What Issue Does Your Fandom NEVER Address? 

I absolutely hate the timeline. In one school year they went from 10th grade to 8th grade to 9th grade

I still can't believe that soccer episode with Chloé was actually real

I am in the fandom as well and the show is just a slog but once you watched it once you must watch it all no matter what.

@@AntonioTheTurtle I straight up couldn't continue after episode 18 of season 5

@@SnickerDoodleBug05 wdym?

also we hear about Aang as a parent from the biased perspective of his adult children remembering their childhood, if you've ever had siblings you have exaggerated things for the sake of sibling rivalry, they seem more upset at each other than it is with Aang as a father, and at the end of the episode when Bumi, Kya and Tenzin found an old photo of them as children, they all agreed that they were a happy family. The bad times, all the childish scraps and the immature pranks, are burned into their minds as it would be with any moment of intense emotion, but there’s no doubt among them that they were loved equally.

I just wish Katara and Aang’s relationship wasn’t so ham fisted and they were properly developed in some way instead of “ooohhhh they’re kissing” like in the original show or the disaster of the comics. It’s one thing to portray a problematic relationship but the two main show runners for atla are insistent on them being the most wholesome loving relationship possible when everything screams the exact opposite, even if they did try to say something about Aang’s treatment of his kids in tlok. Any time someone points this out it falls on deaf ears and it drives me nuts because somehow their relationship is above criticism despite how poorly fleshed out it as a romance

To add onto this, I feel like people forget that the entire Airbender Culture is *significantly* different from what we consider to be normal; Air Nomad children were temporarily raised in the Western and Eastern Air Temples before going to the Northern or Southern Air Temples to practice and train in Airbending techniques and Spirituality. (They were also segregated by gender, IIRC.) Aang never had parents; the closest person he had to a parental figure was Monk Gyatso. Obviously, someone who never had parents wouldn't really know how to parent as well as we think they should. (And before someone points out Zuko: yes, Ozai was an abusive and neglectful father, but Zuko still had Uncle Iroh to guide him and act as a father to him throughout his life. Aang was acquainted with Gyatso for only a couple of years.)

​@@appletart7262 I'm still salty over the show never having had Aang apologize for kissing Katara at the Ember Islands Play even though she said she was confused about her feelings towards Aang. That and the two having a proper, mature discussion on where they stood with each other after the kiss.

Seriously, I'm sick of people saying that TLOK was a character assassination of Aang for the simple fact that he had the GALL to not deal with the near complete genocide of his entire race 100% perfectly. They made it abundantly clear that he loved all his children and Katara, but the simple fact is that the teachings, lessons, and way of life of an ENTIRE race of people could only have possibly been retained by one of his children. Of course there's going to be stress, and of course Aang can't do everything perfectly. But in the end, all the kids express how much they still love Aang and his memory. Hell, when Bumi first gains the ability to Airbend in Season 3, the very first thing he says is how proud Aang would be and how proud Katara will be.

he's really nice honestly he gives us a basically free house, lets us take our time. the real enemy is the fox that sells fake stuff fuck redd

Meanwhile, Lyle was an insurance scammer in City Folk, if I remember correctly. I don't know what the fandom thinks of him, though.

I once saw someone say that it’s “the collective proletariat urge to detest all debt collectors,” and that’s the explanation I’m sticking with.

@@paigeepler I think we like him. He did redeem himself my no longer teaming up with Redd the Fox, and started working at the Happy Home Academy. The NPCs did not forget he used to be a scammer, they talk about it with or without Lyle.

@@blueotter5954 Good to know, thanks! I like Animal Crossing but I never know what the fandom is doing at any given time

they've just reinvented the gender binary again

Agree. In the vocaloid fandom some people want to reclaim the character v-flower as non binary, and that's ok... But you have to also let other people treat the character as a woman (canon gender) and don't get mad about it. There are so freacking few masculine woman characters and it's so damn frustrating when people can't refer to the character by she/her pronouns because some people will appear to try to correct you.

@pamelavergara3771 I think the vflower being nonbinary thing is also cause in the early days of vflower, everyone thought she was nb. I'm not sure why, but that's what it was, so I guess the people who still correct that simply never got the memo

@@pamelavergara3771 Personally, I saw her a couple of times and really liked her, but in the contexts I saw her she appeared more masculine so I thought that she was a boy. I've decided to just run with that because I can't be bothered to change how I think of her, she's a male to me.

I never saw this, but i actually see the opposite a lot

Yeah, acknowledging a character's flaws and the harm they caused without demonizing them is something Fandom is really, REALLY bad at

The Attack on Titan fandom... Eren killed 80% of humanity for "freedom" but ofc they hate on Annie for yoyo-ing someone whilst in her titan form because 1. She was a brainwashed child trained to be a killing machine and 2. she detaches herself whilst in her titan form to cope with the guilt. Now I'm just justifying killing but Annie literally never had a choice AND she killed a lot less people than Eren.

So basically the fandom for the phantom of the opera, (spoilers) you have no idea how much people defend him despite him threatening and murdering innocents and also was manipulating, stalking, almost murdering, attempting to force into marriage, and kidnapping the much younger girl he "loves"... But nooooo he's just a poor baby who needs love and Christine is being unreasonable and selfish when she chooses the rich and beautiful guy who loved her and makes her feel safe. Then the fandom proceeds to attack Raoul too when he does something wrong while the phantom does x100 worse. Seriously the fandom doesn't get it into their head that one isn't entitled to another's love.

I have no room to talk, I struggle with this with real people.

Yeah nuance in general seems to be hard for a lot of fandom. Even in fandoms where the entirety of canon keeps beating you over the head with how multifaceted real human beings are, whaddaya know, the fandom has reduced that to the character with a hint of anxiety is an uwu bean who can't do anything by themselves and is never wrong and the pretty guy is so perfect and infallible and to suggest otherwise is bashing them. Like I'm sorry but the uwu bean has their own life and career they built themselves and has at multiple points yelled at people and in general been very non-uwu bean like. And your perfect hot guy starts the series off by being a jerk and continues to mess up again and again and learn from those mistakes. That doesn't make them bad people, it just makes them *people*. And that grand evil villain who probably skins puppies because they looked sceptically at the MC that one time? Yeah sure they're not super nice but they're not evil for not being 100% on the MCs side at all times. They're not evil for calling out the uwu bean for being disrespectful or straight up dismissive and mean. And even if they are an actual evil villain, they can still do good. You not liking them doesn't mean they're canonically as bad as you want them to be. Good people to bad thing and bad people do good things and just because you're biased for or against a character doesn't make your opinion of their actions and their forgivableness objective truth. Let characters be multifaceted, please

This show needs to be on a bingo card.

The fact that they literally made a statue out of the TERRORIST (because he literally made people afraid of being sad or angry) will never not baffle me

​@montserratmarroquin400 yes, because LB is a 'hero' and 'heroes keep thier promises' . Even if said promise was to a bad guy, because 'it's the right thing to do'

I legit started writing magical girl au fanfiction for the first time, because I was so done with how bad miraculous was. Akumatization is such an amazing concept, so why did it originate from a shitty show?

My exact thoughts. The show sucks

fr. Fandoms are such a beautiful concept and I'm tired of people antagonizing it because of a few assholes

Tiktok needs to realize this. I've seen so many times people with Hazbin Hotel pfps get harassed and even doxxed by Tiktokers just for having a Hazbin Hotel pfp So many received death threats for a pfp of a fandom they don't like. I thought RU-vid Community was exaggerating until I used Tiktok myself, the death threats are common there

Kpop fan here

Yup. I've never had much issue in the My Hero Academia fandom, in my experience. Like, people go on about the fandom being so "horrible, and horrible, full of toxic degenerates and fujoshi's". And... Like... Where??? BNHA has many issues, as does the fandom, but I don't think the fandom is really that overwhelmingly toxic. Unless I've just accidentally avoided "the toxic majority", despite being in the fandom for about five years, straight. It just feels like people look at fandoms that have predominantly queer and/or neurodivergent fanbases, and label them toxic because people like projecting on characters, and find comfort in "canon non-conforming" ideas. That, *or* they specifically point to the young straight girls who often follow these demographics, because of fetishization of gay relationships. (The only point I will give to the people who call the BNHA fandom "toxic" is that Bakudeku is one of the most common ships in the fandom, and it's inherently polarizing. *But*, as somebody who doesn't like Bakudeku, it's avoidable. Again, this is anecdotal, but avoiding it isn't impossible, you just have to know what demographics you'll often find it in. For example, you're significantly more likely to find Bakudeku in parts of the fandom where young teens, and pre-teens, tend to congregate. If you're judging a fandom based on the youngest demographics in the fandom, then... I don't know what to tell you.)

​@@UnholyGlitch404 Thank you. I've been waiting 3 years for someone to say this. I wish people stop generalizing everyone in the fandom. (I'm glad you haven't encountered so many toxic ppl... There are some really rotten apples in here)

Agreed!

THIS, I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH

This is literally what people don’t understand about Catra (obviously she did bad and toxic things, nobody’s saying she didn’t, but the fact that she saw that she was wrong and changed is what give’s her redemption)

Actually that atonement.

@montserratmarroquin400 Catra getting so much hate made me think and realize that, if we had a version of ATLA where we saw Iroh in his youth, everyone would hate him, say he was irredeemable and bash his redemption, because the things he has done prior to the events of the cartoon are so much more horrific than anything Catra ever did and he doesn't even have a traumatic backstory to explain his actions. He just was a terrible person, and then made the decision to do better after the loss of his son. And he is one of the most beloved characters in any work of fiction.

... THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! plus... SHE IS A FREAKING TWELVE YEAR OLD, LET HER BE SELFISH WITHOUT MAKING HER SEEM LIKE A MONSTER(I commented something similar to this.)

I'm never going to forgive the way the Gravity Falls fandom treated Mabel. People go so far out of their way to demonize a 12 year old girl for being selfish and impulsive while ignoring the moments where Dipper is just as selfish and impulsive. Especially regarding Wendy. Which is because THEY'RE BOTH 12 YEARS OLD.

MY GOD THANK YOU. mabel is my favorite character from gravity falls and i HATE HATE HATE how much the fandom slanders her. she's 12 fucking years old give her a break 💀

She's also 12 years old like everyone was a little selfish at 12

I don’t know why but everywhere I go it’s always the young girl characters who are treated like vile monsters for just being kids, god forbid if they’re traumatised/a victim of a abuse because then they’re utterly irredeemable!

also, bsd fandom specific: if you're going to put atsushi/akutagawa and atsushi and kyouka having a sibling relationship in the same fic i think it should maybe be acknowledged that he's dating his sister figures abuser?? i never see it brought up and it would be interesting to see people explore more often

@pferinne No bc I was literally about to mention the BSD fandom before I read your reply the women getting ignored is such a big problem. I don’t think I have ever seen the fandom mention Yosano outside of these four contexts: - She hot - Shipping (usually with other hot women) - Mori - Her ability (sometimes) And she’s one of the main cast, like the second most relevant woman in the series after Kyouka. It’s wild. I know people would (and sadly sometimes do) act the same about Kyouka if she wasn’t literally a child.

Fandom sexism my beloathed 😭 it's fucking everywhere

There's also the third option, where any girl who isn't an absolute doormat is referred to as a MONSTER. For example Katara. She's done wrong, yes, but she's a traumatised kid under massive stress. According to some ATLA fans, she's worse than Ozai.

