Even in vice city stories Lance was a liability. Victor was always yelling at him (rarely praising him, but he did). Lance was always trying to act like a big shot player and it blew up in his face. So when Tommy started to mirror Victor, Lance didn't question why he was doing it or self reflect. He just jumped the gun again and let his actions end up burning him.
Imagine if Lance was killed instead of Vic. He'd be a lot more helpful and much mature than Lance with Tommy. He'll mostly focused on helping out Tommy and be an actual help with his military skills. He can also introduce Robina and Phil much earlier , He ain't gonna fool around and let emotionally take things he'll get his empire back and just listen and even suggest ideas to Tommy.
I think Vic would retire from criminal life after helping Tommy kill Diaz (as a revenge for killing Lance. Though Lance was a trouble maker, Vic values family) had he survived the botched drug deal instead of Lance.
@@sreenaths6829 And Tommy would let him as a repayment for services rendered: Tommy believes in honor amongst thieves, a thing that sometimes helped him, sometimes screwed him over.
Oh yeah and speaking of liability, in VCS there is that mission where he says, it is his drugs and he can do whatever he wants with it, jumps in a helicopter and Vic has to collect from where he drops it. That guy is a prick from the beginning till the end.. 🥵🥵
Pretty much guaranteed Tommy is a psycho yes but completely reasonable Sonny is a person who could care less about human life he would probably put a hit on his best friend for not paying off a bet
Actually he is using the definitive edition The real definitive edition AKA the definitive edition project modoack. I see the improved wheels from the newer vice city versions and the improved grass , etc.
@@johanjoe3012 Mods don't count, it's still the pc version, not the original in that reguard, but close. Better than the goddamn defective edition. But the mod is using xbox version assets. That's nice. The real definive edition is the xbox version of 3 and vc. All songst and all, bug fixes and better grafics. Tbh, i still play more the ps2 Version. Looks better in general. And the pc has mod support. Even it didn't count as definitiv edition, i love what people have done... As a big Rockstar fanboy my whole life: Rockstar isn't Rockstar anymore. The people aren't in the team. Rockstar these days is just a take2 Cover up. I will not buy anything take2 related anymore. The last two releases show, that they don't care at all. The only thing they have in mind is $. I hope "Rockstar", the old team i mean, will make a own new company. Like Hideo Kojima it did with Kojima Productions because of Konami. Like Rare done it with Playtonic because of microsoft. And so on. We need to support the old devoloper, not a fake name Take2. I boycott games from take2 and Rockstar! We all should, except you (in not someone specific more like in general) don't care. And if so, don't call yourself a rockstar or gta fan. I hope for a new gta under a different name from the old team... I know, will most likely not happen. But even a new gta like 6 would sound interesting. It's not from the real Rockstar anymore. Just remembered folks, it's just a cover up and i have the feeling they will get more "a good boy" and also missing alot specific details (specific cruel humor as exsample), what the game made so special... Thanks for reading. Sry if my english sucks. It's not my native tounge. Have a nice one. Greetings from a big, dissapointed Rockstar fan...
Funny thing that Lance never seem to have realized is that, Sonny is part of an Italian-based mob. You don't get to join an Italian mob if you aren't Italian, that's just part of their rules. Lance, in the most generous of situations, would have been demoted to an associate if Sonny ever succeeded in his takeover, and would be in an even worse position than he was with the Vercetti Gang.
@Claude#7 Cj screwing over salvatore in las venturas, maria messing around sals back and his uncle who he didnt like ... Also maria to make sal jealous by saying her and claude were an item .
@@plewisjr90 Lance was jealous of his brother and he took advantage of him most of their lives. Every time Lance tries to run a get rich quick scheme, Vic is the one who ends up bailing him out. Lance even tries to steal girlfriends from other family members due to his lack of social manners.
@@steveboone1498 He deff was envious of vic and like i said, dude was dumb. But he did love his brother. Just cause the man was an idiot didn't mean he didn't have love for vic. He DOES actually help vic out here an there (like maybe 2 or so times outta the 400 times vic helped him) Even before he blasts Diaz, he reminds him that "this is for my brother!"
