Dorella Narange I know, right? Targaryen guys would fuck a hole in the ground if somebody made sure there were no snakes in it. Nothing's off limits for the dick of a dragon lol
What if the Targaryens were lying about that being "an ancient Valyrian custom" and the Targaryens were considered the silver haired trash of Old Valyria? 🤔
@@sleekoduck Possible, though iirc the Essosi Valyrians of Volantis also perform dynastic incest for similar reasons, so it would have to be a mutually agreed upon lie.
I always thought Nettles was a dragonseed. "The seed is strong," dark features usually overtake light features. But the LEAF theory just blew my mind! Wow! You've done it again! Always bringing the new new even during the long night when we are dry and thirsty for new theories and new materials.
@@GrayArea yeah, I get super mad whe ppl in the fandom dismiss this possibility because of her dark features. I think she's blood of the dragon for sure, probably with some summer islander inclusions.
John Shorter yeah it’s a dumb assessment to think she can’t be Valyrian based on her look. Especially if you take into account Rhaenyra’s own children, Rhaegar’s Daughter Rhaenys, Jon Snow, Baelor Breakspear , the black pearls kids... it doesn’t have a leg to stand on based on that alone. I think George made it ambiguous to purposely make us wonder but if I had to stake money on it. I think she is a blood of the dragon.
Girl Nettles Same with my daughter, I thought my husband’s jet black hair and dark eyes would take over. She was born with jet black hair, the spitting image of him. Oddly that hair fell out and she became a blonde with blue eyes as she grew. I agree with the dragon blood theory! 🩸🔥🩸
The theory of Nettles being a witch actually makes a lot of sense as it was magic that bonded the dragon riders in the first place. It would be interesting if it turns out that she is a descendant of the people from Asshai, as there is the theory that it was sorcerers from Asshai who first taught the Valyrians to tame dragons through blood magic.
Yes but later down the line they literally have dragon blood, hence the lizard babies, it's possible nettles is any number of things because she's dragon seed but they are different percentage Targaryen arnt they? They are only half if one parent is full Targaryen, it'd take a few generations of incest to work backward to be full Targaryen. In books daemon is only in late 20s. And sorcery can come from any person with any ties to valarryia, and the purple eye thing is interesting, is it a dragon lord thing or a relative of amethyst empress thing. House Targaryen weren't even the top, they were the bottom of the barrel in relation to other dragon lords. If they are related to the empress they are related to her ancestors. Also go back far enough of course the sorcerers made dragons. Dragons didn't always exist in beginning. Also the eye thing is more interesting than the hair thing. So reneysse is dark hair with purple eyes, books say alicent looks velaryian and yet she is still dark hair and not purple eyes. So genetics work normally with hair. It'd be so odd if nettles was daemons daughter and he liked her, yea we've seen incest but so far no parent child except the man in got giving children to the others. But that was odd thing I don't think targs ever did it
Fun fact Nettles settled into the mountains near the vale of Arryn The tribes up there started a tradition where young men of the tribe would attempt to visit Nettles and her dragon The visits usually didn’t go well but the survivors were recognized as men, burned men The Burned men This is one of the same tribes that Tyrion and Bronn run into on their way back from the vale of Arryn in book 1 This tribe sends members who continue to serve Tyrion in king’s landing when he was hand of the king
Omg when you said: Aemon was enchanted by the Witch Queen and Daemon was enchanted by the Fire Witch...and both men died fighting eachother My mind went 🤯
I honestly think it would be really interesting if Nettles wasn't magical at all, and she really did manage to bond with the dragon by offering it sheep. Maybe that's a clue into how the pre-Valyrian shepherd ancestors originally bonded with dragons. Or maybe it's a touch of realism in a fantastical tale.
I think she’s a dragon seed. The Leaf idea is interesting, but I don’t think the actual Leaf could pass herself off as human for any length of time, even with a glamour. She is a different species.
