What Killed Rock & Roll? (Hint: It Wasn't Hip Hop) 

I love classic rock. However, I'm sick of FM stations the same 200 songs, over, and over, and over.

When the Beatles arrived in the US for the first time a US journalist asked John Lennon "what's the first thing you are going to do in America", John replied "I'm going to see Muddy Waters", the journalist asked "Where is that?"

I think it would be really cool if Rick made a list of up and coming rock bands that aren’t getting the recognition they deserve

Geddy Lee of Rush sums it up nicely: "All this machinery making modern music, can still be open hearted; it's not so coldly charted, it's really just a question of your honesty, yeah your honesty; one likes to believe in the freedom of music, but glittering prizes and endless compromises shatter the illusion of integrity"

"Everyone talks about rock these days; the problem is they forget about the roll." - Keith Richards

What killed Rock. To quote Keith Richards, "they forget about the Roll".

I want rock and roll to come back, it’ll be tough but I’ll learn the style and try my best. We can’t let such an amazing sound die.

Rick, I'm of the '52 generation, too, but my influences go back a little further. I became aware of rock and roll in '62 and started listening closely in the summer of '64. So along with blues I heard the influences of country, tin pan alley, minstrelsy, chasson, and all the mash-ups--rockabilly, Texas swing, uptown R&B, soul, surf, Brill Building--and it was all good. The elements that they all had were a sense of the past, an element of fusion or crossover, en element of surprise, and a sense of drama--setting, tension, climax, and denouement. You could turn on the radio and be surprised, and each song had a way of pulling up out in. We've lost that, first with the sense of the past. In those days musicians listened to the record collections of their elders. Elvis had Lonnie Johnson, Bing Crosby, and Bill Monroe. Bob Dylan had Woodie Guthrie and Cisco Houston. And the Beatles had everything, plus Goffin and King. I had the Ink Spots from my dad, Burl Ives from my mom, and doo-wop singles from my Aunt Pat. Second, for worse as well as better, filtered out a lot of chaff. Making and selling records was expensive and you had to have something special to make the cut. Third, public airwaves and limited bandwidth meant democracy on the airwaves. On one hand FM rock introduced a lot of new sounds, but it was also the tart of market segmentation. Last, people really listened to music. We demanded more from it than background noise, accompaniment to occupy the ears while we were busy doing something else. So my theory has many culprits, but maybe the big ones are the decline of vinyl and AM radio.

What's often overlooked whenever this issue is discussed is the Telecommunications "Reform" Act of 1996 -- a horrendous bill that (among other things) allowed a handful of corporations to buy up radio stations all over the country, and thereby dictate from on-high which songs get radio airplay and which ones don't.

Jim Morrison predicted that popular music would become one guy on stage with a bunch of machines.

MTV abdicated their throne as a launch pad for new music back in 1993 and replaced music with reality (narcissism) TV. I found Santana IV while shopping at Target in 2016. I had no idea this new album existed because the local stations didn't promote it and I was blown away by how great is was/is.

First two songs our little neighborhood garage band tried to learn were "House of the Rising Sun" and "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida". I had my work cut out for me as the groups drummer. We were all just turned 12 or 13... back in 1970. What a great time to hit adolescence!

What Killed Rock & Roll? Quick answer: Culture changes. Technological changes. And the music industry being a money machine over a creative machine.

I'm 67. Have no fear, there was plenty of garbage in the 60s and other decades before or after. The main difference between nostalgic times and now is the forum that technology has provided. In the 60s, music was available through records, American Bandstand, and AM radio, and to a big extent word of mouth. Today, due to the fracturing of the culture by way of available outlets due to technology, there are so many outlets where music is found, the music pool is very watered down. I am typing on a technology that anyone can pigeonhole themselves into a particular genre and never have to come up for air. In the 60s, super groups were marketed similarly, but the number of outlets for the music was severely limited compared to today. Within a minute, I can find any particular kind of music I want and expose myself to something that would have taken days, weeks whatever to seek out. Availability. Rock wasn't as dominant in the popular culture in those times as you may think. The big difference between then and now is the supergroup phenomena. In 1967, when the Beatles unveiled Sgt. Pepper there wasn't a human on earth that had access to electricity that couldn't tell you who the Beatles were. That doesn't mean they liked them, because there was a huge backlash against 'Rock n Roll' then. It just means the Beatles were known worldwide. Who would that group or person be today? We're so fractured now, I don't think that question can be answered. If I want to hole myself up and listen to 2021 Rock today, I could access it and never come up for air, thanks to the availability of extremely narrow bands of genre out there.