You forgot in the mission Sir Yes Sir! Colonel Cortez also mentioned Diaz was behind busting the deal, and Tommy also reached the same conclusion and never disagreed with Lance that Diaz did that, also lots of things happened behind the scene and it was established there Diaz busted the deal, also after Tommy kills Leo Teal on of Vic's assassins, the first contact calls thinking Tommy is Teal saying they got a buyer for Diaz's merchandise, so yeah canonically Diaz undeniably busted the deal. In VCS we saw Gonzalez also working for Diaz, and in VC Colonel had Gonzalez killed by Tommy for leaking information about the deal. The reason Tommy wanted to wait was because Diaz was the Kingpin and he wanted to learn more about the business from Diaz before taking over. But anyway what happened to Lance he had it coming, he caused Vic so much pain in VCS, it was because of him Vic could not live a life o peace with Louise with Lance always messing up, and Tommy saved Lance after his idiotic childish failed attempt to take Diaz, but he was still ungrateful, while Tommy was busy buying assets and making their empire strong, Lance did nothing but lazily dark with the boys and later betrayed Tommy, as if Sonny was gonna give an idiot like Lance Tommy's spot, had Tommy died Sonny would have ditched the insecure brat Lance in seconds. Lance had it coming and is one of my least favorite characters ever in the series. He mentioned Vic treated like him a kid, and Tommy was doing the same, but the reality was that is exactly what he was and deserved no better. Anyway great video, thanks..
And we would like to add something after a little discuss :) Actually, we are going to mention "Sir, Yes Sir!" in one of future videos while talking more about the failed drug deal 😉 However, we wouldn't necessarily say that Tommy reached this conclusion. To be honest, we would rather say that he was manipulated into attacking Ricardo, due to Cortez's suggestion, but more importantly because of Lance's constant persuations. And well, how could he disagree with that? He didn't have anything in favour or against Diaz at the moment. Although "behind the scenes" seem to be a bit trivial in our opinion. That is because by using this, we could easily point out something completely taken out of our imagination and providing this as a our point of reasoning. That's why we are focused on something that happens in front of us. But of course saying that something happened "behind the scenes" is a mere speculation, not a fact. Another thing about Diaz's merchandise. Don't you think that it could be his own stuff? He is a drug baron after all. Surely this conversation highlights Ricardo Diaz as potential Mr Black's client, but regarding that, we can only be sure that Leo Teal has worked for Diaz. Thus we can't say that Diaz was the one who ambushed the deal with 100% accuracy, at least we don't think so. And the things about the Lance are exactly like we think about it. This moron wanted just to get something , but for doing nothing. And well.. he got what he deserved. Thanks for dropping by!
@@gaminginvestigators I never thought of it that way, but great perspectives, but one more thing is Cortez finds out Gonzalez was behind the deal's ambush, leaking vital info, and Gonzalez was also working with Diaz in VCS two years prior, avenging the deal getting busted started with killing Gonzalez. Anyway I agree nothing is totally established, this is however the only direction the game hints at but I agree your points that there is no 100% conclusion, and either ways, Lance was a man child jerk and had what happened to him coming, good day :)
I said this before but I find it sad how Tommy had to grow up so fast especially when he was arrested at only 20, He missed out on the joys of being 20 and going to fun party, I can see why Tommy is so introverted for many reasons. And plus that can explain his whole personality too.
Yes, you're totally right.. But what could he do really? He was a young man with aspirations to become a high-ranking member of the Forellis, he had a good mind to risk his life to make more money, not just for himself, but probably for his parents to a bigger extent. 🙁
@@gaminginvestigators You're also so right! And that just makes it sadder too and actually shows the real life struggles of mafia members, Props to rockstar! They are make their characters feel so real..But hey they have amazing writers so of course lol. But back to Tommy, And the fact that he probably had a bad relationship for his mother on top of all that mafia stuff, Ooo boy, Our man has been through a lot!
@@Abigailstars yeah.. like some mafia members are just trying their best to earn the respect of their bosses but they end up getting mistreated and betrayed..
In the final mission "Keep your friends close...", after killing Lance and stopping Sonny's men from stealing the cash from the mansion, Tommy and Sonny have words - Tommy: YOU took fifteen years from ME Sonny, and NOW I'm gonna make you pay! Sonny: You still don't get it, do you?! I OWN you Tommy! Those fifteen years were MINE to spend! Get him boys, he never understood a thing! Basically in 1971, Sonny led Tommy into an ambush which caused Tommy to kill eleven men instead of one man to save his life, and is imprisoned for fifteen years.
