Why I Hate Evil Superman 

Enough of evil Superman. I hope James Gunn make things right with Superman.

2013 me : oh cool a evil Superman game that’s interesting 2024 : I’m so tired of evil Superman

My biggest problem with evil Superman is how out of character it feels for him to go evil when tragedy strucks like really?

I remember hearing somewhere that a subversion of Superman feels pointless since Superman already is a subversion of "power always corrupts"

This is why I love Red Son, he’s not some generic “evil” Superman, he’s just the same Superman we all know and love, just raised in a different place and way of life.

"A farm boy's wholesome values vs big-city cynicism and corruption" is an integral theme of Superman, and here's the proof: Even if a writer is clever enough to tamper with this trope and write a great story, you're still left with the feeling that you haven't read an actual Superman story.

It's interesting how evil Superman trope started as a subversion, but ended up becoming so mainstream that now making a genuinely in-character Superman adaptation is considered a subversion.

A general problem with heroes becoming villains is that so often they develop a completely different personality to the point that they might as well be a different character. There's no emotional impact to these evil Supermen because there's nothing uncanny about them. They don't act like Superman or say things he would say. They're just generically evil. Interestingly, this never seems to be a problem when bad guys become good guys. They still get to be themselves. Vegeta is still proud and arrogant, Doom is still vain and condescending, etc.

Wait, Batman's sunny disposition does work. Adam West proved that.

My distaste for evil Superman (Superman is my favorite fictional character ever created) is why Superman vs The Elite is my favorite Superman movie (so far), because it's a pretty damn effective deconstruction of evil Superman/evil super"heroes" in general as well as a reconstruction of good Superman.

Fun fact: Thinking that Superman can and will always be evil is the mentality of Lex Luthor.

People call Superman boring or boy scouty is because people don’t really value morality these days

I wouldn't even hate it as much if it weren't so damned overplayed. It's like every six weeks, someone walks into the office at DC with the mind-eraser thing from Men in Black and goes "Hey guys, I've got an idea! What if Superman....was a BAD GUY?!"

We already have an evil Superman that works. He's called Ultraman, and he comes from Earth Three.

One of the biggest problems with the Snyder movie in regards to Jonathan Kent is that he dies saving a dog. In the comics he dies from a heart attack or some natural death. A natural death to Jonathan shows that Superman has limits. He can save people from disasters but not from disease. The human mortality happens no matter what. Time will eventually kill a person and all the powers Superman has can’t prevent that. This is something Snyder didn’t understand and something Donner did understand.

It's funny, I actually consider Superman to be who he really is rather than Clark Kent, but in a different way from how most people would see it: to me, "Superman" is the embodiment of everything the Kents taught him about being a good person and how to use his gifts. So, Superman is his real self but not because his Kryptonian side is more important, Superman is still his "human" side, in that it's the embodiment of the values he was taught by his very human parents. His "Kryptonian side" is Kal-El, who is neither Clark nor Superman.

1:02,Just an idea,i think it'd be better in this scene if instead of clark saying ''if i wanted it,you'd be dead already.'' he said,''Batman,stop. I don't like hurting people''

I think a big problem with Injustice’s potrayals of an evil Superman is that you don’t have a lot in game to sympathize with, at least in Clark’s actual actions and dialogue. This where the Injustice comics really shine, because they show that downfall, and how Superman slowly lost his morals more and more, and went from a hero to an antihero to a villain

I’ve seen more evil Superman nowadays than the super chill, wholesome, down to earth Superman I’ve always enjoyed just a guy with the power to do literally anything apologizing for being late for work or helping a kid find their cat.

It just makes me sad when I hear people say, "I wasn't interested in Superman until MoS came out," "Snyder made me care about Superman," or "DCEU Superman is the best Superman because of how "realistic" it is." If that's the case, then you don't understand Superman fundamentally and what he's supposed to be and represent.

Great video! The way I imagine Superman is that he's smiling as he's saving people. He loves people, and he enjoys being able to save them and does so willingly and happily.