Even worse is when canon goes OUT OF THEIR WAY to make a character nothing but sex appeal. One of my favorite fictional characters EVER is Momo Yaoyorozu from MHA, and she’s infamous for being a 15 year old that almost _constantly_ has a boob window. She does have an actual personality, but most people don’t remember that very often.

I agree and nothing justifies what he did BUT I'm tierd of people calling Mitsuki a good mother, yes she loves him, yes she cares about him but that dosen't mean it is not abuse to hit and blame your child for getting kidnapped. It isn't ok and I don't get why people think it is

@@tati-4638 I think it’s because she barely shows up in the story. If she had more screen time, maybe Horikoshi would’ve made her mention the bullying.

@@selmabm3409 yeah we don't know how it was back then but we do know that bakugo never learned how to deal with emotions. Deku thinks that in the fight in ground beta and Katsuki says himself "a little violence is necessary" .. "that's how I was raised" to todoroki. (That dosen't excuse the bullying ofcourse)

As a bkdk shipper in fics we usually never try to justify his bullying or portray it as "him being too shy to show Izuku his feelings" but as him going through his arc as "the gifted kid" we usually have him grow from his past through other characters (maybe go to therapy) and then start having feelings for Izuku after admiring and appreciating his input in some fics he straight up just rejects Izuku because he knows he isn't mentally there yet sometimes they don't even have them as childhood friends because a lot of us believe "soulmates" because the story keeps bringing up the twin stars motif and that they're complementary in the "save to win" and "win to save". We do not ship it because of the bullying we ship it inspite of the bullying as we see them as two individuals who've grown together sometimes as a result of one another for better and for worse. A lot of bkdk fics also don't make Mama Mitsuki abusive because we like her being nice to her son and Izuku.

you fxcking fujoshi comshiper get a life @@magicalpopfish9570

Honestly, I get and agree with what you’re saying, as a lot of it comes off as really victim-blamed,,, but like… they didn’t get it from nowhere. the books do it too - i mean, there’s tons of scenes in their relationship where Cho Chang is looked down upon for crying and it’s heavily implied she’s just ‘acting sad for the attention’ and ‘didn’t really know cedric anyway’ so yeah, they shouldn’t do that, but the books shouldn’t, either

@@starcre9338 Oh that's what I meant. If it wasn't in the books my problem would be different, but no, she actually wrote that. That's my problem.

@@stormrider24 oh whoops! i just misread it, sorry

i feel like the HP fandom ignoring the problematic aspects in JKR’s writing is fine as long as they don’t replicate it. confronting it is cool too

To be honest, I think the book nailed how a bunch of teenagers would react to someone who was going through the ringer. Teens are assholes (WE ALL WERE, DON'T EVEN TRY TO DENY IT) and are very self-absorbed. Cho was a popular girl before the events of Order of the Phoenix, meaning that it was pretty likely that most of her "friends" were just hanging with the popular girl and didn't actually care. So when she starts getting all sad and depressed, they drop her like a dress they've worn one time. I always thought it was a realistic portrayal of cliques in High School and how they would react. Harry being totally confused and frustrated by her makes sense too, it's not like he had emotional support growing up, so his emotional growth is likely extremely stunted and because we follow the story through his eyes, we get his interpretation. The story would've likely been written very differently if we had read it through Cho's eyes. How she lost her crush, lost her popularity, is trying to move on with her life despite not being in a good place and then not being supported by her boyfriend (let's be real, Harry didn't really make the time for her, nor did ever actually have a full on deep conversation with her). Remember, the story may be written in 3rd person, but it's being conveyed through Harry's eyes. We never get to see what other characters are thinking.

Especially since there's valid reasons to hate Rose/pink but this isn't one of them she can love who she likes

Agreed. Rose loving who she wanted instead of the main character who loved her is nothing to get mad about. It seemed somewhat reciprocated at some point in the past, but that doesn’t mean she owed Pearl anything when her interest drifted elsewhere.

I totally agree with that...but I think she should have marked more boundaries with pearl so as not to give her false hope. I am especially referring to the rainbow quartz scene.

@@henrybugado593 True. If she didn’t want to maintain a romantic relationship with Pearl, she should have said so instead of stringing her along. My question is if she realized that Pearl was so jealous of Greg because Rose is relatively oblivious and Pearl pretended things were fine when she wasn’t happy. It’s not exactly Rose’s fault if Pearl didn’t clearly communicate that she wasn’t ok with Greg because she had established a pattern of being fine with Rose’s human trysts so long as she was going to be the one Rose stuck with. It’s amazingly complicated even when trying to follow simple seeming rules when it comes to relationships.

@@starlydonati2008 I agree with that last point. Communication is hard; you think you got it right, but then it becomes too late to realize you did not get it right. It certainly lead to some some of my own past breakups at least.

Nobody wants to talk about the headcanons based on toxic gender stereotypes.

Wait, people hc Luisa as transmasc? But she's super feminine whenever she gets the chance to be... Her imagine spot is full of fluffy pink clouds and sparkly (donkey) unicorns!

As a queer person myself, I hate when people just decide this or that character must secretly be queer because they don’t conform to every stereotype of their gender. First of all, gender stereotypes are stupid and constantly changing anyway, so someone who would have fit them a few decades ago might not fit them today. Likewise, a character who was breaking the gender stereotypes of their time might be gender-conforming by today’s standards. Not to mention, if someone tried to claim that an openly queer character must secretly be straight because they’re gender-conforming, they’d be laughed out of the fandom. Headcanon characters however you want, but reducing them to “iF yOu DoN’t AcT lIkE a PeRfEcT lAdY/mAnLy MaN yOu MuSt Be GaY” comes across as kind of gross.

@tsifirakiehl4250 People can headcanon characters as whatever sexuality they want but please PLEASE can they stop claiming it's some secret malicious message when the whole basis for them thinking that is toxic masculinity or other harmful stereotypes? I've seen a Fandom send hate to show creators for "queerbaiting". The queerbaiting in question: two male characters had emotions, and were friends. And not very good friends, at that. I think people in Fandom need to start accepting that your personal headcanons not becoming true isn't a personal attack.

@@tsifirakiehl4250 Mitten from Animated Inanimate Battle said it best- "I'm free to violate any gender norms I want!"

OH MY GOD FOR REAL 💀💀💀💀😭😭 I felt like I was going crazy. They always blamed every other character for Nico's actions, even vilifying Bianca. For what? What did she do??? Saying that she abandoned him is absolutely insane. All she wanted was for him to move on. God forbid the daughter of Hades tells Nico to respect that she's dead. Being depressed and traumatized doesn't make you except from being a jerkass. And Nico was a complete jerkass. Refused to talk to people that wanted the best for him, then would lament that nobody liked him. Which I understand, because he's a flawed character, but the fandom took that as "YEAH BABY NICO YOU'RE SO GODDAMN RIGHT EVERYONE HATES YOU!!!!"

I know right I had seen the Fandom stuff about Nico before I read the book he appeared in and was utterly confused about what they were talking about. Granted he is one of my favorite characters in the series by the current point I'm at but that's for the exact opposite reasons that the Fandom seems to love him for.

Yes! I have a pjo instagram account but I actively avoid anything that has to do with that. I just found it weird.

Absolutely agree. I actually have many issues with how the fandom handles most of the cast, too, such as their "macho-fying" of Frank, the despicable, useless power scaling debates, the Mary Sue-fication of every member of the old cast (especially Percy), the extreme flanderization of Literally Everyone But Specially Leo™, and the deep misunderstanding of characters to the point of fans thinking their unintentionally made-up version of the characters' personality = canon (this is doubly so for any characters that are part of the supporting cast, such as Will and Calypso) But, to be fair, Rick Riordan has slowly but surely become the biggest part of the problem with the passing of the years. He also started writing Nico as an OOC "uwu angsty baby", too. I remember the whiplash I got reading Blood Of Olympus, because half of the time Nico's character was written in line with both his appearances in the older PJO books and his development in Heroes of Olympus, the other half he's written as if he's some sort of hybrid between Charlie Spring from Heartstopper and the goth from Boyfriends WB, there's some really good scenes where some stuff is acknowledge and then poof! Nothing, everything solved in the most cheesy way possible, character flaws never have to be faced bc now they're non-existent! And similar goes to Piper, and Leo, and Jason, and Hazel, and Frank, and Thalia, and Annabeth, and Percy, etc etc, it's just waaay more prominent with Nico. Sigh. I still love the newer Riordan's works, Magnus Chase is one of my favorite MC's of his, after all, there's no issue with him not being a perfect writer and making mistakes and all that jazz. The problem I have is with the fandom, who are all extreme sycophants completely closed off to civil discussion, or just exchanging different opinions that don't line up with the mainstream ones within the fandom.

​@@michellekeppler982same fr fr, he's also one of my favorites but for completely different reasons most of the fandom likes him. Mainly, because the version of him they're obsessed with is an imaginary one they have mostly projected into the character. (And I say "mostly" bc for better or for worse, Rick Riordan _has_ indeed been woobiefying Nico)

Also, dislike doesn't mean enemy doesn't mean antagonist doesn't mean rival, all different and not exclusive things

YES!

coldest take

Amazing take, enemies to lovers is so overrated

this!! I HATE. JOSUKE X ROHAN. LET THEM. BE ENEMIES. AND THATS A MINOR/ADULT GAP (josuke4 is 16, rohan is 20.)

What is it with the _current year_ internet's obsession with gays (specifically,homos3xuals)? Yes,I myself go to e621,I saw the memetic femboy rat & the noseless space sheep & the 2 canine knights,& all the other famous OCs.I look up Zackary911 DAILY,as a CISHET male! I STILL have no idea why people act like pigeons seeing seeds whenever a LGBT character appears in media.Especially women.Gay men are GAY,so logically,they aren't going to be into YOU. Fcck,the "Elfslayer Chronicles" 4chan post only happened because some sl00t wanted to make her D&D party go through her p0rn without plot setting. I actually tolerate gay p0rn a lot more than gay characters or people.P0rn doesn't have rancid vibes.

Just watch the lego Batman movie, the gayest Batman media in existence

@Anonymoustoothbrush-il1gf Or the Telltale games

@@one-onessadhalf3393 true, I forgot about telltale, I’d say that their both tied for the gayest Batman thing out there.

So real

Even the show had to call this out, as a shy person i can't just get over my shyness

They even made an episode about it.

I dont think thats just a MLP specific problem. The internet kinda gave eveyone the idea of direct good or bad and that anyone who does one thing wrong is suddenly a horrible person, no matter if they try to learn or make up for their actions.

When the ponies got mad at Fluttershy re-learning the same lesson over and over again, I got so annoyed. As a shy person myself, you can't just expect someone to always feel comfortable expressing themselves when they're not with people they trust, especially since there is probably a reason why they're so shy.

'The Mane 6.' He he

The only reason to acknowledge the finale is because of a glitch in time undoing it

@@plutodragon4 I will not acknowledge it until I get a chance to read A Glitch in Time. It simply does not exist to me

Well,I never saw the finale.I watched the show,I have no idea why it stopped airing for me OR which episode I left on.I definetly remember sitting down & watching it,so it isn't just me going through the clips I saw on the internet.