I still remember back in 6th grade or so when I first play this game and I was really into it. I remember when I saw the betrayal and it felt like a personal betrayal
Same... I also spent a lot of time playing GTA VC on my laptop when I was in 6th Grade, back in 2013... And I can't believe that Lance would betray Tommy after being saved in "Death Row"! I wish I haven't completed "Death Row" but too bad it was a mandatory mission!
Great. I like it. Lance's stupid and greedy behavior is what got him killed at the end. Lance was a man child that expected to be given everything to him on a plate and not putting in the work and effort to it. Lance never learn his lessons. Vic and Tommy had every right to yell at him. They did all the work. Lance was also a big idiot for trying to make a deal with Sonny and trying to betray Tommy because there was no way Sonny was going to let Lance have full control of the criminal empire in Vice City. Sonny betrayed Tommy and he would have betray and kill Lance later on. Lance got his brother killed because Lance didn't want to give up the coke and the drug business.
I find it funny how people ridicule Lance for being greedy yet Tommy built a massive empire. For what? Charity? For goodness? No, for his own greed. Seriously, if you’re going to call Lance greedy take a look at how greedy and power hungry Tommy is. Also Lance helped Tommy a bunch. He’s the reason he manages to acquire Diaz’ empire. He saved Tommy’s life from the chefs at the beginning. Helped him take down the SuperCafe shop and Diaz despite how dangerous it was, and helped Vic on various jobs. Basically my point is, Lance betrayed Tommy because he felt that Tommy was only out for himself. For Christ sake, he had Ken and Lance help him with work in building his criminal empire and still had the audacity to say this is my operation. Can’t you see how selfish and self centred Tommy is as well? It’s ridiculous how people blatantly ignore this and pretend Tommy is perfect. Now I’m not a hypocrite. Lance caused problems, spent some time on his ass doing nothing. He’s not perfect. Neither is Tommy. But still, I recognise his flaws. But all the same I sympathise with him because of his childhood and I can’t condone Tommy’s behaviour and arrogance at all. What I do respect is that Tommy treated Lance equally as a friend and was straight with him. Tommy was a good boss, yes, because he said that if he’d screw up his peers can criticise him. But at the same time he deemed the operation his own, despite the fact others helped him, again further proving my argument that Tommy is selfish as fuck.
@@furqantarique3484 Thanks for the reasonable answer. Believe me, I honestly don’t hate Tommy as such. I like him and I respect peoples’ opinions on him and Lance. But I try seeing things from a different perspective. I can’t justify every betrayal because unlike Lance, Smoke and Ryder for one are both worse because they betrayed their entire gangs and disbanded them and totally betrayed their beliefs for money. On top of that they allied with the conspirators who caused the death of Carl and Sweet’s mother. It’s far easier to sympathise with Lance rather than Smoke and Ryder. Smoke and Ryder had a legitimately good position in their gang and weren’t feeling under-appreciated like Lance, though I suspect Ryder was massively jealous of CJ. It doesn’t undo the fact that he’s a massive hypocrite because he was the true buster that was a constant drug addict.
Didn't he also say "this is for my brother" when he executed Diaz? I just figure it was Lance being Lance. But yeah he was petty, childish, and a terrible decision maker. He only ever made things worse for Tommy.
@@99mrpogi Then, Vic and Tommy would become the most powerful duo in Vice City, and once they kill Sonny Forelli together, Tommy would go on to marry Mercedes while Vic would go on to start a new romantic relationship with Candy Suxxx!
Lance's behavior flips in this game immensely. He goes from cool customer to emotional train wreck very quickly. In Vice City Stories, he's a complete screwup and Vic has to constantly fix his mistakes.
I've seen this behavior a time or two. There are people out there that self-sabotage for various reasons. I've seem stellar workers come apart from stress the very instant they get promoted or recognized.
Wouldn’t lance know Tommy’s name from the first deal in the game because lance was the pilot of the helicopter, he probably wanted to know who they were doing business with
There can be also possiblity he only knew who set the deal Cortez and Sonny but its not necessary cause Sonny can send any of his man to deal at the spot so he can't know Tommy's name
There's probably a possibility that Vic could have already mentioned tommy by name and vic could have already identified who tommy Is based on Tommy's attire so lance probably did not have problems in identifying and recognizimg Tommy
The deal was an ambush... Lance quickly escaped for as soon as Vic got shot to death, not to mention that Vic didn't even get to introduce himself to Tommy...
