference. Decide what’s more important a lighter more nimble front end or a slightly heavier more plush feel.

@highlandcycles Год назад

It’s about 3lbs difference

@nicholasreist-li3pz Год назад

Can you do a top end rebuild video on the 2023 ktm 300xc when the hours on the bike come to needing one?

@highlandcycles Год назад

Will do. Just waiting on parts

@Andy-co6pn Год назад

Jeff says they are "game changers" 🤣

@highlandcycles Год назад

Bwahahaha

@miro_s 4 месяца назад

Thanks. What would you do to the xplor shock to match using the xplor 6500 inserts? Leave it as it is?

@highlandcycles 4 месяца назад

We valve it to match.

@markturi5055 Год назад

Hey Morgan. Can you explain the difference in Mx tech lucky/raven vs. 6500. Have a lucky on xcw and really like it. 23 300 is stock at the momen

@highlandcycles Год назад

The 6500 is a lot like the ravens. Both are a twin chamber(closed chamber) setup. The lucky is more like the old open chamber forks. I like the 6500 because is WP parts that were made to fit the forks by the factory who builds the forks. They also have pre load adjust and I don’t believe the ravens do but I could be wrong about that.

@desert-timber-outdoors6577 Год назад

I love the air fork set up and the air fork design. For someone who has rode my entire life but cannot afford to drop thousands on suspension upgrades (even if I could I refuse) It is amazing….besides when I pay 10k for a bike why should I have to drop even more to “make it work”….. to me it is the best non professional riders system. You can change spring rate feelings instantly, and then the compression and rebound is extremely simple. I don’t race anymore, and for guys who ride for fun…. It plain works amazing, set up your air pressure correctly and then play with compression and rebound as normal and they feel great. Think of your bike investments this way, if you are a B level rider, and you take your air forks off and put 2k dollar front forks on your bike, your still going to be a B level rider with expensive forks…😂

@desert-timber-outdoors6577 Год назад

Plus it feels like nowadays people are spending so much money to get old technology….. why should we have to spend so much money for technology that they had 7 years ago 😂

@highlandcycles Год назад

I like the air fork too. But I have ridden a ton of bikes and I just like the feel of springs. Doesn’t make me faster and they don’t cost me anything so why not try them out and report back.

@TheLeoborges 2 месяца назад

Yes, more realibity, but lot morr friction than bladder design.

@highlandcycles 2 месяца назад

Yep. That’s why I’m running the Dal Soggios now

@TheLeoborges 2 месяца назад

@@highlandcycles , true is, I never had a issue on that bladder fork. Mean, they are reliable, too

@TeamStruggleBunny Год назад

Do you have a video on servicing? I'm mostly looking to confirm how the compression assembly is removed. Do you need to hold the preload nut in place then use a pin wrench to spin out the the compression assembly?

@Jrod_FPV Месяц назад

Did you ever find a good video on servicing?

@TeamStruggleBunny Месяц назад

@@Jrod_FPV I didn't find a video that covers it completely but between this and on from JBI Ride there's enough info. Maybe I'll make a video as I need to service mine soon.

@zachfarkash6430 Год назад

🤘🤘

@highlandcycles Год назад

🤘🏻

@painsrides3616 Год назад

Don't be mad but I'm blowing my budget on a full suspension upgrade(by Traxxion Dynamics) for my old Victory Cross Country... got to show the road bike some love 😎 I feel like the 22 XC-w's stock suspension(sprung for my weight) is such an upgrade form my 16 Husky's 4cs forks that I'm just going to enjoy the 22's suspension the way it is for this season at least.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Literally ANYTHING is better than 4CS

@hachtenduro7824 Год назад

@@highlandcycles 4cs can be reworked, with base valve adjusters (lainersuspension does good ones) and some mods, including blocking bleed holes etc. that makes them work like normal cartridge forks. Kreft Moto has done some research as well. But the effort is maybe to big with cost and time. I did mine to see if its possible and it is. Now they work for jumps as well as logs and rocks.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@hachtenduro7824 yeah. It’s basically like dropping cartridges in. Pain in the but when you can just buy a set of old open chambers and quick shim shuffle and you’re better

@memphis28571 Год назад

How do you like it compared to Luckys or the Raven inserts?

@highlandcycles Год назад

Don’t know yet

@ronhartle3268 Год назад

I know nothing about suspensions and only understand most of what you have posted on your channel about them. Is this better than buying totally new forks or just less expensive or both? Thanks

@highlandcycles Год назад

This is essentially buying new forks but a little less money since you don’t have to buy the outer tubes

@josecantu5753 Год назад

What about something for the cross trainer ?

