Why are Grapplers so feared and hated in Fighting Games? 

Grapplers are cool in their own way as it teaches one to respect grabs. I wish I could play some of them like Shermie but I can’t preform a 360 at all/ very well. This is why I play off brand grabblers, Makoto and Q in 3S. And I try to play Sakura my main and favorite character like one too as they never see run up and grab.

Just the same as Dhalsim was voted the #1 HATED character in SFV on EventHubs 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Trash players who could NEVER deal with Dhalsim & Zangief have always hated them!!!

"What, you want me to lab or something?"...

@@DJKHAI23 wait shermie don't have a 360 motion

@@ironshinobi9384 I’m new to KoF never played a game before but seen some gameplay of older games and know some lore and characters so I want to get 15.

Or their footsie. But it's easier to have a whipping boy then to just improve. Lol

LOVED THIS, starter XD

Potempkin did need a nerf imo but not Zangy! What were they thinking with nerfing him again? He's never been all that great

This comment needs to be Pinned

WrestleMania gear.

Its the grab super on wake up

At least he has the decency to let you wake up first. Some grapplers can and will grab you when you're down.

@@Aulvikdngr its quite rude to let people think they have a chance

*he already got me once i bet next time he will expect me to jump, so ill attack instead* 🤡

Unless you neutral jump on wake up of course. Then he uses the move that is perfectly to designed to punish that which they ALL have for some godforsaken reason.

"Good reliable Rock, can't go wrong with that!"

Paper grabs rock

You have to condition opponent in order to use it tho. It's like solving a long math issue in order to force people to use scissor, so you can use rock.

@@unciervoenciervado Don't be a boomer

@@randomuser-mv7bb or you just don't condition and somehow win anyway. Good reliable rock.

they should change the title to, "why people hate big characters" well because some people have tiny pps for egos.

Is heat knuckle not in strive?

@@chiggomckekllecuck5117 oh yeah i forgot about that move

@@momazosnachos3939 ggxxacr pot main here. Np yo

@@chiggomckekllecuck5117 It is in Strive, but it is a hit grab and not a "true" command grab.

Dude, same.

Me neither. I do not respect your mother.

As a new player, as soon as I decided to main grapplers the very concept of respect disappeared from my brain.

u must have grappling emotions

@@ominousparallel3854 Savage

LOVE THIS

LMAO DUDE! I’m a Chun Main but when I want to have fun I play Zangief lmao 😂😂😂😂 my favorite thing to do is dash up SPD at max range 🤣. My transition is slowly occurring lmao

I guess I did become the grappler, proud of it though!

wait but I started as grappler, what does that make me?

You were destined to be a shoto in your past life then?

It's true. We have no decency... We are like Fleece Johnson in a prison shower on hard...You giving it up one way or another...lol

lmfao the truth kinda hurts, but its perfectly fair. King's (tekken) rolling death cradle feels like im rubbing their face in their "mistake".

Perfectly describes my T hawk style

I have no respect for God, true

We grapplers stand tall and Merkava shake the heavens.

Thats a really cool way 2 put it

Old reliable Rock, nothing beats it~

When two lesbians play guilty gear: Heaven or Hell.... Let's scissors!

Rock gud

It's funny you chose rock as one of my favorite fighting game characters is a moving rock.

You don't understand, I was already cying when I was throwing those projectiles. Grapplers scare the shit out of me

Grapplers feel a lot more unfair. For Zangief and Potemkin (so far I've played only sf5 and strive) we need to wittle down their health with combos that we need to grind for hours to get down and they just nullify all of that effort with one move. That is so frustrating. If you mistake even once they get to punish you with at least a third of a healthbar gone. I mean ppl zone grapplers bc getting near them is so punishing. In strive and sf5 there's a lot of wiggle room for zoners, so they feel a lot less frustrating.

@@clueless7822 You talk like Kara cancels and command grab combos aren't hard to land

@@mrchocoslave7859 but you need to land it only once to get a lot of value. Not even mentioning that it wouldn't take a lot of effort to develop a decent dmg combo whereas any other character archetype you need to develop muscle memory and hand dexterity for tens/hundreds of hours to develop a good dmg combo and that isn't even mentioning the fact that you need to see if you can even use it in a real online fight, which also takes a lot of time and effort. Even zoners need a lot of time and effort to pull anything decent. And for grabbers you need to figure out a way to grab the opponent and grab them that's it, you do the same damage (if not even more) than other archetype combos with one move. Like granted it still takes effort but it is so ridiculously miniscule when compared to any other archetype that it is invalidating. Not only that but you cannot mess up when you grab smb, if you grab them then that damage is guaranteed, unlike any other archetype in which you actually need to work to not mess up anything mid-combo.

