I don’t think people really get what this means. As a human being you are constantly subject to emotional states, your entire brain chemistry represents the world to you as influenced by them. There’s no getting around how inherently biased just being a human subject makes you, you’re only ever aware of yourself really, everything else is filtered through that.
This phenomenon is also known as "Convert Fever." The thing about conversion is that it is very tempting to throw all your sticks into the fire all at once and watch the fire burn bright and really feel the heat and warmth of it. Thing is, if you don't go out and collect more sticks to keep the fire burning, the fire burns out and is reduced to embers or goes cold altogether. Christ doesn't want lukewarm followers, but he doesn't want burnouts, either. Keep the fire burning bright, warm, and steady, brothers and sisters.
One thing that I'm glad that you brought up in this video is the whole idea of everyone needing a "Born again experience". I went to a Christian Middle/High school and there were many times in Bible classes in which I had to make up something for an assignment to talk about my "born again experience" or my "testimony" because it was very heavily emphasized. Through those experiences I realized that not everyone has one of those and that one does not "get saved" by saying a single prayer and all is good. It is unfortunate because I know that I, among the many people in that school who were raised in very good conditions going to church since birth, felt that I wasn't as much of a Christian because I didn't have this amazing "testimony" to share. I do absolutely acknowledge that people do have these experiences and that there are amazing stories of people finding Christ in their darkest of times, but that is not the case for everyone and it doesn't make anyone less of a Christian for not having such a story.
Thanks for sharing. I've had a similar experience. I grew up Catholic and, over the past couple of years, have tried to grow my personal relationship with Jesus along with practicing the sacraments. When I've talked and met with other Christians, they always talk about a moment at which they were saved or Jesus COMPLETELY turned their lives around, and I've felt like I must not be saved because I haven't had that transformative moment. I also saw a video recently that said that, to tell whether you are truly saved, look at your life before and after you were Christian and compare the two. For me, that doesn't really work since I've been Christian my WHOLE life. LOL!
If a revival fails, it does not mean that it was false. Then again, Asbury seems to have these things about every 6-10 years or about once per student intake. The question from my side is what happens to those who have left the college and experienced one if these revivals.
Despite being someone who (as usual) finds themselves in between the Old Light and New Light in regard to revivalism, I definitely think that if the Apostle Paul had been around when people were accusing others of not being saved due to not being enthusiastic enough, he'd have given them a severe talking to.
New light be like "Hey, Ho, more passion, more passion, more energy, more energy, more energy, more footwork, more footwork, more energy! More energy!"
It makes me wonder if this was some kind of over compensation for the "salvation by faith alone" sentiment that came from reactions to "salvation by works" mentalities found within Catholicism at the time. That maybe this emphasis on "energy/passion" was their answer, whether conscious or subconscious, to the rejection of salvation by works. A sort of pendulum swing, if you will. After being under one extreme of living by a legalistic and impossible law to then being under another extreme of "faith alone so works don't matter," an emphasis on passion and emotion could potentially be a driving force towards an ideal where salvation comes through faith and that faith without works is dead. Maybe the "new lights" described here saw a "dead faith" that was not being backed up by works and sought to remedy that with passion and "energy," unfortunately also including the pitfalls that came with such an approach. Ultimately, as with most things, it seems there are always pros and cons to both sides of an issue.
@@Irishman8778 That's a good point. Sometimes coldness and lack of life can infiltrate a church and make it stagnant. Thankfully, the answer is not to bend the knee to crazy heterodox madness from the NAR😃
12:03 THANK YOU! I grew up Baptist and when I started taking Christianity more seriously a couple years ago I used to stress if I was truly saved. I cannot point to a specific moment when I became Christian, all I know is that I am saved now. I am glad people are pointing this out so people can stop stressing if they are truly saved even though they ARE Christian.