4LIFE1DEEP1 that’s true, but whenever the described Nettles i just kept looking at Missandei, especially after that dance of the dragons history and lore vid came out and her artwork too
You have to be blood of the Dragon in order to bond with a dragon. And before you bring a brown Ben plumm it's obviously clear he's lying about his parentage cuz there's no way in hell dany's dragons would acknowledge his Targaryen blood which is over 200 years old and diluted to the point where it's non-existent which means either his parent or grandparent is of strong Valyrian blood and his whole speech about his parentage was either a liar or a half-truth
Not really... Tyrion clearly bonded with the Dragons. So did Danys homegirl. They say dragons know who their friends are. And most people tried to TAKE CONTROL or trick the dragons. Nettles came with the gift that the dragon wanted. Simple. People tend to overlook the simple answer in the story. They want everything to have a deeper meaning, or be a clue. When some things, just are. And, how do you know what a Dragon can acknowledge? They are creatures that no one understands fully. Not even their riders. Dragons do what they want. I think we should only deal with information that we KNOW, and be careful not to speak for the characters or the writers and adlib.
@@madambutterfly1997 In the book, The World of Ice & Fire, they say Nettles is a "plain, baseborn, disreputable girl" Nothing, absolutely NOTHING even hinted at about her being a Targaryen. She's not Targaryen. This book would have at least hinted at it. It's a full account of the entire history of Westeros and the rest of the world of ice and fire.
Ummm what? Brown Ben plumm wasn't lying, he had a Targaryen ancestor named Elaena Targaryen who married Ossifer Plum, from this marriage she bore him a son whom she named Viserys (though he was most likely fathered by King Aegon IV targaryen). If the rumours were true, which they most probably were, Viserys Plumm is Targaryen on both sides. And btw Viserys wasn't born over 200 years ago but in either 176AC or 177AC, on top of this Brown Ben is quite old and descending from one of Viserys' younger sons so he most likely either his great grandson or great great grandson imo. Dany's dragons have only truly shown affection for one other person, Brown Ben, who happened to have Targaryen blood. All this shows to us readers is that you don't need that much Blood of the Dragon to bond with a dragon (though you shouldn't rely on that since we've seen what happened to Quentyn, though he most probably had less Targ blood than Ben).
in the books, the affair with Nettles is disputed. Some sources say he had an affair, other sources say Nettles was like a daughter to him. One source also swears they had separate rooms- Nettles and Damon, and Damon was indeed treating her like how daughter. Mysaria, Daemon's old mistress, is the one who tells Queen Rhaenyra that Nettles is sharing Daemon's bed. AT this point, daemon isn't really sleeping with Mysaria anymore and it could just be a vengeful tactic on Mysaria's part. Rhaenyra believes it though, and orders the Lord whose house Nettles and Damon are staying in to kill Nettles. Daemon comes to know of this, and sends Nettles away on her dragon quietly. Then he leaves. It could have been an act of kindness towards a lover or a daughter. We have no way of knowing. These are 3rd person accounts, often based on rumours and half truths. Either way, even if Daemon had an affair, he's not a traditional lover or husband when it comes to sex. Don't think that means much that he had affairs. He still cares. Or he wouldn't have jumped onto Vhagar, knowing he'd die.
Isn't the whole issue of trying to kill Nettles without Daemon knowing that they slept in the same room. That's why they eventually just told Daemon lol
Even Targaryens don't break the taboo of parents and grown children bathing together. The person who said Daemon doted on Nettles like a daughter, didn't dispute that they shared a tub. And bathing together is not something that adults who aren't lovers do. Besides, if a pro-Team Black chronicler of the Civil War wished to write favorably about Team Black OR Daemon, they'd chose to write of him as a doting dad type, despite the fact that in no other historical account is he described in that way.
I always thought it was his daughter. Thank you so much for doing a video on her. She was always my favorite character in the Westeros universe, being a mixed race woman who loves dragons supremely
It seems a little hypocritical of Princes- Queen Rhaeynera to say Nettle didn't "look" like a dragon seed, WHEN HER KIDS WITH HARWIN STRONG LITERALLY HAD BROWN HAIR AND BROWN EYES. Oh well, losing your kids and going to war with your family probably breaks your brain a little.