Gentlemen, excellent explanation of what became of Rock N Roll. Rock is not dead. I have been watching dozens of youngsters on RU-vid discovering the great music of the sixties and seventies, and their minds are blown. Even becoming angry that they were denied the opportunity to hear this music until they were well into their twenties and thirties. Rock is not dead, the blues are not dead. They sleep in repose as this generation and the next absorb the greatness of the past. I believe a new generation is on the horizon who will discover the great blues masters and the great rock artists and will be inspired to create the next generation of Rock music. Great music does not die. Take heart, perhaps we all will live to see the next genius who will burst upon the stage and blow our minds. I can’t wait, but in the meantime I have a couple thousand ancient vinyl discs and as they spin on the turntable become a portal of time and sound returning me to the days of giddy excitement when a new song by my favorite band was played by my local radio station.

Very late to this conversation, but I think Napster was a big factor in music changing right at the turn of the millenium. Record companies quickly realized they could possibly lose their ability to make money. I think this incentivized them to take fewer risks (than they were already taking, which was not much by that time), do things as cheaply and quickly as possible, and repeat. There's not much room for art in a system like that. Rock, being an art, lost a lot of its power.

The reason why Rock effectively died is totally because of the corporate takeover of the music industry... record labels, radio stations, instrument companies, etc.

What killed rock? Silly question. What killed classical? What killed Baroque? Nothing killed them, they are all still alive, but time marches on and they all become the music of then, and not now. But seriously nickelback killed rock.

It ran out of ideas in the mid 90s basically. Went through every genre (folk, blues based, psychedelic, hard rock, progressive, glam, heavy metal, punk, new wave, indie, alternative, grunge) . After 1995 it was just recycling the same old stuff.

Music goes through cycles like everything else. I have a feeling that we're going to go through a period where the wheat gets cut from the chaff. One thing is that music schools are better than ever now. I live with a 21-yearold whose high school band toured Europe and Australia. His high school has three jazz ensembles because the program is so popular. The local jazz station (independent of course) has a high school DJ night where kids 15-18 yrs old are playing Clifford brown, Art Blakey, etc because they actually love the music. Yes, 15 years old and loves Clifford Brown. So all hope is not lost. The kid I live with can perform Chopin on the piano and won the state championship for solo marimba twice in his age group. He is NOT musically ignorant in ANY sense of the word. He marvels at my jazz improvisation skills. So, my message is - I appreciate what you're saying - but be VERY CAREFUL with the over-generalizations. Don't sell the young folks short - they can surprise you in many ways.

My wife made a good point as well - losing school music programs. There's so much in the music experience that is lost by not being able to participate in early music education. So what kids end up being exposed to has become largely homogenized.

This is literally the best channel on RU-vid. A nice break from the endless politics and conspiracies.

I have done a lot of things in music, including a stint as a DJ. I loved being DJ, and taking people on a journey. Like, this is the Party Bus, I'm the Driver, and I'm gonna take you to Great Place, because I had the Artistic Freedom to do so. But the Corporations took over, and I began losing my freedom to go where I wanted, to play what I wanted. Further down the road the Corporations narrowed the pipes even more. The new listeners had no reference to good music anymore. They just took what was fed them as good, boy bands for example. Most kids don't know the old music. They don't miss it because they don't know it. It's up to us, the Old Guard, to keep the music alive. 🎶

I was born in 1961. When I first heard a Beatles tune, it blew me away. I've never heard of music like that before, and rock & roll was totally new to me. BTW, it was "Hey Jude" that I first heard. It was released in 1968 as a "by itself single." It was momentous.

To paraphrase Frank Zappa - "It isn't dead, it just smells funny."

1) People stopped going out to see live music. 2) So it was cheaper for venues to hire DJs rather than live bands. 3) So those DJs started to become music producers. 4) Then all popular music started to sound like club DJ music.