I’m a Pentecostal, and I agree with a lot of your points. I think the biggest problem with my denomination is the celebrity pastor epidemic and churchgoers only consuming what the kingdom gives them and not actively fighting for it. A lot of churches will have “revival nights” that end up looking more like concerts, and elevating pastors to a celebrity status removes their accountability and allows heresy like the prosperity gospel to thrive. I don’t think all revival is bad though. I think it has some Biblical backing, particularly when God uses Jonah to prompt all of Nineveh to turn to Him. Also, Paul’s ministry incited many scenarios that could be called revivals. I actually think Ashbury was a net positive, especially for that university in particular. It started because of someone forgiving someone else who wronged them greatly, and they treated the celebrity pastors who showed up like equals, not letting them speak just because of their church’s size. Nevertheless, revivals can easily be used for personal gain and that is something all Christians need to be aware of. Also, emotions do not equal faithfulness. Jesus didn’t die to make us feel good.
Look at the revivals at asbury over the years... they have continuously dissolved good biblical principles and replaced them with progressive worldliness. The asbury "revival" was a big ole lgbtq festival. That's not the work of the HS.
True. That's part of the reason I stopped attending church for many years. It all felt so artificial. Like I was attending a show, where I was just a spectator. Most church services have become lifeless. They all basically follow the same structure. And don't change. You pretty much know everything that is going to happen at the service, even before it begins. I don't think that is what the apostles had in mind for church. The early church seemed more dynamic. Constantly growing, moving, evangelizing, in touch with the local community. Church happened wherever the disciples went. I have recently begun attending church again, because I know we are commanded to gather with other believers. But I find myself often distracted and not really connected with what is going on in the service. It seems like the church is not really engaging the culture or community. It refuses to change or to adapt in order to reach more people for Christ. Sometimes I think that the churches would be stronger if they didn't have church buildings. I think most people who attend church wish there was a more meaningful way to serve in the church. But most churches already have their positions filled. And usually the only positions they will allow you to participate in, is something basic like being an usher, or watching the kids. No real work for mature believers
@@nerychristian Church is the body of believers and the service needs to be aimed at the discipleship of the believer. The work of reaching the non-believer is called evangelism and that should principally be done outside the church, individually. When church tries to evangelize the non-believer and be seeker sensitive than there is no fruit for the believer and it makes church pointless and leads to a very theologically shallow congregation. This is one of the main reasons why pentecostals have such terrible theology... they'll say whatever is necessary to get someone in the door including "you can have superpowers..."
@@anthonyprose4965 I agree with you that church is supposed to be a fellowship for believers. But at the same time, I think the church is failing to disciple believers. Part of the discipleship process should be preparing men to tak on duties and responsibilities in the church. But in most churches, it's probably like 5% of the members who are actively using their gifts in some capacity. When the pastors are salaried, there is not incentive to try to train or to produce new preachers and teachers. Ideally, the pastors and teachers should be training the young men so that they can one day take over the teaching duties, or so that they can go open their own congregations. A church that is not growing and expanding every few years in not a healthy church.
@@nerychristianall four of the ministries in Eph.4 are necessary: the evangelists to evangelise, the pastors to look after the flock (old and new), the apostles to direct and fix doctrine, and the prophets to declare what Christ wants and explain the Scriptures (there are more nuances but that's a good start). We tend to hear a lot about evangelists, something maybe about pastors and teachers, but there's virtually nobody who ever talks about apostles and prophets. But the verse indicates that if you don't have them, you can't go on to perfection.
Very insightful video. As a former DoC and newly found Catholic, you have me curious in reformed theology. Like you said towards the end of the video, I haven’t really been exposed to reformed theology. Thank you Zoomer, may God bless you
@@Idishrkdmd I understand, I’m not saying I reject Calvinism or Thomism (I’m more familiar with Thomas Aquinas), but it is unique to learn a different train of thought, even if I don’t end up subscribing to that belief. That’s how I came to understand the teachings of the Catholic Church, I rejected it completely for so long, then I learned to understand it. While I subscribe to the Catholic teachings, I do want to broaden my knowledge of other people’s beliefs even if I disagree. It’s beneficial to know what it is you’re arguing against than only to know what you’re arguing for
Im not even Protestant, i am Orthodox, but i like your videos a lot! Your channel is the best Protestant theology channel i usualy watch, even tho i do not agree with you on a lot of things.
I've been increasingly moving away from American evangelicalism towards more traditional forms of Protestantism and your videos have been influential in this.