@@clueless7822 You aware Potemkin gets the same punish value as a rushdown landing a combo? Figuring out how to trick your opponent and how to get close to him without getting punished IS the part where you need to train yourself. Potemkin cannot actually break free from many combos and they always end up basically wall-splatting him. Potemkin takes as much effort as any other character combo and his general low tier feeling from the whole community says so. TLDR: Potemkin isn't easier than any character just because he has different playstyle and gameplay, he's even harder than other characters

The real mix would have been to grab him a sixth time in a row

@@remuvs Surely he won't go for a 7th! (But seriously, I won a game as a zoner (Axl Low GGS) the other day by just...walking up, and throwing my opponent 8 times)

By the gods fear the command grab laurence....

I will no forget our adage

Grant us plus frames

Plant plus frames on our jabs, to cleanse our beastly tick throws

Grapplers all over the shop... you'll be one of them, sooner or later...

Almost everyone is a zoner in FighterZ though XD

@@Ramsey276one Z Broly can aim his ki blasts!

@@JustAdam123 OH

I mean all of grabs in dbfz is quite reactable unlike 1 frame command grab in other fighting games so I think Broly is different from traditional grapplers.

@@으아아-x2q oh you're consistently getting out of Z Broly light grab? Video please

Folks we got a winner, you nailed it exactly.

I watched the video and jumped to the comments to say this. You my good sir are the saint we deserve.

Don't forget sloppy pressure. If you leave a gap and I'm right next to you with my 1 frame grab what do you expect to happen?

Grapplers are the Fleece Johnsons in the prison that is a fighting game.. The easy way or the hard way...the choice is yourrrse....

I did not until right this second realize from a fundamental level, Grapplers and rushdown both are "in-fighters" and need to get close making them natural enemies. Although I don't think it always works this way but if it was Grappler beats>Rushdown Beats>Zoner then it makes sense that there would be a lot of noise from the most represented character type about their "bad" matchup. Course everyone knows grapplers have no good matchups though so it's still quite puzzling...

I'm personally a rushdown kinda guy.

95% of the fighting game player base are rushdown players. That's why many newer fighting games are more rewarding for been aggresive and so little play play Baiken or defensive character and people hated grapplers, Zooner and everything that is not Rushdown hyper aggresive characters because is not there fighting style..even thought rushdown character are often the most broken top tier and sometimes brain dead character but because they look flashy, agile and have cool looking combos they think they are not toxic and every character should follow the same rushdown formula, everything else is unfair and boring.

And does Rushdown characters are often counter by Grapplers becuase of them often having lower hp? No wonder everyone hate grapplers.

@@theamericanbrotherofmightg3734 no, it's boring because it forces the game to play like musical chairs and rock paper scissors. Grapplers make the game fuckin boring bruh accept it. You ruin other people's fun.

@@fathead3632 cry more, please

It truly is an anti grappler society

In Slave's Glory... GG1

@@MimebladeGMail?

Ggxxcacr pot main here. Burly Heart is love, Burly Heart is life.

@@chiggomckekllecuck5117 X or XX version?

True

How do you need to guess against grapplers? You keep them out and they never get in. Am I guessing if they rage quit or they’re masochistic?

True u know the only thing i.can say is with 50/50s u have a well 50% percent chance but a grappler percentage is increased because it well unblockable 😂

@@Neogears1312 This isn't true for every game. In some games grapplers can have really good approach options or even pretty good pokes in addition to being a grappler who gets a lot of damage off of grabs.

@@LadyViolet1 DBFZ with og '93 Broly is a good case in point for that. He's got great grapples, great zoning and super armor on a lot of his stuff. They may have gone a little overboard with him

That's precisely why I enjoy them.

@@marche800 Fax

@@marche800 You revel in their fear

As a grappler player, i can confirm, this is the intent. Grapplers generate fear, they're built to generate fear. Because fear is the mind killer. Just like how zoners generate frustration and rushdown generate panic. Grapplers want their opponents to feel that creeping dread that makes them hesitate on every move they make. They want their opponents to want to jump away when in grab range, or to overextend in pressure for fear of what follows. Because when you're scared, you're predictable.

fuck no, too mucu damage

@@leper763 but people forget the leadup to that big damage, the reads, the poor spacing, or an unsafe button, all of which a rushdown might slip up and forget about a couple times a match because they get away with it most of the time, the grappler is specifically looking for those moments to strike.