@@callmesummonit never even happened also i like your leo pfp my fellow rottmnt fan

@@plutodragon4 eyyy rottmnt buddies

Ya, but I think I'm partly a problem in this 😂

I hate how people irl look at a boy & girl or man & woman being friendly to each other & say that they are dating or have feelings for each other. Once at my school people thought 2 teachers have feelings for each other just cause they were seen hanging out with each other. Turns out they were cousins. Then there was this time that my friend thought these 2 teachers were dating or something just cause they held hands/touched each others hands. It frustrates me so much especially since I befriended boys in my past but now my friends thinks I like them. I don't even talk to them anymore.

Hello there, Pokémon anime fandom.

Applies to every sort of relationship. Male-female, male-male, female-female, they're all shipped because they looked at each other once. Friendship doesn't exist anymore.

​@@gyppygirl2021 this is what's going on in the ramshackle Fandom ( if you haven't heard of it , it's an animated pilot that just had it's first official episode and people are shipping the main characters, even though the main theme of the series is found family ( do people not appreciate characters that have a family bond )

Depends on the actions. But traumatic past or not, some actions can't be defended. For example, Frieza blew up an entire planet in Dragon Ball. A sad backstory won't justify that.

God this is a particular part of the ofmd fandom. Coming up with a traumatic backstory for izzy and demonizing ed. So annoying

Or turning said characters with trauma into “perfect victims” when they aren’t. Saw that a bit in dsmp with c!Tommy. C!Tommy himself was a surprisingly accurate portrayal of someone experiencing trauma and being irreparably changed by it (which is surprising for a Minecraft series), but everyone in the fandom always filed off his edges. C!Tommy was a surprisingly complex character but he did a lot of unambiguously bad things out of trauma after exile

​​@@kevintanza6968 vegeta also blew up planets, he is one of the good guys now and i think some people would say that he couldn't do any other thing considering his father and is entire life before z, so no, you can write a Backstory to make a planet destroyer simpatetic if you do it in the present too

I saw this happening in the SU fandom with Jasper and Lapis 😭😭 someone on twitter treated Jasper like "the poor victim of abuse from Lapis 🥺🥺" meanwhile they treated lapis like if she was abusive for STANDING UP against her abuser?? The worst part was seeing a lot of people agree and deffend this person?? As a victim of abuse i really think its weird, awful and it just show how media literacy is dead

Yeahh 😞its really really common for fandoms to forget a character is aro, ace, or both

​​@@twotruckslyrics Side eying the hazbin hotel fandom. But yea, especially in queer spaces, ive seen a LOT of aro/ace/aroace erasure. One of the only reasons i can assume people believe wukong is not aroace is that journey to the west has a lot of wacky and debateable translations with many things changing from translation to translation. An example would be nezha's age, which varies from being eternally a child to being an adult, or Tang having a lover in a few odd translations

I used to be in the fandom, and I had no clue.

​@@goldie1943 I'm nowhere enough pages deep into it to have any valid opinions myself, but you're 11 centuries off

@elalaela2694 Oops, yeah that was just from a quick google search and I misread 😅 thanks for correcting lol

Yeah, I love the musical (it's one of my favourites!) but the fandom is weird. Also, where did the John "turtle boy" thing come from?

Yeah, a lot of people tried to hate on the show for “glorifying” its title character, and I wonder if they even watched the same show I did. Yes, the show does feature good things that Hamilton did, but it also features bad things he did, and when he does bad things, he is clearly shown to be in the wrong. Alexander Hamilton wasn’t a saint, but he wasn’t a demon either. He was a person, who did a lot of both good and bad, and that is what the show portrays.

​@@lenabluejay1166that came from the fact that he liked to draw a lot of turtles irl

@@panizshariat7892 That's really cute!! I guess the fandom just really exaggerates it to the point of acting like it's his only personality trait...

Yeah those that say the musical glorified Alexander and the founding fathers clearly didn’t pay attention or only saw the fandoms side of things, I think Lin made it pretty clear that despite the good things he did Alexander was a flawed human being who cheated on his wife and indirectly got his son killed in a duel and that the founding fathers were also petty assholes, it’s not his fault people horribly misinterpreted his work

Which is even more hilarious when iroh himself doesn't believe she is beyond healing and redemption, he just thought she needed to be removed from power before more people got hurt.

They forget that her nation being at war is all Azula has ever known. About the only real career option for a member of the Fire Nation is either warrior, or directly related to that. And as a master firebender from seemingly the word go, Azula is training to be a warrior as all firebenders are expected to be. Iroh is a person who needed his son to die to see the personal cost of war; until then, it was a job he did, & he was good at it. Once his son died & put things into perspective for him, he was hit hard, not just by grief, but also by guilt & remorse for all the sons & daughters who died at his hand whose parents now grieve them just as he grieves his son. And then we have Ozai aka the WORST father in the whole show. Favouritism, strictness, coldness, high expectations, physical abuse... At least Zuko had Iroh watching his back, & before him, his mother. Azula only had Ozai, & he wasn't good to her either. He drove her to be who she is, & almost nobody can counter that effect on her. Especially not as the war backs him up.

Yeah, if Iroh can change, so can Azula. They’re just at different points in their lives and journeys. Iroh had many years to turn himself around. Azula is still grappling with everything and her own relationship to herself. She could very well get there someday.

Yeah, I love Iroh as a character, but Azula was a victim herself. She was mentally unstable during the final Agni Kai and was a child used as a weapon to further Ozai’s agenda.

I don’t understand people hating her for that at all. Like, I have my issues with Mabel, mostly just her in season 1, but blaming her for Weirdmageddon just doesn’t make sense

YES, I hate that. I dislike Stanford for how dumb to trust Bill so much despite being a genius and a grown man but Mabel is a child, a literal child. 😭

​@@Imserious184 I hate Stanford too... Not for trusting Bill, Stanford is a curious man so I can understand why he trusted Bill. But I hate him for not saying 'thank you'. Stanley ended learning to say 'please' in season 1, why can't Stanford learn to say 'thank you'?'

I still don’t get how people hate on her for weirdmageddon. Like, she had no idea what the thing she was holding was and had no reason to distrust blendin. Also, her feelings in that moment make perfect sense and is something that I’m quite sure nearly all children have felt at some point.

She acted rashly in response to Dipper, but they literally had zero time to talk things over and make up before Bill showed up. Its wild that people blame her because of a demon taking advantage of two literal children fighting. Absolutely wild.

I do wish fandoms in general were a little more open to the messy but intricate aspects of characters. Those traits are what makes them multi-dimensional, and they leave a ton of room for further thought, interpretation, and exploration (as demonstated above)

@@FruitSalad253 Agreed! Obviously there’s always time for treating characters like silly little guys, not everything needs to be serious. But you should try to look deeper into a character, beyond what the text states.

I had this exact discussion a year or so ago on Twitter... If I remember correctly, the thing was that people was pissed that Loona was phisically aggresive towards Blitz on the beggining of the chapter Seeing Stars. I too was often bothered with how her was horrible to other characters on the show, but this time I felt different for a simple reason: It is established on that episode that she was an orphan for more than 19 years (apparently dropped by a uncaring mother onto the rain, if the drawings on her cell are anything to go by), and was being captive all those years on an obviously toxic, not at all nice type of orphanage. What is my point with all this, may you wonder? Well, people was angry at her because they expected her to 'behave more kindly' to the guy that adopted her, and, you know what? I knew people who where orphans irl, and they don't always show undying love for their tutors since the very beggining, specially not when they grow up on problematic situations or spent most of their childhoods on the orphanage. Keep in mind: Loona was not only almost a grown ass adult when she was adopted, but also was grown in a toxic enviroment and she only knew Blitz for a year or two (Age of adoption: 19; Age in the show: It was confirmed to be 22). Frankly, how Twitter expected her to 'be nice' when the literal trigger for this fight was him saying quite literally that he didn't like her attitude and 'I may as well replace you'?? Also, there's something very wrong with the idea that if you adopt someone, he/she/or them are obligued by contract to always look at you like a saviour of some kind...

@@SkullQueen33 Actually she was 17 when Blitzø adopted her but I agree. She doesn’t have to do anything, she went through a lot of shit and she has a right to be angry about it. But Blitzø in particular is not equipped to handle that. He has a lot of his own issues he has yet to resolve let alone an entirely different person with different struggles that are completely foreign to him.

@@SkullQueen33If I remember correctly, I thought there was a scene of her helping Octavia with Stolas, then ignoring what she said and kicking Blitz. If I’m wrong, then sorry.

Given how he left his other two kids alone and brought Tenzin with him everywhere he went, it's obvious that the responsibility there had to go somewhere, and is reasonable to assume that said responsibility would go to Katara. It's understandable that it would be a bad situation with how he's literally the last surviving member of an extinct race, but it's not really something you can call a "reach". Plus, in the series, he never really took "no" for an answer, not from her, not from anyone - which works to his credit for the most part during the show, but ends up leading him to be a pretty awful father & husband.

@thilsiktonix That's not entirely correct either. We know he spent more time with Tenzin, but I believe the only somewhat clear confirmation of that is Kaya saying that Tenzin went on trips with their dad sometimes. Presumably to teach him airbending and air nomad culture. Nothing indicates how frequently he was gone. Nothing indicates that he wasn't involved with his other kids at all. The *only* thing we know for sure is that he comparatively spent more time with Tenzin. Which makes sense, because Tenzin needed to learn air bending, was the only kid who needed to learn air bending, and Aang was the only person who could teach him.

Op probably was a zutara shipper and the tie in comics are badly written for me to consider them canon

Whether or not Katara was a homebody, I think it’s fair to say that her romantic relationship with Aang heavily neutralized her more aggressive qualities. I’ll give benefit of the doubt in Katara only specializing in healing due to old age, but there’s still very little mention of any other accomplishments that she hypothetically made as an adult waterbending master. So while nothing explicitly states Katara was a homebody, there’s no evidence to disprove it either.

@@jessical4866 Okay, but if there is zero evidence to a claim, you can't then make that claim. Because you have ZERO evidence either way. OOP made the claim that Katara became a homebody based on nothing. They were wrong, there is no evidence. By the logic of "there is no evidence to disprove it" I can claim I have an invisible unicorn and because you don't have any evidence to disprove it I have one. You can't disprove it after all.

Real. A while back, a small group of people went crazy about how Warhammer 40,000 was racist because they thought the giant hyper-adaptive space bugs were an allegory for...Jewish people?

​@@josephdavis4682 There's a few cases where it's valid (like goblins are literally an anti-semetic caricature), but 9 out of 10 times when you see something like this it really seems like the "anti-anti-semitists" are the anti-semitists 💀

I met a person who thinks of Naruto as a deadbeat dad 😭 Seriously, he had a lot of responsibilities. He couldn't have just abandoned the job he wanted his entire life and he even still spends time with his family.

​@@Imserious184 borruto is a brat

I don't think Aang _was_ a deadbeat dad though. Yes, he had favouritism towards Tenzin, and I'm not saying favouritism is OK, but like... it's understandable. He had an entire culture to pass down. Yes, Katara ended up living at home... because she was very old!

I remember watching redwall mattimeo and was finally happy that Matthias wasn't a dead beat dad

Or making the parents of a main character worse than they are. Sure, Tim Drake's parents weren't perfect, they just sent him off to boarding school, classical rich kid sheltered life, but nothing suggested that they were verbally or physically abusive. Same with Willis Todd, Jason's dad. Him being abusive was a classist retcon in order to villify poor people

Exactly. This is why fandoms just aren't fun anymore.