Sonny was behind the ambush at the beginning. Back in 1971 Sonny sent Tommy to kill one man who knew Tommy would be going there. Another point is how did Sonny know that Tommy took Leo’s cell phone?
And to think GTA vice city takes place in a period where SIM cards Don't exist... It's not like tommy had a personal phone with him other than the phone that he took from Leo...
@@thomasdando2043 I'm guessing that sonny forelli probably knows Leo teal's phone number and sonny may have a contact in vice city who informed him that tommy already killed Leo..
@@thomasdando2043 the bigger question is why tommy did not even ask how or why sonny knows Leo teal's phone number... Sonny simply calls Leo teal's phone which is now in Tommy's possession and tommy simply answers the phone and talks to sonny
if you look at the intro cutscene, it makes actual sense. Intro: Sonny: Tommy Vercetti? Huh shit, didn't think they'd ever let him out! Goon: He kept his head down, helps people forget! Sonny: People WILL remember soon enough. When they see him walking down the streets of their neighborhoods. It will be BAD for business! Goon: Well what are we gonna do, Sonny?! Sonny: We treat him like an old friend and keep him busy out of town, Ok? We been talking about expanding down south, right? Vice city is twenty-four carat gold these days! The colombians, the mexicans, hell, even those cuban refugees are cutting themselves a piece of some nice action! Goon: But it's all drugs, Sonny! None of the families will touch that shit! Sonny: Times are changing! The families can't keep their backs turned while our enemies reap the rewards! So we send someone down to do the dirty work for us...and cut ourselves a nice quiet slice, ok!? Who's our contract down there! Goon: Ken Rosenberg...shmuck of a lawyer! How's HE gonna hold Vercetti's leash!? Sonny: We don't need him to! We just set him loose in Vice City, we give him a little cash to get started! Ok? Give it a few months, then WE go down and PAY HIM a nice visit, right? See how HE's doing!
I always wondered who the blondes were at the beginning of the game. But knowing now that lance still had connections in Vice city with the gangs, he thought of himself as something of a big shot, Diaz put those two up to it and had possible sharks gang members there for lance.
The blonde guy in Marco's Bistro? Probably one of Sonny's caporegimes 🙂 About the Lance - yeah, he still had some contacts in Vice City left after being away for 2 years and Diaz was just one of them. 😄 Now the Sharks definitely had some kind of cooperation with Diaz, we know that pretty much from the first two missions for him. But whether they were involved in putting an end to Lance for his betrayal.. we really doubt it. 😉
Catalina betrays Claude Lance betrays Tommy Big Smoke betrays CJ Dimitri betrays Niko Michael betrays Trevor / Franklin betrays Michael or Trevor This franchise should've called Grand Betrayal Auto
Vincenzo cilli betrays Toni Cipriani Jerry Martinez and the Mendez brothers betrays Vic Billy grey betrays johnny klebitz Ray Bulgarin betrays luis Lopez Wu Lee betrays Huang Lee
I remember the quote on John Wick's Back Tattoo 'Fortune Favors the Bold' You can't have a fortune wealth if you're not bold enough to work for it. He still got a fortune staying with Tommy and doing nothing, but he was too stupid to realise it.
I always thought that Lance was working for Sonny since the beginning and he sent Lance to make sure that after Tommy takes over Vice City, Lance would be the one ruling over it and would be under the payroll of Sonny.
You know I also think another contributing factor in why Lance betrayed Tommy other than Him not getting a "fair slice" is due to Lance's use of Cocaine and as a result He became extremely paranoid and thought that Tommy was possibly planning to betray Him as well, I think at the end of Vice City Stories Vic may have possibly made Lance go to rehab, but after Vic's death He became sad and depressed and started using again, in the beginning of the game He may not have been using as much which is why He seemed to be more focused and in control than He was in Vice City Stories, but after Tommy and Lance kill Diaz, He gets complacent and His Coke habit worsens to the point where He starts neglecting His duties within the Vercetti Organization, which causes tension between He and Tommy to the point where Lance decides to defect to the Forelli Family, which ultimately leads to His death at the hands of Tommy, though Tommy did seem to care for Lance as He does show a brief moment of sadness at being forced to kill Him
4:30 "It ate my favorite 'El Burro' movie, it died! What else could I do?" "It's probably not plugged in...." "Wha?!" *checks to see unplugged cord* "Dang! No matter. I could buy a hundred of em..." I'll always have this moment seared into my memory. I'll sooner forget my mom's name than that .