He literally said at 21:26 that Log College guys founded Princeton. I'm not American so idk anything about those and I don't care, but RZ _did_ say that.
This channel is teaching me a lot about church and history and just in general good things and important aspects of Christianity I’ve never really heard of growing up Baptist/non denominational
I grew up in a Baptist area and people would have dates on their instagram of when they got saved and talk about it at school and I was always scared that I wasn’t saved because I never had a dramatic emotional experience. Old light ftw
I was able to go to Asbury. It was a wonderful experience. I really believe God moved and did special things there in my life and others. I also think the national attention it received sparked something good in our society. Call it revival or not, it was a blessing and we need more faith and unity like what I experienced there.
@@redeemedzoomer6053 I'm about to go to college, so I will in a few months. All my friends and family go here; I'm not going to just break off and do my own thing just for a few months. I'm going to Calvin University.
Your comments about the “born again” experience really spoke to me. I am Catholic now but grew up Southern Baptist, and I always felt like I didn’t truly love God because I never had any sort of “personal experience”. I genuinely felt guilty because I never had that “getting saved” moment (I don’t even remember it, I was 7 when I supposedly gave my life to Christ). Turning Christianity into a charismatic spectable is one of the worst things to come out of the New Light ideas
I'm a Pentecostal and I don't believe that we can make revivals to happen, but we need to be ready and pray for it! But we shouldn't say "Pentecostalism this, Pentecostalism that" for what American Charismatic people are doing! Remember that Pentecostal Christians are everywhere and we shouldn't accuse the whole denomination for what some people did! We could say a lot if we want to talk about lukewarm Churches!
Charles Finney was a nut and a liar. He didn't even study Presbyterianism before he was ordained, yet claimed that he held Presbyterian doctrines. Rather, he hated the doctrines of grace. He would discredit the pastors in the area where he came into, and then he would exact "conversions" out of the townspeople, then leave the town. This left no one to disciple the "converts", which I doubt were really saved to start with. I have a pretty good paper on Asahel Nettleton and Charles Finney and the nutty stuff Finney used as gimmicks in his preaching. Sadly, individual like Chuck Smith and Billy Graham spoke positively of Finney.
I was born into a reformed churchgoing family and my mom took me out to Calvary Chapel during my childhood honestly it was really disappointing, when I started driving I went straight back to the CRC. Grew up in Jack Hibbs (when it started) and saw Chuck Smith preached honestly it was just a bunch of hype about the "end times". I fully believe Chuck Smith is a false prophet.
@@jdkayak7868 I'm not much into Chuck Smith, but I wouldn't categorize him as a false prophet unless he prophesied something that didn't come true. But, I don't know much about him. I had a few friends who attended Calvary Chapel and I visited the local Calvary Chapel for some time...took their Bible School classes remotely. It wasn't my thing, though. There was some lady who prophesied during services once but I think that's against the rules. I liked Skip Heitzig's teachings back then, but there are better teachers in the Particular Baptist world imho.
@@jdkayak7868 Ah, OK. I really didn't listen to him much. I listened to tapes by Skip Heitzig and Mark Martin. I thought both of them were fairly decent back then. I learned quite a bit from them, but at a more basic level. I don't know if Skip got into the dispensational stuff very much. I never really learned dispensationalism, I don't think, because I was raised in a church that believed in historical premillennialism. I am now amillennial.
I think both old light and new light had a point. It's important to really know the Bible and hold to solid truths, but it's also true that having a relationship with God is more than a reading list.
Really enjoyed the video. I have actually been looking for content on this subject so praise the Lord for his providence 😁 I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the subject of prayer brother. God bless you y ¡arriba la Reconquista!✊💯
Good topic. Also I attended a PCA, and the building is over 100 years old with beautiful stained glass with a well educated pastor. Just letting you know so maybe you’ll stop generalizing denominations that aren’t mainline. Love you brother!
I highly recommend the book "a time to build" by Yuval Levin. Its a book of political philosophy centered around the importance of institutions. Levin is probably the smartest politically conservative intellectual around today.
@@igorlopes7589following God is a relationship with the Lord. He is close by, and you should care about it. It's not an emotionless task to follow God.
