One thing I believe the video forgot to mention, there aren’t a lot of great fighting types in this format while many of the best Pokémon are weak to fighting like Arch, Gambit, Incin, P2, Ursa, Ttar, etc. Fighting is such a great typing right now Flamigo was popular at one stage.
@@ofmoosenmen Costar was NOT why flamigo was used to p2 ursa teams. It was a intim immune fighting type that could hit ghost types specifically dengo, with fighting stab (due to scrappy) and it could sit next to ursa and let it spam eq while scaring away rilla w/grassy terrain. On top of that other had wide guard for psyspam teams. Basically costar sees no use except on cheesy af muk smeargle teams
As Nails put it, Pokémon are allowed to break one rule maximum, and Urshifu breaks two rules- ignoring protect and ignoring stat drops. Sneasler is good, but it’s manageable, it has a 4x weakness and is a lot frailer generally, and it has to respect intimidate. I was theory crafting gliscor as a Sneasler check because it resists both stabs, is immune to status, had good natural physical bulk and stab dual wingbeat to break sash. Someone then actually brought a similar set to the last EU regionals and day 2ed with it lol
@@banditrests .. they might also prevent you from ever getting poisoned if they hit you first (higher chance than poisoning with unburden) so I wouldn't say that as a bonus exactly
For me it’s definitely Urshifu being worse. Sneasler has strong counteplay against it - Lum berry, electric types, covert cloak, PROTECT, intimidate etc. Urshifu bypasses protect (the easiest way to stop damage) and bypasses stat drops (the second easier way to stop damage), and even bypasses damage halving berries, since you’d have to be water weak, get hit by surging strike and NOT Tera beforehand.
@@asierx7047 raging bolt, rillaboom, flutter mane, amoonguss, the incredibly high number of fighting-resistant rocky helmet users etc. woger was a good answer, but not even close to the only one
Which is worse? Easily Urshifu for one simple fact, Sneasler will not stay relevant. As stated, Sneasler had all these same tools and options back in Regulation D but it just couldn't keep up with the power level that was going around. If Sneasler gets too unhealthy for the VGC format then all they have to do is up the power level enough for the next regulation and it will become either manageable or maybe even irrelevant. Sneasler is a temporary problem within the current generation, Urshifu however is a looming threat that will eventually be let back into the game and once Urshifu is no longer banned it *is* the powercreep, and the only way to keep it out of a format is to either ban it (which as they've typically shown that overtime the rules tend to expand to let more powerful pokemon in) or wait until the next generation. No matter how bad or unhealthy Sneasler is, it cannot maintain it's hold over VGC long-term and those who think Sneasler is worse will be free from worrying about it, the same cannot be certain of Urshifu.
just like joseph ugarte said it would be relevant even if the format change double fighting type in a team is not a problem at all so both urshifu and sneasler could be play on 1 team
Pretty much every single mon banned by smogon that isn't a legendary has proven itself to be quite great in VGC as well. Annhileape, Archaludon, Ursa blood moon, Palafin etc have all proven themselves great at some point in VGC. Most are still pretty viable now as well
@@Eroil while this is often true, there are plenty of pokemon that overperform in singles compared to doubles. Espathra and shed tail cyclizar to name a few
I’m going to still go with Urshifu being worse for the game. Protect is so essential in helping to keep the pace of the game from being too overwhelming for players. It’s such a key, defensive move to prevent the game from becoming all-out offense. Invalidating Protect is way too dangerous. Even measures to bypass Protect in the past (mainly Feint) are restricted in being weak attacks. Urshifu can just go straight through a Protect with a full powered Close Combat. And Sneasler may have coverage, but at least Ghost types are immune/resistant to both of its STABs. No single type resists both of Urshifu’s. Countering it becomes far more niche because of that.
Sometimes a little competition for number 1 is a healthy thing and leads to more variety. Comps, counter comps and counter-counter comps are sure to make their rounds which could make things really interesting
I really liked Sneasler when I first saw it, even more when I started using it on Showdown, and I was absolutely through the roof when I found out Regulation H would give it a chance to be great. Still amazed at how well it is doing. Sorry I wished for this.
I’m not everyone. I actually love Sneasler. It’s actually my first shiny Pokémon when I first got PLA! I got bashed for liking it because they didn’t like the design! Now either those people are getting karma or I am getting bashed even more for just liking Sneasler. Plus, I want to try a Bulky Supportive Tailwind/Safeguard/Multiscale Dragonite for the Global Challenge in case I run into one to counter it, but I don’t know who to partner it up with.