I always found making Superman a villain or a metaphor for Jesus just lazy writing I always liked when hes a friend as well as a good person I hope we get this in James Gunns Superman Legacy

Evil Superman is such an oveused trope at this point, and I definitely hate the concept of evil Superman. Regular Superman has shown that powerful people can still be good people who can inspire others to be better. Evil Superman just takes away from what makes Superman such a special and great superhero and person. Not to mention that evil Superman doesn't improve on Superman's character at all. An evil version of Superman is just a terrible thought and even a scary thought when you think about it, since if Superman ever was evil, it would be a bad thing for all humanity. I do agree that turning Superman evil just shows how depressing humanity is as a whole because Superman's goodness comes from how he was raised on Earth. Take that away from Superman, and it just makes humanity look bad. There's a reason why the evil versions of Superman tend to be relegated to DC elseworld stories. Evil Superman just ISN'T Superman.

1 thing I have in mind about whole Evil Superman concept is that, it really shows how much world has changed for last 90 years. Superman, in way we know him, was originally created as symbol of hope at time, when world was expecting for Big War to come. Back then, he was Hope. But after 9/11, Superheroes became just another source of fear, with Power they had. That's where The Boys and Invinsible got created, and that's when Evil Superman moved from being Mind-Controlled by others, to being evil by himself. Kind of scary to think about it

This is part of what makes Kingdom Come so interesting. We get Joker killing Lois but what makes Superman retire is the people cheering on another "hero" for killing the clown.

Evil Superman can be good, its just way too overdone.

What annoys me is that they keep ignoring the real evil Superman, Ultraman. They all these different ideas through him, but Earth 3 doesn’t get the same love and attention that used to.

Batman's popularity surpasses Superman's due to the complexity of his character. Despite his brooding demeanour, he is still considered a great hero.

I always thought an evil Batman would be more compelling and believable than an evil Superman. Injustice would’ve been a much better story if Bruce became the dictator instead of Clark.

Evil Superman is best described as taking Clark Kent's humanity away from him.

Shin Ultraman is what modern Superman supposed to be. No, not the evil Superman with a U on his chest. A silver giant hero from the land of light. I really want you to cover it, no pressure.

When you think about it, the Man of Steel's Superman was raised differently from the many other supermen. Clark in many stories is raised with the idea "If a good man sees injustice, and misfortune, a good man helps." Where Man of Steel, Jonathan constantly fed the message "You are meant from something great so you cannot help others and reveal your powers." So it makes sense that MoS Superman feels like an alien because he was raised with the idea that he is some Messiah figure who has to constantly hide himself and as such could not form connections with people.

I think one of my biggest problems is that all these evil Superman versions are all just the generic superpowered god complex villain in love with their own power and believe every other being is beneath them, it’s the same villain you have seen countless times just pretending to be unique because “ now it’s superman, dundundun”. My favorite version of the evil Superman is ultraman from crisis on two earths (I know owl man often gets the spotlight but he is just as interesting) and that’s because he ACTUALLY an evil mirrored version of Clark. Clark/supes whole thing is the despite his grand power he is just the average Good Samaritan jus ton a grand scale, ultraman by comparison is just the average thug/punk just put on a grand level. Like take the moment where he threatens the president to know his place, it’s treated less as a god threatening a lowly human but more as a mobster shaking some “protection money” from a business, even The crime syndicate acts more like a gang rather than superpowered overlords. (Additionally, as Clark was eased in Kansas/farm boy ultraman has a slight Brooklyn/New Yorker accent. Two major places representing American life but with two majorly different contexts and perceptions) this is why he is probably the only good version because he reflects aspects of Clark and uses the evil equivalents of that/elements of the character that make the most sense

I blame that 12-year-old in a man's body, Zach Snyder. The idea existed before him, but it was more sparingly used until he went and screwed it all up with his need to be "edgy" and also not get the character _nor_ what could be compelling about inverting a well-known character. And how to use that idea _competently._ Any use of an "Evil Superman" requires juxtaposition. It's not interesting in a vacuum. If everyone in the narrative world is just as dour and uncaring and selfish... then it's just a miserable world. People often critique The Boys here, because of Homelander, and fair enough it is a prime example of Evil Superman. But he actually is the _antagonist_ of the story and not the POV character. Additionally, you have the contrasting character of Starlight. So you can still honor the hopefulness of a Superman character, but you've just moved that trait to a less powerful character so now it's a different kind of story. When not oversaturated as a trope, the concept can be used to pretty good effect to have an exploration of what unchecked power looks like -- that while the fantasy of Superman is nice, in reality we have to be wary about assuming that someone with power will just be a good guy, and why it's important to check power. But also it can be a good vehicle for showing why we need to interrogate _ourselves_ if/when we wind up in a position of power. Normal Superman can teach this message, but for some it's important to show the counter as well and why we shouldn't be careful of who we turn into. So, again, Evil Superman is a perfectly fine kind of character when used with care. But we live under capitalism and so anything that is interesting and liable to sell tickets/subscriptions will get oversaturated and misused and run into the ground. A lot of instances of this trope can wind up not even having a message beyond "isn't it cool how powerful this evil dude is?! Did you see all the gore?!" And _that_ is a problem.