And this post is why I love Grapplers....they are ticking time bombs and please....don't stay still lmao

Wait I don't get this. So you can't stay still but can't get close, so the only choice is to have zoners?

@@GypsyDanger2000 if you're in breathing space of Pot you're doing something wrong

doing combos without thinking is an oxymoron. what you must mean is doing unsafe moves or fucking up meaty moves and eating a potbuster on wakeup.

@@overdrivee00 a lot of combos are done on autopilot if they’re generally a good option, if you become predictable with combos against potempkin especially if it starts with a jump in you have a one way ticket to the shadow realm

These crayons taste so good

UNGA BUNGA!!

@@N1k0SP Even better with paint to wash it down

Say what? I was snorting talcum powder and I didn't hear you.

Grapplers invest in amc lmao

If they both played perfectly then the grappler is gonna be better because the grappler is not gonna be able to see those reads so they make them for the win.

I dunno man, on wake up a command grab or meaty is just a 50/50... it's hard to call failing a coin flip a flaw.

grabs are literal mixups, nothing skillful

God dammit I thought I had forgotten Daimon clanging sandals running full speed at me

...or Wesker's crunch...I mean Clarke...

I’m about to make you fearful with two, simple words. Gadget Finger

@@dudemcguy8949 good times

This dude is just crazy 😂 He runs at you as a hunter who's searching for a prey 🤧

You mean like a Fei long vs Zangief.

I think there might be a bit of this. Almost always the grappler is also big bulky dumdum stereotype, which is the least appealing for me. Watching the Shermie trailer made me think, maybe paint doesn't taste all that bad after all?

“Lol sure” - a r.Mika player

my friend hates my Tina doa 6

*Laughs in SkullGirls*

@@Kami_Jojo Cerebella power

Then was he truly a grappler cause last time I checked command grabs have always been untechable?

@@monaco0042 It was Blazblue and he was playing Tager. If I remember correctly, you can tech command grabs if they’re part of a combo.

@@Boomerangofjustice yeah, 'gold throws' like in Under Night.

I never knew that, super cool

@@monaco0042 Depends on the game. In Tekken you can tech at specific points in various throws, like Lion's Rolling Death Cradle.

Yep, you instill a air of hopelessness, all while limiting options and chipping away at the lifebar/sanity.. And you corner them off. Brilliant! I dub this phenomenon the "Prison Shower" effect.. lol

​@@jasonelbow3807 Its conditioning, now like, conditioning is good for any playstyle, but when you live and die on reads like a Grappler, you condition and provoke

HEAVENLY!!!!

HEAVENLY!!!

POTEMKIN!!!!

...you better watch out, you better watch out, you better watch out, you better wa-...KO!...

Ikr?

I mainly play platform fighters like Smash and Rivals, but that why I love Zoners so much. A good Zoner can make you rethink your entire approach to a match. It dosen't matter if you can od a perfect 0 to Death if you have no gamesense. Same kinda goes for grapplers, but a little less so in Platform Fighters.

It's funny when you see someone try to cheese a grappler with fireballs only to watch the big man walk the poor sod into a corner

video made due to the fact so many FGC talking heads slandering grapplers lately. The fear in their hearts has not gone unnoticed.

@@rooflemonger Preach.

@@rooflemonger like you said they just felt stupid for getting command grab, that's why they hate them

@@xidjav1836 well then if you felt smart, you would not get command grabbed. So maybe its time for them to smarten up!!!

Yeah I know it's mostly memes but it's still annoying when people like leffen say shit like "grapplers should always be low tier, games aren't fun when grapplers are viable" and some proportion of the viewbase unironically believes it, probably fills and fills out the arcsys survey with salty tears still in their eyes

Grapplers: I see no god up here except me.

Wanna see me spd when I’m negative? Wanna see me do it again?

Ironically Grapplers are lowkey the most honest archetype in fighting games

Why have morality when we thrive better when there's a lack of it?

@@N1k0SP yeah keep telling them the lies. We need the propaganda!

Hell Yeah you ever played Kotal Kahn in MKX with the Sun God variation?? Ima Kotal Kahn dude myself

...scoopa!...Hagendaz, sucka!...