I love Sneasler from a design standpoint, and even as a Mon (stats and typing) it's awesome. But Dire Claw is legitimately the dumbest thing they've added to the game for a little while... But most importantly why does it ALWAYS proc the sleep?!
Fun fact: Dire Claw has the highest Sleep secondary effect chance of any move (as of Grassy Terrain Secret Power being axed in Gen 8) The second highest - and also lowest - is Meloetta's Relic Song at just 10%
The funniest part is that Sneasler has almost the same stat spread as Weavile, meaning its basically her but with an ability that pushes the cheapness to beyond (plus also having a good dual typing).
Eviolite boosts both defenses by 50%; that makes it an amazing Follow Me sponge, letting its partner attack unhindered; Follow Me + Vital Spirit shuts down Spore Amoonguss; Overheat is good one-time burst damage; and Will o' Wisp decommissions most physical attackers I'm sure there's more to it. But these are some of the reasons why Magmar and Electabuzz are great picks for VGC right now!
I wonder is Sneasler would be better for the game if they banned Dire Claw instead of Sneasler themself. Also surprised that there was no fling + Big Nugget + unburden set mention.
There’s not a lot of dark weak Pokémon in the format that you’re not better off hitting with Tera dark throat chop, except maybe Gholdengo if it doesn’t Tera steel
@@VulturineValkyrieThis video is about vgc. We dont outright ban anything in vgc. We just have rotating formats that change who is allowed on a limited basis
Dire Claw is my only issue with Sneasler. I really like everything else it brings to the format. I like the rise of coaching sets, and fake out poison touch is neat. I also like that as good as it is; it's pretty easy to counter
There is a special place in hell for the person who thought making a move that has a 1/6th chance to sleep and a 1/6th chance to paralyze WHILE also having the BP of regular moves was a good idea. Even if the move is nerfed in Gen 10, Paralysis no longer stunning but having old speed reduction, Sleep becoming Snooze, and/or the move becoming 50-60 BP, they are still going to hell.
As somebody that was using Sneasler prior to the new regulation set, I've been thoroughly enjoying the shenanigans with it. Terrain seeds + Unburden is a fun time.
Urshifu 100 percent, ignoring protect is just such a fundamental disregard for how the game is supposed to function. Sneasler is just super rng which sucks ass but isn’t disregarding the fundamentals of VGC
When I first saw this video, I was surprised people didn’t like sneasler. The moment he brought up dire claw I remembered how much I hate that move, so I see why everyone doesn’t like sneasler
I use a sneasler with persim berry then i use a prankster mon to swagger it It gets a +2 boost, when it gets confused it eats the berry, unburden activates and acrobatics is doubled and gives more power with tera flying, it becomes a nuclear missile
My hotpick is Sneasler with liechi Berry + endure Stuff ohkos resists with close combat and if you're greedy you can run SD + stabs + endure to destroy anything
Sneasler feels like what would happen if the competitive designs of Urshifu and Flutter Mane had a kid. Just a Pokemon with a really minmaxed stat spread with some really busted signature attributes. The key ingredients to designing a Gen 9 Pokemon.
@@PinkaholicOfficial the irony is that Smogon banned Sneasler not for its Dire Claw RNG; they banned it for the sheer consistency of its SD Tera Flying Unburden set that was basically Hawlucha on steroids while still having STAB Gunk Shot to destroy things like Zapdos and Unaware Clefable
i think sneasler is probably worse, it has a lot more counterplay than urshifu but a 50% chance to inflict a debilitating status as a secondary effect is imo even more ridiculous than ignoring protect or stat drops since even with perfect play and all the right tools to win you can still lose to luck. urshifu is broken but it has very little variance, if you have two solid checks on the field then it's not gonna do anything crazy, but unless you really go out of your way to status proof (which is usually a waste of resources that f*cks up other matchups) sneasler can always find a way to win if it gets lucky enough. you also have to remember that it hits like a truck, so anything that counters dire claw hax also needs to comfortably eat your excellent stab combo and whatever coverage move you're running, and unless you're running ariados or venemoth that's not happening
I dunno if you can really quantify which one is worse for the game because they're in two different formats, but in a format where both are allowed, but only one really sees use, that kind of pushes me to think that one's the more problematic one.
I feel like Urshifu is good for the game once it gets nerfed. Either damage through protect is reduced, or even a worse nerf, make surging strikes and wicked blow non-contact moves (doesn’t fit thematically but hey it’s a nerf)
It's hard being a Sneasler enjoyer. I just like its design, typing, and sassy attitude. If people aren't hating it for being different from Weavile, it's because of its competitive dominance.