The thing is when there are evil versions of superheroes you often get warped corrupted heroes that could challenge the originals methods With evil superman he’s just, a superman that failed which is why the best evil supermen, are entirely different characters

I'm sick of the whole "evil superheroes" trope because it's just so damn cynical that people can't choose to be good.

To quote one of my favorite Superman TAS episodes of all times. Jonathan Kent: He just can't be Clark Kent anymore. Clark: But I am Clark Kent. I need to be Clark Kent. I'd go crazy if I'd have to be Superman all the time. This is understanding Clark's character.

One of my favourite comments on Clark/Kal-El/Superman's personality comes from Batman: "In many ways, Clark is the most human of us all. Then he shoots fire from the skies, and it's difficult _not_ to think of him as a God. And how fortunate we all are that it never occurs to him." *That* is pretty central to who he is, and it sums him up very succinctly (as Batman is wont to do). He's not a 'God', he's just a man, doing his best for the good of all. It's just that his 'best' happens to be better than most others, simply due to the feats he can accomplish.

I do however like the idea of changing Supeman's origin/upbringing and showing how it impacts his values and decisions later on in life

I think It stems from a trend of some disliking characters that are genuinely good ppl i.e. finding them 'unrealistic ' (whatever that means) and/or boring. I just wish they wouldn't change up superman to make him more 'interesting' or 'better'. I think it's slowly becoming better now tho since fans are starting to miss generic good guy heros. Videos like yours help too imo.

Thank Rao for My Adventures with Superman. You have no idea how happy I was to see a new piece of Superman media where he actually acts like the classic Big Blue Boy Scout. Here's to hoping that James Gunn's Superman: Legacy is great so we can FINALLY have a good big screen Superman for the general audience.

Snyder-Verse trying to push “muh evil Superman” was trite the first second they showed it. It’s a tired, worn out trope at this point. Leave it at the Justice Lords from the Animated Series and only that, DC.

I just always like to point this out: What Superman did to Zod in the comics is far, far worse than what he did in Man of Steel.

Liked MoS for the action and effects, but yeah, that portray of Clark is what bugged me. ANother thing Snyder got wrong, in my humble opinion, was having Jonathan Kent die in a way CLark could have save him..

He is Born as Kal-El but rise as Clark Kent and his alter Ego IS Superman, is what is true Superman but the Man of steel got all wrong!

Ya evil Superman is just lazy writing and shows that the writer has no idea what Superman is actually like.

Remember when Superman TAS showed an alternate universe where Lois died and Superman was manipulated by Lex to support a fascist regime but when Clark realized he was lied to about what was really going on he turned on Lex and tried to fix his mistakes?

6:28 "Superman is what I can do, Clark is who I am" Lois and Clark, the new adventures of Superman explain it perfectly

I like evil superman, but he's way overused

Superman and Lois is the closest thing to the True Superman we all know and love. And that’s a shame because there’s a perfect template for a great movie but Hollywood likes to trash anything that’s good.

I'm sick of him too. I prefer the optimistic, wholesome and humble version of the character.

That’s exactly why I love Superman vs the Elite, it shows the notion of an evil Superman but quickly pulls the rug and shows that it was all an act, as Superman would never just become evil

While Omniman and Invincible draw inspiration from Superman, they are distinct characters in their own right. They serve as symbols of a national ideal, inspiring others to strive for greatness and embody the virtues they represent.

I feel we have an evil Superman already, and it’s General Zod, he’s the alien ability without the humanity while Superman is the human with the abilities of an alien. General Zod is the Superman without holding back, Superman is the Superman with him holding back.