The moment Lance got into Vice City during the events of VCS he was after one thing: money. I honestly don’t think he even cared for his brother Pete while Vic definitely cared or else he would not have been doing all of this.
I have a different view of this story. I think Tommy was set up from the beginning. I think the guy that sent Tommy to Vice city for the drug deal ambushed his own deal so that Tommy would have to make the money that was lost back when in reality it wasn't lost to begin with. Lance on the other hand is the pawn of the same guy who is Tommy's boss whose job is to watch Tommy and also convince Tommy into taking over Vice City so that Tommy can do all the work and hand his empire over to his old boss. We can see this from the beginning of the game when Tommy's boss amd his crew were discussing on sending someone to Vice city amd f*** them over and let that person do everything for them. Thats what happened.
Thank you for sharing your opinion, my man! 🙂 It's great to see you're suspecting Sonny Forelli of ambushing the drug deal because certainly, he is an option. However, there are also various reasons why it could be Ricardo Diaz 😃 But don't worry, we are going cover both of these men in one of the future episodes, so stay tuned!🤘
Wasn't that like that. I always thought Sonny ambushed the deal and was using Tommy. I never thought the other way. Because Sonny already looked like a villain.
I kinda doubt that. Sonny picked up the phone and immediately went "Tommy!" and clearly expected better news. Yeah, Sonny wanted Tommy out of town because his reputation would be bad for business. I think that if Sonny just wanted Tommy dead, he would have made that happen in prison.
Not really, you can pretty much characterized lance’s character well in vice city through his phone calls to tommy after killing diaz. Vice city stories only wanted the people to hate on lance more because he is still well liked. In vice city even with the betrayal
You gotta hand it to the writers at R*, they've managed to craft a fairly complex and intriguing lore that links all the GTA games. I realize it's not one long story arc through all the games, but there certainly are some interesting connections.
Generally Lance woth his brother wanted to sell drugs and live like kings, but then first Dias involved in the game and ruined the initial plan and then Tommy involved and Lance had to forget about his dreams of king's life but neither could accept it nor could match up with Tommy thus the only solution he could see was to rely on Sonny, but considering Sonny's actions he would after simply betray and get rid of Lance too
I wish Vic had survived, so he and Tommy will team up to kill both Ricardo Diaz and Sonny Forelli together, even though Lance Vance will lose his life in the process!
i never thought about about this prior to watching this video; this came to me after your point about hit the courier in cap the collector: how in the blue hell could sonny or his goons know where each and every bit of tommys assets are located and where was the supposed right hand of tommys operation as the attempted collection was occurring?
You missed one key point. In the phonecall after that cafe mission, when Lance says Tommy is embarrassing him for his mistakes, Tommy says Lance can all Tommy out anytime he makes a mistake. This shows Tommy still trusts and respects Lance.
I remember playing VC when I was 10 years old. I was not surprised by Lance’s betrayal at the end of the game. Seeing Tommy berate him for his laziness and that phone call from Lance complaining that Tommy was treating him like a child was enough to let me know either Tommy was going to kill him or someone else was lol
That counterfeit money plot never made much sense to me - I'm sure that mafia family as big as Forellis would easily find use for counterfeit money, but then again - Sonny didn't come for money, he came to kill Tommy and take over the whole operation.
At best Lance would have been an associate in the Mafia as non-Italians could never be made men - a clear demotion from what he was with Tommy. He would be kicking-up forever.
That's right! Moreover, considering that Lance can so easily turn on your friends, Sonny wouldn't even like to work with that kind of guy anymore, they would probably kill him immediately afterwards. 🤦♂
9:57 if lance wanted an easy life he could’ve stayed number 2 or just retire. No, Lance wanted respect 10:25 exactly …respect. You can see in GTA Vice City Stories Lance craved his older brothers approval. In a way Tommy treated Lance just like his big brother did
Well, Tommy established the organization while putting Lance as his second-in-command, so wasn't it obvious to Lance that Tommy will be standing higher in the hierarchy? Moreover, we wouldn't agree that Lance was about respect in GTA Vice City. We would rather say he was about getting more for doing less. But it's just our point of view 😉
@@gaminginvestigators That’s the only reason why Lance turned on Tommy. Tommy talked down to him in front of the men. Victor treated Lance like a screwup who couldn’t do anything right. Which was fair considering how much shit Lance started. When Tommy started doing the same Lance felt sidelined and that stirred his insecurity. There’s no indication that Lance is lazy or just wanted to coast. Lance wanted to be an active member and feel appreciated.