I remember being on the fence about that ‘revival’ last year and honestly quite sceptical, most of the other people in my Christian circles including my parents and pastor were heavily against it, and they honestly were right. You can’t ‘induce’ a revival, and many of the people doing it at Asbury were indeed practising sinful lifestyles and generally lacking in the piety and spiritual excellence needed for a effective revival.
The Holy Spirit has to start somewhere with what He can get. Sinful lifestyles can be remedied and repented of. If He isn't starting with you or me, who are, of course, the most perfect people He could find, that's probably because there's something stopping Him doing it - maybe our pharisaism?
@@jeremywilliams5107 No, I don't think the Holy Spirit is limited by me. You must think he's just a voice in your head or a little genie that tells you that your thoughts are infallible. And maybe don't call people pharisees when you yourself preach a false gospel.
@anthonyprose4965 Let's not get emotional. You're wrong all along the line with what you think is my relationship with the Holy Ghost, and please note that pharasaism was a hypothetical and also applied to me. But accusation of a false Gospel is heavy stuff, and not something to be done lightly. Find me the contradiction of what i have said in the Bible, please.
@@jeremywilliams5107 "Don't get emotional," says the guy from the charismatic church that places emotion above scripture.... Your shame techniques have no affect on me. And your revivalist gospel is a false gospel. How far down the rabbit hole have you gone? Oneness? Jesus was created? We can be our own god if we do enough good works? Spirit Babies? Total perfection in this life? 2 works or the spirit or 3? Christian's can be possessed? Deliverance? False tongues speaking? I have zero respect for your lies. That which has been given was the completion of scripture and it wasn't until the pentecostal movement started to make up false doctrines did that get perverted, even more so by the charismatics. You are the result of a 100 years of brainwashing. Completely unaccountable and completely unteachable, prideful and full of arrogance. The first to accuse of the very things he is guilty of. No Thanks. I don't need any of your "new light."
Check the link in the description. He's got a map with churches he recommends. Looks like there's several Presbyterian and Lutheran ones in the LA area, and a couple of Anglican ones as well.
I'm curious what you would think about praying for revivals? Not trying to actively start a revival, but instead hoping and praying that the Holy Spirit will stir a revival in the places which seem so desolate of God, especially here in Scotland, whilst still keeping good word and preaching.
My church has revival every Sunday, it’s called morning services. That’s how I think we should all view church. I personally have a very active emotional side to my faith, but it’s okay that not everyone does. Just repent and call on the Lord, and you are saved.
@@ethanmulvihill7177 debate doesn’t always lead to truth my friend. Baptism doesn’t wash away sin also the baby has no sin, baptism isn’t the new circumcision, the Bible says it’s a circumcision made without hands, why? Because when one believes that’s the spiritual baptism, then a person can physically get it done. Also Are they dunking the baby? Because sprinkling doesn’t count anyway.
There's a ton of people being baptized as adults and they never truly believed just as well many leave the church, neither did those who are circumcised.
Infant baptism is an Unbiblical concept that has no backing by scripture. Period. The Bible is our ultimate authority we should adhere to, as it is God's word. nothing else.
@@notyourtypicalcomment2399 You 1. Denied original sin 2. conflated spiritual baptism and physical baptism 3. assumed that sprinkling doesn't count for no good reason. 1. I'm still not sure why people are denying original sin especially in light of affirming Paul. 2. Spiritual baptism relates to spiritual circumcision, physical baptism relates to physical circumcision. In both cases the physical act demonstrates entering membership in a covenant and the hope for (or signification of) the spiritual reality. 3. There's actually no way you can prove full immersion from the Bible. I'm curious to see how and if you try but I'm sorry, I can't see any way.
I’m going to ask a clarifying question, RedeemedZoomer you said that baptism saves and the Lord’s supper is the true body and blood of Christ but Baptism only saves when the Holy Spirit wants it to save? Does that mean that you think people who are intentionally baptized cannot be saved sometimes? I guess I’m just confused because it feels like God lays out the things to do to be saved but now you’re saying that the people who do those things are able to be picked and chosen by the Holy Spirit regardless of them following God’s directions for salvation?