Heroes and villains are not technical terms. In reality, people's actions and intentions are not always black or white, and can often be complex and nuanced. Although Superman is often regarded as the epitome of pure goodness, it is important to acknowledge that even he may be challenged in certain situations. It is a common belief that under extreme agitation, even the most virtuous individuals can behave in ways that are uncharacteristic of them.

A comment that i saw resumes Superman well for me is “Superman is not a hero you can identify with. It’s a hero who you can take inspiration from”

“He is the embodiment of truth, justice and the American way, guided by human kindness in a world that sees kindness as old-fashioned” - James Gunn

I absolutely DETEST both Evil Superman and this Idiotic desire to make him "Cool, Dark & Edgy." To me, he is a representation of every HACK "writer" who has zero business writing for a character that they don't know Jack Squat about, even more disturbing the idea that they want people to empathize and relate with THAT type of a monstrous misrepresentation; It kind of says a lot about the quality of character of those HACK "writers." You change ANY aspect of Superman's core; he ceases to be SUPERMAN. Every single time Dolts like Zack Snyder think they can make these changes based on their own infantile lack of sense; they FAIL every single time. I am not against the concept of the "evil superman" provided that they are essentially a pastiche, i.e. an ORIGINAL CHARACTER not in any way resembling Clark Kent. What makes me laugh at the sheer idiocy of these HACKS is that they are so desperate to have an Evil Superman, they ignore the fact they already have an Evil Superman; HIS NAME IS GENERAL ZOD!!! To a lesser degree: BIZZARO. Nope, they need to tarnish Clark Kent because they are 100% GARBAGE Talents.

Kingdom Come is a great example of a Superman who lost Lois Lane and became a bit darker but still remained a hero and an example of hope for humanity and other heroes.

It is not just Evil Superman, but most media with a Superman standin makes him evil. I remember watching a review by Captain Midnight of My Hero Academia. Captain Midnight does not watch anime, but his watchers talked him into reviewing My Hero Academia, because of the superhero theme. He was expecting the Superman standin, All Might, to be revealed to be evil. He was waiting and waiting, and did not happen. Captain Midnight even namedropped Homelander and Omni Man for comparison. It was not some sort of meta commentary about the state of superhero stories, Captain Midnight was just reviewing media from outside his comfort zone and was confused by the lack of familiar tropes. Point is, Evil Superman has become the norm and Good Superman the subversion.

I'm really glad people are starting to respect Superman again, he was always my favorite superhero as a kid. In an age of nihilism and negativity we honestly need someone bright like Superman to look up to. No more evil supermen or moral ambiguity, let Superman actually be a hero again.

If any director wants to make Superman not boring or evil then they should that inspiration from Batman and Superman Public Enemies. That movie has one of the best Superman adaptations in the 21st century

Superman was created by two children of immigrants. Both were part of a minority that was actively discriminated against in America and that was at the time being actively exterminated in Europe. Both grew up poor. The dream Clark came to represent in those early stories was that a refugee could be adopted, and loved. That this adopted child raised on a farm in small town America could come to the big city and do good. Both as a crusading reporter, which was a common style of pulp hero at the time, and as a two fisted costumed adventurer. That the immigrant could successfully assimilate. That he could fight the evils oppressing working people, and get away with it because he was bulletproof. Look at his earliest adventures. Stopping a wife beater. Fighting the gangs that made life miserable for ordinary people. Stopping crooked landlords and war profiteers. The adventures got wilder. More fantasy and Science Fiction elements kept being introduced as more writers got in on the character. World War II turned up the patriotism, the comics code authority limited depictions of violence and other more realistic elements, The Donner films added and turned up the Jesus allegory, etc. It has been a long road. But that dream of doing good, even though the powerful try to stop you; of being an outsider yet being embraced and loved for your differences; of having the power to help people. And, of course, of being the small town kid who comes to the big city and finds somebody who represents the very best of that city who loves you. That is a great dream. It’s a great story. Characters like Homelander and Omni man are not “evil Superman“. They are evil kryptonians. They are what you get when you have the power set but not the kindness.