@@Monk-ow3ok Tommy talked down to him in front of the men....because Lance wasn't doing his job properly. He was the underboss of the Vercetti Gang, which is a post of great responsibility and Lance spent his time drinking at the bar instead of actually putting a solution to the problem. Lance wanted to get the rewards without making any effort whatsoever and always did things without thinking them properly, something that Vic already lampshaded and called Lance out for: "My problem?! My problem is that you are going to have us both killed because you are a moron. I told you not to get us in so deep." Lance liked coasting through life and shortcutting his way out of problems and never cared about what the actions he takes would entail for others as consequences, like throwing the Mendez' Coke they were supposed to sell in a fit of petulant rage or outright saying that Louise wasn't for Vic even though Vic was saddened by her death. Of course Tommy was going to consider the operation HIS, because he did the 90-100% of the work while Lance just lazed around, doing nothing.
@@jorgebersabe293 1) A nice detail included in the game was Lance’s phone call to Tommy. Lance said “you’ve been talking down to me *in front* of the crew” Meaning Lance can take criticism and want to improve as a gangster but he doesn’t want to feel belittled in the process. As far as leadership goes, berating in front of others is a no no for this exact reason - it unnecessarily bruise egos 2) Tommy is not the type to let someone leach off his success. Tommy wouldn’t let his employees or partners laze around while he did all the work. So this idea Lance did nothing is just not a reasonable take giving what we know about Tommy’s personality. The other characters did help operations or Vercetti would’ve cut them loose. 3) Being the number 2 in a criminal empire is not how you coast. Having a drink does not mean Lance didn’t take the job seriously. Most likely he was thinking of a way to deal with the situation. 4) If Lance just wanted to coast through life becoming the point man in vice city for the LC mob is not how you do it. Lance knows succeeding Tommy’s role would come with more responsibilities it doesn’t take a genius to figure that out. So obviously he didn’t want to just coast through life. He wanted respect If Tommy didn’t bruise Lance’s ego Lance wouldn’t have betrayed him. Not saying what Lance did was right, simply pointing out cause and effect.
@@Monk-ow3ok 1) It's obvious that he can't take criticism, because he refused to own up to his actions, even asking for a "fair slice" he never earned in the first place. Vic and Tommy were right in berating him, because Lance is impulsive, childish and utterly lacking in self awareness. The fact that he acted petulant instead of cleaning up his act says a lot. 2) Of course Tommy would never allow his partners to be lazy, that's why he berated Lance when he was caught drinking at the bar instead of putting a solution to his problem. 3) If Lance took his job seriously, he wouldn't be drinking in the bar. Lance already has a history of never taking into account the effects his actions have on others, something that Vic already called him out in more than one ocassion. He was never thinking out anything, because as I already said before, Lance has a history of doing actions without thinking things through, both in VCS and VC. 4) Lance is not even an accomplished criminal, just an immature manchild riding on the successes of his brother and associate. He wanted the rewards but without the efforts.
Well yeah, he is in the chopper, but how is he supposed to be against us if he wanted to make a deal with us along with his brother? Please explain this to us 🤔
@@georgedunnells50 i felt conflicted because i liked Dimitris personality, i fucking hated vlad. Yeah i know Dimitri was a backstabbing psychopath but he was a likable psychopath, like Catalina.
In VCS Lance and vic worked for diaz. I always thought that Lance tipped off diaz in order to obtain a high ranking position but when he saw that Tommy was moving in and diaz didn't deliver the riches he promised that Lance double crossed him to get higher. I also always thought that the mission where you watch over diaz and the Cubans, I always thought THAT was the coke which is why we never get the coke back, just the safe full of money.
Yes, at some point in the story Lance and Vic were working for Diaz, but it wasn't necessary to mention in the video, so yeah... As for Lance tipping Diaz of the deal, that's not his work. It was Gonzales who did this according to GTA Vice City Stories lore and VCBI sources. Another thing is the transaction between Diaz Cartel and Cubans, there's no guarantee that it was from the ambushed deal. But don't worry, we will cover this topic in one of the future episodes, so stay tuned! 🙂
@@gaminginvestigators makes me wonder why lance would introduce himself as Quentin to diaz if it turns out that lance already met diaz in vcs, and diaz should have already been aware of lance's real name even before vice city took place
Unfortunetly there is people in the real world like lance vance... sucks but is true it could be your best friend of your brother or sister they do exist..