A) Everyone is at least potentially saved already, it's just that most don't realise it. B) Faith precedes baptism: faith imputes righteousness, the confession of Jesus being the Saviour saves, and baptism regenerates and imparts righteousness. C) nobody should be left in any kind of thrological limbo that might arise through being baptised and then not being brought up in the faith, or bring forcibly baptised, and so on. This has to be left up to God's mercy to sort out, but we shouldn't cause these cases to occur.
Isn't one of the big rules in true Christianity is to not solely look at emotions? Also, thank you for bringing up the different conversion experiences.
I felt really good yesterday, and I'm feeling pretty down today. Am I any more or less saved in either of these two states? Emotions have their parts to play and are not to be ruled out, but the thing they should be applied to, as with all other character traits and gifts, is the edification of the church. Feeling good on a personal or private level is not to be despised, but it's not the main thing.
Closest church to me you've mapped is Anglican Church of Canada, which is almost as progressive as United Church of Canada. There's a good Wesleyan (unfortunately Armenian), just 50km away in Yarmouth.
Hearing all this stuff about New Light vs. Old Light and The Dangers of an Unconverted Ministry...I still hear that a lot in evangelical circles. Celebrity pastors are how we get things like Mars Hill and people like Mark Driscoll.
I think the reason for secularism in New England was Puritanism. Everyone thrown into that machine came out a Unitarian Universalist (look at Ralph Waldo Emerson) or, if they were lucky, a Wesleyan (look at Emerson’s Grandfather, Ezra Ripley) and probably one who later fell from Methodism to Proto-Pentecostal new-lightism. Anything touched by Calvinism/deep reformed theology falls apart into Liberalism, lol. OSAS and TULIP are either always either inverted over time to justify complacency with sin, or, they just drive theologically conservative Christians away.
I like how you believe that people should consider staying in the church, especially younger people and reform it from the inside. I would love to get your input on how you believe regular layman can have such an influence. Should I join a church, stay in it for a while, then attempt to become a deacon and influence it that way? Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Maybe a good video topic if you haven't already made it?
The Asbury revival was going on back while I still attended the nondenom church I was raised in, I can confirm they were all absolutely convinced it was going to bring about some countrywide conversion. Funny how they seem to not remember it now.
You won't fully know the extent of a revival until years later. A profession of faith today is one thing, but holding fast down the line is another. It *just* happened a year ago. A tree does not grow overnight, but takes time to grow.
@@aquicklad972 Funny how there has been countless revivals over the past century and yet even with all this time for it to grow all it's bloomed into is a drastic decline in Christian faith.
@@DepravedSinner instead of showing disdain and seeming to be upset at the prospect of people coming to Christ, maybe you need a new outlook. The love of Christ seems to be far from you with your remarks.
@@aquicklad972 Why do you assume I have disdain or am upset? If anything my comments show how much I care, because I won't allow fads and trends to lead people away from Christ.
@@DepravedSinner if these people from these revivals are being "led away from Christ" why don't you explain it? If you believe that the working of the Holy Spirit is something to scoff at (which you *have been doing*) then you need to seriously do some introspection. Instead of wanting to bring good theology and teaching to these people in need of it, you dismiss their experiences as irrelevant, their very stance as Christians as moot. The love of God is not in you. Be more like Paul, who exhorts one another to teach those who need to know. Where we "come to Christ only able to have milk" but "grow to eat food" in the spirit; that is to grow and become mature Christians. "All scripture is good for teaching and exhortation." Use the Bible and your spiritual maturity to help mentor those who are newer and weaker in their faith rather than disparaging them and dismissing their understanding of God. Your unwelcoming attitude is exactly what draws believers away from the church.
I would say my religious practice, Messianic Judaism ✡️ is a combination of Old Light and New Light concepts, for obvious reasons. However, for me, the actual doctrines that come out of a New Light mindset are within my standard of belief. For example, many messianic Jews such as my congregation adhere to Pentecostal style worship. At the same time, though, we hold traditional Jewish liturgy along with a strong adherence to educating our members in the meaning behind all of the Jewish customs, so long as they align with the Hebrew Bible and New Covenant scriptures. For me, Messianic Judaism has, most of the time, met my needs of combining fervent expression along with institutional grounding.