Social media ruined it.

MDZS fandom frfr

The biggest example for me is Qinter in the Wings of Fire fandom. In canon, they're two intelligent, complex characters who joke around and have a fun dynamic. In fanon, they're either the subject of 2,000 page analyses that you "have to" read, or they're portrayed as a pervert and a victim.

So... the Genshin fandom, basically

tbh i don't give a flying hoot what Jk rowling says (she's obviously not the brightest tool in the shed) snape wasn't good and harry son should've been Remus Arthur or something like that

In a similar vein, I don't get how anyone would fawn over Draco Malfoy at all. Especially when they romantically pair him with either Harry or Hermione. The little sh*t is the fantasy equivalent of that one kid who wore confederate flag t-shirts and drew certain WWII symbols on the Jewish kid's notebook

​@@pallydan893 yeah draco is literally a blood racist and called Hermione the wizard version of a slur, i don't even believe he got development i just think him and harry just kinda avoid each other

... No, he didn't "want to get with" Lily. The point was that he LOVED Lily. He showed that in some terrible ways but he LOVED her, truly, as a friend as well as romantically.

​@@pallydan893I mean I never shipped it in canon but I used to read Drarry fanfiction because it just makes for the perfect enemies to lovers setup. And the last two books did make me feel sorry for Draco even though he was awful for the majority of the series, and in the end it seemed like he turned out to be a somewhat decent person. I still think Rowling should've written a proper redemption arc for him instead of "Slytherin = evil, except for Snape because he fell in love once" and having none of the Slytherins stand up against Voldy at all. A lot of fanfiction gives the Slytherins in general way more depth and nuance which I always appreciated. But yeah a lot of people tend to forget just how nasty both Draco and Snape were in most of the books and imo Rowling definitely overdid it with the cartoonishly mean bullying

Tonks is generally underrated

Facts and logic typically don't matter to shippers.

Or people who ship their head canon version of James with Sirius . . . gang, the events of the book can’t even fucking happen without James and Lily having Harry

the jegulus ship makes NO sense to me bc james loved lily with every fibre of his being

i think thats because they subconsiously see tonks is toxic (to a piont) like..she forced remus to marry/love her and even when 'in love' hes clearly uncomfortable and dislikes her verbally.

The fandom treating characters like percy and leo like they’re toddlers who can’t do anything without their girlboss™️ gfs feels so icky to me and also the fact that they boil down will and nico’s characters to their sexuality like man

Canon Will: Nico we just killed a person what am I supposed to do with this? My dad had to rely on me for emotional support and only now treats me like a son, I can’t figure out what to think about that. Sure, I’ll go to Tartarus with you, mostly so you don’t die, but you better know what you’re doing. Fandom Will: I’m Nico’s gay doctor and also a flashlight :)

YES! And the infantilization of Nico. When you reread the books you see he's really a bit of an asshole, even if he's gone through some stuff.. But no, he's a "traumatized cinnamon roll," lmao

THIS THIS THIS.

@@ranting2daMAX I don't think Nico was ever really emo, he's just portrayed as overly edgy in fanworks. Besides, "emo" is more a music genre than a specific style. Also, Bianca is his *older* sister.

It iritates me so badly when people can never see both characters’ side of a conflict, even when they both have perfectly valid arguments. The fact that they both have a solid point is what makes the story good, but people always have to choose sides 😔

This. I’m an MHA fan and a Bakudeku shipper. You described it perfectly.

I feel like you could apply this to just about any fandom lol (for me right now it's Good Omens)

This is why I love the Class of 09 fandom. Everyone is aware that pretty much every character is evil

​@@andreaseverin1346class 09 from what i seen is breaking bad but yuri because i have only seen shipping art of the two titular girls

....except maybe Papyrus

Except monster kid they did nothing wrong

@@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel They’re just a silly little kid that doesn’t really understand the adult-y stuff lol

As much as I like Undertale and I don't want to sound like I'm trying to disrespect Toby fox, I _strongly_ disagree. Papyrus, nearly all of the non-fighting characters, Alphys, and arguably Toriel are all unwaveringly good people. Making a mistake does not equate to doing something bad and accidents aren't moral failures, so outside of lying about the true lab, none of those characters are even remotely outside of the good area at any point in the story. Things get a bit complicated when discussing Asgore and Undyne (and especially Flowey), but they are blatant exceptions to that. And in that case, nuance is literally never shot down by the fandom unless you imply that you actually *dislike* the characters, which is a separate thing. I have no doubt that Chara has helped Asriel get medicine or something, or that Papyrus might've slapped Sans at some point, but that isn't something we see or hear about in the game because it's irrelevant information that isn't supposed to matter to the story or our perception of it. Acting like Chara isn't a bad person because they made a shirt for Asgore is a refusal to acknowledge nuance, and so is acting like Toriel _is_ a bad person because she left the kingdom.

@@smileyhappyface5864 Toriel and Alphys are very much morally grey. It is important to note that morally greyness does not make a character a bad person, and in fact most morally grey characters are good people, just in general. - Toriel did abandon her duties as Queen and ultimately attempted to imprison Frisk, and allowed a total of seven children walk to what she believed would be their death when she could have accompanied them to confront Asgore. She's also shown to not really be a great parent: Between Undertale and Deltarune, her track record is at least three out of four(and that's only since we haven't seen DR!Asriel at all) children with crippling mental health issues which Toriel seems to be completely oblivious to. In particular, Chara is known to have been suicidal and Kris' SOUL-removal stunts are clearly framed as an analogy for self-harm. She's shown expressing concern about Kris' recent well-being, but she doesn't really investigate much, she doesn't try to speak to Kris about it, instead stopping when Alphys told her "they're normal". - Alphys, as you point out, actively and dishonestly hid her mistakes. She also lied her way into her job, and engaged in some big-time medical malpractice by injecting people with significant amounts of a substance she had literally just discovered without further study. That part wasn't an accident, and the fact that she couldn't have predicted the results is part of the problem. - "Nearly all of the non-fighting characters" Mf, nearly all the non-fighting characters are, at minimum, not actively opposed to Asgore wiping out humanity(Which is omnicide.), and some, like Catty and Bratty, are disturbingly enthusiastic about the idea. - Even Papyrus, the morally whitest character in the game, still has his issues. In context, the whole "dating a child" thing isn't as bad as it sounds, but he still did attempt to imprison an innocent child so that they could be sent off to die. - There's... literally no indication Chara was a bad person, at least in life. The worst things we hear about them are Asriel, who previously had a very warped perception of them that was incredibly unhealthy for both of them, admitting that they weren't as infallible as he believed them to be, and that they were willing to kill their attackers(which may have included their implied abusers), in order to protect Asriel.(Notably, we know from Asriel that they had absolutely no desire to harm any of the humans until after their shared body was attacked, otherwise Asriel would have detected it and taken back control sooner.)

what fandom? i'm guessing maybe demon slayer

YES. I use fiction to escape the patriarchy not partake in it

@@purrowell Funnily enough, we don't live in a patriarchy. We live, in most places, in a democratic oligarchy that happens to have male leaders. An actual patriarchy would be something like ancient rome, where the *fathers* would have special legal and judicial powers. Compare that to the U.S, where fathers can barely get custody of their children, it's not a patriarchy.

​@@johngellare3507Again, the male leaders don't just happen to leaders. It's a product of patriarchy. Patriarchy doesn't simply mean no women rights, it's more nuanced than that. Otherwise usa would have women leaders but they don't. Why do you think that is?

@@johngellare3507awww you delululand seems to be a very cute place to live in 💀

I agree, but we also have to acknowledge the fact that not _all_ asexual people are sex repulsed, and thus _can_ have sex, and we also need to acknowledge the fact that aro people _can_ have relationships. Because asexuality and aromanticsm _IS A SPECTRUM, FIRST AND FOREMOST,_ and I feel like hardly _anyone,_ even self-proclaimed and out ace/aro/aroace people, acknowledges that!!!!

I completely agree. I have a particular fandom in mind and it might not be what you were thinking of , but Hazbin Hotel has an aro/ace character that is quite literally shipped with EVERYONE in the main cast. The fandom does everything to justify it but are essentially erasing aro/ace representation. It's made worse with the fact that the character is explicitly stated to be aro/ace. Why cant people just leave certain characters alone? I'm not aro/ace but I would hate for representation to be constantly erased and then justified

@hannahmetzger4880 this is very true, but it can also be used to erase aro and ace people who are sex repulsed or do not want a relationship beyond platonic. We need a balance of both in our representation. Again, I am fully agreeing with you, just saying that we need representation for both ends of the aroace spectrum.

@eclipsemoon01 yeah... it's almost just funny seeing him be put in situations he would canonically avoid like the plague, but it's insane how common it is

@@hannahmetzger4880 As a sex-positive ace person myself, I absolutely agree with this. The problem is that it's so easy to run into the same issue as claiming that a character is bi, but only ever showing them being attracted to the opposite gender - it feels like just paying lip service without actually committing to the representation.

These are probably the same people who simp over Nagito Komaeda

I like Feligami and Felix (because he's smart, not because he's a good person) but I feel like since Season 5, everyone's just forgotten that he kind of sucks?? Especially since he was literally stalking Kagami and making assumptions about her before actually knowing her.

I think part of the issue is that Felix was a character in the fandom long before he was introduced in the show. For a long time (because ML competes with SU for first place in hiatus hell), Felix was just an abandoned concept character that the fandom was free to use as they wished, creating a collective fanon-version, especially after episodes like Syren when some fans wanted an alternative to Adrien. And though canon-Felix is completely different to fanon-Felix, some of that attachment would have still been there. Plus there's the fact that he's a white dude, which makes fans more willing to excuse and make excuses. Just as they did for Draco and Kylo Ren.

felix also murdered all of paris

​@@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel based felix

Literally makes me so annoyed

"Sometimes"? Make it "most of the time". Majority of fanfics are ooc BS.

​@@thichinhphan4010... which is completely fine lmao. The author can write/rewrite/completely change to original character however they want

It's one thing to write your own fanfiction, it's another to disrespect the source material.

I write fanfics and often play around with characterization too (i.e: making a character a cannibal when writing a dark content fanfic). There's nothing wrong with changing up the character a bit! It honestly feels refreshing to write a character in a role they don't usually play, such as making the kind character a serial killer in a murder mystery, etc. It's all fiction! All fun and games!!! But I feel like most of these complaints rise up when people force it OUTSIDE fanfiction and fanart. For example, let's use Kaveh and Alhaitham from Genshin Impact. It isn't explicitly stated that they're queer (I'd like to preface I'm aroace and have nothing against my fellow comrades), but there are fans who would hate you and send death threats if you ship Alhaitham with Nilou or Dehya, claiming that he's strictly homosexual since he's secretly rooming with Kaveh and would attack fanartists/fanfic writers who go against it (which, doesn't really make much sense considering the culture Sumeru us based on. My arab mutual says arabs are generally very hospitable and allowing others to stay in their homes for a while. Plus, these sort of people forcing the agenda act like bisexuality is not a thing lmao ouch 😭😭😭-) Hence, I don't think most these anger stems from fan fiction (w-we all love fanfics right?-). It's when people take these headcanons and claim it as a fact. Imho, that's the only reason why half of these are people angry at characters being ooc. Just cause I write Character A as a yandere for fun doesn't mean I should go around claiming he's one everywhere I go. That's all ^^ have a nice day!