First time I tried sf4 I went straight to arcade mode on medium thinking I was gonna beat it with ryu. Zangeif came and put me in my place real quick🤣

"Get ready for the red cyclone"

@@joshgutteridge2909 SAME that’s why I hated him for the longest time 😂

That SPD jab grab range 🤕

Imagine someone with PTSD using Zangief?!! 🤕

“Work harder and think” you mean spam one move and win? I don’t want to watch an 10 hour documentary to have a chance against them

@@rohansensei5708 git gud

@@rohansensei5708 oof @ScrubQuotesX

@@rohansensei5708 homie you got that pot buster ptsd

@@rohansensei5708 I Can Feel The Salt. Feel The Glue Scrub

We were winning. We were winning against the grappler until suddenly, we started losing.

False senses of security are exactly what grapplers need to win a game. Without that, they are nothing, unless they have some other archetype's tools as well.

@@samuelevans738 False sense of security and/or fear. Grapplers want you to either be overconfident or afraid, because if you're overconfident or afraid, suddenly you're predictable, and then you eat dirt.

That's a very excellent point. The health and meter economy in a grappler match is fundamentally very different from any other playstyle. In other matches if you have the advantage in health and meter, and have the opponent in the corner, you are definitively in the lead and in control of the fight. With a grappler you can be at 80% and have a super stocked and they can be at 25%, but if they get the spacing and punish they need it's all out the window. They play around the physical field state more than the state of the bars in the HUD. This is unintutive to people used to seeing a health bar and super stock as an objective sign of being in an advantageous position so to them it feels cheap and they hate it.

Don't even get me started

Hes still godlike just a tone downed God

I don't understand why people complain about nerfing Potemkin in strive. He and Ramlethal were the best characters in the game.

@@으아아-x2q you just answered your own question

Potemkin is pretty good in ACR, though ironically I enjoy him more in Rev 2

I think thats a valid idea. But I'd counter (not you in particular. just anyone who thinks this) with the idea that grappler players often have to spend just as much time in training trying to get their very limited combos off but also learning how to handle the neutral game. Plus any player with an ounce of game knowledge will know the possibility of a grab coming. Therefore at least in my eyes you have to work for those grabs just as much as anyone else has to work to not drop their combo. Its just the suddenness of it that makes it so embittering I'd argue. Not to mention in most games the grappler's signature command grab won't combo and resets the game to neutral. Grapplers have to metagame even harder than other players which is why most of the funny clips are about the grappler guessing right or conditioning the opponent.

Preach. Them nerfing LaDiva in Granblue made me so sad

@@joncliffmckinley5868 tht shit hurt

Zangief getting his EX spd nerfed still hurts

Nevermind green hand 😭

The chipp vs pot match up has taught me to NEVER use unsafe strings against a grappler. Mfs will be buffering throw and get you the second they are slightly plus

@@canete571 This is why i miss slashback in GG. Being able to suddenly say "hahaha, you thought that blockstring was safe?" Then making someone eat a Pot Buster was the best feeling in the world

yeah, i beat pot most of the time with the characters i play but if i do lose to one i honestly just usually its because i got outplayed. putting that boy in the corner is fun times tho.

Its way too stressful tho

People hate grapplers because they can be in control of the match most of the time but then it all comes crumbling down when they get in and do stupid damage. It's not unfair but it feels unfair.

This. I usually play shotos (because is the easiest archetype that you can adapt in a game) but for Tekken i play King and never felt any hate towards him or even characters like R-Mika or Shermie. Is more like the "10 foot hyper-strong" stereotype that easily take half your lifebar and if the game isn't that refined can spam that move endlessly. Grapplers need to evolve in better tech and no just being the "Big ass guy that is a tank made of flesh"

@@prime98k4 well look at jax and soloman grundy from netherrealm studios they have strong command grabs and mix which i really do enjoy the feel of

Chaingrapplers in some way can still evoke that immense frustration though, they're usually balanced out by having you need to guess/recognize the moves and input the tech accordingly, at least that's how Tekken has done them. Those grapplers also usually have a much more "functional" kit, whereas grapplers such as Zangief, Pot, Iron Tager, etc, have big limitations imposed on them for their damage potential. I don't particularly think grapplers of this type are badly designed or broken, and I somewhat enjoy them, but I don't really see why they're so massively hated either.