Lance is lazy and useless for not being Tommy’s running dog? ROFL. Lance was co equal in partnership with Tommy. He already knew the streets and helped Tommy from the beginning. Is that how you treat your friend? No wonder Tommy felt bad about killing Lance at the end.
Why do you think he was worthy of getting 50% of the power? He was the one who almost got killed because of trying to get Diaz by himself. Tommy clearly told him to wait with this, but he didn't care. Was he really that much helpful? He was implying that Ricardo Diaz is the culprit, that's it. What did he do after taking over Diaz's mansion? He only helps us during the "Cop Land" quest. That's it. He was supposed to look after security and extortion, yet Tommy had to intervene because of Lance drinking in the mansion instead of taking care of the business that doesn't want to pay protection...
@@thesixxx8925 Dude, did you even play VCS? Tommy calling out Lance for not doing his job properly is exactly what Vic did. And both of them were right in doing so because Lance was a petulant manchild who caused more trouble than he is worth.
Wow u guys wouldn't believe I thought vice city was main game I forgot all about vice city stories cause I'm like how is Lance still alive until I saw the ending
I Love your content, just subscribed! HUGE GTA fan so this is super interesting... I would Love to see you create a few on GTA LCS, extremely underrated, I'd argue that it might be more underrated than GTA VCS
Uh Tommy told Lance his name right when he took him to ammunition. He introduced himself as lance and Tommy replies with, "Tommy Verceti. Let's go." Y'all obviously didn't do a lot of research because a lot of these things y'all point as Lance being shady are revealed in dialogue during the mission or later in the story. Lance betrayed tommy because he felt like Tommy was treating him unfairly. Lance wanted to be in charge but Tommy was the one who could handle being in charge. That's the simple explaination
Is that so? You're saying that we didn't do research yet you bring Tommy's reply from the mission "Guardian Angels" saying it appeared in the mission "Back Alley Brawl" 🙂 Believe me, we have done a lot of research. Check for yourself this "Back Alley Brawl" mission, you'll notice that there's no single line where Tommy introduced himself. As for the reasons for Lance's betrayal, you're right. But the thing is, Tommy was treating him "unfairly" because he was doing shit for the organization, except for this one time during the "Cop Land" mission.
Paul would call Tommy, drinking and reminding Tommy to don’t forget what he had done for Tommy yet Tommy said ‘ that’s what I’m trying to forget about’ that’s not just Tommy messing around or joking. That’s exactly how Tommy is. Another example is during phone conversation with sonny. He complained about Sonny not sending support. Sonny had perfect response. ‘Oh, My fault is it? How is it Sonny’s fault when you don’t even write or talk to him? Tommy’s main intention was takeover. He sent mixed signals to Sonny and Lance and they had every right to be paranoid.
And you're absolutely right, my man 🙂 However, Tommy wasn't like this since the beginning. Pay attention to the first missions in the game, he is really looking for money and drugs. But when he meets Lance and Ricardo Diaz, he decides to screw Forellis over because he realized they don't really care about him as they should and it would be better to establish his own gang instead 🙂
Lance betrayed Tommy because he was getting paranoid and a liability, Lance openly tried to take a hit on Diaz, which caused Tommy to go rescue his ass, then openly killed him for "killing his brother" (which is still unknown whether or not Vic is dead or not) and as Tommy was growing his empire with others like Rosenberg etc, Lance felt that he wasn't getting the "respect" he deserved despite NOT doing anything, and decided to openly betray Tommy in front of Tommy, Sonny and Ken leading up to Tommy killing Lance in cold blood "This is the LAST dance FOR Lance Vance!". Not forgetting, that Tommy didn't trust him to begin with, even when you do the mission for Diaz where you protect him from the enemies whilst he's trying to do a deal with the cubans or in the mission where you kill the chef for his phone - "nice going, tough guy! Beat a guy to a pulp then try to get him to talk!". It also stems from Vice City Stories with his brother Vic Vance. Vic was a highly respected Army vet before the corrupt guy who was in charge of Vic decided to betray Vic and have him Dishonorably Discharged and at the end, Vic wants to ride off into the sunset, put all the shit behind him when Lance comes in yelling about how he's got keys of coke and how they could keep a hold on it and then sell it off later for millions, which Vic yells at him about it because Vic didn't want anything to do with drugs. Getting onto the subject of Sonny Forelli, notice how jealous and angrier he gets when he finds out that Tommy is doing it all alone instead of giving him a "slice of the action" - killing Diaz, buying "fronts" to his operations such as porn industry, Kaufman cab company, the printing place etc to the point where Sonny tries to butt in and intimidate Tommy to no avail and tries to steal money from Tommy near the end of the game and at the end of the game despite Lance telling Sonny that they're counterfeit notes, Tommy smugly says (even though he's still reeling from the open betrayal from Lance) to Sonny - "I just wanted to piss ya off before I kill ya!"