Man I just discovered you last week, I love music and I love your channel 👊🏾♥️

Only a new generation of musical ears and mind can tell. Either they’ll raise rock&roll back to life or continue to make it a fabric to tailor a new genre of music to fit their time...the spirit of rock and roll is looking down upon us waiting for the right time to reveal itself once again.

The late, great Tom Petty wrote an album about this with his frustration at the corporate control limiting rock music.. There goes the last DJ, Who plays what he wants to play, There goes the freedom of choice There goes the last human voice...

Rock N Roll isn't dead, it just went into the Witness Relocation Program. It's still around to an extent.

Trouble is, these days there is little chance of any band making it through without their sound and image being shaped by the record companies

Great commentary & very insightful!

You permanently won me over with your criticism of the 1996 Telecommunications Act, which removed the caps on the number of stations a single broadcast entity could own. A+.

Actually, MTV had a lot to do with the death of rock music. What you see with MTV is that in the early years ('81 through '83) it WAS about the music - videos were mostly clips of concert footage or simple band performances. And it was a great way for bands to promote tours, new albums, etc. Along the way, videos became more like short films (Michael Jackson's "Thriller" for instance), so all of a sudden you have an art form that is intended to focus on the audible things such as musical talent, songwriting, etc. and as (possibly an unintended) consequence MTV and music videos made the band's visual image more important than the music. And then over time MTV changed its focus away from music and centered itself more on "reality" shows and other programming. I doubt if they even play videos anymore, haven't watched them in years.

I've always said rock and roll died in 1995 after The Pumpkins' Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness. And it wasn't rap or country that killed it off. Those genres were freaking co-existing with rock and roll. Snoop, Tupac, Garth, Massive Attack. It was a great time to be alive. I was in radio for 7 years during that awesome time and witnessed rock's death. It was like losing a parent.

Note to guitar building companies. Simply add better quality control to what already make with the player in mind. Hear what happens.Thank you!

As long as there's four dudes who grew up on their parents stack of Zeppelin and Floyd and Sabbath and the Beatles there's gonna be rock and roll. Question is whether it sells.

I think the death of Rock and Roll can best be summed up when in some time around 2010 Rolling Stone magazine had a cover article featuring the Black Eyed Peas with the caption of "The Exciting State of Rock and Roll." When the photo represents a group where no one plays a live instrument live as the main reason to be excited about rock, then it is dead as far as mainstream goes.

Just love this chat!! I talk about the feeling of danger in Music!

Dominant music styles tend to run in 40 year cycles: jazz (1915-1955), rock n’ roll (1955-1995), hip hop (1995-the present). That doesn’t mean people stop playing and listening to older styles, but they cease to be prevalent in the wider culture.

Hey hey, my my Rock and roll can never die There's more to the picture Than meets the eye. Hey hey, my my.

In my opinion, "American Idol" is the worst thing that ever happened to music, and deserves the most blame for killing rock and roll.

For some of us, what is happening with the internet and spotify is not much different with what happened in the 70s when the album oriented music disappeared and there was the payola scandals with corporate take overs of radio stations. Music went underground for us in the 1980s with a few bands peeking up like REM, The Smiths, The Cure, U2, The Replacements etc. When grunge broke, the corporate world didn't understand that there was the huge frustrated base of people who wanted good music and so Nirvana's popularity stunned them because we weren't part of their previous purchasing demographic. Then Nirvana breaks and all of a sudden companies are signing anything that remotely sounds like Nirvana (which is good for some really good bands like Pearl Jam and Soundgarden but then there are tons of bands that come up with one song which is even close to be any good and the sound gets watered down and slowly goes back to being underground music. What it takes is one band with some universal appeal like U2 or Radiohead to open things up for a while because the audience is there. Until then, I'll keep searching the internet for cool stuff. I stay away from spotify as I'm not going to support this corporate structure. This is a period in time where really good artists, for example, Aimee Mann, Bad Bad Hats, Beach House, and Wolf Alice can do their thing and build a following via the internet and touring. The internet taketh away but it also giveth for those who look for good stuff.

60’s and 90’s rock will always be my favourite It will never die in my heart We have a dedicated rock staion on the radio here in NZ and it can get a bit repetitive but they also provide a platform for up coming kiwi bands and its really great to hear fresh stuff from local bands

rock never dies, it just took some time off...the cycle will return...