I choose to believe that Papyrus has no idea what a date actually is, and Alphys is just humoring you. I think that's what's implied anyway.

​@@rosykindbunny1313 Yeah, it always sounds more like 'Okay, kid. Sure. I can play along with that. Want a tea party?', than 'I'll just take this seriously despite not having any incentive to, pure or not'.

yeah, and also how their design kind of resembles a racist Asian stereotype what with the eyes and skin tone. I wholeheartedly believe it was completely unintentional but it still feels weird that no one talks about it.

@@odditycat2716 she's literally a lizard T_T

@@odditycat2716 It's sometimes talked about, but during the heyday, it was mostly played for half-heartedly stereotypical jokes, so it's at least a bit better that it's not being talked about in the same manner. I'd say we could definitely be doing better, though.

Bluey fandom is what comes to my mind

I feel like this about Encanto fandom. Like ok, Abuela made more than slight mistakes, but not nearly as bad as some fans claim she did. It is combined by claiming every single character has "severe trauma and anxiety" while there is nothing indicating that for most of them. Especially Camillo and Antonio. While, at the same time, completely ignoring the trauma Abuela had, from losing her home and seeing her husband killed in front of her, which in my opinion is a valid reason for making mistake of wanting your children to be overpowered. I feel like people just project their own trauma and the behaviour of their own parents on Abuela.

The Owl House with Camilla. And that show had *actual* abusive parents in it. And yeah, it is pretty much always the mothers who get hate. That should make us think.

​@@rainpooper7088 luz would have been happier if she just went to summer camp.

​@@juliawidmaier5334 bad parents? no. Bad neighbors? Absolutely.

Yeah, I don’t understand why so many people think Jason is/should be Percy’s best friend. They could barely tolerate each other, and Jason was a much less interesting character than Grover. My best guess is that these fans just want all the pretty human-looking characters to hang out, and Grover can’t sit with them because he has “ugly” goat legs and horns.

Wasn’t the empathy link between them broken in HoO? Like, wasn’t that why Grover couldn’t immediately locate Percy when he went missing?

​@tsifirakiehl4250 They only didn't get along in one book and for only part of that book. By the time they reunite they're calling each other "my bro" and Percy keeps it up in his mythology books.

​@@emerald9194Suppressed by Hera, if memory serves

Such a shame, really. Grover was my favorite character even back in the 6th grade when I first read The Lightning Thief.

This is 100% pretty privilege. I've been a Zelda fan forever, and I never once saw anyone claim Ganondorf as "misunderstood" or a "tragic hero" until Tears of the Kingdom, exactly. Nintendo gave us a hot Dorf, and now thirsty people want to justify their attraction.

I like WW ganondorf the best, because of the lengths he goes with his more nuanced goals. I like evil antagonists with nuance, that aren't necessarily redeemable or antiheroes.

Exactly!

@@Celestia282people have like been like that over WW’s final monologue before we even knew what Totk Ganondorf would look like

Much like Kingdom Hearts,the story would be better if it never existed at all,& if we ignored the lore.

Yeah, I'm a part of the fandom (more specifically the theorist side) and it's honestly just a mess. Mainly because the actual story is a mess, never confirming things and giving only vague interpretations on what's going on. Because seriously, what thd hell were those endings for Help Wanted 2!? And why is there Dream Theory 2: Electric Boogaloo implied with the "oh, these games were in-universe video games" in the 1st Help Wanted and the Tales books!?!? The creators expect fans to get into the mystery, without giving all of the pieces for them to find and put together.

I was never that much into FNaF but when they made the movie I feel they lost a big opportunity to create some kind of tied up lore that wasnt just a bunch of headcanon theories. Even if this canon was some kind of "movieverse" thing (like marvel got different canonical facts for comics and movies) and didnt affect the games at all, it would give the fans and the movie-only enjoyers a more consistent lore to embrace

I used to like a different series that’s been running for over 14 years, and it makes way more sense than FNAF. NGL, it’s almost a bit sad.

thank you for saying this-Everyone seemed to immediately jump on the “Abby and Mike Schmidt” are Afton’s” thing before the movie even came out. Hell, even after the movie was released, a ton of people are trying to find some explanation for them to be Afton’s and it’s a little annoying 🥲

The opposite hapened with the ending of the Mirror Visitor series; the ending is not happy for all characters and is open for to the reader's interpretation. People hated it because they wanted a perfect explicite happy ending for all the characters.

Yeah, I feel like happy endings are really nice, esp after a dark story. I really like endings that are bittersweet where the characters are happy, but didn’t forget about what they went through. I think these endings are happy enough to keep you content and angsty enough to satisfy. I also enjoy open-ended endings where we don’t see all the details bc theories are fun lol. Tho a good and happy ending is almost never a bad idea!

I personally like happy endings where the villain wins

I'm not sure Mordor and Isengard work on a capitalist economic system. But sure, the other ones I get.

Ever wonder why we're here?Besides to just stand around talking,in the middle of a box canyon...

This reminds me when i read a fanfiction about a random stormtrooper whose dream was to pilot a tie fighter. She wasnt involved in any canon big conflict and was like "fuck it we ball" everyday but in the end everything exploded lol

Not that I like praising the sequels, but that is the whole point of Finn.

​@@BrunoMaricFromZagrebred vs blue reference 🥹

I haven't got anything to base this off of, but the perspective of "it's okay that they did bad things, they're traumatised/mentally ill" has gotta hurt the perception of people who have mental illness FAR more than it helps

@@osheridan yeah Like some people will genuinely justify a characters actions entirely based off of trauma, yet there are other characters in the story with their own trauma who choose to be better

Sometimes it feels like “Misery” was a prophetic text

Now I'm curious, what fandom is this?

@@Florceleste28 Sun and Moon Show.

The fact i thought this was abt bungo stray dogs cuz the fandom literally characterizes very bad people as quirky and gremlins

​@@regionalvariantmakeri know someone in the bungo stray dogs fandom, she is literally INSANE over dazai

Wasn't another joke Peter Lukas doing the Kayaking trip with him? I think I remember something like that and it was hilarious. XD

I still don't know where that came from even though I just finished s4. I did skip s3 QnA though so... also good to see TMA fans in random places :D

@@thetariawait are you telling me Tim has nothing to do with kayaks in canon? I'm only at the beginning of season 3 but i've heard of the kayak thing and i just assumed it was based on a canon thing...

@@lilalinoIf I remember correctly he did go kayaking once when he was on vacation. Not entirely sure and can’t point to an episode off the top of my head so this could be a mandela effect haha

@@lilalinome too but well... things go wild in the bad way...

Ooh, as someone who loved Future that's a really interesting point! The SU fandom was, as a whole, very, VERY bogged down by fanon, and honestly I blame the long hiatuses and inconsistent release schedule. By the time Lapis Lazuli became a series regular she was already an entirely different character in everyone's heads than she was in canon.

I think Future couldve gone about their plot in a better way had they been given more seasons.

@@perrisavallon5170People like to blame Rebecca Sugar and her team for the esporadic releases, but it was mostly Cartoon Network's fault. There were moments where they had various episodes finished, but they had to wait until CN decided the "best time of release". They also forced the bomb format (a special of five episodes in five days), forcing the team to cram the story in five episodes and fill the rest with fillers (though i think this isn't an excuse to uninteresting stories)

I don't know, Steven just suddendly being a HUMONGOUS dick to everyone, not giving a second chance to Eyeball and Aquamarine, almost killing his dead, ACTUALLY killing Jasper (then they revive her which makes the WHOLE point of shattering being a big thing pointless), and it being passed off as "oh it's trauma" even with ZERO hints of it being the case, then the WHOLE trauma being INSTANTLY RESOLVED WITH A HUG, I think it's fair to say Future is a big clusterfuck that doesn't even compare to its predecessor. I kinda like aggresive bitch Steven though, even if he's out of character for what Steven is supposed to be like.

I never really interacted with the fandom before after the entire show including Future had aired and MAN am I glad because what in the holy hell happened. Like sure, parts were rushed, there were elements that could've been executed better but as someone who watched it all isolated, I found very few thematic inconsistencies and none that really mattered. It was a about family, trauma, and finding healthy ways to deal with your issues through connection and communication. Not once does the show stray from this. And Future is IMO the perfect epilogue for a series all about picking up the pieces after the big dramatic finish, be that the gem war or the s5 finale. Of course Steven has a Messiah complex, of course he can't rest when there's peace because that was never an option since as early as he can remember, of course he's not going to be completely a-okay after learning that the tyrant whose mistakes they've been fixing since before he was born is actually his mom and he could have inherited her terrible traits. Of course he's scared of everything falling apart around him. The entire show is Steven trying to undo the mistakes of the past he played no part in and being hunted relentlessly for things he doesn't even really understand. He's 13-14 years old. His most formative years were riddled with life or death scenarios and the threat of intergalactic war which hinged entirely on him btw, the only extremely mortal person in this. If Future isn't the logical result of all this then I have no idea what else could've happened to Steven. Child chosen ones are by design going to be traumatised adults unless there's a really good reason that the fate of the world/universe hinging on them while they're in constant mortal danger doesn't affect them and Future shows us that Steven is not unaffected. It points at the child chosen one trope and says "it doesn't always have to be you" and lets Steven get some damn closure about all the things he was never allowed to process because he had to be the one with the answers, the one to stand in front all the time. The gems tried their best to shield him but ultimately they were all in terrible positions to actually do much. Steven would always be the target and the Diamonds were going to aim for him no matter who was standing in the way. Future was going to be the result of that no matter if we'd seen it or not

That’s Most Fandoms I’m In Help 😭 Even Ones With Canonically Queer Characters,And They Get Mad At People Headcanoning Young Kids As Queer Even Though I Was Lesbian When I Was 7-8

@@Anna-hy4sb I understand! I’m queer myself (bi, ace) and I was always headcanoning characters as queer and ace too, especially when I got into MHA. Most of the fandom also headcanons the cast as mostly queer, but some of them are really toxic about it. Thankfully, I never had any social media or shared any of my headcanons on platforms, so most of the hate I saw was other people fighting.

I always get so baffled whenever I see people being like “waahh, boohoo! this fandom is the worst because they made these characters GAY and they AREN’T >:(“ As if the whole point of fandom isn’t to just have fun and interact with others who have the same interests. I always say that canon is like a lump of clay, and each person on the fandom is their own individual sculptor. They can mold and shape that clay however they want.

In the case of BNHA, I’ve seen a lot of posts along the lines of “what statement will piss off a lot of people in a fandom?” and without fail, one or more of the replies are “Deku isn’t gay.” Yeah, we know that canonically, he is not gay. But that doesn’t mean we can’t have fun and say that he’s gay in fanfiction, fanart, and headcanons.

@@JunebuuuuuggggABSOLUTELY!! That’s the perfect way to describe fandom. I agree completely.