Id agrue theres a bit of irony between Urshifu and Sneasler. Sneasler isnt broken but is inconsistent with Dire Claw. Urshifu is really consistent but is...well broken isnt the right word but ita harder to manage sonce it ignores defense and attack drops and goes through protect.
The one thing that tilts me about dire claw is that it doesn't really justify its existance outside of being a marginal upgrade over poison jab. If dire claw didn't exist, sneasler would still be an excellent pokemon, dire claw just sends it over the edge.
I prefer Urshifu to Sneasler because it's consistent and therefore is easier to play around. Meanwhile, trying to account for RNG from Dire Claw is so limiting that it isn't fun.
Saying "Lum Berry and Covert Cloat is a counter to Dire Claw" is like saying, "Evasion isn't busted, just run Aerial Ace or Swift" on paper it might be a counter, but we know in practice it's not. Plus you're restricted to one Lum Berry and one Covert Cloak per team.
@@hailthequeenFM I think they're fine as counters to Dire Claw, the problem is honestly just the combination of things that Sneasler has going for it. Close Combat + Dire Claw on the same fast, strong attacker is polarizing. Dire Claw does still need a nerf, no doubt.
50% chance of inflincting a status, paralisies and SLEEP included, is crazy, expecially on a strong stab moves on a mon with 130 atk that can double its already high speed. Rng is bad, rng on an already food Pokémon is insane idk what gamefreak was thinking when creating this thing.
incineroar literally make the game a lot more balance if inci doesn't exist calyrex would be a lot more powerful pokemon who usually hold clear amulet would run other item
It's possible for Sneasler to feel worse to play against, while Urshifu is still more broken. Sneasler was legal in Reg G, there is exactly zero argument for it being as broken as urshifu when urshifu had 40% use stats and sneasler had 0.4%. They are not in the same league, and it isn't close.
Terrible take Tuesday- on paper, venomoth hard counters Sneasler, as it is 4x resistant to fighting, resists poison, is immune to being poisoned and immune to flinch and secondary effects if it has shield dust. In practice, no one do this, venomoth has terrible stats and will just die to it’s partner.
For a Pokémon with a 4x weakness this is pretty impressive. Shouldn’t a psychic move be able to take it out easily? Because really an even faster Pokémon that has access to psychic moves should be able to take it out.
Psychic is just a really terrible typing in general, but specially so in the current regulation, with gholdengo, kingambit and incineroar being so abundant. The most used psychic types are probably either Indeedee-F or Farigiraf, and they're both pretty support oriented mons.
Why do i have the feel, while i dont play competitivo netbattle since gen6, that people have become a bit intolerant to certain Pokémon just being op but ypu have to deal with it? Sneaseler is unpredictable? So was lucario/mega lucario and infernape on release. Urshifu is predictable but you cant stop it? Mega kangaskhan and chlorophil venusaur. I see sneasler and i cant fandom how it can be banned... I could see blaziken in gen V, but not sneasler
At least Urshifu is consistent in it’s stupidity, like you can play around him because you know what he can do Sneaseler is inconsistently stupid, some games you might just lose turn one because it clicked dire claw and happened to get a sleep proc before you can even move
@@gittesanddahl9873 that’s my point tho I’d rather go against Urshifu who can do that every time than a who might just drop the fastest sleep in the game
Urshifu has been a menace since release and without any drawback and very little counterplay. Sneasler has found a niche moment in this meta to shine (VGCwise) but has not been good until now. Besides, Gholdengo nullifies it
Wait are actually debating if urshifu or sneasler worse??? That’s so dumb, atleast with sneasler you can stop his shenanigans with covert cloak reliably while you can never stop urshifu’s
you can't stop urshifu but you can win a lead against it while on sneasler case even if you win the lead once one if your mon got status by sleep its basically a 1 vs 2 and its a guaranteed win 90% of the time
I think Urshifu is still worse. Sneasler can completely upset a gane for no reason, but Urshifu broke so many rules and ignored so many staples of VGC. It'd be one thing if it were a rule change that affected the way the game was played, but just one mon being the clear pinnacle because it doesn't have to play the game everyone else is playing is FAR worse.
I will never not believe Urshifu is the worst thing to come to competetive Pokemon. Guaranteed crits AND hits through protect? It's completely busted and needs to remove unseen fist from the game entirely.
Sneasler was always good, people were just blinded by Urshifu and Iron hands before. They didn't want to put the effort to experiment with Sneasler, when Urshifu and Iron hands were there and proven to work. I know this because I had a Sneasler + Zapdos core which I used to counter the very popular Urshifu + Tornadus core. It had a very high winrate against that opening too.