Grapplers wouldn't be so hated if they didnt a full combo with super damage on a simple quarter back button grab

@@alanauelia7526 the things is, they're slow and need to be very close for that... So if you can't prevent the move, it's on you.

that shit is soo fucking lame, they shoudl never really be good except in kof when they are not fully a grappler

See that’s what makes grapplers so much fun, getting zoned out for 20 seconds to pull it back with one good read is incredible. On the flip side I really enjoy fighting grapplers, I love zoning characters so it’s a final exam of my evasive skills and how well I can weave into my own combos.

Personally, I'd rather die to three command grabs, as that way it's over, than watch you hit me for 20 seconds as I'm in your combo, waiting for you to end the combo. Both are the same effective thing, one just feels better to some individuals than others.

This is the mental problem. You think you are playing well, that a round is playing safe without consequences. Grapplers are the consequence. You make mistakes and you get punished. There is someone controlling the grappler, knowing you should beat them. Then you don't and you don't like that. This is the way of the grappler.

Yeah, but then there's the otherside where they face a zonner and they get camped out for the entire round, it's so boring to me, and land a grab feels so good

Sounds like good combos with Oki to me..

@@joncliffmckinley5868 I see the wisdom in your words

@@joncliffmckinley5868 oki at least gives you a chance to think about blocking. Plus you have options like pushblocking/burst/mashing

@@zero123alpha6 there's a tool called neutral jump which punishes command grabs in most every fighting game. Backdash is a thing. Yall act like grab oki is some arcane science when you've got the same number of options in most games and cases. And a smart grappler doesn't even go for the grab most of the time - you lure the opponent to blocking with strikes.. Kinda like a rush down character hitting you w high-low 50/50, and conditioning you to block one way or another.

@@joncliffmckinley5868 1) Are grapplers smart? Also 2(it's pretty hard to neutral jump or backdash on wakeup if your opponent is already doing the grab. For neutral jump, all you have to do is see what the opponent does after being grabbed (which is easier for grapplers since they have more hp) and anti-air grab. Or delay the grab to cover backdash. Plus, that grab isn't coming in from upclose, its coming if from like a step or 2 away, so there's almost always that threat in the corner.

I have a different experience. One of the first fighting games I've ever played is SF2 Hyper Fightering on an emulator during 2019 (I just wanted to dip my toes into a fighting game) and one of my first ai opponents was Zangief. Ya I was fighting an ai opponent but for someone who doesn't know how fighting games work Zangief was the perfect opponent to face of against because there is one simple rule to keep in mind. DONT LET HIM GET CLOSE TO YOU unlike other characters like Ryu, E. Honda, Blanka, etc who have special moves I would have a hard time understanding with all their weird fireballs, shoryuken, and charge motions I have to keep in mind.

@@FastJohn443 If the Gief touchs you, you die, nowhere is this more true then SF2 AI, which cheats, shaves off start up frames, and for the system grabs that have characters pummel, can cheat out possibly over 80% of your HP on one grab

@@syrelian Even tho the AI is cheating it doesn't ruin the fun of the game and the rule still stands, "keep him away so that he doesn't do a lot of damage". You don't deal with fireballs, shoryukens, or the opponents charge motion inputs.

Snakeeyez is an insane grappler player lol

Yeah a KoF grappler is absolutely very different in style than the usual. They can be small and fast(vice, shermie), on top of the usual big and slow.

@@rooflemonger we need El Fuerte back

@@joncliffmckinley5868 He had a bad balance technique though...

@@rensten4893 what technique you mean?

@@joncliffmckinley5868 He needs a better gameplay style than once built around knock downs. No OTG techniques, no real pressure tools, he is basically a one trick pony that needs more than a difficult infinite and hard knock downs to be competitive.

That too. Its rare for a grappler to be combo heavy and many people who don't like combos as much find their home in the grappler.

I like Terminator in MK11. He’s really simple, but effective.

THIS is why I love grapplers! I from a personal standpoint don't like them much, HOWEVER this kind of character means my fighting game friend, who enjoys fighting games but doesn't like to train learning large combos, can still have fun fighting me with my big ol combo strings :D

The only games where I don't play grapplers are Blazblue and Samsho. Because in Blazblue Haku-Men exists, and in SamSho EVERY character plays like how I like to play. It's not about execution, it's about getting inside your opponents mind and waiting for them to screw up, and then you eat their entire lifebar for it

@@rooflemonger This!!!! I fit this perfectly lol. I can do combos, but sometimes in stressful situations, the combo can be dropped. Command grabs on the other hand, that lands and that does about the same of a good combo or more. I think about it like this...heavy combo characters are like machine gun bullets....command grabs are like up close shotgun blasts or grenade launchers/rockets being shot a point blank lmao

Yeah I will admit..soo satisfying playing grapplers...till you have to play against them yourself.. it never any fun when the rabbit has the gun. Lol

"Grapplers are easy to counter bro, just jump" I proceed to jump amd get antiair command grab into oblivion.