People just refuse that someone with than much power can use said power for the benefit of their fellow neighbour, they took the saying "Absolute Power corrupts absolutely" as an absolute truth not taking into account that a lot of DC heroes,specially Superman are an idealistic point we should strive to be

This is such a problem that in the Batman wiki, Superman is classified as one of Batman’s rogues

Best way to describe superman is like the scooby doo show turning into velma. Apart from some of the looks you're basically just making a completely different character (not saying evil superman can never work but it requires time and dedication as well as making him maintain the same qualities which is kinda hard to do)

The biggest issue for me when it comes to the laundry list of evil Superman stories and character-types is that it always comes from a place a cynicism from the writers and the people who love these stories. This isn't my quote but it sums up the issue pretty succinctly: "It's become easier to believe a man could fly over that a man could be this good".

Finally! someone who understands what Superman is about! Snyder should not EVER get near any Character! let him destroy his own characters! I'm so tired of all the modifications that's being done to the character that destroy what he is about...

Earth-3's ultraman really paints a good picture of a clark raised wrongly

Evil Superman looks interesting for a teen that thinks everyone is good by default and thinks of him as an samaritan alien. Superman is inspirational to an adult because we actually understand how hard it is to stay commited to his idealistic ideas power or not.

I am personally tired of evil Superman and frankly I have lost my patience a long time ago, and personally for me I am more of a fan Superman Clark Kent and Lois lane being married and they have there son Jonathan Samuel Kent superboy as his little 10 year old self being a great family in my opinion.

Evil Super-man is the cause of why people think super-man uninteresting as a character. When he doesn't have a moral compass all charisma, intrigue, and personality. I absolutely hate it when someone says he's a plank of wood because they obviously know nothing of his source material.

Modernity has diluted superman with current dayism, he is a paragon that all people can strive for!

the evil superman has ruined my interpertion of superman and i hate it

Most people think that Lois is what makes Superman human, but is the Kents. And is not that hard, every single good adaptation has excellent Johnathan and Martha Kent, like Lois and Clark, Superman the Movie, Smallville, and Superman and Lois.

There is a nail. It has a head. You hit it. Excellent video.

Why Kingdom Come superman is strong and Injustice is weak , budget ass ip for people who can't be bothered to read

First things first, I must say I loved your video, and your editing and narratuon is top notch. However, I must humbly disagree with your point, and similar to all the majority of comments under this video. In fact, I believe the thought process of "vilifying" or "anti-herofying" characters like Superman (& Batman too if you're a fan of Snyderverse like me!) Is extremely complex, which even though the esecution at times is jarring, make it all worth for me. For a spell, I'm not a writer or close to any worker in the DC headquarters, but, I can tell you the complicated, and well thought-out proccess of making a character adaptation os this magnitude is of a akin similar to this: "HE GOOD GUY?? HE CAN'T!! WE CAN'T HAVE GOOD GUY CUZ GOOD CRINGE! WE NO WRITE GOOD. BUT SUPERMAN ICONIC BUT GOOD CRINGE *BUT EDGY GOOD!* YES! MAKE SUPERMAN EDGY!" As you can see, just like the Sonic franchise, we must appreciate effort where effort is due. There was a clear and daring, even BRAVE, attempt of creating something truly unique that the writers and CEOs of the company (formers of which have been running the company for years, whicu is a stome of their competence and wisdom), that was just misunderstood by the public and its audience, who was simply caught off guard by the sudden shift. In a few years, hopefully the fans come around like I did, and realize these adaptations were not jarring, just ahead of their time.

To be fair though Superman and the Golden Age was often Petty and spiteful and did some crazy stuff man

What people often overlook at injustice superman is how he did created world peace and general safety. Thats why he still have supporter despite everything. Is he evil? No Twisted? Yes

Evil superman from a Lois death is stupid when the Lazarus pit and plenty of resurrection protocols exist in DC

I’m getting so tired of seeing Superman Evil, sure it was interesting at first in Injustice but Snyder’s Vision completely ruined the whole concept of the Character being the embodiment of a Human Man that that’s physically a Alien but has alot of Humanity that he only wants to do Good and stop the Evil and Corrupt in the Right Way, the reason why Homelander and Omni-Man works isn’t because they’re Supermen that Kills but because they’re raised by different Environments and are a Interesting as a Character Study as Nature and Notcher, hell if DC wants a Superman that Kills then Zod is the Perfect Evil Superman they could Adapt More.