Definitely agree. So sick of fandom deciding that ADHD is Excited-Distracted Disorder. I have ADHD and I personally love ADHD headcanons for characters who aren't the stereotypical "omg squirrel!!!!" character type and instead lean into other ways ADHD presents itself.

i honestly agree from the other side of this pov. it seems like a lot of extroverted, loud, over the top characters get adhd headcanons even if there's nothing really pointing to it, but not someone who doesn't fit the stereotypes even if they have a lot of traits that real people with it do. as someone who went under the radar for years, that mindset pisses me off. i also think there's the fact that adhd, or any neurodivergence, tends to get ignored if the character belongs to other marginalized groups. like, in the six of crows fandom, people will talk about the representation in the series and mention that kaz and wylan are disabled, and that jesper is black and bisexual, but not the fact that jesper is really clearly coded as having adhd. like, it's not subtle at all, i think leigh bardugo has said she did it on purpose, and honestly? he's some of the better adhd rep i've ever seen, but somehow it just gets brushed over?

Dude, a character will be hyper or something and that makes them have adhd apparently and its so annoying like ???

@ellianar4151 I also have ADHD, and some of my favorite characters that I headcanon as ADHD are the characters from “Noises Off,” none of whom fit the “lOoK aT mE i’M sO hYpEr” stereotype. They’re characters in a farce, so their traits are exaggerated for the sake of comedy, but they feel like real neurodivergent people: Brooke has issues with auditory processing, Garry talks faster than he thinks and often forgets the words for things, Dotty struggles to keep track of which props she’s supposed to be carrying when, Freddie overthinks everything and worries that he’s stupid, and so on. They may not have deliberately been written as neurodivergent, but I honestly find them better representation than some canonically neurodivergent characters.

@@tsifirakiehl4250 I feel that, with the unintentional representation being better than actual representation! I'm always wary of canonically ADHD characters since people will often default to a very generic portrayal of the disorder, whereas headcanons made by actual ADHD people will be more varied and represent genuine personal experiences. Same goes for autism in my experience as well. Also love the mention of auditory issues, since it feels like barely no one talks about it! One of my favorite characters I headcanon as ADHD for having a lot of anger and struggling with rejection sensitivity. Another character that I have an ADHD headcanon for struggles with time blindness and is often late to things. None of them are a quirky, hyperactive "omg shiny!!!! wait umm what was I saying??" type of character. Not that those people don't exist, but it feels so overdone.

I feel like Chara going "when were you ever in control?" in the end of a genocide route contributed alot to that part

You're probably right

See for me, there's two sides to the Chara argument. While it's true the game is very obviously addressing *you*, the player, it changes a bit when you consider Frisk is also a character themselves. So I can see arguments there, but mostly you're right imo.

I'm sorta new to the UT fandom but from what I've seen people are acknowledging chara wasn't actually the villian & that papyrus is an adult. I don't know how much of the fandom actually acknowledge this. It could be that I'm in a specific corner of the fandom plus I've been into more of the aus lately so idk if the fandom is growing out of that

@@LazyRosey-os7jy I know but I'm talking about the old UT fandom I should have clarified that though

I haven't watched the show.It doesn't air on my TV,& not sure where to watch it online & don't have the time do download pirated versions,but I'm aware of the plot point & have NO IDEA what the fandom has done with it.

Explain?

@@Sireington without knowing anything about bluey, white folks have this thing where they try to destroy indigenous cultures using a wide range of tactics like literally stealing kids and adopting them away so they are raised away from their culture, or forced schools that twist history, and does not teach people about their past. it is really tragic and there is most likely a reason you do not know about it.

@@SireingtonI'm pretty sure OP is talking about a character from Bluey who's really struggling with infertility, the fact leading her to isolate herself from the rest of her family (her sister is the mother of Bluey, and Bluey's sister looks really simmilar to the character in question). Many people are like "why doesn't she just adopt" failing to see the implications of her feeling as if the child will never truly be hers or in general her feeling too destroyed by her infertility to even consider it an option. That's what I think at least, and it's only based on my knowledge from a video on it. The video is by Pugly here on youtube, I really reccomend it

@@thetariaAnd also, the aforementioned societal roadblocks, too, because Australia basically wouldn’t allow anyone who wasn’t a white nuclear family to have familial cohesion until the 70s-80s.

I am of the belief that vocaloid canon ages are extremely stupid unless the voice provider is underage. they're VOICES. you should be able to project whatever you want onto them. it's fine if you find miku hot or ship her with Luka or Kaito or whatever. she's a voice and a drawing. she doesn't even have a personality

So real,, the amount of vocaloid fans policing others over the vocaloids' "ages" and shit is so tiring

To add to this. No, Rin and Len are not siblings. Their relationship can be whatever the song needs it to be.

I once saw someone ship Len x Kaito, Miku x Kaito, Len x Rin and Miku x Luka were all "pro-ships"...@@odditycat2716

This! The only way that it should be considered a problem is if the voice providers for the Vocaloids were children at the time of recording, such as Kaai Yuki, voiced by like a 7-year old, hasn’t had an update to her voicebank since due to the provider aging! (Also this isn’t a hypothetical either btw.. there’s ACTUALLY a gross song out there that uses Kaai Yuki for this sort of stuff… ew)

are you talking about nagito komaeda by any chance?

@@blueheart-mb8ujno I’m talking about John from Milgram but yeah Nagito can definitely fit this description as well

@@LanieMae I've NEVER heard of EITHER of these 2 shows...

@@BrunoMaricFromZagreb Nagito Komaeda is a character from the second danganronpa game (the game series is about some 16 teenagers being trapped in a place and forced to kill eachother to escape, it's fucked up at times and not in the good way, more in the sexualising teenagers way so personally wouldnt reccomend but the concept had potential imo) and Milgram is a primarily youtube series where 10 people, ages ranging from 12 - 39 are placed in a prison for commiting murder, and the audience can go on a website to vote whether they should be forgiven or not forgiven for their crimes based of music videos that show their point of view of their murder. Unfortunately it is true that John gets bastardised lots, and from what ive seen the fandom is pretty weird about selfcest shipping him with Mikoto which will never sit anywhere near right with me

@@ur4niumsnail I mean it’s really not selfcest since they’re different minds and from what I’ve heard dating within systems isn’t uncommon. And this is pushing to the side how John said “snuggle together and say good night” when referring to mikoto that one time, but the fandom basically uses the ship to flanderise them and it’s ugh

wait which moment??

@@areeba7045i think they meant the one mentioned in the video about Katara being jealous, though I haven’t read the comics so I don’t know much about it beyond how it was described in the video

@@EF-kk3vh ah i see, thanks for the explanation

do u know what comis its in??

@@redrose5904 no I’m not sure

i also have severe social anxiety and i stutter alot- but yeah just because someone has social anxiety doesnt mean they stutter in their every sentence-

@@aikoaikoaikoaikoaikoaiko yeah, plus everyone is different, I know someone who doesn’t have social anxiety and still stutters, some people stutter, and some people don’t. I guess everyone just collectively thinks people with social anxiety stutter ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

and i have a stutter but im very outgoing. in general i dislike when people mischaracterize stutters and overuse them to be cute

@@pressedrose1 yess and when people make like a flinch to scared like bro i flinch at loud noises and when i’m in a zone it doesn’t mean im terrified of my door opening

No because I'm not even a fan and I found it weird how they thought a kid who probably has problems, is violent, and eastern Asian as racist? Like, the bat kids are adopted from crappy lives, ofc they'd have a few emotional issues.

@@X0.LA_BRAVA.X0 *middle eastern. And to be fair, most of the racism discourse I've seen is because of how that side of his family is portrayed, and the fact that they intentionally raised him to have violent tendencies. Even as a Robin, Damian was uniquely bloodthirsty as a child because he was raised to kill.

​@@yoyohan9Also, most of that aggression has nothing to do with their race.It's It has a lot more to do with the fact that ras al goul Is a millennia old Nutcase who regularly takes baths in evil mountain dew

@@yoyohan9 In a stereotypical sense tho? Maybe they just wanted a robin with a troubled homelife that just so happened to be middle eastern. I can understand why they might think it's a stereotype, but it seems stereotypical to assume a family of color is aggressive because of their race. Like only white people couldve been a good fit for abusive parents

​@@yoyohan9Yeah. And his family isn't even the typical "violent middle eastern" stereotype either. They're effectively ecoterrorists who predate any modern belief system.

they want her to be a love interest and nothing else :(

@@Cinnamonraisin_Bagel it's so sad 😭 she's such a complex and amazing character

Same in later movies....

I don't really do HP fanfics. But based on the books? Hermione is basically a pain in the ass but somehow lovable. Cliff Claven from "Cheers" in the banging little body of a pretty Mickette.

and then they make Ron unsupportive?? HELLO?? He's actually an awesome friend for Harry AND Hermione! I just think his canon character might have anger issues. And that one scene in the Deathly Hallows wasn't even his fault... THE HORCRUX WAS INFLUENCING DARK THINGS ON HIM.

That's why I don't understand fans who make Mori to be this horrible horrible guy, and the chosen ignorance toward a backstory not completely fleshed out in canon. He's not worse or better than most other characters

No to be fair I do understand that. You know, with the whole pedo thing. That being said, I do think people should be able to like him while acknowledging his flaws. I can’t stand when tiktok tries to woobify him, they’re even claiming he’s not actually a pedo. The writing could not be more on the wall about that.

@@SqualorOpera I'd say the "comedic lolicon" is still a trope in Japan, although the actual thing isn't at all a joke. But like with the Tanizaki siblings I think yes, you can still like the characters and admit their flaws. I suppose I'm just touchy because a vast majority of fans coddle characters like Dazai and Fyodor, who have done atrocities that should be taken into account.. Like you say, "woobify" and I agree. I think it's unfair to support one character's actions over another because it is "attractive" or something (Sorry if very long)

Honestly, when I think about Dazai and a few of his actions I think of "The ends justify the means." And yeah, the fandom does really woobify the characters like Dazai and Fyodor.

I hear you and I raise you: Aya

Also, it's supposed to be abusive, Jokes shouldn't get "fixed" because of love. He will not love you, he is LITERALLY as in a literal manner or sense, whiteout exaggeration the worst person ever.

But also related to this, Harley isn't a poor little thing who just needs out of the relationship to turn her life around. She chose to do some pretty horrific things quite gleefully in canon. I'm not vibing with this 'feminist icon' who laughs like one of her hyenas over a joke about murdering a baby.

Her old outfit also looked cooler and had more personality to it tbh

I don't understand you think it's bad for them to acknowledge he's a bisexual disaster?

​​@@Imserious184No, the original poster was suggesting that everyone sees Phoenix as gay (strictly attracted to men), when the fandom instead sees him as bi (not erasing his interest in women). This person is defending the fandom, they don't see it as a negative.

Yes!! You can absolutely ship Phoenix and Iris, since they did genuinely like each other, but saying that a relationship that’s actually explored for literally one case is overlooked is a given. (And of course, we all know Phoenix to be bi. just bc the fandom likes narumitsu doesn’t mean Phoenix x Iris can’t exist.)

(one of the lies actually being Phoenix believing he was dating completely another person; and another one being that Iris knew that this another person was going to murder Phoenix, but actually ignored it and never tried to protect him from being accused for the murder - which very well could mean a death penalty)

yeah like idk im a wrightworth shipper for sure but i could see phoenix having some chemistry w/ mia when she was alive...

From the PJO fandom: Grover

Grover?

@@LazyRosey-os7jy it so sad how we had the same though

@@user-tz3co6rz7o Yeah 😔

Shuichi Aizawa my beloved 😭

I’ve been in the creepypasta fandom since 2015 and it’s still one of my favourite things to see like, these are literal killers and cryptid monsters, but it’s so fun to make them found family as well I like both interpretations of the characters depending on what I’m reading or in the mood for, and I find the arguments between the different sides of the fandom to be really funny and some good quality entertainment

As someone who was really into it in middle school and has had a couple visits back from time to time, I think it's a really interesting fandom! You can go either super dark and heavy on the murder or you can just not and you'll have people there with you either way.