Country music is even more awful since the 2000s.Hillbilly tractor rap.

Wow - supercool discussion. You guys hit the nail squarely on the head!

I have a number of friends in their 20's and 30's (I'm almost 58) and I'm constantly introducing them to classic rock and classic country. Boston, Stones, Pink Floyd, Bryan Adams, Alabama, The Highwaymen, Garth, Glen Campbell, etc. I also throw in generous helpings of Sinatra, and all sorts of stuff from my dad's generation. My one big regret is not taking up guitar as a kid...

You can't send your local DJ a tape anymore and ALL airplay is determined by the mega media corporations.

I think the only thing they left out of the discussion is the impact of classical music. Yes, Jethro Tull, King Crimson, Rush, Genesis, etc.... had a lot of soul that came from classical or fusion.

I love live music! The music from the 60s, 70s,and the 80s seems to be endless. The movie and tv industry seem to use music from those eras constantly. Our music seems to have heart and soul.

I love Adele but it would have made even more sense if you had brought up AMY WINEHOUSE!!! When here voice, here personality and ironically (closely) here name isn't blues, what is?!?

You know what else? I'm old and we would hear one, maybe two songs off an "album" (yeah it was a thing) on the radio. But we wanted to hear it when we wanted to hear it, not once every two hours on the radio. So we'd buy the LP and suddenly find out that there were 8 other really amazing songs on that album. That made us a fan of the band and I'd ruin that LP picking up the needle and replaying the same riff 20 times in a row to learn it on my Gibson ES 125T. Ah, those were some good times.

Music was much better when ugly people were allowed to make it. That is the real truth. Now its more important to look like a model than be talented or innovative.

what you're doing is both awesome and essential for some us. Thank you

Had no idea y’all were in Atlanta until you started doing those old radio stations ❤

your passion for music is contagious!

My (dumb) opinion Old School: Musicians were ugly (for the most part) and music was beautiful Today: Music is awful and everyone is cute I literally worship this channel!

The Strokes are incredible started in 2000s and Depeche Mode are amazing and still selling out stadiums and are electronic rock

I write only about the 'human element'. Maybe that's why no one has ever heard of me and Spotify playlist curators say that my lyrics are too depressing!!!! Brilliant video Rick, as always!

Great conversation. Let's face it. There will never be another Beatles, another Rolling Stones, another Led Zeppelin, another Cream, another Jimi Hendrix... There's a reason it's 2021 and we're still listening to them over bands from today.

I wish i was born in the 1540s, when music was good

Just in my suburb in Sydney Australia in the 1980's, I can remember a handful of small recording studios. Heaps of live music, small record labels, small record stores. A diversity of different types of radio stations to get new bands music played over the radio.

When you said about a fragmentation of stiles and groups by internet media, I remembered Impressionism on Art. The last big art movement which was pulverized in like 4 or 5 different moviments from it, and (art) became more fragmented from there. Point of no return. I have this feeling with rock. Like, different Spotify groups of interest, hard to break worldwide...

I almost always cite the 1996 Telecommunications Act as the dividing line for "before" and "after." Great video, glad to see there's some like minds out there who get it!

Hey. Just a simple comment...as an older guy (50) picking up the guitar as a late in life hobby (first instrunent ever), and many of the same influences...I love this channel!

My fav part is at the very beginning when Rhett sits down and immediately hits a chord that compliments Dave's blues licks

Another excellent episode! 🙌

In the late'50s, people wondered if rock and roll was dead, in the early '70s,after The Beatles demise & the passing of the great rock and roll triumvirate, people thought rock was dead, every so often, people prematurely write Rock's obituary, but rock got stronger as it metamorphosized.

Rock isn’t dead, you just need to know where to find it.

I never get tired of classic rock, classic pop rock, oldies....