@highlandcycles Год назад

I believe that Beta offers a KYB setup for them. It’s really good

@mikeburnett6222 11 месяцев назад

Ive had 3 sets of AER's, all tuned by professionals. None of the worked below 5mph in the rough. I currently have a set of 6500's in a TX that I'm selling. My forks are 2" shorter and the guy wanting the bikke wants it full hieght. Can you infirm me what to remove on the cartridge to go bsck to full length?

@highlandcycles 11 месяцев назад

There will be a spacer inside the cartridge that keeps it from extending all the way.

@ghost53pilot Год назад

110 hours on my XPLR version. So good! I change my outer chamber oil (383ML) every 50 hours. Anybody know if the inner chamber (160ML) needs to be changed ever? I run 18 clicks playing in the rocks and 16 for race pace and yes 2 clicks on these 6500 is like 4 to 6 clicks on the stock forks.

@highlandcycles Год назад

I would do the inner every time you do outer. It doesn’t get dirty as fast but it’s more important for damping. And it’s not much more work.

@Andy-co6pn Год назад

Hey Morgan, are these available.for the 2019 and earlier AER forks or just the later "Xact" models ?

@highlandcycles Год назад

Have to check but I think they are. Might have to buy a couple other parts inside to make them fit but I am not sure.

@Andy-co6pn Год назад

@@highlandcycles thought I heard somewhere that the bottoms are different

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@Andy-co6pn they might be. If so, you can get lugs. Might be able to get them cheap from someone who did a kyb swap

@kevinearls7496 Год назад

The 21 and up lugs changed, these are drop in for those bikes but fit the 17 up bikes with a lug change...if I remember correctly.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@kevinearls7496 I think you are right

@scottphillips445 Год назад

I have a 36mm pwk question for you. I think I have the carb dialed in or close to it. Here is what was going on. There was a slight bog off the bottom so I lowered the idle and it cleaned up" at the crack of the throttle " I have not ridden it yet, but I am thinking that either the floats are a little high or I have too large of a pilot jet.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Usually a bog on a two stroke is from a lean condition

@scottphillips445 Год назад

@@highlandcycles I am running a 172 main 40 pilot necj needle in the 2nd position, also I had the carb misaligned a little bit, but lowering the idle did eliminate the bog. For motocross ai would install a 182. I have the 172 in it for the woods.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@scottphillips445 try a 42 pilot

@scottphillips445 Год назад

125/150 jetting is a whole other world! Thanks for the advice. My specs call for a 182 main at Washougal. A 172 is for single track or elevation. East fort Rock east of bend has a 300+ trail system. I very put down a few bottles of pre mix out there. Your bike would be the funnest bike in the park out in east fort. I have always said that a 250 2 stroke is the most fun but not anymore. 300SX/XC is. Runs like a perfectly jetted 250 all the time.

@scottphillips445 Год назад

After listening to what you have for jetting I must be way off. I have not ridden it yet but I am planning on fixing that. Where would you start for motocross jetting with a 36mm pwk on a 2018 150SX? I have a 182 main 40 pilot necj in the 2nd position. I have collected jetting from multiple sources

@letsdroneit7060 9 месяцев назад

Is the kit for the Wp aer 48 Shockers ..

@highlandcycles 9 месяцев назад

Yes

@philsheridan6759 Год назад

I've got 23 ec300 with ktech curious to see reviews on 6500 kit

@paultweeton9902 Год назад

How do you like your Ktech? Just had that setup done on my daughters 23 SXF 250, she hasn’t ridden it yet, thanks in advance

@philsheridan6759 Год назад

@@paultweeton9902 I like them had check point off road do them. Hes got lots of experience with them set them up well. Going to dunes next weekend nice to see how they adjust to that.

@philsheridan6759 Год назад

@@paultweeton9902 he put bladder and revalve and xtrig adjuster in shock

@paultweeton9902 Год назад

@@philsheridan6759 Matt knows his stuff, he’s one of our fast guys here in Minnesota, anxiously waiting for snow to melt, have fun in the dunes

@philsheridan6759 Год назад

@@paultweeton9902 I think k-tech are good as long as setup well but never be a 6500 set. But havnt got much single track in on new setup with mn weather looking forward to theilman and summer

@mikeb4708 Год назад

I prefer the 6500 kit over cone valves which are way overrated IMO. I was told the 6500 kit is identical to the internals on the CV forks with the exception that it uses shims on the mid-valve instead of the cones.

@highlandcycles Год назад

I am sure that’s right. I agree that cone valves are over rated.

@emw5008 Год назад

👍

@wayneleonard8367 Год назад

Ya Morgan you need a base before adding tbt spring

@highlandcycles Год назад

Yeah but I don’t want to wait. I’m running out of time before race season. And if we install, it barely costs more to have it re valved.