Hmmm so I like Catholicism, and the Orthodox seem sincere as well. I like that Mar Mari or the priest who was stabbed and lost an eye. He spits hot fire.
No. It comes from two areas: 1) trying to achieve sanctification by human means through replacing spirit with emotion (the bad end) and 2) "if these should hold their peace, the stones would cry out" (the good end). _Post hoc non propter hoc!_
@TitusCastiglione1503 the Latin phrase means " If B comes after A, it does not mean that B was caused by A." The original question is describing a situation that grew up after the 2GA but was not caused by it. I hope that answers your question.
I for one would like to hear RZ debate a baptist, because I have a lot of my own convictions about why he's wrong. Don't get me wrong, I like RZ but this was really out of left field.
I would also like to add with regard to your map that the CREC has planted a church in North Spokane, WA United States in 2023, though I know that your not as much of a fan of the newer reformed church plants.
7:57 Society in general these days is so much more mobile (people move more during their lives) that churches simply have to deal with their communities being less stable. That said, simply whether one likes the pastor is certainly not a good criterion.
@@nerychristian No one is suggesting being stagnant, just being *stable,* there is a difference. A local church should always try to grow, but that doesn't mean there should be no stability at all
We are dead in our sins and trespasses. Are we in our own might to make ourselves alive? Or is it the Holy Spirit who makes us alive. As profesied in ezekiel
He said it himself- he's got Skibidi Ohio Rizz (it's a reference to something that happened on his discord; he says it's because the first time he rizzed up a girl, it was in Ohio)
Just want to point out that Jehova's Witnesses and Mormonism had their genesis so to speak in the Burnt Over District, so we have that to thank it for as well.
I have an idea, how can Calvinist soteriology fit qith the ontological argument? Surely the greatest possible being would would treat everyone the same as there will be a greatest way of treating someone, so, either Universalism, Universal Damnation or Arminian soteriology mist be the case.
You can argue that the greatest way of treating someone is customised to that particular person. Imagine a parent treating their child the same as they would someone who harms their child. God does otherwise - He protects His children and justly punishes those who hurt them, both the greatest ways of treating two different groups of people
@@hewziheng4587 However, the person doing the hurting is still His child. And the Bible clearly points to 1. That He wants everyone to be saved 2. Not everyone will be saved. Good eye, @jacobpottage6938
@@micahbannister1287Well I’ll say that #1 is not correct, usually supported with Scripture verses taken out of context/not read with sufficient nuance. So there really isn’t a contradiction here with a close reading of Scripture
@@hewziheng4587 #1 absolutely is correct. The primary proof for that is in 2 Peter 3, where it is revealed that God even stalls His return as a mercy so that more people have time to accept Him. (You can try to find 2 Peter taken out of context, I promise you'll be trying harder and reaching more than the people who take Him at His word) And there isn't a contradiction between free will and God's sovereignty. Predestination traditions try to limit God's power by saying that it can only take place in a way that they understand. Since they only understand sovereignty to be full control, and none of the nuance of God being outside of time, they limit God's sovereignty to "having a script by which the universe runs", which is entirely their own invention. Rather, God is sovereign because He is all good and all powerful and timeless. And if He in His goodness chooses to create beings with the will to accept or reject Him, that will not interfere in the slightest with His power and His ability to orchestrate things outside of time. Do we not have the Incarnation as an example of an all-powerful God lowering Himself? His power and His ability to humble Himself are not contradictory there, why would they be anywhere else? Our God remains sovereign, but there is no reason to think that this means never allowing a choice against Him. It just means that the choices against Him will not prevail, that they will not undo His promises to the faithful, and that they will not change His nature. Calvinists simplify sovereignty to a "child playing Barbie and making certain dolls the bad guys and certain dolls the good guys" game, and get away with it because they are very intellectually sound in other areas. They remain my brothers in Christ, but predestination soteriology is part of the reason that so many people reject what is otherwise a very strong tradition.
People think worship is about good feelings towards Jesus when it is really about glorifying Him. Once you understand this you will understand why solemn cerimonies, architecture, music and art are the better way of doing worship: they better signify what you are supposed to be internaly doing