Rock Radio and the Industry behind it is what killed rock music. Between 65 and 75, you could hear Black Sabbath followed by Jim Croce and then Sly & the Family Stone all on the same station. I knew rock was dying when a new station popped up that only played Metal. Stations became specific to a genre, which resulted in listeners losing interest in anything but a particular music, which meant they weren't exposed to any other types. We started out eclectic but then the Industry funneled exposure which narrowed what we heard. I was with a female friend on our way to go party and I was excited for her to hear my new tape... Gene Loves Jezebel's 'Immigrant'. That albums rocks and I put it in. After a song or two, she asked me to put on something else. I asked her if she didn't like GLJ and her response was "I've never heard it on the radio"

“Spotify, the one station to rule them all.”, great line. Love the LOTR reference.

The music industry wanted consistent revenue and it was not about the music. Just crank out the crap as cheap as possible. This has happened in pro sports as well to create more scoring and generate more revenues. Money runs everything

I am so grateful for this interview, reflecting different generations of musicians and music-lovers. I am fascinated, along with feeling depressed that there may never be another Nirvana kind of explosive world-wide discovery. But I'm not sure, because these events DO happen. It's the history of the world.

There's still so many phenomenal rock and roll bands out there, Eagles of Death Metal and Jon Spencer Blues Explosion are two of my favourite bands, I've been fortunate to see them both live and they seriously embody the spirit of rock and roll.

I appreciate you framing the history and “recession” of rock music. I now understand why I’m bothered by the sound of music produced after about 1990. I find myself going back to all the bands/musicians during the 60’s 70’s and 80’s. If I had not found and listened to your channel I would not understand that “blues music” is at the very heart of all of the music I enjoy. I have really enjoyed all the videos I have watched on your channel. Thank you for all the effort you put into making your videos. Dr. Dave

RoCK is not dead. It’s everywhere just not on mainstream media. There a millions of new awesome rock bands out there all over the internet.

I love that you directly addressed the allusion to rap music’s impact on rock’s popularity. Your content is truly golden and I have been exposed to so many fantastic artists. Thank you immensely for what you’re doing!

Everybody acts as if this is internal to the music industry; as if we could change some rules, technology, practices and traditions and it would suddenly be 1978 all over again (when I turned 16). Wishful thinking. After 50,000 years of only live acoustic music, electronics wired the whole world together with increasingly better and cheaper recordings, radio, and then whole new instruments to express and record with. The simultaneous economic, technological, and culture explosions of the 20th Century gave us plenty to sing about. Like mixing paint, the music of the psychedelic 60s (and our lives) were fully homogenized by the end of grunge. I'm just mad because we all should have known and appreciated it more. But like all good things, it has come to an end. At least we kept great recordings. But I see these being lost. Consider the difference (particularly the lyrics) between Janice Ian's At Seventeen and Alessia Cara's Seventeen. My one word of advice is consider: What we were singing for? My generation's music was like a soundtrack that made our bland little lives seem important (i.e We are the Champions, You are still the one). Garrison Keillor said it best, referring to poetry: It lends grace and gravity to the mundane, thereby lending courage to strangers. (i.e. Ian's homage to "ugly duckling girls" JCM's Little Pink Houses, or Jackson Brown's The Pretender. If I had to pick the problematic word about today's music? SELFISH, typically braggy or whiney. I don't want to hear about your nice ass or your problems, I want you to help me give my life meaning.

College stations are a major force in exposing our country to new music that isn't mainstream. That's how U2 and Nirvana came to the attention of the public.

In the last week i have found something new to me: the virtual band. I'm 60, and Yes and Rush, all those bands (All this machinery making my music) that impinged on my classical upbringing are fading away. I don't listen to 'new music' anymore, because I don't care for the feel of it, it's plastic. But these kids I've found on the internet are writing and performing their own stuff, and it's good. I still don't know how much of it is processed, but they seem to have found the roots of rock and blues, and are exploring it in the same way that the bands of the 60's and 70's were stretching the limits of the tech of their day. The fact that the individual artists are thousands of mile apart means nothing to them. One thing you didn't mention was venues, and how where shows were located and ticket prices affected access by younger people. You couldn't go to the local venue and see top acts unless you lived in a major market. Going to see Bob Seger on a friday night with your friends for a few (inflation adjusted) bucks doesn't happen anymore.

So glad Rick you mentioned Reggae. Big Reggae fan. Evangelist Roger Mansour former manager of Junior Braitwaite from the original WAILERS

I only listen to 98.9 out of Tijuana here in San Diego because the DJs have the freedom to branch out and play what they wanna play and their tastes are eclectic and impeccable. About a year ago I heard Black Sabbath's Heaven and Hell and decided to get a turn table again and dust off my old vinyl collection that I saved (thank god) and I've been collecting records and building up an impressive home stereo system like I had back in the day.