I think Nettles was a dragonseed that just didn't have the Targaryen features. Also, I think Deamon did love her as a daughter, because she reminded him of one of his own girls, Princess Baela from his marriage to Lady Laena. Daemon was an unfaithful man-whore, but a man can be a shitty husband and a decent father, and a woman can be a shitty wife and a decent mother. Baela was several years younger than Nettles but was very much her father's daughter. When Aegon II came to Dragonstone while riding Sunfyre, Baela didn't hesitate to mount her dragon Moondancer, even though Sunfyre was the older and more powerful dragon. Even though Moondancer died, Baela still managed to cripple Aegon for the remainder of his short life, and the wounds delivered by her dragon ended up killing Sunfyre a few weeks later. Daemon seems to have a lot in common with Oberyn Martel, in that he sleeps around and has a more progressive attitude with his female offspring. Finding a young girl/woman who is a fearless badass, who is also close in age to his daughters, would no doubt endear her to Prince Daemon.
I’m so happy somebody’s finally talking about Nettles and Sheep Stealer! From all the cannon that exists so far, Sheep Stealer is one of 3 dragons (pre-ASOIAF series) that has no documentation of death (the other 2 are Morning and The Cannibal. Also, Terax maybe doesn’t either, although so little info is provided about Terax that it’s seems more of a stretch admittedly...). We believe no dragons were left in book 1 bc that’s how the characters present that information to us, however, GRRM leaves us with the question when he doesn’t kill them himself (so far). Furthermore, if people think that Nettles is actually Leaf then there has to be room for dragon carry over from Fire&Blood to ASIOF series too. So many content creators speak to the dragon at Winterfell that Bran saw while in summer as a metaphorical vision but I never really subscribed to that… It has been a while since I read the books, but during the time that Bran saw the dragon at Winterfell through Summer’s eyes, do we know where Leaf was? -Was she close by? If Nettles is Leaf, could she have sent her dragon to Winterfell? -If so, why? Could Leaf have benefited at all from Winterfell burning? It wouldn’t surprise me if Nettles was Deamon’s daughter and no sexual stuff ever happened. The Maesters clearly had issues with the Targaryens and benefited from the infighting, divisions and dragon deaths. The way their reports came to Rheanyra, sounded a lot like the way Deamon was with her once upon a time. It is easier for all sides (black, green, and The Masters) to paint Nettles as a villainous ‘whore’, than a bastard Dragon Rider. Lastly, let’s say none of that is true about Nettles being Leaf... fine... a less intriguing twist to the story but whatevs. Still begs the question, what the ‘eff’ happened to Sheep Stealer??? Lol! PS: when listing and describing all the dragons in The World Of Ice and Fire, notice how when it talks about the last dragon dying it specifies classifies them as “Targaryen Dragons”. Makes ya go; 🤔
I've wondered if Sheepstealer and Cannibal were either descended from or were actually the construction dragons used to build Dragonstone. Jorah Mormont gave a speech to Daenerys once about her dragons being fine battle dragons, implying that dragons were bred for different tasks. Maybe this was why Sheepstealer was tamed the way he was.
Sleekoduck, I’m not sure. It was my understanding that the Targaryens were a family that bred dragons for battle… but I could be remembering that wrong. Maybe they did breed dragons for other occupations as well. Fun fact: there’s no evidence to suggest that the cannibal was younger than Balerion... think about that. Sometimes I wander if the cannibal was one of the dragons that was brought over before the Doom, and perhaps he so ancient that no one effs with him. I do think that it’s odd that there’d be two huge black dragons existing at the same time and they’d have no relation. I beleive I read sheep stealer was born when jahaerys was young... and Grey Ghost even younger... if the cannibal truly was a cannibal why did he spare greyghost and sheep stealer?
He literally was treating her like his daughter and maesters just turned it all upside down for their own purposes. I mean, Mysaria clearly took her sweet revenge lol
@@michaeldavid7961 Looks more like the Cannibal was Balerion's son, the offspring of Balerion and Vhagar and brother of Vermithor. At the time, they werent enough Targaryen kids to give dragons too, only Aenys and Maegor the Cruel before the great gransons of Aenys were born but by that time, Cannibal was probably already too big.
I like the idea that Nettles is just a normal girl who used her brain to forge a relationship with the dragon. Daemon found an unexpected kinship with her amd of course anyone who is unique or special in any way gets blamed for being a witch and sent to burn for it. I'd love to know more about her as a person. I feel a lot of empathy for what she may have had to go through if she truly were just a dockside orphan
@Bla Bla i mean, Rae used the excuse that she was a witch to seduce daemon and the dragon to justify attempting assassinate her so yes not a wild accusation, but one still exploitable.