@Mostviews111 Год назад

Would it be easier to just swap over to spring forks

@highlandcycles Год назад

Sure but maybe much more money depending on what you can find

@Mostviews111 Год назад

@@highlandcycles right I know a lot of people that want to try the other and will swap.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@Mostviews111 totally. Just depends on availability

@robtoole1480 Год назад

Soo a KYB copy. Lets get some details comparison with KYB and what is the weight difference vs AER and KYB.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Will do

@winterfriction Год назад

Yeah WP pretty much killed the cartridge kit market with the 6500. Couple years ago the Kyb and Mxtech kits sold well but not anymore. And nice business for ktm who sells a shitload of these kits and cv forks/trax shocks. Especially for the exc/te/ec bikes with the crappy explor suspension.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Yep, kinda like they are doing with the bladder kits now too.

@darrellyazzie7664 Год назад

You would be better off with the proven mule suspension from slaven’s…. Worth every penny

@highlandcycles Год назад

Hahahah. I’ve ridden both. I like TBT much better for going “fast”. And Jeff just buys the MX Tech stuff. Which is very good but not specific to Jeff. He has a guy local here in montrose valve his stuff

@randytidwell5836 Год назад

does your air forks have a midvalve

@highlandcycles Год назад

Yes

@randytidwell5836 Год назад

When y'all revalued the forks did you lighten up the mid valve? A Lot of companies now days don't touch the mid valve because it can be tricky to get set up and easy to mess up.

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@randytidwell5836 Actually on mine we "stiffened" it up a bit. The new AER fork feels harsh at first be we found that it was because it was moving through the stroke to quickly. It was counter intuitive but worked really well. We always change the mid valve on forks. I really do believe that TBT is at the leading edge of suspension.

@randytidwell5836 Год назад

I gotcha, sounds like the AER has too much low speed in the compression stack and does not ramp up enough as you get into the stroke .

@hachtenduro7824 Год назад

I like you show the product end explain what it is. If the reason for revalving is a different use than it was intended - OK. But if you got setup for your likings from WP, what makes you think you can do immediately better than manufacturer before even trying? Do you have a test stand to quantify changes in an objective and reproducible way? At least a track that has all features and is relatively reproducible? Last but not least - you can not compare it, when never tried. Regarding the theory, asymetrical interiors do enhance stiction and friction. Yes - but the asymetric induced forces bending from right to left or vice versa are pretty small compared to the bending back and forth in the riding direction. If you want to improve go for coatings like DLC. Have the fork seals and bushings in good shape and so on. Air forks are adding friction because of the airtight seals and the spring curve is never as linear as steel coil spring. This is more serious than the asymetry. I am curious about your next results! Best regards!

@highlandcycles Год назад

We have a ton of testing on these as a company. TBT is a big suspension company with small franchises so as a whole we have a lot of info on these kits. That’s why I know I want to valve it for me specifically. I would for the sake of RU-vid install, ride, then valve but I am running out of time before race season and I don’t think I’ll have time. Despite what it looks like on RU-vid, we are super busy as a shop and I don’t always have time to work on my own stuff. Maybe when we hit 100K

@highlandcycles Год назад

And the stiction is the biggest thing for the AER setup but the kawi ones and the single leg conversions also never worked that well in my opinion with just one heavy spring.

@davidgrunklee8407 Год назад

Word is the 24 xc bikes are coming with this setup.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Really?? XC or XC-W? That would be killer

@davidgrunklee8407 Год назад

@@highlandcycles xc/tx for sure....unsure on xc-w

@donaldblank8873 10 месяцев назад

I'm watching this video for a specific reason, Is this kit worth it, I'm sitting in a chair with a badly twisted torn knee. The reason being, My WP suspension on my 2023 gas gas sucks, Front end dives really bad, I ride hard eduro,creeks, loose rocks, roots. Logs, Those forks deflected off loose rocks and my toe caught the bank and my bike ran over my Heel, I must fix the forks. They should be a recall.

@highlandcycles 10 месяцев назад

Yes it is worth it!

@davidgrunklee8407 Год назад

Fyi 6500's come valved for mx for 350's.

@highlandcycles Год назад

Depends on which kit I think. They have an SX and an enduro

@davidgrunklee8407 Год назад

@Highland Cycles that's not what I'm hearing. Every single one in USA I'm told is valved 350/mx

@highlandcycles Год назад

@@davidgrunklee8407 well, Solid Performance (the WP importer for the US) says there are options and we have seen differences in the ICS rates. Either way they have to be re valved to fit each rider.