I haven't been in that fandom since 2015, but I remember this. It's an odd memory.

The duality of man- Psssst I totally agree. I’ve been here for a good handful of years now, and I love indulging in both the more realistic takes on the characters and the off the wall bonkers fanon versions of them. My only concrete rule is that the Jeff the Killer reboot is the only canon Jeffry Woods to me-

I'm not even in the creepypasta fandom and I love that there are "hot versions" of the characters to self-indulgently fantasize about even if the canon is usually just a badly written horror story about a guy who kills you while you're sleeping

THANK YOU! Shipping has just started being SO controlled. In my first main fandoms, no one really cared what you shipped(not like now anyway) unless it was illegal or abusive, but still then, it didn't seem to be as much as a big deal. But now in the two newer fandoms I've joined(H.H one of them) they get all killy over someone Shipping slightly off cannon, and it isn't even for good reasons half the time, like: NOOOO that person is dating canoniclly!(I don't care if this isn't a real word or spelt wrong) Or, even worse(not H.H) you can't ship that BI character with a BOY! THAT'S REMOVING LES'S. And with that logic you're doing same to BI PEOPLE! Sorry I got a little worked up, but I swear it's like everyone in fandoms now are all babies have haven't learn how shipping works. I just ship what I wanna ship.

this is so important omg

Damn, I should have included this in my comment.

Was she? Both Amy and Metal Sonic came on the scene in the same game, and Sonic 2 and CD were in development at the same time

@@grunkleg.3110Amy was technically created for a manga way before Sonic CD, actually. That same manga is also where Charmy Bee came from and he's probably the most disrespected reoccurring character in the series(he literally lost the Knuckles Chaotix popularity polls to the one-off robot characters with zero personality by a landslide), so I'm on board with respecting these characters.

@@rainpooper7088 Funnily enough, Sonic CD was actually confirmed to take place before Sonic 2, meaning that Sonic and Amy's relationship started before he befriended Tails

Meh...by that logic Vector the Crocodile is more important than Amy since hes from the OG concept art of Sonics band

sdv fans when obviously autistic man is obviously autistic

I barely ever hear anything nice about Demetrius and it makes me so sad. And people get so heated about that tomato/fruit thing but like…it felt like an honest mistake to me, and if you agree with him in that argument, the resolution for it is so sweet. He gets so unnecessarily demonized in the fandom spaces I’m in 😭

allistics when autistic character has flaws (they weren't a perfect little baby who just likes something a lot)

@@pxme.granate My only hang up with that cutscene is that I have to chose one or the other when fruit is a botany term and vegetable is a culinary one so are not mutually exclusive and so I should be allowed to say both are correct in their ways of thinking... but that is likely just me

REAL Demetrius is so misconstrued and over hated by basically everyone in the fandom :((

I hate that people seem to be incapable of seeing it as "he was flawed as a person, much in the way that people are." He wasn't a terrible father and a deadbeat and he wasn't a perfect person who never would have made those mistakes either. It's not a character assassination to have your character who's generally a great person be a less than ideal parent, particularly if the weight of an entire culture rests on said character's shoulders passing it down to a kid.

Star Wars being fairytale-like is precisely what makes it amazing to me. I still get butterflies at the “I love you” “I know” scene, or “I’m a Jedi like my father before me”

OH MY GODD i just got reminded of the fanon interpretations of 2012 michelangelo... like, 2012 tmnt wasn't my favourite but mikey isn't a sweet uwu crybaby .... and to add on, raph is so often characterized as an abusive brother to mikey especially, when mikey is the one instigating him a lot of the time. i love tmnt but the fandom......

I'm annoyed by this as well, and when it comes to Luigi, the Mario movie really didn't help in this regard by making him stay stuck in a cage throughout most of the movie until Mario saves him, that just made peoples perception of his capabilities even worse than it was.

I didn’t realise that this was the case with Luigi, lol. There are times in the Mario & Luigi series where he has to continue for a while alone to save his brother. Don’t get me started on the Luigi’s Mansion trilogy.

as soon as i saw ur pfp while reading the comments, i knew u were going to bring up Michelangelo.

​@@kanemorsillo5501You may like how Luigi was portrayed in the live action movie then. It predates the "Luigi is a coward" characterization from the games, so he's a reckless guy with a penchant for science fiction stories.

I don't even have fandom experiences like that, people have pulled that shit on me IRL. Like I'm somehow able to choose how I feel but other people have no choice but to act in a way where it's blatantly obvious I would get upset. If you act in a way that causes an emotional response, that is the consequence of your actions and you made that person feel that way. End of.

Yeah this isn't a fandom problem, this is a therapy problem 😭

And every one has the audacity to villainize Silena.

EXACTLY. Just because I think Luke had a point about the gods DOES NOT mean that any of his actions weren't wrong.

People wanna victimize Luke by saying Kronos did all the heavy lifting, but that's definitely not the case. Luke knew pretty well about what he was doing (the only thing I think he was genuinely unsure of was the fact that he was going to be used as Kronos' host if a Big Three kid couldn't be convinced) and stuck to his guns numerous times. Yes, Kronos was the ultimate mastermind behind the plot, but Luke isn't blameless, wasn’t possessed, and wasn’t brainwashed. Pretty much all his actions in TLO, TSOM, and TTC were his own, and shouldn't be ignored just because Luke was a Greek tragedy. He's a well written character BECAUSE of his flaws, and that falls apart if you try and ignore them.

Yeah it kinda pissed me off at the end when they’re like ‘you’re a hero Luke! You’ll go to elysium!’ Like, no. Living a life of hurting others is not erased by one good deed at the end(that deed being killing himself/and Kronos). Wow, you solved a problem that YOU were partially responsible for! Too bad you had to murder all those kids to get to that point, huh?

@@eaglefan2569 I actually think he might have known. Now, I've only read the series once, but I remember being absolutely horrified by the ending of Battle of the Labyrinth. I spent so much time asking myself, "Did he know? Did he know that was the plan?" Then I started skim-rereading Titan's Curse because I still had it out of the library, and somewhere there's a scene where the general (Atlas) makes some reference to Luke's part in the plan, and Luke visibly pales in response. So, I could very much be recalling that wrong, but I think Luke actually may have known.

I think it's implied that there is a kind of magic that make them unrecognizable and even if in the show Paris seem to be like a village it has many people and Marinette and Adrien have no ideas that the other is someone they know

Also the 'socially isolating children in groups to foster magic rasism' being a plot point in like, a very niche amount of fics at most

@@alicepersson9568 School Houses are a thing in the UK and the Hogwarts children are very far from "socially isolated". The Houses interact during classes and free time and have no bearing on your life after school, they're just "which dormitory you sleep in" and "gamifying being good".

I feel like we should acknowledge the house-elves were portrayed as brainwashed and Hermione as correct to want them freed.

@@chelonianmobile Hermione wasn’t portrayed as correct. The characters treated her as an annoyance and her organisation was literally named SPEW. Harry himself ends up being a slave owner. The signs that Rowling had some fucked up views were always there.

​@@101YoufailI don't think that the autor wanted to says that she was wrong to fight to end slavery but actually that the way she did was not improving things because people (including the elves) have been like brainwashed to accept slavery as a normal thing and that she need to understand society first to fight a good way to end the slavery

THISSSS

They have the same last name and look nearly identical, you're telling me they're not related?

​@@amazinggrapes3045Rin and Len doesn't have a canon relationship because it's up to fans and producers to mold them with their creativities. they're mirrors. they can be whatever you want but they'll never be canon

@@amazinggrapes3045 they are literally just gender bends of each other

As a rinlen shipper everyday is TORTURE

In a fandom with a similar character like John is not evil he’s just extremely frightened for Mikoto’s sake. Like why is it always with these types of characters

That's actually an interesting observation. I hadn't thought of that before but the evidence backs it up. With the exception of Frenchy & Marlene (who are both as f(y0v)ck3d up in the head as he is. Understandably in all three cases, but still) all his personal relationships, everything really human about him, stems from Jake Lockley. Moon Knight is the avatar & earthly champion of a horrifically bloodthirsty God, Marc Spector was never anything but a contract k!113r in a hit squad that operated with (dubious) legal sanction, and Steven Grant was never anything but a name, a tuxedo, & a good natured taking of the piss on one crime fiction writer from another crime fiction writer.

I'm not surprised that fandoms are ableist to systems in the slightest.

that kast one(i’m pretty sure) was the topic of a study and it turns out that people who were in abusive situations, take domestic abuse, often become highly abusive.

This did not go where I thought it would lol

@@BookWyrmOnAString Yeah, I just have only ever seen the "Kris is just the player's vessel" argument in relation to Kris's gender If you have seen it elsewhere, then this applies in that instance as well

IVE BEEN SAYING THIS FOR SO LONG AUGH Listen, I use any pronouns. I would be so stoked to see rep in that regard in something as big as a Toby Fox game. But that is absolutely not what’s happening. The entire point of Deltarune is that Kris is their own person with their own identity, completely separate from the player. They are, in no way, a projection of you. There is no exception when it comes to how you refer to them (take note of the game literally trashing the name you give them). To ignore this part of their characterization (or worse, only acknowledge it when it benefits you) just to avoid “they/them” is just transphobic at this point. When the game first came out and we weren’t sure where the character was going? Fine, I can accept early DR content gendering them. But surely we have been analyzing this game long enough to know what the goddamn main character’s pronouns are. But if a rant but it’s been bugging me a lot of as an nb person

Yeah honestly the enbyphobia (or even just the misgendering of the SIX** (major) canon nonbinary (or at least not boy or girl) characters we get) in the Deltarune and Undertale fandoms makes me want to scream. **The six characters being: Kris (they/them), Seam (they/them), Napstablook (they/them), Monster Kid (they/them), Frisk (they/them), and Chara (they/them, also uses it/its in genocide). Mad Mew Mew (then Mad Dummy) used to be on this list but she transitioned. Onion-San might be enby but no other characters talk about them. Every character on this list, with the exception of Frisk, is well known by the characters using those pronouns (except Jevil, who doesn’t refer to Seam by any pronouns for some reason) EDIT (4/7/24): Corrected Seam’s pronouns from no pronouns to they/them and re-added Monster Kid. Missingno_Miner gave me those corrections and also gave some minor characters who could be added to this list so please look at their comment below for that!

​@FrozenFennekin i reallly thought napstablook was a dude but i guess i was wrong 0_0

I feel like the reason why the fandom doesn’t like Alya is because she believes Lila’s lies (which is really stupid because she knows THE LADYBUG and still believes) but apart from that I don’t really see the hate for her because I actually like Alya

Finally someone said it

God that brings back some memories. The whole debate over if Darkstalker *really* counts as a villain is one of the main reasons I left that fandom

Yes, glad to see someone else thinks that

Exactly. I liked his character because he wasn’t a good person. I hate when the fandom tries to justify his actions or treats him like a cinnamon roll. No, he was an incredibly cunning and manipulative person who used magic to make his love interest more agreeable and instill false trust in her, used magic to brainwash several races, poisoned a whole race of people because of a few of their ancestor’s actions thousands of years ago, started a war because of his own racist ideals, manipulated a child who didn’t know any better, and brutally murdered his own father (who was also not a good person, but that doesn’t mean he deserved to die) on a public stage.