superman is clarks alter ego, bruce wayne is batmans alter ego, theyre a great duo because theyre so opposite but also so similar

You nailed it. I absolutely hate it when Snyder fans say "Superman is only realistic when he kills and is depressed" gtfo

Why is it that a Superman thats angry is alot more interesting than a modern evil superman? Because evil superman is so easy and cheap to the point no one has naunce to it. An angry Superman, is our glorious boy scout being mentally tested, where he must truly rise tothe occassion and live up to his mantra and be a real symbol of hope. And above all......shows he is VERY MUCH SO......human. who makes mistakes, who is not all powerful as we think be is .....but will do what is right even when it doesnt feel good at the moment. Evil Superman just makes Superman a paradigm shift but with NO naunce at all. The worst part, VERY VERY much against any sight of coming back to the side of good. Not a single ember in sight of the main who spent most of his life protecting people.

I've been a huge Superman fan since I was a little boy and I pretty much agree

Well I think you’re missing that being an alien is an important part of his character as well. It’s shouldn’t define him but it’s important. Other than that I agree with everything else you said

i agree i never wanted superman to turn to the dark side like anakin the only superman i cared who never turn evil is tom welling clark kent

Superman is a huge dork and his name is Clark Kent.

Superman is cool AND a kind of dork, which is the charm.

Hollywood: What if Superman was... EEEEEEEEEEVIL??? ME: We'd be screwed.

I think that the reasons why Superman is made evil are because A) He's Superman, everyone wants a piece of the guy B) He's a symbol of a broken American system and idealism which I believe he could expertly challenge and still represent because he as a symbol can do more individual character growth and good than a bureaucratic government that Superman himself fought on multiple occasions and C) People want to dunk on their elders' idealism because reality is dunking on them, and they want to let out their frustrations on someone.

Clicked on this hoping it’d be something along the lines of “he’s too evil and scary, it’s really screwed up!!” It kind of was.

With the release of My Adventures with Superman and the final season of Superman & Lois, that's considered a good sign that we're slowly moving around from the Evil Superman trend.

stating that it's just lois lane dying in injustice is pretty disingenuous

The reason I like injustice Superman is cause when he goes evil its for a reason, Joker tricks him into killing his pregnant wife and then nukes metropolis. And even when he goes evil he doesn't go completely evil he still saves people and believes he's doing the right thing, but he just goes way too far and starts to delude himself that when he kills Billy Batson at that point he's too far gone. Another reason I like it is cause Batman and Joker. Batman refuses to kill the Joker even after all the times joker has tried to get him to. So after losing constantly joker decides to break Superman and make him lose literally everything, his wife, his unborn son, and the city he swore to protect. And through doing that Batman loses one of his closest friends and Joker effectively destroys the world. This is what Joker wanted, Joker won. But I do get what your getting its a bit overplayed at this point I would like to see more good Supermen. As far as evil Supermen types go I like Injustice Superman Omniman and Homelander and maybe Ultraman but I absolutely hate his portrayal in Suicide Squad.

I think the writers could've made a foil or counter point towards superman, maybe a character who has a really good reason to be evil like....facing horrible abuse, starvation and violence of an untold number, without anyone to save or council the poor fellow. His or her trauma grew into distain and resentment, being forced to steal, kill, and/or join gangs in order to survive, getting exploited by others in return. I'm not sure on any decent ideas or any ways to make it a good story but hey who knows, maybe it's already been made or I'm just tired asf XD

Man, i want the boy scout Superman in the big screen again, leave the dark stuff to Batman.

Smallville, i think, did a pretty good job of touching on the idea of evil Superman without it feeling forced or overstaying it's welcome. It was never made into a season long arc. Only shown when you take the influence of the Kents out of him or strip him of his inhibitions. Something we see in full effect in episodes dealing with Red K or the other world where he wasn't raised by Martha or John. Like Red Son, it challenges the nurture vs nature ideal by presenting a Kal El that was raised by Lionel. It's short & to the point, only running for a few episodes, & makes us wonder about our Clark if circumstances were different.

It is so hard to get a Superman that is actually Superman since 2013 since the DCEU decided to butcher him beyond recognition.