Grapplers are the most honest. No projectiles, no big combos, easy to hit, slow moves, you rushdown players wouldn't understand.

@@NSFSponsor HALF YOUR LIFE IN ONE HIT, pot has flick and floating screen projectiles, and he has heavenly

@@Scragg- Tbf that's strive damage. But flick does not go full screen, and is a projectile reversal. That's like saying gief can't have green hand, he could use some type of anti zoning tool.

@@NSFSponsor you just said no projectiles, he has projectiles. And it’s not just strive damage play ac+r it’s not much less damage

Oh absolutely. Axl and Gio in Strive are still my biggest hurdles for that exact reason.

@@CesarGonzalez-bw2hz I have a friend who mains baiken, but they're sides are ramlethal giovanna and I already got him pre tilt after the first grab so if he is losing he swaps and from what I can tell you is to spam the shit out of 6p and use heavenly to get out of corners and 6p into buster if it connects is usually how I deal with gio, but for ramlethal, may God be on your side

Are ferry dhalsim poison dizzy and axl not zoners?

@@frothyslider253 easier to get past opposed to Deathstroke imo

@@Manlygenius101 I think that’s more about NRS being bad at game design

@@frothyslider253 could be, on the bright side ferry, dhalsim, ect have hotboxes on their tools. Unlike Deathstroke, which that character hurts my soul lol

@@leithazizpagy4699 nawh see Sim and ferry are both zoners the thing is there are 2 major types of zoners. The projectile based like guile and dizzy And the limb based which is where axl ferry and sim fit. They both have the same plan jus a twist on how its done.

justin wong is a scrub apparently? thats where i hear most grappler slander from

@@gobthor6181 He PLAYS grapplers. He's trying to bullshit people with that nonsense but he doesn't actually believe it.

First off, a grappler can't make "a million mistakes" relative to other archetypes. They will, at most, have 30% more health than the average character, usually 10 or 20%. It can be a lot of stray hits, but its at most one extra combo. I always hear people say "you have to play completely differently" when fighting grapplers, but what do you actually mean by that? Neutral is the same, in fact its easier on a lot of characters because a grappler's tools in neutral are almost always risky, or if they are low risk, they don't reward much. Defense isn't very different either, its a 50/50, but instead of like a left/right or a high/low, the emphasis is on block/ throw, something every character in the game has as a mixup. Is it when you attack a grappler on offense? Because if you block next to them when you're minus you can get thrown?

Bro, I said I disliked playing against them. I didn't say anything bad about the archetype. Chill. I understand their necessity to fighting games and I welcome the archetype. Doesn't mean I ever have to enjoy the experience.

I agree. People also talk smack about rushdown characters like they don't have to take any risks either. The risk/reward just feels so skewed when you're fighting against an archetype that often has the highest health in the game and is designed around making you guess. I understand that grapplers aren't cheap, but I don't have to pretend they're fun to play against either.

You just don’t like losing to low tiers 😎

Disagree. A good zoner will make you approach all of your defensive and movement options differently.

@@joncliffmckinley5868 Movement, sure, but you're still just going to be blocking a lot, heck most zoners I can think of don't really even mix up much so your defensive instinct to block attacks works even better.

@@Mantafirefly you still block a lot vs a good grappler, while also using your jumps and dashes to avoid grabs. Kinda like high/low/unblockable zoning.

I consider myself a very defensive player by nature. You know who works great with a defensive playstyle? GRAPPLERS so time to switch over

@@rooflemonger dammit you're right noooooooo

I only find trouble with this statement because most grapplers can and will turtle constantly in a blockstring, only to break free with a command grab that is not only impossible to tech, but also can't be stuffed with a button, or throw out a move that has super armor and completely screw over the corner pressure that you were trying to keep them in. Grapplers get to block, you don't, the moment you throw out a button to keep them away, your limb hets command grabbed. You empty jumped to avoid the command grab? Better hope they don't have an air grab or an armor move that can stuff your j button and lead to ridiculous damage. Being forced to chip away at a grappler while sweating bullets the entire time while in comparison the grappler can shut you down multiple different ways and you literally can't do anything about it. The ball is literally in the grappler's court from the character select screen.