EXACTLY people don’t understand what a complex flawed character is, I remember all the defenders 😭😭😭

Naw I don’t like Lapis much because by her own admission, she “almost drowned a lot of people”. Like she had every right to not want to be around Peridot, who hurt her. But she hurt a lot of people herself, but is only ever portrayed as a victim. She gets better towards the end of the show though.

There's a winx club fandom? Let me innnn

​@@elalaela2694bestie get in here with us loll

Yes, Bloom became a Mary Sue, but look at what they did to my girl Stella 😭 She's not even my favorite but that was just disrespectful!

oh i used to be really into that show where can i find this community please help??? i want it??

@@ed-edd-n-eddiee It's mostly on Tumblr though you can find some RU-vid channels that make edits of the characters aswell as RU-vidrs who do redesigns of the characters and maybe on Tiktok too

(OMORI SPOILERS) "awwwh my babyyy 🫶" meanwhile they beat up their own best friend and stabbed his eye out to the point of hospitalization

LMAO been searching for this comment-

that or they demonize him to hell and back UGH i hate how fandom exaggerates things sometimes

@@Zitronen_please stop calling mentally ill people or characters “crazy.” as someone who has experienced psychotic symptoms like basil’s, it frustrates me how much the derogatory labels crazy/insane get weaponized against mentally ill people or associated with violence/dangerousness. that’s part of the reason i dislike psychosis representation in the media because almost all psychotic characters are depicted as violent, which only contributes to the dangerous=mentally ill narrative.

@2ysb654cg I'm also mentally ill. I'll just delete my comment though, sorry :[

Exactly, I don’t even know how someone could try to argue that Bakugo’s household isn’t abusive? Just because his mom’s not Endeavor doesn’t mean we can’t acknowledge her abuse?

I think people are going to crazy over a two minute scene

I think the only reason Mitsuki’s poor parenting isn’t addressed more is because she barely shows up. It’s definitely there though.

@@appelofdoom8211 Because people made up an entire tragic backstory for Bakugo. That scene was played out as a joke. People overanalyzing shit is why fandoms suck now. And I think even Horikoshi would agree that scene was a joke because he did it the one time and moved on.

​@@kevintanza6968 wow analyzing a mother's line to her child in which she blames him for getting kidnapped is so DUMB 😂. that is so obviously a JOKE😂 It's not like good writers intentionally include dialouge in a scene to characterize a relationship 😣😞☹ it's not like people would run with a characterization that provides insight into a characters motivations, actions, and thought processes throughout the show 😱. no, that would require horikoshi actually being a decent writer.

Quick question, are Victor and Yuri from Yuri on Ice gay? Is Amanda from Chasing Amy bisexual, or a lesbian who went straight after meeting the right man? Is Namona from Namona genderfluid? Sometimes it’s not said with modern day terminology, just shown though actions and people are still unwilling to read the most basic of subtext. I understand lots of people get very set in their headcanons and have a hard time separating them from canon, but sometimes it’s a matter of multiple readings being possible, with one of the intended readings being the gay one and people passionately explaining their thought process is endearing and useful to understanding it even if you want to share your reading of the text too that clashes with theirs. Sometimes, the “obviously” in “obviously canon” is a self defense mechanism from years of being told no one like you exists, especially not in fiction.

Oh yeah, it gets really annoying. Most people Who do this claiming later go on bashing and harassing anything "het" with said characters, and if you oppose their actions arguing against their claiming, they call you homo or lesbo phobe. They also use, if they find said characteristics, the term "coded" to say a certain character is gay even thought is barely or not implied at all. And even so, does that give them the authority to police the fandom like that? Absolutely not! Then again, most of the people are bigots in their own right once you check up records of their activities in their profiles(Twitter, Reddit) and, Hate to say this, a lot of them are queer, a Pattern I see often repeated. I can understand if their hatred from normalized relationship or sexuality depicted in media is rooted in traumatic experiences of bullying and harrassment due to their queer identity. I really do. Nobody is born naturally as a jerk or malicious. I albeit I ain't queer, I know how being bullied feels. And that is why I come here, writing this. Please, don't harrass others for their headcannons which you dislike, turn away and focus on what you like.

After trolls 3 came out there were all the random toxic people who kept saying how gay velvet and veneer are (which is also very stereotype-y) and would harass and attack people who disagreed and also kept calling them girlbosses and the only good characters.. trolls is one of my comfort franchises and it was super uncomfortable 😭

I disagree with you to a point. It's VERY possible to be the truth. I mean, queerbaiting is very much a thing that happens all over the place, and it's not because the fans are all delusional. Do I think it's queerbaiting every time? No, of course not, sometimes the fans ARE delusional. Lol. But sometimes it really is just a "they couldn't show it." There's one fandom I'm thinking of recently, where everyone was like "These two characters are gay" (I think it's called American Housewife?) and the series got cancelled - the showrunner said "yeah these two were gonna be in a full on gay relationship the following season." It's word of god fiat now, but it's just an example of 'it was there in the writing, even if it wasn't explicitly stated.'

I will say one exception to this, and it’s Bungou Stray Dogs, where the creator confirmed that no ships would ever become canon, out of respect for the authors the characters were based on. In that situation, I’d say “this is obviously what the author intended” is not a wholly unreasonable thing to say, depending on the context

I feel like a lot of trauma fics arise when fans feel like canon did an inaccurate or otherwise poor portrayal of trauma, because there are many cases where a story will just entirely brush off whatever traumatic event a character just went through like nothing happened. Though I do agree, if there’s a reason for them to canonically not be traumatized from the event, then acting like they are feels a bit strange. And yeah, it does get tiring where portraying a character as traumatized just means infantalizing them. Characters can have trauma and still be badass. Heck in a lot of cases the character became badass as a coping mechanism for their trauma.

@@a.n.9800 Tbf, there doesn't always have to be a reason. I've personally been through things that could easily be traumatising but they just aren't, and I am not one of a high mental fortitude lol. Human brains are funny things

Butters especially gets treated like this being of pure innocence. He's naïve maybe, but definitely not innocent.

Ah yes, home of the "he would not fucking say that"

That's why I like Nicholas Meyer's "The Canary Trainer." Screw all of that.

I’m not in the Phantom phandom (not to the fanfic extent anyway), but you are 100% correct. And this is coming from someone on Team Erik. I love Erik, because as a disabled person, I can relate to a lot of things he went through, and if I start talking about his backstory I WILL cry, but he doesn’t get a pass for all the things he does and as much as I want to give him a hug, I don’t condone what he did and Christine doesn’t owe him anything and being with him would be disastrous. However, I do think Raoul has some genuinely bad moments. 1) He’s annoyed that Christine doesn’t want anyone to know about the engagement. Regardless of why, the fact that she wants to keep it a secret she be enough for him to not to press her about it. 2) The moment where he tells Christine she doesn’t need to do anything if it makes her scared or uncomfortable; then goes back on that a few minutes later. TLDR: no matter who Christine chooses, they’re going to need couple’s counselling. Her best move, in my opinion is to stay single.

Right? What a shit post.

I agree, but something being popular doesnt equal that thing is of high quality or otherwise good

Okay, but at the same time, Star Wars is genuinely one of the worst-written pieces of media I've ever seen

i desperately need a enemies to lovers fan fic between wheatley and the one turret from (i think) chapter 2 the turret that talks about "get mad!" and the prometheus rant

@@beehive983 wait omg yes

So real. Like dont get me wrong I love vocaloid but you gotta give credit where credit is due and admit that utau is NOT what it used to be anymore lmao

SythV is also pretty good. As for Vocaloid, I just prefer some of the songs over UTUA.

@@Dressup_DollWell yes, synthv is very good. And for the songs, thats more about the skill of the producer rather than the actual software. That song would likely sound as good with an utau voicebank.

I don't use any of the softwares (I just don't have the patience), but as a song and cover enjoyer, I appreciate all three main kids equally (Vocaloid, UTAU, SynthV)

@@naolucillerandom5280 i have all three and I think that each has their own use depending on what you want to do Synthv is if you want realism Utau is if you want flexibility Vocaloid is if you want to do things easily and get popular fast Synthv and utau have definitely become better, but I understand that Vocaloid is just extremely simple and has basically everything you need and has the most notability of them all, although once you know how to do the things it offers yourself with free software like utau or fl studio it becomes obsolete unless you want to use it's exclusive vocals or don't wanna track down a good utau vocal. Plus, it's a bit better at English than Utau Anyways, sorry for this long reply-

as someone who used to be in the bnha fandom and was a hardcore tododeku shipper at one point, i'm pretty sure none of them have ever been in a relationship (besides yo shindo and nakagame). i stopped reading the manga at least 2 years ago so smth could've changed since then but it always confused me how adamant people are about the canon relationship statuses and experiences of the characters.

I like it when people use the "there are virtually no canon relationships in MHA" as an argument for ships. It's a nice breath of fresh air from the whole "stop making everyone gay!!" thing.

Hasn’t it been established that Midoriya and Ochako literally have feelings for one another? Not a full on relationship, granted, but that doesn’t mean the chemistry isn’t there.

​@@AverageJoeMamatrue, doesn't mean it's bad to ship them with other people though.

Midoriya and Uraraka is probably the only ship would become canon, I mean is quite obvious that is the author intention

FR. And I feel like specially early on a lot of people were very elitist if you refused to go along with this same practices and were f2p.

I thought I was going insane with how little It's mentioned, because, I too love tf2 and gets no one wants to address this because it'd give the game bad rep, but It is true they feature most things you'd hate in modern gaming, oddly enough execution and reception made it a positive somewhat, but it's predatory by design too... I'm guessing It's fixed by most things being accessible as a f2p (outside of inventory space and chatting) and the gameplay being awesome through and through (not without bugs). Though I'll say It, I dislike the mvm ticket for tours system, there's these odd elements of gambling with elitism and bot farming, It feels wrong.

See also: Kel, from OMORI.

Canon: Sunny is an intelligent, resilient character. She's kind and wants to spread love, because she's a pro-peace activist. She's survived years of horrible trauma and has shown her capability to survive alone. It's not a sign of weakness but of strength that she continues to have so much empathy when she's been wronged so many times. Fanon: HAHA MANIC PIXIE DREAM GIRL EMPTY HEAD NO THOUGHTS

Michelangelo from TMNT(most versions, but especially 2012) also gets this treatment a lot

Another problem with bl is the smut😭😭 like im not saying having smut in a bl is bad im saying people need to take no for an answer and stop sexualizing noncon.

Also with the people who see two characters look at each other and immediately start making smut of them. Those kinds of people scare me lmao

Its the stereotypes. I try to avoid m/m written by fujoshis because the bottom is always submisive, smaller, feminine or all three and the top ignores consent and starts talking like a rapist. It always makes me uncomfortable seeing as a reason i read less w/m is because of the gender stereotypes and the woman always being submissive in bed. Its not about top/bottom, its about inserting heteronormative ideas in everything.

Biggest problem is the women reading smut (aka fujoshis) since they ARE fetishizing gay people, cant read any bl manhwa/manga without seeing a parade of pink symbols in the comments

​@@MinttChocolateChip omg right? The amount of times I read a beloved BL piece and wonder how absolutely outraged people would be if one of them was a woman is crazy