Nah nobody just befriends dragons it's always a blood thing, I don't think nettles is a first of any kind. I'd not call being a lizard hybrid by blood being a witch, not all targaryens even use magic. And what of snow and drogon, drogon didn't try to kill John and when Tyrion freed the 2 they didn't kill him, it's not magic nor purposeful sorcery when you don't know your a dragon seed, although nettles is of an earlier era so
I would love to have seen how huge Meraxes would have grown! This just makes me super pumped to see House of the Dragon! Mushroom and all of the epic dragons are gonna be amazing!!
I cannot truly express how much these videos-the videos that YOU HAVE CREATED!!! I'm so grateful, so glad I've followed your for years and years. Please accept my admiration for your hard work! ❤️🖤🐉🖤❤️🌋♨️
A thing to consider: why believe the words of the maesters about their romance? The maesters were plotting against the targeryens, by their own admission and certainly at the time. If nettles wasn’t leaf, I think she was daemon’s daughter and the rumors of their romance just a ploy to further incense the war, create more division and ensure the end of the dragons.
Yyyyeeessss. NETTLES IS THE GURL. I HEAR YOU AND AGREE. MAYB NOT THE DAUGHTER BUT ADOPTED AND ACTS AS IF SHES CLOSE TO HIM. I LOVE YOUR THEORY. GO WITH IT.
8:27 I personally doubt that Rhaenyra personally chose to exclude Nettles. Leaving Nettles out does nothing for Rhaenyra politically except make her look like a selfish bitch who doesn't care about the people who fight and die for her. Also it makes no sense for Nettles to keep fighting for the woman who shafted her. It seems a lot more likely to me that the decision to exclude Nettles and her contributions was made by later historians who wanted to downplay her importance and vilify Rhaenyra.
i hope they cast a girl with dark skin, kind of like the sea snake’s. all of the black female cast members have light skin, so it would be nice to see them expand their range on a canonically black character
i just found your channel and I love it, most ASOIAF/GOT channels are so serious but yours is really funny and I like that you put your personality into it :)
I've always believed that Nettles was blood of the dragon. It's funny and kinda weird to see prejudices based on skin color in a fantasy setting. The fact that she was able to bond with and ride Sheepstealer, is proof enough. Though it does make me sad that she didnt have any Valyrian features. Would have been cool if she was brown skinned with white hair and purple eyes, or brown skinned with the eyes/ hair only. She deserved better
@@ocky88 Exactly like really? She was able to bind with one of the most badadd dragons ever and you are pissed that she wasnt blonde. Some of the most Targaryen looking Targaryens/Blackfyres couldnt do that. But you big mad that girl looked black? Her looks make her special its ashame that disappoints you. Smh
@@sarcasticsid5589 I don’t think the comment was meant that fashion - some Dragonseed had the silver-gold hair and the purple eyes and others didn’t - so far there haven’t been Dragonseed so far depicted as a mix of both - dark skin and hair but purple eyes, or dark skin and eyes but hair of ancient Varlaria - Even Prince Baelor in the Hedge Knight who was Dornish from his mother - didn’t have Targaryen features Of course taking a dragon in of itself is testament to her dragon blood
After reading fire & blood I always thought that nettles was Daemons bastard daughter there never was any description of Daemon & Nettles actually having sex together it's more described the way a father would treat a daughter...
I really think HBO should research some of these RU-vidrs and hire them to help w the knew series! I swear the best content for season 8 was everything I watched on RU-vid leading up to it!
Tammy Martinez some yes but I saw way better theories and ideas to end GoT then the way it was! GRRM probably won’t ever finish the original series. I say this as a fan and not a hater!
GRRM is so good at weaving mysteries within mysteries....So much about Dragons is still a mystery. I just hope the new show does the tone and complexity of his work more justice than GoT did. It needs to capture that sense of mystery. It's clear that the Dragons bond emotionally with their riders, may even take on some of their personality. Witness Caraxes' s scream after the departing Nettles and Sheepstealer....It's like the Warging relationship between the Starks and the direwolves.
I want to see Nettles but honestly please not as Daemon's lover. It would be AMAZING if they finally used that chance for a simple but meaningful friendship. As wrong as DaemonxRhaenyra is... I really don't want to see their chemistry totally destroyed and I feel like Daemon being a teaching figure for Nettles and later sacrificing his life to let her escape would be great and a really good way to make him somewhat dislikeable but likeable as well.