In 1969, John Fogerty's Creedence Clearwater Revival preserved the genuine American rock and roll and blues at a time when the Brits lay claim to American rock and roll. He inspired many Americans to appreciate American rock and roll, blues, country during the british invasion.

Are you using “blues” synonymously with passion and feeling? Because that’s what I am gleaning from this video. Rhett makes a good point that much of the pop music of today is polished and plastic, and that’s because it only exists to make money. Musicians that make music for the love of the actual music are still out there and you can hear the passion in their music. It’s similar to the movie industry where they pump out sequels because they know it’s a safe return on investment, regardless of quality. Aversion to risk is the enemy of passion and innovation.

Rock is now traditional music . Many people are searching for sounds they’ve never heard before. I grew listening to Cream, Zeppelin and Hendrix and love it, but now it’s EDM music at raves where you hear some really interesting productions. Despite the perception of EDM being inferior, there’s some amazing stuff out there.

I feel like RU-vid guitar lessons are a big reason why unique, original self expression through guitar is very rare to come by with young guitar players these days.

If rock is dead, why do they have to keep trying to convince us? I've been hearing this phrase ad nauseam for 30+ years.

It's interesting you mention the shift taking place in the mid-90s. That's when I started to not like most of what was on the radio. I never made the correlation before but this is interesting information.

Hi Rick I’m 63 still playing my own songs in a power trio, The Razed. Influences from hardrock and punk. Alternative/Grunge style. Had a gig last week after 3 years hiatus due to Covid. It was great! Even got an encore. I will keep rocking until I’m sick or no one claps. My question to you is: Do you think we will get another mega artist/band like Bowie, Sex Pistols, Prince, Nirvana etc. Or are we doomed to listen to formula pop that has a 1 week shelf life? Enjoying your insights. Cheers, Paul.

Blues music is just so full of resilience! I think that’s what we all love about it. No matter who you are you can connect to that. It’s just so human.

The dude on the right looks like what H3H3 will look like in twenty years

I was born in 2002, and in Asia, with none of those cool music, but hey, I'm here, following your channel, listening to Rock N Roll, I think there is hope.

Post 1996 had some great rock bands.White Stripes,Queens of the stone age,Muse,The Black Keys are some that come to mind.May rock never truly die.

1966-1977 is the sweet spot, the top of the bell curve -- from Revolver to Aja. Everyone is in there and at the top of their respective games: The Beatles, The Who, The Rolling Stones, The Kinks, The Byrds, The Band, The Beach Boys, The Doors, The Grateful Dead, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix, Bob Dylan, Yes, Jethro Tull, etc. all the way to AC/DC, Boston, Steely Dan, Elton John, Aerosmith, The Doobie Brothers, The Eagles, The Ramones, The Cars, The Police, Bob Marley, Van Halen, and the first Tom Petty albums.

You guys nailed it dead on! Even the younger dude gets it. I was mentored by Willie Dixon for a short while when I was a kid; worked with Solomon Burke as a singer starting around 2001 and in the studio a bit. Solomon and I met singing gospel and anything could pop up in one of his shows, we even did "Mojo" together at a Seattle birthday party for one of the Microsoft dudes. Soul, Blues, Rock'n Roll, early RnB and even some country, all born of the same mother! It's too expensive for me to get into the studio these days so I try to use Superior Drummer in PT but I'm just not a midi guy or an engineer and having a live drummer making his own choices really sets the creative pulse in motion. These days you're supposed to be a one man band-studio-record company...I'm a frickin' singer, player and song writer, that should be enough, eh? Long live folks makin' real music, Amen!

Auto-tune and reality tv shows like "American Idol" and "The Voice" killed rock.

I greatly enjoy these music discussions. I have found that my tastes in "modern" rock lean toward blues-influenced sounds like Jack White, the Black Keys, the Strokes and Tool among others.

Great discussion guys ! The listener gives music relevance . Spotify is an Algorithm not a human . The blues and Blues based rock never died and just bc young people don’t like something does not make of break it .