Damn this is my favorite GTA I'm glad so much smart people here discussing it! For me, Tommy is absolute beast in terms of building a criminal empire that he overshadows all other protagonists. Lance should not had mess with him as he pretty much realize what Tommy is capable of.
Lance was insecure. Plain and simple. He was getting paid and helping to build up the vercetti gang but he started waffling about half way through. I liked Lance. and I think the game would have worked better if Lance had survived. Lance is the one out there recruiting and driving the gang forward. I didn't ask all those people to show up at Vercetti mansion.
It kinda sucks cause I saw Lance to be someone Tommy could actually trust, the man even saved his life. Lance just feels like someone who wanted to like Tommy and fit in with his gang, but he wanted to be more powerful too, he had that leadership complex that he simply didn't have, his brother had it and Tommy had it, but he didn't.
You are right 100% He was definitely very immature and selfish when Tommy on the other hand was very mature and selfless to close friends. Also I find it sad how Tommy had to grow up so fast especially when he was arrested at only 20, He missed out on the joys of being 20 and going to fun party, I can see why Tommy is so introverted for many reasons.
Lance was never an accomplished criminal. Just a manchild who played the gangster. Every success he had, he had it because Vic and Tommy did all the hard crap.
If only Vic had survived the ambush, Lance would be left to die at the junkyard in the hands of Ricardo Diaz's hitmen, because Vic would most likely warn Tommy about Lance's behavior! Also, Vic would've been Tommy's perfect partner because both of them are mature and values loyalty!
With context of vice city stories I think he was paranoid that Tommy would keep treating him like the little brother instead of an equal and potentially get rid of him when in reality Tommy had no intention of doing so.
Big smoke and Ryder's friendship with cj is longer dating back to their childhood unlike lance whose friendship with tommy only started during the first half of GTA vice city
Lance was stupid but i had a different impression when he came to tommy the first time, how did he find him? He questioned Tommy for getting rid of the lead (leo the chef), him always finding Tommy is something that im still impressed by and dont know how he did it
3:55 thats not how things work in the criminal world. Gossip is evidence Tommy assume Lance was just as motivated to catch the people who robbed them. So Tommy had no reason to doubt Lance’s sincerity. Cortez also implied Diaz was the one interrupted the deal but he didn’t have evidence. Also Tommy didn’t seem concerned with where the information was from and Tommy was new in town. So there’s no reason for Tommy to ask who said it. 1) it already confirmed his suspicions 2) He likely wouldn’t have known who it was in the first place 3)Tommy already had designs on taking over.
Well, we are not sure that everyone would take gossip for granted 😉 Of course, Tommy could assume that Lance's informants are "good quality" ones, while Cortez didn't have a reason to lie to Tommy when suggesting Diaz. These are pretty much the reasons for Diaz being the culprit in the final concept of the game. We are going to talk more about it in one of future episodes, so stay tuned!
@@gaminginvestigators Not so much that criminals would go off gossip alone, but gossip is a piece of evidence that helps indict you. Especially if that hearsay is from trusted sources. Tommy trusted Diaz and Lance.
Is kinda Ironic because Vic in the stories wasn't so different, solving Lance's mistakes and causing him problems. Maybe in some way the same Lance is the guilty of Vic downfall after defeat Martinez and Mendez in 1984, maybe he wanted to get back the empire and do it like his brother did once. I think that Diaz didn't know who were in the deal, just know about it, so that is the reason that he was so familiar with Lance without care.