I will never not laugh at the name 'Sheepstealer'. It's just too good, it's like they gave up on majestic unique names when it came to Sheepstealer lol.
I think Rhaenyra was talked into this by the other woman. And since someone said it was Mysaria I could imagine that Mysaria did this out of jealousy to remove Nettles. Even though I hope they weren't lovers and maybe Nettles was simply someone who helped Daemon be a better person
@@mangamama9881 I think Nettles is just lore. Daemon has always been a good person when he is with Rhaenyra. I cannot see Daemon leaving Rhaenyra because they were separated away from each other too long. Especially, when he basically commits suicide to protect her, their children, and the throne. Whoever wrote about Nettles in the history books was not honest. The show is revealing the truth from lore in the history books. So, we have to wait to see if she pops up.
Nettles is the one character I'm hyped to see more than anyone else, besides my husband, Daemon, which we already have. I can't wait to see her casting!
Honestly scared of all the hate she's going to get from the pro-Daemyra shippers. They're toxic already. Nettles seems like what Alicent thinks she is - righteous and honorable.
@@queenb2450 I don't think she's going to be a lover, so I doubt she's going to get some kind of hate. To make her a mistress is strange, banal. And why at all ? I think they will make her more interesting, and under the rumors of the book, the mistress is very suitable to direct Rhaenyra against Daemon.
I'm late to this playlist & so happy it's here! Wonder if Nettles will finally make an appearance in upcoming episodes now that we've jumped ahead 10 years ahead.
thats why she got cut her being black in the books is what made her special since the valyrians are all white she would be least likely to have valyrian blood (and rr martin does not write black characters he said this himself) making her the only non valyrian dragon rider but since the velaryons are black in the show it ruins what made nettles unique
I also like the idea of nettles being a fire witch as well, I think nettles is one my favourite characters out of the house of dragon. Could you also do another one about the witch queen of harrenhal: alys rivers
I had wished and hoped that Queen Daenerys would be like good Queen Allysayne! She went North 2 help protect the realm and she did so at a great cost 2 her and her armies! She proved herself and we all know that Jon betrayed her!!
Umm book sets dany character arc the same. It will be handled better but dany snapped she's just a stereotypical Targaryen nothing special, fans need to realize if Martin tried to only please all fans all the time the story would suck. This is one series the author can write without fan help. And so many fans ignore Martin because otherwise theyed trust him to do his own characters justice no matter if they live or die but people can't even do that. Also dany apparently isn't fit to rule, she could have done other stuff had she not gone obsessive
Sheep Stealer!!! And you mentioned The Cannibal... The only two dragons who are still alive, and the only two dragons who were never handled by the maesters. So how long do dragons live when they are not under the care of maesters? Will Fire and Blood II reveal? Are they still alive and have a roll in the Dance II?
You always do your homework never coming less than correct.👍 This connection works for me because it also hints at coldhands identity. Leaf would see past our attachments to the characters in this story and be focused on the true war. Our perceived view that Bran is being lowered into a trap by Leaf is her sticking to the plan. Her saying coldhands died in battle a long time ago is a hint. She knew coldhands before his transformation. I thought it was Dunk but now I think he's a dragon rider who's body hasn't been recovered yet
Who said Daemon was bewitched? I mean, it's all rumors, like rumors about Rhaenyra's escapades with Cole and brothels. Daemon just did the right thing: saved Nettle's life because she was valuable AND innocent and then sacrificed his life for the good of his family and his legacy.
Queen Grey I was angry at GOT for that horrible ending so I shunned them I vowed never to revisit it ever again then I ran across this video and it got my attention the way you talk about dragons old valyria I remembered my love for it you have restored my faith in GOT I am forever in your debt
I have a little problem with the whole nettles is leaf theory, 'cause children of the forest are too small so pass as a teenager, they're usually said to 4ft tall and skinny that's why they were called children by the first men, I really don't think it holds up, because there would be something mentioning her very very small frame if she was leaf
❤Sheepsteeler and the Nettles story thanks for the read… I saw a reading with Tim Greywaste about sources and mothers in fire and blood 🩸 ❤😂🎉and I thought you felt a lot like me about a few of the characters
